WHO is Winning the FIGHT between AIRBUS and QATAR Airways?!

Рет қаралды 234,858

Жыл бұрын

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This is the second video about the ongoing feud between Airbus and Qatar Airways regarding the paint chipping off Qatar’s Airbus A350’s. In this video I will discuss how this might affect Qatar Airways in their preparation for the soccer World Cup.
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Below you will find the links to videos and sources used in this episode. Enjoy checking them out!
Sources
-----------------------------------------------------
Petter’s previous Qatar A350 video:
• Airbus vs Qatar | What...
Qatar Airways’ own video showing paint damage:
• Qatar Airways Statemen...
A recent source:
www.reuters.com/business/aero...
Source about Qatar returning its A380s to service:
www.reuters.com/business/aero...
Qatar world cup stadium:
• Video
Paint issue:
• Qatar A350 paint issue...
Qatar A350:
• Video
Qatar A350 making:
• Qatar Airways' Airbus ...
Qatar soccer cup:
• 2022 FIFA World Cup: Q...
Airbus:
• Airbus A350-1000 Type ...
Airbus formation:
• “Family flight” - Five...
Boeing 737MAX10:
• The New Boeing 737 MAX 10
A321neo making:
• In the Making: First #...
Qatar A330:
• Qatar Airways Inaugura...
Qatar A330 2:
• Qatar Airways Inaugura...
Qatar A380:
• Qatar Airways Airbus A...
Qatar A380 2:
• The Qatar Airways A380...
A380 making:
• In the making: All Nip...
Boeing 737:
• Boeing 787-10 Dreamlin...

Пікірлер: 865

@Tch5802 Жыл бұрын

Looks like Qatar thought it could squeeze airbus during the pandemic and now doesn’t want to lose face.

@jillcrowe2626 Жыл бұрын

This behavior by a customer will absolutely raise the price of future orders from Qatar to any European organization. Contractual agreements are sacrosanct. Now, the price doubles.

@stankythecat6735 Жыл бұрын

It’s a cat fight for the ages !

@Cingearth Жыл бұрын

Qatar made more money than any other airline during the pandemic !

@ETTechnologis Жыл бұрын

That is so true. And besides that, Qatar Airways is known to be a very, very complicated and at some point annoying customer in the industry.

@katego370 Жыл бұрын

Snobby sheiks who are used to being served and flattered. Admitting that they were wrong is too embarrassing in their circle of snobs. It's grown men acting like spoiled rich kids and it seems like that pretty much sums up government and leadership positions in Qatar.

@jjquinn2004 Жыл бұрын

I lived and did business in the Middle East for 25 years, inc in Qatar. Face and face-saving are a key part of the culture there. I don't expect Qatar Airways and Al Bakr to back down on the paint issue; they'd rather lose their collective shirts in court.

@user-lv7ph7hs7l Жыл бұрын

Yeah unfortunately my experience has been similar. Loosing face is a huge thing a little like in some Asian cultures especially the older generation. Spent quite some time there and the divide in philosophy between above and below ~40-50 is absolutely huge. Don't know about Qatar but if you look at Iran the situation is similar. The old guard in power and the on average young population are fundamentally opposed. Pride never helps anyone.

@_Ben4810 Жыл бұрын

Al-Baker in particular is a petulant, arrogant & unpleasant individual... The fact his name is mentioned in relation to the death of former Discover Qatar executive Marc Bennett is unsurprisinging...

@iwatchwithnoads7480 Жыл бұрын

@@user-lv7ph7hs7l "problem with the older generation" said every "younger generation" ever everywhere. This rhetoric is never productive

@user-lv7ph7hs7l Жыл бұрын

@@iwatchwithnoads7480 They are completely different mentalities. If you knew Asia you wouldn't say such a stupid thing.

@iwatchwithnoads7480 Жыл бұрын

@@user-lv7ph7hs7l i didn't compare anything. replied to the wrong person?

@Ticklestein Жыл бұрын

Coming from a legal professional: It’s not weird to hear AirBus is winning the legal fight, if you see the publicly available info on the case, AirBus isn’t being unreasonable in how they’re handling the problem, which is the general principle on which European contracts (like the ones with AirBus) are based.. combine that with UK Common law’s “contractclause is contractclause”-mentality…. “Pacta sunt servanda” - The agreement will be served.

@Jonathan_Doe_ Жыл бұрын

Things will change if this paint/mesh issue does turn out to be a safety issue at some point. The manufacturers have historically had a habit of “ad hoc ergo proctor hoc”ing their way out of reports of issues from airlines “well, non of them have fallen out the sky yet, so our design must be ok”.

@Ticklestein Жыл бұрын

@@Jonathan_Doe_ Eh, EASA and FAA say they're airworthy.

@esahm373 Жыл бұрын

Nice Latin gibberish. But what's your point?

@ThePeperich Жыл бұрын

@@esahm373 Tess translated “pacta sund…” - It means: “If you agree on something, you have to oblige it” (come whatever). Changes can only be made if both sides are okay with it. Qatar became personal in a way, to say it an internet way: Mimimi. In the business world between professionals there is no room for that (mimimi is for Kids and Twitter only). And Tess said, Airbus did what they had to do and did it in the right way. I hope that helps you… for the record, there was no bla bla, just a very short and excellent explanation.

@ThePeperich Жыл бұрын

@Tess Do you have an idea why the UK are the place of jurisdiction? The Netherlands, France, Germany or even Spain seems much more reasonable as neither Airbus nor Qatar have links to the UK but Airbus is an EU registered company?

@CrazyArcher2160 Жыл бұрын

It seems to me that Qatar originally wanted to grab some money from Airbus as compensation, but the matters went out of hand. When Airbus declined to give in, Qatar didn't want to lose face and got caught up in a circle of raising the stakes. But it's just my guess.

@mwat22 Жыл бұрын

true

@arceuslee7087 Жыл бұрын

Or maybe planes are faulty

@wengelder9256 Жыл бұрын

@@arceuslee7087 no regulator has decided so , except Qatar . Every airline and regulator have stated to have issues with cosmetic issues . Qatar Airways makes bold statements and complaints with every new aircraft being delivered . That’s what they do . This time , a supplier simply gave them the finger .

@coffeelover5827 Жыл бұрын

Qatar has the money. I think it's not about the money it's about the faulty

@lani6647 Жыл бұрын

It’s like this. Airbus has sold a defective product (whether cosmetically or functionally so. Qatar dared to complain and now they’re getting shafted.

@thetowndrunk988 Жыл бұрын

Awesome video. Always polished, straight to the point, and well explained. This is gonna be interesting to follow

@Hartbreak1 Жыл бұрын

I can understand why Airbus cancelled both contracts. If Qatar went as far as declaring the paint issue as a flight safety issue and got support from the regulatory agency of their country and then refused deliveries, I’m sure Airbus wouldn’t want a repeat of that with the A321 orders. I think more than an issue of prestige it has now turned into an issue of trust.

@Dracogame Жыл бұрын

On top of that, Airbus is currently going at full production on the A32x-family, so it's not like they are losing money. They will just work for airlines that are more likely to actually pay.

@aliirtazabhatti5911 10 ай бұрын

As long as we c less n less airbusses in the air umm happy 😁 unfortunately Boeing Don have small to medium range people haulers 😢

@GeeBoggs Жыл бұрын

Oh, my gosh, I'm continually amazed by how beautifully you break questions down into simple terms for us non-techies! - Sonoma, CA

@CheatOnlyDeath Жыл бұрын

Petter's conclusion is spot-on perfect.

@fToo Жыл бұрын

@12:15 "an artificial spat" i'm not sure you can describe it like that at this stage. Once Qatar invoked the safety card it upped the stakes for both sides. And so neither can now be seen to back down. And "prestige" is always an issue for Al Bakar, and for Airbus.

@jursamaj Жыл бұрын

I suspect prestige is more of an issue for Al Bakar. Airbus is not a member of an autocratic monarchy.

@the80386 Жыл бұрын

@@jursamaj prestige is certainly an issue for Airbus too - especially given the dreaded 'S-word' had already been pulled out of the bag (safety). if you don't like the term 'prestige' in airbus' context, then feel free to replace it with 'reputation', but the underlying dynamic remains the same.

@jursamaj Жыл бұрын

@@the80386 Yeah, no. The word "safety" came up as soon as the world's aviation authorities started talking about flightworthiness. Qatar didn't "up the ante", since that had already been on the table.

@grahamo22 Жыл бұрын

@@jursamaj Akbar isnt even Qatari - he is from Baluchistan originally, and so he has to be even more of a Qatari so as to not let any natural born Qatari point out that it would have been handled differently had they not given his job to a 'foreigner' like Akbar. You are spot on about Akbar - an egotists who has created a really great airline but unfortunately has never operated in an environment when others can just say No to him.

@jursamaj Жыл бұрын

@@grahamo22 Really? According to his wiki page, he was born in Doha, Qatar.

@C.Fecteau-AU-MJ13 Жыл бұрын

Maybe the supply chain problems will make these orders very easy to move on to other waiting customers

@Scoopta Жыл бұрын

While I do sort of understand the concern with how airbus is handling the issue, ultimately qatar airways signed the contract with the cross-default clause...if they didn't like it, they shouldn't have signed it. Airbus isn't really doing anything wrong here IMO, they're sticking to their contract.

@Scoopta Жыл бұрын

@@somebody700 then they should negotiate to not have those clauses in there if they're that concerned

@Scoopta Жыл бұрын

@@somebody700 yeah, that's fair

@jokepp Жыл бұрын

@C B How is anti-American sentiment relevant here? No Americans are involved or am I mistaken?

@mike-barber Жыл бұрын

Not sure if it's the case, but it's possible the cross-default clause works both ways - i.e. allowing Qatar to pull out if Airbus doesn't uphold its end. It might have appeared like a good idea for Qatar at the time too.

@charles5a Жыл бұрын

@@mike-barber Exactly. It's not an unusual clause in contracts, and usually it's bilateral.

@frollard Жыл бұрын

I'm really surprised to see the a380 being retired with the post-pandemic passenger numbers we are seeing. Definitely some multi-variable calculus in those decisions.

@ThePeperich Жыл бұрын

Let’s hope for that many more airlines will have a need for the next A380 or 747 or whatever, so that a Airbus rethink A380 NEO, develope “A480” or Boeing create a new “848” the 747 successor (or how ever the planes may be called). Combined with sustained fuel, new only wing designs, new engines and much more… there is still room and hope for new Kings and Queens in the sky.

@paul756uk2 Жыл бұрын

I watched a video recently (can't think who it was) where they're putting A380's back into service due to some airports restricting the number of flights due to their net zero obsession. Edit. He did state that towards the end of the video that they're putting all 10 back into service.

@siriussaracen8371 Жыл бұрын

@@paul756uk2 wow dude you serious? A380 coming back into production and service?

@paul756uk2 Жыл бұрын

@@siriussaracen8371 not sure about production. I don't think there's any plans for that, but returning more into service. Some airports like Heathrow are limiting the number of annual flights because of this net zero bs and also because of pilot shortages so I guess that reinstating some A380s makes sense. Have a look at simple flying channel. "Airbus a380s are back whilst Boeing falters on wide bodies"

@metalgearsolidsnake6978 Жыл бұрын

@spiderman no way home

@anthonydecastro6938 Жыл бұрын

I don't think you meant "prestige"; you most probably meant "pride". It is now a matter of pride for both parties to stick to their guns. But you seem to slide over the fact that it was Qatar who started all this. And it was Qatar which did NOT want any negotiation but proceeded to bring Airbus to court. In my view, Airbus just has had enough of the pompous posturing of Qatar. And now Qatar is held hostage to Boeing. That they now have to re-activate their 330s and 380s shows the stupidity of Qatar in this whole matter.

@beeble2003 Жыл бұрын

Thanks -- "prestige" was obviously wrong, but I couldn't figure out what he actually meant. I think you're right with "pride".

@NicolaW72 Жыл бұрын

Indeed, exactly!

@jordanalexander4331 Жыл бұрын

I don’t think it’s the airline itself, rather, it’s chief executive who is known for being animated in overdramatic when something happens. I think the company needs to look at a possible change in leader ship to restore the relationship with Airbus. Secondly, they can simply reactivate all those eight 350s that have been grounded because there’s absolutely nothing wrong with them.

@ahmadkidwai3141 Жыл бұрын

Firstly if they change the CEO it will mean accepting defeat to airbus and secondly if Qatar reactivates the A350 the court case does not hold then.

@anthonydecastro6938 Жыл бұрын

that's not going to happen. Qatar and its airline are owned by the family that rules the country. And the ceo belongs to that family. Politics, Business, etc. are all of a piece in that country.

@jursamaj Жыл бұрын

@@anthonydecastro6938 And *that* is why the case started in the 1st place. Autocrats aren't fond of not getting their way.

@MP-cb7zk Жыл бұрын

That will literally never happen! When the executive at QA is comprised of members of the Royal Family and the Royal Elite, just like 99% of all senior level government & business sector positions throughout the country. Those roles don't get filled simply by anyone; Qatar is not a democracy.

@Peizxcv Жыл бұрын

Amazing how people that don’t fly put safety last and toss all safety concern as overreacting. If the plane was designed to fly with no paint or exposed carbon fiber some airlines would have ordered it that way

@kadose Жыл бұрын

This is the first video on this topic (and I’ve watched quite a few) that actually explained why there were issues with the A350’s paint job. Thanks for clarifying it.

@delta_cosmic Жыл бұрын

If Qatar would just cooperate with airbus and help solve the issue then none of this crap would have happened. Ultimately Qatar's intentions of them asking for money in a baby manner made Airbus look like good people here in which they're with them solving the issue to prevent this from happening again on future a350s.

@petep.2092 Жыл бұрын

I'd like to know how the paint and copper mesh repair scheme is going at the other airlines. What does it entail? What does it look like when done? Is it holding up to wear and tear? Or showing signs of cracking open again? or…?

@mantinizz Жыл бұрын

Good insight. Thank you.

@MentourNow Жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching!

@nopenotme6369 Жыл бұрын

I suspect a personal offense was taken, between one or both parties. I seen this kind of damage on E-175’s as an A&P, we had a contractor fix the delamination, I don’t know if the rework was paid for by Embrair as warranty work or my employer just paid for it, but talking to my contacts in the Engineering Dept and middle management, nobody was too worked up about the problem.

@mancubwwa Жыл бұрын

It's mostly Quatar trying to shift the cost of pandemic groundings back onto Airbus, by relying on the fact that airline and regulator are owned by the same guy. And airbys simply not having their BS.

@kenoliver8913 Жыл бұрын

Never underestimate the influence of simple personality clashes in business or politics. CEOs and Presidents alike tell themselves that they are cold-blooded negotiators who do not let their ego get in the way of business or diplomacy - but they are ALWAYS fooling themselves in that.

@OfficialSamuelC Жыл бұрын

Excellent video as always Petter and gang!

@DHRUVPATEL-cl5qb Жыл бұрын

I Work in a PCB manufacturing company and we have our own fair share of customers like Qatar who complain about every small thing which has no effect on the functionality of the product. These customers just like all airlines have multiple suppliers and they have problems with all of them. We like to deal with all our customers professionally up to the point it doesn’t start hurting us financially. Our business also runs financially the same way as airbus. When all suppliers start kicking 1 picky customer out they have no choice but to pay a higher price because no one wants to do business with them. In the end these companies run themselves into the ground no matter how good they treat the end customer. Qatar clearly doesn’t understand that there are only 2 major airline manufacturing companies and having bad relationship with either one or both of them is an extremely terrible idea. That’s just 1 way of running yourself into the ground.

@cassiebanks Жыл бұрын

I'd actually like to see a video about the life of one of these "stored" Qatar Alirlines planes and how the mechanics go about choosing which planes to pull out of retirement first and all the things they do to get them back into shape. Not exactly something one can report on without being there I suppose, but it is interesting to me. I was also surprised by the fact they were retired so early.

@indahooddererste Жыл бұрын

kzfaq.info/get/bejne/Zpl_mN1yvM-sd4U.html Its a small docu about reactivating an A340 from Lufthansa u can put english subs under it.

@mhdibm7515 Жыл бұрын

I agree

@arturoeugster7228 Жыл бұрын

Cassie Newer aircraft had lower operating costs, in view of the rapidly increasing fuel prices and pressures to reduce oil products, fuel consumption reductions were the deciding factor. Aircraft go through periodic maintenance and tests , performing those tests before putting them back in operation, is what happens. In this case the A 350's need repair . AB refuses to fix the problem, The court in England will decide, while Quatar happily flies their 67 B-777's, more economically btw.

@C_e_z_i Жыл бұрын

keep it up! I love these videos

@lisanadinebaker5179 Жыл бұрын

As a composites engineer, I have to agree with Qatar in that loss of skin integrity (paint peeling) is a concern. Their mistake is calling it a safety issue. It is an airframe life issue. Those composites inside that metal mesh are highly susceptible to moisture damage. With breaks in the paint, moisture will gradually penetrate into the structure which may shorten the use life of the airframe. You spend this much money on something, you want to get your money's worth. But you don't start tossing the "safety" word around in the airline industry unless you have data to support it.

@JonathanStanley Жыл бұрын

... and we may or may not know about an airframe lightning strike mitigation failure for an A350 till maybe 10 years down the line... just hope it's not one that causes a hull loss...

@suprashank Жыл бұрын

Curious question - Is it to do with that specific paint color that Qatar uses?

@JonathanStanley Жыл бұрын

@@suprashank Think CX was the next carrier that saw significant issues... could be a primer issue, general environment issue (desert plus salty sea air), thermal cycles, paint chemistry/colour issue (QR uses grey rather than white?), or some combo of the above... tricky eh?

@dopepopeurban6129 Жыл бұрын

@@suprashank Lufthansa, Air France and Finnair are experiencing similar paint issues, neither climate noir paint structure is the cause. May be the age as said carriers, including QA, operate the „oldest“ A350s built.

@asicdathens Жыл бұрын

Several people from Airbus or in contact with Airbus corporation commented on social media that Qatar was warned multiple times not to use thick layers of paint, They obviously did and the result was a not so elastic paint that would crack and peel off.

@durchschnittlicherzuschaue9733 Жыл бұрын

Looks as if Qatar has scored a spectacular own goal even ahead of the upcoming World Cup. I'm no industry expert but I suppose that you need aircraft to operate an airline. Perhaps someone should point out to Karen al Baker that it doesn't look like a good strategy to kill your relationship with the bigger of only two manufacturers that produce the kind of planes that you need.

@danharold3087 Жыл бұрын

One could say the same of Airbus.

@durchschnittlicherzuschaue9733 Жыл бұрын

@@danharold3087 Why? While Qatar is a major airline and was a good customer, there are plenty of airlines that are buying Airbus planes. In contrast to this there are only two manufacturers that build the kind of planes Qatar needs and Qatar is now completely reliant on the smaller one.

@danharold3087 Жыл бұрын

@@durchschnittlicherzuschaue9733 Airbus makes an excellent line of aircraft. As does Boeing. I said "same as airbus" because while Qatar lost a aircraft provider Airbus lost a major customer. They both shot themselves in the foot. Qatar used a 50 cal and Airbus maybe a smaller caliber. We have yet to see what that caliber is.

@caput_in_astris Жыл бұрын

Haha 😀 Yes I agree assuming an airline needing an aicraft to operate seems reasonable from a non-expert point of view.

@kkao33 Жыл бұрын

@@danharold3087 I don't think that will be the case. A320/321 neo and A350 are selling like hot cakes. Other airline will be more than happy to pick up delivery slot free up by Al Baker temper tantrum. A350 has pick up over 90 new orders in the last 2 years. They do not miss QA in any shape and form. And now QA will have the pleasure of only rely on Boeing for new aircraft, you can kiss goodbye any discount from Boeing knowing they are the only supplier to QA now.

@johncgibson4720 Жыл бұрын

I like the reawakening of the A380 option. Just personal opinion.

@user-lv7ph7hs7l Жыл бұрын

My entire childhood was spent admiring the program and being super proud of finally having a European 747 and now they are being retired after 5 years. Barely a quarter of the development program. Super sad. I hope jumbo jets make a comeback and maybe Boeing makes a replacement for 747. But a proper one, not just glue two 787 together with a software fix to keep it flying level...

@shrimpflea Жыл бұрын

I think they are done. Jumbos are just too expensive and too limiting to operarate for most passenger carriers. The 747F will be around for decades at least.

@user-lv7ph7hs7l Жыл бұрын

@@shrimpflea I can still dream about my supersonic double decker jumbo jets. I imagine an XB-70, but 300 m long , 4000 t fully loaded with 70 engines, half scramjets, a bunch of turbofans and the rest afterburning turbojets. And screw fuel cost it runs on liquid methane made by solar powered sabatier reactors taking carbon from the atmosphere. For long distance it carries LOX droptanks and boosts into a low orbit, stainless steel airframe with ceramic tiles on the bottom. 1500 passengers, atmospheric top speed mach 9, mach 20 with the droptanks and auxiliary rocket engines.

@user-lv7ph7hs7l Жыл бұрын

@@shrimpflea The staircase connecting the 3 main decks is of course styled after RMS Olympic.

@rilmar2137 Жыл бұрын

Well, Qatar shot itself in the foot here

@anthonydecastro6938 Жыл бұрын

not just the foot; the mouth as well!!!

@heidirabenau511 Жыл бұрын

In the heart more like

@rodkennedy9800 Жыл бұрын

I think Qatar believed the old adage ‘the customer is always right’ and Airbus’s patience finally run out! Real world!!!

@dennis2376 Жыл бұрын

Thank you and have great week.

@AndreSomers Жыл бұрын

The purchase of those max-10’s may also turn out to be a miscalculation, given the troubles Boeing has to certify the type.

@rashkavar Жыл бұрын

I wonder if Qatar Airways might also benefit from renting from an aircraft holding company. Here in Canada, many of Air Canada's planes were (before the pandemic) actually owned by a company named Chorus Aviation, which just owns a bunch of planes and rents them out to airlines to pad out their fleet as needed. Such companies have faced great difficulties over the last few years, for obvious reasons - the first step to downsizing one's active fleet is to cut off the rental contracts and let the owners deal with mothballing. So, it's conceivable that such an organization might be willing to consider contracts from further afield than they normally would. Chorus normally works within Canada, but if Qatar Airways called them up and said "we want your whole fleet of jet liners" the response would probably be positive right about now. (I'm sure there are other companies elsewhere that are probably somewhat more convenient to Qatar than Chorus Aviation - Canada's more than halfway to the opposite side of the world from Qatar, after all. But it's the only such company I know of.)

@Curt_Sampson Жыл бұрын

Right; aircraft leasing is a big thing and there are plenty of companies out there that do it. AerCap, with some 1,756 aircraft owned, is by far the largest, as far as I can tell. The "Lessors" section of the Wikipedia "Aircraft lease" page lists the top 20 as of 2015. (Since then the second largest, GECAS, has merged with AerCap.)

@beeble2003 Жыл бұрын

Most airlines lease a sizeable fraction of their fleet. If you're leasing out wide-bodied aircraft, the distance from you to the potential lessee isn't really an issue -- it's never more than 20 hours' flight.

@abikeanditsboy3449 Жыл бұрын

I think he's on to something with the possibility that Qatar grounded the airplanes during the pandemic as a cost saving measure. Good chance the strategy backfired and now both sides are married to their respective positions and can't back down.

@arielleblond6201 Жыл бұрын

If you ground your fleet because of the pandemic and ask Airbus to pay for it, because of a minor problem, you're a cheater. People won't trust you anymore.

@beeble2003 Жыл бұрын

@@derektaylor2941 Er, that's not how courts work. (Unless the OP is one of Airbus's lawyers.)

@bpp299 Жыл бұрын

Looks very likely. Too bad for Qatar.

@abikeanditsboy3449 Жыл бұрын

@@derektaylor2941 - Dude, lighten up, it's a KZfaq comment section not a court of law and its an opinion not evidence. Hopefully you understand the subtle differences. I'm simple saying that the notion that an airline could get its national regulator to ground the airplane so the airline could cut their losses during the pandemic is quite reasonable. I can easily see business executives making that decision. Qatar Airways would lose millions upon millions during the pandemic and a chance to shift $600 million or more in losses to Airbus would be hard to pass up. If that's the notion being made by Airbus in court, which it sounds like it is because the notion is out there and needs to be fought, I would not be surprise in the least to find out it's true. So no evidence, bro, just an opinion saying that it wouldn't shock me if it were true.

@abikeanditsboy3449 Жыл бұрын

@@derektaylor2941 - #1 Thanks for allowing me to have an opinion. I appreciate it. Unfortunately for you all you're probably ever going to hear about the reason behind the grounding of the airplanes will be pure speculation. Even if Qatar Airways did conspire with their regulator to have the airplanes grounded to mitigate losses they would never, ever admit to that in court as their case relies on this being a flight safety issue. #2 I've never heard this myth about Airbus being able to do no wrong. I certainly think they're quite capable of doing wrong.

@JohnnieHougaardNielsen Жыл бұрын

If Airbus had folded quickly during the pandemic, when Qatar went in attack mode, a quick resolution would likely have been very good business for the airline, but that gamble badly backfired by it becoming a protracted legal battle instead, with the cancellation of the A321neo orders on top to really break the plans for passenger capacity and so on. But with strong state backing, the airline can afford to waste a huge amount of money, of course.

@dimjad7933 Жыл бұрын

Why would they do that ? Than other Airlines could question the Air worthiness of the A350 series and they would loose way to much.

@JohnnieHougaardNielsen Жыл бұрын

I suspect that the idea was something like "as a very big customer, Airbus can't risk losing us, and our friendly local regulator helped us by declaring it a safety issue, so our hand is too strong to resist". Sure, there is a skin quality issue, which will be expensive for Airbus to solve in a good way, but playing the "safety" card was too high stakes without other regulators agreeing.

@dimjad7933 Жыл бұрын

@@JohnnieHougaardNielsen I totally agree with you on that. Undoubtedly Airbus are at fault for what is happening with the A350. But also the airline tried to play them. If EASA and FAA don't find it as Air Worthiness issue then Airbus made the right decision.

@todortodorov940 Жыл бұрын

Qatar overplayed the cards that they had at hand.

@coco_bold Жыл бұрын

@@dimjad7933 Then and Than are two different words, learn the difference. "Then Airbus made the right decision" , Then is the word to use. Than is used to compare. Airbus is bigger than Embraer.

@RobEJC Жыл бұрын

Did the Qatari aviation safety authority (read: al Baker) decide the paint degradation was NOT a problem, allowing the "grounded" A350's to once again fly? Hard to make an argument to the court of the safety issue when you're still flying the type. A al Baker gets to bully just about everyone in Qatar, but international courts of justice are not run by oil wealthy emirs; he's going to have to prove things, not just bully.

@mhdibm7515 Жыл бұрын

Quality content as always

@jaypilot2643 Жыл бұрын

Great info, thank you🙂

@motioncompensation1544 Жыл бұрын

Airbus should keep one Qatar A350 and offer it again for the next delivery, again for the next one etc. This way they can stop remodeling interiors and repainting.

@kevintaylor31 Жыл бұрын

One point that seems to have been missed is that the pilots, crew, engineers and back office staff will all have to be trained for the Boeings and there is also the headache of the logistical side of things with the spares required to change over to Boeing aircraft. Also I'm sure that Qatar are aware of the issues that Boeing are having with their quality control (Or rather the lack of it!) on the 787 Dreamliner and the 737 Max. The paint is just falling off the wings of the 787 and the whole aircraft engineering world is well aware that the aircraft that are being built by Boeing nowadays are of a far lower standard than Airbus. I work on both manufacturer's aircraft and the Boeing is like comparing a Suzuki car to a BMW. It really is that much of a difference. Just go into the E & I bay of each aircaft and it's clear who really cares about their products.

@petep.2092 Жыл бұрын

Qatar already has Boeings in its fleet. And what about the Boeing EE bay?

@albertov9664 Жыл бұрын

OMG, form a person that had owned brand new Suzuki and BMW cars, I would recommend you using a different analogy. BTW, right now I have a (Japanese) Suzuki and got rid of the BMW (Shiny lights and quality are two different things).

@unconventionalideas5683 Жыл бұрын

The 787 paint issue has a fix. The A350 issues do not.

@kevintaylor31 Жыл бұрын

@@unconventionalideas5683 You obviously don't work on the 787. The paint issue hasn't been fixed. The paint is still coming off the wings in large sheets. Get your facts straight mate. I work on the plane, you clearly don't.

@bjornnilsson1827 Жыл бұрын

I'm surprised you didn't mention type ratings in the video. Given that Qatar airways was intending to retire their A380 and A330 aircraft, isn't it likely those pilots have been retrained on the A350 or other types and let their old type ratings lapse?

@NicolaW72 Жыл бұрын

The Pilots can restore their type ratings without so much trouble - and Qatar still operates the A 350: not all are grounded, there´re 24 of them still flying. So the Pilots and their licenses shouldn´t be a problem for Qatar Airways.

@lijmes Жыл бұрын

Their CEO and regulator are in bed together. If baker-boy says his pilots will be rated on the SR71 tomorrow, Qatari regulators will reissue their licenses by today.

@NicolaW72 Жыл бұрын

@@lijmes Something like that, yes. The Pilot´s and their licenses will not be a problem for Qatar Airways, the problems of Qatar Airways are on other fields.

@mdb831 Жыл бұрын

A 350 is a beautiful plane.

@roterdachs Жыл бұрын

... which has smallpox :P

@shrimpflea Жыл бұрын

It's gorgeous...my favorite Airbus plane by far.

@bambojet Жыл бұрын

EXCELLENT VIDEO...

@sailaab Жыл бұрын

Not sure if you wrtetge script of the crucial parts. But the smmary and your final words/ opinion: 👌🏽it was👌🏽 soooo measured. Neutral yet fairly indicative of the realities. Thaks again to the whole team.

@HNBGamer Жыл бұрын

I like how many comments are just football vs soccer

@TiptronicSS Жыл бұрын

Qatar shot themselves in the foot. If other companies can live with the same aircraft, so can they. The best to come out of this is the A380's coming back! I would love to fly in 1 some day.

@baomao7243 Жыл бұрын

The A380 is amazing if it can be configured such that it is not a cattle car. When that happens the cabin is jammed and the boarding area is the biggest zoo you’ve ever seen !

@petep.2092 Жыл бұрын

It was designed to BE a cattle car. 😐

@baomao7243 Жыл бұрын

@@petep.2092 I think of it as a “worst case requirement” that some carriers will implement - i just won’t be flying with those carriers. 😉

@accountalreadyinuse Жыл бұрын

Qatar recently made a deal with Finnair. Finnair will start to operate 28 weekly flights from 4 european airports to DOH on behalf of Qatar. I'm quite sure QR have made similiar deal with other airlines aswel.

@elainelouve Жыл бұрын

Wow! I had no idea, but Finnair is otherwise doing not so great due to the situation with Russia. Not being able to use the airspace.

@anthonydecastro6938 Жыл бұрын

exactly, but that is to Finnair's benefit, not QA who will have to pay and pay and pay...in order not to lose face re the World Cup.

@IMBlakeley Жыл бұрын

I can see the gain for Finnair but for Qatar no.

@-tsvk- Жыл бұрын

In my understanding the new Finnair services to Doha were not "on behalf of Qatar Airways" per se, but simply regular scheduled Finnair routes that were codeshared with Qatar Airways.

@raymondrizzo284 Жыл бұрын

@Wombat…very good info.

@beachboy0505 Жыл бұрын

Excellent video An out of court settlement is the best solution 👌

@darylp9306 Жыл бұрын

Very comprehensive explanation! Thank you so much. Very enlightening. In any case, after all has been said and done, the only losing party here is Qatar Airways. 🤷🏻‍♂️ Time is of the essence for the company to procure more jets in actual service in light of the upcoming worldcup of which Qatar is the host. The Boeing deal will however make not make things any much better because of considerable delays of production in their primary jets for sale. Truly, the matter could have been handled more professionally by QA or should I say, its CEO.

@Eyes_On_Sky Жыл бұрын

Thanks!

@Proefkonijntje Жыл бұрын

The one positive result of all of this is that those 10 A380's are flying again. In my opinion the failure of that airplane is one of the great tragedies of modern aviation...

@FireAngelOfLondon Жыл бұрын

From the Airbus side the A-380 was doomed to make a massive financial loss before it ever flew, and there isn't anything likely to change that.

@stevehines Жыл бұрын

There's also a thing called static lightning plus cutting through the air composite or fiberglass they also have a anti static spray. It works great zephyr edit how you may now you know

@GorgeDawes Жыл бұрын

So the Qatar regulator is doing Qatar Airways’ bidding? How shocking. It’s almost as if both organisations are being run by the same unaccountable family, or something.

@julianbrelsford Жыл бұрын

Reminiscent of the time that US FAA gave Boeing permission to "self certify" a 737 redesign and then later found out Boeing hadn't really done so in a fair and independent manner.

@Russell_and_co Жыл бұрын

No, sounds like EASA is doing Airbus’s bidding!

@the80386 Жыл бұрын

Every country(or country-block) backs their champion business with any means necessary to succeed in the global market. EU with airbus, USA with Boeing and Qatar with, well, Qatar.

@NicolaW72 Жыл бұрын

Yes.

@MrBe787 Жыл бұрын

Build planes from aluminum and you won’t have problems. Aluminum is way easier to repair and replace as well. Also, you can’t use paint stripper on composites, making repainting, 2or 3 times more expensive. Also, when it’s all said and done, you’re not really saving that much weight either.

@se-kmg355 Жыл бұрын

Not saving much weight?! 20% on the 787 so it is not a small number. It also is stronger, more flexible and can be made in larger pieces and less joints.

@FireAngelOfLondon Жыл бұрын

Composites are cheaper, stronger, last longer and require less maintenance, so as time goes on no sensible manufacturer will be using aluminium for airframes. Yes they are sometimes more expensive to repair but they require repair much less often. Weight savings are huge, up to 30% on military aircraft and about 20% on airliners to date, with savings set to increase as time goes on.

@MrBe787 Жыл бұрын

@@FireAngelOfLondon composites are definitely not cheaper. Composites are way more difficult to repair and sometimes impossible to repair requiring complete replacement of the part, subassembly or entire aircraft.

@scottjuhnke6825 Жыл бұрын

I think, in this situation, and it is understandable, Qatar Airways is more concerned that the peeling paint would give Customers the wrong impression of their Aircraft, and the Airline in general. It's sad that the issue has come down to a legal fight. Had the Airline pitched in to help find a solution to the paint issue, and kept taking deliveries, both Parties would have benefited at much lower cost to both.

@beeble2003 Жыл бұрын

If Qatar Airways stated that the peeling paint gave the customer the wrong impression, everything would have been sorted out long ago. Instead, they stated that the peeling paint was a safety issue, and no organization outside Qatar agrees.

@NicolaW72 Жыл бұрын

@@beeble2003 Indeed.

@Jonathan_Doe_ Жыл бұрын

I’m sure most airlines would be stoked to have Qatar spec seats/colours (retrimed/carpeted to their colours of course).. Apart from the budget lines who want to cram more people in.

@CaptainRon1913 Жыл бұрын

I always take delivery of a brand new car with the paint peeling off. Whats the big deal?

@NekiCat Жыл бұрын

More like, after a year of driving the paint peels off, and the manufacturer offered to repaint it for you. But instead you are worried that the car falls apart when hit by lightning and sue instead?

@cliveluff6622 Жыл бұрын

I'd like to know, have other A350 operators been experiencing the same issues? And has any Boeing Dreamliner (which, I believe also has a Carbon Fiber fuselage) experienced the same paint issues? Thanks

@se-kmg355 Жыл бұрын

Yes, other operators have experienced similar issues with the paint on their A350. However, Airbus offered full repaint while they investigated the matter to find a solution to it. I know the 787 have had similar paint flaking on its wing due to the composite structure, seems to be rectified with a repaint.

@NicolaW72 Жыл бұрын

Yes, it is known from the A 350 of Finnair, Lufthansa and Air France - but these Airlines accepted the solution which Airbus offered them.

@valentin6824 Жыл бұрын

Yes, but they also did Not make it public Like Qatar.

@todortodorov940 Жыл бұрын

What an irony that what will get Qatar trough the World Cup is the A330 and A380. Especially the A380, which Al-Baker has trashed so much. NB: For the North American viewers; The World Cup is the FIFA Football (Soccer) World Cup 2022, taking place from mid November for about 4 weeks.

@vladsnape6408 Жыл бұрын

A bad paint job is certainly not ideal, however, surely this ia a magnitude better than having computer software that forces the plane into the ground in certain circumstances.

@shrimpflea Жыл бұрын

Ha ha

@vedymin1 Жыл бұрын

Could the mesh start rusting out when uncovered ? That could compromise its lightning protection ?

@johnnunn8688 Жыл бұрын

Copper doesn’t rust.

@vedymin1 Жыл бұрын

@@johnnunn8688 Ah, so its a copper mesh then. I thought it could have been some other metal that could rust or maybe aluminium that could corrode or galvanically react with those composites. So this should just cover itself in a layer of oxide and nothing more ?

@SlavaUkraini85 Жыл бұрын

that backfired nicely 😂 Qatar Airlines has become an Airline I want to avoid because with the lack of A350s their board product has really suffered. They now have to use old A330 with a older cabin - as customer you still pay the same ticket price

@arceuslee7087 Жыл бұрын

And it still took top spot for best airline in the world

@valentin6824 Жыл бұрын

@@arceuslee7087 But Not in their old a330s :)

@ibbk1 Жыл бұрын

Great to see an airline act with principle against the aircraft manufacturer. I wish someone had stood up to Boeing before the 737 max disaster.

@MrPicklerwoof Жыл бұрын

When the UK court asked them to clarify their findings which differed from the independent analysis, what was their actual argument for why they felt it wasn't safe? Paint peeling off and getting into the engines? Missing paint affecting ice build up? Etc. Something perhaps missing from this video.

@jadamsnz Жыл бұрын

The bigger issue for me is how Qatar Airways managed to get the Qatar safety board to ground the aircraft on grounds of safety when no other safety regulatory agency saw the paint delamination as a safety issue. This smacks of corruption to me with QA thinking they had a smart way to milk Airbus of money during the pandemic and "persuading" the board to go along with it. Well that smart-arse idea as now bitten them in the butt and sunk the credibility of the safety board in the process. QA has made their bed now they have to lie in it.

@ThePeperich Жыл бұрын

if a state owned… state run… state funded… asks a friend or family member in another state run entity for a favour. Sad but you are totally right.

@petep.2092 Жыл бұрын

None of the aviation authorities that grounded the MAX even gave a technical reason for grounding it even though such is required by ICAO rules. Not even the FAA.

@JerryAsher Жыл бұрын

With the slavery used to build the world cup stadium in Qatar, no one should go either by Airbus or Boeing.

@joecrammond6221 Жыл бұрын

seems unlikely but part of me still hopes that even today Airbus and Qatar may come to some sort of agreement where both parties are reasonably happy and Airbus can start delievering to Qatar again

@verocimil Жыл бұрын

I would have wished that too, but from what I got by reading the discussions and even News from the past - and probably you are aware of and would agree with me on that as well - no one could trully be happy when dealing with Akbar Al Baker from Qatar, since he seems to be very demanding and trying always to get the most for him. That began long before the current dispute with Airbus started. But now we all can expect that one supplier could suddenly very well be satisfied by him because it has turned into a monopolist to him: Boeing. Since Airbus too has more than enough costumers to deliver to throughout the world, it will be a win for Airbus as well by not having to deal with an old very known unpleasant costumer anymore. It is known that there is modern slavery in Qatar. One can turn people into slaves, but not expect that they will love him for that. Such kind of mentality will never pay of on the long run and leave its imprints also when dealing with others that aren't yet his slaves. Airbus refused to become such one. And for that alone I would already say: well done Airbus!

@foxylady1048 Жыл бұрын

Just a question. Do u have training to fly the side stick with Airbus.?

@devi3301 Жыл бұрын

They have large shares in numerous airlines, including cathay, which still has many aircrafts of its fleet still grounded, maybe they could lease those

@jjoulekelvin2986 Жыл бұрын

Can't find the video of "Rebuilding Aircraft From Desert Storage".

@Clonefiles Жыл бұрын

The geographical placement of Armenia is just...... I literally have no words for it.

@user-lv7ph7hs7l Жыл бұрын

I kinda started out on Qatars side, if I paid 100 M for a state of the art aircraft and the paint was flaking off exposing the airframe to the corrosive local elements I would be pissed and I would want them to work on it and eventually retrofit the already operational ones but now I don't know. Airbus seems to be working on the problem and just tanking one of the larger current contracts for aircraft based on ehat seems to me like an unwillingness to admit defeat or a mistake or pride just seems unnecessary and mayve stupid. But what do I know, I'm just a sim pilot and armchair observer. Sometimes putting the Kings relatives in charge of high tech industries may not be wise.

@oadka Жыл бұрын

I was confused when I saw a Qatar A380 in the air above me yesterday (LHR-DOH). After seeing this video its pretty clear.

@JohnRodriguesPhotographer Жыл бұрын

What is the metallurgy of the mesh? Is the mesh made from a weather resistant alloy?

@ConstantinosDrymiotes1 Жыл бұрын

The mesh is made of copper. The mesh type is expanded copper foil (ECF).

@JohnRodriguesPhotographer Жыл бұрын

@@ConstantinosDrymiotes1 thanks.

@Shahnavas Жыл бұрын

It seems that #Qatarairways has opted to go with #codesharing with some middle east airlines like #kuwaitairways to adjust to the soccer #fifaworldcup event demand

@sopissedoff Жыл бұрын

I would imagine the mash is guled or recited to the underbody ,Then it is covered with a filler to smooth the mash before painting, Fillers don't handle movement very well ,The expansion and contraction do the damage on the filler ,It's more than flaking paint

@nayaman1023 Жыл бұрын

I still trust the EASA its only cosmetic issues

@danharold3087 Жыл бұрын

I agree. Qatar took the wrong approach.

@heidirabenau511 Жыл бұрын

After the MAX crashes, regulators are being very careful with safety think a321xlr, 737-7, 737-10, 777-9 and until recently the 787

@howardshepherdson2925 Жыл бұрын

Excellent analysis and really interesting to watch

@BenjWarrant Жыл бұрын

Just FYI, there are no gavels in English courts. Nowhere. No judge uses them in any circumstances. The only place you see gavels in England is in auctions.

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@neilperry2224 Жыл бұрын

Why aren't they using an elasticiser within the paint to aid in the expansion and shrinkage ?

@davedarling4316 Жыл бұрын

I got the impression from videos earlier this year that there were quite a few planes out there that had formerly been leased to Russian carriers that have been reclaimed by the leasing companies. Could Qatar Airways lease those on a short- or medium-term basis?

@asicdathens Жыл бұрын

These planes are unusable. There is no continuous service history, because a lot of these planes flew after the sanctions.

@beeble2003 Жыл бұрын

@@asicdathens Dave's referring to the plains that are still in the hands of the leasing companies, not the ones that Russia stole.

@mitcho04 Жыл бұрын

The BA agreement will likely help out if they're struggling for aircraft.

@mitcho04 Жыл бұрын

@@CandyMan2001 Yeah I don't like it either, some horrible business practices there, especially against Women.

@archiewoosung5062 Жыл бұрын

A while back it seemed that Boeing were in trouble with (737 max?) flight safety issues, but are Airbus going to be left with a surplus of A350s as United recently cancelled a huge order (in favour of Boeing)? And now that the World Cup is (almost) over, what planes were used to fly people to Qatar?

@cdreid9999 Жыл бұрын

The thing about the aviation industry that has always astonished me is their systemic practice of resisting innovation. Not just with jumbo jets but all the way down to ga. A 75yo design is fine to produce as are it's parts. Want to slap a new light system or tire on a 4 seater? It best be certified and have gone through expensive testing.

@seiya880 Жыл бұрын

For Qatar, starting a fight with one of the only two aircraft manufacturers in the world was a very dumb idea to me; also in a time were new aircraft are so hard to get these days, Airbus can live without Qatar, not sure if the other way around is true. And Boeing can have them pay premium prices for their aircraft now. Very dumb decision.

@Msal7aCZ Жыл бұрын

safety come first!

@mxyzptlyk Жыл бұрын

I've said on many occasions that Al Baker has been a screw-up from the get-go. He threw money at a few no-hope airlines that ultimately failed. Now he's at it again with Pakistan International. He bought the A380 but didn't know how to make it work, so that was the aircraft's fault and not his. I think Qatar Airways was heading for a financial problems after all its previous failings, needed an "out" and Airbus and the A350 was an obvious target. This has backfired on him once again, his orders have been cancelled leaving him scrambling for aircraft and re-awakening old jets with non-competitive products. How is this guy still in a job? Don't Qatar have a "Department of the Dog Catcher" that they could move him to, in a non-managerial capacity of course.

@454chevy454 Жыл бұрын

Ahhh thats why they are the biggest most successful airline and have been no1 in the world for many years..thank u for info 😂

@JuliusUnique Жыл бұрын

instead of fighting about this they should start to work on a paint that sticks better or another lightning-strike absorbing material

@wr6293 Жыл бұрын

Pride overtook mind. Looks like Qatar Airways management was pushing it a bit to far and then was not able to walk back without loosing face. It remains to be seen who of their managers will end up to be sacrificed to reinstate a working relationship with airbus in the future….

@larkhill2119 Жыл бұрын

If you book a flight in December it shows flights in QR68 - Airbus A350-900 Operated by Qatar Airways?

@billschannel1116 Жыл бұрын

Who do I contact about becoming a live in caretaker for one of these wide body planes going into mothballs? My family really annoys me and I'd like to put them into a modern day version of The Shining.

@TimothyChapman Жыл бұрын

How is it that only one airline can be experiencing issues with the paint chipping? Is their paint different from everyone else's?

@jameshiggins-thomas9617 Жыл бұрын

Curious ... why the UK courts?

@ShekarRangarajan Жыл бұрын

One aspect that the video is silent about is this: Did other airlines like SIA and BA that fly Airbus 380 experience the problem of paint chipping? If so, were they putting up with it, or did they also sue Airbus for it? If they did and manage to resolve it, why could Qatar Airways not adopt the same? I am sure such questions and considerations must have come up during the investigation. Just out of curiosity, I would greatly appreciate it if these aspects could be clarified. Thank you.

@YogiLogic Жыл бұрын

By looking at the title, I was curious how is 'World Health Organization' winning this fight !

@bazoo513 Жыл бұрын

This is a perfect example of a dispute going out of hands resulting in a lose-lose situation... 😞 BTW, B787 also has paint issues, although not as serious as A350 (probably for the same reasons.) Also, interesting: for Qatar "purchasing A380 was their biggest mistake" - not so for their neighbor Emirates.

@arceuslee7087 Жыл бұрын

Lol emirates canceled a380 orders 😂 🤣

@bazoo513 Жыл бұрын

@@arceuslee7087 How's the weather in your parallel universe? Emirates have 119 A380s, including the last ever built. They are refurbishing more than half of that fleet, by far the largest in the world (with about half of all A380s in existence) with the new premium economy class. They are clamoring to Airbus to build a successor, because nothing in the skies is able to replace it. Lol indeed, my clueless friend.

@NicolaW72 Жыл бұрын

Qatar Airways and Emirates have partially different business models. Emirates operates only globally on long-haule-routes and only two aircraft-types: the A 380-800 and the B 777-300. Qatar Airways operates globally on long-haule-routes as well as medium- and short-haule-routes, partially to feed their long-haule-routes, but also as a regional airline, and Qatar Airways operates a fleet of A 320-200, A 321-200, A 330-200, A 330-300, A 350-900, A 350-1000, A 380-800, B 787-8, B 787-9, B 777-200, B 777-300 - and even two B 747-8 F - so a much more diverse fleet.

@bazoo513 Жыл бұрын

@@NicolaW72 Indeed they do.

@most-average-athelete Жыл бұрын

What can go wrong with the option at 11:18? Boing who has restarted their Boeing 787 deliveries, to ramp up and expedite deliveries to Qatar? any ideas?

@HuyV Жыл бұрын

1. Price. Now that Boeing knows Qatar has only Boeing as a supplier, they won't give out discounts. Good job artificially creating a monopolist market for yourself Qatar.... 2. You gotta pay even more if you don't want to be at the very end of Boeing's waiting list. So I'd say Qatar is going to pay dearly for this failed gamble.

@stevehines Жыл бұрын

Static also affects other things think about it