hey thats me! I'm a huge fan, thank you so much for posting this

kotlin mentioned let's gooooooo

Kotlin is a fantastic language. We switched to it for backend development 4 years ago, and haven't looked back since. I'd love to see Prime explore it a bit more and see what he thinks.

There's no need to write this on your own, but you absolutely can. This is a first-party library from kotlinx-html, but you can easily define custom elements with whatever methods you want and it all works out nicely

Finally... A Kotlin video done by Prime.

"He probably uses vscode" *Proceeds to open IntelliJ with IdeaVim*

Finally, Prime looking into Kotlin. There is also the Kotlin Multiplatform and LLVM compiler.

OMG NO WAYY primeagen is finally getting Kotlin-pilled i can't believe this! Please man get deeper down this rabbit hole, you won't regret it. I'm a very active member (and moderator) of the Kotlin Slack and would be more than happy to help you with anything on your Kotlin journey

Also, as someone who was forced into learning kotlin (not for this use case tho), at first I wasn't very enthusiastic about it. But the more you learn the language features and the nice to haves it has, you just end up falling in love imo. The abstraction addiction is a real problem but at the same time it just starts to feel like you are making art 😅

Kotlin is massively underated

I've been working with Kotlin for backend development for two years, and I've made a DSL for our work area. To avoid making tools just to make other things, the best approach is to do it iteratively and incrementally. Start with a basic version that has only what's really needed, and then add more features step by step when they're needed.

Learning Kotlin and Jetpack Compose after being taught Java and XML in Uni gor movile dev was like entering a cooled Mall in an arid desert

A thing that wasn't explicitly mentioned, but I think it is kinda cool (and a very substantial part of Kotlin DSLs) is that lambdas can have the type of extension methods.

I do server side typrscript work at my day job but get to spend a lot of time coordinating with ios and android devs supporting the company's mobile apps. Both swift and kotlin seem like really solid languages and I always leave those meetings feeling jealous. Given the chance to rewrite the backend from ts to kotlin I think I'd take it if go wasn't also an option for some reason.

The issue with }}}} is def a valid point but it's also true for an any tag you may use in html repeatdly (i.e. ), and is also why your IDE should be set up with visual indicators :D

That honestly looked very good and clean. Im sold.

This got me inspired to try HTMX with Swift and result builders.

Kotlin is a great language!

Kotlin is awesome. I worked with it for 3 years, amazing language.

Kotlin makes programming fun

That Pam person is worried about nesting and talking about HTML at the same time...

Awesome video, hope you continue Levi!

I did not know that a trailing lambda argument could be broken out as to look like a little function instead. That's actually really nice looking. It's very cool syntactic sugar actually. Honestly any language with lambdas should probably implement this syntactic sugar.

I think Compose Multiplatform can already do all this. It is a Kotlin UI framework. Also breaking things up into components reduces nesting.

Great vid. Had a little bugger about with this in go and is really easy to get something useful working.

His video was good, but also your additions were spot on and insightful, one of your wisest :)

finally, java 2

More about Kotlin please, this language is awesome

Kotlin mention let's go

I expected surprise, but I didn't expect to be that impressed.

15:08 OMG as a front end developer I must say this is so backend-style HTML. No semantics, 1000 nested divs. 😛

Finally kt getting recognition

Kotlin is the best for anything to do with web dev (backend or frontend) 😍

I think language based abstraction for building html or some ui is really cool. Except for when you want the user to be able to provide custom templates to use

Kotlin mentioned let’s go

kotlin my beloved

I never heard of HTMX before until a month and a half ago. I tried it and i really, really liked it. For me it works great with Python in Django. I don't know, i just really enjoy not needing to write any JavaScript code.

kotlin is freaking goated, such a great language without all the java bloat

I hope you can try it, it's very nice to code in honestly.

This is awesome. Is there a startup repo or something you can clone to start with?

I think kotlin is one of the most well designed programing language on present days

Finally some Kotlin! Pretty curious what would he think about Jetpack Compose

16:08 several years ago I was using Kotlin (it was my Conference Driven Development moment :D ) and ended up overabstracting and over"simplifying" things in a project, just because I could and was amazed by all the Kotlin's nice features (and, that's the worst, I was in that project alone for some time, so there was noone to stop me). Today… I think I still would like Kotlin, but due to my nature I would have to put an extra effort to NOT use too many lang features :D

Prime should look at Jetpack Compose

Might want to figure out how to compress the audio on other streams so you can keep it near 100% without peaking. (Audio compression in terms of compressing the soundwave not compressing the data)

I love that you let him cook despite being roasted by chat

Kotlin was for sure the most elegant/clean language that I meet. It works for backend, android, web etc. I do not use it in my day-to-day life for enviroment reasons, like jvm and all kind of enterprise stuff that comes with it. Maybe a will try some kotlin native to see what happens.

I have been waiting for this one

+1 to html - few problem: 1) sometimes u may just want to try something before coding it with kotlin/recompiling/redeploying (how angry u will be after 10 tests with all this circle around) -> soon you'll want hot reload and html2code converter 1.1) there might be a huge plain html template that do nothing, but u still will have to convert it to this code struct 1.1.1) if you say - then just cook it differently/save to file and send as raw file -> then u already have 2 options of doing things 2) performance, mem? 3) codestyle/convention - since it's a code nobody will stop u from doing hard things inside template and soon it can become a huge spagetti php/flutter like 4) html is not that hard but kinda native "language", while all this macrosing works in terms of modern langs but its kinda overcomplication for that purp. 5) imagine tomorrow's manager will come to u with a great idea to use some other language for serving html

I suggested to Prime to do a kotlin video 6 months ago in the discord server... He said "absolutely not". But I'm glad he did!!!!

npm is free because you pay with your soul

20:34 ... wait a second. Why can't I open Levi Dawn's channel? Is his channel down? I made to type the exact name and searched the web too.

This is what using Hiccup with Clojure showed me, and because of that React never grew up on me. Knowing that there is a better way makes you wonder how React went that widespread.

Would it create a closure for every single html element tho? If you have 100 elements that will be 100 functions for the garbage collector at server side, compared to 1 if using regular html templating

Swift calls them trailing closures and they’re amazing.

Kotlin is very good, super pragmatic and you can go very far design wise

Clojure is the best language to use with HTMX, no templates needed, html is part of Clojure code. HTML has tree syntax, like Clojure can't get more simple.

Nice! I like Go, but this might be even better!!

KOTLIN MENTIONED

I really like Kotlin. Its biggest problem is its biggest feature: its connection to Java. But the functional utility is so good. When I first used Rust, it felt most like Kotlin to me.

Kotlin's string interpolation is lifted from Scala. And you can do what he does in Scala as well.

Tom is a genius

This is like next level Spring MVC

I barely heard the guy in the video. But how fantastic! I just bought Atomic kotlin last week :) More kotlin videos please!

Tim cooked that joke so much that I'm about to get burned out. TheJokeagen better take another rare one out of the oven before this turns mid-ium. Keep the commentary hot and fresh.

7:19 thats ruby block passing right there, but unlike ruby blocks lambda is explicit argument in function signature

BTW probably Prime would love Swift, it has some similar things. (I'm talking about how lambdas can be written, this makes UI programming is fun)

I like the builder pattern in the host language. Better than a language extension like JSX because more tools & patterns are available.

i'm gonna get back to this video to watch it later. in the meantime, you better not disapprove of kotlin, kotlin is awesome

As a mobile developer, I can say Kotlin and Swift are both great languages, and it's sad swift has a limited scope in development, and hope to see it change in the future... even if I don't believe it will.

link in description is missing

Thr greatest thing about this is strong typing in the template

Remember to paste the video in the description. I prefer to put the reacted video in the background with muted sound to give them a deserved view.

I tried Kotlin a while ago, and I loved most of the things that it offered. Thing that I did not like, and actually made me quit writing it, is the ecosystem; the java thing and the kotlin native thing... I feel that back then, if you did not use the premium version of Intellij, it was quite awful to get a project running and manage dependencies and all of that stuff.

📝 Summary of Key Points: 📌 The speaker enjoys using HTMX and Tailwind for building websites, especially for side projects, as it allows for building reactive UIs without needing to use React and for creating visually appealing UIs without much effort. 🧐 The speaker discusses the benefits of using Kotlin with HTMX for building reactive and clean UIs, highlighting features like string templating, extension functions, and trailing lambdas that enable the creation of custom HTML components and domain-specific languages. 💡 Additional Insights and Observations: 💬 Quotable Moments: "The less dependencies you can have, the less steps you need to get to the endpoint, which is a joy to work with." 📊 Data and Statistics: The video did not present specific data or statistics but focused on the technical aspects of using HTMX, Tailwind, and Kotlin for web development. 🌐 References and Sources: The speaker demonstrated practical examples and code snippets to illustrate the advantages of using Kotlin with HTMX for web development. 📣 Concluding Remarks: The video provided valuable insights into leveraging HTMX, Tailwind, and Kotlin for building modern and efficient web applications. The speaker's detailed explanations and examples showcased the power of these tools in simplifying the development process and creating elegant user interfaces. Overall, it was an informative and well-presented discussion on enhancing web development workflows. Generated using TalkBud

I didn’t understand HTMX until I realised the advocates are backend developers

Nice! Ruby has things like Phlex, very similar to that DSL, even better IMHO. Also Lucky framework in Crystal is similar for building views. This way is easy to do reusable maintainable components. Mix it with htmx and I think it could be great for building the front-end.

Each time I add a dependency I feel like i'm adding a point of failure. And sometimes I also feel like i'm reinventing the wheel

TLDR on the function based html builders (super common in functional languages): they’re super nice because they’re super testable and you get your languages tooling, but there’s a performance trade off because you have to concatenate all these little strings as opposed joining templates only on dynamic content.

Congrats on the award prime🥳🥳

Have just looked into some iOS dev for a small period, but even Swift has that thing.

You then wrap it into functions then into classes, and maybe with some builder pattern you'll have a Form that can add input fields and tons of abstraction to get rid of all xml nonsense, that's is where the juicy part is, oop + html, your code base will pretty much be 90% business logic and 10% UI stuff. This is php but obj oriented and typesafe requires only one single language and your exisiting skill can be easily transferred from java.

Dioxus for Rust does the same kind of templating when building UI its fun tho...

"we let tim cook, and I think an iphone is about to come out" 🤣

I like how Primeagen mentions things he likes every now and then. Like ketchup and stuff

"the ability to extend things that already exist"... we saw what you did there... :P

Does Prime have anything on Scala?

7:32 stolen from Ruby!!! Ruby does this too. It is a very cool useful feature!! Works well not just with DSL building, but also iteration. It’s kinda like continuations.

What I've never understood about HTMX is the amount of iteration that is always required to get a component looking visually perfect. When you're doing any html/css that is even slightly more complex than a rectangle with a bit of padding you will drive yourself insane without instant feedback and HMR. Try debugging a flex overflow issue by waiting 10 minutes to recompile, rebuild and refresh each time you change one class.

Where is "the name, ....."? I really waited for it. But it didn't come out?

this trailing lambda feature is straight out of Haskell

Why no link to OG video, I'm gonna watch it without commentary

xml and html are also easy to read. jsx too. Unless you make it large, and complicated and the same would apply to his declarative kotlin.

SwiftUI uses this kind of syntax sugar, and turns Swift into an alien language, super hard to learn and debug.

You can literally do this in C# fight me

Sorry Pam, I also prefer non-html html, like PUG, when you want to prototype fast its out of your way, and when you want to go back and read it, theres no brackets regardless of type in your way UNLESS you have attributes then you get parens.

i like to mix functions and data, functions and code and functions and function. what i don't like is to extend builtin types

Damn I love Kotlin!!! Such a pleasure to code in.

hell yeah, kotlin gang

I'm sold