Let's hope so ;-)

Jist too many superior rules sets out there. Outdated 40k IGOUGO list building on steroids is just a bolted on system so there's something to do with the minis. Xenos Rampant is prime example.

I think tabletop gamers, especially older ones like me, are used to being in a silo when it comes to their chosen game(s). What I've seen happening recently is those silos coming down to a degree, and I very much want to be part of that process.

+

This ultimately should be brought up in most hobbies. Because the bad practices in one industry are rapidly bleeding over into others. A while back I would had said convergent evolution; but I'm steadily discovering that theres a significant amount of overlap in the Executive space, as new industries try to bring them in, after seeing "big profits" in other industries. As of right now, WotC/Hasbro are being run by 2 former Microsoft Executives from the Xbox division. The first in 2016, who just got promoted from Wizard's Digital division up to Hasbro's new CEO just last year. And the second to back fill for the first one as President of WotC. Coming from the video game side of things, and learning about GW's over the last few years, I can't say I'm surprised by these developments anymore. Its practically a playbook at this point. And if you think I'm nuts when I said "most hobbies", take a moment to understand whats been brewing in the automotive scene the last several years. Many, arguably irrational measures taken to make repairing a car on your own very difficult. But the troubles also extend to 3rd party garages, IE professional mechanics, being told they're not qualified to fix cars, while also denying critical information resources, training, and even tools (including design specifications for tools and parts); unless you're willing to enter a work program with the manufacturer. That effectively pidgin holes you into only being able to work on that specific brand of car, and only being able to find employment at selected cars dealerships. The consequences of this push has not yet peaked..... but with the switch to electric based drive systems in cars, and the more esoteric nature of electronics and software (compared to mechanical systems that were intentionally standardized); this has been a huge opportunity for them to shape the industry, and consolidate control at every level. Like a recent story about how one manufacturer was trying to gate physical certain "enhanced" safety systems behind a subscription service, which could be managed through the car's computer systems, and would be validated by some external server. The capability has technically been there for a long time (think OnStar); but people are only just now starting to realize they are more then willing to chop up an existing complete system, in order to sell it piece meal, slap some marketing terms on it, and pretend you're getting a discount if you buy it as a package. Sound familiar? Now imagine being a car enthusiast. Wanna add something? We're sorry, this service tier of the automotive management and safety software does not support this feature. Please contact an authorized service agent to make an appointment with one of our many partner dealerships for an upgrade to your software service. Wanna change a part? Oops, the registered serial number on this device does not match the one paired to this vehicle. This vehicle has been disabled to prevent potential safety hazards caused by unsafe and unmonitored operation. And when you're at the dealership- "would you like to sign up for one of our seasonal cosmetic packages? This month's special is on the "Marvel's Young Justice". 7 different color schemes and theme music based on the Heros of the movie. And if you visit a Subway this month, we can unlock a limited edition, exclusive 8th hero theme for FREE!" Please tell me I'm crazy. Because I don't like seeing patterns like this everywhere.

CBT was one of my go-to games in college, except we used keys instead of minis. I was looking into the new one last year, but the box sets couldn't be had for love nor money. Has the supply gotten better?

@@MTFTabletop : It's still coming in waves, but a lot of items sell out within a month or so of getting restocked. The new Alpha Strike box set and the Game of Armored Combat set are available at quite a few online retailers still according to Google.

AMG does seem to have learned from GW's mistakes. They're not perfect, but they do seem to care about making their customers/players happy.

There's a reason I was painting Gambit the other day 😉

@@MTFTabletop i got em and rouge for Xmas !

GW doesn't treat its customers like valued hobbyists they treat them like paypiggies. They no longer get my money.

Yeah AMG is pretty good, power creep has been minimal for a game that's been out for a few years. They give updates out for free and are generally not overly greedy.

Konflict47 has dem super sexy weird warbots.Battletech is /has been such a gR8 game.

I feel that. I find myself less and less tempted to buy minis these days, though I will still probably buy some if for no other reason than supporting the FLGS.

The problem is every time GW releases a new shiney, people just throw money at it no matter how much the complain about GW's consumer practices, constant price increases and honestly a slog of a game that is no longer fun to play.

you realize if GW sold STLs that people would just give them or try to resell them...

Pirating...GW is so afraid of that they won't even do digital rule books, everything with them is printed and out of date pretty much by the time the release it

I had to look this up. A RPG specifically for Dungeon Crawls...not for me, ta.

@@davidmorgan6896 Check all D100 books 1 for overland and now even D100 Space. Though dungeon crawls as what D&D 1e was all about is my jam.

I feel like Forbidden Psalm is a perfect example of how great that can be.

Prolly not 40k fanboys been getting cucked since at least 5th edition. And they love it.its the English way.

That is exactly what the problem is. Companies are out to make money at the expense of quality instead of making a great product for fans and making a good profit for their efforts.

It's not only the bean counters, in both cased WOTC and GW their upper management have no clue about the products they are selling, they are just their to make the share holders money, they don't care about the games or the consumer

@@SacredCASHcow It's not the share holders, most are funds, they don't care about the products they invest in, it's management that is clueless, GWs CEO came from Hasbro and WOTC president came from Microsoft and amazon, both have no idea about their fan base or care, they just want to squeeze every penny they can from their consumers

@@SacredCASHcow 100% this. The boom both hobbies had during the pandemic gave a false impression of how much growth to realistically expect. Now that growth has dropped and stabilised, the money hunters are looking for ways to return to profits from those times. I get it; the role of a corporation is to continously grow for the benefit of shareholders but the pandemic wasn't "normal" so greater caution ought to be applied. But greed takes all.

Exactly, in the beginning dnd was made to be something you can play for free, maybe a pen and paper is the only thing you need

In terms of options, it's a bit of a shame that Warmachine/Hordes declined. Maybe it could pick up again, but it once seemed like it could have been an actual competitor to 40k.

I don't think it's that; everyone saying the same things about GW It's more GW has done "nice" things and bent a little... so people were like "oh maybe they'll change... soon..." and just overlooked the problem The "Missing Stair" fallacy

Players maybe spend hundreds. GMs like me spend far more. I've dropped $11k in about eight years on RPGs, and I've made the decision (mistake?) to now get into BattleTech once again since the recent success it has experienced.

I may try Idols of Torment. I've been an OPR sub for a few months now. Great stuff.

You lost me at Paizo, how do they fit in that list? They to my knowledge have always done their best to be consumer and creator friendly

40k die hards are masochists. They love a GW that beats shits on them regularly. It's the English way.

Yep

If you've already got a 40K model collection I can think of over a dozen games off the top of my head you could use those models in. The only time you'd really need to build up a new collection is if you were switching genres (and even then, there's no reason you couldn't use an existing 40K army in something like Bolt Action, it'd just look a bit weird). Though even assuming you did want to build up a new collection, GW are also pretty much the only company where doing so would cost hundreds of dollars - I put together two 3000 point armies for Oathmark last year at a total cost of under $200. Also money isn't the only investment. Getting a new RPG book might be relatively cheap, but convincing players to abandon a campaign they've been playing for more than five years to start fresh in a new system can be a bit of a hard sell.

@@markwatson8714 that might be true. I tend to prefer shorter games so that never was a problem, but getting DnDrones to read 2 A4 pages of another system is a chore like no other

Yeah. I've heard about that, but am not as versed on the details. I did see something about re-printing the Power Nine 😬

@@MTFTabletop Reprint "proxies" of the power nine at a HUGE premium. 999 dollars for 4 boosters. Those aren't even Tournament legal. A mess, it was a "celebration" of the 30th with the community. With nobody in the community having the means to buy it or the need. Was hilarious and kinda sad to see.

Yeah that's a big yikes

@@sportyeight7769 and it was short print so even people who somehow wanted to by it they couldn't

@@lorekeeper685 nha, they pulled it after nobody bought it. Rumours are that it was a big failure.

If you 3d print lookalike minis for your own use, where is the problem?

@@sidtheragali1447 if you sculpt them and print strictly for your own use - perhaps. How many people exactly do that instead of acquiring pr purchasing those sculpts made by others? GW clearly state that they have zero tolerance and consider it IP infringement if the model is imitating their own product or artwork too heavily. And whilst there are people who sculpt traditionally or digitally their own models and use them for games (some of the GW sculptors even did that as well), strictly for personal use, it’s not the majority of the 3d-printer users, it’s a small minority, and I’m not sure it will be even relevant in the grand scale of the hobby and its Warhammer part.

I think the biggest problem with GW products is the cost, people feel locked in to GW because they have literally spent thousands of dollars on GW products and can't bring themselves to get out of the GW cult

It’s the intellectual property rights that are the issue so you have to make your own lore

I'm this day and age, there are literally zero reasons to buy directly from GW outside of FOMO. Friendly local game stores have been, and will continue to be, the lifeblood of tabletop gaming.

@@MTFTabletop you should do some videos on malifaux. It's such a great game and so under represented

@@MTFTabletop you are so right id like you to talk about malifaux and dark future though aha my two fav games outside gw

Thanks! It was unscripted, but I had to do some heavy editing to lose a bunch of rambling nonsense 😉

Would also like to state that I've noticed a lot of fantasy style Kickstarter stl archives but not a lot of cool sci-fi stuff like mechs/mecha or space tanks or crazy stuff like that other than the Battletech kickstarters, which is fine, but a limited pool to draw from in terms of asthetics compared to just trying to figure out which company's dragon model looks nicer to you lol.

The obscene cost of GW products priced me out of the hobby for a long time. I’m happily playing ASOIAF miniatures game by CMoN which has its own issues, but the pricing and rules aren’t predatory. I’m also interested in trying out Frostgrave and One Page Rules

Look at Shadowrun, Rifts, or old school world of darkness.

You're absolutely right. I feel like WotC is slipping into the post-Gygax TSR mode, but with a LOT more money.

the chapter house lawsuit did 2 things to GW, 1 monopose models to try and destroy 3rd party bits companies, 2 they changed the names of every faction so they could trademark/copy right the names ( it was then names GW lost most of the court case on)

WH+ will never really affect their bottom line, the only way to get GWs attention is to stop buying their books and minis, no other way but most with just throw their cash at the new shiney GW releases, like the new imperial guard even though their prices are going up by 20% for the new models

Honestly right now I'm looking hardest at Monte Cook Games and whatever MCDM comes up with. If Paizo really does come out with ORC as promised, though, that could be huge. I know Paizo has had its problems. My hope is that the unionization of their staff has put a check on the worst of it.

@@MTFTabletop I wouldnt go for Monte Cooks stuff now either.

I don't need to trust Paizo either, if they stick to their guns the licenses they are creating won't be their possession. In theorie it will be held by a linux fondation like association, so no actors in the business can pull a WOTC.

@@sportyeight7769 they haven't answered several questions. One is about a Morality clause. Any way check it out over on GrimJim channel.

What's the issue with Monte Cook Games?

There was guide for how to use it online back than on some cases. OGL 1.0 and 1.0a never forbade online stuff it was just very hard to I think knights of the Chalice. Pathfinder: Kingmaker 13th age Castle and crusades Fate Fudge ect. For video game examples

The (now revoked) changes to the OGL threatened the livelihood of thousands of independent creators. Billion dollar companies do not need you to carry water for them, but the community does need such support. Please choose wisely.