11 Facts About the Atari Jaguar You Maybe Didn't Know

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2 ай бұрын

The Atari Jaguar was a unique system that's both loved and reviled. Join me for a look about 11 interesting facts about the system that maybe you didn't know! For best results view at 1080p 60fps.
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If you liked this video, you might like some of my others:
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Links to sources used in this video:
Next Generation magazine same tramiel interview: strider.untergrund.net/toxicm...
Enhanced Doom port: forums.atariage.com/topic/295...
Mortal Kombat Jaguar port: www.timeextension.com/news/20...
Mortal Kombat Jaguar dev KZfaq Channel: • MORTAL KOMBAT Atari Ja...
Atari Jaguar Case story: www.gamegrin.com/articles/ora...
Jaguar FAQ with lots of info: atariage.com/Jaguar/faq/index...
Is the Jaguar 64-bit?: engineer81.com/is-the-atari-j...
Panther Info: ctrl-alt-rees.com/atari-panth...
Interesting things aobut the Jaguar: forums.atariage.com/topic/171...
Coleco Chameleon Post Mortem reddit: / video_games_coleco_cha...
#AtariJaguar #retrogaming #videogames #bigpemu #11facts #Doom #alienvspredator #kasumininja #retrogames #classicgames #classicsystems #atari

Пікірлер: 152

@Phredreeke Ай бұрын

Never ask a woman her age, a man his salary or an Atari fan how many bits the Jaguar is

@SensibleChuckle Ай бұрын

I remember being a lurker on GEnie BBS in 94. T-Bird was unforgettably cruel. Hopefully he received therapy and found his respect, kindness, and empathly glands. Obviously their game came out and pushed the limits of the system. They appear to be the Jaguar's anchor nowadays. I'm happy for them-- genuinely. I'm hopeful life is better. Edited to tone it down after hearing good things in the community about their Jaguar support.

@masterquake7 Ай бұрын

I was actually pleasantly surprised by the Jag controller. I haven't played a ton with it, but I thought it felt good to use for me for what I did play.

@randyfemrite7525 Ай бұрын

I like the controller.

@ScrapKing73 Ай бұрын

Since the beginning of computing, the width of the main data bus has defined what bit width a system is. And a 64-bit data bus allowing two 32-bit chips to execute in parallel is actually pretty advanced. And EGM was wrong to say Atari was just adding up the “bits” of each chip, as (if so) Atari would have been claiming much more than 64-bit if that was the case, so that claim is confused. Fun fact, the Motorola 68000 chip is 32-bit internally but 16-bit externally when communicating with the rest of the motherboard. Another fun fact, the original Mattel Intellivision from 1979 was 16-bit, which proves that the width of the data bus ultimately doesn’t tell you much about how powerful a system is. I enjoyed everything else about the video though. :-)

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

EGM was basing their slightly sarcastic claim on the two 32-bit chips in the system that run in parallel. For the data bus width determining the system's "bitness" in the past, have to disagree there, especially since several 8-bit systems use busses that are technically 16-bits wide (C64 is one example). The Intellivision CPU is a whole different can of worms 😁 The version of the chip Mattel used primarily worked with 10-bit instructions (decles). Actually already planned on talking about that one in an upcoming video!

@donpalmera Ай бұрын

68000 is not 32bit internally. It has 32bit registers etc but it works on at most 16bits at a time.

@ScrapKing73 Ай бұрын

@@InglebardGaming Huh... I haven't heard that alleged about the C64 before, and I used the C64 as my primary system for many years. I'd watch a video on that, and will be 100% there for your upcoming Intellivision CPU video! :D But, a couple of exceptions to the rule doesn't necessarily disprove the rule. EG: the 8-88 is internally 16-bit, but the data bus is 8-bit so everyone called 8088-based PC 8-bit.

@ScrapKing73 Ай бұрын

@@donpalmera What do you base that on? Everything I read online is some variation of this statement: "Internally it was a 32-⁠bit processor, but a 32-bit address and/or data bus would have made it prohibitively expensive, so the 68000 used 24-bit address and 16-bit data lines."

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

@ScrapKing73 It's part of the reason it can access 64k of RAM, that's a 16-bit number. The largest 8-bit number is 256 (well, 255 when you start at 0).

@stevew8513 2 ай бұрын

I picked up my Jaguar in November of 1993. It was still technically in the "test market" phase, not yet the nationwide roll-out, so there was a dearth of games for it until late 1994. I have almost all the games for it (not Battlesphere, I put my email address on the list of buyers then lost that address when I changed over to a better ISP, and I've hated myself ever since) and the Jag CD drive. I even have Aircars, bought when it was only offered as a mail-order game, before its wider release with the age rating on it. Yeah, I can see why Atari management decided not to publish it. I'm astounded by how much Jaguars and games are going for now. A great retro game shop in the area had a boxed one for $500 at one point, and the boxed games rarely dipped below $100. I can honestly say "I was into the Jaguar before it was cool". Favorite games are Battlemorph, I-War, Hover Strike Unconquered Lands, Ultra Vortek, Missile Command 3D, Iron Soldier, AvP, and Doom.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Yeah, I got mine for Christmas in 1993, along with Cybermorph (pack-in) and Trevor McFur (yuck, lol). I was never a huge fan, but I liked some of the stuff on it. Way too much of it was 16-bit-style quick and easy stuff that took zero advantage of the hardware. But when used well, the Jag could produce some decent quality stuff like Tempest 2000, Wolfenstein 3D, Doom, AVP, Super Burnout, and some others. Like I said in the video, I have a soft spot for a few games that aren't great like Kasumi Ninja, its port of the Humans, and some other stuff. It's too bad Atari couldn't land big licensees or Japanese devs at the time. Also, that their settlement with Sega never amounted to anything.

@janwilt6974 Ай бұрын

I have a problem with your judgement on the controller. I am 72 years old and I bought the Jaguar the first time I saw it in a gaming store here in Louisville Kentucky at a store called videovisions. I personally have had no problems with the buttons or the joypad. I also have talked to 3 different electronics engineers and after looking at all the specs they all said it was rather unusual how they used the chips , but they all said it has a true 64 bit bus and it is capable of sending 64 bits of information over that bus. They also said it would pretty stupid to put a 64 bit bus on the jag if it was only a 32 bit system.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

A lot of that is why people still debate if you can consider the Jag 64-bit to this day, 30+ years later. The data bus isn't the only thing to consider in this. And I know the debate isn't going to end now either, so I'm just going to leave all that where it is since I said my piece in the video. I'm not angry with people that disagree and won't attack them, I just don't agree with them. As far as the controller goes, again, opinions will vary. I'm pushing 50 myself and was was in my late teens when I first got the system. There have only been two controllers when I was young that physically hurt my hands to use and they were the Atari 7800 (joystick, never tried its gamepad) and the Jag. I stand by it being one of the worst first party dpads I've ever used. It really needed to be taller, it was like someone took the TG16 dpad , which was already problematic itself and amplified its issues. Playing stuff like Kasumi Ninja that required rolling motions was a nightmare for me. But again, I understand we're different and have different experiences with things. If you like it and never had issues with it, I'm not going to try to convince you its bad, but that was my experience with it and I've used a LOT of controllers over the decades.

@SensibleChuckle Ай бұрын

@@InglebardGamingI have to agree with the original poster, I loved the feel of it. I was about 28 yo, I wear XL gloves. It felt perfect like a P226. The The joypad isn't as precise as a PSP but I liked it. What I didn't like was that the games were not games; they were tech demos. Graphics and game engines felt amateur at best. But at the time, being a professional 3D guy, I was happy to play with real-time 3D even if low quality, without rendering. Tempest 2000 was great but needed a spinner. I was in love with virtual racing and multi-player War birds on the Lynx at the time, and the Jag, the perfect platform to play these types of games-- didn't. AvP was the best Doom-like, but like you said good games were thin.

@Mrshoujo Ай бұрын

Study a block diagram on the Jaguar architecture. The data bus is a full 64-bits wide. I prefer DOOM without music.

@JetScreamer_YT Ай бұрын

Maybe Theranos could have bought the Jaguar mold for their imaginary product too?

@andycraig7734 Ай бұрын

LOL! That is hilarious! And since that evil Theranos president Elizabeth Holmes liked to dress like Steve Jobs with the black turtle neck sweaters, you gotta get an Apple Pippin angle in there somehow.

@kevinstrade2752 Ай бұрын

Oh boy...I could tell stories..but I will spare you all. Still have my Jaguar and JagCD. Many games including many homebrew turtles and conversions. Have Battlesphere Gold. Atari was in a tough spot at the time. Juggernauts like Sega and Nintendo has far more resources at in the 90's. I am grateful and glad Atari took one last try. There are some good and decent games for the system. Unfortunately some are complete garbage...(Checkered Flag). Don't think JagVR would have saved it. Maybe had it been released in 94 along with the CD unit. Both were too little too late despite enhancing the system.

@darkfalzx Ай бұрын

Jag always seemed like the case of unexplored potential for me. I don't think a single game in its library comes close to squeezing anywhere near full power out of it. Another thing that doesn't help matters is how poor most games are in terms of presentation (with few exception). Hire artists, guys! Either that, or make Jag dev tools simple enough to be used by artists themselves, kinda like GameMaker or Godot.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

It definitely had potential for greater things. There were some interesting approaches to the hardware and it was pretty good at 2D stuff unlike some other systems of the era (3DO). It had definite issues holding it back, though, like the procesing cost of texture mapping... that alone would have kept it behind the curve against polygonal games on other systems. I would really have liked to see some of that 2D power exploited and more stuff like Super Burnout that had sort of that super scaler look.

@thefurthestmanfromhome1148 23 күн бұрын

@@InglebardGamingCommercial titles like Skyhammer, Iron Solider 2 etc pushed the system, hard, Doom by John Carmack's own admission, could of been better if coded from the ground up for the hardware. Battlesphere and WTR Racing ciders have admitted there would be slight performance increases with further optimisation to their game engines, but look at Hoverstrike.. The CD version saw code moved to the GPU and only a minimal increase in frame rate performance.

@roberto1519 2 ай бұрын

Agreed, how anyone in their right mind thought that DOOM was OK to be released in that state for the Saturn is beyond comprehension. In any case, just like the impressive DOOM Resurrection for the 32X, which wasn't totally awful to begin with, and even OptiDOOM for the 3DO improving it quite a lot, I believe at some point, Saturn will have its own improved version.

@BurritoKingdom 2 ай бұрын

Blame John Carmack. He hates affine textures and forced the devs of Doom Saturn to scrap their engine and to program a software renderer that only used the two SH-2s and the SCU. If the devs were allowed to use VDP1&2 it would have performed similar to Duke on the Saturn

@iwanttocomplain Ай бұрын

@@BurritoKingdom I heard it was just a software renderer on only one SH2 cpu. which is 28Mhz. I can believe that. VDP2 can accept geometry co-ordinates to do ground and ceiling. I don't need to tell you , you probably saw Labotomy's Slave Driver games.

@Phredreeke Ай бұрын

@@BurritoKingdom Carmack probably assumed the Saturn could perform similar to the PS1 version (which he himself was involved in porting). PS1 Doom does software rendering but uses a trick to draw the walls using the GPU. I assume said trick won't translate over to the Saturn

@roninxix4428 2 ай бұрын

AVP was awesome and creepy, definitely was a must play at rhe time. I remember playing as the marine and being freaked out when hearing the Predator.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Yeah, it definitely has atmosphere. I made a lot of progress in it but never finished it. I find it really hard to stick with games that have no in-game music, the silence just makes them seem dull to me after a while. Still, I think I'll see it through one of these days.

@thefurthestmanfromhome1148 23 күн бұрын

@@InglebardGamingI played all 3 campaigns to completion at the time, The Marine is definitely the strongest, the Predator one is OK, but the Alien one is far too flawed. Regarding no in-game music on the game.. AVP producer Purple Hampton, Retro Gamer magazine issue 57, page 30. "In some instances what may have been a limitation turned into an identifying feature in the game. So when we found that the memory limitations weren't going to let us have a movie-like symphonic score, we opted to go the other direction, and create an eerie soundscape from the ambient space station noise. The result added a lot of dramatic tension and captured the spooky feeling of being alone - until a threatening Predator clicking sound appeared nearby."

@fazares 2 ай бұрын

Fantastic video...for a quasi proud owner of the jaguar itself

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Ha, thanks, my quasi-proud Jag owning friend!

@PixelzNcreatureZ Ай бұрын

There was a website (possible atari site? I can't remember) selling the Jaguars and the CD for $49 each around 1995/96 so I ordered 1 of each. I ended up getting 2 Jaguars. I emailed them saying I wanted a Jaguar and a Jag CD. They told me to keep the 2nd Jaguar and sent me the CD Unit next day. I still have them 😁 they were already dying or dead but I still had fun with em

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Yeah, they were deeply discounted toward the end, a few places were clearancing them out. I'm pretty sure Tiger Direct was one of the big ones, was it them?

@user-rt9zq8rs9k Ай бұрын

There's a website still operating for everything ATARI . Best Electronics .

@Tolbat 28 күн бұрын

Enjoyed this, thanks for sharing

@InglebardGaming 11 күн бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it!

@whatspeedlimits Ай бұрын

#7- the case ended up being bought by AtariAge - so when Atari bought AtariAge last year...the case is now home. I would expect to see a Jag mini in the future.

@caseycu Ай бұрын

Great video with some lesser known bits! I do think it’s very possible that the final version of “Fight for Life!” could have played quite a bit better than the released version since optimization usually comes at the end of development, but it’s unlikely the models, graphics or animation would have been improved on.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Thanks! Personally I don't think there's anything salvageable in Fight for Life, that game is just a disaster from start to finish. They really needed a team of programmers instead of relying on one (they did have other people doing some of the graphics and music and stuff at least). The gameplay in it is just embarrassingly bad, even if the stories were true, that I didn't talk about, that it was accidently labeled for "review" instead of "preview"... it should never have been shown off in the state it was in. But that's just my opinion, anyway!

@marklechman2225 3 күн бұрын

From what I understand, the Jaguar’s official development tools were weak and/or broken which probably helped push developers to embrace the more familiar 68000 over the custom Tom & Jerry chips.

@tical2399 Ай бұрын

I had a jaguar, and while I didn't love it, it had some fun with it. Had way more fun with it than the damn gamecube. Now THAT is a system I regret getting.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Well, can't agree there myself, but if that's how you feel that's how you feel!

@TeeroyHammermill 26 күн бұрын

Saying "it's 64bit where it counts" is not admitting anything delinquent. All it's saying is by videogame device standards, it's 64 bit. I had several Jaguar brochures back in 90s which stated the 64 bit data bus is what made the Jaguar a 64 bit system. It even described the processing as a "64-bit freeway". It said nothing about 64bit processors or 2x 32bit CPUs. In the end, bits don't mean anything if you don't know how to use them.

@104d_3rr0r_vince Ай бұрын

Atari should get the Darwin Award for putting a 16bit CPU in there.

@juststatedtheobvious9633 2 ай бұрын

As usual, not much was news, but there were still crumbs of shiny new things that I didn't know despite decades of study. The best part, from the perspective of someone who never got in breathing distance of a real one, was the description of how it feels to actually use that controller. I was an Intellivision fan, back in the day. My nostalgia was never going to steer me right. Complaints? None that aren't pedantic nitpicks. The screen ratio was only an issue when the tiny car sprite kept transforming as it changed directions. Also, no mention of the CRY palette? It blew me away when I finally got my hands on Atari 50th. It's the one decisive advantage it had over the Playstation. Jeff Minter's update to Tempest isn't as impressive without it. Like I said, pedantic nitpicking. My own list doesn't exist, and it wouldn't be anywhere near as good. Thank you for making these, so we don't need to. One last thing: What were the other rumored names for the Midsummer project? So far as I know, Puma was just a joke?

@waylonoconner9121 Ай бұрын

I enjoyed my time with my Jag and it was nice hardware. The potential was there but with absolutely awful management and the tricky hardware it wasn't meant to be. Also, I liked the feel of the controller myself. My hands aren't huge but smaller controllers are more uncomfortable to me.

@gregjarvis1232 Ай бұрын

I don't Wether you can still get them but someone was making a Bluetooth adapter so you could connect t your favourite modern day controller to your Jag

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

I've never tried one, but they're still available. Looks like they're about $50.

@eriksgc Ай бұрын

You didn't mention the motor cycle. Racing game. They had. It was actually 32 bit game. At 60fps

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Ah, I thought I did when I mentioned the good games on the system, I wrote it in my original script, anyway. But that game is Super Burnout and it's definitely one of the better Jag games once you get used to the controls and the extreme sliding on the corners.

@mikejohnson699 2 ай бұрын

I used to own a complete retail collection (including cd stuff) that I bought brand new. I got my buddies into the system and showed them a unique perspective on gaming. Good times!

@InglebardGaming 2 ай бұрын

It was definitely unique! I have a good amount of the carts myself.

@jbmaru Ай бұрын

This homebrew Mortal Kombat port looks serious! The Jaguar would benefit a lot from an AJDK ;)

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Be interesting to see how it comes out and if he moves onto a better game like MK II if he ever finishes MK I!

@MarginalSC Ай бұрын

@@InglebardGaming Something like Pit Fighter would be interesting.

@johnwayne9933 Ай бұрын

@@MarginalSC I'm the oddball for sure, but would take a Jaguar port of Pit Fighter over Mortal Kombat. When I first saw PitFighter in the Arcades, its really was impressive- the first time I was confused as to how it looked so "real"- at the time.

@MarginalSC Ай бұрын

@@johnwayne9933 I like Pitfighter. It's a product of its time and SF2 eclipsed those older brawlers, but Pit Fighter was the most advanced and well designed brawler of its time. Getting a proper home port that could handle the scaling etc (and doesn't have the weird run too fast timing issue of the Williams Arcade Collection) would be amazing.

@johnwayne9933 Ай бұрын

@@MarginalSC Yep, the PS2 version plays way to fast, the best fix is still the Genesis or Emulation. But, I would have loved to see this on the Jaguar, and being an Atari Corp arcade game, just would seem to be where it belongs, "Pitfighter" really seems to fit with Jaguar's "odd-man out" vibe for sure.

@marklechman2225 Ай бұрын

I thought the XEGS was the last system before the Jag.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Technically yes, I should have clarified the 7800 was the last 'new' console Atari made before the Jag since the XE is an extension of their older 8-bit computer line and uses the same hardware of the 65XE.

@sandroace 2 ай бұрын

Always wanted one and ended up buying one years after it's demise but before it became sought after as I paid $50 for one brand new. Not too long ago I purchased the Game Drive and the re-released pro controller(an official pro controller price had skyrocketed by this time). Was eventually wanting to add it to my games setup and start playing that was until the BigPEmu was released, so now all my original hardware Jaguar stuff is nicely boxed and unused & any time I feel like playing the Jag I use the emulator.

@amnril Ай бұрын

Looks longingly at my totally mint boxed and complete (with hardware dongle and OST CD) copy of Battlesphere Gold.

@Hamdad 28 күн бұрын

You a real one for this

@Gameboy-Unboxings Ай бұрын

I could never understand why any game would possibly be released without gameplay music... Like just why? Especially when there is music in the start screen/other parts of the game.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Agree completely. It should have been a priority, IMO, playing games in silence or with just sound effects makes them seem more boring.

@JohnCrawford1979 Ай бұрын

Atari never quite got out of its old ways of the 2600. I still consider the option not to have the POKEY as the sound chip for the 7800, and instead keep the TIA only was one of Atari's biggest mistakes. But regarding Doom, to be fair, I can remember playing it with Beck's Odelay album playing. The PC even had the option of sound effects only, And really, the PC is by far the best way to play Doom.

@randyfemrite7525 Ай бұрын

It seems as though "Atari" (Sam?) was always more interested in making a better machine than focusing on what was on hand.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

I don't think Sam had the foggiest idea of what he was doing. Every Atari exec of the era seemed to be scrambling around like a chick with its head cut off. There was no real strategy, there was no quality control on the software, there was no vision for the platform. It was just "Hey we made this thing, now lets find someone to make games for it!" I feel like if Atari had real vision for the Jag, and worked to make sure that the original games for it were much higher quality and emphasized the things that made the hardware unique, they would have had a real shot. Bonus fact that I almost included in the video: Atari sued Sega and won during this era (technically there was a settlement), with Sega having to invest in and end up owning a piece of Atari. As part of a resultant agreement, they could have ported up to five Sega games to the Jaguar and Sega could have cross licensed up to five Jag games. Not a single game ever came out of this agreement on either system. Atari could have, for example, made their own versions of Saturn games like Virtua Fighter, Virtua Racing, Daytona (yeah, right), or maybe more realistically 2d stuff like Astal or Guardian Heroes. The only stipulations were the games had to be over a year old and couldn't be a mascot or something weird like that. I don't know why they never did this, I suspect it was a lack of developers that could take on and produce these projects.

@matthewc994 Ай бұрын

The Neo geo Aes was billed as 24 bit (motorola 68K 16 bit and the zilog 80 was 8 bit)

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

No, that's not the reason SNK claimed it was 24-bit. I did an 11 Facts video on the Neo Geo, too and talk about that as point number 1. Spoiler: it has a 24-bit address bus. Also, if we were going to go by the example of a 68000 plus a z80 equalling a 24-bit system, then loads of arcade games would be 24-bit, everything on system 16 or cps I for example, as well as the Sega Genesis and plenty of other platforms. It was a very common configuration.

@JohnCrawford1979 Ай бұрын

That's pretty much how many of the consoles back then did the math. it was the sum total of the chipset used. Thus, you have two main processors that were 32 bit, so working together = 64 bit.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

@JohnCrawford1979 that is not at all true. No consoles 'did the math' that way.

@joeg4707 Ай бұрын

@@JohnCrawford1979 100% false.

@JohnCrawford1979 Ай бұрын

@@InglebardGaming - The Jaguar did, with using dual 32-bit CPUs. And it is possible that loads of arcade games could be 24 bit. There was no exact math, and there are many technicalities in all the old consoles and arcades. After all, the Intellivision had a 16 bit CPU, even though most would consider it at best an early 8 bit console. So the math has always been a bit fuzzy and depending on what the companies wanted to focus on what the console's main capabilities were to highlight to the public.

@MarquisDeSang Ай бұрын

Modern consoles are 64 bits, but never actually use 64 bits instructions. Games use 32bit floats for the GPU.

@ArneChristianRosenfeldt Ай бұрын

At that time itanium could have worked. DRAM access needed 2 or 4 cycles. JRISC register file only has one read port. GBA ARM CPU has two register write to store the result of a 32x32 multiplication. Wouldn’t it be nice to store this in a 64 bit register?Multiply and accumulate on 64 bit. So a 64 bit instruction would fetch operands from regfile, DRAM, SRAM, division unit, and writeBack register (as it does now), but you could use the long instruction word to select bits from all these. Condition flags for vector elements. Load instruction in parallel. Double Float instructions naturally defined by bitfields. 32 bit immediate values would fit in. MIPS and RISCV need special instructions for this.

@ArneChristianRosenfeldt Ай бұрын

Jaguar could have used its 16 bit instructions, but try to run 4 in parallel. Solve all the dependencies with some clever logic and execute in as few cycles as possible-mostly Superscalar.

@Phredreeke Ай бұрын

x86 (and its 64-bit counterpart) use variable instruction lengths, this makes decoding a lot more complicated than other systems, where instructions are fixed length (which are easier to decode since you always know where the next instruction starts without decoding the last one, but may need multiple instructions to achieve what a single x86 instruction does). Long mode (in other words running the CPU in 64 bit mode) matters because it means you can address more than 4 GB memory. For the x86 architecture, it also means having more general purpose registers available. This is a big deal because x86 originally only had 8 such registers, as opposed to 16 on the 68000 and 32 on PowerPC and ARM.

@MarquisDeSang Ай бұрын

@@Phredreeke It may take more RISC instruction to write by hand by the assembly programmer than with a CISC, but it does not matter at execution because the CISC will do multiple RISC internally. Also with Risc-V assembler there are multiple pseudo-instruction that the assembler will convert for you into a sequence of instructions. RISC is the only possible future of computing because decoding instructions on CISC require more metal and transistors than actually exectuting the instructions. Also with prediction branching, CISC becomes a nightmare internally. CISC belong to the past, RISC is the only possible future of computing.

@ArneChristianRosenfeldt Ай бұрын

@@Phredreeke Arm in the Archimedes has 16 registers as does the SH2 in Sega consoles. Yeah, I don’t know why people love variable instruction length on 8bit CPUs .

@bogganalseryd2324 Ай бұрын

Its really kicks the llamas ass lol 😂

@erockbrox8484 2 ай бұрын

Also would love to see someone take the Atari new VCS controller and just make an adapter to use it on the Atari Jaguar.

@user-rt9zq8rs9k Ай бұрын

Why ?

@msolom9521 Ай бұрын

Jaguar was a fantastic scam, I, like many poor victims, remember "Avoid to the ground" and "Were did you learn to fly" with horror. My only sweet memory is Tempest, then I back to Saturn

@user-rt9zq8rs9k Ай бұрын

It was better than the Saturn . Alien Vs Predator was awesome. And the Saturn couldn't compare to the Jaguar when playing audio CDs.

@lordterra1377 Ай бұрын

Is Doom on the Jaguar 3D? It doesnt appear to have the slight distortion of a 2.5 raycast engine. You can tell when you study the in game movement and look at corners and ceiling edges. I notice the same difference when using Zdoom and switching from software to the 3D renderer.

@MarginalSC Ай бұрын

Don't think so. 32x version was based on the Jaguar code IIRC.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

@MarginalSC it is (32X is based on the Jag version). I covered that one in the video. Edit: added the bit in parenthesis for clarity.

@MarginalSC Ай бұрын

@@InglebardGaming Oh yeah. Just one of those things I've gotten used to reciting by rote. It's up there with how Jag Wolf 3d was ported in a weekend.

@ChuckieV79 Ай бұрын

I think I read somewhere that the beta version of fight for life is the real one. Any info/thoughts on this?

@Tolbat 28 күн бұрын

Dont think so but video of the real version exists, it had more details, more colors, and better animation.

@notthehelper6289 Ай бұрын

I think the Jaguar was the first game system to have 64 bit processors in it and a 64 bit data data but but a True 64 Bit system it was not. It was 64 bits where the System Designers thought it needed to be to make the most out of the Ram they were using. It was enough 64 bit to keep the debate going for alot longer then it needed to be but I think in the end most everyone will admit - the Jaguar is not a real 64 bit system.

@kaiokendo Ай бұрын

Man, IBM is a Kitty Ken Kutaragi

@MarginalSC 2 ай бұрын

I bought a 32x because the Jag CD took forever to appear.

@user-rt9zq8rs9k Ай бұрын

Sad . The Jaguar CD is awesome

@MarginalSC Ай бұрын

@@user-rt9zq8rs9k Maybe but I was just tired of waiting at the time.

@stevenchan3822 Ай бұрын

Trading in my jag for PS1 was the best decision I’ve made in my life

@Tolbat 28 күн бұрын

look at the value of the systems today, I am not so sure.

@stevenchan3822 28 күн бұрын

@@Tolbat I had 6 years of great video gaming in my childhood, totally worth it. Besides eBay prices aren’t that bad for the jag.

@iwanttocomplain 2 ай бұрын

Inglebard. You have to look at what a 64 bit number actually _is._ It goes up to 4 billion. That's pretty much it. Useful for big gigantic numbers. But that's just big numbers. Not that useful. Nintendo's first 64 bit console is the Switch! It's made by NiVidia so it's overengineered. The Jag _is_ 64 bit's where it counts. Which is the size of the bus. A bus bandwidth of 64bits is a real number that is used in the system alot and it goes to working ram. Do Tom and Jerry have 64bit instructions? Maybe not, I couldn't confirm it. But it's irrelevant as the only 64bit thing about the N64 is a couple of instructions and registers that made development more difficult and could arguably be considered a bug. Put there 100% for marketing purposes. Meanwhile, the Jag has that bus so both chips and the cpu _can_ operate at full speed independently without a buffer through a very impressive full and true 64bit bus pipeline. The N64 had a 9bit system bus I think, how weird is that?

@iwanttocomplain 2 ай бұрын

"the main cpu of the unit...thr 68K which, is regarded as a 16bit processor..." Because it has a 16bit external bus and ALU (bit's counted per cycle) but _does_ have 32bit instructions that take two cycles to process. Making it a hybrid, as the Z80 was an 8/16bit hybrid and the SNES is an 8/16 hybrid. Although the instructions in the SNES are purely for show because it has an 8bit external bus.

@InglebardGaming 2 ай бұрын

Let me break out my nerd card here. Um actually, the biggest 64-bit unsigned integer is 18,446,744,073,709,551,615, which is 18+ quintillion. The largest 32-bit unsigned integer is just over 4 billion. I teach IT, btw 😁 Just about every early console manufacturer engaged in bit shenanigans back in those days. Still, I don't think by any realistic measure that Jag can be considered a 64-bit system considering so many of its limitations. I haven't looked enough into the N64 to talk confidently about its technical side at this time. Maybe sometime down the road!

@iwanttocomplain 2 ай бұрын

@@InglebardGaming Let me find the recent video about the N64 I thought was very good.

@iwanttocomplain 2 ай бұрын

I think the fact the N64 bus is 9bit says it all. The Jaguar architecture was hampered primarily by not having many eyes on it and actual bugs from the Trameil school of product design. But remember the bus is really important because every time you add a bit you add the possibility of more data per cycle to move. The fact the N64 has such a small bus bit is because the bandwidth is compensated by a fast clock rate. So you see that the two risc cpu's and the 68kcpu are working together genuinely. So by that fact alone, the bit rate of the system if 64bit and it's pretty clear really. Adding an instruction like in the SNES does not matter because the data is going to need two cycles to move the data through the external bus eventually and the clock speed/bit width is the speed of the bus.

@iwanttocomplain 2 ай бұрын

@@InglebardGaming kzfaq.info/get/bejne/ab2Vkr14tN3RmZ8.html this man is trying to make a new N64 game.

@tron3entertainment Ай бұрын

Sales guy tried to stop me from purchasing a Jaguar. Wish I had listened to him. McFur wasn't all that fun despite being an R-Type clone. So much promise. Bad marketing, so--so games and no controller stick.

@erockbrox8484 2 ай бұрын

What I like about the Jaguar that is not present in the Playstation 1 or Sega Saturn is that the Jaguar is a cartridge based 32 bit machine. This means that you can plug in a cartridge like the Game Drive, which has an FPGA on it and use this to increase the performance of the Jaguar. So if you really want to see the Jaguar truly deliver 64 bits, you can do this by programming a custom CPU within the FPGA of the Game Drive flash cart and give the jaguar some extra power. No joke.

@ArneChristianRosenfeldt Ай бұрын

Cartridge slot is only 32 bit and never the full clock rate ( not even half like memory).

@Mrshoujo Ай бұрын

You develop using a TT030 workstation instead of a PC Based Development kit.

@ArneChristianRosenfeldt Ай бұрын

@@Mrshoujo before we had the emulator. Workstation? At least a TT had a reasonable price unlike the SGI based development system for N64. I like how the development kit basically just has the full memory (RAM) and cartridge space (ROM) before Tramiel cuts down on cost and reduces it for the consumer console.

@jeremiahthomas8140 2 ай бұрын

IBM never distributed the Jaguar. IBM manufactured the Jaguar only. Atari did the distributing.

@InglebardGaming 2 ай бұрын

Every contemporary newspaper article I've read from the time said distribution was part of the deal. One example: www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1993-06-29-fi-8269-story.html

@user-rt9zq8rs9k Ай бұрын

IBM did part of the construction of the console .

@jeremiahthomas8140 Ай бұрын

@InglebardGaming Distributing implies that retailers contacted IBM to order products. I am 99% sure that never happened. Retailers ordered product through Atari.

@JohnCrawford1979 Ай бұрын

By the same rationale, because 99.99% of N64 games never fully utilized the console's 64 bit capabilities, and the ports sent to it were developed in 32 bit, then the N64 was not a 64 bit console because no one used its 64 bit capabilities. Heck, the Game Cube was developed with 32 bit tech because no one was using 64 bit tech because 32 bit was just good enough. As it is, 64-bit didn't get fully realized until the 2010's when multicore processors and computers needed more than 4 GB RAM to be able to keep up with growing demands of 3D modeling, animations, and graphics. Also when talking about chips and chip sets, consider that it's ridiculous to compare an Pentium i5 9th generation to an i5 14th generation, and more so to say the Pentium II is just as good, or exactly the same as both i5 chips because they're all Pentium chips. Because that's what a lot these echo chambers on the retro gaming YT channel seen to be doing these days, regurgitating the same Wki talking points without even a thought about what went into decades of development on the chips that improved how they worked over time.

@j.makison1547 Ай бұрын

Agreed! It was basically just a video crapping on the system by regurgitating talking points that people who have never actually researched the system properly always spew. So boring.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Echo chamber? Not exactly. As a Jag owner from the start I know the system has its die hard defenders and what the community is like. I even talked about how interesting the aftermarket/homebrew scene is on the system and showed the in development MK port. I didn't bring up the N64 at all because this video wasn't about the N64. If I ever end up doing a video on that system it'll be treated fairly and claims by Nintendo would be evaluated against the tech in the system and what they actually did with it. I wasn't easy on Nintendo in my SNES video, so I'm really not sure what your point was here in bringing up the N64.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

Yeah! The guy who made it didn't do any research at all! He definitely didn't provide links, or direct quotes or citations in the description! He definitely didn't show actual magazine articles during the video! And what, no brand new information on this system that was discontinued 30 years ago? Ridiculous! I mean, he couldn't have done any research at all!

@Phredreeke Ай бұрын

Here are the things that are 64-bit on the Jaguar. The data bus, the blitter and the object processor (the latter two both incorporated in the Tom chip). The data bus doesn't correlate to the CPU's bitness. The original Pentium had a 64 bit data bus, most computers nowadays have a 128-bit data bus (assuming you have two or more RAM modules plugged in), and the Xbox Series X has a 320-bit data bus. As for the blitter and object processors, both of those are fixed function. Doom has already been mentioned as repurposing the CPU in the Jerry chip for collision detection instead of music. You can't do that with the blitter or object processor.

@JohnCrawford1979 Ай бұрын

@@InglebardGaming - The N64 mention was a comparison in reasoning, in rationale, not about it being covered in the video. The point is that both were 64-bit systems, even if they had 32 bit capabilities, even if the majority of games at the time were already being developed in 32-bit even before being ported onto the consoles, so they never realized any of the 64-bit capabilities on the majority of the games because there was no point to, because 32 bit looked good enough. Heck, a lot of devs would still be running 32-bit XP on their computers even to this day because 32-bit tech had such a longstanding legacy reach of most of a decade. That was not the atmosphere in the 90's when the Jaguar came out, when a new computer you might of bought from Best Buy was already behind the curb of the rapidly growing tech at the time. Even with game consoles, We had the PC engine that was questionable if it was indeed 16-bit, and it could be argued that it wasn't a 'true' or 'fully' 16-bit console, to the Dreamcast that claimed to be 128 bit. Never mind that even today there is no such thing as a 128 bit operating system, unless it's somewhere still being worked on under some code project we have yet to hear about. The point is, even if the Jaguar was 'fully' or 'tuly' 64 bit, people were not programming for it, nor were there any dev kits capable of utilizing 64-bit.

@johneygd Ай бұрын

If only the jahduo was released, and if atari did came up with atari classics with many of their 8bit games on it including nintendo & sega games on it as well, i definitely would,ve loved the atari jaguar, what a misopertunity from atari to NOT releasing the atari jaduo because that 2 in 1 combo atari jaguar system could,ve compeated waaay better against the playstation,sega saturn and the N64, But also because the atari jagduo looks waaay more cooler then the atari jaguar, And yes that’s right, as a atari fan i dare to say that the atari jaguar just looks ugly, it’s just as ugly looking as the nec super grafix 16 system,yug.

@ArneChristianRosenfeldt Ай бұрын

When the Panther is so buggy, why did the Jaguar end up with its object processor? Whoever thought it would be great idea for videoDMA to have write permission to DRAM???

@ArneChristianRosenfeldt Ай бұрын

@@TheLairdsLair Sprite is like C64 , where the sprite patterns for the line are loaded 1:1 into shift registers. Then the C64 can expand them in x direction on the fly without hogging memory. Lynx only has a blitter. It loads patterns from RAM and stores them in RAM. This is shared RAM, so it does not care if it is written to or read from. Nothing is idle. SRAM has no fast page mode. So what of these do you mean? Jaguar has a linebuffer like the SEGA Genesis. Just the genesis draws to the buffer in horizontal retrace, while Jaguar has a double buffer for a better duty cycle.

@ArneChristianRosenfeldt Ай бұрын

@@TheLairdsLair According to Jeff Minter, the Panther's sprite hardware was very similar to the object processor in the Jaguar, to the point where both had the same limitations. Putting too many sprites on a single scan-line, for instance, would require too much time to draw the line and caused a "tearing" effect in the affected row. Ah, I always wondered when exactly the buffers swap. Now I just need to find out if the earliest the buffers swap is when the last pixel has just been drawn. How did Atari manage the async event? Pixel clock is not system clock, but better should exactly be in sync on both borders.

@ArneChristianRosenfeldt Ай бұрын

@@TheLairdsLair so like Jaguar and Neo Geo ( and some C64 demos ).

@MarquisDeSang Ай бұрын

club drive has better physics than the first 5 grand turismo.

@DNAsGhostzHouze Ай бұрын

My dude, don't start off by telling me you owned a Jaguar back in 93; that does not lend credibility to your opinion so much as it tells me you make bad purchasing decisions.

@InglebardGaming Ай бұрын

It was a Christmas present, I didn't buy it.

@DNAsGhostzHouze Ай бұрын

@@InglebardGaming fair enough.

@michaeljordan6008 Ай бұрын

Dope

@JohnCrawford1979 Ай бұрын

Depends on when you bought it. I still kick myself for not getting one, and a Jag CD back when you could get the packaged bundles with a choice of games for nearly half the price of the main console on its own when it was new.

@jasonmuller1199 Ай бұрын

Great video I didn't know a lot about Jaguar consoles, they were never sold in my country, and I am 1 of those people that mocks anyone that owns an Atari game console 😂

@Mrshoujo Ай бұрын

You get mocked for NOT buying Atari.