STILL struggling to practice their own beliefs, because, almost all tribes have been deeply imprinted/forced to follow Christian varieties of religion for so long. Slowly, some are bring it back.. But sad that it is still so overwhelmed and changed by Christianity's stamp. But bottom line, IF the Abrahamic religions looked closely, and understood ancient traditions better, they would see themselves in it, and them in us. Because, what all religions basically teach are good rules to live by--how to be a decent human on the planet. But Religions have become so corrupted, almost none of them really understand or see how we are alike; they only see the differences, and it scares them--so they keep pushing more micro-management and ugly business dealings, to control what they do not understand.

Before 1978

@@Chimonger1 never stopped in our tribe we did it anyway

@@thunderwolf5969 VERY glad some have!!💜

A "monk" came up to me and tried to sell me a book on meditation. I said "how could this book possibly teach me about how to get in touch with myself?" He got mad and told me the monks at his temple would laugh at me because I'm not even on the first level with them lol. Then a man begging for money asked if I had a dollar. I didn't, but he said "you got God don't you?" Then he sang me a hymn. All I could think is, this man is the real monk. His life is his temple. (but I wanna say, I think the singing man understood all religions and spiritualities, even if he mentioned God specifically; the "monk" I don't think truly practiced any religion except capitalism and self-righteousness)

I have nordic descendants

@@corriescott2124 ok then

Same applies for the spiritual healers of mainstream American culture. Going to college and getting a degree in social work or psychology doesn't make you a healer either.

How do y'all feel about a white person living in New York going to acupuncture school, run by Chinese people, but then practicing on their own? They may not be Chinese, but this isn't China, and if they didn't do it, New Yorkers would not have access to something that would heal them. Plus, the Chinese school gets paid handsomely. Not saying it's the same as what's at hand here, but I'm curious what y'all think. It's been on my mind a while, because my acupuncturist is white, and I have gained a lot from going to see her that the MDs could not do for me.

Thank you for your comment . so true.

No no no....it goes, "Those who know WON'T tell; and those who WILL tell dont know". Basically either your woke or ya bitch a55 aint

A paraphrase of Lao Tzu? ancient Chinese sage-

Truly.

None have a clear, single heritage on the planet. Not for hundreds of thousands of years. Everyone's traveled worldwide, by land, water and /or air, for many thousands of years, mingling their DNA and traditions everywhere they move. .EVERYONE. ...So...you want people to only honor ONE of their roots? Discriminate against themselves?? Deny their other roots because they don't LOOK stereotypical for the traditions they practice...? How does that even work? Have you walked a mile or so in their shoes yet, to learn if they are true to their beliefs, before you get angry at them? If you dislike how someone is honoring their Spirituality, would you teach them to be more in line with your personal limitations? Would you fear learning from them? Have you checked out your own DNA, to learn where all your roots come from?

Winter Star Man you just DON'T GET IT ! geeez get a clue.

Na Dene You are absolutely entitled to think no one else "gets it"...though, holding onto that, can have painful consequences ....holding tight to that thought, in the way it sounds like you are doing, will keep pain in your heart and mind. It will keep stirring conflict. Some of the consequences of hearing your pain, causes hurting in others; I cannot heal your pain, only you can make that effort. Everyone has walked some harsh roads, and has to decide how they will carry those burdens...or if they will carry them. It _might_ stimulate you to do something _positive_ about it. Ever thought of how else you might perceive any piece of information? Everything has many ways to perceive it. I'm only stating one. Anyone can learn anything...it's a question of, is their heart in it? Dedicated to it? _Doing it properly?_ There's precious little that any ancient cultures have left, anywhere in the world; there are few pockets of indigenous groups that still live in the old ways; most must resurrect fragments and re-learn it. Many don't, for whatever reason. That is one of the saddest things. But OTH, what would a planet full of over 7 Billion people, look like, if everyone could return to tribal living? Really...what would that look like? How might that work? If you were going to re-start a culture, according to whatever ancient traditions used to be, how would you start doing that? Please...many people want to know. Natives never traditionally had casinos, watersides, hotels, glass walkways over the Grand Canyon, with all the foreign-made tourist junk for sale......but _are_ prospering from those. But, too often, those running those things, take on some of the worst behaviors of other cultures.....graft, corruption, greed, misuse of funds, pollution, even mistreating their own people, including family members. What Natives are screaming to stop those non-traditional, foreign subsidized travesties?? Foreigners come build things, then turn it over [eventually] to tribes...then what? Those have often milked out as much profit as they can, then dump them when there's huge infrastructure repairs needed. Guess what happens to those who protest those things? [clue: they often have been disenrolled from tribes, despite proving their heritage; or railroaded into developing their historic villages, connecting to commercial utilities against their wishes]. Yet, the money rolling in from those people traps, is helping rebalance things economically.....those area a fast start.... IF they are properly handled, to build into other income streams that are more environmentally sane. ......IDK...wind and solar farms? Manufacturing home unit machines that get water form humidity in the air and filter it, instead of from drilling wells, run off of solar panels or wind gens?? Making window solar air heaters for houses, to sell or trade? Learning how to green-build traditional houses that mesh well in regional climates, instead of suckering for crappy Warren Buffett empire trailer/mobile homes, which cannot withstand climate in the MidWest, without huge costs to run/upkeep?? Thing is, only Change is guaranteed. We get to choose all or part of how/what that change will be. Culture and tradition can have a lot, or little, to do with that. You choose what dogs to feed. We each choose to have a peaceful heart, or a burdened heart....no matter how harsh life may have been for a person [and all have walked some painful roads..everyone...if they claim never to have experienced pain in life, they're lying, or, they've truly learned to carry that burden more lightly]. I wish you a more peaceful heart, lighter burdens, and insight to make a better walk...you choose what you want that to look like.

Just more BS. ..Fake a** clueless colonists ..

It's easy to understand why white americans do this.They are desperate for an identity. I don't mean to sound harsh but face it, they're halfbreeds lol. Their blood has been mixed too much. It's hard to tell where the true roots are. It's natural they feel lost. I'm slavic, born and raised in Bulgaria (still there). I'd love to participate in some native american ceremony some day, but I know I will never be anything more than a guest there. At the end of the day, the Balkan is my home. I have no desire to stray from it. It's ancient and wild and can probably tell me more about me than anywhere else

nicolina1987 these are my thoughts exactly. i see it as them reaching for something to hold onto, looking for a void to fill

a lot of sympathy and pity to be had, though their actions unchecked by whom they're appropriating, results damaging, the true reason is profound wounds of the soul, of exile from their very foundations. these actions are a symptom of that like all actions. also natives protect your cultures but don't fall into the trap of dehumanizing hatred for people looking desperately to fill an essential void. have sympathy and pity

@@nicolina1026 absolutely correct- thanks for elucidating ♥️😊♥️

dagulf odinson From what I understand that's no easy endeavor considering what civilization and Christianity did to the tribes of Europe. Like the chopping down of Irminsul by Christianized Franks.

Missikech Kechqua It is a difficult road as pretty much all documentation of our ways have been destroyed or altered to a Christian stance. The Christians were fairly succesful in destroying the native European culture. There were small isolated villages where oral traditions survived like it has with Native American culture. On a side note, we know Vikings came to North America and assimilated to the Native cultures here, what I am curious to know is what was imported back to Northern Europe and/or what was exported here culturally. This is what facinates me, as the lines between Lakota and Viking way of thought are completely blurred it is almost a mirror image :)

dagulf odinson It is extremely doubtful that the Norse assimilated into this continent's indigenous population. The brief settlement at L'Anse aux Meadows failed due in large part to acts of aggression carried out by the Scandinavians against the indigenous people. Warriors were mustered and the invaders were driven back into the sea. At that time the Lakota living hundreds of miles away were mainly a woodland people who had not yet migrated out onto the plains. They could make canoes, but not long ships.

Missikech Kechqua the Norse were all over North America. Their Viking ships could travel the rivers. There have been Runestones discovered from Oklahoma all the way to Minnesota. There is no doubt they have been inland.

dagulf odinson I don't doubt that other Norse mariners visited this continent and probably made it up river several miles before being pushed back by cascades or large warlike inland tribes.Traded and captured Norse trinkets passed from tribe to tribe. However I don't think their brief presence reshaped the Lakota, Dakota, Nakota or any other tribal group's sense of being. What did reshape the Sioux's sense of being was the horses they began acquiring after tribes like the Ojibwe pushed them out onto the plains in the early 18th century. I realize it's difficult for some people to accept that we had being proficiently primitive down packed without the assistance of white Solutreans or even whiter flaxen haired people from northern Europe.

12navajo It's not just ours, there's plenty of practices that people exploit for their own personal gain. Don't let it sadden you though, because we know the truth and we need to continue walking down the red road.

12navajo By coincidence there is someone claiming to be a Navajo "shaman" on KZfaq. He is very supportive of these plastic medicine people and new age movement. He goes by the name Thunder Bow. He's also over at Psych Central Forums and some new age site called Spiritual Forums. Perhaps you've heard of him?

Missikech Kechqua I have not heard of this person. I could try and look him up and see what he's all about and I could get back to you on this issues.. Thank you for bringing this to my attention.

Jemiance I agree and walking the red road is already hard enough with out seeing ,and hearing these people use our spirituality because they read about it or sat with a native for a few days. u know?

12navajo I understand, I've seen my fair share of plastic Medicine man using my Lakota culture to gain popularity within the Native Community in California. They attempt to teach others but Wakan Tanka knows they are fake.

Cultural appropriation. Those very words were made up by the same kind of people. BS. This is spiritual Scam artists. They exist in Native culture also.

And if they do practice it from their own culture the Native Americans think that they are 'borrowing' from the Natives and distorting it and being disrespectful. They don't know how similar our ways are. I just think it is bad form to be fixated on criticizing how anybody is relating to their Divinity and claiming ownership of the form in which somebody is praying.

it is not a Russian word.. www.cabrillo.edu/~crsmith/shaman.html

2passnthru2, you do realize that Siberia is a part of Russia?! ;)

@@thehiddenyogi8557 No they don't, there's a huge difference between European shamanism and Native shamanism. Nobody confuses the two.

@@David-bg9od " there's a huge difference between European shamanism and Native shamanism" Elaborate. How do, for example, Mari religion or any other Finnic shamanism differ from indigenous North American shamanism? For me, they seem rather similar. How do you seperate Uralic shamanism from proto-indo european paganism?

Very good, I'll call them that too 🤣

They are no seekers. They are looters. They are con people. They at their best are business people. But the only thing they sell is their lies and half cooked truths. Maybe some of them were genuinely interested at the start of their " journey ", but it's obvious from what I see and hear that these people are all about the benefits they can get from giving some naive people the fantasy they fancy.

Now they're business people.

Missikech Kechqua right!

I'm laughing! it's so true!

Hahahaha very true. ^_^

justin williams Ditto. xD

They don't have guts.

Native Americans are so funny and good at jokes

as a first nations person. i'd say that it is not a terrible crime to follow/ practice my belief, and to privately do them. but the thing is you can not act as if you are a know it all about my people practices. such as trying to lead ceremonies or try to bless people. the only way that you'd have a small chance of doing anything remotely like that as an outsider is if you grew up among the natives and was brought under a traditional spiritual persons wing for many years and learned the teachings. think of it as, sure you can go to the church and practice being a christian. but you can not pretend to be a priest like a bunch of plastic shamans try to be.

#ErikBulters , there are more local spiritual traditions as well. Heathen groups based on the ancient ways of Europe and The Lowlands. What attracts you to the native american culture. vs. the European one? ( Besides it being more globally known and appropriated.) There are many similarities between the European heathen spirituality and worldviews and those of native tribes, all over the world, including the native American ones! I have to agree with Derrick Barney; To start saying you are a priest, or shaman out of the blue, or after following a quick course with another self proclaimed shaman, is just a sad practice.

Why not try to look into your ancestory, and beliefs first? A lot of open practices and beliefs are just there, that you can commit to 100%! why look so far, and pry into a community that asked to be left alone because it was a victim of conolization, genocide, stereotypes, violence, rape, sexualization, to this day ?

I would suggest that you research the mystical traditions of the Christian faith with a trained spiritual director.

You say “why would i be excluded from traditions that embrace all earth life?” But you (like all white people who want to take from our cultures) forget that our traditions where created long before we knew of your existence. Our traditions embraced all life on earth as we understood it, and as hard hitting as it may sound it does not include you. Of course now we can include white people in our ceremonies and traditions, but that takes work and is a great expense to our own spiritual health. We still need our own ceremonies and traditions that only we can perform and use.

WORD...walk your talk, or be the change- leave all the commerce and do something real

In the early 90's pre internet I met several new agers...they were so superficial and down right mean people. They didn't know how to show or even feel unconditional love.

You are so right, I was invited by some new ager women in the early 90's to visit with them and they were so hostile I got up and left. My husband's grandfather was a Medicine Man and it takes years and years of training and you are chosen - you just don't decide "when I grow up I want to be".

The New Age movement is even stronger, IMO. All this supposed Reiki certification energy healing BS that the common man claims is sad.

Persimmon Frost it’s a void they’re trying to fill

stating that there is no white culture isnt racism, especially when its factual. what white americans practice culturally is a mishmash of what they adopted thru cultural developments that minorities have made. there isnt a white culture. there is american culture, and move often than not, it is created by the same people white people have historically oppressed.

A Lakota will say if your born in America your native American. If your Lakota, your Lakota.

If you’re white fuck off

+sugarray300 You have self-respect. Stay true to it. Peace.

+sugarray300 +1

They dont like being called Native Americans. Their tribe name is correct.

Of course you don't think anything is wrong with cultural appropriation or misrepresentation of our beliefs and practices

Apparently you don't know how to read. " I don't think there is anything wrong with embracing a religious or spiritual tradition" That stated nothing about condoning misrepresentation of beliefs and practices. Secondly "However, my problem is with the exploitation and whoring of traditions that are supposed to be sacred." Again learn to read. Thirdly Aho Mitakuye Oyasin.

Jhana Quinn Aho Mitakuye Oyasin.? All NDNs are not Lakota nor do they speak it, so please spare this Shawnee your appropriated catch phrases. I read quite well enough into you.

Missikech Kechqua yeah they throw around mitakuye oyasin like all us native people speak the same language.. they already think we all have one religion and live in tipis..

Brookee Saponi I don't have to impart how they arrive at such bizarre notions, do I?

Lakota Oyate Problem is that civilization, (mainly Rome) and Christianity eradicated their original and traditional sense of being.

Lakota Oyate That is very true. The Abrahamic religions were always genocidal. First it was, "we're the chosen ones, everyone else is our chattel". Then Jesus comes to them to reform them, then Paul wanted to start converting gentiles. Then they were back to square one. I don't see the Muslims being any different either.There is no way to coexist with a spirituality that is inherently intolerant of others. I do recognize that individuals of these groups have done much good. But overall they've been one of the worst things unleashed upon the world since The Bush family.

Similar? Perhaps Mirrors? No.

Missikech Kechqua I have to agree with you on that, we are very similar. In fact many times when discussing these sort of things with the Native Americans I have come across, especially the medicine men and women, it's really fun to talk about the similarities in practices, methods and techniques.

John Ford Fun?

Missikech Kechqua Mmhmm we usually both get really excited to see ssimilaritiesin the ways we do things and the things we believe. We're more alike than we think, and it's amazing to connect with people.

John Ford You envision it as being as such, but we have retained what the new age seekers do not have any longer so now they seek to appropriate and recreate it.

Yes, this! You would be surprised how many things Celtic Paganism has in common with certain Native traditional beliefs and sacred objects. If a person is non-Native and drawn to things that resemble sacred Native ideas and spiritual truths, it could be Celtic ancestral memories. These people might do well to research Celtic Reconstructionism. In this film, they speak disparagingly of Native spiritual teachers who are not against non-Native people learning these things with the proper respect. But these traditions help to hold the universe together. Maybe it's time. Indian tribes used to adopt white people all the time and believed intermarriage would help bring out the best strengths of both peoples.

Charlatan

@@Indygenous There is verifiable research into reincarnation memories of children who are very young. You can find it with Google. I haven't evaluated all that research, and all I've done was share my experience in my comment. I had my Chinese memory when I was three years old, and my father and mother - a Mennonite minister and a Mennonite inspirational writer with an international following - provided me with no impetus to remember my previous lives. For you to call me a charlatan says more about you than about me. What it says is that you are a judgmental individual who likes to point fingers at people you don't understand. That makes you prejudiced and a bigot.

OH, How I wish you'd see what we're seeing nowadays.... White people from Europe thinking they're entitled to ancestry they don't know shit about, buying from white shops and attending white meetings to reach a "new level of enlightenment", "to be a new self", "to be full of light and love". This shit drives me insane

I know a few people like that. They have a small amount of native ancestry and are white af. But if you met them you'd think they were completely Native.

try to contact that family. or somehow try to find some sort of work on a reservation. there are some whites that work as elder workers or nurses on our reservations and the people are always sharing stories to the non natives. teaching them words in our language, teaching some of our practices and customs to them. since you are half, if you find out what reservation your family came from, it might be possible to get a house on that reserve.

what does that have to do with anything?

That's a sorry excuse when money is being paid and lives are being lost over stolen practices. If reality is infinite how come people can't handle the reality of theft?

@@AtenRa it's got everything

@@revishon ...What does that even mean? Do you believe these white folks shouldn't be held accountable then because "reality's got everything?"

@@AtenRa I wouldn't pretend to have the answers. All I know is if we forget to love we lose ourselves and eachother. Infinity is everything ever so that means the good, bad, ugly, and the unimaginable. Our personal histories on this planet are composed of a complex web of various different understandings that we all pretend to be the same as to what reality is and isn't.(consider how many religions are on earth( even when we are in the same room we are in different rooms)) We in our desire to be right lose sight on how differently one can experience life. If we are patient with ourselves and eachother then there is the potential to be listened to and to listen.

@@revishon You have nice sentiments but another expression of love is having mercy on people who have been victimized. You can remember to love by showing people how their experiences are hurting others. People have had their webs of complex understandings broken by thoughtless people taking without care. Your acts have resonance and since patience and listening are so valuable to you, one ought to be patient and listen when they are committing theft. Then maybe they can learn to repair the web.

White people, or should I say Europeans had their primitive tribal sense of being eradicated by the early Mediterranean civilizations(namely Rome) and the spread of Abrahamic monotheistic religions. The European ancestor spirits, which are extremely important in keeping up old traditions have been purged from their memory and sense of being. Europeans cannot claim or call upon ancestors of the many diverse groups traditional indigenous people who long faced difficulties not unlike the tribes of Europe, but managed to retain their ancient beliefs. Unless one has been fully adopted by a tribe and his or her white blood washed out, that path back is almost impossible to find.

Missikech Kechqua So Native Americans, or should I say Asians (since that's where they came from) have no common ancestor with Europeans, but the video refers to non-Indians as brothers and sisters. Why would my blood have to be washed if we are of the same blood?

Adam Hollingsworth What, are you spoon fed misinformation about us from the nuagers?

Missikech Kechqua Please tell me what misinformation. All of what I said is based on scientific evidence. White people came to the Americas from Europe. The Red Man came to the Americas from Asia (Bering land bridge, look it up!) Scientific study also shows us that all humans originated from Northern Africa, so we all share ancestors. And, to be clear, I don't practice any Native American spirituality (I had to look up what the derogatory term, nuagers, means), but your comments come across as very racist, which upsets me.

Adam Hollingsworth In some of the tribal adoption ceremonies white people were taken down to a river or stream where their white blood was ceremonially washed away. Out of Africa? Perhaps. From Asia across Beringia onto the western hemisphere? More than likely. Common ancestor? Maybe, but no justification for over 500 years of genocide and continuing subjugation. Racism? More like a strong bias tinged with wariness.

+Jackee Saumani That's how you're always going to be able to distinguish them from everyone. Our names are sacred and we only use them when we talk with Wakan Tanka, we don't let anyone know our names, so when we see people like the people in the video. It's very disheartening knowing that they're able to trick people into paying a lot of money for a spiritual journey. Very sad to see....

we NDNs don't call our spiritual leaders and medicine people shamans..