Why Did Elizabeth I & Mary, Queen of Scots Never Meet?

Рет қаралды 31,365

Жыл бұрын

To explore “A Tudor Discovery: Thomas Cromwell’s Prayer Book” and more first-class history content subscribe to History Hit: access.historyhit.com/checkout...
Let’s take a look at Elizabeth and Mary, Queen of Scots and the meetings that might have been…
I hope you enjoy this video and find it interesting!
Please subscribe and click the bell icon to be updated about new videos.
Also, if you want to get in touch, please comment down below or find me on social media:
Instagram: katrina.marchant
Twitter: @kat_marchant
TikTok: @katrina_marchant
Email: readingthepastwithdrkat@gmail.com
Intro / Outro song: Silent Partner, "Greenery" [ • Greenery - Silent Part... ]
SFX from freesfx.co.uk/Default.aspx
Linked videos and playlists:
Mary, Queen of Scots and Lord Darnley: • The Mysterious Murder ...
Death of Amy Dudley: • The Original Staircase...
Excommunication of Elizabeth: • Excommunicating Englan...
Plots against Elizabeth: • The Babington Plot: Co...
Images (from Wikimedia Commons, unless otherwise stated):
Portrait of Mary, Queen of Scots by François Clouet (from 1558 until 1560). Held by the Royal Collection.
Portrait of Queen Elizabeth I by an unknown English artist (c.1600). Held by the National Portrait Gallery.
Illumination of Mary and François in Catherine de' Medici's book of hours (c.1574). Held by the Bibliothèque nationale de France, Paris.
The arms of Mary, Queen of Scots and the French dauphin, and of Scotland, France and England, sent from France, July 1559: Cotton MS Caligula B X/1, ff. 17v-18r. From: blogs.bl.uk/digitisedmanuscri...
Portrait of Mary, Queen of Scots in “white mourning” by François Clouet (between c.1559 and c.1560). Held by the Royal Collection.
Portrait of the Infante Don Carlos by Alonso Sánchez Coello (1564). Held by the Kunsthistorisches Museum.
Portrait of Robert Dudley, earl of Leicester attributed to Steven van der Meulen (c.1560-1565). Held by The Wallace Collection.
Portrait of Mary, Queen of Scots, and her second husband Henry Stuart, Lord Darnley by an unknown artist (16th century). Held at Hardwick Hall, Derbyshire, in the care of the National Trust.
“The Tide Letter” from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/e...
Quoted texts:
Julian Goodare, ODNB entry on Mary, Queen of Scots.
Also consulted, were:
Other relevant entries from The Oxford Dictionary of National Biography Online.
#History #Tudor #Stuart

Пікірлер: 564

@FingalsMyst Жыл бұрын

Considering Mary’s unbending beliefs about religion, Elizabeth was correct to act as she did. Elizabeth was far better at playing politics than Mary.

@tamarafarnsworth5049 Жыл бұрын

And a bit smarter about men, I would say. At least smarter about men who would pursue a monarch!

@suziemartin3587 Жыл бұрын

True. Elizabeth used her head, common sense, Mary didn't.

@BigMamaDaveX Жыл бұрын

@@suziemartin3587 Elisabeth used her keen mind; Mary followed her heart, with disasterous consequences. 😢

@janegardener1662 Жыл бұрын

@@suziemartin3587 Mary's mother died as Regent of Scotland, whereas Elizabeth's mother died divorced and disgraced on the orders of her father. So she had good reasons not to want a man on the throne of England.

@TheSimpleRomantic Жыл бұрын

Mary married cuz that was the rule set she knew Elizabeth , probably for various reasons we can imagine, looked beyond the rules established for royal women

@mariahunter9882 Жыл бұрын

I'm a little stunned at how unconcerned Mary was about the impact of her behavior on Elizabeth and how unrealistic about her expectations of support from Elizabeth. She claimed Elizabeth's throne, asked openly if she inherited after Elizabeth was dead as soon as she transitioned back to Scotland and then expected Elizabeth's backing once she'd made Scotland too hot to hold her. She seems to have made no accounting of the fact that Elizabeth had a close brush with death a couple of times and was not likely to view any threats in a favorable light. Mary seems to have expected Elizabeth to view herself through Mary's eyes and not her own.

@carmenpeters728 Жыл бұрын

it was a cut throat business tho..

@noahhh4587 Жыл бұрын

@@carmenpeters728 which is like exactly why she shouldn't have expected support from a woman whose rule she intentionally threatened

@--enyo-- Жыл бұрын

I think she’d been very sheltered her entire life.

@NCKrypotonite33 Жыл бұрын

@DrZarbon I agree with this. Mary had a completely different upbringing than Elizabeth which would of course influence her behavior and personality.

@jehannedarc1429 Жыл бұрын

Very very well said.

@jacquelinefaulknall8513 Жыл бұрын

When I was young, I always saw Mary as a romantic, tragic figure. As an adult, I now appreciate Elizabeth’s resilience and political understanding a lot more. I don’t want to sound harsh, but I find Mary a bit of a fool, who could easily have been manipulated into another rebellion and attempt on Elizabeth’s throne. For this reason, I think keeping her imprisoned and away from any drama of a public meeting with Elizabeth, was the right thing to do, even though it had awful consequences for Mary in the end. Great video, thanks.

@possumaintdead Жыл бұрын

I always thought Mary wasn’t terribly bright, but I don’t think I ever realized she’d never not been a Queen. That must have really skewed her thinking. 👸. Great program, thank you!❤

@morgan1687 Жыл бұрын

Hindsight is a pretty great thing, I think it’s easy to consider her not bright with what we know about how events turned out. Although many would probably end up similar if they had that power, lifestyle, and it’s arrogance built into them from birth as well as being frequently told they are entitled to more of it without ever being given the same tools/understanding a male child would have been given. She’s very much a product of never learning to see the full picture politically but I don’t know if that’s the same as not being bright

@maryfrump7937 Жыл бұрын

Mary was queen of France

@deeeriz7188 11 ай бұрын

Don't think saying Mary wasn't bright, that it seems like Mary was just in the wrong place at the wrong times to offend her self up against elizabeth and the men in Her life. It seem too, she really didn't really get a fair shakes And downs she fell.

@alanboyd8416 10 ай бұрын

I got the same impression when I started studying her at uni. However, my opinion has changed. I remember reading that while Mary was in France her education was based mainly on French politics and diplomacy and there was next to no mention of Scotland in her education. This was largely because it was assumed that while she was married to Francis II she would stay in France her the vast majority of her life while Scottish nobles ran Scotland on her behalf. After her return to Scotland, she was in a country that didn't particularly expect her to ever return. On top of that, she was seen as more French than Scottish (she even had a French accent). Also, the French had pulled out their troops from Scotland to deal with domestic matters so she was practically left to govern a country she no little about, didn't share a religion with and had next to no support in the country. Most of the nobles, including James Stewart, her half-brother, knew she was uneducated on Scottish politics and diplomacy and didn't want to or have time to ally with her or educate her on current events. Not to mention her half-brother was a spy for William Cecil. I feel after the death of her first husband and her mother in 1560 it was just a series of unfortunate events. She couldn't even stay in France after the death of her first husband (even though she did have the wealth of several French estates that would have allowed her to live an independent comfortable life - especially if she sold her Scottish estates and bought more French estates). Catherine de Medici saw her as a political rival (due to Mary's Guise relations) so went out of her way to make her feel unwelcome in France.

@alien-vu7yl Жыл бұрын

Mary was a spoiled girl thrown into a dangerous and complicated situation. She was never taught to navigate such a life as it was in the French's best interest to not give her any ideas about ruling in her own right. Elizabeth had a lot of grit due to how dangerous her life was basically until she got the throne and was playing in a completely different league. I also don't think our modern heads can really understand how strong the idea of divine right to rule was for these people and how much it governed their views on everything. Same for God and religion, no matter how devout someone might be. We think Mary was stubborn, she thought she was following God's will. Since her right to rule had never been challenged, she couldn't imagine making the compromises Elizabeth did in her life. If Mary had grown up with her mother in Scotland, I think she would have been much more capable to handle the politics and more of an equal to Elizabeth.

@noelleggett5368 Жыл бұрын

The events of Mary, Queen of Scots’ life, the circumstances she found herself in - and the choices she seems to have made - are one of history’s most enduring mysteries and a pure tragedy in the (Shakespearean) dramatic sense. No wonder there has been a never ending series of accounts on television and the big screen of her story. Thanks, Cat, for your concise and gripping narrative! 🎉

@annalisette5897 Жыл бұрын

An author, possibly Antonia Fraser, noted that Mary was very personable and lovable because she had always been raised with love and security. Not so for Elizabeth who knew threat and opposition from her youngest years. It was suggested that another reason for the two queens not meeting was that Elizabeth did not want to encounter such a socially confident woman, cousin and fellow queen.

@NCKrypotonite33 Жыл бұрын

I completely agree

@gogreen7794 4 ай бұрын

Do you really think Elizabeth wasn't strong and confident?? Give me a break.

@moniquelucas5862 9 күн бұрын

Could also be that Mary as a Catholic and contender to the throne (or an alternative Queen) would likely legitimise herself in the eyes of her subjects and nobility should Elizabeth have a meeting with her. Something Elizabeth strongly wanted to avoid because it could bolster her already strong claim to her throne. (Aside from personal insecurity and jelousy) Or onwards to that effect.

@moniquelucas5862 9 күн бұрын

@@gogreen7794Besides her vanity wouldnt allow her to admit anyone else, even Mary, being more charismatic or beautiful than herself.

@ellencook1658 Жыл бұрын

If there’s one thing we know about Elizabeth I, it’s that she had a highly developed a nose for danger. And Mary reeked of it. Elizabeth’s best move was often to do nothing In this case, she played it perfectly. You knew Mary would ‘hang herself’ given enough rope.

@jehannedarc1429 4 ай бұрын

Well said!

@TreyCapnerhurst Жыл бұрын

*Can we have one on the incredibly bizarre position and influence of Dr. Dee and the wizards in Elizabeth's court?* Historical depictions usually gloss over it in part because she is portrayed as one of the first "modern" and rational rulers, but in fact she relied heavily on her mystical advisors for even the everyday decisions of state. Arguably, he was also a spy and scientist, but he was chiefly in her employ as an advisor because of his magic calculations.

@prarieborn6458 Жыл бұрын

Yes, i second the request!! And I wouldl iike to mention that the French Queen, Catherine De Medici, Mary Queen of Scots mother-i-law, rescued Nostradamus, the great Astrologer.and mystic. from his persecutors after he had famously foreseen the death of the King of France.. The King died from a fatal wound sustained in a jousting accident.. The Queen kept Nostradamus at court as her advisor,. Modern day Astrologers have studied the birth chart of Mary Queen of Scots..at the time of her birth the Sun, signifying her life-force, was closely joined by “the most evil star i the zodiac” Caput Algol.. Algol is an arabic word for satan..Also known as “The head of Medusa”.. The Ancients believed it signified death by beheadiing or strangulation.. Believe it or not, many great scientists and doctors of medicine , such as Sir Issac Newton, Johannes Keppler and Nostradamus studied and practiced astrology. Then there was Eli Lilly who wrote and taught on “Christian Astrology” 2000 years ago three “Wise Kings” from the far Eastern lands traveled to Bethlehem. guided by a Star..In Jerusalem, they inquired of King Herod, “where is He who is born King of the Jews? For we have seen His Star in the East and have come to worship Him” Were the three wise men astrologers? Yes, Dr Cat,please look into this fascinating and controversial subject in history..

@debbylou5729 Жыл бұрын

Too much Lord of the Rings? You mean horoscopes?

@tianna1116 11 ай бұрын

I don’t know anything on this specific topic but what you wrote reminds me of Rasputin, and the good he held over the czarina

@TreyCapnerhurst 11 ай бұрын

@@tianna1116 Not really comparable. Dr. Dee was a renown published scientist, spy, and very high official court functionary. He was 1 of the very few Elizabethan advisors who was always consulted and never lost favour or his head. He was mostly called upon to do astrology and predictions, tho, and Her Majesty rarely took any significant action without asking him to horoscope it first. The Czarina & Czar were captivated by several dubious religious leaders. Rasputin claimed to help heal their son, and may have done some good by keeping the quacks away from him. He also was a notorious Lothario, and there were many rumours that he was banging the Empress.

@sempressfi 10 ай бұрын

Coincidentally, I recently started looking at charts he calculated and analyzing them lol I believe I have a couple books/biographies about him on my historical TBR list, I'll look for the titles and share if so!

@mesamies123 Жыл бұрын

Two women, cousins, sisters divided by patriarchy and men with craven needs for power and self-preservation at any cost. It's a sad, tragic story--and a continuing reality for many women everywhere, alas. 👸💔👸

@johntshorter Жыл бұрын

Great video Kat! Elizabeth was caught within a classic Scylla and Charybdis dilemma when it came to Mary. Elizabeth sacrificing what would’ve been a commiserate meeting between a fellow regnant queen and one of her few closest living relatives demonstrated her tenacity and political acumen, qualities she’s already incredibly famous for. I think the fact that they were both family and ruling Christian princesses (on the same island) in a time when Europe was dominated by kings and emperors makes the situation of them never meeting all the more tragic and compelling, which I think explains why historical fiction would latch on to the notion of “what if they did meet?”, and “what would that be like?”; “what on earth would they say to each other?”. I’m quite entertained by writers and directors playing with these historical “what ifs”, just so long as we remember it’s fiction 😂👸🏼🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿🇮🇪

@eshim3961 Жыл бұрын

Dr.Kat truly makes history come alive with her commentary. We don't often think of these historical figures as being influenced by their all too human character traits, but Dr. Kat 's analysis of how these things played into historic events always are a spot on. This is probably my favorite channel on KZfaq, and I always look forward to new videos.

@mercyjokes2d696 Жыл бұрын

Dr Kat is a fantastic storyteller and teacher, but thinking about it, a teacher is always the best storyteller?

@karendooks6244 Жыл бұрын

Queen Elizabeth was a very intelligent woman, which is more than can be said for Mary who never seemed to learn from her mistakes.

@loiskondo8349 Жыл бұрын

Elizabeth was much better at politics than Mary. She never let infatuation guide her choices. Mary had no wisdom, no patience. Elizabeth had staying power. Thanks for another fascinating video!

@jehannedarc1429 4 ай бұрын

Very well said!

@kayleenfeher4341 Жыл бұрын

I think that Elizabeth refused to meet Mary for the sole purpose of not giving her public recognition. I know Elizabeth was very vain and she may have had an issue with the fact that Mary was a younger her. But Mary was very vocal about how she was the rightful queen and I think Elizabeth and her counsel felt that meeting with her would give even more fuel to the people who might back Mary.

@kathyjohnson2043 Жыл бұрын

Yes, there was nothing for Elizabeth to gain by meeting with Mary, a meeting that could only give credibility to Marry as being of equal status.

@moniquelucas5862 9 күн бұрын

@@kathyjohnson2043Not to mention Elizabeth didnt want to associate herself too closely with Mary and the scandals that she got herself embroiled in.

@cyndiewalton5656 Жыл бұрын

I’ve always thought the relationship between Mary and Elizabeth very interesting and needing more study. I think we have been tainted with the over romanticized versions of both women… this was very interesting. Thank you !

@kaytillie Жыл бұрын

I always love to think about how the conversation would go if Mary and Elizabeth did meet. I feel as if the movie Mary Queen of Scotts shows sorta what I think, but I do not believe Elizabeth would allow herself to be so vulnerable and she would be more angry and guarded. The way Mary is portrayed is ideal though: arrogant, angry

@the_petty_crocker Жыл бұрын

I'm reading a wonderful book about the relationship between Elizabeth and Catherine de Medici and it reinforces my long-held belief that Elizabeth was incomparably clever and manipulative. Mary, though I have much sympathy for her, was both sheltered and spoiled in her youth, and neither served her well later on. She was trained to be a queen consort, not a queen regnant, and though she wanted to rule in her own right, Scotland's dislike of her mother and Mary's acquired Frenchness did her no favors. I don't believe Mary was a romantic; or, if she was, she experienced little romance in her life. Her marriages were utilitarian and pragmatic. She believed a man would save her, while Elizabeth had learned the hard way to save herself. Fascinating women each condemned by the times in which they lived. 👑

@Rosedawn321 Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the lesson Dr. Kat! I looked but can’t find any time you did Margaret Beaufort, Henry VII th’s mom. Would you consider doing it? She really amazes me and I would love to hear your take on her life!

@arcola44 Жыл бұрын

Great job as always! You laid out a pretty comprehensive list of reasons why Elizabeth could never have allowed a meeting to take place: the coat of arms, the continued claim to the English throne, the numerous plots, probable involvement in the murder of Darnley, and, as always, religion and that pesky papal bull from Pius V. I also wonder why Mary fled to England. Was it the only place she could escape to? I mean, the Pretender eventually made it to France, right? Maybe it was the same impetuousness she showed with her marriages. Did she really think Elizabeth would help her? Thanks again. You make my Fridays.👑

@cathryncampbell8555 Жыл бұрын

arcola44: Yes, I've always wondered why Mary didn't hightail it to France, where as a Dowager Queen of France she would have had security. I wonder whether Mary calculated that Queen Elizabeth *might* be easier to manipulate than Catherine de' Medici, Queen Regent of France? In any case, Mary gambled -- & lost.

@moniquelucas5862 9 күн бұрын

@@cathryncampbell8555Mary was led under the (false) belief that Elizabeth would offer her support and reinstate her back to power in Scotland with her help this was (because of all the letter of sympathy, rightgeous fury and offers of protection Elizabeth had sent to her). Mary bet on Elizabeth's 'affections' and her own charms as a way to get her throne through her and even be named her successor for her throne. Of course no such thing has happened. Mary refused or couldnt grasp the reality of the situation, and she paid 18 years of her life with it.

@ameryek.9607 Жыл бұрын

What wouldn't Shakespeare have done with a play about Mary Queen of Scots!

@kimberlyperrotis8962 Жыл бұрын

I can’t see that Elizabeth I had anything to gain from meeting with her cousin Mary Queen of Scots, but she potentially had a lot to lose. Mary was reckless and foolish, but she was also up against the burgeoning Protestantism and ultra-misogyny of that period of Scottish history. She could have stayed on her throne had she some political acumen, but her extremely poor choice of marriages, especially to the Earl of Bothwell, undid her. In that place and time, the husband of a regnant queen had the full powers of a born king, and the powerful nobles of Scotland couldn’t bear that, so the took her son, the new king, and gave her the boot.

@julzy3 Жыл бұрын

I completely agree. Elizabeth had more intelligence and better counsel than Mary.👸

@kiddDEVY Жыл бұрын

👸 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 vs 👸🏼🇬🇧 in the Battle of the Tudor Queens 👑 🏰 🏇🤺💀

@themagicringhandmade Жыл бұрын

👸🏼I was named for the Elizabeths and have always been fascinated with both the Tudors and Windsors. Thank you for the video!

@silversweet9211 Жыл бұрын

Love this topic for a video. I always thought Cecil was vehemently opposed to Elizabeth meeting Mary because he feared an alliance between the two and what it would mean for England. 👑

@MsJaytee1975 Жыл бұрын

It would’ve meant a loss of power for him, that’s why he killed her.

@neilbuckley1613 Жыл бұрын

William Cecil was a long term friend of the Scottish reformer John Knox [ going back to the reign of Edward VI when Knox lived in England ] who was a major opponent of Mary in Scotland. As a strong protestant he hated Mary and in the early years of Elizabeth's reign has promoted the idea of Lady Katherine Grey as Elizabeth's successor.

@nativevirginian8344 Жыл бұрын

The more I read of Cecil the sicker I get of him.

@danielsantiagourtado3430 Жыл бұрын

Fantastic job as always! Your lessons are always so incredibly well done!

@evelinharmannfan7191 Жыл бұрын

Mary was raised with a sense of entitlement, while Elizabeth grew up fighting for her live. Mary had nothing to prepare her for the struggles ahead. and she was unable to learn. That is the reason Elizabeth survived, and Mary did not,

@mlgmoore Жыл бұрын

I particularly love the videos that zero in on small but pivotal moments. 👑 🗼

@kathyjohnson2043 Жыл бұрын

As someone commented, I would love to hear your views on John Dee, scientist and alchemist/magician.

@tessat338 Жыл бұрын

Mary, Queen of Scots is an object lesson on what happens if a reigning queen doesn't refrain from committing international incidents and causing offense to her country's more powerful neighbors. Spending her formative years in France, an equally strong rival of England's, did not prepare her mindset for ruling Scotland, a weaker neighbor of England's. Mary certainly succeeded in making it very awkward for Elizabeth and England to give her any sort of aid or assistance.

@kfemme68 Жыл бұрын

Thank you for telling us the story of these two cousins. I knew quite a bit of it but you still found a thing or two that I didn't know or remember in this story. 🤷🏼‍♀️ I think, as many have said here, Elizabeth was just so much more savy at ruling and keeping her thrown and power in ways that Mary, Queen of Scots never learned to her own detriment! Elizabeth had lived through so many tumultuous times growing up and as a young woman seeing what happened with the women in her father's Court but also how she and her half-sister were treated must have been hard to endure so she learned early about power and who had it and who didn't. Then there was Thomas Seymour when she was a teenager trying to compromise her to get her to marry him to get to the throne. She learned a lot of lessons the hard way, unfortunately. Mary,QoS didn't have that. She was more coddled at the French Court so she didn't learn the same cut throat lessons. So now that I rambled long enough.😂 I hope you have a great weekend and I have a question because I don't remember if you answered it before. Do you do the reenactment of the historical women regularly or is it a once in a lifetime thing? I'm sorry I forgot who you portrayed. I want to say it was one of the Queens but I'm not positive. So thanks for what you do on this channel. I really enjoy all of your videos but I also loved getting to see you dressed in the historical clothes for the reenactment. I would love to see it more, if you do it again! Thanks, take care and big healing hugs, k 💗👑👸🏿💂🏼‍♀️👸🏾💂🏿👸🏻💂🏾👸🏼💂🏼👸🏽💂‍♂️👸🏾💂🏻👸🏿👜🏳️‍🌈🏳️‍⚧️

@danielsantiagourtado3430 Жыл бұрын

Love your channel! Always informative and great❤❤🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉

@LusiaEyre 4 ай бұрын

Mary was practically born a queen. And then raised to be a queen, both regnant and consort. No one ever disputed her divine rights to the throne of Scotland, and her path to being the queen of France was also fairly straightforward and secure. Elizabeth, on the other hand, didn't know she would be queen until almost the last minute (when Mary's pregnancies turned out to be "fake"). Her divine right was, therefore, coupled with an understanding of the twists and turns of fate, fickle favour, and shifting allegiances. I don't think she ever lost sight of that from the very beginning. For all the things stacked against Elizabeth, she always has the ball in her court in her interactions with Mary. Mary is the supplicant. And I think that also coloured their relationship. Mary, double queen at one time, was playing checkers when Elizabeth was playing chess.

@moniquelucas5862 9 күн бұрын

Mary's undisputed legitimacy, pampered childhood in France, and the ideology of the Divine Right of Kings ingrained in her left her unequipped to effectively navaigate through the trecherous politics of the time. And given that she had been Queen all her life and never so much as had to lift a finger for her crown, gave her an inflated sense of confidence which bordered on arrogance (as a Queen should be) but left her at a gross disadvantage when dealing with Elizabeth. Not to mention her emotional and political reliance on unworthy, self seeking men like her own uncles, half brother, nobles and husbands who ultimately destroyed her. I find it ironic that most look to Elizabeth as the cause of Mary's demise, but really it was her herself and the men around her that caused it.

@jennshoultes6195 Жыл бұрын

I'm in the camp that believes that Elizabeth didn't want to meet Mary because she knew she'd have to order her execution

@grtlyblesd Жыл бұрын

Part of me wants to doubt this, but then I remember that Elizabeth had watched her sister Mary have to execute Jane Gray, who was little more than a pawn, and even today is not “counted” as a queen of England. It makes sense that she knew she might have to put down Mary QoS who’s actually made claims on her throne. 👑 💔🤔😢

@jennshoultes6195 Жыл бұрын

@grtlyblesd my birthday is September 8 so I always look at Elizabeth as WWJD (what would Jenn Do), and that's exactly what I would do... I also have a "Robert Dudley", his name is Dave

@steelerbear Жыл бұрын

Love this! The meetingless relationship between Elizabeth and MQS is a fascinating one. 👑

@dcollins4679 Жыл бұрын

👑

@theclassicso8094 Жыл бұрын

Mary, Queen of Scots, and Elizabeth I were fascinating individuals. This is a great discussion as to why the two never met. Thank you.

@misslarissa6046 6 ай бұрын

I've read that William Cecil, one of the very few people who Elizabeth ever allowed to influence her opinion, was relentless in advising Elizabeth never to meet Mary. He was perpetually paranoid about Mary's potential to concentrate Catholic opposition to Elizabeth, as Mary Tudor had done in supplanting Jane Grey. He also feared that Mary, by all accounts charming, would have charmed Elizabeth and softened her attitude. Cecil increasingly petitioned Elizabeth to execute Mary for treason, but though Elizabeth took much counsel from Cecil, it took years and multiple events for her to finally be persuaded to execute Mary. Even when she signed the final warrant, she changed her mind several times, and in the final event Elizabeth did send a messenger with a stay of execution, but Cecil having finally got the green light for the execution pushed it ahead before Elizabeth's letter of clemency could arrive. I think in the even Cecil underestimated his queen, because Elizabeth seems to have wanted to keep Mary alive not out of familial affection, but because Mary was an anointed queen, and therefore a creature beyond a mere mortal. Again Elizabeth kept to this concept not out of piety or sentimentality, but out of self-protection. Elizabeth was very much not interested in setting a precedent for executing anointed queens, as she felt that sharp edge could easily point her way.

@jovindsouza3407 Жыл бұрын

I like to think hat they didn't meet because Elizabeth was frightened of Mary. Any kind of direct diplomatic contact or meeting would have been a huge event, and people from all across the country along with most of Elizabeth's court would have met and interacted with Mary in person. I feel like Elizabeth was fearful that putting her rival in contact with her close advisors and members of court would be risky. Mary had been the focus of anti-Protestant and anti-Elizabeth plotting and intrigue since literally the moment she entered the country, and giving her the chance to form connections in Elizabeth's inner circle would be potentially deadly. Mary's apparent beauty and charisma would have made that risk even bigger in Elizabeth's mind. At least, that's my reasoning. A much tamer reason would probably be that Elizabeth and Mary just didn't want to see each other and didn't meet for that reason.

@MsJaytee1975 Жыл бұрын

I think that’s definitely part of it. If Elizabeth thought she could have come out on top of any meeting then I think they would’ve met. There’s plenty of evidence Mary wanted a meeting.

@vickystopp6302 Жыл бұрын

Great video. I think Elizabeth was very wise not to meet with her cousin. She was very conscious of the two queens on one little island & understandably did not welcome the comparison that would have obviously have been made. 🫅

@danielasarmiento30 11 ай бұрын

Sometimes it baffles me that someone as gloried and remembered as Elizabeth the first had the same desicion-making skills as us commoners of the 21st century, as her favorite form of resolving difficult desicions seems to be "if I don't choose the problem might eventually go away"

@jehannedarc1429 4 ай бұрын

It wasn’t about an inability to make decisions. It was about tactic and pragmatism.

@eddieboyky Жыл бұрын

Excellent video. I think you always do an excellent job of getting behind the romance and drama that gets built up around the Tudors and addressing the political nitty gritty realities of the time, which in turn makes the people involved seem more nuanced, and thus more real.

@lindabismuth6377 Жыл бұрын

👸👸every time I watch one video, I fall into the channel's links and only emerge a few hours later a little wiser for the experience. Thank you!

@austinross3540 Жыл бұрын

Great video Dr. Kay! I would love to see your take on Henry Stuart, prince of Wales, along with your thoughts on what kinds of king he would have been, had he lived and succeeded King James rather than his brother Charles 🤓

@cathryncampbell8555 Жыл бұрын

Austinross3540: Yes! I too would love an analysis of Prince Henry, son of King James I of England. I believe that had Henry lived & assumed the throne, the British Civil War might never have occurred.

@kikib1067 Жыл бұрын

I remember when Mary Queen of Scots came out and the discussion of the two “meeting” I think they were trying to portray they had never met by showing during the bulk of the scene they really did not have an eye to eye discussion. However making it look like they did. 🏰 👑🐝

@fabrisseterbrugghe8567 Жыл бұрын

I did a scene study from Maxwell Anderson's "Mary of Scotland.". I genuinely enjoyed trying to grapple with the role of Elizabeth.

@pams4557 Жыл бұрын

I believe that Elizabeth wanted to meet but was always advised against it. Another excellent video Dr. Kat! 👸👑

@Hfil66 Жыл бұрын

What has been clear to me for some time, and reinforced by your video here, is how temperamentally different the tow Queens were. Mary always struck me as an impetuous woman who simply could not make careful calculations of her situation. Elizabeth, by contrast, was very much under the guidance of her ministers. That may well have been a contributory factor as to why the Scottish nobility rejected Mary, while Elizabeth made sure that her ministers had enough reason to want to keep her in power to keep themselves in power.

@apriljones2950 Жыл бұрын

Very good breakdown of the complexities of the matter. Elizabeth was pragmatic in her refusal for a meeting. It's called self-preservation. Love your talks.👸🏽

@jenthebubble1914 Жыл бұрын

I think Elizabeth kept Mary at arm’s length deliberately. If she had met Mary in person then she would have had to acknowledge her and Elizabeth liked to sit on the fence. As long as Mary was in Scotland and had the possibility of succeeding Elizabeth dangling she might behave more favourably to England. Once she was in England Elizabeth didn’t want to see Mary as she was a political headache. Out of sight out of mind and her councillors can deal with her. The biggest misstep Elizabeth made was suggesting Dudley as a potential husband to Mary. She should have either suggested another English gentleman with vague royal ties or a Protestant prince. Mary should have converted to Protestantism to keep her crown and never married Darnley or stayed in France and let her half brother rule as regent. She would have had a happier life.

@Kris-bw7cv Жыл бұрын

Elizabeth was no fool. She would never allow a rival to her throne into her presence

@lspthrattan Жыл бұрын

Thank you for the lesson, Queen Kat, Ruler of Historical Storytelling! 👑🏰

@BeeKool__113 Жыл бұрын

Hail Queen Kat ❤👑📖

@emiliamead6803 Жыл бұрын

💂‍♀️👸 I love learning from Dr. Kat!

@yvonnemoujalli6904 Жыл бұрын

reading The queen of this realm by Jean Plaidy is a remarkable book about Queen Elizabeth so enjoyable and many of the info you mention is in the book TY Dr Kat .

@kathrynbiglin3124 Жыл бұрын

Such an interesting video, thanks! I'd never realized there were so many potential reasons why the two never met. I'd always chalked it up to distance, not sure why! 🏵️

@texanasimmons1761 Жыл бұрын

I love, love, love your channel! Your videos are always very informative, especially because Im a native born Texas girl and always interested in English history. Thank you, Kat!💐

@tarabelle2530 Жыл бұрын

As always Dr Kat, you've done an phenomenal job! I truly enjoyed this video!👸

@ginawiggles918 Жыл бұрын

I've always liked the Glenda Jackson portrayal of QEI.

@Chris-iz1rd Жыл бұрын

Having read Jacob Abbots' little biography, I am not surprised that the two women didn't meet in person. It is interesting that the movies have them meet. I see how the biographer has put Mary in a pleading/weak role in spite of her stature and beauty. He also has put Elizabeth in a rather uncertain role. This is how I see it (read it). It seemed at times that Elizabeth did want to meet Mary and then would think better of it or be given council against a meeting. Thank you for making all of this history understandable and fun to learn about! Hmm, royal emoji...Have fun stormin' the castle!

@kimberlynreetz3840 Жыл бұрын

I love the way you bring these historical events alive. I feel like I have a whole new perspective ❤❤

@cecilyupdegraff2559 Жыл бұрын

Elizabeth was given no choice but to imprison Mary and meeting for all the reasons you mentioned, would have been foolhardy. Though Mary was her kinswoman, she had consistently chosen husbands who showed her to be a week person and that alone would be enough to make Elizabeth leery. Meeting Mary just wasn’t a safe or smart thing to do.

@debbiekern2841 Жыл бұрын

I think Elizabeth always knew she would have to eliminate Mary. That task would be easier if she never met her. Elizabeth clearly knew that she, herself, would leave no heir. Her total contribution to the Tudor Dynasty would be that she lived and ruled. The fact that Mary's Catholicism was repugnant to her, aside, she could have molded Mary and possibly converted her over time. Maybe she simply felt that her own life was more important than who the future ruler would be after she was gone. It would be a bit like Harry vs Zara. I think there is so much more to what went on in her mind.

@rhiannonpoole6019 Жыл бұрын

Thank you as usual for a thought-provoking video. Elizabeth had such strength of character to survive and triumph as she did - your presentation made me think how vulnerable she must have felt, with that young and beautiful cousin hovering around.

@MaryPlaysPiano Жыл бұрын

Another well researched and well presented history topic by our wonderful Dr. Kat thank you!

@hedgehog0856 Жыл бұрын

I love your channel! I've heard stories before, but this is the first time I've heard how difficult Elizabeth had it when it came to her cousin.

@kaloarepo288 Жыл бұрын

In Schiller's play and the Donizetti opera that is based on it they do meet and have a dramatic confrontation where Mary screams "Bastarda" at Elizabeth - I have seen a production at the Sydney opera house.

@ireneford5722 Жыл бұрын

Visited Hampton Court Palace last September. I wanted to go there after enjoying your videos. Love from Canada

@lacyhanson7542 11 ай бұрын

Elizabeth had more traumas that directly impacted the way she moved, presented herself, ruled, and governed. Mary ruled with her heart and Elizabeth with her head. While both were passionate women, ultimately Mary was her own undoing. She could not read the room, so to speak, and act accordingly. If she had held a tighter rein on the Scottish court and asserted her dominance as ruler in a manner to earn respect, it may have ended differently for her.

@Lulu-ut9pv Жыл бұрын

I think Mary was raised to be a consort, not a monarch She spent most of her life in France, she was always told she will be the wife of king of France and was expected to think of Scotland and 2nd best

@Myke_OBrien Жыл бұрын

Brilliant as always. I hate to admit this, but I always thought that the two queens had met, based on numerous movies over the years. Elizabeth was clearly between a rock and a hard place over actually meeting with Mary. 👸🫅

@kathyjohnson2043 Жыл бұрын

I recently discovered that Henry had a Psalter (sometimes referred to as a prayer book) with his notes in the margins. Depending on the article, they either stroke his ego or reveal his insecurities. I haven't found a source for these. That the miniatures depicting Henry as King David make the question even more interesting. I would love to know your views as well as a source to read them all. I love your work!

@No_One507 Жыл бұрын

I think the first one to propose the idea of Queen Elizabeth I and Mary Queen of Scots meeting was Friedrich Schiller. Of course, being a dramatist and not a historian, he forced events because he wanted to write good drama, with "strong" scenes. Not only that: he was a medical doctor with an interest in psychology. Therefore, his main goal was to explore what went on in the mind of his characters, and if he had to "bend history" in order to do that, so be it. The same can be said of his treatment of Elizabeth of Bohemia, whose ambition to become queen he set down as the real reason for the outbreak of the Thirty Years War, thus making her go down in history as some kind of femme fatale. By the way, Dr. Kat, may I ask for some videos concerning the Stuarts? Pretty please...

@mellowfishie Жыл бұрын

wonderfully detailed and entertaining video! The laundry barn sequence threw me for a loop for sure... The reasons why they didn't/couldn't meet would have been so cool to see on-screen...

@Scraggledust Жыл бұрын

Excited!!! 🎉👑🎉. You always engage the mind! Perhaps they didn’t meet for “all the above”. Seeing someone in person actually brings to life written words. It humanizes the other party, making such choices that much more complicated. At least, I believe so.

@gafls3151 Жыл бұрын

I wonder if 👸Elizabeth did personally view Mary 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 from a distance. Imo it would fit Elizabeth's character to want to see just exactly what she was up against.

@catherine6646 Жыл бұрын

It would also be in Elzabeth's character to not wish to bother with such a 'silly creature' - she shows this in the tone of her letters to Mary.

@hillerymcdonald2303 Жыл бұрын

YAY!! Oh how I love the way Dr. Kat pronounces "sixth." the same way most Brits do I suppose, but still. Love it.

@carabear1337 Жыл бұрын

This one was very good. Well done 👏🏻

@jakual339 Жыл бұрын

Some excellent points! It seems clear that there was never any real reason for Elizabeth to meet with Mary, and that it would often have been difficult or even potentially harmful to do so. And given what we know about Elizabeth's insecurities, the argument that she would not have welcomed comparison between the two of them makes a lot of sense.

@lynnedelacy2841 Жыл бұрын

The more I hear about Elizabeth the more I’m impressed with her She managed to walk a tightrope throughout her life and facing the real possibility of death on numerous occasions She must have spent so much time looking over her shoulder from threats from her own family, the Spanish Armada and the hard core catholics looking to side with Mary Thanks you for an excellent presentation of the facts which give pause for thought Not least the more personal insecurities you mention towards the end My impression of Elizabeth is of a human as well as a consummate politician and the unfavourable physical comparison with someone famed for their beauty and 9 years younger which could have been made would definitely have been a consideration. To have met Mary would have made her real and the political social and religious considerations just too difficult to overcome and be given unnecessary prominence to any or all leading to questions and possibly unfavourable action Elizabeth did the right thing although Mary’s inevitable death being the willing pawn in too many potential overthrow plots must have given Elizabeth sleepless nights before she signed the death warrant, perhaps consoling herself that James would eventually succeed to the throne, but sentencing a fellow queen and family member must have been difficult With hindsight we know Elizabeth was ok but throughout her life she had to skirt so many dangerous and explosive trials she must have needed nerves of steel - outwardly at least Just a side note I find it fascinating on Elizabeth’s letter to Mary that she scored across any blank parts of the paper to avoid there being an unwanted unofficial additions to the letter from any third party such wereElizabeth’s survival instincts always to the fore Thanks again for a fascinating and thought provoking video - one of your best and that’s saying something

@ashleydavis1937 11 ай бұрын

This is the best breakdown I've ever heard of such a complex situation

@eliscanfield3913 Жыл бұрын

Idk whether it was the political or personal reasons that proved the strongest for E, and she had control over M's person for a long time. I suspect part of it depends on how important the level of politics were. Elizabeth was a phenomenal politician, but not above petty nonsense. Mary, unfortunately for her, was not as good at politicking.

@bbybella9937 Жыл бұрын

I was with you all until you said smallpox. I mean Mary also had smallpox and nobody points that out 24/7. Elizabeth had smallpox but she recovered quickly and basically only had small acne scars. Ambassadors wrote about how shocked they were on how she recovered so quickly. So that means her face was not covered contrary to popular belief.

@fiorimonde7494 Жыл бұрын

Thank you for another great video

@vikkiwinfield1377 Жыл бұрын

❤. Love this video!! Thank you

@carmenpeters728 Жыл бұрын

I think your final theory is the most plausible. Elizabeth would not have tolerated sharing the limelight with another woman, especially if that woman was not only in competition for her crown👑 , but physically appealing👙as well... Didn't she disallow the wives of her 🎩parliament in court? Mary worried her mind, no doubt. Great insight! thanks! I live in a part of the world where most folks don't care about their own current affairs or history...never mind England's history. Maddening! But you saved the day...I got my fix.

@ChemGirlLiberal Жыл бұрын

So glad you covered this topic.

@TheCujo75 Жыл бұрын

Yass this has always fascinated me!!

@Goddessofvets16 Жыл бұрын

Elizabeth was a smart shrewd operator 😂

@charleston1789 Жыл бұрын

Fascinating video as always Dr Kat, thank you 😊

@kathleenbrennandejesus5149 Жыл бұрын

Great video, as usual! ❤ 🎉

@deborahdauray8933 Жыл бұрын

Thank you!

@SusanCat5098 Жыл бұрын

Thanks Dr Kat! 👑💅

@emileeunger6142 Жыл бұрын

❤I love learning about history!!!

@BlackCatMargie Жыл бұрын

I think you outline very well, all the many reasons the two Queens could not meet, throughout their lifetimes. If Elizabeth had been a less wiley character, the maybe she would have agreed to it, but it would have been a huge political mistake, and she was far to clever to acquiescence. Thanks for another great video. 💪👸

@CrazyArtistLady Жыл бұрын

Oooo what a good question to discuss! 😊

@pennyatkinson5740 Жыл бұрын

Thanks again Dr Kat! I wonder if Elizabeth was jealous of Mary's many marriages and her ability to bear a male heir? Perhaps considering the death of her own mother and her inability to find a husband made Mary the last person Elizabeth wanted to meet?? I can imagine there could have been a terrible row if they HAD met ! Maybe Scotland would have remained independent if that had occurred?? Maybe the civil war would have begun decades earlier than it did, after Elizabeth 's death ???

@bbybella9937 Жыл бұрын

I doubt she was jealous. What did getting married and having an heir do for Mary? It made her life worse.

@pennyatkinson5740 Жыл бұрын

@@bbybella9937 it ensured her line carried on.Elizabeth must have been very aware that she was the end of her line .

@bbybella9937 Жыл бұрын

@@pennyatkinson5740 Elizabeth chose not to get married and have kids. It was an active choice on her part. She wasn’t surprised knowing her line would end.

@pennyatkinson5740 Жыл бұрын

@@bbybella9937 agreed, but she was also known for her very vicious temper & jealous nature,which could be turned to her own advantage when it suited her. It could have been her way of justifying not meeting Mary.