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A False Alarm That Crashed A Jet | TWA Flight 843

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Mini Air Crash Investigation

Mini Air Crash Investigation

Күн бұрын

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This is the story of TWA flight 843. On the 30th of july 1992 an L1011 was planning to fly from New yorks JFK airport to san francisco. The flight had 280 passengers and 12 crew members on board. At about 5:16 pm EDT ATC came on and cleared the plane to taxi to runway 13R.The runway was more than 14,000 feet long, more than enough for this L1011 tristar to get airborne.
By 5:40 pm the plane was at the runway and the first officer was at the controls ready to take his plane into the sky. The captain acknowledged their takeoff clearance. Power was advanced and flight 843 was on its way to san francisco.
As the plane picked up speed the captain called V1,, indicating that they couldnt reject the takeoff after this point. They went past the Vr speed and the plane started lifting off into the sky. At an altitude of about 16 feet the stick shakers activated and the first officer said, “getting a stall”. A stall is a situation in which your wings arent generating lift to keep the plane in the air. In the cockpits the control columns vibrate letting the pilots know that they were very close to a stall. Its designed to draw your attention to it because it's just that serious. The first officer felt that the plane wasnt performing as usual. He felt that the plane could not climb out and handed the plane over to the captain by saying “you got it”. The captain now had a split second to make a life or death decision, the fate of 292 people rested on his shoulders. In the background The flight engineer kept saying “ get it off get it off” and they got a transmission from the tower “TWA 843 heavy, numerous flames”. The captain saw runway the in front of him, but it was unlikely that theyd have enough runway to come to a stop. He checked the status of the plane, the plane had the right attitude for takeoff and the right air speed but he felt that the plane would not fly. Heres a quote from the report. “ He said he positively did not believe that the airplane would fly”. 1.7 seconds after the captain assumed control of the plane the plane touched back down on the runway. He applied full reverse thrust and maximum braking, but the plane was not slowing down fast enough. It was almost as if the brakes were losing their effectiveness. In front of him loomed a blast fence beyond the end of the runway. They just had 1500 feet of runway left and the plane was still travelling at 100 knots. The captain knew that they would run out of runway before they stopped. So he turned the plane left onto the grass. He was confident that he could stop the plane on the grass or the concrete beyond it. As the plane left the runway a thump signaled that the nose gear had collapsed. Soon the plane came to a stop on the grass. The captain immediately turned off the fuel and the ignition switches. He asked the first officer to pull the fire extinguishers in the engines. He immediately got on the PA system and said “"This is the captain, evacuate the aircraft." After that he went into the cabin to direct the evacuation. They were not out of trouble; they opened one of the hatches on the right side only to find flames and smoke outside. The captain walked through the plane one last time and making sure that no one was left behind. He was the last one to leave the plane.
In 90 seconds passengers and crew were beside the plane watching it burn, within minutes the firefighters showed up and it took them about 45 minutes to get the blaze in control. The burnt husk of the plane smouldered on the side of the runway. Looking at the plane youd think that it was a mass casualty event, but miraculously every one survived. That was due to the amazing work by the crew. It's even more incredible when you consider that the crew did not have access to a few of the exits due to the fire. Even with that they were able to evacuate almost 300 people in about 90 seconds. Hats off to them.

Пікірлер: 523
@MiniAirCrashInvestigation
@MiniAirCrashInvestigation 3 жыл бұрын
Small correction The "numerous flames" call by the ATC was made right after they touched back down"
@fredashay
@fredashay 3 жыл бұрын
Aha! AOA sensors again!!!
@pascalcoole2725
@pascalcoole2725 3 жыл бұрын
Verry relevant though !!
@alokeparvati
@alokeparvati 3 жыл бұрын
Not small but very significant
@pascalcoole2725
@pascalcoole2725 3 жыл бұрын
@@fredashay This however was a Tristar, not a model-T Boeing with a upgrade pack
@fredashay
@fredashay 3 жыл бұрын
@@pascalcoole2725 LoL :-)
@abh2cool1
@abh2cool1 3 жыл бұрын
"According to Board pilots should have looked at all information available before deciding"!!! Yeah sure, those pilots had all the time in the world!! 🤷
@stevenlemieux7220
@stevenlemieux7220 3 жыл бұрын
Next time they should flip a coin first.
@patrickmollohan3082
@patrickmollohan3082 3 жыл бұрын
But the NTSB is from the government..and they are here to help!!🤣😅🤯😲
@TimothyChapman
@TimothyChapman 3 жыл бұрын
Alternate history: Flight Computer: "STALL, STALL" Pilots: "Let's make sure this isn't a false ala-"
@Carlos44
@Carlos44 2 жыл бұрын
@@patrickmollohan3082 Want to fly without an NTSB?? I don't.
@patrickmollohan3082
@patrickmollohan3082 2 жыл бұрын
@@Carlos44 I was just being facetious Carl. I'm well aware of the importance of the NTSB sir. Sorry if I upset you man..it wasnt intentional.✈
@timmack2415
@timmack2415 3 жыл бұрын
I think the captain, with the data he had, combined with the lack of time, can't be faulted here. Most importantly, everyone survived.
@hariman7727
@hariman7727 3 жыл бұрын
Yeah. Monetary damage only, no deaths.
@martinb3927
@martinb3927 2 жыл бұрын
If an AOA sensor has ONE incident, duh…..in the fk#ing trash!!!!!!!!
@hilbertmolen1020
@hilbertmolen1020 2 жыл бұрын
Indeed, the captain was given the controls and had litarally 2 seconds to make the decision of his life
@craigusselman546
@craigusselman546 Жыл бұрын
Its nice this turned out alright or everyone well except the plane...
@mikewhipkey6863
@mikewhipkey6863 3 жыл бұрын
It's easy to criticize the pilots decision when you are standing on the ground
@ARCANEmateCLAN
@ARCANEmateCLAN 3 жыл бұрын
The judgement isn't so much a critique of the pilot from what I get but more of a judicial style decision on what future guidance should be for issues of that sort.
@hariman7727
@hariman7727 3 жыл бұрын
Exactly. A review board can take days to analyze something that occurred that gave a pilot only a second or two to make the right choice. This is the one in a million shot where taking the standard reaction to a stick shaker after that exact point in the flight of putting the plane down was technically the wrong choice, if you are magic and can see all that is happening with your plane at that exact moment.
@mrkiplingreallywasanexceed8311
@mrkiplingreallywasanexceed8311 2 жыл бұрын
Absolutely.... I know flight crew are meant to act like the skilled professionals they are trained to be, but at the same time, in another Universe, the Captain would have made the determination they weren't stalling, decided to continue with the takeoff - and in this mythical parallel accident scenario, it would have transpired they were indeed stalling and the decision to carry on would have cost everyone on board their lives. 20/20 hindsight is always a wonderful thing, especially when you are talking about additionally dealing with a lot of stress when something is apparently going really wrong at an acutely critical point - not just taking off, but past V1, flying down the runway at 160mph, in the middle of rotating and fully loaded with fuel and passengers and suddenly you've got the goddamned stick shaker going off. It makes me quite cross that there did seem to be an implied level of blame directed towards the pilots when the report said words along the lines that despite the stick shaker, they had correctly set and checked the flaps, had enough thrust and speed, the FDR showed the 'plane was flying fine - and that there were other means that could have been used to determine that they were not, in fact, stalling and that they could have carried on with the take-off. While possibly true, I'd like to see the people who wrote that report make that "correct" decision under those conditions and again, to refer to my alternate reality example, in that case they would have been open to (implied) criticism for ignoring the stick shaker. An extraordinarily high pressure and critical scenario where it's difficult to imagine more than a few percent of pilots carrying on with the take-off with a similar train of events - and even then, those that would have done so would likely have been relying on the toss of a coin rather than a carefully judged decision based on the other factors the accident report suggested could (and should) have been considered ....
@commerce-usa
@commerce-usa 3 жыл бұрын
I was amazed to learn the pilots got dinged for this event. There would have been near zero time to accomplish what the board found. They may have lost the aircraft, but everyone survived. They went with data presented and given the time and circumstances, did an amazing job.
@AudieHolland
@AudieHolland 3 жыл бұрын
Right. You should have checked at all the flaps, your actual airspeed and the amount of thrust each engine was giving. We realize there was not much time but next time, please try to reset the cabin instruments because passenger airliners are expensive. Better to get it into the air anyway after passing V1. No congestion on the airport that way and if you have to crash, you have time to steer it away from the airport.
@commerce-usa
@commerce-usa 3 жыл бұрын
@@AudieHolland yup, it really does boggle the mind when expectations exceed the reasonable means to achieve them.
@ghostsofpunk
@ghostsofpunk 3 жыл бұрын
Unfortunately, this just goes to show how much more the industry cares about money than passengers. I realize an airplane is extremely expensive, but the safety of all passengers should be FIRST ALWAYS. And I don't think they should of gotten "dinged" for this either. In fact, they should have gotten some kind of award for keeping their passengers safe above all else.
@krozareq
@krozareq 3 жыл бұрын
Last thing you want behind the controls is a pilot who's going to second guess everything and hesitate to take action. Save the passengers and crew and let the insurance company deal with the property damage.
@patrickmollohan3082
@patrickmollohan3082 3 жыл бұрын
That's what insurance is for...replacing the jet. By the Captains actions, insurance did NOT have to pay victims families. I think that says it all.
@niku30504
@niku30504 3 жыл бұрын
That is one tough decision to make by the captain. It is a pilot’s instinct to lower the nose when you get the stick shaker. After V1, during rotation, you just don’t have the time to cross check other instruments. The captain had to make a split second decision, and his decision should be respected, because after all, nobody died.
@pascalcoole2725
@pascalcoole2725 3 жыл бұрын
If the Captain thinks the aircraft is not capable of flight, he is alowed to abort even beyond Vr. And yes, he then knows he's gona crash the plane on the ground. There have been cases where this was the beter option.
@kholmar
@kholmar 3 жыл бұрын
I agree, I think the Captain can be forgiven for the mistake since the FO basically panicked and handed him the aircraft with no warning... I clipped this from the NTSB report: The first officer, who was the flying pilot for the takeoff, incorrectly perceived that the airplane was stalling and gave control of of the airplane to the captain without proper coordination of the transfer of control. and The National Transportation Safety Board determines that the probable causes of this accident were design deficiencies in the stall warning system that permitted a defect to go undetected, the failure of TWA's maintenance program to correct a repetitive malfunction of the stall warning system, and inadequate crew coordination between the captain and first officer that resulted in their inappropriate response to a false stall warning.
@patriciamariemitchel
@patriciamariemitchel 3 жыл бұрын
Right.
@krozareq
@krozareq 3 жыл бұрын
The captain didn't have the luxury of sitting in an office somewhere pouring over the data. Every split second counted. On a 14,000ft rwy it's better to go off the rwy while being on the ground and having bled off most of the energy with toe brakes, spoilers, and reversers than to nose over into a fireball while trying to rotate a plane that's giving stall warnings . Had the plane crashed after taking off and they heard stick shakers on the CVR then it would've been determined to be pilot error for not responding to the aircraft's warning. Nobody wants to reject a takeoff after V1. If they run into something the first thing to get crushed is the flight deck. The captain did the right thing for the goal of preservation of human life from the information he had and a stick shaker going off is nothing to ever dismiss.
@krozareq
@krozareq 3 жыл бұрын
Also to add that the airline should've listened to their pilots that something was wrong with the AOA system and not just test it out, probably just once, and assume they were lying about a type that those pilots know well.
@3Greens
@3Greens 3 жыл бұрын
Lots of people might not realise that most airline's SOPs do allow for rejected takeoffs after Vr if the plane is "unsafe or unable to fly". I think their decision was appropriate in this case.
@wilkgr
@wilkgr 3 жыл бұрын
@Chris While the NTSB did blame the crew (as mentioned in the video), apparently TWA stood behind them: *The conclusions from the NTSB were disappointing. But TWA never faltered; "Our pilots did everything right"* www.twaflight843.com/investigation.html
@blargvlarg1390
@blargvlarg1390 3 жыл бұрын
Coincidentally, the video by the MentorPilot a few days ago is on Ameristar Air Cargo Flight 9363, where the captain also had to abort after Vr because the plane couldn't climb.
@kholmar
@kholmar 3 жыл бұрын
@Chris agreed except for one thing, the FO panicked and handed off control with no warning or coordination...I can forgive the Captain but the FO at a minimum needed more training
@kholmar
@kholmar 3 жыл бұрын
@Chris no I agree, I can't know, it just felt like it based on the CVR how the handoff was done and truthfully, I think the handoff was the only thing done really wrong. I am not certain I agree with the "inappropriate response to false stall warning"... we are trained to push the controls forward when we get a stall indication...period. the idea that they should have figured it out and flown it out RIGHT THE F... NOW I don't think I agree with that, LOL
@krozareq
@krozareq 3 жыл бұрын
@@wilkgr Good to hear TWA did the right thing here. 100% behind the captain on this. A split-second decision to preserve human life and he did everything he could to save everyone, which he did. I'd fly in his plane any day.
@FlywithMagnar
@FlywithMagnar 3 жыл бұрын
The captain made the right decision to stop. He couldn't know that the AOA sensor had failed, and there wasn't time to investigate the problem. When you are uncertain whether the airplane will fly, you stop, even after V1. And kudos to the cabin crew who managed to get everybody out in time. Next time you fly, give the cabin crew respect they deserve.
@MeMe-gm9di
@MeMe-gm9di 3 жыл бұрын
Yeah, and if you (for example) compare it with the most recent video of Mentour, sometimes you have to abort a takeoff after v1/vr. Damaged property is better than dead humans
@millomweb
@millomweb 3 жыл бұрын
The captain made the right decision to stop." ABSOLUTELY. Zero fault of the captain. Steering onto the grass was an excellent move. As was extinguishing the engines. As was getting everyone off quickly. A successful landing is one where everyone walks away. Stuff the aircraft - saving then only occurs with an 'ideal landing' :) The FO on getting the stickshaker, should have asked himself "Are we flying?" Airspeed correct ? climb speed correct ? If both YES, then keep going but possibly reduce climb rate.
@feelincrispy
@feelincrispy 3 жыл бұрын
Couldn’t agree more. It really pisses me of when I see a passenger being an asshole to a flight attendant. Just shut up and sit down. Your no more important than anyone else on this plane
@doinasdanescu6594
@doinasdanescu6594 3 жыл бұрын
V1 is the speed beyond there is no chance to stop the airplane on the runway.They are all so lucky to be alive...
@blatherskite9601
@blatherskite9601 3 жыл бұрын
AOA failure... reminds me of more recent occurrences in Boeing aircraft.
@byronarnason6006
@byronarnason6006 3 жыл бұрын
I was an electronic mechanic for TWA in SFO. Most planes that I worked on in SFO had THREE!!! separate and totally independent Pitot-Static plumbing systems. We checked those systems accurately and religiously. We knew that lives depended on doing our duties properly. Many times I would see pilots at 3AM with a flashlight poking around their plane to try to assure that everything was perfect before take-off. Pilots and crew knew that their lives depended on our competence and honor and we tried to be worthy of their trust. This was an AMAZING CREW. Thank God for pilots and crews like this! Your story-telling narrative and extreme detail are VERY welcomed. Good job!
@LunaticTheCat
@LunaticTheCat 2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the great insight Byron!
@fhwolthuis
@fhwolthuis 3 жыл бұрын
I'd rather have a captain who puts the plane down like this than someone who takes a risk and takes off anyway
@ajbent1
@ajbent1 3 жыл бұрын
Putting the plane down was the more risky action in this case, no?
@Star-xx5zr
@Star-xx5zr 3 жыл бұрын
@@ajbent1 not when you have seconds to make a life or death decision. Its really easy to judge the pilots after all is said and done, because you know everything about the event. They didnt have time to seat through a 10 minute video explaining in details what was wrong, and were forced to act to the best of their knowledge at the time.
@ajbent1
@ajbent1 3 жыл бұрын
@@Star-xx5zr I'm not judging the pilot's choice, but more commenting that deciding which choice is riskier is often not obvious or intuitive. Sometimes wanting to get back to ground feels "safer" even though it is actually the riskier path. At the end of the day, if everyone was able to walk away safely, it's hard to say it was a bad choice.
@stripeybeast
@stripeybeast 3 жыл бұрын
@@ajbent1 i dunno, I’m more afraid of the ground than the air when flying. Seems like it was a gamble, and aborting takeoff was the compromise. Based on the info available at the time in a split second, the potential consequences were: a) Takeoff and things may be just fine, but if they aren’t then it’d be catastrophic b) abort takeoff and accept sacrificing the plane in exchange for a result that’s likely to be catastrophic I don’t think the pilots made any poor judgements.
@Milesco
@Milesco 3 жыл бұрын
@@stripeybeast : Did you mean to say "Abort takeoff and accept sacrificing the plane in exchange for a result that's NOT (or LESS) likely to be catastrophic"?
@danilon3121
@danilon3121 3 жыл бұрын
Another great video. Definitely think the crew made the right call to abort the take-off. A faulty stall warning is very rare and while stopping past V1 is dangerous, trying to lift a plane that's stalling as you're hurdling at 120+ knots towards houses and trees is even more dangerous.
@NightMotorcyclist
@NightMotorcyclist 3 жыл бұрын
Which is why I say the FAA and NTSB are just making these calls behind the safety of hindsight and not actually being in the flight deck as it was happening. LaGuardia and JFK are airports where you don't really want take a chance when things go wrong as you're faced either with bodies of water or structures like apartment buildings and bridges.
@danilon3121
@danilon3121 3 жыл бұрын
@@NightMotorcyclist I agree that the report in this case seemed disappointingly one sided. With the benefit of hindsight it's easy to say they should have taken off and would have been fine, but in the moment the pilots had to make a choice. They saw that there should be enough space to stop, even if it's outside of runway boundaries, so they made the call. If they had have persisted with take-off but there was an actual problem, chances are everybody would have died.
@kirilmihaylov1934
@kirilmihaylov1934 3 жыл бұрын
@@danilon3121 yes that is true
@kirilmihaylov1934
@kirilmihaylov1934 3 жыл бұрын
@@NightMotorcyclist yeah we saw that in 2001
@billlawrence1899
@billlawrence1899 3 жыл бұрын
@@danilon3121 Exactly. The board has unlimited time to sit in a safe comfortable room to evaluate everything once facts are known. It's easy to criticize. That captain had a second to make a life or death decision based on the information he was suddenly presented with. And no doubt he was aware of American 191.
@PWNsoldier
@PWNsoldier 3 жыл бұрын
I've heard about FAR too many crashes caused because pilots either didn't react at all, appropriately, or quickly enough to a stick shaker. It's an incredibly dire warning, and if the pilots of this plane react as they did any other time they get it, they'll be doing the right thing.
@testaccount4191
@testaccount4191 3 жыл бұрын
yeah, he trusted the system which was checked just before the incident and had 2 seconds to act on information he believed was true
@radiosification
@radiosification 3 жыл бұрын
@@testaccount4191 Yeah. So many accidents seem to be caused by pilots not believing their instruments are correct. It seems better to err on the side of just believe the instruments when there's no time to make more thorough checks. In my opinion the pilot's actions were completely reasonable.
@patrickmollohan3082
@patrickmollohan3082 3 жыл бұрын
@@testaccount4191 But the overlords at the NTSB blamed the pilots for "not taking appropriate action during a false stall warning"?? Where the hell did they come up with that? I wonder if any of these investigators hold, or at least held, an ATP rating? If they did...it would be a wonder! Those pilots were "expected DC" to process everything and to react properly bc they would've knew it was a false stall warning... bullshit!! They had 1-2 secs, MAYBE, to find a solution. Well that Captain DID come up with the correct solution!! It cost a plane, but saved everyone's life!! Plus it let investigators find the use and reuse of defective important components. That alone saved countless MORE lives bc hopefully that shit stopped occurring.
@testaccount4191
@testaccount4191 3 жыл бұрын
@@patrickmollohan3082 yeah exactly, what they did there was scare all future captains not to positive action. That mentality gets people killed
@higueraft571
@higueraft571 2 жыл бұрын
@@testaccount4191 You mean pilots should just ingore sensors telling them that "bad things are happening"? And... you know, most likely kill more people and trash more planes? Brilliant. It's wiser to risk a 50/50 95+% death rate than to lose the plane but save most if not all of the people, apparently?
@ScottDLR
@ScottDLR 3 жыл бұрын
The reluctance to get rid of unconfirmed failed parts is huge. As a tech, I either tortured them until I could verify the failure or they "went away". There are also a lot of bad or arrogant techs that wont take the time to make a part fail or just assume the people involved are stupid.
@michaelm1
@michaelm1 3 жыл бұрын
The pilots did great. There was no time for them to consider or test the possibility of faulty sensor, especially if they tested the sensor before. They had seconds. Even if they could take off, flying with a stick shaker constantly running or disabled wouldn't be safe. Then they wouldn't be warned if the plane was about to stall. What they did was the safest choice given the circumstances.
@chlyon
@chlyon 3 жыл бұрын
5% chance say of it being an actual stall = death 95 % chance faulty AOA with a 80 % chance of survival . what your FINAL answer you have 1.2 seconds . That's correct , you have balls of brass . Land it and hope to live another day .
@disphoto
@disphoto 3 жыл бұрын
Add to that, if you put the plan down now immediately, you might stay within the confines of the airport with fire equipment. Take 10 seconds to see if the flaps or something else is not working and you have no chance. KZfaq is littered with video of crashed planes and everyone died where the pilots assumed a sensor was faulty and they had more than a second to decide.
@AudieHolland
@AudieHolland 3 жыл бұрын
Anyone remember that scene from the movie "Glory (1989)," which was parodied in a South Park episode? (holds loaded revolver near trainee's head) "Faster!" (fires gun into the air next to the trainee's head) "FASTER!"
@NightMotorcyclist
@NightMotorcyclist 3 жыл бұрын
Yeah, FAA and NTSB can make all the judgement calls they want behind the safety of simulation and hindsight. In NYC you have little room for error when taking off from the runways of LaGuardia and JFK as it's either surrounded by water or buildings. Take a chance and try to save it from an impending stall may have done something else.
@rilmar2137
@rilmar2137 3 жыл бұрын
Great video as always. I think that in the very limited time they had to take action the crew did what seemed to be the best thing to do based on the informations they had
@MiniAirCrashInvestigation
@MiniAirCrashInvestigation 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks rilmar!
@hariman7727
@hariman7727 3 жыл бұрын
I agree. Review boards need to take into account the time available to make the decision. If the angle of attack sensor had failed during flight, there would have been time to figure out that the sensor was failing. But during takeoff the margin of error is measured in split seconds, so there's no time to double check and then realize you are stalling in the 99.9% of other cases where a stick Shaker triggers during takeoff.
@kilroy1964
@kilroy1964 3 жыл бұрын
So basically, being stingy about a faulty part, cost them an entire airplane. (And nearly lives as well.)
@gnosticmom2805
@gnosticmom2805 3 жыл бұрын
Exactly. When bean counters control the airline.
@stevenlemieux7220
@stevenlemieux7220 3 жыл бұрын
Watch the video again. TWA wasn't being stingy, they used calendar day's instead of hours. The AOA was replaced 3 times within several months apart. Had they checked the hours the problem existed early on each three incident and was replaced hours apart instead the AOA was replaced 3 times say however time frame in calendar 18 months??? etc... talk about stingy AA used a forklift to put a dc10 engine on to save thousand man hours and maintenance cost on flight 191 in Chicago O'Hare that killed 273 people. Don't forget Eastern flt. 401 when a 25 cent light bulb caused that crash. all plane crash you tube channels the majority crashes goes to Pan Am, Delta and United.
@mikemoreno4469
@mikemoreno4469 3 жыл бұрын
I'm not satisfied with the official report: the plane not only had a stall warning but physically would not lift off. Also, the tower said there were "numerous flames" . That was before the plane touched down. So, there appears to have been a fuel leak before the touch down. The next aspect is the brakes that lost power. We know there was a faulty AOA sensor but that obviously wasn't the only fault with this plane. Seeing as the pilot only had a split second to react, he did a marvellous job of saving his passengers. If he had decided to try to lift off, it could have led to a Concorde-style disaster! The pilot cannot be criticised in any way. He performed magnificently under tremendous pressure. He deserves a medal .
@AIRDRAC
@AIRDRAC 3 жыл бұрын
It's likely that the brakes simply overheated, as there is a max speed for max brakes for that exact reason. You can only convert so much momentum to heat, before overheating either brake pads (lowering their effectiveness) , brake fluid/cables(lowering/removing brake pressure) or the rims (and thus blowing up the tires), leading to significantly decreased stopping power.
@drnogueiras8783
@drnogueiras8783 3 жыл бұрын
There was a mistake in the video about when the report of flames came in, it was after touchdown. The rest is explained adequately, except for the criticism of the captain imo
@robertbarber4486
@robertbarber4486 3 жыл бұрын
Actually their was much debate about when the tower told them of the flames. According to FDR and CVR the fire comment was made simultaneously with the A/C touchdown. The NTSB claimed it was a timing issue and thus determined the touchdown occurred prior to the tower transmission. The L1011 had a main spar issue which is part of what led to the early retirement of the fleet at both TWA and Delta. I am friends with the Flight Engineer and he is now a retired AA Captain.
@mikemoreno4469
@mikemoreno4469 3 жыл бұрын
@@robertbarber4486 , wow! That is a revelation. Thank you very much for that.
@stevekingdon
@stevekingdon 3 жыл бұрын
Not a pilot - just someone that wastes too much time on KZfaq - and just wasted an hour of my life reading the report. CVR transcript from the report says flames were seen by the tower after touchdown. The plane was 71,000lb overweight for landing; it was only just under max takeoff weight - are brakes designed to take this - esp under hard braking? I'm not sure if the perceived failure to lift off was real; could that not be confirmation bias from the stick shaker? It was a clear calm day - could you not have checked the attitude indicator? Don't think the report blames the crew per-se, is more the inadequate training/CRM/procedures. And agree with you think the pilot did a great job - in rugby, a team-mate passing you the ball a split second before you get crunched in a tackle is called a hospital pass - this guy got given one by the first officer. Juan Brown from Blancoliro says aviate, navigate, communicate - he aviated and everyone walked away - isn't that the definition of a good landing :)
@garbagegremlins4707
@garbagegremlins4707 3 жыл бұрын
I like the ones where no one dies the best. I still get to hear about catastrophic failure but without having to feel sad about loss of life
@GenericGeeza
@GenericGeeza 3 жыл бұрын
I saw the thumbnail said a miracle in new york and thought 'Wait why?' Then after watching I can see why, no deaths and a captain who is last to leave, the truly a miracle
@isilder
@isilder 3 жыл бұрын
No,not a miracle. Engineers designed things ...
@bretten911
@bretten911 3 жыл бұрын
Definitely made the right call with the info and time he had, it’s easy to find better solutions in hindsight but having to make a decision under that stress and limited time is a whole different beast. If it was a stall like he rightly assumed, trying to power through would likely lead to a much worse crash. Aborting is the best bet, at that point screw the plane it’s the lives that matter and glad everyone made it out safely!
@TheLukaszpg
@TheLukaszpg 3 жыл бұрын
definietly not. V1 and VR are there for a reason. He had the speed. He had the flap and slats levers to read. He broke the rule and got lucky. How many aborted takeoffs (full of fuel) and well? Not many and this one got lucky. Should have not been praised for his actions.
@tobiasl.726
@tobiasl.726 3 жыл бұрын
@@TheLukaszpg kzfaq.info/get/bejne/bJePh9SWrrqpY30.html Would you still say that after watching this video? If they would have followed the rules everyone on board would have died. If the pilot concludes that the plane is not airworthy and can not climb than he has the right to reject the takeoff after v1. You should consider that he wasnt flying the plane. The FO was flying and gave him the control. He didnt really have time to test how the plane reacts to his inputs. He had to make a decision immediatly and the only info he could base his decision on was what the instruments were telling him. And there were so many crashes already were pilots just assumed the sensor was faulty and crashed because of that. If that would have been the case here too everyone would have blamed the pilot for taking off even though the instruments were teling him the plane cant fly.
@higueraft571
@higueraft571 2 жыл бұрын
@@TheLukaszpg Easy to judge with hindsight. Simply put, the plane was telling him he wasnt going to fly. And it's better to have a high-risk stop than to try to force it, find out it's *not* a malfunction, and plow through everything at the end at high speed with a full tank of fuel, with CERTAIN death for pretty much all onboard. Or you gamble and find out it *is* a false alarm. Yeah i'd take that former myself, fuck the 50/50 chance of just killing everyone.
@jamesstuart3346
@jamesstuart3346 3 жыл бұрын
The Transportation Safety Board should be given the same amount of time to write their report as the pilot had to make his decision
@erictaylor5462
@erictaylor5462 3 жыл бұрын
6:00 It is almost second nature for a pilot to dump the nose at the first sign of a stall. A well trained pilot will not even think about it, it is an automatic reflex, like putting your hand out when you start to fall. Stalls are extremely dangerous when you're close to the ground, and the quick fix it to lower the angle of attack of the wings. This means dumping the nose.
@glennchartrand5411
@glennchartrand5411 3 жыл бұрын
I dont know how you can fault the captain for rejecting the take-off when the plane was telling them it couldnt take-off. If the stall warning was real, continuing the take-off would kill every one. Going into the grass killed nobody.
@kjelladrian3205
@kjelladrian3205 2 жыл бұрын
Exactly! One of the most common pilot errors is that they don't trust their instruments and warnings systems when they absolutely should. This time they trusted the most clear, obvious and critical warnings system, the stick shaker. As they should. Damn if you do and damn if you don't ...
@eyetrapper
@eyetrapper 3 жыл бұрын
Man you've improved a lot since the beginning. Keep it up, throughly enjoyed
@MiniAirCrashInvestigation
@MiniAirCrashInvestigation 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks eye!!
@tommc290
@tommc290 3 жыл бұрын
I remember watching live coverage of this accident on tv knowing I was taking a flight into JFK the next morning. We landed on 31R just after dawn and I can still remember seeing the roasted carcass of the plane off to the left as we landed.
@jejewa2763
@jejewa2763 3 жыл бұрын
All alive The crew made the right decision. This seconds decision not 1/2 hour narrative.
@harrietharlow9929
@harrietharlow9929 3 жыл бұрын
I think they did, too.
@jimgraham6722
@jimgraham6722 3 жыл бұрын
Agree, stalling straight ahead not a good idea.
@PassiveSmoking
@PassiveSmoking 3 жыл бұрын
I think the pilots made the right call. It's easy to criticise them after the fact when you're sat safely on the ground in a comfy armchair with the FDR dump in front of you, but when you're barely 10 feet off the ground with your yolk vibrating like crazy in your grip as you barrel down the runway towards an ILS antenna your first thought probably isn't going to be to start running a checklist.
@YourSkyliner
@YourSkyliner 3 жыл бұрын
Unfortunate accident, but excellently handled by the flight crew. Aborting the takeoff was the right decision in this situation.
@alex2143
@alex2143 3 жыл бұрын
The biggest contributing factor was definitely the system by which a ticking time bomb could stay in circulation like that
@aerospaceguy4639
@aerospaceguy4639 3 жыл бұрын
An episode released today.. on my birthday. WOW. Thanks. My day is much better now. Love ur content!!!
@MiniAirCrashInvestigation
@MiniAirCrashInvestigation 3 жыл бұрын
Happy birthday!!
@SongADayPodcast
@SongADayPodcast 3 жыл бұрын
You don’t have time to “check all the systems” when you are past V1, much less V2 and rotation. You need to make a decision in 2 seconds. He chose the route that made sure everyone survived. That was the right decision.
@joerivanlier1180
@joerivanlier1180 3 жыл бұрын
Every crew member here performed excellent, even the first officer. If you really lost it, you best stop trying, a stick shaker is a major scare. Calling it pilot error is far too easy here. And as an engineer, never pick a part with a ? On it, that is totally a recipe for disaster.
@umadbra
@umadbra 3 жыл бұрын
I thought when he realized he didn't have enough runway, he turned the control back to the first officer and said back to you bro.
@over9000713
@over9000713 3 жыл бұрын
"Sorry bro, not my kind of problem"
@roy12525
@roy12525 3 жыл бұрын
Empowerment
@K1OIK
@K1OIK 3 жыл бұрын
bro?
@orionwesley
@orionwesley 3 жыл бұрын
I have a particular affection for the L1011s of TWA. I flew aboard one from Seattle to St. Louis and onto to Detroit. It was wonderful.
@fhowland
@fhowland 2 жыл бұрын
Jealous !
@sorgfaeltig
@sorgfaeltig 2 жыл бұрын
There was another problem that contributed to this accident: The stall warning (stick shaker) is disabled when the nose landing gear is compressed = aircraft on ground. It is enabled when the nose of the aircraft is rotated upwards on take-off. This gives a surprise / startle effect to the pilots in case there is a false stall warning. At this time the aircraft is still on ground with its main landing gears, or just leaving the ground at that moment. So the pilots could have the impression that the aircraft is in a real stall situation and is unable to fly. A bad situation will develp when the aircraft is put back just moments after lift-off at high speed. There were other accidents that were quite similar to this one, (DC-9 and DC-10). At a point in history there was a modifiction to the stall warning systems mandated to incorporate a five second time delay between the lift-off of the nose landing gear and the activation of a possible stall warning. During those five seconds the aircraft leaves the ground and there are indications of a positive climb. If a false stickshaker warning would start after the plane is clearly flying and climbing away from the ground, the pilot would not be tempted to believe that the aircraft is unable to fly, and therefore wold not abort the take-off. If after those five seconds, with no false stall warning, the pilot would try fo fly a too steep climb-out, the stall warning system would be able to warn the pilot in case of a real stall danger. Obviously the shown accident happened before the modification of the five second delay was implemented.
@vjrei
@vjrei 3 жыл бұрын
I am a project manager and I like these videos because they show the reasons we do not expect when dealing with a problem and who is accountable for it.
@Lyndiloo
@Lyndiloo 3 жыл бұрын
The comments section is absolutely here for the captain.
@u12uNiiGuNx
@u12uNiiGuNx 3 жыл бұрын
That’s amazing, never give flight attendants any shit because if something goes wrong they could save your life
@Umbry_Rose
@Umbry_Rose 3 жыл бұрын
Sadly, flight attendants just get ignored in many major events. Look at the miracle on the Hudson. Even on the Wiki page, only one flight attendant is named and it is because they had a laceration on their leg. The flight attendant who directed passengers away from the water coming in to the back of the aircraft is simply labelled a flight attendant and no name is given. What Sully did is incredible. But he wasn't the only hero on that plane and no one will remember any of the flight attendants involved. And this happens a lot across accidents with survivors.
@22vx
@22vx 3 жыл бұрын
You're very easy to listen to. Great job, as usual 👍
@rob737700
@rob737700 3 жыл бұрын
I was based at JFK at the time and remember seeing this plane in the grass for quite some time after the accident. The airline put a tarp over the TWA logo in an attempt to ward off bad publicity. We all had to start checking our aoa vanes every day as a result of this crash.
@thegregdavieschannel
@thegregdavieschannel 3 жыл бұрын
That was an unbelievably difficult call to have to make. Yes it's easy to say that if they'd ignored the stall indication they could have continued the flight incident free, but at the same time when your rapidly running out of runway, that's not the time to diagnose a technical issue. Had the indication been correct and they'd continued the most likely outcome would have been fatal for all on board. They made the best decision they could with the information they had, that's all you could ever ask for. To make a visual conformation of the flap settings, some one would have to have walked from the cockpit towards the back of the aircraft to see what was going on. With the runway running out, they're wasn't time for this.
@lightningstrikestwice6302
@lightningstrikestwice6302 3 жыл бұрын
In this crash the pilots and crew were heroes. Always will be second guessed but everybody lived. I believe there's another video on this great channel where the plane landed the pilot taxied off of the runway didn't evacuate in time cuz he wouldn't get off his hands and make a decision, everybody died.
@CoraVanLincolnius
@CoraVanLincolnius Жыл бұрын
just wanted to say that your video's are so easy to bingewatch, since you do not rely on visuals so much i can easily follow the story in the video due to the excelent narration while focussed on something else. I've watched plenty of your video's while doing TruckersMP stuff yesterday. Thanks for making them!
@Michael.Chapman
@Michael.Chapman 3 жыл бұрын
Most advanced, good looking wide body tri-Jet design was the L1011… Bit sad to live to see the L1011 and the 747 leave service-and who would’ve thought the incredible A380 would follow as quickly? Let’s hope the big twins are just as safe successors.
@Vxllain
@Vxllain 3 жыл бұрын
This was the same aircraft involved in TWA Flight 37 which nearly had a mid-air collision with American Airlines Flight 182
@wootle
@wootle 3 жыл бұрын
A True Captain, maximum respect. Their lives were in his hands and he wanted to be sure everyone was off.
@sciemk8723
@sciemk8723 3 жыл бұрын
If a part doesn't work properly, just try it in another plane. Wow that's worrying, I fly often.
@Decybello
@Decybello 3 жыл бұрын
Lucky it was a L1011 Tristar.... If he was flying 737MAX and decided to continue flying - it would actually stall, and if he'd rejected take-off it would pitch up for him and stall.... :D
@moseszero3281
@moseszero3281 3 жыл бұрын
The pilots are allowed to abort a takeoff after V1 if they think the plane cannot fly.
@hariman7727
@hariman7727 3 жыл бұрын
Yep. Poor maintenance procedures regarding suspect parts caused a critical component to fail and give the first officer and pilots an errant warning at a critical moment during takeoff. The pilot chose to err on the side of caution and abort the takeoff, with zero casualties.
@billthetraveler51
@billthetraveler51 3 жыл бұрын
Under the circumstances I have to agree with the captain to abort. The other option was to crash faster by pressing a bad position. Great job to evacuate everybody. As for as other lights that disagree with the stick shaker I can see the shaker would grab more attention. I really glad to have found your channel.
@markcampbell369
@markcampbell369 2 жыл бұрын
TWA L-1011 was my first wide body aircraft. June 1984 STL-SFO.
@jamesgraham6122
@jamesgraham6122 3 жыл бұрын
As pilots, we have a saying regarding 'Pilot Error'.. Pilot Error is what a board of examiners, each highly qualified in their aviation discipline, come up with after a 2-year investigation of an accident where the pilot had three seconds to make a decision. This is a classic case.
@_JayRamsey_
@_JayRamsey_ 3 жыл бұрын
Did you say the tower told the pilots there were flames before the plane landed, then say the fire was started when landing caused a fuel leak? Anyway, love the channel.
@commerce-usa
@commerce-usa 3 жыл бұрын
YT won't advise you, but it was corrected in a comment by MAI and a really good catch by you.
@_JayRamsey_
@_JayRamsey_ 3 жыл бұрын
@@commerce-usa Ha, I see he's corrected it now. Thanks for the heads up!
@asteverino8569
@asteverino8569 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for these “other” investigations. You do a superb job. 👍🏻😘
@yogib37
@yogib37 3 жыл бұрын
who was name at fault or was it the typical easy way out and blame the pilot? it think they way they track the AOA components it has to be blame on maintenance the pilot did a good job to save everyone tough
@Pretagonist
@Pretagonist 3 жыл бұрын
I feel that the fault here is with the design. A faulty AoA sensor is very dangerous and if you only have two you can't know which one is correct. A plane really should have three so that a faulty one can be overruled by the two that are working.
@yogib37
@yogib37 3 жыл бұрын
@@Pretagonist yes that is true but according the FAR the Capt. AOA is the one you go by if their is a dispute between the two. Some plane crashed in a Tropical Island and it was not flown for a bit, some bug made a nest in the pitot tube and cause an dispute in air speed but the co-pliots was normaal but they went off the capt's reading.. which is normal
@cyberi4a
@cyberi4a 2 жыл бұрын
If I remember, only one passenger was injured breaking a foot coming down the slide. I worked for TWA in Los Angeles, and was working at the time of the accident. We were all shocked when we heard what had happen. I remember going through JFK sometime after and seeing a tarp covering the fuselage.
@davidtucker3729
@davidtucker3729 3 жыл бұрын
I have worked in diagnostic testing and sometimes you cannot test certain parts unless they in field use. Shame that a missed window of time caused a part to destroy a beautiful aircraft and endanger so many lives. Great explanation Mini. Thanks
@ghostsofpunk
@ghostsofpunk 3 жыл бұрын
Now THAT'S a good captain! Be the LAST to leave your aircraft and make sure all passengers are safe. 🤍
@DanielW118
@DanielW118 3 жыл бұрын
The crew should be the last to leave, as the captain I should be the last of the crew to leave. If I pass you on the way out you are to assume the rank of captain!
@ghostsofpunk
@ghostsofpunk 3 жыл бұрын
@@DanielW118 💯 agree with you.
@TGouse1
@TGouse1 3 жыл бұрын
Thats his job.
@ghostsofpunk
@ghostsofpunk 3 жыл бұрын
@@TGouse1 I agree. But unfortunately, there are quite a bit of stories where this is not the case. And they are the FIRST off. Not so much in the aviation industry, but quite a bit in the maritime industry. If you ever want to get pissed off, look up the Sewol ferry disaster.
@naziahasan709
@naziahasan709 3 жыл бұрын
Thats how they are trained
@questionablebackyardmeows
@questionablebackyardmeows 3 жыл бұрын
Two in a day! WOW :) Thank you for doing this.
@AudieHolland
@AudieHolland 3 жыл бұрын
The stick shaker is part of the pilot's own reflex system in my opinion. Of course it's no comparison, but when I was driving a passenger van many years ago, it featured a 'anti brake blocking' device called "ADS" No, not "ABS." When the streets were slippery with ice on it in places, I learned what the "ADS" actually did. As I instinctively put down my foot on the breaking pedal, I felt like someone had put a wooden beam or metal bar underneath it, so the pedal wouldn't budge. My next immediate reaction was to let go of the breaking pedal, which was what the "ADS" was designed to do. When it's slippery and you're at some speed, doesn't need to be much, better not break at all because breaking would be worse. I once did a 360 degrees mind you but it sounds much more spectacular than it was. It occurred at a snail's pace literally, with no traffice around because it happened during the morning hours on a Sunday I believe.
@NiHaoMike64
@NiHaoMike64 3 жыл бұрын
Could the AOA sensors be more thoroughly tested on the ground using a leaf blower?
@briant7265
@briant7265 3 жыл бұрын
Maybe a small wind tunnel.
@stanislavkostarnov2157
@stanislavkostarnov2157 3 жыл бұрын
they did that on the Tupolevs using the deicing hot air fans... so yes.
@uranium54321
@uranium54321 3 жыл бұрын
Great video! I love how your channel feels like Chubbyemu but for planes instead of humans
@kasuraga
@kasuraga 3 жыл бұрын
hell yeah, just in time for my last break at work
@how_about_naw
@how_about_naw 3 жыл бұрын
I just sat down to eat lunch and it was here waiting for me :D v. nice timing
@Lovuschka
@Lovuschka 3 жыл бұрын
Catastrophe averted by a great crew!
@zew1414
@zew1414 2 жыл бұрын
I mean BRAVO to the crew! I love hearing about a crew that stays calm and knows exactly what to do! 👏
@vernonsmithee792
@vernonsmithee792 3 жыл бұрын
"Here ya go, Skipper...she's all yours!!"
@kholmar
@kholmar 3 жыл бұрын
he screamed while squeezing his eyes shut and throwing his hands in the air...truthfully, I think this was the only thing done wrong here...
@vernonsmithee792
@vernonsmithee792 3 жыл бұрын
@@kholmar Agreed. I happened to be at JFK that evening and saw it burn. Very memorable indeed.
@DrWhom
@DrWhom 3 жыл бұрын
it is an established custom that captain flies in an emergency, and even outside emergencies it is understood that f/o can hand back control at any point in time
@vernonsmithee792
@vernonsmithee792 3 жыл бұрын
@@DrWhom But unexpectedly relinquishing/ transferring control at an extremely critical moment without warning isn't very smart. But I wasn't there and neither were you.
@errorsofmodernism9715
@errorsofmodernism9715 3 жыл бұрын
there should be 3 AOA sensors and any faulty sensor would overruled by the other two
@Syclone0044
@Syclone0044 3 жыл бұрын
Man you’re really hitting your stride with these videos! This one was damn interesting, I must’ve spent 30 min watching it and rewinding and pausing just trying to take in the sequence of events and the gravity of everything that happened. People really love your consistently great narration! And so many pilots of the same type as you cover in the video, are watching and commenting, that kind of blows my mind. Saw you charging ahead from 71k to 78k followers in the past 2wks. There’s no question you’ll be finishing 2021 with over 100,000 subscribers and *GETTING ONE OF THOSE AWESOME SILVER KZfaq ▶️ WALL PLAQUES!!* I can’t wait to see that!👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
@ShakespeareCafe
@ShakespeareCafe 2 жыл бұрын
These were sophisticated air traveling passengers on board that plane. Today, 300 passengers would be jockeying to grab their carry on luggage, taking selfies, updating their instagram or Tik Tok accounts on the evacuation as an event.
@petcatznz
@petcatznz Жыл бұрын
Thanks for this explanation. I flew into JFK the day after this accident happened. The burned out wreck was very sobering to see as we came in to land.
@arbiter1er
@arbiter1er 3 жыл бұрын
I like that the crew seemed to use aero braking to slow the plane down a bit more (according to the video). Congratulations on them for saving everyone.
@las10plagas
@las10plagas 3 жыл бұрын
"thank you for wathcing this video" thank you for making this video! =)
@soulman4292
@soulman4292 2 жыл бұрын
The L1011 is one of the most beautiful aircraft ever built. Sad that such an advanced plane was such a commercial failure. Lockheed is an incredible company, and I wish they still made airliners.
@caseyfaceirwin
@caseyfaceirwin 3 жыл бұрын
Love that Tristar ✨
@ATejkl
@ATejkl 3 жыл бұрын
Personally I feel like the Captain did the right thing, all though he didn’t check the information to see if the plane was correctly telling him that it was stalling, unlike many other examples on your channel, he wants to believe what his plane is telling him, so based off what he was being told and the amount of runway space available he decided to put the plane down and potentially save hundreds of lives. If he actually had a stall at that point and continued to try and take off it could’ve gotten everyone killed like shown in other examples on your channel, he did what he felt was best with what his plane was telling him.
@aarondynamics1311
@aarondynamics1311 3 жыл бұрын
They had no time to assess the situation. A stick shaker must be responded to immediately, especially at low altitude
@ATejkl
@ATejkl 3 жыл бұрын
@@aarondynamics1311 which is exactly why I feel like they did the right thing, the best they could assume was that it was an actual stall so if they continued with the taken it would’ve been fatal in that case.
@hariman7727
@hariman7727 3 жыл бұрын
Yep. 2 seconds to make the choice, 2 months for the review board to hem and haw. It's better to Launchpad McQuack and have everyone walk away than to ignore an emergency warning system that warns of impending death the other 99.99999% of the time.
@GringoLoco1
@GringoLoco1 3 жыл бұрын
Yet another great video. I could watch that Tristar sim for hours 💓
@JoshuaNicoll
@JoshuaNicoll 3 жыл бұрын
What a fantastic captain, everything you want from a captain, not a soul was lost.
@Werrf1
@Werrf1 3 жыл бұрын
A rare misstep by the NTSB here, I think - seems like a clear case of 20/20 hindsight! Sure, it's clear _with all the data in hand_ that the aircraft wasn't actually stalling, but the pilots had absolutely no way of knowing that. Compare this incident to one a few years later when Aeroperu 603 crashed shortly after takeoff because their instruments were giving them bad data. They did the right thing.
@powwowken2760
@powwowken2760 3 жыл бұрын
Clearly the people who were on the board in the early 90's weren't Pilots
@hustledude
@hustledude 3 жыл бұрын
Wow that captain made the right call, what a hero
@tylerbrass4002
@tylerbrass4002 3 жыл бұрын
Wow, I cant believe i had never heard of this one, the captain sounds like a real pro.
@DevenARam
@DevenARam 3 жыл бұрын
Hey man I love the videos! In the future I think it might be a good idea to raise your mic volume though.
@gunnarsundman6828
@gunnarsundman6828 3 жыл бұрын
I really like You presentations, especially how You explain everything, like stall. Thank You so much!!
@JoePez
@JoePez 2 жыл бұрын
Always ALWAYS reject the take off. If you feel the plane is under preforming, just reject it. Think back to AA191 they didn’t reject the take off and crahsed
@elen5871
@elen5871 3 жыл бұрын
The board blaming the captains is absolutely him being scapegoated lol. A stick shaker is a stick shaker lmao, you take that *seriously,* and human reaction time is what it is, so putting the plane down makes WAY more sense than spending valuable time trying to figure out if the flaps and slats are correctly configured, checking airspeed, etc. ABSOLUTELY the right call on their part.
@ryanfrisby7389
@ryanfrisby7389 3 жыл бұрын
Awesome video and I think the crew did great here!
@davidzang7197
@davidzang7197 3 жыл бұрын
This is such a fine example to help and understand the Swiss Cheese Model: but the final slice, the buffer and 15% zone of V1 take off speed saved most people’s life.
@johnledingham852
@johnledingham852 2 жыл бұрын
The Captain had to think quickly, and act quickly. The fact that he managed this situation in the manner in which he did, resulted in the loss of no lives. there was no rewind, let's go back and start again. With aircraft things proceed very swiftly. The stick shaker pitched the ball, and the Captain hit the ball out of the park. He did well. No loss of life!
@MrBlablaishere
@MrBlablaishere 2 жыл бұрын
Most here seem to overlook the fact that TWA maintenance procedures are the main issue here. As said in the film, they did not keep track of the flight hours between part failures and kept putting broken (or at least suspected) parts back in inventory. TWA tried saving a few bucks in doing this.. Any technician that worked under such procedures/restrictions would certainly complain about this, but probably was told from management to just do their job and not complain... If they would just have installed a new part the stick shaker would have worked as it should. Then, as always, shit runs downstream, and the pilots had to deal with this situation. And thanks to the pilots only the airplane was lost, and no lives!
@BillyAlabama
@BillyAlabama 3 жыл бұрын
Great segment!
@tadlambert1493
@tadlambert1493 3 жыл бұрын
Dude made the right call with the info he had.
@coca-colayes1958
@coca-colayes1958 3 жыл бұрын
My day just gets better , just home from work and I have a notification and it’s my fave channel miniaircrashinvestigation, I’ll have to greet my wife and give her a kiss in about 10 mins
@armchairtin-kicker503
@armchairtin-kicker503 2 жыл бұрын
The question is what did pilots rely on before the advent of the stick shaker warning, a fairly complex system indeed? Knowing exactly how these sensors are supposed to work and how they propagate alarms can empower a pilot to make the best decision. So what crosschecks could the pilots have performed? Wing contamination? Altitude/temperature? flap settings? stabilizer trim? attitude indicator? airspeed indicator? That stated, a failed AOA sensor on takeoff scenario would be a great addition to simulator training.
@Swagmaster07
@Swagmaster07 2 жыл бұрын
Not rejecting takeoff after v1 in a big airport dosent make sense, in smaller ones it does ig. Remember the b737 that rejected after v2? Survived.
@normanrhone2791
@normanrhone2791 2 жыл бұрын
This is a giant of a captain, and his team.
@JimDean002
@JimDean002 2 жыл бұрын
At the end of the day they're not having to settle with crash victims next of kin so I would say hats off to the pilot,job well done. No way in the world I'm ever going to second guess someone split second decision like that unless it's so far off the mark that it's ludicrous. This one was clearly inbounds and made sense to both the first officer and the captain
@Amanda-C.
@Amanda-C. 3 жыл бұрын
I though the NTSB called this one wrong, but then I skimmed through the report. It's worth noting that other pilots have successfully taken off with false stall warnings at liftoff; less than a month before, the same plane took off with just that condition. The first officer, I think, holds more responsibility than the captain. He panicked and tried to give up control of the aircraft, instead of letting the captain assess and then assume control, which is standard. In addition, thanks to simulator training, he pushed the nose down, effectively initiating rejected takeoff, which, for better or worse, is not the first officer's role, and may have contributed to the captain's false understanding of the situation. In they end, they were caught between competing absolute rules: if the stick shaker goes, immediately nose down and increase speed; and, if the plane is capable of flight, do not reject takeoff after V1. Thank goodness nobody died.
@smorris12
@smorris12 2 жыл бұрын
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