Just take it easy

What your experiencing wont last, make the most of it before the meds settle in. As he said 10:59

@@NathanCroucher you're absolutely right.

It’s very variable. Great news that it doesn’t affect your creativity.

Same here for making music. Much easier to work through ideas consistently and much more likely to problem solve when I’m not flowing. Instead of giving up or wasting my time on eh ideas without the medication. Much easier with than without. *usually*

Same here I started a business and KZfaq channel when I started

Exactly the same for me. I've recently started dexamphetamine and I'm now finally finishing all of my half done paintings that I could never find the concentration and enthusiasm to get through before

Thank you for sharing Scrib

Would ‘Ritalin SR ‘ be the same? I tried this . 3 hours numbed out then fell asleep after work. Couldn’t drive home. Zapped me. I thought these were the same medications.?

Wow, I want to try it

Ritalin sr is trash. Anxiety overload. Dexedrine is king. Unfortunately not pushed by docs as patent expired hence less money etc etc.

@@nireeburr Ritalin made me feel like shxt and I stunk to high heaven. Gave me the "fear sweats." and it made me DROWSY!! Doc switched me to Adderall. I haven't had some great Aha moment yet, but the side effects are way lower for me. Don't know what country you are in, as it's not available in many.

I really want to try Dextroamphetamine but my doctor insists they're not comfortable because they're not informed on the medicine, kind of frustrating.

You’re welcome!

Dr. Russell Barkley. Adhd is closer to diabetes then it is anything else. If you find yourself becoming addicted you probably don't have adhd

The only similarity between adhd and diabetes is that the are both conditions which respond to treatments. In every other manner that are as different two conditions could be. Diabetes is the inability to dispose of glucose which causes its blood concentration to rise and thereby chronically will cause micro vascular injury (or acutely DKA). Not addressing diabetes with lifestyle (or meds) will damage the health of the diabetic. ADHD is a deficit in frontal lobe inhibitory capacity. Not treating it will mean one is distractable and can’t concentrate on uninteresting things. That has social, occupational and esteem consequences. As to addiction. If one has no other sources of positive emotion and chronically lots of negative emotion, one can become addicted even if one has adhd. Not everyone that is prescribed ADHD meds uses them as prescribed. And there’s plenty of overpresciption, tolerance and dose creep

@@thePSYCHcollective @the PSYCH collective The core of ADHD is an emotional regulation deficit. The symptoms of ADHD are external regulation. Not addressing ADHD with medication and lifestyle reduces life Expectancy by 13 years if it persists into adulthood. Without medication the symptoms are self regulation. With medication less self regulation is needed. When medication is taken self regulation is less needed. Hyper active behaviors lessen, distractabilty lessens; the body does not need to work overtime to regulate the brain. The cognitive issues come into play because the medication is a powerful regulation tool. The ability to regulate internally was never there and will never be there. When you take to much medication you have a regulation issue in the opposite direction. You are not becoming resistant to medication, your are becoming accustomed not seeking external regulation. The slow increase is so you can replace one with the other. If you are tired and stressed, you will habitually try to self regulate. Your "symptoms" get worse and you feel better. You over extend yourself habitually, as you always have as a regulation tool. The cognitive issue is the lifestyle change, now that you have some free space you apply it to schedules... or not, because you never have. So some sugges 2 days off meds. Which feels good. Then back to the grind. Except you never allow your body to handle other things as it cannot trust that tomorrow the stimulus will be there. Are you addicted to insulin ? No you can regulate without. But what about the worst diabetes that you can't regulate. Well you die. Are you addicted to adhd medication? Well no you can regulate without. What about the worst adhd That you can't regulate. Well you die. The "addiction" implies that it replaces and stops the body from doing a natural thing with diminishing returns. What it does is allows the mind to be less distracted in a overstimulated society. Not being on meds is bad enough, putting someone into a on/off state is guranteed to cause accidents. Your life becomes habitually different, when on meds i trust i didn't forget to do certain things that I wouldn't trust without.

What are you taking?

@@sameena713 Medikinet 10mg

@naomi.shenton Thanks for the feedback!

This sounds very much like my experience. Jumped around from Bipolar to ADHD diagnosis and really only accepted the conclusion that I simply didn't like school or as others put it, "too smart for school" A cute way of saying 'easily distracted' No mood swings, I'm pretty well balanced morally and behaviorally, but I find myself in a writers-block state of mind sometimes. As a mechanic with literally ENDLESS amounts of work, I find that small doses of Adderall provide that minimal change in brain chemistry I need to go throughout my day without slowing down. Not necessarily moving too fast, but I find I have better mental clarity. Even when subjecting myself to doses of THC which should modify the effects somewhat of these kinds of stimulants, I still feel "right" after a day of Dextroamphetamine use. Which is interesting considering I am 32 years of age and have been unmedicated since my early teens after a nasty experience with Ritalin and overzealous prescriptions for my minimal issues.

They're right. If you have an addiction problem, of course you'll get addicted to ADHD stimulants too. I've seen it so many times in the rooms. They sell these drugs on the street. People get hooked.

Think very carefully. Look at the list of "secrets." Stimulants are very addictive. They can have a very positive effect in the short term, which gains these doctors all the glowing reviews that they use to sell people on their safety and efficacy, but nothing is for free and you pay for it on the back end with depression, anxiety, psychosis, and suicide. Going on and off these drugs is traumatic at best. A lot of people end up developing symptoms that lead to more severe diagnosis of mental health disorders that they never had in the first place. I'm just saying don't just take this doctor - who will profit from you believing him - at his word. Find out as much as you can and talk to as many people as you can. Once you go down the medication path, it's very difficult to get off of it.

I was in your same boat. My mom in and out of rehab my entire childhood with alcohol and drug problems. I have always been fearful of developing addictions to substances, and I treat this fear by affirming frequently that I am indeed not addicted by taking days or weeks off at a time. I recently started taking Adderall and, for me, it is nothing to worry about. It does not even come close to the feelings of dependency that I experienced with my heavy cannabis use.

Many people find the improved concentration benefit to be huge and the reduced creativity effect to be negligible. It’s a matter of seeing how it goes.

@@thePSYCHcollective thanks, I’m still waiting for my script to come through (any day now, according to my doc) so I’m really hoping it helps me :/

I was diagnosed today. So much to process and work through. I had had so many diagnosis' since I was 16 but this ADHD truly makes sense. I've struggled at uni these last 5 years and I have 3 subjects left and I'm 53. They say better late then never. I'm on dex but my son was on Vyvanse and he was super focused but he hated it as it affected his sport and weight.

@@katfarmgirl I’m glad that you finally have a diagnosis that makes sense to you! I have been on Vyvanse for almost 2 months now and honestly, it’s been life changing for me. It’s been so good that it’s made me question almost every decision I’ve ever made in my life. I have become a better father and a more productive member of society. I’m losing weight but that’s a good thing for me. I no longer look to food to get a dopamine hit. There are a lot of options when it comes to medication, you just need to find the one that works for you :)

You should be concerned. These side effects do occur, and a lot more often than the doctors who profit from these drugs want people to believe. They lie - routinely. Psychiatry and the mental healthcare industry in general very artfully suppress the real damage that these drugs do to people. Not saying you should believe me, just be careful and use your common sense, please. I have seen many lives ruined.

Congrats man! 3x?🤯 Soo proud of you and overcoming.. Best of luck to you and your journey 💯🤞🏾.

Out of curiosity, how hard is it to get in Aus? Im in America and would love to know the differences.

@@johnnyvidal3154 Hi JV. It's become much more accepted. 10 years ago I had no chance of being diagnosed with my personal doctors, it wasnt considered. Now all I had to do was an evaluation, which was a Diva 2/5 test with a pyschiatrist (He signs me off for 2 years, which is the law, so only 1 appointment every 2 years). A doctor is authorised to prescribe the pills & he sends 6 repeats of 100 pills (4 a day but allowed up to 8 if I require) every time I need a repeat. Which is done over the telephone & sent as an E-Script to my phone. And the beauty of Australia, I don't need any insurance, my doctor is free, the pills cost about $10US per 100. The pyschiatrist is the most expensive part, I think it was roughly $330US dollars for the Zoom appointment.

Very similar story to mine. Just started meds today. Most productive day in years.

I will say, been less than a year and it has been going well, the medication does help but you may find yourself relying on it too much which is what I don’t want to do, but I keep telling myself “that’s what it’s there for”. I try and do some days with less of it and will recharge again, just to keep things afloat. But it does help when using it for all the correct things, and I can focus more - but it doesn’t do everything for you. You still have to keep track, organize, ect. Make sure you get enough rest, diet is good and Exercise. DO NOT look past those 3 things and you’ll do even better.

Hang in there, and fight until you get the support that works for you. Thinking of you!

Glad you found it helpful. This might also interest you: SSRI versus SNRI. Why SNRIs like Effexor might worsen anxiety and distress. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/q8Vnf9p9mqvRcac.html

Thanks. What studies did you look at for the stimulant tolerance effect?

It’s self evident when the dose needs to go up over time

@@thePSYCHcollective I wonder what percentage of people develop tolerance, and how quickly it develops. Very interesting. There may be other reasons people ask for a dose increase - increased fatigue due to sleep issues, or they realise the dose they were on initially wasn't high enough to begin with, or theres depression developing and they actually need that managed. In terms of recommendations of taking 2-3 days off completely per week, and 1 week off every 3 months, are there any studies to show this reduces tolerance effects? Id be recommending patients experiment, perhaps reducing the dose at times, rather than stopping all together. This would enable them to function looking after kids/socialise and do household chores/life administrative tasks. Anecdotal medicine is a tricky area to make recommendations from.

Yes. I don’t know the proportion, but it’s not trivial. Those who become tolerant end up with the predicament of being on maximal dose without efficacy. Then they face a dilemma because they cannot easily stop because of withdrawal. I prefer not to have my patients endure futile iatrogenic harms. But that’s just me.

I also feel chronically tired, maybe that's the depression. I also have to disagree on stimulants keeping people with adhd awake, my first dose of ritalin LA after 3 hours I felt so tired, I went to bed and slept for 8 hours. It was the best sleep ever but I am worried about tolerance.

Have you considered telling your doctor about the undesirable side effects you're having? Maybe it'd be a good idea to add or try another medicine. I know a lot of people with Adhd & they did much better on other meds. Good luck finding what works best for you. 💙

@@thorabast8817 my country only has ritalin. Hopefully a generic of Vyvanse will be available when the patent expires in June next year

Thanks for the feedback!

Ask for Dexedrine not Adderall. Google it. I spent hours and hours and the reason docs push adderall is because patent is still active (just) which equates to more money etc. When adderall patent is out it will be Vyvanse, hence why that is being advertised so much. The patients well being is not a priority unfortunately.

@@johnnyvidal3154 Is this true? can you send me more info? I'm currently taking Methylphenidate Teva (Prolonged Release)

Then your brother most likely has adhd. It’s hereditary anyways

@@AV-kr6gc no he has not ..

Totally unpredictable. Everybody's different. It's like rolling the dice.

I might have misunderstood but it sounds like your doc suggested more of the drug to deal with the tolerance to the drug (whereas a break from the drug would reduce tolerance). If tolerance to the high dose is causing withdrawal come-down effects in the afternoon, the “solution” is even more of the drug. There’s possibly some dose creep going on which can add up to a lot of milligrams!

Some prescribers might suggest weaning then taking a break from them to rest the tolerance. Subsequently they could be used 4-5 days a week to reduce the accumulation of tolerance. (Not medical advise)

Fuck ritalin. Gives me angry headaches

You need an amphetamine not ritalin. There is a huge difference. And yes, anxiety is the main one.

I had those exact same symptoms, it’s very weird

Check out online support from psychologists who offer their services via Zoom/Teams.

I went to an online psych in Tasmania. I'm in Adelaide and finally have help.

@@iamstormy can you tell more ?? Sorry I just saw this . Thank you 🙏🏼

@@nireeburr Psych2u is an online psychiatrist. Call them and they will help.

@@iamstormy just wondering does Medicare cover costs, under the new mental health Allowances . By using MHCP? Otherwise I just can’t afford $500 for one appointment sadly. It’s always the case when no one in Adelaide can address such strong needs. ESP for adults.. How do you go with working and maintaining a life of normalcy 🥴🧚🏼‍♀️

They can be helpful for some people. But also can have the crash (eg reboxetine half life about 12h). And dose creep a potential issue.

Your question as posed is not really answerable because “Anti anxiety meds” is a massive category including almost all the antidepressants, all other medicines with sedating qualities and drugs which affect adrenal/epinephrine signalling (beta blockers, clonidine) and others. So it depends what exactly is being combined. Some combos are okay, some are not so great, some are not a good idea.

When we use a stimulant there is a rebound when it wears off. The higher the dose the more evident that it. For some people regular use leads to tolerance and increased dose. Worse rebound. A break can start to resolve the tolerance. But this is not medical advise, discuss this with your doctor.

They can. I’ve stopped initiating long acting as the MANY of my patients would find that tolerance and dose creep would have them maximum dose after 9-12 months (even with skip days). But SOME people don’t seem to get tolerant to neither long nor short acting. [just observations, not medical advise]

@@thePSYCHcollective Then whats Dr Mander on about kzfaq.info/get/bejne/gbmhgtqkldq-e6c.html Seems bit harsh to not have them as an option now there on the PBS. Im on Vyvance and happy with it, saves on having to pop dex all day.

I can’t answer this as it would need to be worked through systematically and addressed empirically. Here are some comments: Odd to be taking it before bed, it’s mostly dosed morning and midday only. I’m curious as to the rationale for dosing before bed. Chronic fatigue/tiredness may relate to other matters such as CFS, Long COVID, etc. A long break might be informative. One needs to weigh up benefits/costs of any treatment.

I recommend watching this KZfaq video. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/psiSldhmrLLbgmg.html

Tolerance to amphetamines was established in WW2 by the nazis who used it on their soldiers. They noticed that the dose had to go up for a large proportion of users. Tolerance is not a controversial notion for stimulant drugs such as amphetamines.

@Mady Ask your doc about whether you could take a dose of a beta blocker an hour before you take the Adderall. The beta blocker can prevent the physical symptoms which lead to that anxiety. Often helps. If it works for you, let us know.

@@thePSYCHcollective thank you very much! I'll definitely look into this, and if it works out I will be sure to let you know!

I'm not sure if he or anyone can answer that unfortunately. He said some people can find a stable dose and be fine without taking any breaks for years. But others can't and need to take breaks. PS: i'm also on dex and wish i knew the answer to your question.

I take 2 immediate release (IR) 15mg tabs, 1 at 7am and 1 at noon, gets me through the day job. Then slam the stimulant breaks in the evening with a magnesium supplement which is a champ for nervous system rest/repair/growth and SLEEP.

Some people notice tolerance after the first dose. Others notice tolerance after a week or a month or not at all. It’s very variable.

@@nicocortez102 yes I noticed that too for my sleep using magnesiumbisglycinate

It’s not mandatory to take days off, but watch for tolerance. Some people don’t become tolerant, but many do. If one becomes tolerant then either a break or an increase in dose is needed. But repeated increases of dose may not be sustainable.

@thePSYCHcollective Thank you for your reply, much appreciated! Absolutely, thankfully I don't have a tolerance issue with stimulants so can maintain a schedule, but more importantly to me is the health effect of taking daily which just means closely monitoring your heart and not doubling up on other stimulants like coffee! Thank you for the work you do and for engaging and educating 😇

@thePSYCHcollective Just to add to that, is there evidence of "amphetamine aging", I was concerned about this when I started and have noticed a subtle change in my face so wondered if there was any correlation? 🤔 To note, a lot of asd/adhd are noticeably biologically "younger looking" in general, surely I am not ths only one who has observed this!

It’s an interesting idea, I’ve not come across any literature on it.

PTSD makes ADHD worse. PTSD is mentally fatiguing, it reduces “RAM” In ADHD “RAM” is already low. This talk helps unpack the effect of PTSD on “RAM”. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/d8ygY8Kmmcywe2w.html

@@thePSYCHcollective Thanks for the reply, I definitely agree with that especially after the last 3 years and my decline my mental well being has improved but that is also due to the fact i have been a patient of SCP for m&a first and the ptsd, i qualified for ptsd2 and learnt and implemented many tools form your videos etc Al hits the nail on the head when he covers moral injury in the link above... how does one ask to be evaluated or trialed for adhd and not come across as just trying to get "stimulants" all i want to do is move on with my life and try to live a productive life

@Evan Mc The difficulty is that one usually needs some evidence of ADHD prior to PTSD. The general wisdom is that ADHD is a developmental issue and persist from childhood. So doctors will usually need some supportive collateral information to justify the diagnosis (school reports, interview with parents etc). Not all psychiatrists prescribe stimulants. There are clinics that specialise in ADHD. They tend to be expensive and doesn’t guarantee it will be prescribed.

@@thePSYCHcollective i guess eventually getting thrown out of school at the start of year 10 fits the criteria!

Common problem with daily dosing. Long term/high dose, I wonder.

@@thePSYCHcollective I do what my psychiatrist tells me. Have been on meds for mental illness for going on 20 years.

I do. I take 5-15 mg. I do take breaks but I work in health and am a student so I got to be on my A game to provide perfect patient care and results. I work in pathology.

Yep! My doctor & pysch didn't say anything about taking time off.

@@Polecat-qz5om wow. Is it bad taking it everyday? And so how many year have you been taking it?

Tontito...

Seriously seriously. It was not intended to be derogatory and there was no mention of cheating anything. The “no free lunch” comment was intended to highlight that there’s a potential cost to using them that’s not obvious and often not mentioned to users.

Thanks for your feedback. But very few patients or even doctors realise these effects

It is still very helpful and interesting. This because there are no other videos on KZfaq which explain it with this much detail.

A numpty that can't comprehend the gold info that is in this vid. Smh.

Thanks for raising this important matter. Tolerance to dex necessitates gradual withdrawal and a period of cessation to resensitise one to the effect of the medication. Then after resuming, people who are prone to tolerance may benefit from time away from the medication (eg weekends off it and a week or so every few months) to limit accumulation of tolerance. Taking meth can have serious consequences and tolerance to it is likely if one has tolerance to dex. So one ends up back in the same predicament but with more difficulty stopping meth and more troubling health effects.

Please check it out ❤❤❤❤