Why Do We Care SO Much About Historical Accuracy?

Why Do We Care SO Much About Historical Accuracy? | Napoleon v. Historians

Рет қаралды 11,076

Kaelyn Grace Apple | Historian in Training

6 ай бұрын

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Title: Why Do We Care SO Much About Historical Accuracy? | Napoleon v. Historians
Current Subscriber Count: 102,000
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✨CITATIONS (Special thanks to my research assistant Mimi for helping me pull this video together!)
Mike Duncan: www.thenation.com/article/cul...
Dan Snow re: Historical Inaccuracies in Napoleon (www.independent.co.uk/arts-en...)
Ridley Scott Response: www.gamesradar.com/ridley-sco... AND deadline.com/2023/11/ridley-s...
Laura Saxton, ‘A true story: defining accuracy and authenticity in historical fiction‘, Rethinking History, 24:2 (2020)
Hannah Grieg, ‘As seen on screen: material culture, historical accuracy and costume drama’, in Writing Material Culture History (London: Bloomsbury, 2015)
J. Furman Daniel and Paul Musgrave, ‘Synthetic Experiences: How Popular Culture Matters for Images of International Relations’, International Studies Daily, 62 (2017)
Erika Ruth Sigurdson, ‘Violence and Historical Authenticity: Rape (and Pillage) in Popular Viking Fiction’, Scandinavian Studies 86:3 (2014)
Alison Landsberg, Engaging the Past: Mass Culture and the Production of Historical Knowledge (Columbia: Columbia University Press, 2015)
Alison Landsberg, Prosthetic Memory: The Transformation of American Remembrance in the Age of Mass Culture (Columbia: Columbia University Press, 2004)
Hayden White, ‘Historiography and Historiophoty’, The American Historical Review, 93:5 (1988)
Robert A. Rosenstone, ‘The History Film as a Mode of Historical Thought’ in A Companion to Historical Film (London: Blackwell, 2013)
Robert Rosenstone, ‘History in Images/History in Words: Reflections on the Possibility of Really Putting History onto Film’, The American Historical Review, 93: 5 (1988)
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Пікірлер: 64

@bijouxducoeur 5 ай бұрын

Very intriguing video! Thank you for addressing the issue of historical accuracy in film and other forms of popular media. As a historian specializing in Haiti, it didn't surprise me to find that the film didn't cover the loss of Saint-Domingue by 1803 and its various consequences for Napoleon's Atlantic empire. Similar to your concerns, I worry that, unfortunately, academic history, being less accessible to the general public, allows films like this one to shape people's perceptions of the past. In some cases, such films become the sole means through which individuals access historical information. This is why I believe videos like yours and the overall work of public historians are crucial. It's not about gatekeeping who gets to talk about history (as history belongs to no single person) but rather about fostering discussions that challenge and complicate what is feasible to portray on a screen. Anyhow, I'm happy that the success of your channel implies that more people will be contemplating issues like the one discussed in this video! Best of luck with your dissertation in 2024!

@charissalee1575 5 ай бұрын

we need more critical public history. thanks!

@PokhrajRoy. 5 ай бұрын

As someone who grew up with ‘Horrible Histories’ but of course being clear that it’s a stepping stone to more learning.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

yes!

@Atmviola 5 ай бұрын

I watched Amadeus for the first time in 8th grade, and even though that movie is highly inaccurate, that was what sparked my interest in musicology. I’ll hopefully start my PhD in musicology this fall!

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

I love this story!

@tomc8888 5 ай бұрын

Amadeus is the one film I give a pass to on inaccuracy issues, because it has an unreliable narrator (Salieri, played by F. Murray Abraham). Movie/play Salieri is an embittered old man who has mental health issues, and the film is seen through his eyes, so it's understandable that the film gets both minor (how many children Mozart had) and major details (Salieri killing Mozart) wrong.

@Atmviola 5 ай бұрын

@@tomc8888 oh that's a really good point, I didn't even think about that. One of my undergraduate music history courses essentially ripped this whole movie apart for the inaccuracies, but I would be interested in revisiting this film again through the lens you presented.

@jacobking3704 5 ай бұрын

As someone who is pursuing a graduate degree in public history and possibly a phd, I cannot express how much I loath Scott’s argument of, “If you didn’t live it, then shut up.” It’s the same type of energy whenever Graham Hancock distorts facts and dismisses professionals who have dedicated their lives to their chosen fields. Furthermore, if both Martin Scorsese and Christopher Nolan can work with historians on their projects and make their films engaging, Scott has no excuse. I mean it’s no wonder why the last few biopics he has made have been lackluster.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

👏🏻

@PokhrajRoy. 5 ай бұрын

Yes to VIDEO ESSAY! Even more excited if it’s a debut 👏🏽

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

Thank you! I am really proud of this video

@PokhrajRoy. 5 ай бұрын

The video was such fun! Great start to the year 👏🏽

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

Yay! Thank you!

@dasmysteryman12 5 ай бұрын

I am a fellow historian in training, specifically dealing with the period set in the last two-thirds of Napoleon. From the Napoleonic era discussions among historians from podcasts and articles, what I noticed in the discourse is that many of them would have been a bit lenient towards the inaccuracies if it was a good movie to begin with. Instead, it was a confusing mess even through a purely cinema perspective. I should have watched the new Godzilla movie that day, which ironically authentically depicts the devastating personal consequences of war better than Ridley Scott's movie.

@Ashthegrey 5 ай бұрын

Yes with the video essays!! These are some of my favorite videos. Great job.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

YAY! I am so glad you like them!

@Betmas2 4 ай бұрын

This was great! And so important. Thank you for the sources

@trewaldo 5 ай бұрын

Historical revisionism has been rampant everywhere especially when people are obsessed with conspiracy theories and unwritten narratives that fit their fondness of intrigues. The use of social media (especially Facebook and Tiktok) only worsened the issue as these historical inaccuracies get more hype than true history or real news. Thank you for sharing your straightforward insights about this topic. Happy new year! Cheers, Kaelyn! 😍🤓🥰

@SSingh-nr8qz 5 ай бұрын

The issue is people in ECHO CHAMBERS. Bad information has been around since the printing press. In the past you had public debates and had to be able to defend yourself in public forums. Today, you can post whatever crazy thing you like, block your critics, have your fans tell you that you are correct, and be completely in that bubble.

@biegiemdokultury7238 2 ай бұрын

I watched this video essay with interest, as the subject of my dissertation is somewhat similar. I'm a PhD candidate in literature, and I'm looking at adaptations of literature in original Polish musicals. I can't tell you how many times I've been asked about the accuracy of a particular adaptation when presenting a paper... 🙃It is interesting to see how people from different (though related) fields see adaptation differently. From my observations, I can see that for academics who focus on theatre or film, it's quite obvious that the adaptation is a new work that won't be "faithful" to the literary source, because it's almost impossible to do so (I could go on for hours explaining why). On the other hand, there are people who do literature research, and they would almost ALWAYS say things like "oh, well, they didn't have to do it that way, it was done much better in the book"🙄 Anyway - thanks for the video! The arguments you used can also be used in the discussions I'm having🙌

@kasiag4274 5 ай бұрын

Love video essays! Thank you for all the recommendations too :)

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

Glad you like them!

@MMircea 4 ай бұрын

It's because Napoleon's real life is a script worthy of any academy award. If you capture any 3 years of Napoleon's life into a 2.5 hour film, you've got an Oscar winner. For the love of God, it does the scripting for you.

@SarinaMotta 5 ай бұрын

it is sooo clear that you are passionnate about this topic, it makes really good content too!

@chrisdeutsch4669 5 ай бұрын

Excellent video essay. I particularly like how you integrate sources and citations (on my mind thanks to Hbomberguy's recent video essay). I don't know if this is what you want to do in the future, but, as an adjunct and terminal postdoc, doing video essays like this is something I've been looking at doing. I am glad that you discussed the value of history to the broader public. Also, Hayden White!

@montsesobraldorado5910 5 ай бұрын

Such an interesting video. Understanding the impact of art forms in our comprehension on the world and our history shouldn’t stop artists from doing fictional historical movies or novels but to differentiate fantasy from historical facts (recreation of a past event). Congratulations on your channel and all the best on your dissertation journey

@DarkRuins 5 ай бұрын

yass love this! :)

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

yay! I am so glad you enjoyed it :) It was a lot of fun to put together

@taviailes9478 5 ай бұрын

I love this video so much!!! I can’t wait for more content like this. Happy 2024!

@rachaelpowles8902 5 ай бұрын

Such a great video!! Will definitely be checking out these sources 🥰

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

Thank you so much!

@PokhrajRoy. 5 ай бұрын

2:42 IN DRESS HISTORY KZfaq WE TRUST.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

I love that content!

@garnetli2173 5 ай бұрын

interesting and important topic. Thanks for sharing!

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it!

@JohnSeney 5 ай бұрын

He actually admits in his closing line to not having a life! 😂😹 I have been through this long ago with 1973's film "Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid," and came to the conclusion that what matters more is the spirit of the matter. "Common" people are unlikely to engage any history without something spirited coming first.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

👏🏻👏🏻

@PokhrajRoy. 5 ай бұрын

Omg just finished watching the last season of ‘The Crown’ and the finale was the only saving grace because my goodness did they do Prince Harry and Kate’s Mom dirty. Fumbled the bag in a big way.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

Some rather interesting production decisions were made. It was entertaining but I took it all with a grain of salt

@PokhrajRoy. 5 ай бұрын

@@KaelynGraceApple I suppose that’s the best way to go.

@timothyjudsontaylorofficia9786 5 ай бұрын

Loved it. Facts matter. In order to connect with history, it is essential to establish the facts accurately so we can try to grasp the time prriod, the events as they happened, and the mindset of the parties involved. Without those touchstones, you have a fantasy of what the author or film crew projects, rather than a place of understanding. New to your page, but instantly subscribed.

@karleybioanthro 5 ай бұрын

I saw that Lewis and Clark film at the Field museum! It’s been awhile but I’m pretty sure it’s same one.

@MalcolmY89 5 ай бұрын

Thank you very much for an interesting video on an interesting topic! Myself being a Ph.D. Candidate in architectural history I was especially intrigued by your final question: "How can visual mediums work as a form of method for historical research?" In architectural history visual mediums are obviously essential. For instance, original archival drawings or copper/wooden plates in published treatises indicates a historical architect's design intentions. This can in turn be compared to corresponding archeological evidence. Film, however, has (to my knowledge, except a few modern exceptions) a massive unused potential within architectural history research, especially given the fact that architecture is a three-dimensional visual art. Your video was inspirational in the sense that it made me reflect on the way of working within my own field. Keep up the creation of great content!

@andreeablaj3414 5 ай бұрын

Great video! I have recently started watching your videos from the beginning of your YT career and I find that they have improved so much over the years! I really feel motivated to work on my own dreams after seeing your content! Happy New Year and all the best!

@dalishrogue3621 5 ай бұрын

I wish I could have specialized in my courses. Unfortunately the 4 year I went to offered mostly 19th century classes 😪. I wanted to focus my studies on modern-contemporary literature. At least I have fun teachers who help me skew the material to be about more contemporary themes lol. My sister and dad took me to Napoleon. I didn’t think it was that bad but I was expecting to fall asleep so it was a low bar. My sister ended up trying to walk through the inaccuracies but kept getting sidetracked by different Russian wars lol

@SarinaMotta 5 ай бұрын

kinda random but do you think the movie 300 was historically accurate? i remember watching it in history class

@montsesobraldorado5910 5 ай бұрын

I can’t agree more,

@PokhrajRoy. 5 ай бұрын

People really do misinterpret the term ‘creative license’ like it’s meant for taking steady imaginative leaps. Also, if people are going to do this new trend of ‘remix history’ genre ( ‘Marie Antoinette’ (2006), ‘The Favourite’ and ‘The Great’ being good examples), then stick to it.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

👏🏻👏🏻

@SSingh-nr8qz 5 ай бұрын

So Netflix's Cleopatra is not accurate?

@bsaneil 5 ай бұрын

Very good video. The real Napoleon was Charismatic, intelligent, energetic, concerned about replacing decadent monarchies with meritocratic societies, and a patron of the arts and sciences. I'm not sure who Joachim Phoenix was trying to represent...

@poohoff 5 ай бұрын

Nobody ever expects an American movie to be historically accurate. This one was made to educate Americans on Napoleon, so that they know it's not only a type of dessert.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

Fair enough :) This videos isn't actually about the film as much as the topic of historical accuracy

@miketacos9034 5 ай бұрын

I think you're right on the money in terms of the issue of historical accuracy on its own, but Napoleon in particular was not inaccurate, it was also inauthentic. I'm all for shows that are historical authentic cuz it's a great way to draw people in, but ... Ridley Scott did Napoleon dirty in so many ways. He didn't portray the essence of Napoleon or the times he lived in. It was just a mopey mess. It was neither exciting nor authentic.

@leonidasthermopylae3378 5 ай бұрын

Because the movie is called Napoleon. Change the title and call it Waldo and there won’t be any issue.

@PokhrajRoy. 5 ай бұрын

Ridley Scott…is a complex personality. His comments on not casting Middle Eastern performers (industry wide issue, it’s not just him) were just…wow.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

Indeed!

@jimmycricket7385 5 ай бұрын

Ridley Scott and other Hollywood directors play fast and loose with historic facts all the time. Frankly it annoys the hell out of me. We know you want to sell a movie but if you are going to transmogrify historical facts out of all recognition then DON'T give your movie a title that indicates it is an accurate historic drama. Call it something else. Give the characters fictional names. Admit that your work is a fantasy. I don't even like it when Hollywood takes traditional fairy tales and twists them out of recognition. Invent your own story! If people did the same with music, they'd have their bank balances rinsed out with law suits.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

Fair!

@antred11 5 ай бұрын

Even ignoring the historical inaccuracies, Napoleon is just a bad film. And I mean BAD. It feels like a random series of badly written scenes without any coherent story telling.

@KaelynGraceApple 5 ай бұрын

♥️