Agree!

Mjkl

Mjkd

Agreed

I KNOW! INCREDIBLE!!

If she starts recording before the loop went to "1" that can happen. ----1----2-----3----4 aaa ---1----2-----3----4 bbbbbbbbaaaa

akuuu

Gueeeee

Hadiir

+Steve Mullins Not trying to reply to everything you're saying here (probably going to leave this thread, actually), but I do want to point out one thing you've mentioned for which I think there happens to be a completely innocuous explanation: of the three women's voices we hear at 1:00, one is Katarina's (talking, I guess explaining the song and how it explores the re-use of this particular bass line across popular songs), one is a replayed loop of Emma's just-finished "dit-dit" part (on an E), and one is ostensibly Emma live-singing (and recording another loop) on a slightly lower "dit-dit" part (starting on D). Shortly later (c. 1:04), Emma even goes on to lay down another, higher-pitched "dit-dit" loop (starting on G) at which point we hear not two but three copies of Emma... and presumably everyone should be fine with that, because this particular live performance is clearly meant to be based on live looping. I mean, they're very up-front about it, with that one mike on the stand in the corner to which everyone walks in order to record their particular loop, when it's their turn. The whole thing starts out with obvious intentional live looping, where they pull down all those seemingly random syllables that come together to build the famous "Rapper's Delight" lyrics, and it's fun. Looping is not a bad thing here.

+Steve Mullins I guess that on the mic that's to the right of the screen, where they all take turns to sing on, there's a looper; in fact you see the blond counter-tenor sometimes looking down and trying to aim his foot on the device. That's why you have several loops... They are simply genious... to synchronize the beginning and making the loop on the go is mind-blowing!!!!

To TheLordPresident: Your self-exalted title speaks for itself. Buckwheat, your "entire point" WAS my point: One of two things happened: Either they pre-recorded Good Times, and, then lip-synched live to the track, OR, they actually sang it live, then didn't like how it sounded and re-recorded their voices to perfection in post production. Whichever method they used, they, on video, are trying to give you the illusion that they are actually singing live. It's a no-brainer that when a singer's mouth does not perfectly line up with the audio at ALL times, you know they're lip-synching. Duh. When Emma Nilsdotter pulled away from the mic and her voice continued, and Anders slipped up, their secret was out. Game over. And, as unusually animated as Anders was on GOOD TIMES, when he and his mouth didn't match his singing, my money says they lip-synched. He never slipped up like that ANYWHERE in the STOCKHOLM VIDEOS. Go study it. And, no, MATT LIBBY, if they are really good at lip-synching, the audience may well NOT have noticed. Then, again, perhaps many did notice, and you'll just never know. My theory is that they lip-synched it, and their unusually animated choreography helped to distract the audience from detecting any lip-synching - but on that score I can't be sure.Neither live lip-synching or post-production patch up is something the original five did in their LIVE FROM STOCKHOLM SET ONE and SET TWO concert. In those videos, if you listen (and look) carefully, over and over, you'll begin to hear tiny imperfections, which is to be expected even from an amazing group like TRG - imperfections, by the way, you never EVER heard on their CD's. All of their CD's are keyboard perfect. To perform live, and be that in tune and that in synch standing that far away from each other at times is truly an amazing feat, both from a personal vocal expertise standpoint and a hell of a good monitoring set up. The original five were just such amazing vocalists and had sung together for such a very long time (20 years) that they just really did do that well. If there was EVER a concert where the original five would have wanted to put their very best foot forward by doctoring the audio, it would have been at the STOCKHOLM CONCERT, yet it was all live, and, so, there were NO inconsistencies EVER between audio and video. If you still doubt that they lip synch, go watch PASS ME THE JAZZ. At --3:25--, Anders actually coughs, with hand to mouth and then quickly continues to "sing". I have watched that video at least 50+ times over the past year (no kidding), and I only caught it a few weeks ago. Someone else in the REPLY menu caught it also. So, I know lip-synching can be hard to detect. That's the way they want it. Mr. Lord, to recap from an earlier reply: Get off your throne and go back and look at time code --2:34-- on "Good Times", and you'll see that Anders mispronounces the words "...to the sound of the beat". He doesn't sing the word "beat" and then on the "wah, oh, oh," his mouth opens up and he appears to not be singing, yet that's what you hear. Watch and listen carefully. Also, at --3:00--, Emma is definitely singing the scat (the camera is on her) and at --3:07-- she walks away but her sound continues. The mic is in her left hand, but she does not raise it to her mouth to sing, as the following camera angle shows. it's still at her side. To top it off, at --3:18-- as she and the others walk forward, she sings "Good times", and then lowers her mic on the words, "And other one bites...". Yes, they had to doctor that video.Mat Libby could be right that they don't lip synch, but which ever, it's either pre- or post- doctoring. But, how he knows they don't lip-synch, well, he really doesn't - unless he knows the group personally. I don't absolutely know that they do lip-synch. I do know it's simply got to be pre- or post- doctoring, of that I'm sure. It's a carefully guarded secret, for sure. So, "Lord", why not save your name-calling for someone else, and put your own reasonable explanation out there. I've studied this group more than you could possibly imagine, and still revere them as THE standard. SINGERS UNLIMITED and TAKE 6 (both on You Tube) are in their league. Everyone else is a distant second. VERTICAL VOICES (You Tube) are also very good.FYI: did you happen to see an interview with Peder Karlson where he was asked if they (the original five) ever overdubbed in the studio? His reply, words to the effect was that they did"."Lord", let's see: someone with no explanation whatsoever (you) then just uses obscenities to tell someone else not to use obscenities. I think we know who the moron is. Put out a reasonable explanation, Einstein. Or, if you simply do not want to believe anything but the sound of your own opinion, then, by all means, delude yourself. If your mind is made up, any facts to the contrary are not going to matter.Can't wait for your next intelligent reply.

Well, to be honest, I literally did not think to deep into this at all. While I revere your outstanding argumentation, and envy your dedication to this matter, this entire thing doesn't matter to me. Like, I honestly don't really care. I have so many other things to do right now to refute your argument, so I concede. I will say, though, that I think you are wasting your energy on the wrong thing. Unless you have unlimited free time, I doubt that putting that much effort into your refutation was worth anything. You should use that energy for something more productive. And, I mean, again, I appreciate your intelligence, I guess, because it sounds like you have no shortage of that. But I'll be honest, I didn't even read even a quarter of what you just said. I don't know if that's an indication to how tired I am right now (studying for 3 APs, currently in 4 choirs, and in 4 shows, simultaneouisly), an indication of my stupidity (I don't think so, but intelligence is subjective so...) or just the pointlessness of putting that much effort into something as proving me wrong. I dunno. To me, The Real Group is just perfect. I have hear almost everything they have, and really want to study some of their scores. I personally doubt very much that they would cheat the audience into lip dubbing. That just doesn't seem like something they have to do. Maybe it's ignorance on my part. Maybe I have to much faith in them. In any case, it's not like this will shake my beliefs that they are the best vocal jazz ensemble (and I saw Take 6 live during the NAU Jazz Madrigal festival a few weeks ago, so the bar is pretty high) That's all I have to say. Like I said, I'm really tired right now, and under any normal circumstance I would probably just fall asleep instead of responding. However, I feel like I should put in some effort to match the intensity of your argument. I probably don't come close, but we'll see. Have a good night!

TheLordPresident If you have other things to do, why not just write "Sorry Steve, I was wrong" And everything had been over and thread closed. It should save time for us all and everyone can be wrong some time in life, no big deal.

The soprano (the brunette) is also "new" compared to the rest, who've been there from the start I'm pretty sure :D.

Using the one she's holding in her left hand?

ortoPilot, it's because she sang in the microphone that is looped. Watch the beginning of the video closely, they use the same looped microphone.

No I see what you mean. she definitely realized she screwed up. Not surprised at all that the loop mic is prerecorded.

Actually - she has a spare mike in her hand. You can see it in her hand right before she walks away from the first mike. She uses the spare.

Also the next guy to loop starts singing on the audio before he's actually in position, so there's another hint that something's up!

떵*

search for the lyrics of Rapper's Delight, and also Good times by Chic, Another ones bites the dust by Queen, Around the world by Daft Punk

Steve Mullins Oh boy -- a group lip synced in a live performance. In other news, water is wet . . .

m64h Yeah, but this is The Real Group. Bummer.

+Steve Mullins I'm not sure about Anders really, but at 3:00 when Emma is singing into the mic, shes singing the scat into that mic to loop it like in the beginning of the video, which is why it continues even though she's not singing it. And maybe she just didn't sing "and another one bites the dust" There is no proof her voice is in there. It sounds like just one female voice.

+Steve Mullins You are wrong. Have you listened to these guys before, have you seen them live. Do you know their voices inside out?

+Nordic Original This is me butting in here, because I'm not Steve Mullins, but, yes, I have listened to TRG before (endlessly, across all their albums, sometimes even transcribing their excellent arrangements just as an interesting excercise, etc.), and yes I have seen them live, and I do think I know their voices inside out (Anders E's certainly), and also I sing a lot and know what sounds come from what mouth shapes, and I still agree 100% with what Steve Mullins said in his comment. I even noticed the exact same moment that he's calling out before I read his comment. But it's not the end of the world if TRG lip-synched parts of this thing. Given the number of performances this group has given over its LONG history, something like this was bound to happen eventually. It's just kind of a downer to see it happen yourself like this, with a group that I greatly respect like TRG.

+Steve Mullins I'm sorry to disprove you but i personally know Anders and the other members of TRG. They never lip synch when they are live. HOWEVER, they alter their live perfomances sometimes to make the live perfomances durable for videos and replay value. The sound of this video is probably modified from the original live perfomance, but wasnt lip synched during the concert.

+Safetylast the earpieces is the monitor for every singer. During concerts they sometimes go back to the mixer to edit the balance. For example: Margareta had to much bass from Jalkeus and had to change that.

+Safetylast That would certainly make more sense, i.e. that the audio was fiddled with post-performance in order to make the video better somehow (as opposed to TRG actually lip-syncing live, which would just be insane, not to mention noticeable to the audience). Still, if they do somehow replace the audio after the performance, I think that's regrettable, first because it invites this kind of speculation (i.e. the whole "do they lip sync live" question), and second because, frankly, I really doubt they need it. I'd much rather see TRG's live performances as-is, warts and all, because they're usually just absolutely superb, even if there is the occasional "mistake".

+Steve Mullins Guys, the mic and the far right of the stage is looping what they sing into it. Otherwise why would they need it? They all have their own mics!!

Hey so, I'm new to this group and not super familiar with them, but that mic they're all singing to is definitely for looping parts, which is why her voice is continuing after pulling away from that mic. That happens multiple times in the video, with each of the singers. If you notice you can also see they all have their own mics, which only reinforces the fact they are using the one on the stand for looping. Looping things live is generally how it's done so that the performer can be sure what their looping is fitting perfectly in the groove, feel, tuning of the song. Also the things in their ears are likely in-ears which protect the ears of the performer and it also puts a mix of their preference in their ear so they can hear what they need to hear to perform their best, that mix is designed by the sound engineer. Pretty much every pro musician ever uses those.