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Perturabo went traitor just so he could fight Dorn. That's it. That's the tweet.

Whats funny is the Iron Cage was basically Purterabo forcefully switching roles with Dorn, and making him experience what the Iron Warriors had to go through during their battles, and Dorn wasn't prepared to do that but Purterabo was every but prepared to be the defender.

Perterabo always seemed like he'd infect himself with the Obliterator virus as a middle finger to the Chaos Gods

A short story that featured Pre-Heresy Peter Turbo is one I really enjoyed. It showed his sheer pragmatism. It was him and a force of his elite iron warriors who deployed to support a group of imperial fists under siege from Orks. After securing the ridge and eliminating the Ork artillery, they sat on the ridge and watched as the green hordes broke on the fists defenses. The entire time his sons showered scorn and criticism on the decisions and techniques of the fists from on high while Perturabo remained silent. After it was done and the fists had won Perturabo looked at his sons with disgust. “You lashed down nothing but scorn while observing one of the best defensive specialists in the imperium. Rather than observe and learn you looked down on him and degraded them despite that none of you could have done what he did this day.” And then walks away from his sons to go talk to the commanding son of Dorn. He may not have liked Dorn or the fists, but he did give credit where it was due. Disappointed in his sons that their pride was too great to learn from their rivals.

Bit of a theory: Perty ran into Vashtorr, who, even if not having the aspirations of becoming a chao god yet, fashioned a new armor perty to make him like a daemon primarch; while also acting like Guilliman's suit in keeping him alive.

i like the theory that when Fulgrim stole some of Perturabo's life force, the wound left by him was slowly killing Perturabo and thus he needed to make a massive dreadnought like lifesupport system to survive.

Perturabo appearance sounds like he isn't being ascended, more like put into life support. Reminding me of Huron, where he made a pact with Chaos to save his soul in which his appereance is like a broken cyborg. Makes me wonder if Perturabo is a daemon prince or ended up as a semi-being like Kharn or Lucius.

I do love the idea that Perturabo’s daemon form is essentially just a big Iron golem looking Robot. If that is his Canon appearance it makes so much sense that he’d outright refuse to become mutated like the others and choose to become more machinelike. Hell I’d go so far as to say that the Iron warriors aren’t really CHAOS marines not in the usual sense,

Fun fact Dorn stole the line "drag him back in an iron cage" from Marshal Ney one of Napoleon's greatest Marshals. When Napoleon escaped from Elba and returned to France (this is just before Waterloo) Ney was charged to arrest Napoleon and Ney pledged he would return Napoleon alive in "an iron cage". When Ney finally met up with Napoleon instead of arresting him he joined Napoleon's forces.

If Vashtor ever becomes a 5th player in the great game, Perty would be the best candidate for daemon prince for it

I would personally LOVE to see Lorgar coming back, to see how he thinks of the Imperium using his old texts as the foundations of their religion….

I think it was mentioned in the Vashtor book that he and Perturabo have a deal of some kind. If Perturabo's ascension was actually a forging in the Forge of Souls this would make sense. Until his debt is clear he has to listen to Vashtor. Now the debt is usually donating to the Forge but considering this strength of the Daemon not all deals are the same. I assume they had to fix Perturabo up from what Fulgrim did, and give him actual power.

What I think would be good is retcon it so that Perty makes a deal with Vashtor in exchange for the gene seed from the Iron Cage he helps him cheat death, turning him into a kind of primarch daemon engine. Vashtor seems like the one daemon Perty would willingly work with, and Iron Warriors love daemon engines.

I feel it would fit better if he became a demon primarch of vashtor as he’s a smaller chaos god of logic and mechanics so I feel it would work better but have no clue how they would fit it around peterturbo

Personally my favorite headcanon is that Perturabo just adopted that title and kinda plays along with it more for the reputation/ability to stop his soul from leaking and slowly killing him, caused afther the wound Fulgrum delivered - rather than being truelly a daemon primarh by choice

My expectations is he’s helping Vashtorr behind the scenes all to betray him and ascend to god hood so that he can go to Terra and try to kill the Emperor. Either that or he’s secretly the avatar of Malice and we’re finally going to see the god step into the fight.

I have always preferred the idea of the iron warriors and Perturabo being more renegade space marines than chaos. Much like the red corsairs I believe making them just like the other chaos marines strips them of their uniqueness. Being anti-imperium without being pro-chaos. Heck originally the red corsairs were supposed to be pirate space marines. They are so generic now that i have seen their capture of Robute attributed to either Magnus or the black legion. I even like how more recently Iron warriors were shown to only use demons as war engines. to basically bind them to something then let them wreak havok. I'd even be cool with them leaving the warp an conquering their own corner of space.

I think that during the time peroid that has not been writtten yet by the authors' of Warhammer 40k, Perturabo failed in his attempts to resurrect Calliphone, in his frustration he sought the powers of Chaos to complete the act. Now he has her hidden from all, maybe even himself, thus hiding the reason he turned to Chaos.

I find it interesting that demon perty looks...basically like himself? From the description, its mostly his armor that is twisted

Personally I hope not, I like the idea of a non chaos traitor so much better. Chaos for being the big bad of the setting has become underwhelming and predictable from a reader standpoint. Besides I think it's a lot more interesting to see a traitor scavenge and struggle for survival in a hateful universe rather than just have things gifted to them by chaos. Weather or not they're actually malicious or just have different morals than the imperium. I'm also set in my belief that if there's going to be a Dark mechanicus should focus on xeno technology, AI, and other tech heresy rather than chaos. That, and primarch dreadnaught.

This explains the whole demon ascension in a way that I think makes a lot more sense, and could actually be cool to investigate in the future.

My favourite part is when Perturabo said "it's perto time" and demonstrated his T-posing skills in front of the funny not so alive emperor

Doubt it. I like to think he currently resides in some massive primarch sized dreadnought.

Only reason I prefer non-daemon Perturabo is because a chaos primarch dreadnaught sounds really cool

I personally like to thing he's augmented himself to be on daemon prince level while having bits of warp corruption. But I'll accept him being a daemon prince only if vashtorr has something to do with it

For anyone wondering, it's because Daemon Prince Perturabo came before Primarch Perturabo. In 1988, before the game's 2nd Edition, GW released the "Realm of Chaos" series. Two books introducing Chaos to Warhammer 40k and Warhammer Fantasy, fleshing out both setting and placing the influence of Chaos in it. These books took the early Horus Heresy and laid the foundation of what would become the largest conflict of 40k. But at this time, whilst the idea of Space Marines Legion was there, GW hadn't yet come up with all 20 of them. Only the Black Legion, World Eater, Thousand Sons, Death Guard and Emperor's Children were fleshed out, to give each of the Chaos Gods their own force (Undivided, Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle and Slaanesh). However, Perturabo and the Iron Warriors are present in the first book (Slaves to Darkness) and are described as renegades in service of Chaos. At the time, he wasn't a Primarch, simply a Daemon Prince. When 2nd Edition came around and 4 more Traitor Legions were added, GW used the name Perturabo and the Iron Warriors (probably because it sounded cool). Then, his character was fleshed out in the novels, creating the contradiction we have here.

I honestly wonder if Perty and the Necrons will will have some sort of interaction considering they're made of living metal and all that. Vashtor seemed to help a lot in that regard though. Either way, more Perty content is always welcome.

You have been my introduction and main teacher of all things warhammer, love the work you pour into these vids and look forward to every upload. Wouldnt mind seeing some more grimdark storytime

With the rise of Vashtor in the Arks of Omen arc, I would love Robo-Perty to be the next Primarch to return in the service of Vashtor

Great video! Love Perturabo, hope we see more about him in the future! I would love to have more dark mechanicum, iron warriors, and Vashtor being chaos besties.

Perturabo may be one of if not the only character in this universe who makes his superiority, while others would see as pride, to be an absolute fact. For him to become and being his own man after becoming a Daemon while his chaos brothers before him became pawns, all to essentially make a point, is beyond all levels of flexing and badassery. It is as if his mission is to become a living embodiment, a message to the galaxy even, of something along the lines of "The galaxy would be a much better place if we weren't getting in our own way." In which case, he would more than likely be right given how everything bad that is happening and has ever happened in their universe is pretty much their own fault in one way or another. I swear if Perturabo ever ends up killing Lucious The Eternal and not be affected by his curse, than that may just end up being one of the greatest moments in 40k history.

I would love a long form video that covers all the primarchs and their current status in the lore. I’m still new to 40k but I’m loving all your videos.

I like the idea of Pertrabo ascending to deamonhood to then encase himself in a deamon engine, I think it would be fitting. Deamons enhabit engins to free themselves from warp dependence, a weakness Pertrabo knows all too well from his bout with Angeron. Forging a deamon dread to harness warp power by his own means would alleviate that problem.

Poor perty needs some fatherly love.

Seeing all of this siege of terra and horus heresy storylines made me want a "which books to read for what series" video. There are TONS of books to read from, and it's all over the place. I think that specially now that people should hopefully be joining the fandom with the 10th edition out, space marine 2 coming out soon, and tacticus and boltgun also on the market, you should use this oportunity to make a video on which books to read to follow which series, like xenos series, imperial guard series, or all of this primarch drama series! I for one am reading gaunts ghosts for a while now but i'm still very very lost.

Great vid!! I’m still semi new to 40k and haven’t gotten around to learning much about Perty yet, he kind of reminds me of what you said about Abaddon in the video you made about him. Someone trying to gain mastery over chaos without letting them take over is a cool vibe

Vashtorr and Perty seem like a dream team for sure

I'd love to see Pert and Vashtorr interact, they're my favorites!

I was surprised to learn that iron warriors got rid of mutation cause I remember seeing pics online of a comic where the iron warriors clearly having mutations with one having a ram’s face and horns.

Simple answer, Peter Turbo had to become a Daemon because the writers said so.

I love Perturabo, and your inclination of him and Vashtor in some way interacting makes so much sense. His demonic Ascension is a good choice, conducted through a ritualistic sacrifice of the gene-seed of his sworn rival and counterpart while also rebuking the demonic lords and refusing to utilize their forces and magics is a great character aspect. That said? I’m sticking with the whole ‘Demon made of Living-Metal that looks like a really buff Titan’ versus the ‘dredged corpse and hissing cornrows’ look!

How I the fuck did you manage to put another amazing video out so quickly?! You're a God Emperor yourself Wes! :D Thanks for all the dedication you put into educating us on this incredibly detailed universe! :)

Hey Wes, just wanted to say that your videos make me happy! They are well written, fun and informative, and i love learning about 40k. Just know that your time put in to this content brings joy, and hope you are doing well! :)

Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal! I could also see Perturobo's apotheosis being him managing to pay Vashtor's price. From the way GW has set up Vash as a demonic arms merchant/loan shark and the enslavement comes from not being able to fulfill your own end of the contract, but unlike a lot of the others he let's simple math do his work for him and doesn't double deal to ensure that his clients default makes him likely the best god to deal with for someone like the lord of iron.

Perturabo being an independent minor warp god leading an independent iron legion faction would be awesome.

I guess you have heard this from many people, but it was you and the content you posted on tiktok that made me love warhammer 40k. Keep up the good work mate!

I’m kinda new to warhammer and with your last bit, I’m really curious at what retcons GW has done to characters and factions, or like the top 10 retcons/controversial changes to the lore. I think that’d be a cool video

While this is something of a personal take I always thought of Perty taking the Daemon makeover was something he did out of necessity after suffering from, let's face it, a lot of damage. Be it from Fulgrim stealing some of his life, actual battle wounds during the siege of Terra, or even after the siege from who knows how many warp entities that probably thought "here's my chance to devour a very powerful weakened soul". It seems like something he'd do begrudgingly more than willingly and to top it all of probably on his own terms in his own way. It's why I kind of like the idea of him being depicted of a giant made out of daemonic metal. Rather than go through some ascension ritual where he'd turn physically into a Daemon Primarch he said "screw this I'll do it my own way" and found a way to forcefully conduct the ritual using technology fused with some warp smithing. He is Petty Perty after all and there's no way he'll accept becoming a weakened shell of what he used to be even if it meant giving himself into Chaos.

I like the theory, that he isn't a demon, rather he build a kind of life support system around himself that keeps him alive due to the wound Fulgrim gave him, which would also explain why he is as sane as he is.

i really admire your work with that passioned 40k-lore-vids of yours and i think it's so great that you are that precise about your sources of knowledge; especially pointing out sequence: 17:53-18:09 in that context; your videos are like academic essays or articles and they remind me of my college years in social work where i had to read all these academic studies and magazines. i think your really unique at youtube with that scientific approach for sources and references in your video work amoung all the other content creators of 40klore. best grüße from germany Thiago Becker

Really good video, been trying to learn some more about all of the primarchs and this was a great overview.

just.... they should retconned Pert into the first deamon primarch of Vashtorr

I would love a standoff between the csm Iron Warriors led by Peter Turbo and the Tyranids. Two brute forces facing off against each other sounds so amazing

That's one of the most impressive army collections and displays I have ever seen, and I've been playing 40k since before it was even called that; I had to restart the video a couple times because I got distracted staring at your models in the background and completely stopping paying attention to what's actually going on in the video!

Of all the character trajectories that throw me for a loop, it's Perturabo. From brilliant but petulant redditor who'd always blame someone else for any of his shortcomings and would look for any excuse to decimate his sons, to an actual leader capable of taking criticsm on the chin and fostering growth in his sons. It is wild that falling to the forces of chaos seems to have made Perturabo more compentent when everyone else got worse from it.

I hope he's not a deamon, but just wearing a giant dreadnought as armour to screw with people's minds

19:35 Well caught 👏 This is something that would've bugged me too in the sense of right being right! Appreciate it. But also the understanding and respectful way you pointed it out. Thank you. PS! Glad to hear someone else also appreciate and give credit to Games Workshop ability to keep and maintain a relatively coherent and sensible overarching plotline!

Man I look forward to your videos. Keep up the good work hope life is good

Bricky's video about the legions was pretty spot on about Perturabo and the Iron Warriors. "Perturabo and the Iron Warriors do not serve the Chaos Gods because they like them, they serve them because f*** you!" They use Chaos for their ends and Chaos uses them in turn, that's it.

I have a theory about Perturabo. The new god and Perturabo of them will work together to stop the Tyranids then they change their focus to the other gods and the Emperor of Mankind.

More tyranid and space marine lore please, heavily interested in it since the new space marine 2 game was revealed and so far you’re the best lore channel for warhammer I’ve seen

I was pondering about Demon-Purty and wanted explanation. Thank you Wes!

Didnt perturabo sustain a wound by fulgrim in angel exterminatus that caused him a soul leak anyway ? And he had little choice but to ascend to avoid slowly dying ? Or is that « Reddit » shaky lore ? I also appreciated Perturabo in his spite for the loss of control of his erstwhile brothers. And yeah, Vashtorr makes the perfect Daemonic Partner for Perty. Engine oriented, no double dealings, frank and upfront. The logical step for me would be perturabo wrenching the title of warmaster from Abbaddon, but well, lets see if GW goes with this Avenue of thinking ;)

I have my own theory, but I’ll admit it’s really more wishful thinking than anything else. I think that Perturabo isn’t a Daemon Primarch, but rather a Daemonhost. He used the gene seed to summon a powerful daemon from the Warp, then bound it into himself in order to access its power, stating in control through force of will. I feel it explains how a Chaos-hating individual could gain daemonic power, since most Daemon Princes had to show a fanatical level of devotion to achieve their status.

Perturabo: seeks to force order into chaos Vashtorr: is the embodiment of order in chaos I hope they become good friends

Those “editor’s notes” are what make you the best dude …. You are for real !!!!

OH! This is something I've wondered about... thanks for covering it!

I was typing this comment when you mentioned my most anticipated meeting between Perturabo and Vashtorr, so I second this motion. I admit I haven't read any of the Arks of Omen books yet, but if I were, I wouldn't be surprised to come across a Perturabo tease. On a separate note, I'd love a video on Erda, but I pretty much watch all your videos.

Great video man, good job and thanks

Awesome all around (IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT) but that is the best rundown of the Iron Cage that I've seen yet

@weshammer that picture of imperial fists with ultramarine shoulder pads is so cursed lol (another excellent vid btw)

Fantastic video! :)

Love your vids man

Awesome vid!

Love the video. Arkifane and Perty is a vibe, but I have just been wanting Perty to come back, under any circumstances, for a long time. I think he needs to have like, perfected and infected himself with the obliterator virus, exerting full control of his daemonhood and the perfected virus and his dreadnought-like sarcophagus of armor.

I’m new at this lore. Mind blown daily. It never ends. I love it.

I want the IW's to get their own models and codex so badly. Whether they choose to keep him more of a renegade, or pair him with Vashtorr if he ascends. They would be such a cool standout from the usual chaos-alligned models

Lore on perturabo is thin and hard to find, but this video threw in a few things I’d never heard before- thanks for making it! IW are my boys, I really hope they get specific models and rules in the future

Wasn't it that Dorn's stubborn refusal of the Codex Astartes rule to break his Legion into Chapters that lead him to bring them to that suicidal attack? I kmow I heard that somewhere.

Please do a future video on some of the alternate Heresies such as the Roboutian Heresy, the Dornian Heresy or even the Imperial Heresy!

Really appreciate your commitment to research and showing primary sources and quotes. Lot of "Here's what I think therefore it's basically canon" 40k content out there.

Love the video Wes!

I really think it’d be fun for the Iron Warriors to semi-alight themselves with Vashtorr. Vashtorr already is a surprisingly orderly entity of chaos, so if he were to ascent to godhood, it may be a fun way to make an “order” warp pantheon, with members like Big E and Malice(since what’s more orderly than nothingness, void without change) alongside Vashtorr

I may watch a few videos of others, but I won't find anyone else that will stop their own words to set the record straight, because! Wes, you have more loyalty to the game than any character within the game! Much respect, and thank you!

I think you are right. Perturabo is probably a Vashtor like figure not only in personality, but in his goal to remain a warp faction independent of the Gods, trying to beat them at their own Great Game

6:30 Sounds like my Friday night awwwwwww yeaaaahhhh

Passages from "Angel Exterminatus" and "Slaves To Darkness" reference that Perturabo's soul is being siphoned in a way that resembles what happens to the Drukhari. Some theorize that Perturabo has been missing from the setting, because he didn't ACTUALLY go daemon. In his refusal to bend to Chaos, he's been spending his time trying to stop, or circumvent that siphoning. Essentially turning himself into a Dreadnought. Others say that he just kind of decided, "fukkit" and went daemon because it was the only way. Backed into a corner, similarly to Magnus and Mortarion. But the quote about how Perturabo and The Iron Warriors want to force order upon Chaos really reminded me of a different theory. There's that one theory that talks about how the Emperor was ACTUALLY actively seeking Godhood. He wanted to become a fifth Chaos God, and basically be a Chaos God of "Order" This is such a tin-foil hat, cooked conspiracy, that I think could be somewhat correct for no other reason than the fact that it is so insanely, "wtf" But here it is; I would open up the theory by referencing to the fight between Guilliman, and Mortarion. Where the Emperor basically possessed Guilliman's body to completely dunk on Mortation. The biggest thing that pressed Perturabo to go traitor, was his jealousy and anger towards Dorn. By the time we get to the Siege of Terra, Perturabo is kind of done with everybody's bullshit. But just stayed traitor because he was just kind of way too invested at this point. He was over all of the bullshit, so he busted up the palace and basically said, "Alright, cool, I've fulfilled my oath, I upheld my end of the bargain, I don't really have anything else for y'all, GLHF." withdrawing all of his forces and ragequitting. Perturabo regretted going traitor after he saw how far his brothers plunged into madness. But it isn't like he could ever come back to the Imperium. I would also like to note the Fulgrim clone. The Fulgrim clone was perfect. Since his original body got yoinked by the daemon. And then there was the Horus clone. The Horus clone was a little piece of shit. But the Fulgrim clone was LITERALLY him. The Primarchs are not their bodies. The Primarchs are their souls. Perturabo's soul is being siphoned / eaten away. And he regrets going traitor. Perturabo and the Emperor have such a hardcore anti-god/anti-warp mindset. What if Perturabo comes back as like, an "avatar of order", the Emperor is filling the gap of Perturabo's soul. Emperor is channeling himself through Perturabo in a way. Or similarly to the Sanguinor, what if Perturabo comes back as like, "an imperial daemon"? Writing this has also made me consider another conspiracy that is a MILLION times more cooked. Vashtorr is such an interesting Chaos entity. This dude doesn't play around. He doesn't do deceptive-daemon shit. He just has a good time being the arms dealer of Chaos. Just chilling at The Forge Of Souls making stuff, and the Chaos Gods don't really mess with him, cause I mean, he literally makes their shit, so they can't really get rid of him. The warp is completely unstable.The Chaos Gods have to begrudgingly accept his existence because of how influential he is. This lad literally binds lesser daemons to his will via contract. And Perturabo is known for his expert craftsmanship, and innovation. Vashtorr owes no allegiance to anything but himself. Even the high and mighty all-powerful pantheon of Chaos is essentially stuck kneeling to The Arkifane due to his purpose. What if Perturabo found a way to master the Warp...? What if he truly found a way to dominate it? What if Vashtorr IS Perturabo? Vashtorr is just a version of Perturabo from the future, finding Vashtorr in the current setting due to a combination of time shenanigans, and warp spaghetti. Or Vashtorr is a version of Perturabo from an alternative universe/timeline/reality. Or at the very least, due to the soul drainage it might not be Perturabo COMPLETELY, but what if there are just pieces / remnants of Perturabo within Vashtorr? Kind of like how Magnus was shattered into the various shards. Those shards are incredibly powerful, with Malcedor literally creating The Gray Knights using them. So what if it's something somewhat similar?

New 40k fan here! Love the content!

My only iron warrior knowledge really came from the little bit in the Horus heresy and storm of iron. So this was fun. Storm of iron is pretty good.

I loved this, thank you!

DANGIT, PETEY! WHY ARE YOU LIKE THIS?! Great vid, Wes!

I like the idea of Vashtorr actually being Perturabo

Vashtor could create weapons for Perturabo and his legion before they fight against the galaxy again. It'd be cool to see Perturabo fight demon Fulgrim.

The index Astartes article does talk about the IW disdain for the immaterium and mutation. I always saw that article (originally in White dwarf) as a founding piece for what they'd become

as a person who never read any 40k and only gets any info based off youube and got into WH40K based off youtube its crazy how much lore there is my fave chars out of all the videos ive watched since almost 2 years now are magnus and perty!

This is a really smart way of battle, GG to Perturabo for planning this out. It's a really cool combat style.

Whoa, that's an interesting point I'd totally overlooked - the other traitor primarchs were elevated to daemonhood by others, but Perturabo did it himself, at a time of his choosing, in his own way. That's huge. I'm going to have to think about that.

Great video. If he does come back the model better look like the art at 21:50.

Vashtorr YES! Honestly, I cannot stand that he and Abaddon are working together in the forefront and Perty is in the back(as ALWAYS) haha. Kinda makes sense, in a meta perspective. He STILL isn't getting the recognition he craves. But it does make a ton of sense that he and the Arkhifane(sp.?) would be working together with Perturabo's love of technology and Vashtorr being the literal Daemon of Technology. I can't wait to see the model GW comes up with when Perty comes back to the setting. Soon......