kzfaq.info/get/bejne/icmaZcxnns_DYIE.htmlsi=xpv5uPPg9Y-gc5ZO

Would it be possible to run both this new Mod and the older Mod with Helicopters at the same time?🤔

Only redo the carrier battles that interest you with submarines and ballistics in either order

Cold Waters is a game you guys can get on Steam, should be a decent trainer/information source for you guys to learn more about Submarine tactics and what not.

hey cap, do you know if cavitation or the subs' VLS is modeled? I have no idea what kind of missiles they carry, but i do know that our modern fast attacks have VLS launchers. as for cavitation, that is the creation and subsequent collapse of bubbles when you try to speed up too quickly. it makes a lot of noise, and can give away the location of a submarine, so subs *usually* speed up very slowly to prevent it. but if they get pinged and fired upon, then cavitation doesn't matter, so the boat's CO will order "ahead flank cavitate" which lets the throttlemen know that it's pucker time, and they need to throw the throttles wide open instead of slowly speeding up.

Honestly surprised the Shipwrecks didn't home on the tanker by mistake as close as the targeted sub was.

Well yeah my experience has shown that detecting a US boat near a battle group is close to impossible due to the ambient noise generated by nine surface ships going 10 knots or greater. The sub has all of the advantages.

Didn't Clancy also pen a non-fictional 688i book similar to "Fighter Wing?" I couldn't find it while patrolling Amazon, but I swear I remember it.

@@cheddar2648 I believe it was called SSN.

I was going to add a comment saying read Red Storm Rising 😃

​@@cheddar2648Great book. He went on a patrol on a 688 and a British sub. Amazing access.

Pretty sure it's a country with good ASW to detect an American sub. It's countries with submarines we can't detect.

Well, every submarine can be detected if they act stupid. Combined Arms bug made them surface inadvertently and the boys didn't really know a whole lot about what they were doing anyway so there's that. Ideally, all they needed to do was to stay under 20 knots and not stray into active sonar range but that would have made a pretty boring video.

@@subjectc7505 you'd think. But the OPFOR has to get REALLY lucky, or the sub has to WANT to be found.

@@hugeinjapan4635 no one is "Lucky" to detect an American submarine. That's like the time an Swedish submarine was capable of sneaking toward a whole Carrier group, I'm guessing they're "lucky"

@@subjectc7505 a carrier group isn't a submarine. It's extremely easy for a sub to sneak up on a carrier group. That's kinda their thing.

Not necessarily. Some ASW surface ships are much quieter than you think. If you run silent (i.e., no radar emissions) it can be very hard for the sub to find the surface ship, too. Depending.

​@@jaredjohnson8553Remember the report of how loud the Type 45 destroyer is? They could be heard by submarines from over 100 nautical miles away.

​@@jaredjohnson8553lol😂 yeah, no. Surface ships are just targets.

I am a former Bubblehead, All surface ships are Targets. that is what surface ships are. and his information about passive sonar not being extreemly precise is hogwash. and any boat commander that would use active sonar should be relieved of command

@@weaverclips Once a bubblehead always a bubblehead. Submarines once... Submarines twice... Holy.... Oops that's not fit for civilian servers.

dipping ... play on words ?

i doubt the shipwrecks would ever be set to target submarines in real life. it would require significant effort, and it would never be needed, because subs are simply NOT on the surface long enough. however, there ARE (lots of) dedicated weapons designed to kill subs on the surface.

Subs can deploy with a CVBG but are not always in close contact. Many times the sub is off doing independent operations depending on its tasking.

When did the boys become an AI? 🤣

@@lutfullahkarahanl2998 About 3 years ago.

@@lutfullahkarahanl2998 Oh wow I didn't realize the Subs were human controlled lol. Very Clever but not really in the spirit of an actual battle.

if the shoe was on the other foot the Russians would happily trade at that rate

Agreed, RUM-139 VL-ASROC, for example...

I remember his rampage on a US Carrier Strike Force using an Alpha. It made me feel the terror the Navy had until they made the M48 ADCAP.

exactly ... and no vikings left

Passive sonar is seemingly inaccurate here but it is possible to narrow the range down over multiple scan cycles. That tool has a special tab for doing just that. If you're, say, 30 nm from the thing you're tracking, you'll usually reach 1 nm accuracy or better in less than 5 minutes. The idea here is to not allow fleeting contacts to be pinpointed instantly and to give the players something interesting to do.

LOL, I completely agree with you of course. IRl, just like to a hammer everything is a nail. Every surface ship is about to be pounded by a US modern sub.

So when are Royal Navy going to put my in command of one of the Queen Liz carriers? Oh...

@@grimreapers they have two, so you've got a spare.

​@@iseriver3982I don't think they're as stupid as the Russians... 😂

1) no wire 2) don't think so 3) I think so but not sure how realistic 4) correct BUT the cool thing about this is EVENTUALLY it could be integrated into a full naval and aerial scenario. We're a ways off that yet obviously.

The ability of Russian surface vessels detecting UK Astute or US Virginia SSNs at 10 miles, without helicopters, is laughable. A Swedish conventional sub, and an Australian conventional sub are both credited with a simulated kills 49:42 against US carriers during war games. The carriers had tight screening but were unable to pick up the subs. Subs are incredibly hard to detect. If a UK or US sub Skipper is detected at 10 miles out, their careers are over. Your model is badly flawed.

@@ohiobrian8993Conventional subs are very hard to detect. Nuke boats have to keep pumps running.

@@grimreapers 3 Virginia class submarines could carry up to 120 tomahawk block 5 missiles , which have anti ship capabilities

@@Dimitris_Datseris definitely true. but that's for another day

Good idea.

Roger, I just want to get the basic add-on working first then we'll worry about proper tactics etc.

I use to work with surface ship sonar techs and they would tell me that if they were looking for an Ohio class, they would search for the quietest part of the ocean.

"It's quiet. _Too_ quiet..."

Well considering tomahawks are land attack missiles (for the time being at least), them conducting a TLAM strike would serve zero tactical benefit in this scenario.

accurate

You are telling me there is a bug in game Grump? I don't believe you...

@@grimreapers I would never insinuate that DCS is flawed...

​@@grimreapers Maybe you can change your mind if Grump provides his perspective. 😜

I played Harpoon for decades until computers wouldn't run it. It was 100% better than this simulation.

Same with RSR. Couldnt play it any longer on modern PCs. However I found an online version of the game a few years ago during Covid. It really helped me get through the lockdowns. You might be able to find Harpoon online as well.@@NanoBurger

lol

7:00 slight correction: the towed array is NOT the entire sensor capacity of the sub. it's just vastly better than what the sub alone can do. 9:45 slight correction: ALL undersea detection is based on SOUND, or being SOLID. passive sonar only detects sound. thus, any ship could "hide" from passive sonar by going silent, i.e. turning the engines off. not something you would necessarily want to do with surface ships, but certainly possible. 13:15 tactical note: there's not much point in dropping a sonobuoy BEHIND a ship. subs are only a threat from the FRONT arc. and, although the simulation probably gives you an infinite number of sonobuoys, they ARE limited consumables, especially in helicopters. indeed, the small number of sonobuoys a helicopter can carry makes them quite ineffective against undetected subs. but it's all the soviets have. and with the viking decommissioned, ... 14:05 ASW procedures: ending the tutorial there gives the subs a HUGE advantage. the really big problem surface ships have is LOCATING enemy subs BEFORE they launch torpedos. in modern times, ONE torpedo, launched properly, will sink ANY ship (except a carrier), guaranteed. therefore, you have to have a bunch of aircraft AHEAD of your ships, constantly using their detectors. that is a difficult process, and (wild guess) won't happen at all here. 17:00 tactical note: the main reason ships are pretty weak in detecting subs is they ALWAYS make noise. subs are typically slower than surface ships, so must get ahead of them, but then they can just sit and wait for the ships to stumble into the death trap. you make no mention of helicopter use. thus the plan you guys came up with should produce an automatic failure. now for the bad news: your carrier carries TWO Ka-27 ASW helos, and your frigates carry NONE. you need a dozen. in other words, you have NO CHANCE at all here. may as well scuttle your ships now. 19:00 i can answer that. your ships are making too bloody much NOISE to hear anything 19:50 sprint ... stop and listen ... repeat ... excellent tactic 20:00 NOOOO don't do that, especially not with the carrier 20:19 and kiss that frigate good-bye (except for the RoE) 21:45 sub range estimated 10 nm, torpedo range 5 nm, shooting now won't work. 25:45 no helicopters ... no hope 26:15 if this boat's rocking ... what ARE your guys doing? 27:00 woof ... at least SOMEONE on your team (the AI) knows what to do. and it is specifically THAT sub that was going to sink the carrier. crash DIVE, nimrod. you do know what the SUB in SUBmarine stands for, right ? 27:30 i think i just died laughing. are these anti-ship missiles unable to recognize subs? 28:45 remember, those are HUMANS you're facing. just a wild guess ... he surfaced to do a RADAR scan, then dropped back down when missiles started exploding all around him. 33:35 subs are faster on the surface. and remember the rules: the subs don't need to survive. they just need to keep the carrier away from the box edge. 35:45 i say again, those are HUMANS out there. VERY tricky. all of them prepared to die for mother russia (oh, right, die for uncle sam), if they can only stop the carrier. and while a carrier DOES expect to survive a single torpedo hit, it won't be happy, no sir. and these are soviets ... not american-style damage control over there. maybe you sink your own ship. 36:45 and so, exactly as i predicted, you had NO CHANCE at all. but overall, despite being only an early version of the sub-surface game expansion, it is already a first-rate simulation, and it clearly demonstrates why submarines are so deadly. and this doesn't even consider that if you can only get a sub near enough to enemy ships to give the cruise missiles a decent destination ... very well done by everyone involved

after the main event ... 38:30 remember, that sub is out of ammo

The game was(is) as you mention. It came with the paperback too! Still got my ZX Spectrum copy upstairs 👍

Probably, first need to get ships and helicopters working together.

I believe this is bug yes...

Are you shouting because you've had to be quiet so long?

Didn't realize I had all caps on my keyboard set. Hope I did not offend anybody's ear canals by shouting through the.keyboard.

Please contact me in the GR Discord(link in vid description). Will try to organise you in next battle.