Konami: understood, we're unbanning shock master next list

Lingering Floodgates, 15+ mins turns, Being unable to interact. When I played seriously I caught myself saying "Yeah I had fun, IF I got to play" far too frequently

I 100% agree. The best parts of Yu-Gi-Oh are when you can interact with your opponent and they can interact with you and I always hate cards that pretty much tell your opponent they cannot play

Flood gates were never fun, but back in the day, decks had multiple ways to out them or play around them, and had several turns to do so. Nowadays, a flood gate, more often than not is an instant win.

I think that one card combos are a bigger design problem. They just lead to everyone playing the same deck. If you just are going to pack your deck with non engine, you should always pick the most powerful one card combo and there isn't really any justification to run anything else. I think it takes away the individuality out of archetypes and play styles

It’s crazy how we got so used to Dweller, Shifter, Barrier, etc to the point we don’t even voice to Konami anymore how much many of us hate these cards. If all cards he mentioned were banned today, the game would be better 00:01am tomorrow

TL,DW: He hates lingering effects.

Snake eyes, and most recently, tenpai has got me thinking about compact engines that allow decks to play 15+ non engine. I'm ok with a deck like marincess doing this since the deck itself doesn't have much disruption. Snake eyes boards have 4-5 with a potential 2+ hand traps, while it also has good follow-up. Tenpai will consistently see 3+ non-engine, and they can run blow outs like shifter. The other thing compact engines allow are the splashes of high-powered engines like melodious. These engines must be negated, or you won't be able to play. I'd like to see the game move away from decks having to run so much non-engine.

what I hate are the time rules. I play a deck which doesnt take too much time and if I play against a combo heavy deck, Ill maybe play 15 minutes, while they play 30 minutes and then Ill be the one who loses to time its so cringe

The game needs to be designed with the fun of BOTH players in mind. While fun may be subjective, unfun usually isn't. As long as the game is designed to only be fun for the person taking their 15 minute turn, then card design is actually fucked.

Insert picture of Jesse getting Shifter’d back-to-back

The problem isn't entirely floodgates. The reason people use floodgates is because of first turn unbreakable boards that require TONS of special summoning. Once the board is made without disruptions (hand traps for example) then the person going second is more than likely toast. Stopping the opponent from playing the game is unfortunately the only way to slow the game to a balanced back and forth nowadays. Floodgates are frustrating but the unlimited amount of special summoning has gotten ridiculous over the years as new mechanics and strategies are being introduced to the game each year.

I think that before get rid of these cards like shifter, barrier, droll, first konami need to stop making decks and cards that are one card combo or cards that makes 3 effects with no restrictions. I can't imagine how toxic this game would be without shifter, barrier or puppet with the nowadays card design...

The only card in this group i can actually defend is droll, largely because you get to search once, and you can do quick play spells in draw phase to play around it. Where mistaken arrest denies all of that lol. As for what i don't like, it's 1 card full combos, I hate this format of 18+ hand traps and topdeck wars where they draw 1 starter and it's like everything you did beforehand doesn't matter because it's full combo.

My core issue is that the core of yugioh is stop your opponent from even playing the game so it becomes a single player and not a DUEL

To me the problem is that they keep making decks that are so stupidly strong that you have to prepare "silver bullets" and draw them or die. Dweller vs Tear is the most obvious example you gave

Worst part of yugioh are the long boring ass turns and the fact that you can just instantly lose the game before you even get a chance to actually play. Very fun.

Just yesterday I was at locals and had my opponent use Buster Dragon and Buster Blader Fusion in branded to shut me down. Then the next game I use D Barrier 2 turns in a row as that's the only answer I had with all monster effects unable to even activate. Long story short game ended and both my opponent and I discussed how neither of us enjoyed playing the game for the same reason... we didn't feel like we got to play. The games power creep has come to a point where the only chance to win is to go first and then stop your opponent from playing. Not much of a surprise old formats are gaining popularity

One could argue that it isn't the fault of the floodgates but rather the path konami made with these certain combo decks. Making certain decks so consistent to get their plays going then it makes sense they would allow a "silver bullet". These decks have art least a third of the deck that will start their combo but d barrier is only 3 cards. It's not fun but it's understandable.

Heavily agree, I've been praying for these type or cards to be banned for so long, especially Dimensional Barrier. The fact that there's little to no counterplay against them and you NEED to open said counter, just makes them so unfun and unfair to play against

I mean, I play 3 skill drain ,but yet again, I don't even play a meta deck. I play earth machine. If I don't play skill drain I lose hard to all meta decks having 18-21 hand traps and a lot of field full of negates. So I justify using skill drain as I don't play a meta deck. If you don't want to lose to skill drain, you have a side deck, right? Same goes for me I side for meta decks.

As someone who likes to play the weirder decks in the game, and usually plays them pure for the lore, the one thing I don't enjoy is the ease at which a player can get 5 or more negates on their first turn, or even before then at times. There are ways to get around them, and I do use them when affordable, but it dilutes the deck to the point where it's no longer what it was meant to be. But this is the game, and I must adapt to it, because in the end, I still love playing Yugioh.

The real problem is 1 card starters that allow you to vomit your whole deck on the field

Yugiboomer here - I think the thing I dislike most about yugioh is how it's basically now just one all or nothing turn, and that in effect invalidates tons of game mechanics as well as making things Like lingering floodgates more of a problem. Like when dweller originally came out, it would slow you down for a turn for a turn if you were playing something like dark world, but that didn't mean the game was immediately over because you could wall up for a turn and potentially out it during your opponents turn with traps & stuff

My biggest pet peve with this game is when you ask your opponent "so how would you beat this deck" and they respond with "droll, shifter ect" these sacky cards that have so little counterplayer that its draw them or loose to them. Its annoying. Im in the same camp as you, navigating complex board states and using ur engine to overcome obstacles is where this game shines!

Something that’s insane to me is that recently i played some HAT legacy format games, and i was playing mermail, and all it took was one abyss dweller to stop my entire gameplan. I had to adjust my gameplay around its existence. While I was able to out it in some games, it completely demolished me in others. This is back in 2014, where not every deck had this issue, and games lasted a long time. Dweller has arguably become even more powerful than that in the modern age, because games now don’t last more than 2-5 turns on average, and so many more decks rely on graveyard interaction.

The amount of comments that miss the point and boil down to unironically “draw the out” is saddening

These effects would be okay if the game isn't as fast as it is these days. Back in the day you could easily wait out a turn or two, or even three for swords of revealing light but these days it feels like one more turn is all it takes to end a duel which is a big issue too.

I completely agree Jesse. The only other problem i have is the card price. You have been to Brazil, and you know we have great players, we would have many more if the card price would be 30% cheaper, only 30%, that's the main issue for me, cause i can't even buy the cards

I absolutely agree. I think that every deck should be fair and balanced. Each deck has a chance to win (i mean close, if not equal, probability) and there shouldn't be ANY overpowered cards which stops your opponent from playing. No omni-negates. At best, there should only be disruption. No OP Generic Boss Monsters and all archetype decks should have an up to date boss monster(s) and support. No more power creeps too. Bring it back with the seemingly neverending combos and slow the pace down. As someone that enjoys playing Blackwing, Raidraptor, Phantom Knights, Clear-Wing et cetera, it's annoying how easy it is to basically stop me from playing at all. Albeit, i have to admit, the decks I've mentioned can play some real damaging combos if not interrupted. I seriously wouldn't mind cards being banned if it meant the longevity, balance, interactivity & enjoyment of the Yu-Gi-Oh! TCG. I just want to have fun playing YGO again without the expense of others fun.

I started off playing TrapTrix with summon limit and other floodgates. They slowed the game down enough against higher powered decks for me to learn and formulate strategies. I don’t like them anymore but I see their place.

I miss the days when we had more main deck strategies than extra deck the game.

Cards like droll and lock bird or dimensional shifter are only a problem because yugioh only last 3 turns. Ex1.Go first and make a crazy board and sit on droll& Lockbird. Ex2. Go second and dimensional shifter then make a crazy board. Dont let you opponent play and beat them quickly, SIMPLE. When you play other card games you realize this is a konami problem.

Even as a combo player, I dont enjoy needing to wait opponent 15 minutes when I got 0 hand traps in the first turn if I go second. Modern yugioh just allows a player to do too much without paying any real costs, and I think the amount to special summon allowed in first turn should be somehow restricted in a way by changing the Master Rule from the core system.

The "realistic" counters for Shifter are: Called By, Crossout, Orange Light, Gamma, Chaos Hunter, or Lancea if you're playing on your opponent's turn with something like Tear... that's about it. Other cards can negate it obviously but nothing turn 1. D Barrier has even less answers with basically only Purple Light, Epsilon, or Crossout. We really need something like a quick-play version of Night Beam or a hand trap/qp spell that negates normal traps.

My pet peeve - floodgates attached to normal summonable monsters. I'm talking about cards like amano iwato, denko sekka, inspector boarder etc. Specifically the thing I don't like is that they are very hard to interact with since their effect comes immediately into play and very few cards negate normal summons. If you've ever had your opponent drop a denko or an amano you'll know what I mean.

One of the biggest problems with lingering floodgates is the fact that NO CARD has come out in ALL THIS TIME that addresses them at all. The whole reason these things are banworthy is because of lazy design that's refused to get rid of what are essentially mechanics exploits. If more cards and decks had answers to this sort of thing that they didn't need to have ready at point of activation these things could have been fine, and it would be easy enough to come up with cards that deal with this sort of thing. But they haven't for some stupid reason.

But in the other side, if my opponent made a 3 to 5 negates board, thats a floodgate too...

Getting skill drained sucks. Ive learnt to have spell/trap negation/ destruction in each deck or side deck

I agree with this, but i also hate not hand traps but the amount, this game falls into hand check wars some times, I always feel like playing board board beaker and solving the puzzle seem more rewarding and skillful.

It's annoying too how some decks owe their entire playability to lingering effects. Floo is arguably a lot worse without shifter or droll or feather storm.

I fully believe Konami pushes these kind of cards because it satisfies the players who just want wins by any means necessary. You see people defending certain floodgates just because it beats a deck they hate (ex. I saw many people defending D-Barrier’s existence just because it beat full power Tear). You can’t pick and choose when the health of the game matters, only caring when your pet deck is the one suffering.

My biggest Yugioh dislike is generic extra deck endboard pieces. I'm ok with (and enjoy) handtraps, teched engines, and extenders, but for me most of a deck's personality is what they end on, and even if the game is very diverse with many playable archetypes, when things like Appalousa, Baronne, Little Knight, and Accesscode are legal, things feel very samey to me, and I get bored fast. It really kills the game's aesthetic appeal for me. Edit: Even worse when the endboard piece is from an archetype but doesn't require specific materials for some reason. Every other deck running things like Savage, Baronne, and Dracosacc better than their own archetypes is frustrating when requiring specific materials would've been a huge boost to their archetypes (and kept some of them off the Banlist)

I think one of the issues that I have with YGO and something that has caused me not to play the game as much, if at all in recent years, is that there are many archetypes that: A.) interact too much with themselves, even during your opponent's turn; OR, B.) too many cards that use either: Special Summoning; Quick Effects; Negates; or some combination of the 3 on the same card.

I hate how fast the game is, can we go back to GX and 5ds format?:)

I think silver bullets are cool. I don’t think the “silver bullets” should be easy to apply to every single matchup like d barrier or so powerful that they just build the deck around themselves like shifter. Droll and lancea are good for the game though, and I say this as someone who plays ritual beasts. So yeah, the topic of floodgates is always taken over by people going ban all floodgates without considering there’s a bunch of floodgates that are so much more powerful than others that they ruin the whole conversation about them

I agree with what youre saying. But I think it's okay to have a powerful card for a format like barrier so players have to build and solve their issue. Id like to see cards like this phase in and out of the ban list to keep things fresh too. But my biggest grip in ygo is hand trap heavy formats. I mean it's been this way for years now. It's not every single game, but there's a high % of games where it's just Player A ashes, Player B plays an extender, Player A Imperms, Player B fails to establish board and loses, or they just happen to have X extender or Crossout/called by and lock player A out. Too high of a percentage where games play out like this. It's silly how most players haven't caught onto this.

I think it's important to recognize that context matters for all of these cards. Nobody is complaining about Threatening Roar despite being a lingering floodgate. If Exosister was the only deck allowed to play Dimension Shifter, I'd honestly be completely fine with it. That deck isn't likely to kill me if I pass and is at a much lower power level. Even Hot Red Dragon Archfiend King Calamity is a completely fine card as long as it is not easily summonable on your opponent's turn. I remember trying a RDA deck a few years back, long before the new support, and the only way to summon it on your opponent's turn was to draw an unsearchable quick-play spell and not be handtrapped at all going first. It was terrible, but instantly winning one out of 6 games was hilarious, and wasn't an issue because it wasn't remotely consistent or competitive, and the deck would get smoked in a Bo3. I'd even argue a card like Droll is fine in a lot of formats, that card almost never "ends your turn" like people like to claim it does because most decks have a lower ceiling line they can go through or have extenders enough to set up a respectable board despite it. And if you don't draw those extenders, it's because you have a lot of non-engine, meaning the game is likely going to turns 4+ regardless. That's healthy and good for the game. Most of the time it's lowering the power level of an end board, just like any other hand trap, without causing your opponent to instantly fold like Dimensional Barrier might.

Jessie what do you mean? Ghoti is a banish deck and yes as a cost most of the cards do need you to banish fish monsters from your graveyard and NONE of them have quick effects to banish themselves or others from the grave unless you play snopios. And youd have to have snopios in hand in order to quick effect banish to set up the tuners to come back

So every deck should just be free to do its annoying overpowered thing? I guess that wouldnt be so bad, nothing will change the speed of the game only caring about first hands. turn to turn struggle is almost never a thing anymore.

BRUH YES!!! The community is to blame as well. Everyone says droll is a bad card, just because it doesnt hit the meta as much... IT STILL IS A TURN SKIP FLOODGATE THAT YOU CANT INTERACT WITH AFTER ITS BEEN ACTIVATED. I was thinking perhaps konami should make carfs that could stop lingering effects.

I hung the game up when someone took 30mins summoning after summoning that kinda killed the game for me

Disagree on Droll and Dweller. Decks that search 10+ times a turn are very oppressive. Decks that resolve 10+ graveyard effects a turn are very oppressive. It's practically impossible to beat a deck of floaters with a deck that doesn't have any form of floating, without floodgating them. The floaters will overwhelm such a deck with card advantage. When it comes to Dimensional Barrier and Shifter, I agree they're toxic.

with protos effect does it have to destroy a card of the type it's calling to be able to call that type or can it just call any type without having to destroy that type apon calling it

Lingering effects are more problematic in my view. However, it still depends on the trade off for executing the lingering effect. Traps for example requires some set up, while a card like Abyss dweller has low stats. It gets tricky if the lingering effect in question lasts longer than 1 turn and if we don't have the proper outs. Looping certain lingering effects can also be an issue too. Floodwandereeze for example had a way to loop Dimension Shifter.

I've played a few card games and I've always said to anyone I've played yugioh is fun but the one thing I can't stand is lingering card effects. I primarily play combo decks, so I add cards from deck to hand and use the GY quite often but when I see cards like D barrier, Droll, or Abyss Dweller I just sigh in despair cause you literally have to interact with it immediately or else you're done. I don't think lingering card effects are healthy for any card game. For Digimon there's a card called ShineGreymon: Ruinmode where it's a blanket lingering effect where you give -5000 ATK to the board which if you have 5k or less you instantly die. So decks that play lots of 5k or less monsters on the board are just unplayable. TLDR: I've played 4 different card games and I haven't seen a single time yet where I found a lingering card effect that wasn't unfair. (Unfair does not equal Meta)

I am so happy that you talked about lingering floodgates instead of just generic floodgates that stay on the field. I really enjoy playing floodgate decks it's just a fun way for me to play, miting my opponents actions at the correct time and gradually winning via controlling the pace of the game. (I do still lose quite often especially post siding) Lingering floodgates are a bane on this game and they should just ban every single one of them and give decks where it's part of their gimmick something to make up for it.

I think that unbanning Prothos and Colossus means that Konami has no intention on removing floodgate mechanic from the game it is just gonna change from format to format on which floodgate is gonna be used and some of the popular floodgates are gonna get banned and some of them which are not that good at the moment are gonna get unbanned/unlimited until they become a problem again,they are also still printing new floodgates as well.I really wish that Banlists should be done by a community of top tier YCS players,the game would be way more enjoyable.

There is a great way of solving this because Konami always is saying okay we have to make better cards than they were before, how do we power creep something we got to keep going with the power creep and no you don't there's a better solution it's called set rotation. Problem solved

As a control player I’m trying to use as little resources to gain advantage and against combo decks that are trying to overwhelm, lingering effects balance the game, artefacts scythe wasn’t the problem it was the extra deck monster that allowed you to summon it freely from any strategy

I wonder why there are so many floodgates in yu-Gi-Oh in the first place. I have the feeling that once they started it, they realised that there are many ways to write something like "your opponent can not do x".

Another thing is how easy to activate are these cards with lingering effects, it there conditions to the activation like being tied to a specific a archetype then it would bee less annoying.

I wouldn't refer to barone exactly as a negate, so much as i referred to it and its style of cards as sprinkles: where it wasnt exactly about the negate, it was about the extension and how much they could add to the board. The negate was big, but it really is just icing on the cake

I really dont like lingering floodgates aswell, getting shiftered in draw or dbarried while playing a deck that has only one extra deck type.

Artifact Lancea is a pretty hard counter to Volcanica if you need a good example. Rimfire, Emperor and Reload all need to banish and 2 of the 3 of these are mandatory for any line of play. There are times where I would love to side Lancea just because Shifter is essentially an auto loss, but then I can't play own deck because I can't banish for cost. This dynamic is really infuriating.

I disagree with gimmick puppet because it’s supposed to be a restriction for special summoning it. It was not designed as a floodgate.

Why not counterplay the counterplay by building decks that don't rely on one or two strategies to win the game.

A fairly specific, niche way to deal with dimensional barrier is by using typhoon. If your opponent ends their turn with a set d barrier (or at least a card you think is a set d barrier) and at least 1 other backrow card, you can use typhoon to pop the d barrier before they get the chance to activate it. Is this a reliable answer? Probably not. Is it technically a way to stop d barrier going 2nd? I'm pretty sure it is.

Imagine going first you set 1 trap and pass then opponent goes and uses shifter's effect only for you to reveal the trap card which could Imperial Wall, likely chance of this happening is slim but if your gonna fight a floodgate deck then why not fight it with another floodgate, its basically the same generic type of duel when using negates to negate a negate.

Super polymerization, I LOATHE the line "your opponent cannot respond with card effects" oh my bad for wanting to try and play around the card. Remove 1+ for free no interaction AND you get a monster. Not like that could be used for anything.

But then how do you stop combo decks that can play through 2 or 3 hand traps

I like floodgates to a certain degree cause I like building around a certain floodgate like rivalry or gozen cause you can still combo and play a good game with those deck cause they don’t rely on them. But floodgates like skill drain, summon limit, anti spell, etc are one that are slotted in to make ur opponent made tbh those floodgates I hate

3:05 Yes, some pieces have inherent ways to remove them. For some reason, Vanity's Emptiness is still Forbidden though.

Make it so that the only cards that can interact on your opponents turn are trap cards and quick play spells. Rid the game of quick effect monsters. Or just get rid of playing the game when it isn’t your turn. Also, I very much agree with what was said in the video

Bro there was an ad before this video and the guy sounded exactly like Jessy but he was trying to sell me a course on TikTok ads

Lingering effects are required to counteract combo decks which build endless advantage. Without them most decks would go full degen.

TL,DW: He hates unengageble states of play. ie: stun, negates, floodgates and lingering effects where players cant interact. No Fun Mode

I played ninjas all of last year. I really wish they get more support. Maybe a new fusion, trap and main deck monster

I agree with what Jesse said. To add to that any floodgates that are allowed to exist should always affect both players not just the opponent. Any powerful effect such as an omni negate should always pay cost in some way.

It's mostly a question of how do we view floodgates concerning each format. Droll & Lock bird for example is a crucial hand trap that's used against combo and FTK decks. I would think FTK can get out of hand if cards like Droll & Lock bird were not around. The same logic could also be true for Dimension Shifter and Artifact Lancea.

I like playing my Alien/Reptile deck and I use brainwashing beam and crackdown, but omni negate monsters need to be banned more often. I have to start playing Dark ruler no more to even stand a chance because Komoney don't print Alien support anymore. If they would print more cards like Dark ruler no more or in archetype cards that say can't respond to this card with monster effects that would be helpful.

Can't even get to a Chixiao nowadays to search protos in the first place XD

I’ll be honest, in the last handful of months I’ve been LOVING Konami New support for old archetypes have been cool and fun New cards have been cool and fun Entire new archetypes have been cool and fun Obviously all of these have exceptions but for the most part they’ve been doing better than usually….until I saw that Gimmick Puppet FTK lmao

Don't forget the biggest perpetrator of ruining a day, Harpie's Feather Storm. This card can actually go die in a ditch. Hot Red Archfiend King Calamity Abyss as a Dimensional Barrier? And all you have to do is play a deck that already runs Shifter? Sick. I'll vomit. On the card. And then burn it. Oh, and good video! Strongly agree. Hopefully they'll keep hitting floodgates. I'll cope and believe they unbanned Protos and Colossus to gauge player base reaction, and hopefully it's been negative enough for them to go get the intern and get some greater evils banned. Imagine being the guy who bans Shifter though, you'd be an actual hero.

Excellent video and 100% spot on. How about a round table video with other 'Pro' players and master duelist to come up with your version of a banned list

100% agree with you. This game is so suffocating, I wish they could ban EVERY card you nominated in this video, this game would be finally fun and challenging

8:32 this reminded me to that time i used lancea agains a dragon link deck. They were furious.

Dimensional shifter: Gravedigger's Trap Hole, Called by the Grave (I believe), various Solemn cards.

I quit the game a long time ago but I keep tabs. It was nice listening to someone who still loves the game but has a legitimate issue with it. Good video. Good job expressing yourself.

i always suggested that they let lingering effects be negated with cards like crossout and called by that way at least people will have a chance to play i mean if called by and crossout are lingering negating effects they should be able to negate lingering floodgates

Cards that either bend the game rules. I hate when a powerful card is powerful because it does one thing but it does so warping game rules like runick fountain. It removes the weakness of quick play spells being need to set before use on op turn and it rewards you for playing them every single turn. Also, why does it draw 3? Should be enough to recycle 3 and draw one, that has being the standard for years now

The game is so beyond me. I'm still at the level of the early GBA games. Where you summon a beat stick and win. Last time I played, there were times when I was just thinking, can I have a turn or are you just going to keep summoning monsters.

Hand traps are a natural response to the insane effects being printed lately.

I’ve been saying this for a while now… any hand trap that applies a lingering floodgate shouldn’t be legal, period. Because you need to have the out at that very moment otherwise you lose. Makes the game completely unfun.

Lingering effects would be fine if there were MAJOR restrictions or activation conditions that needed to be met. That would be one way to fix lingering effects. But then the card would suck and no one would play it lol.

Yeah lingering effects are pretty annoying, I spent a day designing a deck to punish the use of maxx c , using dirge of the lost dragon (masterduel btw) only to realize just because it pops up on the screen it’s not actually activating each time they draw. It only took all day because Konami has the probability algorithm cranked way up on annoying cards but God forbid I draw ANY of my 3 ofs simply it’s a card that’s not in every single deck.

I think floodgates are fine as long as they are removable and not lingering. Stopping an action for a turn is fine but lingering more than a turn is just toxic doesn’t make good skillful game play it’s just losing and there’s nothing you can do about that

I just chose not to play with unfair monster negates. I mostly play with a friend sometimes and it’s way more fun to have a back and forth. What’s fun with a board with 5 negates? Nothing. It’s one thing when it’s a reward for a costly setup but when one card can make 3+ negate end boards … that’s just not fun and prevent the other person from playing the game.

I admit, I main endy, 90% of my interaction is negates, and while that's boring, they do have some alternatives in archetype. (Endymion should have swapped with reflection imo, give it a bounce, and her the negate, it's already a board breaking nuke if you start accumulating spell counters, and then is untargetable.) But being able to play the game, to use my cards, is paramount. If I get locked out due to going second and they have a "You just don't play the game" setup, it's boring. I like the mythical beast doing spell card things, I like that I can choose how to use my cards. I'd happily give up village if that meant spell fragrance would go as just an example.

I think he makes sense, and yes they probably should be removed, but the catch 22 is letting these decks go completely unchecked leads to really hard to deal with board states. That’s part of the problem too. Damned if you and and damned if you don’t