Arenado is still hitting 30hr and 100rbi a year away from coors in St. Louis that is definitely a pitcher friendly ball park. I’m a defense guy that is why Arenado is my favorite current player and Ozzie Smith/Yadier Molina are my all time favorite players. People who can’t appreciate and value defense it’s the problem.

Nobody talks about collecting pujols cards. That’s crazy to me. Oh well, I’ll keep stacking

You guys are the best and great for the hobby!!! Thank you

The biggest thing now is the fact that prospecting costs 3-5 figures for anyone with any hype. Back in th at pre refractor Era, 30 bucks was what was considered prospecting. The thing also with modern vs 70s-80s and even early 90s is the fact it is way more easier to collect the 1-5 rookies that existed for hof players. Nowadays that number is in the 100s so it'll be a more select group of cards that some will go for, while others will go for the more common stuff. That will dilute value with not the whole community persuing the same cards. Also with the higher prices on many of the unknowns, there really isn't much room to go up. Grading has also really made it a different model. Where 10s are what many want and therfore prices are crazy. 9s for most can be very affordable even for those top of the line players ( 89 ud griffey is a great example)

The conversation about traditional stats vs modern stats is a very interesting one. Whenever it came to collecting up until pretty recently, modern stats didn't push value, those traditional stats did. The biggest issue with modern is exactly what you showed. 2 sites and those stats were different. Traditional stats have always been the same no matter where you looked so those still carry more weight to a huge chunk of collectors.

What a great team you all make, good topics, super topic, excellent stories. Along with great info, these are fun to watch and informative as well. Thanks guys!

Manny Machado has amazing defense. Because he’s a third baseman in the NL he won’t have any NL gold gloves but as you mentioned with the bias MVP voting there is a huge bias on Arenado for GG

Regarding Arenado, not overvalued imo. T-Pott makes a good point. The elite D with gold/platinum gloves combined with the pretty consistent raking at the plate is a big differentiator. MJR Sportscards has a great channel with an impressive Arenado collection. All kinds of parallels. Future of ultra modern baseball card values is a fascinating topic. It’s a combo of numbers, personality, and supply/demand of key cards. Great example is Griffey. He commands a premium because he put up the numbers, has an infectious love for the game, and has the 90s inserts.

Also. Good conversation guys. You know more than me. But the reverse coors field effect thing. If that’s even a real thing, according to his numbers, he had way more power in his Rockies days than out of Coors. The players obviously benefit more than don’t.

Tells me how old I am I recognizing all those 1984 possible MVP players they listed. 😂

Awesome show. You guys collect and think like I do.🤘🍀🤘🍀🤘🍀🍺

Great discussion! Most players we think are ‘undervalued’ will never become ‘fairly’ valued. Especially after 8-10 years as a player. Have to get that price peak and hobby love early or it rarely occurs later in career. Guys like Mookie and Machado will have great careers and make it into HOF but don’t imagine their card prices will ever show that. Lots of HOFers - Frank Robinson, Joe Morgan, Yogi Berra, Jim Thome, Musial, etc never see big price increases outside of moves to the overall market. Would be cool if CardLadder or Market Movers added a graph of players’ card prices during their career year - ie show Mookie’s BCA price after his 1st, 5th, 10th year, etc. Imagine it keeps sliding over time for most players. Show the alpha vs overall market. People like shiny new things! Old broken down 38 year olds aren’t interesting and - the collectors who do/did like those players generally already bought their cards earlier in career and may be tentative about adding more. Will Scotty B still be buying Mookie in 2030? Who was buying Miggy and Pujols - all time greats - when those players were 35?

Watching this show made me go back and check my Betts PSA cards. I found that I have the ssp in a PSA 10. Totally forgot I had it. Thank you for rekindling my Betts passion. Been a Red Sox fan my whole life.

pulling for austin riley for 2024 mvp , but jr will repeat with a 30/60 plus season

I love this. Everyone has a different opinion about certain players which is great. I think Arenado is fairly priced but he just doesnt have the hyped collectors that pay top dollar for his stuff because of other players like Harper, Soto, Ohtani and Trout. I think the big money goes to those guys instead. His stuff sells to pure collectors not investors and to people that love baseball statistics and metrics. Great topic guys. Keep it up.

Like your discussions. Prices in general need to come way way down and they will. Can't wait to go to shows - not quite yet - perhaps in two to three years - ti start buying guys out at shows. Keep it up guys.

Love the video, guys! As an Arenado collector, i could make a very strong argument on his behalf but I enjoyed hearing everyone's perspective. :)

Arenado: a good sleeper that doesn’t draw big attention. I have a 2014 topps rockies team card in a 10, but need to pick up a few more of his early cards.

Great panel of guest!

Insightful and enjoyable conversation to listen to for someone who doesn't watch much baseball. Stats are like guerilla glue that a player or fan can't escape from, however they can be passionately argued. One question, how much more attention would we give some of the older greatest players if all of these awards were available when they were playing? Keep up the collaborations. Just subscribed.

I’d love to bash ScottieB here, but as an “objective” bystander (that owns more Machado than Nolan A), if their careers were to end today, I believe Arenado would be more memorable (and as a result probably more collected) in 20 years. Nolan A is more well-liked and recognized by the unsophisticated and sophisticated masses for his “overall” abilities at this current moment. Having said that… many more years to come to evolve and define their legacies.

18:31 drama in the LBC, it's kinda hard being snoop d.o. double g.....

Just buy Lebron and Kobe! All jokes aside (not really), its impossible to see 25 years into the future, i don't even know whats up with next year! Just collect what you like, have fun and if you want to invest in generational wealth, buy something tangable that won't burn in a fire. I feel like we can get caught up in a bubble, or sometimes quick sand, and we just need to take a step back and evaluate what's up! Another great listen, keep up the good work!

Enjoyed the show👍

Sorry but hearing about Arenado from a Rockies fan isn’t going to be objective. It’s interesting how the Machado comparison is always thrown out there. Why? It seems that there was some trigger there. Machado no doubt had a better year last year. I don’t think he’s that far from Arenado defensively. He’s a wizard at third. But the gold glove award is a bit silly. Soto was a finalist last year. Stop it. They like to have players who win it several years in a row. It’s biased for sure. I think Machado is better but Nolan is a very good player.

Excellent topic &.discussion. Really interesting....sometimes its a popularity vote, sometimes merit, sometimes feeling, and sometimes the era. The voting process is more inconsistent than the players they're actually voting for. Enjoyed this video keep spit⚾in' 👍. BTW i'm a Seattle fan and have always been a Arenado fan and collected him more than Freeman. Seems he boosted a franchise like the Rockies more than Freeman did who seems to be surrounded by a better cast. Not to mention he's intense and straight out competes every time and doesn't come with the baggage Machado does imo. Honestly felt he could've taken that MVP in like 2016 again imo.

Great conversation guys I enjoyed hearing everyone opinions 🤙🤙

Yup just like the 80’s, panini and topps obliterated the junk wax era with ultra modern trash. So many products, mass production of each product, unbelievable how history just repeats itself

Great seeing this. Thanks

Mike trout is a great player but always hurt but hits 40+ home runs when he's healthy. He needs either to win a world series or get traded to win, trout doesn't have the ability to win with the angels.

Good video, guys

Riley and Devers are very good players but they will be lucky to have the kind of career Arenado will end up with in terms of all-around contributions. You guys forgot to mention his 8 All-star appearances. Above avg offense + HOF defense should mean he's a no-doubter for Cooperstown if he can keep going for 4 more years. 2500 hits, 400 HRS, 1400 RBIs, and 1100 R is very realistic. Plus the defensive stats. I'd say he's appropriately priced at the moment, but still a little out of my range. I'm buying Freeman and Betts as much as I can. Machado I'm starting to sour on a little. Next year will be key for him.

Some younger guys will hold value if they produce. Acuna being one. Pujols and Betts also shouid hold long term value among others. Also what will hold value I'd bet is sealed wax prior to 2020. Thanks for the discussion.

Well said, Lance.

"Lies, damn lies and statistics." I'm pretty sure that if we concotef a war for basketball that Wilt would score off the charts. His worst war seasons would likely have been when he was with the lakers when they went 69-13 and won the title. War is too data centric and misses the intangibles that rightly and justifiably factor into qualitative awads like MVP. Reggie had great stats for his career but the Mr. October label is more representative of the reason we remember him far more than other players from that era with comparable or even better career war.

It'll be interesting to see what cards from today people will care about in 50 years.

Scott. You from Colorado? Me and my 2 sons are trying to set up a trade night in Littleton, CO on the 27th at the columbine library at 4p.m.. we need people to show to have a successful trade night.

From 1976 to 1993 there is very little to collect due to mass production and lack of great product.

The vast majority of cards will be worthless yes, but you guys already know that. However there are cards that will absolutely have great value from this era. Here is the catch though.... They must be a well-loved player AND generational talent (Must have both qualifiers). Also the cards MUST be iconic cards ! Example of well-loved generational talents... -Babe Ruth -Ted Williams -Mickey Mantle -Ken Griffey Jr -Shohei Ohtani This is just a sample but you get the point.

1st off Austin is having a terrible season. But Austin was on a trajectory that could easily make the HOF at the time and he still could he is young. 2nd Mookie most likely will make the HOF. But so what? Neither player career stats will come close to the top 30 all time. And go look at Mike Piazza and Jim Thome’s cards. Not every HOFers card is worth much. Once they are retired and out of sight they become out of mind and lose value. Trouts card are dropping big time for good reason. He is not going to even reach 500 HR after 4 straight seasons of injuries and more likely to come. He will fade big time.

What happened to the braves this year lol

Arenado is not in the same strastosphere as Freddie Freeman

EVERY SINGLE Active player today will drop in value by a LOT once they retire. Maybe Lebron but outside of him no Baseball or Football. Anyone holding modern long term as an investment is going to lose their money.

You need to do bookmarks/timestamps

Seems to me Nolan Arenado is very similar to Scott Rolen as they were both great defensively and good hitters with better than average power. Granted Arenado will end up with more homers than Rolen and will also end up in the HOF.

the non RCs will be near worthless

Jeff is out of touch with younger people I can tell if he thinks behind the scene stuff anyone cares about. Trout is like a robot, he has no Charisma for example. Some of player do and some don’t. Doesn’t make a difference. and all you have to do is look at basketball values to realize that.

This panel is the prospective of three generations of Baseball Card Collectors. If you could add a younger and older point of view and switch out two members where there is overlap to a moderator and chat monitor, then there would be additional depth to the conversation. The highest earning years are 40-60 for most people. These individuals are Buying and Selling based on their memories and experiences. As all the Players mentioned in the discussion age, I don’t see the masses going out a spending money on their cards. Yes, the Value will go up like an inflationary effect - but, it is not a chase. Only speculation on Ultra-Modern will continue despite Sportscards being overproduced since 2017 into the future with Fanatics. The creation of money from Credit favors Markets for the Ultra-Modern. Vintage and Modern collectors benefit from from more money in the Hobby, but Betts, Trout, Freeman, Machado, Arenado, Goldschmidt, Pujols, Henderson or any other Player mentioned won’t really move that much unless they are talked about in the Media daily. The Ohtani, Acuna, Judge, Rutschman, (Gunnar) Henderson, Carrol, Julio Rodriguez, Witt, Harris, Harper or Seager moments based on recency will always be the driver in Baseball cards. The next twenty years will be driven by what happens next…we are just prisoners of the moment. The numbers that Albert Pujols put up were the best since Hank Aaron, but it didn’t resonate with the Ultra-Modern crowd. 🤓⚾️

As the influencers become more self consciously aware of how they are perceived they will moderate their messaging or wither and die. As for the breakers being bluntly honest that just doesnt fly. If they dont sell some amount of the crappy product that hurts their distribution of the better product. Here's the thing everyone pretty much catches on to what products hold value and which dont. At that point we have to use our judgementvand self restraint. The breakers who routinel and excessively pressure their audience to participate in lesd than desirable product breaks also eventually go away. It aint that mystifying.

🍀🙏🤘🔥

+++THE 2 DUDES ON THE BOTTOM+++ So cool to see Justin Verlander and Dustin Pedroia taking part in your video. Who knew they were Baseball card collectors. Go figure. Dustin, sorry about the knee bro, I'll spit on Machado next time I see him. Hey Justin, say hi to your wife Kate for me. Tell her we need to see her in another S.I. Swimsuit edition my man. I hear there's a stolen tape floating around the internet but the thought of seeing Verlander's junk kind of creeps me out so I never watched it. I prefer to keep my memories of Verlander with him having one ball in his hand rater then seeing him put his bat in his wives bat doughnut while she has two balls in her hand thank you very much.

Gold gloves really don't mean much, as it's a more offensive award than a defensive. And the best defensive player at a position will very rarely actually win it

Quick Answer 99% Yes Mostly Wothless and the funny part is they are worthless now

The value of current players cards retaining value really depends on one thing. Are we currently in a junk wax era? So many great players had their rookie cards in the 80's and 90's and are worth very little. Thing is current cards actually have value. Those from the 80's really never did

pitchers should not be on mvp list

Ohtani and Mahomes will be the wisest long holds

Freeman and Arenado will both fade into nothing. They shouldn’t make the HOF, they probably both will. The point is they aren’t special.

Worthless? NO. Worth less? a lot less yes. Many of these players may peter out and the cards become junk. As for modern players, it will be like the junk wax era. You can get a Glavine rookie for under a dollar and he's one of the best, same for a fleer 1989 Griffey Jr. GREAT player, that overproduction RUINED the value. And speaking of junk... We are in a new junk era. Junk slabs, Junk blasters (Panini) and everything is OVERPRICED for sealed. This hobby has become a lottery. I still buy new boxes and such, but not as much as the last 4 years. Fanatics is a JUGGERNAUT that cannot be stopped until we all stop paying outrageous prices. This includes BREAKERS. They are the main reason product is so expensive. They'll buy 10-100 CASES of a product, while Panini and Fanatics laughs all the way to the bank. Upper deck just looks, shrugs and says oh well. I dislike what the hobby has become when I see kids only caring about what the hit they just pulled will grade at and what its worth. None of these kids will know the joy of collecting their favorite players or teams, only what its worth. We need a huge crash like the 1994 crash to fix this.

No modern or vintage will have value a 1958 mickey mantle is worthless now no card has value beyond a day! The card hobby is officially ruined no modern card should go for more than vintage cards period! No player or card has value beyond a day every single game now up down up down no card has value after a day mookie betts mookie betts ppl don't even know who Maris mantle berra is anymore this hobby has gone to pure shyt n no value over a day pay $500 box cards best card you pull worth $5 bunch rich snobbs sitting right here helping ruin it as we speak

No one cares about defense 😂