111, my exact thought.

I thought paper money first tbh

I was thinking same because it's totally useless in conquest games.

I think we all did.....

Immediately 11

Silk road IS actually useless on 1v1, tho...

@@andoreh4021 not if you trade with your enemy 😌

@@M0rdFustang could've been useful if deleting units/buildings was not a thing.

The second I understood the 11 at the end there, I 11’ed very hard

111¹1

I after all thia Timestill hear "spirit of la hire"

@@OmegaNovaB can you tell me the truth in front of my eyes and reveal the meaning of eleven?

@@unyosalvaje3493 the in game chat when u type 11 the game auto laughs

weird, I remember as a kid I would tend to overwork my villagers and plow through all exhaustible resources on the map before winning... same thing happened in warcraft 2, AoE and AoE2.

@@dominikmagnus that’s what I do now lol. They don’t work they don’t live basically

I tried to get women work on the fields, bushes and sheep. while men needed to hunt, chop trees and dig for gold :D

@@3rdfriend Now we know that the only difference between Male and Female villagers is that the Males have slightly less frames in their attack animation, making them attack faster.

@@liamdell6319 their frame delay is lower meaning they attack first but at the same rate.

Death star tc rush lmao double sw reference

If it was a +2 castle +3 imp it wouldn't be a problem. You could probably make it 1/2/3 feudual/castle/imp and not be a problem, but castle would be safer.

"They could actually... use that bonus to rush in the Dark Age?"

@@biofriik Is it possible to learn this build order?

@@gabrielblacklock3921 not from a DE player

Huns are fundamentally broken.

Instead of that garbage tech where you dont lose houses, you just dont need them lol

Tarkans created in stables are ready faster if you have a frank ally

True. Cav archers, Paladins, Trebs. Great civ bonus.

I see a man of culture as well. *tips fedora*

And for certain monk-laden campaign runs ;)

really? just divide by 100 first then by 2 lol lets say cost is 16200 gold. 16200/100 = 162 162/2 = 81 villagers

@@Janovich how the fek did you get 4! upvotes for such an redudant commentary

@@Janovich hah, Nerd

The unbeatable Teutonic douche. Thank god I didn't have access to multiplayer in those days.

Someone should make a video that listes all differences between age of kings and now

*flashback to bombard towers dealing melee damage*

Camel ships.

@St. Haborym there is like only 3 ways to counter BT. Y u complaining

hol'up: FOREST NOTHING .

@@Thundermikeee But you have to get to castle age first.

@@garretgang8349 well if you have anything on forest nothing its time to get to castle. and yeah huns are vastly superior when it comes to space management, im just trying here xD

lol the times i get that tech are usually on a black forest map that's bad or i got walled into a tight space and need land for farms/stables/etc. and it feels amazing deleting all your houses at once

Big brain play: Build houses instead of walls, never run out of stone! Who cares if the enemy destroys them, just build like five layers.

Wp

Big brain plays

Black forest games are so different that they would need a balance sheet of their own. They favor booming, choke-point play and ranged units so much that I consider it equally different from arabia as some full water maps are. I guess not picking it in BF would be same as not picking Malay's Harbor tech in a water map. Then again, you can't argue that it's a tad bit expensive... 500G and 450S is definitely enough that you should think twice before investing

Well, as he mentioned, there are no "bad" techs since every one of them can be extremely useful depending on the situation. Paper Money can be a life saver in long games.

I would still rather have siege engineers though. +1 range to everything, and more damage to buildings, qnd its cheaper. Not bad, but worse than the generic option

Not black forest, it works in every map.

I also feel like complaining about Stables Tarkans building slower is silly. It is a hell of a lot easier to spam stables than castles, due to costing only 175 wood and 50 seconds of build time

I agree, perhaps you don't research It in every game, but a surprise raid with tarkans from a bunch of sneaky stables behind the enemy's base can do a lot of damage pretty fast

They are like rams that can kill villagers and flee from military. Amazing unit.

Think of them not as cavalry, but as siege.

Just like in real life

It's useful in the campaigns.

Now I really want to see someone eat a treb.... and other bets maybe?

@@MrShadowThief I'm about to do the hun campaign now so I can use 😁

Atheism's pretty useful against goths if you're petrified of 3 hidden fwd barracks or anything like that

And the last scenario of the Atilla the Hun campaign.

@@martijn9568 thats the one mj tomfisher is refering to

I searched for this comment! :D

@@kyallokytty It's also useful on non-pacifist playthroughs of that scenario.

@@kyallokytty Except that doing pacifist runs isn't a requirement to get use out of the tech.

Its pretty common to push an attack in castle age, and even more common to have a mango vs TC situation, so I think this bonus is a blessing.

@@unimportantcommenter4356 The counter to a mangonel push is already a castle, and you need a castle to get the tech. That makes it a bit redundant. It's decent to prevent raids, but actually not that useful vs a mangonel push given the investment of building a castle in the first place (which is generally hard, a mangonel push comes in very early castle age if it's relevant). Guard Towers also do the job fine.

You mean "will reach"? "to range" means something entirely different.

@@MrAbgeBrandt To range is used to mean to reach in AoE and in any videogame. Ranging an unit means being able to hit it.

www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/range There's no mention of meaning the same as "reach". The usage of range for which sounds awfully stupid anyway. Same goes for other dictionaries, the link is just an example.

This makes their cav line utterly unstoppable, on top of the Tarkans casual ability to burn down monasteries and buildings

I rarely see more than like 3 or 4 monks being used. They are most commonly used in castle age to counteract a few knights and to get relics. This will not remove the unique tech from being generally a joke but it will be less of a joke while also fitting the name of the tech.

I'd rather have some sort of buff for Tarkans as a second tech. Maybe a small attack bonus vs archers or a speed boost to make them as fast as light cav. Basically something that would specialize them to be picked over the knight line. Huns should still prefer Paladins in most situations though.

@@Tpoleful The Huns don't really need a buff. Hence making a basically worthless tech only useful in extremely rare situations.

@@MrAsaqe Gotta stick to real life ya know ;)

Houses work well as an extra wall, to not have to use them is useful but to be able to build them then lose them to just doesn't do much. I would normally prefer to have houses to use as walls than not.

Why would i ever want to delete my houses? They are free walls. Maybe usefull if you play forrest nothing or on some Black Forrest generations, but apart from that?

@@CG-eh6oe Makes tons of sense in BF team games where they slow down trade and take up space you can use better for eco or even military. Also, the fact that you don't lose pop space when a house is lost doesn't mean you have to delete them if you're using them as walls.

That's more or less the reason I think nomads is a good technology. It's mostly to prevent getting housed from slowing down your production. It's not there to try and rescue and already lost game, but to preserve the resource of population so you don't lose.

I still think it should also apply to Castles and Town centers. It would be a small improvement to the least useful unique tech. (I don't count Atheism as a useful tech)

House wall in your opponent. If it fails, you loose nothing.

@@Tpoleful Atheism is actually proportionally a lot more useful even in conquest. It's just the scenario that it's truly viable is exceedingly rare. Special exception to weird maps like wolf hill though arguably you use the gold to buy resources at the market and field more units with less villagers rather than just stockpile tons of gold

@@zachariastsampasidis8880 Dude, the only time spies is viable is when you have a stubborn opponent who already lost but refusing to give up. If you can stockpile 10k gold in the heat of battle in any map, you probably should've won long ago. Lets not kid ourselves here. It's main use is in standard game mode which is not the default game mode as the og devs expected.

For anyone wondering (like me) their team bonus is building farms 50% faster... 11

Actually a team bonus actively hurting me because I always forget about it and finish my first farms before Horse Collar completes. Usually you click Horse Collar then create the farms and they finish after the research. Because of stoopid bonus they finish before. So tilting.

@@daisychain5125 oh yeah, throwing off by like 2-3 seconds is not great.

@@suddenllybah Yes, I think it costed me hundreds of wood in the midgame in several game. As any civ bonus it changes the build order, but this one feels so irrelevant I always forget about it. And I have to actively think "wait, let's spend 10 secs waiting before placing my farms" which really does not feel like a bonus.

Actually doing the math it comes to a bit more than 3 food of villager time saved for each farm you build. Not huge but not nothing over the course of a whole game where building 100+ farms is pretty reasonable, multiplied out over each player on the team.

when the huns were released it wasnt uncommon to play standard victory and not conquest.

Yeah i think this tech is even better than tigui

I'm afraid you'll hate the two new civs then...

@@petersavonato4918 yeah looks lame

Interestingly, in AoE3 high level players usually prefer shipments of military units/ressources RIGHT NOW over long time passive effects/upgrades because you may already be finished when those accumulate enough value.

@@petersavonato4918 Oh I do. I'll give them a chance when they come out but I still don't like that out of so many possibilities for new civs they decided to go with Sicilians and Burgundians... And their bonuses seem more like Age 3 than Age 2 bonuses to me.

@@Alias_Anybody Because Age 3 plays much faster than 2. If games in Age 3 were 45 minutes or more on average people would take permanent cards over 1 time use cards. I only play Age 3 with friends where we have a 30 minute treaty. None of us bother with the one time unit cards as a result

Merchant of Venice, everyone. Oh wait, it's supposed to be Venezia. Don't want no angry skater ice boi coming after me, lol.

@@joshuagabrielcatindig7607 Was that a Jojo reference?

@@leonardorivelorivelo9253 I suppose, along with a Fire Emblem one.

I was surprised he didn't have it too

The cost is high but it does provide something actually useful so not actually bad per say.

if strategy games have taught us anything, it's to always go for the easiest target

Well Hun is pretty strong and broken , so may be that tech balanced them out so no one have to spend extra resources to research it .

@@kampfer91 Huns are fine the way they are tbh, I don't think they need a change :)

based thread

@@streetspete 😂

The hp regen is not good but it aint bad either. Tbh is hard to rate its value due to it maybe saving countless units or maybe it not saving many. Still if I was going to spam them I would pick it up. Honestly the berbers version may be for more units but the effect is so much worse might aswell save the cost and time and just make one monk. As for the harbor tech it has its uses it aint for water supremacy but you can trick ships to fight under them giving you the advantage but I think the tech is more used as a cheaper casual defense than tower spamming a shoreline for protecting fishing ships and trade cogs. Yeah not the most useful and it probs deserved to be on this list but it has its moments.

Bro apparently you never used thalassocracy aggressively. Imagine having a wood cost resilient tower. In maps such as islands it fucking rocks.

Thalassocracy is super useful in maps where water isn't that "wide". It can also be used offensively, forcing a couple harbours up just before/during a big engagement helps quite a bit also makes you less likely to be completely removed from water as your harbours are much harder to take out.

You can make a castle during a mangonel rush? The whole point is it's supposed to hit you before you collected stone. Otherwise the best way to counter it is to delete farms and put a castle near the TC, no matter the civ.

@@daisychain5125 When my gameplan is to boom with lithuanians I just go heavy on stone late feudal age so I can get a castle up fast if needed (with some market abuse when they're rly fast). If they change their plan it's not lost and I go 4 Tc boom and then castle when pressure arrives. With my castle and Hill fort + bodkin they just can't do anything to my eco (especially if they go archers). I out boom them, get army, trade with theirs, they don't have eco to reproduce, I do, dead.

@@HermesGO3 In theory, that only works if the opponent poorly scouts and poorly executes his own build order (so what I'm saying is that it works if you're better, so you could win with another strat). You'll always be later to a FC if you go on stone and/or have less military so you should be vulnerable to an early pressure if he executes properly. As every all-in strat, if he's late to it he'll fall behind but it's like people doing a scoutrush at minute 15 or a drush when the opponent is already fully walled and feudal: that's just them misexecuting. If you sit back in base mining stone you'll have 3-4 villagers having no purpose besides collecting stone for a theoretical attack so you should have less of other ressources and be later to castle age/be overwhelmed in feudal. Investing into stone in a fast castle is generally only good if your castle gets you value for sure to compensate for the villagers mining, so generally a castle drop (which is super cheesy above low elo) or a super strong unique unit in early castle age (Burmese and Spanish). And then again, any civ can counter a Hoang rush by just putting a castle or having guard towers by the time mangonels start eating TC, the tech does not make the difference here. If Hoang wins games when everyone knows what he'll do it's because his build order and market abuse is absolutely top-tier so he starts mangonel-pushing you around minute 16 before you can have enough stone for a castle. And as I said, Castles or Guard Towers are probably good enough. I think it's easier to defend a Hoang rush as Spanish, Teutons or especially Koreans than as Lithuanians with that tech.

To elaborate: Spanish has faster builders, tend to go on stone and still get value from it and Conqs are probably the best units in early castle age vs mangonels/monks/knights (and probably overall). Teutons can garrison more, their knights resist conversion and have extra armor to dive in and kill the mangonels/monks and their farms are cheaper to relocate if you lose the front of your TC. Koreans have faster mining of stone and free guard towers to obliterate mangonels. All of those are passive bonuses and more useful than Hill Forts to defend against Hoang pushes. So if you say that's the main use of the tech and it's outclassed by passive bonuses that have plenty of other uses I find it really underwhelming.

@@daisychain5125 As I said I go on stone late feudal, meaning when I'm almost ready to go up, I pool villagers from food, which I won't need immediatly or from wood if I have too much. So I don't damage my castle time as much as you say. I talked about hoang rush but I pulled off this against really any matchup if my map allows it and most of the time I decide to go for it if my scout rush did ok damage (usually does, power of the 18 pop BO). A castle drop dosen't stop a mango push, it just redirects it somwhere else most of the time. Seen Hoang do it plenty of times, seen my opponent try it sometimes. Building your castle in front of your TC is often a nighmare cause the enemy mango does reckt your villagers. Even if you get it up, it costs a lot of idle time and often a lot dead villagers. Once again, hill forts allow you ti build your castle anywhere else it's safe and usefull and then just push back mangos with your TC. There are of course ways to counter this strat but it worked pretty well when I was playing at 1200elo and I can still pull it out from time to time at 1400+ now. I also saw some pros try it (mostly Viper) and they did ok. It's a valid strat, quite unique to this civ, and very funny when the opponent can't do anything to your eco and you get to build a big army to erase his (reminds me of old days low elo games).

those are actually all really great examples of underpowered techs. I was thinking Warwulf myself.

@@FortuneTellher I'm not sure about low to mid level play, but being able to reliably win Treb wars is no joke, so I wouldn't say the tech is bad or underpowered, just that Britons don't really need it to be great

@@FortuneTellher warwolf is one of the best techs in the game no kidding

Or house wall but by that time stone walls are more viable

Huns and Slavs (although Druzhina can be very powerful) are the poster children of not needing the unique tech AND having a niche unique unit while still being very powerful. The same can be said about the Byzantines (Guess Greek Fire is one of the three non-mentioned techs), although the general wisdom puts them below the Slavs and Huns.

@@Alche_mist Slavs have very powerful around options with the sole exception of archery which is fine. A great team bonus, a great eco bonus, a full cavalry and siege techtree (mostly, yes paladin and bbc is missing but they are mitigated considerably) and probably one of the best civs to go siege onager in 1v1 due to the discount. The problem with orthodoxy is that monks have inherently low hp; if it was buffed to also increase monk hp a bit more and perhaps a small price reduction it would be a serious contender Hillforts also allows for amazing harass and trolling even at a high level, and Greek fire is also decent to great to any map that includes water

Besides, hand cannons are nearly useless

@@ashenronin7410 Really? I always think they are the best solution for Goths flood.

@@duongnhdn oh yes i think they are good too. But you need to mass a ton for them to be so good, i believe. Very expensive yet very fragile. I prefer to counter with stronger champions

@@ashenronin7410 i think HC's got a round of buffs around the time of Dawn of the Dukes

Just like in real life

@@europeanpatriot8031 what do you mean brother?

@@Avinash_Lincoln y'know the with the British conquest and all... AOE2 is historically accurate once again lmao with nerfing Indians till they became the worst 1v1 Arabia civ.

@@nostalgicdouchebag1912 AOE2 period is uptill 1500-1600 at most. British conquest was in ~1700-1800

@@kartiksaraf4676 I don't think you get the joke my friend

Some of these i don't agree on at all. Extra armor on water fights can be a huge advantage. It's the same concept as why you pick up armor for knights instead of just making more knights. If your ships take 12 shots to take down while the enemy only needs 10 shots, (Portugese has 10% extra ship hp too) then it can snowball incredibly fast and you can win even against someone with more ships. And fireship range makes them viable even in late castle age up to imperial, i agree you might not want fireships but that extra range makes them go from situational to fairly strong. It also allows you to win fire vs fire super easy. It's not a tech to underestimate if you use it right. The berber tech is not a battle tech, just like how unupgraded bezerks aren't meant to regen in battle either. You will get your advantage the second battle, the third battle and so on. I think the tech is a must have if you go camel units for sure, i always get it.

Carrack +1 armor greatly decrease enemy fire ship damage, easy to understand.

Also it gives bombards more time to shoot things making them get off more shots. Which is helpful due to them being slow shooters. Still wish they did melle dmg instead so they could one shot rams which I think they should.

In high level games, sure, but in 800-1200 games like he's rating most people aren't going to properly micromanage their BBC in Post Imp to make use of it.

Cumman mercenaries: allies can create Kipchaks with the same techs as yours (paying their normal costs).

@@thomasfplm This sounds broken. Many civs have limited archery and cavalry options or very suboptimal for reasons. Granted they would still lack bracer and stuff but giving siege onager civs kipchaks sounds broken. In fact any civ that doesnt have a good cav archer benefits a lot potentially, while alsobeing unplayable for 1v1. I guess the cuman player still gets 10 free kipchaks instantly when the tech finishes or something

@@zachariastsampasidis8880, what if the other players Kipchaks were unupgraded and got no upgrades, and/or were more expensive?

@@thomasfplm I think cuman mercenaries is fine. No need to reinvent the wheel or make everything a simple stat increase

Big brain

Yes when u use trade carts like siege ram

Agreed... I play Ethiopians all the time. Royal heirs would be a lot better and I'd get it more, if shotels weren't already so fast to be created.

“Greek Fire” - What, you mean you don’t like out-ranging enemy fire ships for a whole half a second, and also having just as long to avoid dying to demo ships??? Yeah... it’s really only good for raiding those buildings placed *slightly* out of reach for normal fire ships (Also the 3x/9x/256x tech mods make it **really** derpy XD)

Hop back on the train brother, the game is more popular than ever, and you could basically run it on a toaster

The mistake isnt watching the videos my lost son. The mistake is abandoning the grounds of age of emprires for such a long time. You are always welcome to come back and settle down again. You are always welcome in the family.

Gustavo my honorable grandson. You must once again play this great game! The game has so much to offer and has hundreds of hours of campaign!

if Atilla was alive today, Bill would be a major target for plundering!!!

Bill has become one with the machine. He is god now. The faithless ones shall perish

Lol

What was that one again? I'm old and my brain can't keep up sometimes!

It made castles do more damage to rams. However the extra damage wasn’t enough to stop rams from destroying castles. Especially since you would need murder holes as well to make it even remotely useful, which is a further resource investment for pretty minimal benefit.

How did DE change it?

@@kyallokytty replaced it with Kamandaran.

@@BryanLikesCandy That explains why I've never heard of trash archers before

Remember 500 gold in early castle is alot different than 500 gold mid imperial.

@@codyirwin5508 True, but again it is still an extra 500 gold you didn't have otherwise. That's enough for almost 7 knights. SOTL has shown that even a few extra numbers can have huge effects.

I mean, assuming you start in post-castle/ imperial age in your Forrest Nothing games...

And BF in post imp; makes for better trade and more aggressive military and eco buildings.

Yeah, it's a sick bonus in team games. Silk Road should not have been mentioned in the video.

The problem is that it is entirely useless in 1v1. Tbf I do agree that it is actually a pretty strong tech for team games but I’d say for over half the games played it is useless.

@@Hawklaxx all water bonus are usless on lots of map :/ But i wont say that Carrack is bad. And most shocking thing about it is the fact that SoTL said lately that teamgames often ends when trade is destroyed. So cheap tech that helps rebuild it should be one of the best :D

@@Just_a-guy that is a good point, see I don’t really disagree tbh. Just trynna explain what I think spirits thought process is.

Turks don't have siege engineers, so it is basically just a +1 to bombard cannons and it is at the cost of a castle to produce janissaries out of

Concur, I'd argue that for turks +2 range on bombard cannons is often worth the cost of a castle, especially in a team game.

@@harishsundar3409 Yeah it feels retarded to have turks missing siege engineers. Trebs have insane range, Tatars have hill bonus and they still got a +2 range while also having siege engineers. I get that bombards produce faster and instantly from Turks (chemistry free) and even have higher hp but they are THE designated gunpowder civ and they have gutted skirms pikes and mango lines

Actually you are right.. Because... Greek Fire increases Fire ship range by +1 but at the same time it reduces Fire Ship's %100 acc to 80 (iirc) It should be fixed asap.

@@caglaralaca omg that sucks

@@caglaralaca Actually, fires have a 0% accuracy. They miss every shot. But their dispersion is pretty low, so they hit anyway as ships are rather big - they just hit another pixxel, but who cares. But if you increase the range, the dispersion increases as well, making it possible to miss for real.

Yeah, I would prefer that every civ had a good balance of civ bonuses, unique units and unique teches

Well I would tend to agree but simply stating this is the easy part. What would be the change you would have? How much would this new tech cost? What value does this proposed new tech bring? That is more to the point than just saying that the tech itself needs to change. What is your proposed change? I personally think they should just have Atheism as is so keep the cheaper spies/treason but they should get rid of the whole wonder thing and replace it with all units resist conversion. Kinda like the Teutonic team bonus.

But everything IS at least situational. But some things (like the Hun unique techs or some of the Monastery techs such as the Herbal Medicine) are useful in other game modes than the Multiplayer Conquest. Which is completely fine.

Yeah stone cost is rough BUT If you are doing the tech you are probably collecting more stone than the average player. So you probs can afford it. And it makes tower pushing god tier as turks so I would say its worth it. I would say its worth the one castle you lost for it.

@@jimtim1144 Yes absolutely. I love the turks and I love their overpowered bombard tower :)