In my past as a 10-13 year old ('80-'83) I shot factory 243 Win 105gr rounds. In '81 I took a pronghorn with a Ruger 77, 243 Win with a 22 inch barrel and a Weaver fixed 4 power scope and Remington 100gr Core-Lokt ammo. The range that I took that trophy pronghorn buck is too far to admit. I put 3 shots into its breadbasket and he was on his knees, then ran about 200 yards downhill so to finish him off with a 4th round from dying slowly. As an adult now, I can say and believe that out to 500 yards the 243 Win is lacking quite a bit for a large pronghorn buck. My mom was with me for this eventful experience as I was too young for the out of state license. Later in that morning after my dad and grandpa filled their tags with trophy bucks, meeting my mom and I dragging their bucks into camp, talking about where my buck was at. I had mine quartered out and caped, he was way down hill, but was on my way back for its hind quarters. Dad and grandpa judged the scene of my kill and with ghostly grey faces asked how far I had shot, I threw out a number but then realized that it was to far for my 243 Win. They stepped off the all downhill yardage and then looked at me with their evermore greying faces and told me that I need a more powerful rifle and a better scope. They both had pre '64 model 70s chambered in 270 Win, and both with fixed 6 power scopes. The last elk that my dad shot with his 270 Win was a 6×6 trophy bull that was at the bottom of a very steep Bitterroot Mountain roughly 550 yards. Thanks for reading 😊

I have both a 6mm and 6.5 Creedmoor, love them both. The 6mm is my favorite rifle for shooting 1000 and 1200 yards, consistently 5”-6” groups. It is a much better cartridge than the 243 Winchester for long range. A great starter for a teenager for hunting and target shooting.

🎯 For competition shooting, this one would be hard to beat! 😯

As far as hunting with your kid and 6 creed vs 223…. Huge benefit that 223 has over 6creed is cost of ammo!!! Really loving this series…

It’d be great to hear you guys talk about the .257 Weatherby!

I have a 6XC which is practically the same as 6mm Creedmoor….absolutely brilliant cartridge, fantastic for deer, varmint and target shooting

Love the cartridge talk. Can we see 350 legend, 50 Beowolf, and 224 valkyrie

lets stay on the talk of 6mms. I would love to hear about the 6mm Rem. I have a Rem 600 mohawk in 6mm and it was my first deer rifle and is why I got into reloading. could of been so much better as Ryan talked about it briefly in the 243 ten min talk.

The only thing the 6 CM has over the .243 is the longer throats and ability to shoot heavier, high BC bullets than the standard factory .243 Winchester. I've shot both now and can see no real difference in hunting between the .243 and the 6CM. I only see a difference in long range shooting and even then it's not much. If you own neither then a 6CM will probably be a good choice due to the potential for a little edge at long range, but if you already have a .243 then the 6CM won't really impress you any more than your .243 does.

Guys, great talk as ever! I have run into problems with a 243 of mine, not with bullet weight (95 grn) but via bullet length. Complete tumbling, spraying rounds circa 2 feet at 100 yards, I was aware of the weight v twist situation and thought i had that covered when I moved from Nosler 95grn bthunting to Sierra 95grn TGK , but I found out that without doubt, length also maters a lot! (the age old question answered) All the best guys. (still hoping for the 6.5x47 lap talk one day) Josh, in Scotland.

do a cartridge talk on the .444 my buddy recently got passed down a .444 marlin and weve been shooting whitetail left and right with it this past season.

you guys are spoiling us with all these vids!

I went with a 6.5 Grendel for my kids first deer rifle. The 6 ARC was not out at the time. Either one is good to the distance they will shoot.

Years ago I might a man who used 6mm exclusively. His wife loved it too. Low kick and great accuracy

"Dodge, Duck, Dip, Dive and Dodge!". You guys are so funny, classic Wisconsin conversation there. Guns and throw in a Dodgeball quote. Ryan, my favorite though is "He doesn't have any balls Cotton!"

Great talk as usual. How about talking about the 300 Savage?

So many cartridge talks lately ❤️❤️

The other thing to keep in mind is that a 243 win with a 1:10 twist will not stabilize a 100 grain copper bullet, but the 6 creed with the 1:8 twist will stabilize the copper bullets

I used to shoot 6mm Remington, I don't know much about 6cm. However several years ago 6 mm for deer hunting was pretty common out in Texas. I shot a few deer 6mm .

Fan of the 6mm,second varmint rifle for me was a 6mm ,kilt a bunch of nw ohio woodchucks. Then later my first pd shoot with the 6. Also have three 243,,hells canyon,mk3 , mod 70 compact. They are all so much fun now just shooting in the back yard……

Excellent video. I think it’s especially great to circle back in talk about how these new cartridges have a broader use than their ancestors. It’s almost like to see why I get a 223 when you can get a 6 mm Creedmoor that will do everything the 223 can , all the way up to nearly the 6.5 Creedmoor both up and down in grain weight. It would be interesting to do a video that compares increases in recoil, and whether those are proportional to increases in use and capability, assuming factory ammunition.

Happy New Year guys. Take a couple days off. You deserve it 👏

sounds like a great choice if you dont already have a 243 or similar, great choice with a 7 PRC for bigger game, great factory bullet options,

I have a Howa 1500 sporter in 6mm Creedmoor. So far, my son has taken 4 mule deer using 108gr ELD match factory ammo at 70, 300, 320, and 420 yards. All four deer were one shot kills and fell in their tracks. It's a solid combo.

Merry Christmas is what we say. Happy holidays is what sad when you’re afraid of your company getting onto you.

Been seeing a lot more 6 creedmores out at the range lately. Humbly requesting a throwback episode for 256 Win mag attempt #5

Thanks for Talking about the 6mm Creed. I love it, I own two, a 22" and a 26". Great for precision and will take up to deer size animals. Awesome cartridge.

6mm creedmore, the only creedmore I’d own to avoid the 6.5 fanboy club

These really need to be called #20minutetalk

Still waiting for that 300 Winmag. My favorite show by the way. You guys rock

I'm pretty invested in my .243. I have a Handi-Rifle that was my rifle and a Savage that I built before the 6mm Creed came along with a 1-8 twist barrel that shoots pretty small groups. However, if I lost all of my guns in a fire, I'd replace the Savage with a 6CM. I also have a match rifle in 6BR Norma which is a lovely little 6mm round.

You guys can’t bring up something being a phenomenal coyote round without comparing it to the 22-250

22-250 with a 1 to 7 twist 26 inch barrel shooting 88 and 90 grain pills is what the valkyrie should of been. That makes a perfect long range varmint round that can easily take deer too.

Without question one of my favorite cartridges is the 243 Winchester. It's just a sweet mild mannered round that has more than enough power for anything up to mule deer. Also the conventional wisdom is that killing a black bear is no more difficult than killing a deer and to the extent that the 243 Win is sufficient for the latter it doesn't surprise me that it's effective on black bear also. I already own several 243 Win chambered rifles so I don't see any real benefit to owning a 6 mm Creedmoor as I don't plan to shoot match competition anyway. However, if I was in the market for a 6 mm round rifle and did not already own the 243 Win then I would choose the 6 mm Creedmoor over the latter. With regard to the 223 Rem vs the 6 mm Creedmoor I would go with the Creedmoor. The flexibility the 6 mm Creedmoor offers beats the 223 Rem hands down. I own a 22-250 Rem but I still prefer the 243 Win over it just the same.

"I got a a 6 Creed for shooting PRS." "Hell yeah brother!" haha James cracks me up. As far as the 6 CM vs the .223 concerning younger shooters.. I'd definitely go with the 6. It's just flat out a better choice! It offers less wind deflection and some level of insurance for the "not ideal" shot placement. Also why would Mark even think .223? Not a .224 Valk, 22 Nosler, or 22 Creed? Thank you guys again for the awesome talks 😄

Just bought my first new bolt action rifle yesterday - Springfield Armory Waypoint Model 2020 in 6mm Creedmoor. Currently doing some research on what scope I want to go with. Really looking forward to some range time - I wanted a rifle I could hunt with and enjoy some long range shooting. Great episode boys!

Mark, 6arc for the girls! Trust me!

Lived my 243 comp gun just didn't like loading for hours the night before a match 105rdf @3050FPS Worked great in my gun was a 1:8 twist though

Been dreaming of this day

"At the end of the day, you can have the biggest cartridge, and if you put it in the wrong spot, it's not going to do anything." Wise words, Ryan

A Sierra 85 grain Game King HPBT or 90 grain Sierra TGK loaded in in either .243 or 6 Creed will blow the stuffing out of whitetail or antelope with a properly placed shot. In older rifles with slower twist rates, their 85 grainer is King.

7.5 Swiss is all I wanted for Christmas 😂

The 6cm and 22cm are the most interesting of the line.... in my opinion

I am in the same boat as so many other reloaders. I love the concept of the 6mm CM, but alas I already own two sets of reloading dies for the 243 and have 400-500 pieces of brass in the 243. I am just too invested in it to buy the CM even though it probably is a better case.

Comin I hot with the cartridge talks this week

6 creed is an awesome coyote round. havent had a hit get away and usually anchors them.

My deer are not 800+ yards away. I don't have a safe full of rifles so I needed my one bolt gun that goes up and down from bear to elk to white tail and this is not "the one" in my safe and probably never will be. Yeah I risk loss of usable meat with a missplaced shot but .308 works for me for many reasons - but you do you and more power to ya.

Had a Ruger M77 Target Grey 223. That would produce five shot bug holes all day long with 52gr, 53gr and 55gr loads. Thinking the 223 is not as accurate as some of the more long range focused calibers, is probably more in your head.

I went from a great twist 243 to 6creedmore for that turnkey match I got tied if missing until 1am the night before the match

I hunt over here in the uk. 243 has got to be one of the most common hunting calibres over here. And I know numerous people including myself who with hunt red deer with it. With stags growing up to 240kg. More then capable round. Mine is a t3 rebarreled with a 1-8 twist. 108 eld m at 2930fps and regularly prints half moa at 1000 yards. A delight to shoot!

being an old fart i'll stick with the .243 ... and leave the 6. 6.5 to the younger manbun types ... ; ) ...

In Germany we need a minimum of 6,5mm and 2000 Joule/100 Meters to be able to hunt Deer / Boar. (Exept for Roedeer which need a minimum of 1000J/100M.)

I would like to know more about the 6.5-300 Weatherby and your options.

What’s the expected barrel longevity on the 6creed?

Plenty, Elk being taken with that round.

All my 6mm gt match barrels end up becoming 6mm creed barrels that we throw on Ruger Precision Rifles. Super grateful that ruger went 1"-16 because I can just hack off 1.5" from the chamber end and I'm usually through the majority of the firecracking. We let customers who come to our long range class run the 6creeds when their .308 class cartridges run out of steam at 1k+yards or if it's super windy out. About 600-800 more rounds of 105 hybrids over a case full of H4350 and I usually pull the barrels off the Rugers again. I've also shot a handful of deer and and antelope with the Hornady 90gr copper (cx?) Bullets over Reloader 17 and it is a freaking deer killing machine at least out to 400 yards. About 3350fps out of a 26.5" tube. I wish Barnes would make their TTSX in 6mm...but the Hornady bullet works good in the 1:8, 1:7.7, and 1:7.5 twist barrels I've run it through. Expanding LASER straight through every animal I've shot to date.

105s fit in the AICS mags power just gets crunchy

If i need more than a 100g bullet then im going to a diff caliber. The extra 5-10 grains aint gonna make a difference. I dont get the new fascination with trying to use the smallest caliber possible, at the longest ranges possible when hunting.

Have you talked about the 6mm Remington yet?

Get them all there fun

Aw man! You guys finally do this after I bought a Ruger in 5.56.... Wanted a 6 Creed but couldnt find one anywhere.

The thing the 6.5 creed has over the 7 prc and even the 6.5 prc is its a non magnum short action. Avaliablity and lighter recoil will keep it around. I prefer the 7 prc over all them but I don't shoot competition.

This will be the next chambering I buy. Love the mix between long range target shooting and hunting capabilities this has. Seems like it'll do everything the 6.5 can do but with better trajectory. Excluding elk if you consider the 6.5 an elk cartridge.

Whats everyones ole faithful go to hunting caliber ? Mine if i am thinking to much i bring the cannon 30-378 weatherby as it gets alot of questions or my 45-70 if im walking in woods

I would love to see a 6mm CM vs 25-06 video

Would love to see you talk about the european 30-06 also known as the 8x57 mauser

Bought a Grendel and out comes the Creedmoor. But I decided that the next biggest rifle I got would be a 6.5 PRC.

Which rifle would you recommend this caliber for deer?

@15:29 - the popularity contest comment is apropos while talking about a Hornady cartridge. It should be the title or by-line of any Hornady cartridge conversation.

I have a 6mm Creedmoor in a Browning X-bolt. Killed plenty of pigs and overall extremely accurate

@Vortex Nation Podcast Can you guys do a podcast on bullets? Different designs, metals, alloys, tips, twist rates required for different bullets, bonded, partitioned, velocity required for expansion, ideal bullet types for different size game, etc.

6.5 Creedmoor is so popular by default have you tried to buy a rifle in the last 2 years. The only Creedmoor cool-aid I am drinking is the 22 Creed. At ranges that 95% of people SHOULD be limiting themselves to there are dozens of rounds equal or better. Who cares what it does at 600yds. So few people should be concerned with that, it would be irrelevant. A out as many as my silly long throat 6mm AI. Laser beam but nothing I can't do with a nice 139 interlock out of my 7mm-08. But I love new rounds and the info on them and this is one of my favorite sources.

Have you guys looked at the 6mm ARC yet?

I'm dusting off my wife's grandfather's 243 for my boy to shoot. I have been looking at the 6 Creedmoor as a update/ modern bullet.

Would high shoulder shot on whitetail be good with this caliber?

6 dasher would be a interesting comparison

Good morning!

@ryan , what is your go to load for .243 with 100 grain pills?

I went with the 6mm arc .. but I have found it harder to get ammo for the arc verses the creed

It's like the dasher

300 savage that would be a good one to talk about seeing that all the Creedmoor‘s including the 30 TC were built off of that and if somebody wants to argue the point all you need to do is compared to 300 savage to the 30 TC

It's more like a modernized 6mm rem since it's that bit faster than a .243

Do I doubt the ability of the 6CM? No because I’ve got a metric truck load of experience with the older brother, .243win. Will I swap my .243’s for a 6CM? Absolutely not. I don’t see enough performance advantage for my uses to justify the swap. Especially when I have several hundred rounds of .243win loaded, 2 factory rifles, and a custom rifle all chambered in the same cartridge.

243 has more versatility down to lightweight varmint rounds. 6mmCM has the advantage for long range shooting past typical hunting distances where it offers no ballistic advantage over 243 at hunting distances. So, if you're going to hunt and want much greater ammo availability and versatility, go 243. If you want to go out a long ranges to target shoot, go 6mmCM

What about a comparison between the 22 creedmoor and the 6mm creedmoor?

The new straight wall caliber hit the media today, 360 Buckhammer, 30-30 case straightened and loaded with .358 projectiles.

243 or 6mm Rem ?

8.6 Blackout! Do it!

also mark! Maybe just maybe you never know, but your daughter's might end up liking PRS over hunting and the 6 creed checks that box too!!!

6mm rem ?

A 1/9.25 savage will shoot 105 vld berger, u may have different results. Buying a fast twist 243 win barrel is cheaper than buying a new 6 cred gun. But buying a new one is fun too

Local shops are getting pretty good stacks of the 6mm C going on. But have yet to see a rifle in the caliber.

Good for yotes?

6.8 Western!!! It's an updated 270 WSM!!

04:58 I am so glad that Mark was going to talk about the 243 Win. Tomayto, tomahto. Social Regressive just built an everything truck fun with a semi-auto 6 mm ARC. Technically, a 6.5 Creedmoor can have about 17% more energy and recoil and possibly have better terminal ballistics than the ARC. But .243 works, as well. But, if shooting past 500 yards, probably the accuracy is going to be better with the 6.5 or even this 6 CM, though the slug is a bit light. Rob at deermeatfordinner brought down a canadian moose with his Howa 1500 in 6.5 CM using Hornady ELD-X 143 grain. One shot at over 100 yards. It can be done. I still depend on my .308. But I hunt on public land and if you hunt on a drawn hunt on public land, you have to shoot no less than .270 and the nearest equivalent would be 7 mm Rem Mag and now the 7 PRC. However, I know someone who hunts deer and big horn sheep with a .300 Win Mag. Check the rules where you are hunting.

It does not do anything that the .243 can't when hunting deer, antelope, sheep, etc. so it will not catch on. An extra 5-7 grains in bullet weight makes no practical difference in performance.

It’s a modern version of the .243

I love my 6mm creed. Using 108 eldm. Taken 3 javelina with it. That bullet is too much for coyotes though.

So when you say “good enough for deer …” does that include mule deer or do you really mean whitetails?

240 wby mag or 30-06 with a belt necked down to 24