So weird hearing my early 20's as a history lesson

Gen z are running through aesthetics wayyyyy to quick , damn give it like 20 years please, yal gonna be wearing gucci and yeezy in 2 years again at this point

You got the timeline right! True indie sleaze was before 2011 to me. I feel like it died with Crystal Castle’s III album. I say this bc a lot of younger gen z confuse it with post 2013 artic monkeys stuff.

Indie sleaze is just hipsters after a drug induced party

Hey from someone who was 18 in 2008, I think you're kind of missing the vibe of this era. Rebranding this "trend" as indie sleaze in retrospect makes sense bc everyone looks kind of unwashed and "sleazy" in those party photos, especially if you look at some of the icons of the era (Kate Moss and Pete Doherty's many photos come to mind). But two big influences on our mindset at the time (in the US at least) were 1) after Obama was elected there was a real feeling of like elation, like we'd come out of the Bush era and maybe everything was going to get better, even though we were going through a recession. For a lot of people I knew, we were too young to be working yet, so we didn't personally have a good sense of the recession. So we weren't like nihilistic in the face of some economic peril. I think we were just kind of like weirdly feeling like maybe everything wouldn't be so bad. Like a bit naive I guess. 2) A huuuuuge factor in the culture of the time that you can't discredit is that although we had blackberrys or whatever, and digital cameras, and facebook, social media barely existed. So when we went out to party, we got ready to go out but we didn't think as much about our look or about taking photos or anything. I and most of my friends look wasted in 90% of the photos we took in that era bc we never thought about who would see them other than our other friends. It was a lot easier to turn up and be present and dumb and just party without distractions or reminders or knowing that you looked terrible and your mascara was all over your face lol

I was 18 in 2008 so seeing my teenage years re-branded is kinda cute. I will say the access to affordable clothes and drugs was just better back then point blank. The media also played a major part, I feel like this video left out films like Juno, Garden State, Superbad and Project X that were very impactful on some of the aesthetics of that time.

what's funny to me is that all of the artists mentioned, back then fell into a whole different genre and sub culture which makes sense, indie sleaze being a new term for that entire era. for example, when i was in middle school and high school, i was very into crystal castles, clams casino, purity ring, crim3s, sidewalks and skeletons, salem, etc., back then all of that was witch house. i can't think of more artists, most i listed are mentioned in this video and i can't think of more offf top of my head. it would be cool to see your take on what witch house is or was. it's really interesting seeing gen z taking interest in past trends and giving it a new name and life to it, as a millenial it makes me automatically perceive that time as more interesting and fun that how it actually felt to live it

I think the photography of Terry Richardson played a role as well

"dazed and confused" magazine featured a big part of that Era too

Anything that gets away from quiet luxury is a win imo

Big “key bumps in the bathroom” era

Great breakdown and journalism sir! I will be 40 soon, and I lived through that era. Was even a casualty of it as I spent several years in addiction(sober since 2016). Fashion and art saved my life, but that time was a crazy fun time too. No regrets

I disagree with one of your points concerning the new indie sleaze revival in terms of music. Although you are right about groups like snow strippers and the hellp, I think that new underground rapers like xaviersobased, nettspend, phreshboyswag, clip, bleeod/defficile all encompass that indie sleaze energy that we once saw in the 00s and early 2010s. Even some modern alt rock bands/ artist like trxy!, novulent, and quannnic somewhat fit into this group aswell.

This and the shoe gaze era was my childhood. It was such a vibe. The style felt more down to earth and attainable if that makes sense compared to the gen Z styles of today. I don't know. Back then it felt like we were just expressing ourselves with what we had. Thrifting and finding anything remotely interesting or ironic was the only outlet we had to be different from the last generation.

this whole era of music was documented on the internet in real time and zoomers still cant get it right.

Watching kids discover trends in real time is truly brain cell-killing. Edit: Just to provide some _much_ needed information to this topic- This original “Indie sleaze” trend (which it was NEVER called) came about through many, many circumstances that were either missed or glossed over in this video. First, this look and sound was a reaction to the Minimal Techno genre of music that came out of Germany in the late 90’s and early 2000’s. It was also a reaction to the Y2K Bug, which was the computer glitch that was supposed to wipe out humanity at the stroke of midnight on January 1st in the year 2000. When nothing happened at the turn of the millennium, and “the future” wasn’t suddenly flying cars and world peace, people reverted back to being hedonistic dirtbags with a tinge of nihilism. Then the Bush administration and 9/11 happened, and from that *‘Merica* was spawned. The culture reverted to this trailer park, down-home ‘merican aesthetic. In New York, especially Williamsburg, Brooklyn, the Electroclash scene sprang up, turning an eye back to the 80’s and synth-heavy music. Electroclash mashed up gay culture, hedonism, sexual liberty, 80’s fashion, and partying. It was the first truly post-modern scene, and it set the tone for the rest of the decade, influencing everything from dance music to emo. Vice magazine, MySpace, and The Hipster are also major contributing factors to this cultural movement.

Hey bro as a 31 yr old let me tell you im thankful Indie 8s coming back into the mainstream. I grew up in the original era. Strokes, Yeah Yeah Yeah, Phoenix, Interpol Bloc Party, Tv on the Radio and LCD Soundsystem were part of this NYC movement that went global. Thomas mars of Phoenix grew up with Hedi Slimane and did music for his DIOR show. By the time Arctic Monkeys and the Kooks came around it blew up. Midwest emo was also developing alongside this. American Apparel was important here because it was about the look as supposed to the brands and this movement was popular amongst upoer middle class kids who saw themselves as too intellectual to make their personality about brands as supposed to culture. It came to a head with the british show Skins and indie movies.

In Australia we had the same scene but it was "indie hipster" or "alternative" and we focused more on music; seeing bands at gigs, art shows/exhibitions and yes, party culture was there too with our thrifted op shop outfits. Bands that many of us listened to was Warpaint, The Drums, The Hives, Twin Shadow, Toro Y Moi, Vampire Weekend, Yeasayer, The Kooks, The Wombats, Two Door Cinema Club, Beach House, Bloc Party, Morning Benders (before they became Pop etc) Old school Kings of Leon and of course aussies bands Last Dinosaur, San Cisco, Yves Klein Blue, Cut Copy, Red Riders, The Jezabels, Little Red, Midnight Juggernauts, Bag Raiders etc. I could go on and on but I spent most of my 20's in the indie scene and we all loved music so much, everyone was listening to triple j and going to savers or vinnies to shop for clothes. Also everyone loved polaroid's but of course not everyone could afford to have one.

It's just the grunge aesthetic with hipster vibes from the mid-late 2000s.

I was in school in ireland around this time and most of us were very inspired by the t.v skins, the styling they had was very of this era, topman hoodys, skinny jeans, white canvas shoes or chunky nikes, leather jackets ,diamond earrings all kinda melted together lol

We were just hipsters but you couldn’t call us that. Indie sleaze is such a funny name though

such a nice approach to video to talk about the past of this trend, the meaning or lack of it behind it, mentioning photographers, designers, filmmakers and writers. didn’t expect much on this theme, but you did a great job!

Saying there was no depth in indie sleaze isnt correct. We were coming of age without any ability to come of age. It was a reaction to pensions, the white picket fence and the future we were told we would have being pulled from us. When they bailed out the banks, they sold us. What do you do when your lifetime of hope has been stripped from you? We were coping as "adults" who would never have the opportunity to grow into that concept.

I appreciate the lil brush up you did about the internet in y2k basically the beginning of the paradigm shift of tech

The Cobrasnake has a great photography book on this called y2k archive. Really cool book also if ur a Jeremy Scott fan.

Having been a spectator for this scene on online fashion blogs at the time (I was in middle school/early HS) I’m really curious about the term “indie sleaze.” Is this just a post-facto name for the tail end of the hipster era? As far as I remember, we used to just call members of the scene “hipsters” (a term which has heavily fallen out of fashion).

great essay. actually taught something instead of dick riding a genre for 10 mins. i will review all your recs!

Hedi slimane played a huge part, he has lots of musician friends and he used to dress them. Even when we didn't had the money we were all emulating the look with trifted 70s and 80s fashion. He sold the look to the 1% percenters and media and he influenced both men and women's fashion because his clothes have always been worn by both. He also featured new bands at his shows soundtracks, so he really disseminated it in the wide public mindset.

I’m glad you mentioned the blog era. It was phenomenal way to find cool new music. I miss it a lot. Especially The Hype Machine

The strokes and the Libertines. 2000-4 . !!!! Nice lil doc 👍🏽

Great video man this is so well done!!! 👍

Loved this analysis thank you

I do think that indie sleaze is becoming popular again for kinda the same reason it was popular around the recession as well. Gen Z grew up being taught that “war is over”, all that stuff that happened in the past couldn’t never happen again, we live “in a time of peace and wealth”. Ever since 2020 everything has just become so stressful for the youth. The pandemic, war in Ukraine and now the genocide in Palestine, global warming is still an issue, human exploitation is rampant in places like China, Congo, Ethiopia, misogyny came back in some places thanks to the identity crisis of men, religious extremism feels rampant everywhere, anti-abortion and anti-trans laws being passed in several countries, protests happening more and more often. We, the youth feel doomed. The world isn’t this beautiful place full of endless possibilities it once was. It’s full of trash, suffering thanks to late capitalism, hatred towards everyone, a sense of “how many years do we have left?”. It used to snow in my country, heavily. I used to build igloos with my brother in our back yard. We haven’t had a single centimetre of snow in the last 3 years at least. I can’t enjoy a sunny day in February without feeling guilty. And no matter what I do nothing will change anything. We are powerless and angry and sad.

Uzi (Gabe) was the first to bring it back in 2016 - if you know you know

been kinda getting into these kind of stuffs recently didnt kno it was an actual scene

i like how you related salem and dfw. i couldnt pinpoint why i felt a similar appeal before.

Genuinely appreciate this perspective, and a lot more nuanced than some of the other 'indie sleaze revival' explainers have been. That being said Vincent Gallo and DFW were very much known quantities in the OG era too, especially by the kind of tastemakers who were writing the music/culture blogs promoting this cultural identity. If anything the OG scene was a direct reaction to the naval gaze-y indie/emo early 2000's, where those ideas were definitely apart of it.

I feel like i never grew out of the 2010 vibe, just got educaded and wasted to again grow back into it. Not only music but also lifestye and art was suddenly open for discovery on the web. I remember feeling like the coolest person for discovering new influences. I loved the foals antidote album and the show skins was a huge deal to me and my friends.

Very nice vid Karsten.

great vid!! love the visual aids

this video is great. what are some specific songs that payed tribute to rural America? I just started listening to the snow strippers and the hellp and could use song suggestions

I think indie sleaze was more of a lifestyle tbh. Its completely different than it is now which seems to be another artistic expression and aesthetic. Im so glad im a millennial, we had pretty awesome phases. ❤

beautiful analysis

Whatever Pete Doherty was rocking at that time is ace with me right now.

You’ve been killing it with these recent trend videos!! I didn’t even know about this one

shit u got me, finding myself there, after listening to the strokes and alt rock for years

I was there when it was written, I was an obnoxious 21 year old and you nailed the timeline!

i love your vids and i love indie sleaze

This dude loves his hiphop , love the 9th wonder instrumentals.

Enjoyed your video! However I was confused at the photography part because Juergen Teller typically shoots film, not digital?

Indie Sleaze 😂 Back in the days we called it Witch House.

love that you had to explain what a blog is ahahahh bet people don't know

2007 is peak indie culture

It really started in the late 90s. I saw The Yeahs Yeahs Yeahs and Girls Against Boys NYE 1999. Indie Sleaze ground zero. My boyfriend was the godfather of Math Rock.

Awesome video!

whats the background song for the second part of the video like at 11:00

I’m only 28 and I’ve already seen my child hood and teen years come back into style. It’s interesting. Revitalizing trends in such quick succession must be unique to Gen Z right? I mean the fact that kids are referencing the early 2010’s already is wild. I knew this would happen eventually but not so soon. I wonder if we’re jaded and less creative/original as a society these days.

Interesting take. I like the explanation of the revival movement, and influential artists and photographers. Well thought out. Though, in that era nobody thought of this as a movement, or named it Indie Sleaze (though indie music was def popular, the look didn't really have a set name or label and encompasses a bunch of different trends and styles that sort of flow into one another, except maybe some would call that hipster back in the day)- I think that term came up around the 2020s even? It was just what people wore at the time, especially the more alternative and artistic people. Very interesting how there's all these analyses looking back, seeing it in a very different light. The post-recession vibes and the moving away from flashy branded stuff is very on point.

Myspace 2004 through 2007 music only. It was a short time and it was amazing.

it's a stupid scene/trend/aesthetic like anything else. the music is what matters, and artists like animal collective, mgmt and ariel pink have created amazing music. the same cannot be said for the 'revival' - even direct inspiration like crystal castles is more interesting and original.

What hoodie are you wearing

I think there is a turning point and that’s around 2005. Something changed then, at least in England. MySpace was officially a juggernaut in music and was rapidly changing the accessibility to new music via the web, introducing literally children like myself to brand new often unsigned independent music of all kinds. From Grime and rap to electronic music like crystal castles, post punk like the horrors, arctic monkeys Sheffield roots, not to mention nu rave in its infancy, I remember seeing a lot of these groups crop up a couple of years before they even released records. They were already popular. Stylish clothes were readily available and there wasn’t a snobbery around how much they cost or where they were from because it was just a ‘look’ - they weren’t used quite as much a status symbols. The sleeze aspect was kind of around from the beginning, but certainly peaked in 2007 with moss and Doherty etc, nu rave hitting the mainstream. It must be told however that 2008 was really the death of ‘indie’ in the 2000s as we knew it in the UK. Whilst indies mainstream big bang was happening in the US with Big albums like the MGMT debut, I feel like the UK was already winding down, at least in the circles that I was part of, there was a longing for something new and by 2009 a real sense that culture snobs like myself were looking for something of their own to be attached to again, I couldn’t stand the watered down aesthetics that began to prevail in the mainstream and longed for the scruffy MySpace pages, limewire downloads and most others not being hip to the music I’d desperately tried to seek out for myself, no matter how snobby that sounds. Luckily by this point the music that had been bubbling up elsewhere in the 2000’s found its feet with UK fans, as we grew to know about the likes of Jay Retard, Ty Segall, Ariel Pink etc, which freshened things up. Much like a lot of music eras, things were faster paced here, they came, they became big here they left, at least for your really switched on music fan.

Topman was also very important to men dressing in this era as well as the rise of thrifting

Like bro, where did you find all this info?

Damn bro that’s wild you just described me.

Well done!!!

ending song is washer by slint and it might be the basement version idk🤷🏾 (interesting video btw)

do you think the revival of skrams and indie sleeve have anything to do with each other along the revival of y2k

i think that last bit of rural americana definitely had its own separate era than indie sleaze

where are the clips from 15:00 from ?

For me it definitely starting with discovering aa ads thru vice mag and wiwt community blogs on live journal. So crazy tho bc at the time as a teenager I didn’t know it was a movement or trend I just that’s what it meant to be cool in your teens and early twenties. Not old enough to witness trend cycles first hand, I thought it was a timeless look lol. By the time 2016 makeup trends hit I was so confused why messy eyeliner wasn’t cool anymore and I thought foundation was just for older women

What hoodie you wearin? Ty

If any ones likes music like this I would recommend the xx, Jai Paul, Ross tones, and the 1975 self titled deluxe. The 1975 first album deluxe has great ambient songs and their inspired by hedi slimane. :)

Thank you! That was a great video. I liked how you showed the connection between culture and fashion in this one. I think, nevertheless, that Hedi Slimane is not pronounced "Heidi". ;)

Justice is about to release an album, Cheap Monday is back in production, oh boy.

I think the artistic values and imagery of rural/middle america are interesting, but i've been feeling like theres something exploitative about it. like you said, a lot of these musicians are from LA or other bigger cities. as someone from a rural place, its kinda frustrating to see the culture and issues in places like where im from being used for some sort of trendy backdrop. I don't think this is exclusive to indie sleeze either. I feel like a lot of trends especially with y2k revival stuff is walking a fine line between appreciating and mocking the poopulations that popularized the trend in the first place.

Yo is your ending song slint?

kinda forgot about the americana era of 2012-2015 from lana and taylor swift leaning into the whole james dean and lolita thing. 50s fashion was pretty big during this indie arc that happened after the whole swag era and before 2016 soundcloud era

Pls someone type the new sleaze music, i just can't find it man

No mention of picture plane anywhere here

You going to thrift shop grab random stuff and top with leather jacket 🙌🏻 Here you go Indie sleazy

I lived this. I was going to events like Banana Split Sundays with Steve Aoki as the resident DJ. I was a scenester and never had to wait in lines. Cinespace was the spot and I saw many artists, including MIA before she BLEW UP. I wore lots of American Apparel and one of my friends hooked up with Dove bc she was friends with one of the main AA girls and they had coke fueled orgies. My BF had a business account with them and my friends put in a big order and picked it up at the factory and Dove perved all over her. Vice magazine was definitely a major influence on the culture and fashion at the time. PBR was my go to drink. Blow was common. I went to SO MANY shows. So many. I thought I was super cool and got photographed. I dated musicians. I did a lot of crazy things. I was a party girl and I'm happy those years are behind me.

i think uk post punk, dance punk, glasgow indie were hugely inspirational esp to americans. just look at skins lmao. but yeah look more into uks post punk revival and even britpop cuz the mod revival was very early OG indie sleaze. pretty much invented by the libertines the grungy style comes from the wasters strung out and constantly partying. early arctic monkeys shows a mainstream version of the scene. the kooks naive or ooh la music videos capture the vibe specifically. electroclash goes into this, adult cc, uffie, vitalic, health, dave clark etc but for the more underground, look at the music video for the skallywags - paint the old street black. i feel like this is authentic and right now we are looking back at almost a caricature of indie sleaze. the indie SLEAZE is the grungy rockstar girlfriend kate moss and pete doherty, effie from skins thats the specific aesthetic. this is being mixed with all the indie aesthetics of the time in this revival im in my mid 20s and i was running one of the more popular underground indie blogs on tumblr at the time, thats how i met my husband lmao whatever but im naturally getting back into this aesthetic ive always kept in the background.

Majestic hair

dear algorithm, pls recommend more videos like this to me. thanks

0:10 Cowgirl clue made it yayyy

witch house or indie sleaze

☠️ yoooo how did it become harder 💯...thats crazy

Nice hoodie

You forgot how people became famous out of the blue such as Cory Kennedy

No mention of Aldn and maybe a little hyperpop influence in the indie sleeve revival ?

my life 🙏🏽

Who remembers The Hipster Runoff? 😂

4:25 literally my job during this time. Wow I was dialed in. WTF happened

I love ur hair man :)

Would you say it's like luxurious cowboy?

0:11 does Antoine know what all these albums are i top left is cowgirl clue but i dont recognize the rest

whats the name of the outro song?

Yo tengo 28 y si recuerdo bien todo eso estaba entre la pubertad/adolescencia me encantaba y que se este hablando ahora de esto me hace sentir rara pero amo ❤

Nice vid