Some people want cruelty. The insolence and impudence with which the guilty ones have shown and committed their crimes is what drives the cruel vengeance out.

@@Only_God_Is_Allah_SWT Even if you punish someone exactly with the same pain/evil that he gave, can you be sure that living beings have free will ? Can you guarantee that, if you were at his place (born with the same genes, having same backstory, all these things that you actually never choosed), you would have acted differently ?

Or following Origen, justice is subsumed by mercy. Justice must fundamentally be restorative, corrective, and educative if it is to be considered justice.

That’s a modern idea of justices

do you even know who was this Aquinas? ,,don't display such weak intellect bruh

Lateral violence it goes around ♾

Wax on, wax off.

Often the revenger welcomes death as closure to their suffering.

@@OdysseyHome-Gaming They have to die , to reset the balance of Justice,.

Two graves are better than one. Especially, when that one grave is that of the wronged one.

I came to point out something similar. Specifically how the sequels actually point out just how meaningless what he's doing is. He's no longer out for revenge, he's just killing now because he doesn't know how to stop.

Which is why to me John Wick is A LOT like Death Wish. There was a strong reason for the violence in the first movie. After that it was just an action movie

@@SkittlesInYourHand That sasuke uchiha life.

Yeah, like, ' heres my deathwish AND my excuse to finally cleanse the underbelly of as many bad people as i can while going out seeking my own form of justice'

Kourtney Hanley your comment was so good I started eating popcorn while reading it. 🍿 You should get into movie reviews/commentary or something. 👀

Possibly, other may want the need to punish as a way to get those they hate to understand the pain they inflict. But sometimes some people just need a dirt nap, not much need for understanding just them not living is good enough.

I disagree. While yes there is a need for understanding, it is wrong that it is the need for the target to understand. It is the vigilante that needs to understand the root of their pain, to grieve, accept, and move beyond it. The vigilante is broken because they refuse to do this and instead project that pain onto their target, wrongly believing that by making someone else "understand" their pain, it will resolve it for themselves. This is also why vigilantes are almost exclusively men and very often are men who have lost their female partner, because it is a part of societal expectations of gender roles that men do not self-examine and deal with their own emotions but rather expect others to do that emotional labour for them (usually their female partner). By taking away the female partner the narrative sets up the man to become broken as he has no one to work through his emotions for him, and he is incapable of doing it himself.

@@agilemind6241 Ellie Nesler and Gary Plauché. Two people, different genders, did the exact same thing, and not to make the person "understand", but to prevent them from doing it again. That's meaningful justice.

“What more could I lose” -Seductive Lord of Hammers

Thunder God destroys half of universe - 2019 Circa Colorized

@@popopop984 I love it, as much of a joke he was in Endgame, the reality and weight of such a loss he experienced often leads to depression and addiction. Not proactive revenge and actions, it's always clouded.

@@callmev3531 "Me, personally, I could lose a lot." -Rocket, a talking raccoon.

@@BetaBreaking Addiction, if you are weak. The depression on the other hand is always there, like the anger but anger can be channeled if controlled.

Snyder's version made him even more of a good guy in comparison. Still very radical, but not as much.

@@lunavioleta001 it's because in Snyder's version, specifically the child killer scene, we experience the scene of the crime through Rorshach's eyes and we feel the same feeling of shock and anger as they build up slowly inside. While the comics don't give you the same feeling of connection.

​@@heshamhany8470 We do exactly the same in the comic, and, unlike in the film, there is a whole chapter of build-up for that scene, we get to know much better Rorschach, the end of the fucker who killed the little girl is much more ironically appropriate, and the final monologue is one of my favorite pieces of Alan Moore´s Writing... So I don´t really understand your point...

@@lunavioleta001 Yep. In fact Rorscach's favorite newspaper in the comics actively defends the KKK. Rorschach is a shitty human being.

@@machacasaurius which version of rorschach do u like more? snyderr or alaan moore?

Well, Lincoln failed that test then. Using his power to imprison people without trial for disagreeing with him, having millions die for wanting to be a seperate country, ETC.

Great quote. Saving that later

Lincoln was wrong here. Most people nowadays cannot stand adversity.

Quite ironic coming from Lincoln of all people

​@@aguilarraliuga1777 In what way?

Then try going into a war without any armor in any ancient battle. The need for wounds to need air becomes pointless at that point. :/

@@sigmacademy that’s why you don’t send wounded soldiers into battle, and why you take wounded soldiers out of battle.

Yeah, but it’s hard to heal if everybody recognizes you and kills your family and burns down your house and stuff

@@stanstanstan2597 that’s why you have allies, to protect you when you are weak

@@AristonSparta til they use smear campaigns to distance your allies from you

"Society entrusts making things right upon the state" Not necessarily. If you don't make a legal complaint, the state can't act on your behalf. There was a case of a nun who refused to prosecute her rapists. As someone else says here, " The only meaningful justice is forgiveness."

@@smkh2890 Everyone takes the old " eye for an eye" statement in the Bible so far out of context...if you want to bring scripture into it, then vengence belongs to God...ijs

@@timhenley3602 Out of context? Modern Christianity has manipulated and mistranslated the bible so far beyond the original that its laughable. Look up the origins of Abrahamic religions. El or the Elohim is a Canaanite pantheon that Yahweh aka Jehova was apart of until Israelites had the genius idea of monotheism to prevent the nation from splitting up, it split up regardless.

@@josuem7398 You're preaching to the choir, dude. Go tell someone who doesn't already know.

An eye for eye should still include interest since they initiated the suffering with mens reas to begin with.

Absolutely, these videos have changed my perspective and even helped me through trauma and my own limited views.

I couldn’t have said it better.

This is why the end of The Batman worked so well for me, his character arc throws into stark relief how much of his hero persona had only been violence without helping anyone if the situation didn't need someone stomped on.

And we indeed, live in a society.

All the more reason for us to unite against the injustice of Marxist hate and expunge it from our midst.

That's about as useful a supposition as saying "the universe creates it all". We don't control society. We don't choose it. It is a result of our personal choices.

Society is a spook

Which is ultimately for naught, because the irony of humans needing society to thrive as a whole...is that society itself is often at odds with human nature. The reason why the concept of human utopia is, in truth, a fallacy...is because it requires a universal suppression of human nature. And even if 99% of humanity is agrees to it (which is wholly impossible to begin with), the 1% that can't/won't...are more than enough to bring it all down. Utopia/peace is only achievable on the personal level. Its always been that way, and it always will be.

Thank you. You don't know how much I needed your comment

That maybe because oh brain damage when he hit his head fleeing the set up in Saint Denis. Not that it makes it okay but considering he was consistent up till than makes sense to me.

@@dossiebigham9113 Dutch was a monster before he hit his head, don't forget he murdered Heidi McCourt in cold blood in Blackwater. Dutch was a hypocrite who believed revenge was to be avoided, unless it was his enemies to be dealt with.

@@the_corvid97 okay yes but going off what as presented to us. That maybe a possibility given blackwater is kept ambiguous we don't see all of the details. Does that excuse dutch for what happened or what he does later no no it doesn't.

@@dossiebigham9113 I just responded as I did as I see a lot of people blaming the trolley incident for Dutch's behavior when he was already in a decline before then.

@@the_corvid97 well ok though I do think maybe that injury made him decline faster is all I'm saying. I mean people have gotten brain injuries and had personally shifts and lose of impulse control. I'm just saying it might be a factor not the main one but a factor.

Batman Begins is the quintessential batman to me. The rest of the trilogy misses the mark somewhat with its protagonist. Obviously the Dark Knight is the best *movie* in the trilogy, but that's mostly because of the Joker. Batman Begins gives us a true Batman.

@Garry Snail I dont read comics much.

@Garry Snail It's not my taste. I prefer real books.

@Garry Snail Because i know shit about Batman

@Garry Snail you dont need to ever see a single comic to understand Batman as a character. It's ingrained in our culture. He's an archetype.

yo cant clean dem pots n pans wd an ol wet rag - gotta use HOT wada!

@@phigupot8976 seems familiar, what's it from? :)

@@domhuckle damn, didn kno ae had free rent n yo mind

@@phigupot8976 sorry, thought you were engaging and not just trolling. Easy mistake to make when you post in wingdings

Virtue doesn’t bring the dead back to life, punishment for sins is Cathartic to the victim and a reminder to perpetrators. Forgiveness is only preached by men who have done sins that they wish he forgotten.

Great choice - you learn for life. Be blessed!

Good choice Rene girard saw the scapegoat mechanism as hidden injustice only collective conscious action can stop

You're in for an awesome ride, my friend. Enjoy it to the fullest extent!

Just don't be "that" philosophy student that arrogantly challenges your professors over arbitrary arguments. As a literature grad, I remember all of your faces lolol.

May want to spend a few of those hours finding out what job you might need to fall back on

"Only a jedi works ways of hypocracy" -Unknown

In Anakin voice: ''From my point of view the jedi are evil''

Isn't "Only a Sith deals in absolutes" an absolute?

@@CristianMartinez-hg6xu Then you are lost!

@@StarSage66 yes which makes the quote even better

God I love Sam

The Brazilian Cool Wind

Very out of place for a game who's premise and main mechanic is being able to cut people in any kind of spesific way you want but nonetheless a very accurate quote.

What I love about Rising is that Raiden doesn't give in to the gaslighting. He knows that he's doing what absolutely needs to be done, and he's the only one who can and will do it. He has to save those kids and like Armstrong said, "if it costs a few lives, so be it." Not all of his enemies were fighting for World Marshall because they wanted Outer Heaven 2.0 like Sundowner, but that didn't change that they were still enabling one of the worst human trafficking incidents ever. You missed a piece, too. "No matter how many Mexican kids we cut, or Africans we bury, no one gives a shit. Not the media. Not the politicians. Certainly not the average joe. Too busy fretting over money, or sex, religion, fame." Raiden isn't doing it because he thinks it'll eliminate crime or bring light to World Marshall's actions, but because W.M. is doing those things at all and their victims would never see a chance at life without his intervention.

@@mercury2157 I didn't "miss" it, I left it out on purpose. That's what the (...) is for. But yeah, I agree.

Are you saying that people who get revenge are the real viallains of the story instead of the people who actually did them wrong first?? I have several other objections and disagreements to your statements but this one is the most important to me.

@@absolutenothing7094 I would say there is no Villains and Good Guys in the John Wick saga. He was a successful assassin till his attempted retirement. It's another "Anti-Hero" story which have grown in popularity in recent decades. As an artistic expression, it is up for individual interpretation. I suppose if you imagine yourself as Wick when watching this then there is a desire to justify his actions. To me there is no Protagonist or Antagonist, just Action and Reaction. I am curious what your perspectives are though? What is the difference between Vengeance, Revenge? Avenging and Revenging?

@@bllaze885 i'm sorry. I didn't watch the video and scrolled down in the comments. I just wanted your broad opinion on the topic. To me it depends on the scale of suffering that the first offender caused compared to the scale of suffering that the avenger caused. If the payback greatly outweighs the wrongdoing then to me it's not justifiable.

Bingo

Correction they don't have the straight, pretty much we are weak as individuals, that's why we write fantasies where we are god like strong

Haha

Your comment makes me smile.

It's the perfect video too..

Well not everyone is in the culture. Can't force it.

​@Aditya Chavarkar No, (I don't know "Cool Hard Logic", and "Flat Earth Society" is anything but one).. Seeing as prior to NASA modelling, where high altitude photography is photoshopped to death (to edit remove/add clouds) and then wrapped around a 3D sphere (ergo no two NASA blue balls are the same), as per Robert Simmon's job as NASAs "Blue Marble" creator... I prefer to accept/work off pre-NASA history, that is, actual history, and look at the navigations of ancient civilisations (e.g. Egypt's visit to the Pacific Islands/Grand Canyon) and the use of the unmoving North Star (Polaris, which has been falsely represented as a moving object time and again by "authorial sources") as a fixed point of north-to-east-west orientation, Constellations for the same (and which also don't change position /disappear what with globular tilt, rotation, orbit AND solar movement *need I say more?*), and ancient navigational devices, such as the Astrolabe, which are blatant in their depictions of earth and heaven. I take it for personal amusement that all ancient civilisations are considered dumb, and yet no modern culture has built such structures with such basic materials as they did (much less pointed to alleged star systems), and in all the ancient world cosmologies and religious depiction*, only NASA feeds a globe (*Gnostic Hermeticism asserts globe theories due to Helios (Sun/revolve around the sun) worship, from which myths the *theoretical* (physics, as a term)) wonder is based that drives the Scientism of the globe. It was never proved, just hypothesis into existence. That is to say, I take their words as merely describing their perception of the cosmic, rather than hard evidence to the validity of its existence in the form they ascribe it. (I'm almost guaranteed to be trolled just for saying that, by internet neck beards and alleged academics alike, we me being called every term of ignorance UNDER the sun for stating it). When challenging globe proponents early on, as a former globe-thinker myself (all FEs are products of a pro-Globe "education system" that doesn't teach critical thought as much as what to think rather than how, which is a personal stab on the "gov't education failed you" jab).... I realised that most of the ones I talked to assumed, with personalised vitriol, that earth is a globe not because they had empirical evidence that could hold up in court (and a court did in fact, to my amazement, legally debunk the existence of a globe upon the evidence, if you wanna look that up), but that earth was a globe *because* they look up and see *other* supposed globes elsewhere. That's like living on a pool table with cue balls somehow suspended and making a rash assertion without fully encompassing your vision of the surface you're on first. The difference, only, between globe thought and geocentric thought, against all skepticism to this reason why, is that if NASA has it then there is no divine/holy Supreme being of *any* kind. We're evolved or engineered by aliens, and therefore against all human compassion, the fact is survival of the fittest, and every cold blooded ideal short of Nihilism around the sun is morally acceptable because if God is dead, then baseless is every moral assertion recorded from the mouth of any alleged deity from any religion found here (man cannot create anything for himself, much less self-restraint, being a worthless animal). If geocentrism is the truth, and based on observed and physically tested fact (as most hardcore Geocentrists operate by), as all ancient cultures knew it and designed whole cultures around, right up until the years prior to NASA's inception (a Hollywood intros showed a globe even before NASA's founding!), then not only is a controlled and contained (created) environment the truth of our human existence, and we know nothing truly of the lights above us outside of the assertions of religious scripture (Bible, specifically, but there are some others that trend to Helion paganism), but then also we are as amazingly designed as we are off the bat without self-annihilation over millions of horrific years of aimless existence trying to get out of the trees without cause self-imposed extinction in the process, and the "alien" phenomenon, if there are no habitable worlds because there is no vacuum of space, is not an "extra-terra (earth) strial event", but a spiritual or hyper-dimensional earthly phenomenon of diabolical, demonic proportions (if accounting for victims of "Fourth Kind" encounters). Here's some books on the study of Zetetic/Flat Earth Cosmology. The drive is secure and virus free. drive.google.com/drive/folders/1f4g7WuDy-D_UTha8yjjAHDPyxp4Hh0fK?usp=sharing

Let’s be real, it’s the state that has the power to off Joker. Robot Chicken covered that

Sure but he could still kill Joker. Because, as you said, people like him don’t change. Also, the Joker is a big exception from most criminals. A lot of his rouges gallery are. Killer Croc is too beastly and monstrous to be kept alive imo.

most violent crimes are done by repeat offenders

@@chaindrivesumner9470 You arrest someone for committing a violent crime, which they were likely driven to do as a result external factors such as poverty or retaliatory crime in their area. They get arrested and or go to jail. Now this person can't get a job in most places, adding onto the already existing issues they faced. So what do you expect them to do? It's a problem with the US criminal justice system in general, and not just for people who committed violent crimes. There is no attempt at rehabilitation. You get arrested for something that shouldn't even be criminalized, such as addiction or possession of drugs, including marijuana, mental health issues, or homelessness. You're exposed to more intense crimes in prison, and have to be involved in those things to get by. Then you don't have any options when you get out, so you turn to crime, which you just got a crash course on in prison. Not to mention that our criminal justice system disproportionately targets already historically marginalized communities both in terms of arrests and harsher sentences, despite the things they're charged for (like marijuana possession) are pretty equal across different groups of people. The solution is not to kill people, especially when inequality and other systems in place will just put someone else in their place. It's about tackling the root causes of crime. You invest in needy communities and give them opportunities to better their lives. And you actually work to rehabilitate criminals, which is something that certain other countries do to great success.

@@thedapperdolphin1590 all I'm hearing is excuses and an enabler going full potato.

I should have proof-read this comment before posting, oops. Editing is for super-villains.

I agree that vigilantes in media can be way more complex, but the video still makes very valid points and is very educational

All superheroes fall into the same idea that one person's idea of justice could right the world's wrongs. Superman and Captain America both fight crime. They aren't anti-heroes, but they still use their own judgement to decide what is and isn't just. In essence, they are the same as Nolan's batman. They seek to be arbiter's of a type of justice that's beyond just one person, but the problem with that is, they still are just one person. Anyone who wants to use their own judgement to decide what is right or wrong isn't really going to find justice. Your goal can be safety for your city and peace on earth and every good thing, but the real message of the video is that crime fighting will never lead to justice. Commissioner Gordon and spider-man both want to prevent innocent people from having to face tragedy, but the stories we see about them are always about either stopping supervillains or beating up muggers. And that isn't what will ultimately save a city. The idea that fighting bad guys will make the world better is and will always be a fantasy.

Or stopping people from committing suicide, or helping cure people of disease, or indulging the wishes of dying children. Also, you realize both Batman and Superman have checks and balances prepared for themselves more often than not, right?

@@laststrike4411 I'd say Superman is less a vigilante and more of a good Samaritan/first responder, only he's not a sworn public servant. Batman (most of the time) hunts down criminals and instill fear in the city of a man dressed as a 6' bat who beats the crap out of pimps, drug dealers, gun runners and anyone he pleases. Why, because his parents got shot in front of him. Superman, tries to help people out and protect the world from beings often more powerful than himself simply because he thinks it's the right thing to do given his abilities. He's not looking for revenge, sometimes not even justice and he actually testifies in court from time to time because Kal El is his actual legal name (up until pre new-52 where he renounced his American citizenship because reasons).

I Know is a joke, but Sun Tzu actually believed in violence being the answer when everything else failed, war is expensive and overall dumb like really dumb, it literally there no war with a valid reason to happen even when people try to romanize it with "it was for freedom" or another BS.

@@PEDROGARCIA-qj3gr damn Sun Tzu a badass

@@PEDROGARCIA-qj3gr Like we even need a 'valid' reason.

Can't tell which phrase are you translating from all 13 chapters of Sun Tzu's Art of War. But at least 10 chapters of the book teach us how to avoid war and violence. That's why Sun Tzu's Art of War are highly accepted in the business field and espionage because it never teach how to overpowered your enemy (if you can simply overpower your enemy, that's nothing more to learn at the first place), instead how to outsmarted your enemy.

@@JeusAlprime108 Dude.....that's a joke.

Two is too little, need more because its a drug cartel

Who’s this quote by :?

@@samfavell7368 ghandi.

I like that

@@jordanlaramore5430 the whole quote is even better

@@gabrielmaddern6070 Have a link for the whole thing?

Believe me, you aren't the only one.

That's it isn't it? You believe in system you don't believe in evil. For you evil people don't exist. A pedophile rapist life is just as valuable as the life of the little girl whom he just raped, therefore it's wrong to end him. Funny that in your worldview the bad guys tend to avoid punishment for their crimes, which is convinient to them and no one else.

@@donaldhysa4836 This might be the most insane collection of assumptions anyone has ever made about me. Anyone who actively gets pleasure or satisfaction from the suffering of others is evil. Obviously this includes child abusers of all types. It also includes a lot of other people who cause suffering without breaking the law. I don't care about punishing them, I care about stopping them from hurting other people.

@@Pensive_Scarlet There needs to be punishment to deter them from hurting more people. Its as simple as that. If a lot of evil things were made legal a lot more people would do them. Punishment, retrobution is what stops them. So what are you on about talking about "emotional satisfaction "? This has always been first and foremost about stopping evil. The laws, punishment, revenge all of them

@@donaldhysa4836 I don't know where you're from, but here in the US punishment doesn't work. It only makes them stronger. Prison only teaches them how to better hurt people. People who decide to do something that warrants the death penalty will try to do as much damage as possible because they know they're going to die once they're caught. Not to mention, a lot of the punishment going on here is for literally victimless crimes. That's all about emotional satisfaction. People want other people to be punished because they believe some act like smoking a plant or having gay sex is morally wrong. We used to have actual laws against gay sex here, some are still on the books but not as enforced. Even when it comes to a murder or something, all I ever see is people wanting to see the murderer punished and suffering. You might think that's not so bad until you realize there are so many people falsely accused. When it comes to sex crimes, even more so. Even when an actual sex crime can be proven to have happened, sometimes the wrong person is blamed or punished. Here we have multiple stories of people falsely accused and punished for decades who finally get their names cleared due to DNA evidence and such. You're really naive if you believe the people who built the systems we live under only ever cared about real justice. There was a time when hanging runaway slaves was considered justice. It's always been about emotional satisfaction. People just want to feel justified in hurting or killing someone else. Maybe you're young and you just haven't seen enough yet, but I've witnessed too man people claiming to be the "good guys" acting just like the "bad guys". People who ruin lives in the name of "social justice". People who want their personal morals to be enforced on everyone (radical religious types, etc). There are very few people who want true justice. No one is saying evil things should be made legal, but I'm saying the law should be better designed and equipped to actually prevent evil and protect the innocent. So far the justice system in the US only encourages it, especially with so many people in the system benefiting from corruption and being allowed to act "above the law" because there is no one to stop them. Most of them are all about getting their emotional satisfaction, whether it's an officer beating a woman because she struggled a bit when he threw her against a car (just watched the video of this one yesterday), or a prosecutor colluding to get a win at any cost regardless of proper legal procedure or whether the person they're prosecuting is even truly guilty.

Exactly. It's the thing that sets DN apart. Coz in it vigilante is the villain and they address it quickly and carefully in the second episode itself with L's intro. Watchmen series is a terrible example. It's exactly the opposite. It justifies not Batman esque vigilanteism but Kira like vigilanteism. It's far worse. They just said that he tried to do the thing right way just to write off the question. It's a horrific show which doesn't inspire good.

Yeah but that is collective, not individual. And it forces, hopefully, structural change. A vulnerability was exposed and the reaction by the rich is clearly litigious and will cost at best, blatantly illegal at worse. Could continued actions like this lead to recession or worse? Probably. But a catalyst for change is needed and this is bigger than markets. Breaking the greed motivation is critical to beginning to address bigger issues like the warming of this planet. Never forget the clock is ticking.

@@artemismoonbow2475 yes, and so we HOLD together!

(Breaks single stick into many) Ape...Alone...Weak.... (Raises collective stick) Ape Together Strong

@@artemismoonbow2475 Isn't "collective" justice mob justice?

@@Shellshock1918 Depends on how you define mob. The last guy we had in the white house would call many peaceful protestors a mob and lumped them with looters, but called the people who broke into the Capitol very special people. The term peaceful protest becomes an oxymoron to those who view valid accusations and calls to reform as violence.

He also knows if he doesnt come for the thugs, the thugs will come for him, it happened to his parents and he doesnt want it to happen to him or worse alfred

nah it doesnt change everything because ultimately they need villains to keep selling issues and stories. Even if you have the ideal batman story of his dismantling the corrupt police, then politicians, then secret socities etc and individual villain leaders and fixing the suffering communties of gotham and reducing incetive for crime and gang culture- there will still need to be villains so they can sell stories.

@@mybawzarerichie There's that too but that reminds me of this. Batman is usually the only hero in his city yet he gets more flak as a "bad hero" or the "worst" hero despite Marvel's NYC being filled to them brim with heroes yet the crime rate us still high. So my question is why do people act like Bats is the failure hero and not Marvel's or other heroes when they tend to do the same or have back up?

@@shadowofdakness a lot of the nyc ones are working class heroes and not billionares capable of making change without putting on mask. A lot of the more affluent ones deal with cosmic threats or use science research to help others. As well as this many of them dont beat up crims because of trauma instead of going to therapy. Also a lot of batman stories state his existence brings out the criminals and he actively makes his city worse. Also i think lots of people just view marvel as more light hearted.

@@mybawzarerichie 1. It was pointed out that they would have been criminals regardless of Batman since the catalyst for Gotham being this bad is because Bats parents died. In fact the presence of Bats decreased crime rates and corruption in Gotham cause most of them are scared of Batman. 2. By your argument Marvel is still worse cause the only reason cosmic threats show up is cause of the heroes there and many of the heroes like Hulk and wolverine have super assassins and city destroyers come after them laying small towns to waste and I'm holding back here cause there's waay more. 3. They also said the same thing about Spiderman bringing out more criminals; are you saying it's true? 4. My first comment I clearly stated that having billions of dollars don't mean squat to the monsters in Gotham unless Bats is gonna use it to be a dictator. 5. Yes Marvel is seen as more light hearted but like Superman having no limits only normies believe that. Marvel's comics are way less light hearted than people think. 6. Planet protectors like Avengers and fantastic 4 aren't the only ones in NYC: Spiderman, Dare devil, Luke cage, and the X-men to name a few are city level heroes who work in NYC yet the crime rates are just as high if not higher than Gotham. Also planetary threats don't happen often so why the heck ain't the WEALTHY Avengers or Fantastic 4 helpin? Human torch got time to race Spiderman but doesn't have time to do some at home clean up?? 7. If we gonna talk about bad reasons to become a superhero. First Bats don't see himself as one. Besides that what about Spiderman? Uuuuunnncccllleee Beeen 😫😫 anyone? I think war weapons are bad so hero time *Iron man*? I feel like interfering in other countries and ignore my responsibilities *Black Panther*? Sold my soul *Ghost Rider*? Let's stop wars and men are idiots *Wonder woman*? I'm really fast *Flash*? Threw some DC there so you don't misunderstand things.

Yeah, Batman would rather give a criminal traumatic brain injury that could potentially leave them paralyzed for life, but heaven forbid he put someone out of their misery!

Due to human nature though, they will ALWAYS be needed.

Read poppy war

Lateral violence Promising Young Woman joins the long, often bloody, line of female revenge films. The Bride in Kill Bill (Uma Thurman, yellow latex suit queen) blood lusts for revenge on her ex-lover Bill who tried to kill her on her wedding day. High school hottie turned vampire, Jennifer, due to a nasty boy band in Jennifer’s Body, now only feasts on boys. In the South Korean Lady Vengeance, Lee Geum-ja has spent 13 years in prison for a murder she did not commit, dreaming of the gory revenge she seeks against the real murderer, Mr Baek, who sexually assaulted and blackmailed her. In each of these examples, the woman at the centre of the narrative has suffered at the hands of wicked men. She must rise from the ashes of her victimhood to meet these males with equal or more violent forces compelled by the men who have caused her to suffer. Fight fire with fire, spill blood for blood. There is an inescapable circularity here. Ironically, the tools at the disposal of the wronged woman are the same that caused her suffering. She is perpetually entrapped by the patriarchy.

@@perarduaadastra277 Good thing you didn't waste your money on it. :)

@@umchinagirard1800 Yes, this does seem to be a recurring theme when it comes to female revenge. However, unlike the films you mentioned, my narrative continues after the revenge has been dealt. In each example you listed, the film ends and we see that vengeance has been dealt. But we never see how the individual is changed afterwards. How their behaviors and view on life are altered or affected by achieving that revenge. In the situation with my books, the promising young woman is being asked to become a hero but act of revenge has affected her in ways she didn't anticipate.

I know this isn't the point of your comment, but Batman actually does do a lot of charity work and reinvestment into his community (Ex: the Wayne Foundation). How much this is focused on varies from writer to writer. The thing is that he's so crazy rich, that he can be a top philanthropist AND pose as a frivolous playboy AND be a gadgeteer vigilante. And stories can discuss his flawed attitude toward vigilantism (and how his mental health is affected) and also still have him be a community contributor.

That is true, the Batman in the comics wasn’t about retribution but about justice and the movies show him being full of rage. In the comics Wayne does so much for Gotham, whereas in the movies Gotham is irredeemable despite most of the people being hardworking downtrodden people. Gotham is more like purgatory and the first level of hell

It's ironic. Most will say Superman is an unrealistic character because of his morals and what he does with them before they will say Superman is an unrealistic character because he can fly and shoot laser beams from his eyes. Superman is a power fantasy because it's about a good person who actually has immense capability too.

I have also found that in those countries weapons and simply carrying a knife is illegal, Man, people cannot do anything anymore. One day they will apprehend you and you will just have to take it

@@martinjugolin2087 I'd rather live a better life than moan about not being able to carry a knife in public.

This mindset is one of the problems the video indirectly is trying to adress. Even if what you claim is true, which I could definitely believe in the USA, the judicial system is still a far better alternative to any vigilante. Even if it appears to be arbitrary or corrupt at times or actually is arbitrary or corrupt, its still far better than any one person taking matters into their own hand. The System can be fixed/reformed, it can and is supervised and has checks and balances built into it. These are all foundations that can be built upon. Another problem that the video also clearly showed is that any form of crime or wrongdoing often elicits an emotional response, thats why anecdotal evidence like the one you presented here is so dangerous. Humans and therefore systems created by humans are always imperfect, but because injustice is such an emotional topic, we leave rational thought behind and jump to the conclusion that everything is corrupt, bad, arbitrary etc. whenever we hear a singular story about injustice. What we really ought to do is look at the statistics, the numbers and facts. Only then can you conclude if that certain injustice was the exception or the rule.

In 2021 law and courts are only a cost factor. Since we can't measure life justice does not even exist. Taking superhero/vigilante stories as a base to think about moral questions is pure nonsense. It is just entertainment, with popular IPs held hostage by creatively bankrupt suits. Imagine how much writing would have to be done if Batman killed the Joker or some institution held the nutjob properly after his first massacre.

@@Reaper13411 'The judicial system is still a far better alternative to any vigilante'. I wouldn't say that. Mussolini arguably had the judiciary at his side, to bring him down people needed to overrule it and kill him directly. Was it vigilantism? Conceptually, yes, was it bad? No.

@@Reaper13411 the problem with this mindset is that it starts with the assumption that reform is possible. When we have been shown time and time again that no amount of reform can fix a foundational issue of the judicial system. To truly have an ethical system we would have to tear down the current one and rebuild a better one from scratch. But that would disrupt the status quo, which the power structures in place would never allow without a fight.

@@Alex_Barbosa But then again, even if all possible, I would posit that a new rebuilt system would ultimately end up the same. The problem is the nature of humans in face of justice/injustice, our emotional responses, the fact that certain people have power of life and death over others, that these people can and will be corrupted in a way or another. Only AI could be absolutely perfect. And lmao the amount of people unable to accept that AI is smarter then them and that AI can decide the fate of a human being... Another ethical debate in itself. In french we have a saying for it: Ou il y a l'Homme il y a de l'Hommerie which would translate roughly to where there are Humans, Humaness is bound to happen.

I am excited!

Speaking of Wall Street, the times we live in - now more than ever - prove TSoO's point: the people are reacting the way they are now with this whole Wall Street v. GameStop situation (and in general, towards the rich elites) because of a system that thrives on our suffering and misery, while they sit in their ivory towers without consequences (including celebrities). They tell us it's for our benefit to stay indoors, but when their actions contradict their words and people start hearing about it, we resort to extreme methods of retribution to counteract their transgressions and undermine what they believe or envision to be a society. The only difference is while the elites might have all the wealth and spheres of influence and access, the masses of people involved start to maintain a sense of community. For the past several years, all the issues we've been facing are a distraction from the real issues/enemies at work; this goes far beyond right or left, Republican or liberal, rich or poor. We only live one life, and in our lifetimes, we're more likely going to be stuck on this one planet we live on.

Did you even watch the video

knock knock - whos there ? 2020

So romantic... No, they don't obey because they're children in adults bodies.

@@PEDROGARCIA-qj3gr really? If the system failed them and the criminals' victims by letting said criminals' acts go unpunished, should their victims and their families just sit there being ok with it? Someone must do something, and if the system doesn't, someone else will have to. Or what? Is it ok to let murderers, rapists and human traffickers go unpunished to you just to not be "children in adult bodies" like you say?

I think he means that good men should create a just society where guilty should be punished equally as the crime he committed and not to encourage good men to become evil by pursuing justice individually, To defeat evil good men must get together and create a world that can defeat evil and not go on a quest of defeating evil alone

V for Vendetta was even more of a political commentary movie as a revenge story. The political statements far outweighed any commentary on revenge and justice even though it was woven into the story in an integral way. I'm sure LSOO considered it as it is an excellent revenge story, but the revenge was too integral to the political message so it wasn't appropriate for the themes he wanted to focus on. However the ending of the movie had a similar message as LSOO tried to convey in this essay. Could've been a great addition but I'm sure he had his reasons for picking what he did.

@@TheLeftCulprit On the other hand, it was also absolutely a revenge story, just on a societal scale, like Law Abiding Citizen but with more of the superhero pageantry of costumes and masks. I agree that it's noteble to use Law Abiding Citizen rather than V, but I think the former's use is due to how Butler's character was far more personally motivated, and his protests otherwise were nakedly disingenuous.

This video actually started out as an essay on HBO’s Watchmen, and gradually expanded from there. In hindsight, I definitely could have included V for Vendetta, especially towards the end, guess it slipped my mind as it is not a purely vigilante story, nor is it a purely revenge story, I see it more as a story on governmental oppression, though again, it has some amazing visuals that I probably could have fitted in

@@LikeStoriesofOld I take your work as a pure artifact, every choice being the right one to say what you need to say. This is one of your best works so far. Wonderful and deeply insightful.

@@rottensquid I agree. Keep up the goods.

Can I read that story

Can I read that story?

Happy writing and happy success!

You want to flip the genre back on it's head? Acknowledge the truth: Revenge is not always bitter. Revenge does not always leave you an empty shell. Revenge is not always your ruin. When successful, revenge is IMMENSELY satisfying - both in the short and long term. No story will admit this truth, because stories want people to take the high road and they want to be 'deep.' But revenge isn't deep. It's gratification.

Wow,that story Would be Extremely frustrating to read but also extremely satisfying

Batman does what he does not simply because he’s a wounded child inside. He realizes his city needs him and somebody has to fight crime and corruption if the police and the mayor can’t do their job right.

@@user-sf3pg6fi1j i would agree with you if he did it differently.

That’s an interesting and insightful outlook. Thank you. I hope you have healed from the past wounds.

i am grateful that you are healing.

​@@plasticweaponAre you going to forget about his parents being shot in front of him? Or the part about "I'm the vengeance, I'm the Night" part? Don't get me wrong, he is definitely putting in 50x times more effort than the entirety of GCPD combined. It's just not effective in the long run as video has shown.

I hear there's a comic that explain the absurd amount of crime in Gotham City by introducing the "Council of Owl" Which is lead by Batman's rogue gallery (Joker, Riddler, etc). I think that comic will interest you.

The problem is that the wealthy themselves have no actual way of handling the thugs, Batman learned from his parents mistakes in that being strong by himself on top of being wealthy would both be far more effective on both fronts to save Gotham, than just sticking to one path, this is also something Daredevil goes through as well and both characters are self-aware that if they kill, they cant be on the other front anymore, since they´d be "dirty".

somehow I don't like the reason why nothing works is some magic curse, instead of it being some form of study of the human nature. it feels like a cop out saying that bad things will always happen so there should always be a batman just to sell comic books

Gotham is not a real city it's a never ending loop to sell comic books. Why would anyone live in Gotham with all these serial killers and terrorist running around. The government would most like quarantine the city.

​@@dustinnabil798 Oh yeah I heard about the Court of Owls! Except, from what I remember reading, it's a secret society formed by the oldest families of Gotham who will do anything to stay in power. They are protected by their wealth and their "Talons", a legion of mindless, enhanced undead (?) soldiers. What's messed up is that Talons used to be regular people (mostly children) before they got snatched from the streets of Gotham (in one story, Dick Grayson/ Nightwing got turned into a Talon). The Waynes weren't included bc they were the only few that wanted to use their wealth for good causes. The death of Thomas and Martha Wayne was a turning point not just for Bruce, but for the whole city and all its rouges. If there's a reason behind Gotham's overall shitty-ness, it's probably that.

MLK. You mean MLK.

The State cant be trusted with power, case they´ll be enabled into abusing it, like a drug addict, the only way to fix the problem is to take the Speculators who profit from Law making that speculates on marketting value by using politics out of the way, while also putting balances into place in regards to the State´s monopoly on violence.

All of his stuff is incredible. Watching it gives me more hope for humanity.

I particularly love his video on "moral victory". It's mainly about The Lord of the Rings, but it gives such an excellent, secular breakdown on the idea of god and faith in general.

Wait until you get robbed and then a masked 7 feet bat saves you and recovers your wallet by beating the criminal. You'll be grateful

If you were actually interested in seeing it, the proposed solutions are there to find in the video. A society that produces dispassionate and equal justice, but more importantly works to improve the conditions that cause people to act injustly.

@@TheEvilCheesecake "a _society that produces dispassionate and equal justice and that works to improve the conditions that cause people to act_ injustly" OH , you mean an Utopia ? That's soo cute~~ Well since that is never gonna exists , main comment is right . The proposed solutions are shiet LMAO

@@Dan_Kanerva it's a mistake to assume everyone is as lazy and unimaginative as you are, or as interested in violence.

@@TheEvilCheesecake "is _mistake to assume everyone is as lazy and unimaginative as_ u" WUAHAHAHA !! oh god , nothing i love more than when the frustrated person who realises he lost the point , inmediatly goes for a : "but YOU are the problem here"... just chill out little buddy . This is not some opinion i have , is an opinion most people share because is obvious what you propose is just an idealistic dream that would come out of a 40's Superman comic. THAT is why i said is "cute" Me realising the impossibility of the scenario does not correlate a "love for violence" , are you okay ? I'm sorry but is really not my fault most people go for being realistic , while a few like you go for being chronically idealistic. Especially for a state of society humanity is far from accomplish

@@Dan_Kanerva don't worry, i find your trying-hard to be exactly as amusing as you find mine.

Agreed. The main difference between the two is that revenge/vengeance is personal and selfish, while justice is supposed to be impartial and fair.

So you're saying they're tunnel visioned to the point of missing the big picture correct? I can see that being an issue. Another issue is that they can only do so much. Many vigilantes in fiction do not have the means to fight societal systems like governments so they are limited to fighting injustices on a small scale.

I've read Watchmen not that long ago and your comment pretty much summarised how I perceived the message of the comics. Vigilantes and so-called superheroes (assuming we don't get invaded by aliens or attacked by supervillians on a regular basis) are pointless. They simply satisfy their own psychological needs and beat up criminals for all the various reasons which have nothing to do with improving the world, because the real improvement is done in boring and tedious ways and look very unsexy in general.

@@sonchik6324 Who watches the Watchmen?

@@joeclaridy what if the vigilante didn't want to "change the world" and thought it was impossible, but instead set out to save individual lives and perhaps was content with the humbling nature of his limitations in delivering "Justice." We as humans see fighting to the last man as honourable, so why can't someone fight crime even if it's futile on a large scale, all he's doing is risking his life for others, to me it seems completely just. Ninja were not warriors like the media represents, they could fight obviously at an expert professional level, but they were primarily focused on espionage. If vigilantes focused on saving people, and not destroying the criminal system, they would be more effective. Yeah of course we need to fight a war, but that's for the samurai, not the ninjas so to speak. And espionage is a ninjas job, i.e, your local millitary aren't going to be first responders are they.

If you rip enough leaves off a tree, the tree dies.

Then send me to a fascist state.

@@sirramic202 That's what they all say when they think the state would never break down their doors and shoot them in their beds. Just those other people, ya know, the ones who deserve it.

Not every thing that is authoritarian is fascist, it's people like you that made the word meaningless. Batman isn't a fascist, and the Punisher especially isn't.

@@MALICEM12 Yes, that's what I was saying. But when the state itself becomes the Punisher, declares itself above the law, and that people don't matter as much as its own authority and order, that is the definition of fascism.

@@rottensquid say it 98 more times.

More like: when are we gonna stop blaming society and play the victim, commit crime and demand free stuff, instead of taking action and change our life?

you didnt understand my comment boomer

@@archivesofarda986 you didnt understand my comment boomer

You cant expect god do all the work

2-1=1 The math speaks for itself.

@@redclayscholar620 99-1=98 the numbers don’t lie

So, if you kill a Nazi, do you automatically become as bad as the Nazi? Because that’s kind of what this quote seems to be implying.

@Diewott1 …You’re missing the metaphor here. Yes, if I kill a killer, I become a killer myself, but would I necessarily become as bad as whoever I killed? For example, take someone who kills someone else in self-defense. Or someone who had to kill someone to save the life of someone else. Both are killers, but they have legitimately valid reasons to kill in their respective scenarios, so we can’t really call them evil.

I know right. What an awesome video idea.

Same

Very timely. Yes we need mass population collaboration not stories of false individual hero

Same, and the video is also complimentary to the battle of GME

hold :>

This video encourages diamond hands

@@joshuamay4527 hold fast brothers and sisters, we got the suits by the ballz with diamond hands

We still like the stock.

I'd argue that shooting someone who is threatening your child's life is not vigilantism, it's duty

​@@johannesstephanusroos4969Pretty sure, it's called "self-defense".

@@lakshaykochhar6799 The terms aren't mutually exclusive

A population of traumatised victims is far easier to control then a population of well-rounded characters. That is why there are so many conspiracies about That Event of 2001 and now the Most Recent Explosion of Violence in the Middle East being an intentional plot of those countries governments, because the result was just so convenient for the people in charge. The harsh, boring reality is those governments just don't care about their people and some who know what they doing took advantage of a sudden opportunity and the rest just reacted like animals, like everyone else.

People and they're the worst 🤮

That’s the point of the later movies. He put his pinky back into the pond and it pulled him back in. He’s paying the price for not letting revenge go.

@@callmev3531 Oh~. Yes I see what you mean.

To be fair the sequels are mostly just him reacting to outside influences. In the second movie Santino shows up with the marker and when John refuses Santino burns down his house (Destroying anything of Helen's in the process). At the end of the second movie John Kills Santino to stop the rise of the bigger evil and gets himself marked for execution. The third movie is him being hunted by everybody and being yanked about by Winston for the sake of the assassin world politics while still wanting a way out. I think it's a fair assumption that the 4th movie will be about burning the whole establishment to the ground. As much as it can be viewed that John is paying the price for not letting things go (come on it's a puppy after all), it can also be viewed as a story who's righteous anger got taken advantage of by the figure from his past. Past 2nd movie onward, John is basically a pawn.

I had to stop watching on the 3 movie i think when those Japanese men had defeated him outright then let him kill them

@@NosferatuWickedTTRPG The people who killed his dog deserved it.