Honestly fills me with hope to see other people feeling the same way.

Very true. Most of the hiring we are taught in school is bs

I respect your opinion, but I don't agree. I see it as poor writing, not being able to bring up new story, new truth, new iconic characters, and hence deciding to revamp/recontextualize the past. I see it as lack of creativity. I appreciated the drust, the Mogu, the new races in the past, or the development of old ones, not this type of solution.

Couldn't have said it better myself. To me, what makes a world feel dynamic is when the cultures that exist within that world are able to develop different perceptions about the exact same thing. No two stories are the same, no two experiences are identical and every corner of a cube can present a different angle. Its why I love that the cosmic chart for the Shadowlands is different to ours. It shows to us, as players, what information the Brokers could find and where their limitations in discovery lies. Sometimes, the story isn't what's shown but rather what isn't shown.

Wow, thank you! That means a lot.

Could be true

Exactly, I had a similar eureka moment myself after looking at the models. Such a great comment though, thanks!

I can see that, something more ferocious/angry/primal nature based could totally fit too.

I agree, but emotions run high when it's something you love and can understand when they have a negative reaction at first. As long as after some cooling off we can have a reasoned discussion.

@@thecosycampfire true I only really get annoyed when they genocide they favourite race in any game/book and destory my favourite zone haha

Haha I feel that one!

Glad you enjoyed it!

They interest me a lot, the interplay between their base aggressive nature and then trying to fight against it and find peace. Some through the hunt, some through belief etc

@@thecosycampfire “There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.” Seems fitting and I agree.

Glad you agree, we can all get a little stuck sometimes on one idea, we all have to help each other shake that off.

That could of been interesting.

Agree with a lot of this, but humans have a hard time with change. Sometimes people need a little nudge to help them adjust.

In fact the main issue is not the debate retcon or not retcon, but the shift in the tone and quality of the lore. The recontextualizations or reframings are ok as long as they are good quality content, I'm afraid this is just ok.

@@francescoporcari8597 Its not about quality, because the recontextualizations have mostly all been high quakity. The Nathrezim recontext for example was phenomenal. Prior to their recontext, the full extent was that they were simply really smart demons, who's homeworld was seemingly destroyed by Illidan, and since the Legion is all but gone, without the recontext, the Nathrezim would be basically done with forever for the most part. With the recontext, now they have infinitely more plot time, since they are universal infiltrators for Death. Zovaal and the SL plot added WAY more context to the Lich King plot, which originally was just the Legion, Ner'zhul, Arthas, and Bolvar.

@@monkeysk8er33 I don't agree regarding nathrezim or Zovaal, I think that they could have kept the core theme (a bad guy from the afterlife and the Nathrezim as his infiltrators) but handled the material way better. I found it overcomplicated and forced. it was really poorly implemented as much of that happened offscreen or even "offpage". we were told, we weren't shown. The Nathrezim could have been kept relevant without touching the past, simply by investigating their motivation and by giving them more development.

@@francescoporcari8597 You may disagree and dislike the changes, but that doesn't make their added context less interesting or complex. As a writer of a multi decade spanning universe of lore, their job is to add to the lore. When you run out of old lore, you make new lore, and recontextualize old lore to fit new lore. That's how writing works. I get the fact that 99% of the playerbase aren't writers, and not even half of that 1% who are writers are likely even decent writers, but people have to stop pretending that it is "bad writing." Great writing sometimes flies over peoples' heads. Such is the curse of intelligence and competence, they're not universally shared with the general populace. What's happened is that over time, as the lore has been added to, and made more complex, it's gotten nearly impossible for 99% of playerbase to like the lore, let alone comprehend it, and that's due it's complexity, not it's quality. I get it, being smart is hard, and takes a lot of work. But got is it equally infuriating and hilarious that people don't understand some of this shit. You liking something doesn't make it great. Something being well written makes it great. Note that these stories aren't finished, not anywhere close. So just like with things like the Song of Ice and Fire book series, you cannot say its bad until it's done. But you can say something is good before it's finished. That may be hard for people to understand, but it's simple logic. 🤷 A plot can be great, and be ruined by a bad plot twist, and vice-versa. You can call a movie great until it ends terribly. You can call a movie terrible, until you see a mind blowing plot twist ending. I can think of a million examples of these, but you can't throw something out, and say it's trash if you haven't fully consumed it. Again, most of the playerbase barely knows the MAIN storylines of each expansion, let alone the overall metric ton of lore that comes from external material that contextualizes a lot of it. People who played Cata might have thought that Thrall met Nozdormu in the Dragon Soul raid, not knowing he met him in Thrall Twilight of the Aspects and essentially saved Nozdormu from being trapped in the infinite timeways. That's a huge detail to be unaware of when analyzing their relationship, which seems virtually non existent, aside from a few scenes if you only play the game. It's like Star Wars. You don't know Vader if you don't play The Force Unleashed, watch Clone Wars, or read his comics. You know movie Vader, which is barebones and has less complexity and context.

Nice, I'm so glad you enjoyed it!