We Were Robbed! The Springboks At The 2011 Rugby World Cup

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Күн бұрын

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The Springboks were screwed out of the 2011 Rugby World Cup by a shocking refereeing performance by Bryce Lawrence in the quarter-final against Australia in Wellington.
Up to that moment South Africa had won a tight pool match against Wales before coming good against Fiji and Namibia and seeing off Samoa in their final pool game. Next up was a meeting with the Wallabies. The Boks started as favourites but there was nothing they could do against Lawrence’s dreadful effort that day.
Lawrence, a New Zealander, would subsequently quit after that match and become the head of referees in that country. The All Blacks would also play the winner of this quarter-final in the semis. Conspiracy? Maybe.
In this video Peter tries to objectively break down what happened at the 2011 Rugby World Cup from a South African perspective. You’ll also hear from JP Pietersen and Dick Muir, who were actually there, and get their thoughts on the events of that World Cup that could have gone the Springboks’ way … but we’ll never know.
00:00 Introduction by Pete
00:22 Pre-tournament buildup
04:00 Opening match against Wales
04:16 Beating Fiji & Namibia
04:22 JP Pietersen comments
04:50 Close win against Samoa
04:55 Dick Muir comments
05:51 JP Pietersen comments
07:12 Quarter-final against Australia
09:35 Dick Muir comments
10:17 JP Pietersen comments
11:13 Dick Muir comments
12:35 Aftermath
14:11 JP Pietersen comments
14:36 Dick Muir comments
15:11 JP Pietersen comments
15:53 Final assessment
Peter says: I love the Springboks and rugby is one of my favourite sports. Although as a sports journalist I am supposed to remain neutral, I always like to point out that before I became a professional, I was just a big fan! I hold a Masters Degree in International Journalism so at least you know I should be able to ask a good question or two! My dream is to do this KZfaq Channel permanently. You can help me out by liking the videos, subscribing to the channel and hitting the notification bell.
►Business Enquiries: peter@frontrowrugby.co.za

Пікірлер: 155

@henkstols9326 8 ай бұрын

I will never forget that morning lighting the skottel having a lekker breakfast and beer and watching Bryce blowing us out of the game and WC.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

I was working as a reporter for eTV at the time and was covering a story in Nelspruit. Watched the match in my guest house room. What a horrible start to the day!

@oliverjenner9251 7 ай бұрын

Appreciate the Sentiment at the end. Also worth mentioning that its not necessarily Bryce Lawrence's fault so much as it is those that decided to put him in charge of this match. Lawrence was the ref in the 2011 Super Rugby Final and he pulled a complete no-show there as well. Hes not a bad ref per se, but he did not handle pressure well in any way and those in charge should have known that. Same logic as Wayne Barnes in the 2007 QF, he was poor but he was thrown in at the deep end with only 2 years of Professional Refereeing experience and his first knockout match was the Hosts vs the Favourites.

@frontrowrugby 7 ай бұрын

Thanks for that Oliver. Interesting story on that 2011 Super Rugby final: I was playing in a Superbru office pool and I was second going into the final. I knew the leader would pick the Crusaders so I had no option but to select the Reds, hope they win and that would be my only chance at victory. For whatever reason I picked Reds by 5 and sure enough they won by 5, I overtook the leader and won the office Superbru pool! I had actually forgotten Bryce reffed that match but I was happy nonetheless. Pity it was just for fun and no prize on offer! I agree that inexperienced referees should be spared those high pressure contests. It can ruin a career. Thankfully Barnes has grown so much since then and is arguably the best referee around right now.

@oliverjenner9251 7 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby yea he grown into a great ref, but i will never be able to call him the best because the 2007 QF still gives me PTSD and hes the one ref i dont want in NZ games. in hindsight, NZ losing helped in the long run though, just like losing in 2011 helped the boks and to a lesser extent 2015 semi as well helped make them a better team that won in 2019 and has a greay chance to repear. Also the fact that 5 and 6 against the all blacks could be considered "excellent" really shows just how dominant NZ have been considered

@frontrowrugby 7 ай бұрын

@@oliverjenner9251 That's understandable. Some things you just can never let go of! I can relate. Haha!

@riyaadrhoda3990 8 ай бұрын

Bryce Lawrence blew the Ireland vs Australia game and made sure that Australia came second to face the Boks in the match he was going to blow. The Ausies were never in the Boks half in the second half. The one time they got in the Boks' half the Ausies got the penalty to win the game. Brilliant Bryce.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Yip, nothing remotely suspicious about any of that ...

@seamus9750 8 ай бұрын

Peter was our very own home-grown version of Eddie Jones...always good for a laugh. Often wonder why he wasn't snapped up by a provincial team...the players under him have always spoken very highly of him in interviews.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

He was indeed always good for a laugh. He seems like a guy who knows how to have a bit of fun too which is great and much needed in that pressure cooker environment. It's very odd that he has hardly coached since the Springbok job. As you say the players have always spoken very highly of him, even years later when there's really no need to pretend or sugarcoat anything, so you know it's genuine.

@user-hk8ec7vr8v 8 ай бұрын

Because our Provincial teams are run by the Racist White People, the same happened with Mr Sauls who was the first SA coach under which a Junior team became world champs

@user-hk8ec7vr8v 8 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugbyit's because of the BOERE MAFIA the RACIST WHITE'S that's running our Provincial teams in SA

@frontrowrugby 7 ай бұрын

Eric Sauls was a great man. I had the privilege of interviewing him when he was involved with the Junior Springboks in 2006/07. May his soul rest in peace.

@matthewvanrensburg3824 6 ай бұрын

@frontrowrugby He dropped the ball so badly in the final 18months odd leading up to the WC that SARU arranged an emergency training camp with the 1st team run by none other than Rassie/Nienaber while ol' Snore went on tour with the 2nd stringers. Players spoke highly of him so as to protect their careers such was fear of the racist card backlash.

@Rustie_za 7 ай бұрын

What people neglect to take into account with PdiV in his 4 years, was that he got handed a ready built team. He had nothing to do himself but maintain momentum.

@frontrowrugby 7 ай бұрын

Yes that is true he inherited a good team but it's important to still maintain the momentum. We've seen many coaches take over a successful side and cock it up.

@matthewvanrensburg3824 6 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby And they forget that he dropped the ball so badly in the final 18months leading up to the WC that SARU arranged an emergency training camp with the 1st team run by none other than Rassie/Nienaber while ol' Snore went on tour with the 2nd stringers.

@jadenphilander8799 6 ай бұрын

You forget that PdiV also made those players springboks in the first place he coached and selected most of that team when he coached and won the u20 world cup. He made a those players springboks and coached them at u20 level already.

@frontrowrugby 6 ай бұрын

That's quite right, Jaden. P Divvy came along way with many of those players.

@TK_Originals 8 ай бұрын

The only thing Bryce didn't do for Australia in that game was to put on a wallaby jumper.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Haha, great comment!

@OTYoudecide 8 ай бұрын

😂 💯%

@matthewvanrensburg3824 6 ай бұрын

If it hadn't been for the emergency training camp by Rassie/Nienaber 4-6 odd weeks before the world cup while ol' Snore went on tour with 2nd stringers, we would've been hammered and embarrassed that WC. That we actually were competitive is testament to what Rassie/Nienaber could offer the Boks all the way back then already.

@seanpinkey8798 8 ай бұрын

Well summed up Peter! A few good points- Divvy's record against the All Blacks was very good.And for some reasons the Wallabies had the wood over the Boks for a couple of years! However I must say that the Robbie Deans era was probably the last good era for the Wallabies- since Deans departed the overall winning percentage of Australia was around 40%- very unsatisfactory for a team that won 2 world cups in less than a decade ie 91 & 99.

@seanpinkey8798 8 ай бұрын

And if the Boks played NZ in the semi-final in RWC '11 there was no guarantee they would've won- remember that semi was played at Eden Park- a fortress for the All Blacks- they have'nt lost on that ground since 1994!

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Thanks, Sean. Glad you enjoyed it. Yeah, I've always liked that record of Divvy's. A man who knew how to beat the All Blacks! But as you say, maybe not quite as good against the Wallabies. I reckon a lot of that was down to Deans. The decline of Australian rugby is sad to see for me. On the one hand it's always fun to see your rivals struggle. But you don't want to see them fall apart like this.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Yes, you're quite right. No guarantees. Just speculation. That record at their fortress was tested to its last stretch in the final against France. But what a record - not having lost there since 1994. I wonder who the team will be that beats them there next.

@seanpinkey8798 8 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby actually Peter when one seriously thinks about it, the Boks could've won 5 world cups by now as both the '99 & '11 tournaments could've gone SA's way with a bit of luck! Forget about '03 that was annus horribilis & in '15 the Boks only lost by 2 points to the ABs in the semi-final but the reality was that NZ were a far more superior unit than the Boks that year!

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

I concur. We had our chances in 99 and 11 for sure. I think that semi-final against Australia was actually the real final and I would have loved us to face the All Blacks in the 11 semi-final. Then we would really know! But such is life. I suppose we can't win them all. As the New Zealanders have found out!

@Mimeniia 8 ай бұрын

Word on the street is that we will screwed out of this world cup as well. Apparently a NH country needs to hold the a bit as well. I think France is ear marked.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

I don't like to entertain these conspiracy theories but I'll say this, whoever thought it would be better for us to play the host nation in a World Cup knockout match is about to get a very nasty surprise.

@JINXRSAMobile 7 ай бұрын

Stop believing nonsense mate

@Mimeniia 7 ай бұрын

@@JINXRSAMobile A little too late, mate

@JINXRSAMobile 7 ай бұрын

@@Mimeniia Oh well atleast u were wrong lol lets go bokke ...we will do it mate

@sedickisaacs8464 8 ай бұрын

i never hear they talk about the 1995 rugby world cup where the all blacks was poisoned the night before the cup final

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Never? Please go watch my 1995 retro review. I address the matter.

@stevenmaritz2681 8 ай бұрын

Boks had Ray Modt as fitness coach. They were supremely fit over the opposition. It was the hallmark of Kitch Christie teams.

@russellturner1909 8 ай бұрын

Wasn't the ref awarded with a medal .

@henkstols9326 8 ай бұрын

One thing PdV did well was keep the core of JW team together and give them free reign, lots of coaches want to imprint their style.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Yes, and that is a very intelligent thing to have done instead of tearing it all up and starting from scratch.

@hotshot243 7 ай бұрын

Bryce has stated that he 'wished he had reffed that game differently 'what does that mean?

@frontrowrugby 7 ай бұрын

Exactly. Raises more questions than answers!

@TheDruzza 8 ай бұрын

Gee this channel has taken a bit of a turn

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Hey Drew. I'm really sorry if you haven't been enjoying the latest stuff. The aim was to try and go big on the World Cup. If it helps, I am going back to the regular format after the tournament.

@OTYoudecide 8 ай бұрын

Buddy this is nothing new we all know The tournament was called master plan NZ and bryce was rewarded for carrying out his part in the plan not forgetting a kiwi was head of WR at that time can't blame the team tho they didn't have the whistle the plot was concocted by world rugby

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

It is as annoying today as it was then.

@devmaharaj9768 8 ай бұрын

Frustrating that the poor referee decisions in the match cost us the 2011 world cup. You could say I am biased but I feel that apart from 2003, we should have won all the other world cups.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

You can say that again, Dev. I agree outside of 2003 we had a chance to win every single one of those other World Cups! Maybe in 2015 the All Blacks were truly streets ahead of everyone else. But I would have loved to see us in a semi-final against them in their own country in 2011!

@devmaharaj9768 8 ай бұрын

Nz were brilliant in 2015 world cup. But they were there for the taking in the semi-final. We should have won but for our poor kicking/tactics. I still have nightmare of us kicking everything straight back at them (not find touch). They get possesion run hard against and we defend. I felt our tactics were strange and we got it wrong. We had the players to beat them and NZ players look rattled. We let them off the hook

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

@devmaharaj9768 Yes, we had them but couldn't finish them off. We had a bit of a mental block against them under Heyneke Meyer I feel. We often got close and pushed them without being able to finish them off.

@petercarlisle5828 8 ай бұрын

Who was our Suzie in 1995? Sorry I am obviously not as clued as I thought

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

No, you're very clued. Suzie was her name.

@phillipmiga3961 8 ай бұрын

The springbok have learned that lesson when the ref is against you all you do is go for drop goals ref can't cheat on that make sure you got a strong defense

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

That's the way to do it, Phillip!

@wilburburger6155 7 ай бұрын

Where was Piet van Zyl when needed?😂

@frontrowrugby 7 ай бұрын

Hahaha, yes! We could have used him that day.

@chrisnaude2929 8 ай бұрын

Bryce Lawrence is a typical specimen concerning how they roll.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

He was promoted to become head of referees in New Zealand after that quarter-final. Suspicious? ;-)

@jacohammond9644 8 ай бұрын

Ive always said we were screwed out of that RWC vs Aus in qf. Think back....... There was always cameras in the air to view passes with tries and especially if a try was scored and they werent sure they would have looked on the cameras. All through the RWC we saw that they used the footage. We have not up to today have seen any footage on that pass where we clearly scored. WR didnt want the Boks to progress in my opinion 🤷‍♂️..... Ive heard another interesting fact the other day albeit conspiracy or not..... This year the RWC in France and who we possibly playing in the qf? France....... Is ......... going to get involved........ 😮😮😮

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Jaco, I'll be honest with you I'm not a fan at all of these conspiracy theories. This thing of us losing deliberately to Ireland or the Irish and Scots will conspire against us etc. I think it's nonsense. Having said that we also know that in football Sepp Blatter paid off the refs in 2002 so South Korea could reach the semi-finals. Why wouldn't it happen in other sports? We all know that it's in the organiser's best interest for the host nation to do well. It helps that France are a great side right now but I can tell you now the 50-50 calls will go there way. I have a very uneasy feeling about that match! As for the 2011 match ... well Bryce was promoted to head of referees in New Zealand after that match. What a coincidence!

@jacohammond9644 8 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby yep and that was his last game also.... Strange!!!! To be honest thats why i said what i said..... I also have this nagging feeling inside about our qf game and i agree those calls will probably go France way. They the hosts and i dont think WR going to want them to be knocked out in the qf's. We must just make sure we play all 16 and dont give them chance to screw us over like in 2011.......

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

@@jacohammond9644 I agree with you. I have a very uncomfortable feeling about this quarter-final.

@andrewspaltman 8 ай бұрын

As angry as I was watching that disgrace in 2011...I suspect we will see something similar on Sunday against France.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

I have a very similar feeling, Andrew. I am very uncomfortable. But I noticed just two weeks ago the masses wanted us to face France. Now they will get what they wished for.

@andrewspaltman 7 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby I am very passionate about my Springbok team , but I have already made peace with the possibility that they may be knocked out on Sunday thanks to dodgy calls. What really angers me is that the two teams that win this weekend have an easy semi final . Pool C & D teams have been spectacularly useless.

@andrewspaltman 7 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby That is also something that the masses might very well regret !

@frontrowrugby 7 ай бұрын

Indeed. I have a very uncomfortable feeling about this match.

@GriffMJ 8 ай бұрын

.... and the Welsh, that red card gave France the final. And how about that penalty against the Welsh at the last RWC that gave you the final against England (take a long hard look at that pen)?

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Many, many questions. A friend of mine who is a referee says that at the breakdown for example there is so much going on that it is virtually impossible to referee a rugby match. Interesting perspective. Thanks for watching and leaving a comment. Obviously this channel is Springbok-related but it's always nice to get a viewer from abroad!

@trininair1005 8 ай бұрын

Yeah,that's a good one....could have gone either way that game,glad it went our way.

@GriffMJ 8 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby .... your last RWC final was based on that penalty decision.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Yes but that's also looking at one moment in isolation. Assuming the penalty was not awarded the scores were level at that stage. There's no way of knowing what would have happened next. Wales might have scored a try in the next seconds, it might have gone to extra time ... no way of knowing. We can only speculate.

@sandorclegane3658 8 ай бұрын

Pieter Van Zeil needed to come running out in 2011, and put a shot on Lawrence. How come P Divy not getting international love but Coetze is

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Haha, I wonder what ever happened to Van Zyl? Good point. P Divvy gets no respect but Coetzee does.

@alexandraos2607 8 ай бұрын

THE REF DIDNT MAKE MISTAKES IN THAT MATCH. BRYCE WAS BLATANTLY Bias against us. NZ DIDNT WANT TO PLAY US . THEY HAVENTT WON IN 24 YEARS AT THE TIME. MATCH AGAINST Australia was fixed. NZ had to win their home tournament no matter what the cost

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

If you look at what happened in that match and what happened to Bryce Lawrence after the match, then every thing you are saying has a very high amount of credibility! But no one will ever admit it I suppose.

@TK_Originals 8 ай бұрын

Sad reality is NZ will also say they were knocked out by Wayne Barnes against France in 2007 QF. Scotland will say the same about Craig Joubert in 2015 against Australia. In fact, World Rugby even admitted Craig made a mistake. You will remember Craig famously sprinting off the field after he blew the whistle. This is part of sport and part of life.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

You are quite right, TK. No TMOs in some of those instances and less power for the TMO in other instances. What it does do is give us plenty of material to discuss in the aftermath!

@StaalBurgher0 7 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugbywhat happened to Bryce after that?

@thrusta100 7 ай бұрын

Ya fluked the 95 WC! Stop being delusional, also lucky to win 07, and ya got beat by Japan ffs! Get over yourselves, ya didn’t have the “ measure of ABs in 07 , stop crying!

@tiaanmulder2633 8 ай бұрын

Easy to take over a world number1 team

@WarrenFelix 8 ай бұрын

🇿🇦🤙

@fluxkapacitor8460 8 ай бұрын

Appreciate your content brother. Excellent and insightful interviews. Perhaps just one suggestion: try to be more relatable and blokey, rather than reading off a script and sounding like a robotic 80's news presenter. Lean back and just chat rugby :)

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Thanks for that, bro! Appreciate your kind words. I don't actually read off a script ... I'm looking directly into a camera without any text. I've had a look at other KZfaqrs that do similar stuff and there are different styles. There's one guy who basically tries to make a joke out of every sentence he delivers. He's way over the top and sure some people will like that but it's really not for me. More importantly I'm not like that and I do think it's important to try to be as authentic as possible. I'm a bit of a nerd to be honest and a fairly analytical and philosophical guy so trying to be funny won't really work for me I don't think. Not that I don't have a sense of humour! I mean I love to laugh. But sure, I can try to be a bit more fun. Thank you for the feedback - I do value it! By the way, I love your handle name: Fluxkapacitor! (That's probably the nerd in me coming out!)

@fluxkapacitor8460 8 ай бұрын

My bad brother... I did watch a few more and you are right. Keep up the excellent content - beats my doing nothing! Sincere apologies for the seemingly rough comment.. it reads worse than what I intended.@@frontrowrugby

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

All good,@@fluxkapacitor8460. I read all the comments and reply to 90% of them. I also welcome all feedback.

@vanrooyendavid 4 ай бұрын

Bryce Lawrence. The biggest rugby cheat in history.

@frontrowrugby 4 ай бұрын

You can say that again!

@lancecleary8160 8 ай бұрын

New Zealand don't go on about being poisoned before the 1995 world cup final

@russellturner1909 8 ай бұрын

It was during not before .

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Russel, if you read up on it you'll find they were food poisoned roundabout the Thursday. Some say it might have been the Wednesday night.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

That's right, Lance. The All Blacks graciously accepted the defeat. But as always there are always a pocket of people that will moan about anything and everything! As you well know.

@russellturner1909 8 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby Hard for it to be food poison when they all ate different things

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Laurie Mains hired a private investigator to determine what happened. The All Blacks players were food poisoned at their hotel on the Wednesday/Thursday before the final. Those are the facts. Everything else is speculation.

@sybilprimo235 7 ай бұрын

Why must referees always makes poor decisions. They must go into hearings or be suspended

@frontrowrugby 7 ай бұрын

Haha, yes, I like that idea!

@gagd233 7 ай бұрын

Saffas are weird.

@moes786121 8 ай бұрын

Bryce Lawrence 🤬

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

And then after that match he became the head of referees in New Zealand. And people wonder why we ask questions!

@moes786121 8 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby yes was very sus...

@davidshekleton9908 8 ай бұрын

There are those who may disagree but I always felt that the appointment of PDV was a political move. Jake White didn't step down as coach he was removed. Who the hell removes a world cup winning coach?.. then PDV was handed a winning team the best team in the world at that time he couldn't really go wrong could he. And I believe he took a lot of credit for the work Jake White put in. If you look at the way they played after that world cup their style didn't really change it was all Jake White's blueprint

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Well Hoskins confirmed the political nature of the appointment so you are correct on that front. But it's worth noting that P Divvy's career before becoming Bok coach was similar to Jake's trajectory. He coached the Junior Boks and won the world title for example. Just a slight correction. Jake wasn't removed. They just didn't renew his contract which as you say raises all kinds of questions. Why not keep the World Cup winning coach? I thin Jake also made enemies at SA Rugby. They didn't care that he had won the World Cup, they just wanted to get rid of him. PDV was indeed handed a winning team but it's worth noting that in 2008 he didn't get the best results. In 2009 the team was unstoppable. And for what it's worth Jake never beat the All Blacks in New Zealand. PDV did it twice. I just think PDV deserves some credit rather than to be written off as a guy who won with Jake White's team. To me it's unfair to just say that.

@rodney4107 8 ай бұрын

PDV had it the easiest out of all SA coaches, taking a team that was built by his predecessor, world champs and no.1 in the world rankings. Jake White was apparently told he didn't have to apply to renew his contract but then was told he never got the job due to the fact he never applied to renew his contract? Just more Marxist quota systems to be put in place to get the agenda put forward. PDV was a joke who who sailed off the jet stream of his predecessor and everyone knew it, that's why he wasn't respected globally by serious rugby aficionados. Yes we were robbed by Bryce Lawrence and world rugby and PDV is probably a very nice guy but he was just a tool to be used and discarded, probably why he hasn't really coached again on any serious note as he figured that out by the end of his tenure.

@SupremeBros2012 8 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugbybesides every one who took over from a World Cup winning coach was having a good team handed to them , it’s just perculiar that people only mention this with PDV and not Mallet , or even Nienabar PDV may have been appointed for political reasons but that does not mean he want good Heck the Springboks before 1990 were a political team but that’s for another day I just think when it comes to PDV people become inconsistent , I guess he is not one to “know his place”

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

@@SupremeBros2012 Exactly!

@user-hk8ec7vr8v 7 ай бұрын

Yes RACIST whenever it's a person of colour than it's either quotas or a political move, Jake White was a water boy under Eric Sauls when he took those youngsters Corne Krige...etc to Junior World Champs, you tell me what happened to Eric Sauls but guess who became a Springbok Coach? Go look at the Bulls now Jake White is a Racist who was biased towards overrated white players, he let MANIE LIBBOK go for a k....k player and currently signing old white players like Bismarck du Plessis, Johan Goosen, Akker van de Merwe cause he doesn't know anything about Rugby dam Racists that's what you are, you still thinks this is the Apartheid era where the whole team was filled with k....k overrated white players

@SupremeBros2012 8 ай бұрын

I agree it was horrible to put PDV under the bus, this is contributory to why a lot of people dont rate him even though his results proved not to be the case, it was a boneheaded comment for what was a great coach

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Absolutely. It's interesting how people seldom talk about the SA Rugby presidents and CEOs, except probably Louis Luyt. Many of them have been more responsible for the bad times than the players and the coaches. What Hoskins said that day immediately entrenched a certain viewpoint for many people and once people have made up their minds, it is very difficult to change the perceptions.

@thobelandlebe4634 8 ай бұрын

I read P Divy's book shortly after his stint with the Boks. His comments regarding that specific comment by Oregon Hoskins are quite telling. Hoskins' comment was every bit as sinister as it was made out to be. It is so fascinating how that one comment (which was incorrect) pretty much defined P Divy's tenure at the Boks. Quite sad really.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Spot on, Thobela. Why would anyone say something like that in the first place? It was a truly awful thing to do and then he went on and served as SA Rugby president for another 7 years or so after that. We always talk about judging coaches on results. Well Divvy beat the Lions, won the Rugby Championship and beat the All Blacks in New Zealand twice. And but for questionable refereeing would have reached at least the semi-finals at the World Cup. That's not too shabby if you ask me.

@SupremeBros2012 8 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby as you say, at the end of the day, people with a preconceived agenda used this as ammunition, regardless of the results , they found a reason to denigrade the man, so as bas as Hoskins was, we cannot give those with an agenda a pass.

@user-uv3su7ve9p 8 ай бұрын

Because they don't like South Africa

@awesomeg6785 8 ай бұрын

But you weren't poisoned! We would have beaten the ABs because we would have poisoned them again!

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Hahahahaha!

@russellturner1909 8 ай бұрын

No for that to work you have to invite them into your home ☠️☠️☠️

@awesomeg6785 8 ай бұрын

@@russellturner1909 you haven't heard about the poisoning of the ABs when ABs played the Springboks in the WRC final in SA? It was the hotel food!

@russellturner1909 8 ай бұрын

@@awesomeg6785 It was that dirty Mandela 👿

@janhbhugo5085 7 ай бұрын

Who do they have this year ! Video review ? Foot out foot in ! Disallow Try and Conversion after wards ! Fabrication adrift in the video review right , not the ref ! Joke ! Losing credibility World Rugby ! Hasta la Vista !

@richardmcgoldrick78 8 ай бұрын

Another Boks fan blaming a ref for a defeat. Well, I never. SA fans must be the biggest whingers in sports history 😂

@davidshekleton9908 8 ай бұрын

Bryce Lawrence actually apologised to South Africa after that match... And if I recall correctly he was banned from traveling to South Africa...😂

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Instead of dealing in stereotypes, rather discuss the specific topic. Lawrence by almost any measure had a shocker of a match. And even assuming that he tried his best, which he himself clearly doesn't think he did given his apology to South Africa, then there is a very important question that has to be asked: The winner of the match would play the All Blacks. Why was a referee from New Zealand appointed to officiate that fixture? Oh and one other thing: After the match he never refereed again but was appointed head of referees in New Zealand. There are more questions than answers here.

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Haha, he probably wasn't really banned but it would be a good idea to not visit for a few years ... or decades.

@richardmcgoldrick78 8 ай бұрын

@davidshekleton9908 Well, as long as there is someone to blame, eh? It couldn't possibly be that SA were beaten by the better team on the day who managed the game and the ref better.

@richardmcgoldrick78 8 ай бұрын

@frontrowrugby managing the ref is part of the game. SA needs to grow up and take responsibility for defeats. The whinging continues to this day. Build a bridge and get over it. Your fans are even worse today 😂😂 did the Boks ever lose a game fairly because the other team were better, or is there an excuse for every single defeat?

@sedickisaacs8464 8 ай бұрын

it's always the same old same with springboks if they don't win they were robbed

@frontrowrugby 8 ай бұрын

Instead of generalising, why not discuss the specific topic?

@BruceWayne-dc4bf 7 ай бұрын

@@frontrowrugby typical ''cape crusader'' comment from this fellow.