WRIST SET IN THE GOLF SWING

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Mark Crossfield

Mark Crossfield

5 жыл бұрын

Wrist Set In The Golf Swing chat with golf professional Mark Crossfield. Maybe we have been looking at this idea in far too simple of terms and if we just break it down we could all improve more. See what Mark and Coach Lockey think about setting the wrists on the golf backswing and in the golf swing and if it is something your should be doing more of or less of. Improving your understanding of your wrists in the golf swing can make for some fast improvements. Good golf swing basics can help beginners to pros with their golf swing changes and finding a repeatable action. Let us know in the comments below if this helps with your wrist set or wrist hinge snd leads to some better golf shots.
Music by Ryan Little subscribe to his channel here / ther4c2010
Social Links
Twitter / 4golfonline
Instagram / crossfieldmark
Facebook / askgolfguru

Пікірлер: 485
@MarkCrossfield
@MarkCrossfield 4 жыл бұрын
Thanks for all the great comments I will do more on this subject as I feel it is still misunderstood. Share this video with any golfers working or wrist set or lag in the golf swing.
@JETLFC
@JETLFC 5 жыл бұрын
Where has this lesson been all my life ?
@gcoffey223
@gcoffey223 Жыл бұрын
Just wasted time on a bunch of channels on this... thank God Mark covered this.
@litfroooog2823
@litfroooog2823 5 жыл бұрын
Such a brilliant video!!!! People want it simple and you actually made it very simple. The less you hinge the more control you have!
@joshuabelcher2693
@joshuabelcher2693 5 жыл бұрын
This type of content is exactly why I subscribe love it 👌🏻
@barrybr1
@barrybr1 3 жыл бұрын
After 45yrs of playing average golf I've just recently incorporated a wrist hinge to try and get a longer backswing and to 'help' with lag. How funny to see this vid just now. (I can't tell you how much pain I've had in my wrists lately...thought it was arthritis). Will play round with my swing this arvo and put some of these ideas in action. Thanks Mark and Coach!
@johnkerr6104
@johnkerr6104 5 жыл бұрын
Spot on Mark, I have been getting lessons once a month from a coach (80 years old) so he teaches old school and never talks about wrist hinge. I dropped 6 shots off my handicap doing exactly how you described it, more control of my club face and the ball direction. Great work mark, love your videos. cheers Brahh
@gratickner
@gratickner 5 жыл бұрын
I have been trying to resolve my over swing and across the line backswing for over 10 years. I decided to record my swing and see what I needed to feel in my backswing to resolve the problem and exactly what you describe in this video was the answer to my problems. Fantastic video, if only I could have watched this 10 years ago!
@p1miguel999
@p1miguel999 5 жыл бұрын
i have struggled with added dynamic loft for years. This video made so much sense and described all my thoughts and feelings with my swing. Can't wait for better weather to get out and practice . Thank you Mark, for the video's and for just making sense
@bigdumbanimal23
@bigdumbanimal23 5 жыл бұрын
From one Mark with a 'k' to another Thank You! My swing has been plagued for so long because of the numerous Pros who advocate holding the angle. Because of that number one error most golfers like myself have searched for years about tips for our swings. I have given up watching swing videos tips and I wasn't even going to watch this video, but I did because it was on my Google News feed. You also hear so many times that grip, stance, and alignment are the most important part of the swing, but I think that this is the chief foundation of the swing that should be taught by every instructor. Thank you again!
@jesper8496
@jesper8496 5 жыл бұрын
Best video ever on wrist hinge!! This makes the backswing so Much easyer 👍👍! Finally a clear understanding about this topic
@jonathanthomason7896
@jonathanthomason7896 5 жыл бұрын
Love it when you do videos on wrist angles. You really put the cookies on the bottom shelf for us to reach. The stuff you're talking about is so much easier and repeatable if people would give it a try.
@SC-lo5ez
@SC-lo5ez 2 жыл бұрын
#1 fundamental lesson ever for a proper ball striking. Thanks for sharing.
@KevinConlon
@KevinConlon 5 жыл бұрын
The best description of arm rotation vs. "wrist hinge". Simply brilliant. Another common misinterpretation, explained beautifully!
@balanc3tube
@balanc3tube 5 жыл бұрын
This changed everything for me. Ive been playing for 10 years and have had lessons, yet, never had anyone break down all the points of flex like this. For 10 years I've hit fades and slices. This one lesson made me start drawing it almost every club and shot. So simple.
@richardjames5700
@richardjames5700 5 жыл бұрын
Very very good and brilliantly illustrated in the studio and with the drills - I'm going to keep working on my flat wrist - it makes a massive difference - slice has gone!!
@JimboSRP
@JimboSRP 5 жыл бұрын
When I first started golf and had a massive issue with slicing (and many other things), I remember my coach saying to forget the wrists completely - they'd end up doing what they need to if I just concentrated on body rotation and keeping connected in the backswing. Works really well for me.
@PAULWILLIAMSONGOLF
@PAULWILLIAMSONGOLF 5 жыл бұрын
Great advice
@stevedickson3037
@stevedickson3037 5 жыл бұрын
Very useful video. Again. Years of knowledge being imparted for free. Brilliant
@richshawry
@richshawry 4 жыл бұрын
Finally got round to watching this. Thanks Mark.
@simland
@simland 5 жыл бұрын
This was the one thing I came across through your videos a few years ago and personal trial and error. It changed everything. You mentioned, you may become pat-pat. But, in reality, I'm free to swing with my whole body as hard as I want because I can control face and strike. Lose a bit of distance the first few weeks as my brain gets fixed and then suddenly getting massive distance as everything works together with a solid strike.
@waynepadley1337
@waynepadley1337 5 жыл бұрын
Thank you Mark this made a massive difference to my ball striking this morning. I was drawing the ball easier than usual. Hope this helps others to give it a try !
@jeremyclark4563
@jeremyclark4563 5 жыл бұрын
Mark I just want to say that I have been playing golf for years and have always struggled for distance and consistency. I am self taught with Ben Hogans Five Modern Fundamentals. This video has added 10 to 15 yards to all my clubs and I am striking the ball so much better. Thank You soooo much.
@dougiebtw
@dougiebtw 5 жыл бұрын
Beautiful explanation and breakdown of the wrist action!! I'm working on it now! Keep doing what you do boys!!!
@Will-nb8qk
@Will-nb8qk 3 жыл бұрын
Mark Crossfield, you’ve hit the nail square on the freakin head. I now find that the feeling of wrist inflexion on my lead hand works wonders. The radial deviation method that is taught seems so wrong. I really hope golfers see this vid and appreciate the detail you put in. Bunker shots and chip shots are brilliant now minus feel for distance which will come. When I recorded myself taking swings with this wrist inflexion I actually find it looks look a wrist hinge. Importantly when you watch the pros, wrist inflexion or back of lead hand is facing target, depicting that inflexion to the top of swing. Absolutely brilliant and kudos for sharing this information.
@tonyaguirre2365
@tonyaguirre2365 5 жыл бұрын
Best instructional video on YT this year.
@kd55kd
@kd55kd 5 жыл бұрын
Thanks Mark! I have been struggling with this lately and your explanation of what to do (or not do) with my wrists should really help.
@PAULWILLIAMSONGOLF
@PAULWILLIAMSONGOLF 5 жыл бұрын
Love the idea of keeping the swing more like other movements (throwing a ball, swinging a bat etc). Average Joe doesn't need to think about it anymore than that. Great video again!
@mooremike44
@mooremike44 5 жыл бұрын
One of your best. Incredibly insightful!
@akrickm1
@akrickm1 5 жыл бұрын
Mark & Coach great video have never heard it explained so simple. Checking what I have been doing in a mirror just now been over setting my wrist.Thanks for the great drills going to be working on this actually feels better then what I have been doing.
@jean-francoisouimette6827
@jean-francoisouimette6827 4 жыл бұрын
What a great set of explanations right there! I saved this one to watch it again when the dreaded slice lurks back in my game... Thank you so much for the quality of this content along with the laughs! Cheers!
@dansapp6619
@dansapp6619 5 жыл бұрын
Your best video to date! My mine is blown as this is the exact opposite of what I've been taught and seen in every other video on KZfaq. Thanks Mark
@Automation_Control_Tuning
@Automation_Control_Tuning 5 жыл бұрын
Just reinforced details I have been getting from my lessons... Easy to walk away from lessons struggling with keep applying what have been working on! Great content!
@J264514
@J264514 2 жыл бұрын
Huge help! Thanks for sharing. That brush exercise really helped.
@jonclay1563
@jonclay1563 5 жыл бұрын
Coach Lockey looking very sharp today and you both gave me a very simple understanding of wrist hinge, better than any other video I've seen before. Great job and definitely will help me out this season. Keep up the wonderful teaching vlogs.
@iank2
@iank2 5 жыл бұрын
Such a good video guys really helpful, Keep them coming, some of the best drills I’ve seen at the end as well. Thanks Mark
@ohiomoto
@ohiomoto 5 жыл бұрын
Great Video! Keep pounding these points home, it's finally sinking in for some of us. It took me a while to understand this piece, but I get it now. 1) Wrist flexion/bow is very difficult, if not impossible to achieve with radial deviation/hinge. 2) Wrist extension/cupping is nearly impossible to add with ulnar deviation. 3) Conversely, wrist flexion/bow comes more natural when you have ulnar deviation and extension/cupping will be more natural movement when we are in radial deviation. 4) Understanding, this has truly transformed my strike patterns!!
@terencesullivan8505
@terencesullivan8505 4 жыл бұрын
Great video, I have been holding the golf club wrong for a long time. Went to the range today as well as the course and what a tremendous difference. Thanks Mark & Coach Lockey for straighten me out
@joewolf2343
@joewolf2343 5 жыл бұрын
Great ! U fixed a problem I didn't realize I had picked up.I was working on the backswing, and now realize that to try to stay on plane I was actually starting to "set" those wrists at parallel to try to get the club up a bit more quickly.
@mattgrothues1980
@mattgrothues1980 5 жыл бұрын
Great instruction. Thanks Mark and Coach!
@alansanderson2319
@alansanderson2319 5 жыл бұрын
Finally a good KZfaq video on wrist hinge! I have had so Many lessons where the coach banged on about getting my wrists set or set earlier blah blah blah... Worst lessons ever all you ever thought about was wrists and whole swing suffered as a result.Now I try to "feel" like I don't set the wrists at all .I'm sure concentrating on wrist set and lag must cause more faults than they fix.Very nice video, keep it up 👍
@petewhitehouse226
@petewhitehouse226 5 жыл бұрын
great video. struggled with this for 2 years, just making progress and think this has helped my thoughts in backswing now
@lucascarman2578
@lucascarman2578 5 жыл бұрын
Your videos have taught me just an incredible amount about the golf swing. I came into golf knowing nothing, and so naturally I watched the lessons on the Golf Channel, read magazine articles, and did some cursory google searches. What I came away with was all the typical mumbo jumbo. Setting wrists of course, creating lag, blah blah blah. They all had put my golf swing into a very weird place. It wasn't until I started watching your video that I actually began to think about the golf swing logically and naturally. Lag and wrist set aren't a real thing because you can't radially deviate your wrist more than a few degrees. I've learned so much about face to path relationships, wrist conditions, D-Plane, and a lot more. I'm playing better than ever and I know exactly what I have to work on to get to the next level. I'm going to give a good deal of credit to modern technology like ball and club tracking hardware such as GCQuad because we wouldn't even understand those numbers without them, but you've helped bring it to the real world. I love your realistic and rational approach to golf which resonates with me. You can sometimes sound a bit snobby and I'm not sure we completely agree on club shafts and some of those things, but as for the fundamentals of the swing, you're the best out there. I'd rather have you as a coach than any of the tour guys.
@lucascarman2578
@lucascarman2578 5 жыл бұрын
The last part was just a friendly jab :P
@Ryan-cx3dm
@Ryan-cx3dm 11 ай бұрын
This is great, I’ve never heard anyone talking about this the way you guys have explained it. I’ve always thought I need to set the wrists in the backswing, sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t. I’m currently playing off 11 and can’t seem to get any better, this will help massively!! Thank you!
@SSW8682
@SSW8682 5 жыл бұрын
Great vid mark knowledge is always helpful if acted upon and used appropriately.
@troymckay2256
@troymckay2256 5 жыл бұрын
Your a great communicator. This really helped my game. Always struggled with leaking driver right. Yesterday on course was focusing on going into ulnar and flexion of lead wrist. I was hitting it long and straight. Appreciate the content. Keep up the great work!
@matthewcroad7218
@matthewcroad7218 5 жыл бұрын
OMG !!!!!Whish I had you as a coach years ago. I am always thinking of setting wrist angles which in turn prevent my body turning properly. RANGE TIME !!!!!Thanks guys
@peteratherton897
@peteratherton897 5 жыл бұрын
You fellas just get better and better, love this video, thanks Mark, pure class bruh 👍🏌️‍♂️
@trirobb1
@trirobb1 5 жыл бұрын
Years ago on your askgolfguru channel, you made video on wrist angles! Greatest advice I've ever received to truly help my game . I never flexed my wrist enough at the top of my swing in the backswing . I had a terrible habit of cupping until watching that video years ago . Went from slicing basically every shot to hitting the ball straighter than ever and with a little draw!! Long time subscriber ( 8-9 years) , awesome content as always!
@colindazzell6688
@colindazzell6688 4 жыл бұрын
excelent Mark and Lockey, makes total sense
@user-vm5wo9oc4b
@user-vm5wo9oc4b 5 жыл бұрын
I tried this today on the course, I was prone to flipping and push shots, this has made a huge difference straight away, one of the biggest single improvements I've had in golf! Thanks Mark.
@davidmacdonald8021
@davidmacdonald8021 4 жыл бұрын
Great video!, highlighting the importance of keeping it simple and not over thinking it.. thanks!
@matthewgarman9974
@matthewgarman9974 3 жыл бұрын
Watched a lot of videos but this is undoubtedly one of the best I have seen. Your robot throw summed it all up.
@MarkCrossfield
@MarkCrossfield 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks bruh hope it helps.
@stuartsullivan9161
@stuartsullivan9161 5 жыл бұрын
This was a fun watch. I’ve been in the ‘must set the wrists’ trap in the past. Knowledge bombs brah.
@sgoleaner
@sgoleaner 3 жыл бұрын
I made this adjustment today and it immediately fixed so many problems. One of the most useful online tips I've ever seen. Keep it up guys!
@MarkCrossfield
@MarkCrossfield 3 жыл бұрын
That’s great thanks for the comment. 👍
@paulbrown313
@paulbrown313 4 жыл бұрын
You're right Mark, i did indeed search for 'wrist hinge in golf' as i'm making a comeback and wanted to remember where it should be as it always caused me problems. I now see and as a bonus i got a great explanation as to what's going on which is always a big help. Going the range tomorrow and hoping for good things. I miss my clean iron striking and i think this one could bring it back. Cheers bud.
@kpahsodude
@kpahsodude 4 жыл бұрын
70 year old here, 85-95 scores, have broken below 80. Played today after watching this yesterday and struck the ball more cleanly and sharply than ever before. Can't wait to practice these principles. Thanks
@bernardhilton3527
@bernardhilton3527 2 жыл бұрын
Not the first time I have seen this vlog. It is such a goodie that it was worth a second view. I have stopped wildly hooking the ball- before I was wildly rolling my wrists over to straighten the clubface, my occasional slice has gone and approaches to the green are more accurate. I am loosing a little distance perhaps but the better ball strikes and accuracy make it worthwhile.. Many thanks guys.
@richardwarwick76
@richardwarwick76 5 жыл бұрын
Lol your robotic impression of people on the range is exactly me. Trying to stop rolling the wrists straight from takeaway for years with no joy keep the videos coming please !
@geoff376
@geoff376 5 жыл бұрын
Wish i'd had this lesson 15 years ago. Amazing to get this level of info. buckshee. Golfswing biggy this.👌
@richardkuipers7295
@richardkuipers7295 5 жыл бұрын
eye opener for me Mark!! Thanks allot
@chadsmith7784
@chadsmith7784 5 жыл бұрын
Great video. It made a big difference. Thank you very much
@fredlist7091
@fredlist7091 5 жыл бұрын
Excellent video! This confirms what I found by trial and error. Setting wrist angles in search of "lag" or swing speed is a nightmare to control. Letting the momentum of the club hinge and unhinge the wrists naturally gets the club back to square at impact without thinking about it at all. Immediate accuracy improvements when I started doing this. Great lesson here Mark!
@evananderson2166
@evananderson2166 5 жыл бұрын
I used to be a big wrist set guy until I figured it out about 5 years ago. The game got a lot easier. Great video.
@berniewallis4140
@berniewallis4140 5 жыл бұрын
Great video, I used to hinge my wrist following lessons years ago, but my game improved no end, when I stopped doing it, could never hit my driver with the wrist hinge I was very wayward, both left and right misses. Drove me mad, superb explanation Mark, a joy to watch this one.
@danielbosley8913
@danielbosley8913 5 жыл бұрын
Fantastic video. Really helped. Thanks chaps!
@cudi3212
@cudi3212 5 жыл бұрын
Fantastic video mark! Keep the education coming
@johntemplin7100
@johntemplin7100 5 жыл бұрын
Loved this one Mark 👌
@user-wf7vs3hd9n
@user-wf7vs3hd9n 5 жыл бұрын
I like this sort of content - more of it please. Like me, I'm sure lots of golfers who have had lessons, or watched KZfaq, will have been told to "hinge up" in the back swing. I've spent hours looking for balls over the years as a result!
@jeffrich2018
@jeffrich2018 3 жыл бұрын
Makes perfect sense Mark. Adding unnecessary movements that create a power leak is no good. Keep the backswing as simple and on plane as possible helps with better ball contact.Thanks for the great swing thoughts and drill.
@duncanwraight
@duncanwraight 3 жыл бұрын
This video has helped me to clear my head beautifully. Recently I added some wrist set at my coach's request, to stop myself from pulling my arms behind me too much on the backswing. To begin with, this worked beautifully - exactly as coach hoped. However, I was unable to see him for a while during lockdown, and suddenly found myself hitting the odd steep slice - with pretty much any club. As time went on, and I tried to fix it in my coach's absence, more and more shots became horrible steep slices. Finally I almost "caught" myself on camera putting a ton of extension in to my wrist instead of just radial movement. I also found that the wrist set made the start of my backswing horribly difficult; I would repeatedly start my backswing then have to stop because I hadn't achieved the radial movement I needed. When I managed to see my coach again, we removed the wrist set entirely and I'm back to hitting lower AoA and closing the club face properly. It's great to hear this from your perspective, because I just watched another video by a famous KZfaq golf tuition channel which suggested every golfer should have wrist set in their backswing... Very confusing. Your expertise directly correlates with my own experience however so it's a no-brainer - no wrist set for me.
@MrWattsy84
@MrWattsy84 5 жыл бұрын
Love this video, so many people can completely change their swings from this video alone! Just do this and play better golf
@mikecooper2851
@mikecooper2851 5 жыл бұрын
I found this out at the weekend playing ! Everything going right . Stopped cupping wrist and just rotated. Thanks guys explained it perfectly
@scottish118
@scottish118 5 жыл бұрын
Well done Mark, thank you.
@samslade7986
@samslade7986 5 жыл бұрын
That was great to watch
@Rbshiflet
@Rbshiflet 5 жыл бұрын
Great content, Mark! I even reference back old videos of you doing this when the shanks set in because my fault is that I want to get the club too far behind me and my wrists set too early in my back swing. I agree that (maybe) the number one amateur issue is club face control and it's not practiced nearly enough. Better face control, leads to better strike and that coupled with practicing start direction and learning a shot shape is a way to lower scores and manage the game!! Keep it up, Bruh!
@seantaylor6806
@seantaylor6806 5 жыл бұрын
Brilliant Mark, really illuminating. I struggled for years with an open face related to these issues. These days I have very little "wrist set" and weak high pushes aren't anywhere near as common. Thanks mate😁
@markmckennafox6981
@markmckennafox6981 5 жыл бұрын
Nicely explained and a great demonstration of how unhelpful wrist hinging is, and a couple of great drills at the end thanks
@bengeist3227
@bengeist3227 5 жыл бұрын
Finally clear instruction on how the wrist works. Thanks you!
@MarkCrossfield
@MarkCrossfield 5 жыл бұрын
Your welcome Ben
@guntherthedog
@guntherthedog 5 жыл бұрын
I liked this one as well. Now to try and implement it.
@richardwarwick76
@richardwarwick76 5 жыл бұрын
Great video Mark.
@query1527
@query1527 5 жыл бұрын
I love this video!
@Rikbo77
@Rikbo77 5 жыл бұрын
Thanks for posting this vid. I was going through a bit of a bad patch with my swing recently and this just reminded me to keep things a bit more simple. Especially liked the bit about feeling the weight of the club. Took it to the range the last two times, focused on where the club feels 'easiest' to swing (also feels lighter maybe?) and started hitting the ball much cleaner. Hopefully I can put it into practice on the course soon! Cheers Mark!
@paulchandleredge2edge582
@paulchandleredge2edge582 5 жыл бұрын
Great video Mark. Definitely made sense to me. I use a swing thought which I saw in a video once..I believe it was something Jack Nicklaus said ..I could be wrong ...but showing the ground the time with your lead wrist...with your watch...I feel it takes that cupping out of my wrist
@Pillagepopper
@Pillagepopper 5 жыл бұрын
Thank you for this video. When you said you set up with ulnar a light bulb went off in my head. So simple. Thanks for the explanations.
@willglenister613
@willglenister613 5 жыл бұрын
Very clever Marcus
@robertmuldowney4939
@robertmuldowney4939 5 жыл бұрын
Great vid mark spent years down that rabbit hole, thanks for the great work bruh
@reuk
@reuk 5 жыл бұрын
That's very helpful. Thank you
@joeperez3520
@joeperez3520 5 жыл бұрын
VERY pleased to see this. While I can get around 45* Ulnar Deviation, I can barely manager 10* radial, and just chalked it up to another example of my parents' sense of humor when it came to my physical abilities. For a long time I thought this was something that would forever negatively affect my chances of making "proper" swings.
@rogerzorzan9577
@rogerzorzan9577 5 жыл бұрын
That makes a LOT of sense. I started focusing on bowing my wrist after i take the club back with the driver and just keeping that bow in my mind when i come back down. IMMEDIATELY got straighter driving results with my normal setup instead of power fading :-)
@gordonpparsons
@gordonpparsons 5 жыл бұрын
Great video and clear explanation
@MrMattorge
@MrMattorge 5 жыл бұрын
Cheers from Canada!!!
@davidhealy6994
@davidhealy6994 4 жыл бұрын
Really useful video. Great job gents. I struggle with left wrist extension at end of back swing. Will give the drills a go!!
@shaneducholke364
@shaneducholke364 5 жыл бұрын
Great video. I had that mixed up myself and when trying to get rid of my cupped wrist, I was adding wrist hinge and getting worse. I always thought wrist set/hinge and bowing the wrist was the same thing.very good job of clearing that up.
@shauntaylor7244
@shauntaylor7244 5 жыл бұрын
Great content that has been my golf for the past 5 years 🤬, this will help me so much, having lessons with a young golf pro , got me throwing a ball helping me so much , showing me how to play with a fade not fighting it as I have been it’s the 1st week but going well.🏌🏽
@jamesdawson8103
@jamesdawson8103 5 жыл бұрын
Perfect video, my previous coach was all about take away set your wrists blah, new coach all about rotation as one. Thanks
@thebigeasy8609
@thebigeasy8609 5 жыл бұрын
Thank you Mark for content like this. Your explanation on the subject makes it so us mere mortals can comprehend your gospel. We really appreciate it.
@philipsmith6152
@philipsmith6152 5 жыл бұрын
Great video mark, reminds me of the hit the wall with the R hand video you did, that worked for me !
@chasinggolf5491
@chasinggolf5491 5 жыл бұрын
yup, spot on and something I fixed a long time ago and face control is light years better as is distance, launch angles etc. I think it started with my from being an arm swinger and using it to get the club back. Easy one to fix.
@glennwiebe5128
@glennwiebe5128 5 жыл бұрын
I was glad to see you use the brush at the end to demonstrate how inactive the wrists should be. That's not to say they are tight or stiff in any way. You swinging the two wedges together reminded me of what Mike Malaska says about the wrists. He says that the right wrist should be a simple (mild) flexion and then extension and no radial or ulna deviation (not intentional). He turned the club around and grasped it by the head with his usual grip and then swung it back and forth. He did this several times and then flipped the club rightway around and then swung that. He said that will give you a good feel for the club head, which, if I'm not mistaken, is what you were doing with the two wedges. He used a tennis racquet as you used the brush and his angles were identical to yours. As you said, thinking coaches. That's the key! Great video, bruhs!
@tonyatkinson532
@tonyatkinson532 5 жыл бұрын
Thank's Mark this rings so true and it looks like I have a bit of work to do (was like a private lesson for me) cheers Burh
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