Sources to both Yoshi-P Interviews: multiplayer.it/articoli/final-fantasy-14-dawntrail-naoki-yoshida-ci-parla-di-narrazione-di-design-e-del-bilanciamento.html hardcoregamer.com/yoshi-p-talks-raid-woes-field-operation-in-final-fantasy-xiv-dawntrail/

I can’t stress enough to the FFXIV community, how awesome Quazii is. He’s been a blessing to the WoW community.

I believe it was in his interview with Mr Happy that YoshiP said again that in 8.0 they will focus more on improving job Identity and deeper job redesigns. This xpac was largely focused on the graphics updates and bringing back lots of group content.

“We’re gonna focus on making jobs unique and different” *makes tanks even more identical in combat*

Great content, thanks for summary! Don’t have time to keep with all those interviews.

The issue about the current system that has affected me is the better you become at the game, the worse it feels to play. You eventually start to realize wait there's only really like 4 jobs in this game, tank, dps, healer, and BLU. All jobs feel the same after you realize they're all built around that 2 minute buff window and the same reused boss mechanics with different art assets to disguise the fact they're all fundamentally the same. And it doesn't help that the jobs rotation and abilities is built to follow a strict 3 phase system. Opener > filler > burst. It feels like I'm just pressing a strict sequence of buttons which doesn't feel engaging at all once your brain builds that muscle memory and all you're really doing at that point is staring at the colorful orange, red, purple, green telegraphs that pop up and avoiding them. Now I'm not saying like it's completely easy, but it's just too much of the same thing. It's like watching paint dry, but which color of paint am I gonna watch dry today. I understand I'm just complaining, but my frustration comes from the idea that I absolutely love this game but it's just holding itself back from realizing it's full potential in the form of mundane and outdated combat systems. I get that the game is running on old systems that might make these type of changes incredibly difficult, but I'm really really hoping they can truly elevate what they have now.

I just love Yoshi-P. He's here to hear *all* concerns, and I'm just so grateful that he's willing to try and make improvements. We'll see where it goes.

Didnt expect an italian outlet to get an interview, but it does mean that the game has grown greatly in popularity there

Amazing creator, saving me so much time!

In media tour there was an interview by Vadal(spanish videogame media since 1997).They ask about the spanish tranlation, Vandal show him the offical forum were the petition was created not long ago to yoshiP and he ask to the Goblal community Producer (toshio) have a look to the forums. Square Enix is ​​now open to localizing ffxiv into Spanish, thanks to the new director Takashi, he want to bring all next SE titles to most ppl posible.

I don't think the success of FFXIV or Endwalker really has anything to do with the simplification of jobs. FFXIV's popularity stems largely from its story, from its style, and from its community far more than its combat system. It's true that there are probably far more players who just want something flashy that doesn't take a lot of time or effort to learn and enjoy the key parts of FFXIV, and there's nothing wrong with that. But I don't think these people joined FFXIV or stay subbed because jobs are as simple as they are, and I don't think these same people would be unhappy with the state of the game if job complexity were something closer to what say Stormblood had to offer. Because even when jobs were harder or more complex, getting through the story, through your roulettes, through most of the content in general has never been something that job complexity has walled. Even when we had harder alliance raids like Orbonne or Weeping City, players weren't wiping because their DPS was bad from not playing their jobs optimally and failing enrages. Wipes happened because the mechanics were tougher. All in all, I do hope that these talks of more job identity are true, and that 8.0 will feel like a huge step forward for job design. I just wish we didn't have to wait a full expansion, because 2.5 years is a long time to ask for us to wait for something that's been talked about since as early as Shadowbringers.

Very nicely done Quazii! Your points are well taken. A large MMO must appeal to a diverse player base. Think of it as a great banquet. Some like it spicy, some do not. There are dishes at the banquet to satisfy each. On job design there are several ways to approach this. The first is to have different jobs for different tastes. That solves the core problem, but results in large differences in how often different jobs are played. Look at job frequency in raid statistics. This also leads to some players feeling excluded because their favorite job isn’t optimal for certain content. This leads to calls for jobs to be “fixed”, even though some players love them as they are. The other considerations use two principles, “easy to learn, hard to master” and “jobs change in some content”. PVP is an example of the latter. I'm wondering if the second principle might be applied to some raid content. Combining all of this is the elegant answer, but a huge challenge for developers. Master craftsmanship when it is achieved. I love this game and appreciate the sincere and thoughtful efforts of the developers.

I've heard similar statements the past 10 years. I have a hard time believing they are going to step away from the streamlining they did.

If 7.0 is their attempt to provide a new baseline for classes so that from 7.1 onwards and new expansions can begin rebuilding and re-iterating on class identity then I am fine with playing something simpler in the short term to begin seeing more unique class expression in the future. Its as the said. This expansion was focusing on graphics and raid design. Going forward it'l be job focused.

always fun to listen to you while waking up. Aside that, I agree. The minor group that complains are usually the ones that are really number crunching and someone like me, i take fighting games serious to look up moves and combos and strats but i dont do the frame data for myself on occasions. Same with FFXIV i play to have fun relax and the occasional challenges. I dont have a group i run with really so i don't savage content or ultimate for that matter, and just hope for some interesting dungeons to get drops and the cool looking trials along the way.

I've made many comments on this already, but you made so many interesting points! Last one, I swear. I think that subscriber count does not accurately reflect that FF has made strides in its combat design, because there are far too many factors that leads into an increase in players. - One not talked about enough: with Endwalker, FF14 has the most generous free trial of any mmo and probably any video game ever. So much so that the lack of basic communication features are far outweighed by the sheer amount of content you get to play through. - The pandemic, of course - There has been a huge wave of qol improvements across the board - Trusts make the game aside from trials and raids very solo player friendly - pvp is greatly improved, providing the players into that evergreen content - Endwalker makes the end of a saga which people want to see the finale to. Dissatisfaction in one area definitely doesn't make the game bad nor is the combat so bad that it justifies people leaving in spades. So the game will continue to grow, but that doesn't mean it's not itself a pain point.

Agreed on the job identity being important.

I do want to say I an very happy to hear they are going to change things. I really didn't enjoy things quite as much in Endwalker compared to Shadowbringers(when I started). I really hope all goes well

I think the job design needs to come first because I think it would fit together better knowing what melee/ranged uptime looks like before designing jobs. It's a lot easier to build more uptime into fights than it is retroactively fit jobs and make them all feel different with similar uptime windows

To be fair about ppl complaining but still high sub numbers, I complain yet I still play and pay my sub every month, because at the end of the day no other MMO combat is as fun to me as playing random jobs in ultimates.

I really hope we start seeing some job reworks in the 8.x patches, given how barebones some are, it'd be the time to experiment. I'm thinking of dark knight for example. They could do something like turn abyssal drain back into a spell, dealing less damage than flood and not granting darkside but healing you. It'd add a small risk of failure if you abuse it and then are short on MP to use TBN or refresh darkside. They could make that new combo be useable at the cost of darkside, with a slower GCD, and be free (and restoring MP/blood) and faster when using delirium. Maybe Living Shadow could give ressources based on the skills it uses (give you some MP when using quietus and bloodspiller, and carve & spit, stuff like that)

I just want the difficulty from Heavensward and Stormblood back for both jobs and normal raids.

Very interesting to see other's opinion about the jobs. But I have no strong opinion about how they should change the jobs so I can only tell my current experience and thought with how they are now... I enjoy casual raiding but I'm not skilled enough to use jobs such as Monk and Black Mage on them. Actually, I always use physical ranged (mostly Machinist and Dancer) on progs. But they are my favorite jobs of their role so far, specifying Melee and Caster DPS ( lets see if picto or viper will change it soon 👀). Although I still play with these jobs a lot because I usually use them on Roulettes and others contents because most of them are easy. And by playing with these jobs makes these casual contest more fun to me. So my only opinion is that I would prefer to see some jobs hard to play with and others easier. I'm totally fine by using Monk only in casual contents and Dancer for hard ones. Now about making these hard jobs be more rewarding gameplay-wise looks hard to balance? Personaly, learning how to do decent rotation with Monk which is a job that I like a lot is rewarding enough. To think when I was a sprout I gave up on Monk and was sad about it and now I use it a lot in casual contents makes me happy.

I haven't played healer, but would it make sense to have some Aoe heals and specific heals also do damage? Would that be an enjoyable experience?

From my perspective, the people who just want to mash buttons will be happy mashing buttons whether the jobs are deep or shallow, there is no need to try and design for them specifically. Casual players survived Heavensward and Stormblood. We don't need to bring back HW-era failstates, I just wanna have some more decision making and reactivity in the jobs so I'm not falling asleep in normal modes.

I couldn't possibly receive happier news, shame it'll take till 8.0 but I hope it really does happen. I specially love the point about making jobs have their own strengths and weaknesses. If a NIN has really good ranged options and MNK has none, don't give it more ranged options, make their melee damage especially deadly to make up for it, align the kit with the job fantasy, that kind of thing. You don't need to take it to the extreme as to make certain jobs completely useless in certain content but people should have their glory moments where only their job could do something that way. And similarly people who take the time to get good at multiple jobs should be rewarded in their versatility as well.

i want healers to be more complex tbh. Healers now is too boring. No procs, no mechanics to follow just spam heal buttons without rotation or do 1 button dps...

Yeah I'm one of those that love positionals. I'm constantly moving around the boss or battlefield even when I don't have a need to because it just makes the game more enjoyable for me, so positionals give me a direct reason to do that + rewards me for it. My favorite classes uses positionals, so when I heard Monk was getting theirs lessened, I was actually sad about it. Then Dragoon, my main, is now losing some of theirs. I get why it's happening, and yeah that means easier upkeep of optimum dps I guess, but I was hoping they'd just keep it so that the reward for doing the positional is just slightly higher dps instead of removing them entirely. That meant those who didn't do them still were capable in their team, but those who did were, again, rewarded for keeping the rhythm going. Another thing was knowing when to use True North. Figuring out the best moment to do so against a boss that likes to wiggle around felt great. Now, I don't think it'll be needed as much which disappoints me, but it is what it is.

I'm trying to be positive but as a player since 2.0 beta, it's evident to me that the game I once fell in love with doesn't exist anymore. It gives me hope hearing the interviews and the statements saying "8.0 will fix everything" but I've been hearing that since Shadowbringers. Talk is free and until I see the actual actions backing up these promises I think Dawntrail will be my last expansion.

Just wait another three years graaaaahhhhhhh

I'm in the camp of wanting raid damage buffs removed to allow more difference in jobs but I 100% understand why they didn't drastically change everything in DT. New story arc they need to hook people into, the graphical update and I hope what they said about fight mechanics being more varied and harder at the baseline is true as well. That said, I really hope by the next expansion they really give the jobs a shake up so they aren't so close in how they function because some are very similar to a point it can feel like, why even have the ability to switch between jobs if they're gonna be so similar in timings, tools and just general play style.

I just want yoshi p to make big weapons feel satisfying when we use skills and it also means improve the sounds of the hits. I want him to put mass on enemies so we feel like we are hitting something instead of hitting air.

I prefer skill expression in class design, but I won't get turned off is a class is too hard or too easy. I'm a fighting game player. If something looks cool and makes me feel cool, I play it. However, the problem I have with FFXIV is that everything makes me feel the same. There's no power fantasy being fulfilled in this game with the exception of Monk, Ninja, Black Mage and Machinist (in this current expansion). Machinist is a very easy class, however I think it fulfills the power fantasy and class identity very well. I mention this to give an example that identity =/= complexity. I'm afraid Monk will be losing its power fantasy while they attempt to keep the identity and Black Mage is doing the opposite in DT. Ninja is removing the not fun stuff and leaning more into the identity and the fantasy of the job and Machinist is mostly staying on path. I'm hoping Bard is one that joins the well-designed class list this expansion as the changes look positive. I also feel like there was a missed opportunity with Viper to make its identity be about stance dancing and make you want to manually go in and out of 2 swords, but it just appears to be do damage until you change forms and then do more damage. Which is what Reaper does, but faster. I'm not saying bring back stance dances to everything, but there's no reason why SE couldn't have made Viper fulfill that missing power fantasy and class identity. On the other hand, Pictomancer appears to be very inspired with its identity and power fantasy. It's not a class that I'll play a lot, but it actually has me interested in playing it and experiencing the fantasy and identity of the class.

Overall, a very good response. As much as I loved SHB summoner, and still do, a friend of mine always found it to be a bit much and gave up on playing that job. hopefully they're able to find a balance between a good skill floor and a satisfying skill ceiling. goodness knows it's not easy.

It’s WoW all over again where I feel like as a long term player of 9-10 years I helped “set up” the game by supporting it for years and now it has been changed and neutered to appease new and bad players and now it’s not for me anymore. It sucks. The new players should need to adapt to the game and long time players, not the other way around.

I can sympathize that it must be so hard to balance all these fights with 20+ jobs. Seems better to balance fights around the ROLES and make sure each job in a given role has the same potential for damage and utility if played well. Field operations are a better venue for exploring the strengths of each individual job imo.

Yeah.... sorry. I am not a hardcore raider, though I have done savage raids in the past. The jobs suck right now. I think it is ludicrous to suggest that it is only a "vocal minority" that is complaining about jobs, since the many people I interact with feel the same. Casuals tend to main their one or two classes. So they do not care. But making every class "accessible" in terms of skill level has ruined the game. Listen, maybe it hurts someone's fee fees, BUT NOT EVERY CLASS IS FOR YOU. Some may be too hard, or skill ceiling too high, and you need time and skill to master them. AND THAT IS OK. That would be one step in making the game much, much better. Tanks and Healers need a complete overhaul. Stop listening to people who bitch and moan about "their" tank not being at the top of dps charts. Further separate the "main tank" and "off tank" roles. "Shield healers" and "regen" healers. Stop giving every class everything. My hotbars are almost identical for all tanks and healers, and the difference is basically cosmetic at this point. You already have a game that has plenty of things to play for casual players. Make more hard content and classes.

The way they made BLM paradox take the binding of the fire/blizzard 1 would be a good way to deal with some combos, sure it makes it spammy on that one button but is the button bloat that important. The concentration should always be on the boss mechanics not the class ones imo

As in most things, the healthiest refelection of job distribution would be a bell curve. Have a few really easy and really complex jobs with the standard distribution/complexity in the middle at the top of the curve. Reward the complexity at the back end and take stress out at the front end to welcome newer players. The meat of jobs should not be about "reducing player stress", that's aweful in my opinon, and wil reduce the reason players will want to play, as there is no way for players to grow with the game. Thanks for the video !

In my opinion, the rigidity of the buff window is what makes jobs rigid and hard to balance, because every job has to be able to get its strongest skills in that 20 second window every 2 mins. If you remove every 8 man buff from the game and increase potencies to compensate, the jobs do not lose so much other than a cooldown to press every 2 mins. However, it opens up the ability to change when jobs burst, or if they would rather focus on sustain damage. We know the 2 min window is the problem, because jobs like Paladin and Summoner had to change to properly conform to this window. The focus should be, in my opinion, on creating support job identities. Ast cards, dnc dance partner, DRG dragon sight and most single target buffs are all good ways to create unique support abilities for the party. And they are linked to job identity, so they serve a purpose. You would think the 2 min window is not the main problem and it's that you need to simply add things to downtime, but that is not the case. For example, now that AST draws two different decks every minute, you would think you'd use one damage card on odd minute and the other on the even. But AST mains already have determined that you must hold your odd min card til the even window, making the job more rigid.

if the jobs become unique like in the past ppl will start to run the optimal comps and the gatekeeping beings. poor yoshi-p, not an easy task at all, i want to see what he will pull off

So what about what they did with SMN and SCH. It started as a pet job.. it drew in people like me to play the game.. then with the sudden change in EW, i felt betrayed and alienated.

How about 3 versions of each class, casual variant, challenging variant and custom variant. For easy play difficult play and fun tinkering play. A lot of work for the team but would satisfy pretty much everyone, maybe? Looking forward to Dawntrail.

didnt yoshi p already addressed this before in a PLL? They said they made the 2 minute meta because of player feedback of how tedious it is to align raid buffs. And i remember him saying the community needs to have a consensus of what direction they want the jobs to take.

As long as "more complex" doesn't equal " more difficult" then I'll support it. Not everything needs to be "difficult" to be enjoyed. I'm not saying everything needs to be easy either. No matter what happens at that point, there is likely to be a divide in the community. I just want to be able to focus on learning mechanics etc in content without being overwhelmed by a job being "overly complex". Not all of us who play are Gigachads or even want to be. Some of us just want to play the game, and do the content without having to perform mental gymnastics in order to be simply "mediocre" at the jobs we play and nuclear physicists in order to enjoy them lol

They should make more mechanics like the sword grab in tsusano in raids where tanks actually have to protect the party. As a tank main that feels great. But then you will have the tanks that cry about DPS complaining

Was an Ubergamer my whole MMO career (99-2010ish). I liked hard stuff. MMOs felt like they were getting dumber and dumber as time went on (because it became copy WOW). I have the utmost respect for Yoshi-P and I think that we do need a bit more uniqueness in the jobs. Homogenized playstyles can be a not horrible thing. I think 80/20 or 75/25 (same/uniqueness) would be plenty fine for 14. The other side of the ditch is that if you make classes too unique spreadsheet nerds will just say "W/X/Y/Z is best combo" and then you get people only playing those classes.

I don't really get their approach... Jobs are foundational, and so it's far more important that they are fun and engaging at every major malmstone (levels 30/50/60/70/80/90/100), even when the content is boring. The content largely exists in a vacuum, and good job design will make a run with each job feel fun and distinct, even if the content itself is bad. The inverse is not the case unless you go out of your way to make more CLLs or Dalriadas, but even then, the mileage is far lesser to a job focus. whether you adjust content before or not, it won't save you from having to readjust it all after. IMO what they should do is hold an open beta throughout the 7.x series that any subscriber (no FTs, sorry) can participate in. The idea will be to pick some casual dungeons/trials, and at the end of the run to prompt participants with a survey to fill out to provide feedback on their experience. The first stage should target level 30, and at this stage, most jobs should be accessible to newbies, but also have their gimmicks developed sufficiently to satisfy veterans who get bored out of their minds from pressing 1-1-1 ad nauseam. And they'd go through each major malmstone in order, trying to make the jobs fun and engaging (and hopefully also unique), at each stage. Dungeons I'd recommend to minimise spoilers for new subscribers participating 30: Haukke Manor 50: Lost City of Amdapor 60: Xelphatol 70: The Temple Of The Fist 80: The Twinning 90: Alzadaal's Legacy or Smileton 100: TBD

Single biggest thing I hope they bring back is releasing 2 four mans per patch. I get that it was a ton of work for the dev team, but for the players it makes Expert rou a little less stale because you have four instances that you can get vs just two that you get sick of seeing by the end of the patch.

My only issue with FFXIV is the button bloat. It’s why I left the game after Shadowbringers as my wrists were in shambles. I am hoping to return for Dawntrail after I complete Endwalker of course but that’s my one concern I’d love to see addressed in the future.

More stressful content is the exact opposite of what I want, personally. And I've never played with anyone who wants that since the game released.

In the next expansion lol

I mean yoshi p basically said dawntrail is in a way a new 10 year plan. Basically a reboot from arr. Im pretty excited to see whats in store

I just don’t believe him. He’s been kicking this can since 5.0. The exact same complaints I had back then are the same complaints I have now almost 5 years later. They don’t care. If they did they wouldn’t be waiting until 8.0. The job design team is totally different from the battle content team. They can listen all day but they won’t make any changes. FFXIV is the kind of game that refuses to grow and innovate. There’s zero chance they’ll change anything. The fact he thinks Eureka is the first field operation when really it was Diadem that was a complete mess is wild. He and his team have been doing the same thing over and over and can’t get off the rails at this point. Sad.

I dont get the issue with 2 min meta lol what else should we do lmao stand there such a weird complaint

I think as time goes on the dev team should become more comfortable with power differences between jobs. If eventually we have something like 30+ different options I think most players would have backup jobs and it wouldn't be too bad to have some jobs just be a clear better choice or combo for certain encounters. Give the players more horizontal flexibility. Bring back piercing damage and stuff like that.

Grown to hate door bosses in savage raid tiers. Much prefer fights with transitional phases…if said fight is meant to be a ‘finale’ or conclusion to a tier. As far as making melee easier….I agree. Targets/Bosses having smaller hit boxes in the past (along with multiple positionals for melee jobs)…was the logic used for having those jobs deal out more dmg than physical ranged cause they had an easier time maintaining uptime. They made it easier for melee to maintain uptime over the past few years (as well as adding more support and ‘utility’ functions to them), but more or less didn’t change the balance in terms of dps between what melee can do and what phys ranged can do.

Wait. Players are attracted to jobs that have positionals because they have positionals? Is that for real? Or did I misunderstand.

I think the only jobs that play similar are tanks and healers.

I always think the challenges should be from the content (bosses, ect) but not from the combat. Combat should be fun, interesting and feeling good… it should not be a hassle, a big challenge, a hurdle or some kind of difficulty that players must overcome. CDs of combat skills should not be too long either. All combat skills should be ready every rotation with the exception of some emergency skills (skills that keep you safe). Between a skill that will be available once every 2 rotations, I prefer the skill to be ready every rotation. The Potency can be reduced by half and it’s still okay. It will feel better and smoother and less a headache…

idk majority of jobs are pretty much the same. i think only like astro got major changes. outside of melee gap closers not doing damage anymore, the rest of jobs pretty much are more of the same.

Unlike WoW developers, Yosh-P plays this game at a high level and understands what's good for the game. Gotta love that man! The passion and hard works he puts into FFXIV (and everyone else involved in the development, of course), is what makes it so great.

Need to also pair down the number of abilities for keyboard and mouse players as well. Honestly, I believe it is easier to have all these abilities on the controller, as you can have easier access to 48 key binds than you could with the keyboard / mouse (less finger gymnastics). Honestly, what gamer really wants to have over 30 key binds? Hitting 30 different buttons really doesn’t make the combat more fun.

Good vid Quazii, believe you are on point, I am almost certain they are indeed the vocal minority and their view is skewed because some spend more time playing the game weekly than people do work (40+ hours). Most people when they come from work, if they play 2-3 hours that same day it is a win for them. Mastery of the game among other things changes drastically if they played 5+ hours a day and if they care for high end or not. It's important to listen to the raiders and content creators but they are the minority. When I started the game, I was so bad at it I actually thought some of the later ARR content was already starting to become challenging with Black Mage and I was having fun. Now I could run that content blindfolded and fall asleep (obvious exageration to make a point)... how can I possibly have good insight on what the casual and new players enjoy, and that's what people need to take into account for when they critique job design and difficulty, the louder voices are neither casual or new, the silent majority is like most games no doubt casual oriented and they pay most of the bills. Also, difficulty does not mean necessarily the number of buttons you have to press.. that may help give job identity but external factors, like mechanics, should be the core of the game's difficulty, not learning how to play piano on the keyboard. At least, in my opinion. :) (Granted, that's a balancing act the dev needs to take into account, because some people do like more buttons)

They dumb down jobs to get more non-mmo's players in. It's why we have npc dungeon runs now.

My personal take on mechanics and classes boils down to them updating the game's engine. There is many mechanics that are fun in paper but a nightmare in execution due to the current "snapshotting" system. For example the orbs in E6S, damn dog still haunts me with how damn rng it always felt even when we were reclearing for weeks and knew the mechanic perfectly. As for classes, I am down for less buttons with more power behind them, this is something WoW did right in some of it's expansions, like as a rogue I could use cloak of shadows to negate or speed up some mechanics giving my group a slight advantage. I don't care about more lenient enrage timers, they don't really matter after week one and only really affect low - mid skill casual players. At least on Savage and Extreme, Ultimates should stay as they are. Finally I wish they reworked sub stats. Tenacity being worthless and forced upon you in the final relic stage for tanks is just a huge ugh. And personally with so many jobs getting huge potency skills I don't want rng-sus deciding if we did a lot of damage or A LOT!! of damage.

I just find that the community tends to give nonsensical feedback. Like for example, people gripe about MNKs not having ranged attacks, and now they are getting a couple of new ones. This doesn't make sense from both the game play and stylistic perspectives, because the number of times that you can't reach melee range of a target is small, and even for those times being able to do a couple of ranged attacks means jack for overall DPS. And for stylistic purposes there are better and more imaginative ways to maintain the monk job identity. For example, the MNK could have an ability that applies Pressure Point on a target as they retreat, which then stores up damage the longer that you do not damage the target, and activates the moment they return to hit the target. And this is a concept that already exists in PVP!

The problem with FFXIV job design is that they do feel unique while you're leveling up. At some point, after X expansions, your jobs gets given passives that "ease up" your need to deal with the job's mechanics. A couple more stacks for that job mechanic, a longer timer for that buff, etc... So in the end, you have so many things that help you not have to deal with your job mechanics, that it's possible to create a rock solid rotation where you don't even feel like you have a job mechanic. You just do the buttons in order and repeat, like every other job. If you follow the order, you don't need to track anything and everything will line up perfectly. With exceptions, of course.

Which is a good thing that I've been excited for. They're clearly trying to pursue job identity again so that's a good thing

The way current job design is being handled is the single biggest mark against FFXIV for me at the moment, that isn't how little Housing we have. I need my jobs to actually stimulate my brain. If a dungeon is going well as a tank or healer I am just hitting the same few buttons over and over with no variation, with no depth, no randomness and no real management. Even when doing normal raids or trials, there's so little to actually make the fight give me any enjoyment. Once I know how a fight works, it's just execution, and therefore it's once again back to spamming my filler spell or 1/2/3. I don't know what form it should take, as I'm not a game designer or a dev with knowledge or experience of game balance, but there's a reason even with all of it's flaws I still play WoW. It's combat is just superior in terms of actually stimulating gameplay with skill expression, variation, and variety between it's classes and specializations. Making the game easier and more accessible for casual players should and HAS come in making the content attached to the MSQ easier like story dungeons and trials. They went overboard with what they've done with Jobs.

I play on controller despite being on PC for years - I started on PS4 so all my muscle memory is locked into controller play and FF XiV's controller support is extremely good! it feels natural and fluid in combat. But Hotbar bloat was becoming a problem when you got to level 90 - so even just having those two hotbar spaces freed up by the combo button addition will make a big difference, for me at least - and I'm so happy they allowed you to disable it for players who don't want it because I'm a big supporter for this game being for casual players and hardcore raiders alike. And as long as they stop tilting the scales more towards casual then it'll work well. It's what makes this game amazing compared to WoW - you can just relax and play, socialise, have fun with people, casually do content or party up and prog Savage tiers on MINE or Ultimates for serious gameplay. I feel like with WoW and it's why I never want to touch it (that and I will never support Blizzard) is that I'd have to be switched on 100% all the time, with no downtime - and constantly be flamed with XBox Kid language for like not having Addle on a trash mob or something...

Hmmm eureka wasn’t 1st “field operation” content … old diadem was

I’ll believe it when I see it. We are now on the third irritation of ShB job design.

Compared to every other mmo I have played ff14 is by far the most respectful of your time and money. Love it.

For me, what i have issue with, is people conflate simple jobs = too easy and needs more buttons. You can have have fun, flexible, and solid interactions with other abilities with less buttons, button bloat is quite annoying. WoW does that well. Where your cooldowns actually change your playstyle. People often think we need more buttons to make a job more fun. However the biggest issue, or an issue most of us have is homogeneous jobs. Im glad yoshi p understands this. Most people over all like things to be easier. Which is why summoner is one of the most played caster jobs in raids,not just because of raise, and they know this even though a lot of the community shits on it.

Summoner needs the most work. It's my favourite job and theme wise it's the best fitting job with the most lore and is the oldest job in FFXIV. It's just so utterly boring there's no reason to play it if you are after having fun.

I find it odd that this post is about the jobs, and homogeneity, they want to fix it, but decide the fix the battle encounters, which I thought were just fine? I get how the two are intertwined and tweaking them simultaneously would be a problem. But if the battles are basically OK except for the job stuff, why not fix the job stuff first? Literally seconds later in the video there's details on this :)

😡Hearing this as a SMN player….YOU HAD ONE ☝🏿 JOB MAN!! Just ONE ☝🏿

I do wish they would do some unique mechanics for healers. Just casting your offensive spells isn't all that invigorating. If the best time healing in this game is when everything falls apart, then that's not good design for one of the 3 roles of the game. This is where I have an issue with how much healing they put into the kits of the dps and tanks. Warrior is especially bad and is incredibly boring to heal in content since they're so self efficient. I wish they put more tools into the tank's kit that didn't step onto the feet of healers. Warrior didn't need any more healing in its already overblown kit. This doesn't mean that tanks can't have healing in their kit, but warrior just takes it way too far. In all honesty, I'd probably say gunbreaker might be the most balanced right now for healing in content. I would take a look at paladin if there weren't enough clemency spammers wasting time and mana overhealing with clemency ;otherwise, they feel pretty fair when they actually trust their healer to do their job. Dark knight is definitely a bit too sparse with the amount of healing in their kit, and they could use a little bit more. As for the dps, the big offenders are summoner and dancer. Although monk's earth's reply really irritates me for dawntrial and reapers weirdly given aoe regen when their shield pops just feels off from their kit. If they were self contained to just them, then I wouldn't feel so bad about it. The auto regen of phoenix and curing waltz probably should be toned down some. Maybe just make curing waltz effect dancer and their dance partner with maybe a bonus cure potency when partnered up. For summoner, all I can think of right now is go with how bard and monk are right now and increase the amount of healing done by healing actions while possibly keeping the regen to themself. That said, I really like how both monk and bard are with how they help the healers heal more instead of healing for them. At the end of the day, I don't play a healer just to feel like a crapper caster. With all of these healing abilities being placed in the toolkits of the tanks and dps, why am I as a healer going to have to struggle to find any worth in the abundance of healing in my toolkit. Saying this means that they would have to adjust the design of fights, but I would be fine with that as long as I can actually do my role and do some healing outside of someone screwing up or from unavoidable damage be dealt by the boss. I would really appreciate some mechanics that would let me use more of my healing for the party since they give the healers so much of it. Split the party up like some of the raids in alexander so the healer can keep their partner they alive, or give adds that need healing spells to heal them. They've done this before and maybe some more was done in the higher difficutly content, but I don't participate in those content and would like to see some placed in the normal content.

The jobs, IMHO, I pretty stale, but do to the skill graphical artist ism up to par, compare to how amateur modders are able to put out. DT has , based on the trailer, expanded the aesthetic; so that's a plus.

Boss fight design has gotta be a nightmare for them. Like I miss old trials designs to a point. Nothing says hype like how Shiva entered phase 2 where everyone is frozen and the music shifts after she steps on the ice and snaps her fingers, but at the same time.... man that down time and completely ruining your rotation really really really sucks lmao.

The friends of mine most complaining about the 2 minute meta making the game stale are usually found raiding 4-6 days out of the week.

I think another issue is that MMO players tend to not distinguish between proper skill expression, and, like, rotational chores. Outside of very few instances, something like positional is not a clever use of skill and does not take skill, it's just an annoying chore on top of what you're already doing. Some people, for whatever reason, do enjoy this chore, but to me, removing them outright wouldn't be dumbing the game down anymore than allowing mana to autofill instead of being only be filled at aetherytes (hello 1.0!) was dumbing it down. Some bullshit that makes things a little more annoying is not necessarily raising the skill ceiling as much as it might be raising chore bloat.

I’ll believe it when I see it. I’m one of the people who’ve been upset with job design since 5.0. Tank and healer mains have been giving feedback nonstop since 2019 and the devs have tripled down. Worth noting I work about 60 hours a week and even I don’t want to mindlessly mash buttons. I want a challenge. If I wanted to mindlessly press buttons and watch stuff happen on screen I’d play cookie clicker.

Devs have wasted a decade practically ignoring giving Summoner more summons. At least with that job, I have next to zero confidence they'll ever make it into a true Summoner. It'll more than likely remain Bahamut Mage for another decade. 😢

You can make everyone happy lol Make monk with heavy postionals and make drg with no positonals there you go both sides of the coin are happy a job with tons of postionals and some with none you can make everyone happy its very simple to do

Eureka and bozja I like both but I prefer eureka’s take because I felt like I needed to talk with others more to work together spawning NMs and even if I didn’t wanna farm NMs I could go do side stuff like bunnies to get rare mounts to sell. My biggest complaints about Bozja critical engagements were a bit too tedious to do with others and the big raid style content is tedious to do to get through when next to no one does it makes me wish they were just alliance raids at least you’d have duty finder

I just want a Chemist job!

I fully understand where people are coming from when it comes to their argument regarding job "homogenization", if my focus is looking through the confines of a narrow tunnel. This is the problem with that conversation. It's overly concentrated. I'll keep this example brief, but I never feel confused as to what job I'm playing. SMN doesn't make me feel as if I'm playing a RDM. NIN doesn't feel like I'm playing RPR. If that doesn't register, then imagine playing any game with multiple classes using only your base attack while ignoring every other skill you've unlocked and then arguing that every character class plays the same. There will always be those who look for arguments to substantiate what they already believe and they will rest on that hill.

I've always thougt the homogenization has gonna on for too long. Sure it makes things balanced. But for me its ok for things to be unbalanced as long as things arent so similar(jobs in this case). I actually miss the old warrior with its high HP for example. It needed to be improved, not removed!

the worst thing about ffxiv is that they do not compensate the difficulty of a job being played, a good example would be ast, with all those extra button pressing, your overall dps with buff included is still lower than a white mage output by far, that's just unfair for the extra work effort put into the mechanic

I don't really believe Yoshi-P. I'm sure he means what he's saying, but this has been a trend since Stormblood, that everything in the game has been made simple and easy and uniform, and no amount of complaint has changed that trend. Even in Dawntrail, the trend has continued.

So I won’t be playing dawntrail. Got it.

Mechanics are fine but there is just a lot of job bloat. I'd rather fewer distinct actions and more complex boss mechanics - but that also requires being more liberal with thier "packages."

jobs can be distinct and rewarding if they actually have a playstyle based on the job description or actual mechanics. In melee, only ninja has a unique job mechanic, in range phy dps its bard, for range magic dps its BLM, for healers, THEY ALL PLAY THE SAME, for tanks THEY ALL PLAY THE SAME THEY'RE ALL WARRIORS WILL FELL CLEAVE WINDOWS. A good example of job mechanic is DRK's offense stance back heavensward. U ACTUALLY FEEL LIKE PLAYING A DARKNIGHT FROM THE FINAL FANTASY FRANCHISE. Job identity is not hard, they have a ton of reference from older games, the problem is integrating it with the raids, and i understand that. BUT PLEASE SQUENIX, STOP MAKING EVERY JOB A SKIN OF THE ROLE THEY ARE IN.

Don't forget everyone. The dev team can't hear your thoughts. Speaking up in official forums with legitimate issues is the best way to tell them as a collective, "we have something to say."

Its not that annoying if you don't play every single job. If you only play a few jobs theres enough difference in play mechanics.

If no big job changes until 8.0, then some people will have rolled with basically the same rotation for 6+ years. I feel like they just don't have an answer yet so they're playing for time. This "people will get confused" thing doesn't sound real to me. People aren't toddlers, if the game becomes fresher and less stale both in battle content and job diversity at the same time, they'll probably learn to deal with that terrible fate.

So jobs are designed based on raids mechanics ... 90% of ffxiv players do not raid ... i see a kind of paradox there ...

I think the FFXIV community, at least the vocal minority, are very quick to defend button bloat. Other MMOs operate with much fewer buttons and can still be difficult and the classes can still feel unique. In FFXIV they can make fights with more complex mechanics in order to maintain difficulty, rather than have you play piano on your keyboard. I wouldn't even be averse to bringing back more positionals if they reduce the number of buttons.