bro just told us how to beat GenG

Everything he said was completely wrong the right answer is way easier he got a gf

This is the ultimate proof you‘re steps ahead of every valorant analyst in the scene.

A problem with a simple solution, make barriers for that map, i cant stand playing it

Moore Frank Taylor Brian Lewis Brian

Well, make a video on EDG winning Champs now.

I love your mathematical content

Edg won champs so

Platoon, you (and your team, if you have one) are doing great things. Your hardwork will pay off. You deserve more recognition for what you are doing.

Can you make a video about aspas? To prove whether or not hes a baiter statistically

I think there's a bit of an underrated mental aspect to the strategy. It's like you are just getting the round over with and focusing up on the next round to come. You get a brief moment of hilarity at the absurdity of your strategy which could also be a morale boost. Whether it's backed with statistics or not, if G2 had won the game afterwards we would be biased towards looking at these intangible benefits which we assume to not exist because of the outcome alone.

Good work on the stats. Too often, people let the available stats modify the kind of analysis that they end up doing (eg looking only at FK, FD when maybe looking at the first 2 or 3 gunfights would be more effective) But figuring out the kind of analysis you want to do, THEN finding the data to check if it actually lines up feels so much more effective

lothar bringing up points and being wrong lmao.....i hope i dont see lothar anymore in pro tournaments

also, controllers are technically your second duelists after using their smokes, you cant expect your initiators or sentinels to die first since they have so much util.

god awful video

Can i ask where do you get these data from?

Who tf is lothar btw 😂😂 he can yapp but we dont give a fuck

dont you think its a lot harder to win with pistols on abyss especially though? so many wide angles to shoot from

Dude really got butt hurt over a strat xD sad

Lothar is braindead its like he is the type of guy who will say that lurking and gaining info is a " cowards" way of playing the game

Someone hire this guy as an analyst asap

best suicide prevention video I've ever seen

was sucuide in split / haven allowed ?

The last comment you made is already enough of an argument to consider this a horrible strat. Down a map, down by 5 rounds and you forfeit another round. However, thanks for the stats work to show it even better.

Whether G2 ecoed them or jumped off or what not, it was also pretty much a comp diff so Lev would've won Abyss anyways

lothar is actually r3tarded

The strat isnt bad certainly not disrespectful but it is a bad strat in this situation many teams are so afraid of taking risks winning a round is sometimes greater than going up in the scoreboard the best example is SEN vs TH match Boo makes a crazy graffiti level play with 20 secs left 1 player dead and 1 with 10 hp round in which teams wouldve saved similarly few rounds later benjy in a 4v2 killed 3 players another round in which TH couldve saved but didnt and they didnt just get 2 rounds with these plays they broke SENS momentum if these rounds were played they wouldve lost 2-0 but they didnt

I love the videos and the data is really well organized. But for the ult orbs on deaths, as everyone is aware, are not equally likely to be gotten from the pistol-winning team vs the pistol-losing team so they dont really cancel each other out. More importantly though with the money prevented by teams attempting an eco is that when a team like Gen G buys on round two they often use cheap guns or sheriffs in order to snowball the economy as mentioned. However because of this they aren't losing 800 credits from dying with a sheriff on round two because they would not be using that gun either way come round 3. Im not sure if this was considered or not but that could potentially account for 1600+ credits worth of strewed data. Anyway love the vids and keep up the great work 🐐

Tenz just wanted to say that you can give eco damage and every round is winnable

the man is giving us a phd thesis every vid 😭 thanks for another super interesting analysis Platoon <3

This video actually gives a very good insight

Hey great video but at 8:20 you refer to +1250 as the median and average. Those are not interchangeable. They could theoretically be the same number but if you’re talking about the average you would calculate the mean.

They did the same thing in cs by dying on purpose to a molly and therefore less kill credits

Hey Platoon, appreciate the analysis on the premise of jumping off. For ref, i was one of the strategic coaches helping josh, peter, and G2 during the past few months. Just wanted to give some additional insight on how its hard to look at this specific situation with the math behind R2/R14 Eco Percentages on its own. This situation of jumping off, is strictly viable on the condition of being down 9-3 or greater out of halftime and why the ideal of denying ultimate orbs comes into play. Under any other round situation (6-6/7-5) where advantage is relatively more median, there is no incentive to do the 5 man jump off and is backed by the data you showed within the video. Why it matters in this specific situation, is denying 5 orbs + Kill money for gun purchase + Plant money, allows us more room to equalize and claw back (since eco equalizes assuming conversion) and not have to worry about Lev's Aggro Focused Ultimate's getting online sooner to snowball by round 11 and close the game. Itll be interesting if this becomes a more sought after option or if riot will implement some type of eco penalty. With how niche this situation is though in my head i dont think we will see any major changes any time soon. But thanks for the breakdown either way!

W platoon vid, L lothar. leaving comment here for ur algorithm

Leaving a comment for engagement because unlike rage baiting on twitter this video actually took a lot of effort.

why make a map where u can die of fall damage, when u are just gonna ban dying from falling????

they fall straight to the airport😂

Douche Douche right into Lothar's dome

lothar is prolly one of the most braindead val creators out there xd

Important thing to keep in mind when coming to the conclusion of the video is that this map would be nearly as hard as pearl to win a defending eco. Abyss is very exec heavy, which would mean eco stacking is probably the only valid strategy, but if they don't hit the stacked site retaking is on either site would probably realistically be less than a 2% chance against harbor because of the poor weaponry. If they have to retake, they already granted orbs and plant money. Even if they attack the stacked site, unless they buy utility, the stack will not work on abyss without granting too many ult points or blatantly giving away the stack. If you could jump off ascent (11:34) the stats would still be favored for defending eco success rates, because it's more favored to defend compared to Abyss. Feeding harbor ult points could realistically allow for Lev to have an even chance at winning round 15, which is why G2 opted for the safer option by jumping.

great work man! finally i have some data to prove my points :D

It's not a controversy, Lothar is just retarded. Whether you agree with it or not, it's a legitimate strategy. As with any strategy, it has its drawbacks like the ones the Tenz laid out. But it's still a viable strat.

Very insightful video, and I think you have shown clearly through your analysis that 'instantly dying' would not be a beneficial strategy when averaged across all maps and considering the current/recent professional metas (past 2 years as mentioned). Still, I think there is an argument to be made that this strategy on abyss has merit, as these statistics tends to look at things on the broad scale (naturally, since you need a large enough sample size to make meaningful conclusions). Taking an example from the video, where Pearl is an outlier in terms of eco win % on defense, it might be the case that, from G2's perspective, abyss also is a similarly difficult to defend map on eco rounds and thus this type of strategy has more value than in a generic setting. Additionally, there might be other factors present on Abyss rather than other maps that make the overall benefit of this strategy higher/lower (position of neutral ult orbs, how often teams will opt for the FNC kind of buy on this map, etc.). In my opinion, it's really impossible at this point to definitively say that G2 made the (right/wrong) decision by playing that specific round this way, as we just don't have enough data on Abyss. Plus, even if we were to revisit this question later, we would have to try and consider and control for various other factors that will have changed, particularly agent changes and how they impact the general meta. Perhaps the next agent significantly boosts the likelihood of eco winning % for example. Thanks again for your insight and analysis, was a great watch!

we shouldn't blame G2 for that strat, blame the map for being designed like that

Nerdge (still very good video)

bro eats VCT data for breakfeast

Platoon masterclass as always, I admire the work dude

Your statistical analysis is amazing, I applaud your hard work

Lothar more like Loathsome. Why do people still support him when he keeps giving L takes like this