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A new TWIST on the LONG ENDING of Mark? Dr. Stephen Boyce shares a theory about it's ORIGIN.

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Dwayne Green

Dwayne Green

Күн бұрын

Пікірлер: 28
@helgeevensen856
@helgeevensen856 Жыл бұрын
very interesting input from Dr. Stephen Boyce... and i can appreciate his openness as a CT guy... 👍
@fnscooter
@fnscooter Жыл бұрын
I think this may be my favourite interview that you've done so far.
@DrJosephFMatos
@DrJosephFMatos Жыл бұрын
Very intriguing theory, plausible. I encourage my students to be sure to read the "incidental" comments and the names mentioned in the different texts of the NT like this. As you say, they are not definitive evidence but they provide some fodder for thought. Noting Luke and Mark in this way, both mentioned in 2 Timothy and Colossians (also a letter written prison letter), shows the association. Love the speculation with dogmatism on this. Blessings.
@kathleens.laroche754
@kathleens.laroche754 Жыл бұрын
This was a great discussion. Now I'm off to read the Didache which I just found online.
@helgeevensen856
@helgeevensen856 Жыл бұрын
as for the Resurrection in Mark 16, the difference between the two readings, shorter or longer, is that in the shorter we have the "fact" of the Resurrection, in the longer we have the Resurrection *appearance* itself....
@jamessheffield4173
@jamessheffield4173 Жыл бұрын
The tradition is that Mark recorded Peter's sermon. We have all been in a sermon when the preacher realizes that he has gone on to long and finishes up fast which fits Mark 16:9 -20. Blessings.
@exploringtheologychannel1697
@exploringtheologychannel1697 Жыл бұрын
22:10 I agree with Stephen. What makes Scripture, Scripture is it being breathed out by God, not whether it had a longer ending or not.
@WFSteury
@WFSteury Жыл бұрын
I enjoyed Dr. Boyce’s comments and can definitely see his argument about the ending of Mark. Personally, I would call it scripture as well as apostolic.
@Dwayne_Green
@Dwayne_Green Жыл бұрын
same here ;)
@MM-jf1me
@MM-jf1me Жыл бұрын
Interesting idea! Calling it apostolic seems to be most accurate.
@exploringtheologychannel1697
@exploringtheologychannel1697 Жыл бұрын
26:00 It seem Stephen gave clarity to his view. He struggle to call it canonical. It sounds like he doesn't think it is actually inspired by God, but just apostolic. This is a very confusing distinction since under his theory the church accepted the longer ending of Mark as apostolic and canonical , but it isn't because it wasn't part of the original draft? This make it seems like what is Scripture is limited to be apostolic and a first draft, but I don't see why one would accept this?
@tad3900
@tad3900 Жыл бұрын
The problem I have with the text is the fact that it is quoting Jesus as saying something that neither Paul Mark or Luke were present to hear. If Mark previously had been taking his notes from an eyewitness, namely Peter, then adding a quote from Jesus does not seem right.
@exploringtheologychannel1697
@exploringtheologychannel1697 Жыл бұрын
12:25 This gets a little confusing. It is apostolic but not Scripture? But this seems to contradict what was sad before. A little confusing.
@JamesSnapp
@JamesSnapp Жыл бұрын
Mark 16:9-20 does not contain a narrative about anyone picking up snakes, or drinking deadly poison. It is a narrative - a record of a sequence of sayings and events - in which Jesus *says* that believers will pick up snakes and not be harmed if they drink deadly poison. There's a difference. Is Boyce proposing that Mark finished his Gospel-account by inventing things that Jesus said?
@stephenboyce6996
@stephenboyce6996 Жыл бұрын
Not at all. Simply proposing these saying of Jesus became reality in the Apostles ministries and were reported by Luke in every circumstance save the deadly poison part. Papias claimed to have learned of Justus having an event like this from Philip and his 4 daughters who were some of Luke’s eyewitnesses.
@rodneyjackson6181
@rodneyjackson6181 Жыл бұрын
The only people I have heard that thinks the long ending does not belong is John MacArthur, James White and I think Daniel Wallace.
@exploringtheologychannel1697
@exploringtheologychannel1697 Жыл бұрын
James Snapp, you ask a very good question. For this theory to work, it suggest Jesus didn't actually say these things but were filled in by Luke. Either Jesus said this or he didn't. If he did, this information must have been conveyed to Mark by an eye witness or directly by God. I don't think it is reasonable to claim that Luke told him about things that happened in the early church and then added this back into the mouth of Jesus.
@tonyb408
@tonyb408 Жыл бұрын
Did he make that scenario up by himself? I have to hand it to him, very creative. It's more likely that the ending is spurious than for that story to be even close to accurate, but creative nonetheless.
@Dwayne_Green
@Dwayne_Green Жыл бұрын
he took the available data and attempted to determine a likely scenario, I don't know if I would consider it "Made up" without any plausability. But I would concede that it's one of a number of theories put forward.
@jamessheffield4173
@jamessheffield4173 Жыл бұрын
If it is spurious, what bishop or council ordered it to be put in in the overwhelming majority of texts in Aramaic, Greek, Coptic, Vetus Latin, and other ancient languages? Just asking.
@delfimoliveira8883
@delfimoliveira8883 Жыл бұрын
It happened that the 3 manuscripts are the older From an historical point of view how more the text is from the original more accurate it's On another level the vocabulary and the style of the canonical Mark is very different of the rest of the book Iraneus that isn't middle but final second century seems to know the long end but yet it isn't even sure if it is this long end Second Timothy is consider by a majority of aren't Pauline You are reading what suits your theology
@Dwayne_Green
@Dwayne_Green Жыл бұрын
Every point you bring up hear has a counter discussion. Iranaeus quotes Mark 16:19, which is our earliest witness of something beyond verse 8, almost every other MSS attests to the Long ending, multiple other early translations do too, though some do not have it. The OVERWHELMING majority contains the long ending. Only the 2 of the 3 manuscripts are properly considered "ancient". the other is a minuscule, given the oddities surrounding Mark 16 in Aleph and B, it appears to be a witness at the very least that the ending was known. There are other places in Mark's gospel where the 'style' seems different and noone questions them. There's plenty of reasons to maintain mark 16:9-20. You may disagree, and that's find, but I'd like to think there's more to just what "suits my theology", the same could be said for those rejecting Mark 16:9-20.
@delfimoliveira8883
@delfimoliveira8883 Жыл бұрын
@@Dwayne_Green You didn't answer the question why are the older manuscripts doesn't include the long end ? Why the Washington Codex has a different long end ? If you are going to guess as the Dr does whit Papias and the Timothy reference I can guess too maybe the Church Fathers in the late 2 century didn't like the short end ( remember that Christianity was under scrutiny by people like Celsus ) and decided to create one that would explain the grammar and vocabulary differences that are in my opinion the nail in the coffin for an original long end Anyway I didn't mean to seem disrespectful I'm addressing serious objections to the " reading" of your guest
@Dwayne_Green
@Dwayne_Green Жыл бұрын
@@delfimoliveira8883 See my other videos on the Long Ending. There are three parts to this series, this is the first part: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/epddq6Woq6-3c5c.html There's also 3 parts to this series too but the second part is more pertinent to your question: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/j7yRidOet8ywdXk.html If your looking for me to type up a long answer to your question, I won't do it, you can see the rebuttal to your questions in these video series that I've spent MANY hours producing.
@delfimoliveira8883
@delfimoliveira8883 Жыл бұрын
@@Dwayne_Green Ok i will I've liked your video on the Textus Receptus it was fairly objective and neutral as all the good textual analisys should be I must say that my critiques were address to your guest arguments not you Greetings
@blindcanseemusic
@blindcanseemusic Жыл бұрын
This discussion does not really clarify anything. I think it would be a very heavy burden to decide today “yes or no”. I doubt anyone who honours the bible would take on that authority. All that you can really do is report archeology and history as accurately and as unbiased as possible.
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