Well I don't think that's the right conclusion for you though. Yes, US manufactured knives are too expensive, BUT if you just want some knife there are countless other really damn good Chinese options. And you will actually get a better performance out of them than with clones, because they have a reputation to protect. CIVIVI, Petrified fish and Kizer make absolute beasts of budget knives between 20 and 70 dollars. If your scenario truly is as you propose you would be better off with one of them. I'm not anti clone (in fact, I just ordered by first one) but I think you must really want to try out THAT one in order to buy a clone. If so you want is a good knife there are so many other more reliable options out there.

In short: You're making a false dichotomy with American made knives and Chinese knives, but 98+% of Chinese knives are not knock-offs or clones.

@@Minecraftrok999 You need to re-read my comment because you're misinterpreting it. I never mentioned clones or knockoffs.

@@Oysteims sorry, yeah you're right. I've read a lot into it that wasn't there

I got myself the cheap browning greyscale and browning standard hunting knife that's a Chinese knockoff yesterday. Let's see if they're as good as original pieces. Because at the moment I can't afford too many originals 🥲. I want the mini free Benchmade with the red accent, but they expensive as hell. Edit: mini freek

Half a month rent. Damn. Maybe 4 days

I got that one as well and been using it to pry up baseboards. Its badass.

The Medford is nice, but that warranty does seem over the top. I ended up giving mine away to my brother in law, as a wedding gift to him. He's a big dude, a sheriff's deputy and likes hard use knives.

Thanks man, appreciate the feedback. I do appreciate WELL MADE knives made in the US, but if you want quality, good grinds and excellent fit and finish made here, under $100... It's hard to find. There are a couple, but when you can buy a truly decent knife for $30-$60 made in China, why not? I buy both and take a lot of hate from some folks who call me a communist... I guess they never watch all my other videos... pro gun, hate Biden, pro Israel, I rant about how the current Admin has messed up the country, rail against our current open border... pro cop and military... Yet somehow because I like a good bargain that is made by people who "don't look like us", I need to move to China... lol You can't make everyone happy, I guess. :-)

@@SquireSCA absolutely! I love it when people are bitching about buying a quality affordable knife made in China from their $1,200 Chinese made phone. 🤦🏻

@@SquireSCA That is funny! Communist???? I just watched the video Oppenheimer. There everyone who was not with the current government was a communist. Strange, I thought that was in the 40s... Don't tell me that America never learned a thing since then...

@@andrashavas Yeah dude, the hate and toxicity of some folks is kinda amusing... They just hate anything that's not "MURican", despite half the crap in their house coming from China, including whatever device they are whining at me, on... Not everyone wants to spend $300-$500 on a pocket knife. I spent some time discussing this topic on this weeks Ride with Dave podcast that went up this morning. Take a listen/watch and tell me what you think?

That’s alright you’re supporting a country that uses slave labor comparing a cover band to the ccp is ridiculous the cover band has to have permission to use the music have you been paying attention to the DonHenley lawsuit.?

Exactly. Cheap way to try before you buy! 🙂

Yeah, I liked the Praetorian clone so I got the real deal, but I didn't like one of the other Medford clones... It was ok, but I can't see myself spending $600+ for their Infraction...

I get a ton of my stuff from Amazon. I am a Prime member so I get free 2 day shipping on most items.

www.dhgate.com/online-shopping/vespa-knives-online.html

@@SquireSCA thanks brother

totally agree. So long as they are not outright counterfeits, trying to pass themselves off as the real deal, I don't have a problem with it. Anyone looking for a Chris Reeve Sabenza, is not going to even consider a $23 clone on Amazon, and the reverse is true. The guy that just sees a decent knife for $23 on Amazon, is not likely gonna be the kinda guy to spend $600 on a Sabenza... There really isn't any situation where one brand is stealing business from the other...

Right. The “reverse grip”. Extremely popular among people who’ve never been in a knife fight. You need to stop before you hurt yourself.

Thanks for the feedback. I know that China does some crappy stuff, but they also make quality stuff... You can't just write off an entire country because the people running it are sh*theads... If that were the case, half the world would write us off due to Biden, and the other half would have written us off under Trump. lol Counterfeits are a different matter, but none of these are that.

@@SquireSCA WHAT?! You know that China does some crappy stuff but screw it, they make some quality stuff too?! Can't write off an entire country just because of shitheads running it? I'm glad our grandfathers and great grandfathers didn't think like you. "I know that Nazi Germany does some "crappy" stuff but screw it, those Germans make some quality stuff!" If you don't care about global politics and/or the negative impact on the US and world economy due to the dirty trade practices of the Chinese government and all you care about is buying stolen ideas for cheap, then do you. But I'm sorry, your justification for doing so is willful ignorance bordering on stupidity. Just the fact that you need to give any justification or reasoning for doing so should be a big hint. I bought an Italian made knife a few weeks ago, a country with fair trade practices, respects intellectual property and zero genocide. No justification needed! It's one thing for people on an extreme budget to do so but it's an absolute shame to see collectors and KZfaqrs spend hundreds or even thousands of dollars on Chinese made knives. But this country lost it's grasp of morality and standards a long time ago. Hence Joe Biden sitting in the Oval Office! After rewatching your video, I'm leaning towards willful ignorance. You understand the problem, you're just not yet willing to sit down to take your thoughts and what you know about the issues with China to it's logical conclusion. I like how you use American companies that make $500+ knives to say that they're not really being hurt by the Chinese knockoffs because that's true for the most part but do you know what companies are getting hurt? Companies that make knives in that $75-$200 range like Benchmade, Spyderco, Kershaw, Boker, Lionsteel and the list goes on. If I'm not mistaken a Benchmade Bugout use to cost about $105 and was made from 154cm when it first came out as a lot of their knives use to be. Now Benchmade has abandoned 154cm for more premium steels and the prices keep slowly rising for their products. They have versions of the Bugout that goes over $200 now. Why do you think that is? The American market used to make good budget friendly knives but that's all but gone now. The China problem wasn't created over night. It's been a slow grinding process over the last 30 or so years. So yes, it's gone on so long that some products made in China are unavoidable. But you say screw it, keep going until there's nothing left made in America! You're cover band analogy is off. What do you think would happen if a cover band released a cover album and started selling it at a discount to undercut the original album? Well, if it's a Chinese cover band then the answer is absolutely nothing. People like you would buy it up and sing praises about your savings! You ever heard of a "Mechanical License"? I'm assuming not, judging by your reasoning in this video. At least I hope you haven't. I'd go ahead and look it up if I were you.

​@Dave's Man Cave yeah you know the Chinese people I deal with are very courteous and kind and I like dealing with him I like mine out some them they even if things break they send me the parts next time I order from them they're nice people I like them the other government sucks so does our government they all suck but the people are decent people trying to make a living just like me. I'm a disabled veteran I don't live on a fortune you know. I'm not I'm not saying for me I get buy have more than I need but I'm not going to go out and spend $700 on an ugly Medford knife that's ridiculous I could buy an AR-15 for that and there's no way I'm going to buy knife most I've ever spent on a knife is about $550 and I've done that less than three times and I have spent a lot of time 350 but that's a big deal for me I typically like to spend about 150 or less on a knife in the Chinese can do that. I like your review to I was really scared about making my first review about Chinese clones but you know I don't really don't care what people think I'm going to do what I want to do this is a free country!

Yeah, I love my Bugout for its size and simplicity and light weight, but it really isn't a $140 knife. It's an $80 knife, at best, but you pay for the Benchmade name. My new Chinese Sitivien ST995 is a vastly superior knife to my standard bugout. M390, Titanium, Carbon Fiber and ball bearings, and it's half the price...

Benchmade clones I’ve seen are all D2

See, try before you buy!

Price may have gone up since then? Amazon prices have been crazy lately. The motorcycle oil I was buying was $29, now a month later the same bottle is $44. The one I used to buy for $33 is now $25... Plus, they either lose or delay fully 1/3 of all my orders. They are on the truck for delivery, and suddenly they are lost or delayed... So who knows....

@@SquireSCA I hear you brother I can't trust Amazon to buy knives anymore . I bought a petrified fish beluga last month and it was 2 day prime and here a month later still no knife. There really starting to go down hill. Now I just buy cheap knives from them. But I do love that knife I wished they'd make one that's not titanium get the price down a little. But it being titanium knife with d2 I guess it makes sense. Thanks for the info brother love your videos.

I love my Beluga! It's a bit large for EDC, but man is it a nice knife. Its probably one of the sharpest knives out of the box that I have owned, and the fit and finish is top notch.

Go for it. It's not like I can copyright an analogy... haha

@@SquireSCA I always like to ask first! Great video, I enjoyed it alot

Yeah, its something that a lot of folks don't think of. I see the occasional yahoo on here railing about China, while sitting in their house on their Chinese iPhone, surrounded by objects from China... But for whatever reason, knives are sacred and that's where they draw the line... lol

I have a legit Bugout with the normal grivory scales. It's a very nice little knife, but it doesn't feel like a $150+ knife, that's for sure..

@@SquireSCA I bought my son a mini Bugout 3 or 4 years ago. A legit one. Paid o think $ 130 plus for it. He loves it. Really enjoyed your video Brother. You are spot on.

Agreed dude. It's been interesting seeing Chinese knife makers both in kitchen and daily carry spaces rapidly catch up to many us, japanese, german, etc... brands and make them sweat. It's been great for the market imo.

Yeah, I want the Scarab II, but I am just not willing to spend that much to get it...

@@SquireSCA Exactly !

I ordered the 1136 a few days ago . How is it ?

Yeah, I feel like it works... So long as it's not a counterfeit, I don't mind a "tribute" that is clearly marked and priced as such.

Its totally worth the money, I would go and get it. In the end I went and got the $450 Medford one, but its a very cool knife. If you want a large beefy knife that doesn't break the bank, get that, or better yet, the Artisan Cutlery Proponent. amzn.to/3Mz3Tc3 I did a review of that one, and its a MUCH better knife, and roughly the same size...

@@SquireSCA thanks, the proponent is a really compelling alternative. I've had to look a bit until I found your video (maybe putting the knife name in the tie helps? Idk), but it's a really good video and that screw lock just blew me away. Technically it's not legal to carry here in Germany, because we have a stupid ban on carrying a knife that locks AND can be opened with one hand (that's why I actually prefer it when a knife sticks enough that it can't be opened with one hand). Sadly it is relatively hard to find the D2 version in Germany, so I widened my search to Europe wide and after 40 minutes I finally found a somewhat acceptable price of ~95 USD (much better than the 135 I found in Germany), it's still kinda hard to convince myself to do it, but I think I will buy the beefy boy within the month at 93 Euros. The green or blue G10 also looks really good. Thanks again for the beefy boy suggestion.

@@SquireSCA In terms of usability the Proponent seems like day and night compared to this clone. Of course then it doesn't have the looks, but damn, that blade shape of the proponent seems fine too and it'll be awesome for camping and slicing potatoes.

Yeah, maybe having the name in the title would help. lol I updated that, its there now. Knife carry laws are so weird sometimes. I see one handed opening as convenience, and locks as a safety device, so that it doesn't close on your hand... I have an innate mistrust of a government that doesn't trust the people that elected them, to carry basic tools... :-(

It's a beast of a knife, and it's very well made...

Well, some are clones in that they are exact copies, although the steel might be different. Others clearly use a popular knife as the foundation, but they change a few things and add their own flair... I use the term rather generically... When it's obvious that they just took someone else's design and made their own version of it. To me, that's the Cover Band. It's Aerosmith's song, but it's obviously not Steven Tyler's voice and they aren't charging $250 per ticket to see them play... It's a $20 cover charge... haha

@@SquireSCA 🤣 yes, the good ol days. 🎸. Yes, I only have one of those knives. I don't know the name of the original. It's the eafengrow. I think you said sowcom? I bought it when I first started. It looked cool, but I definitely knew it was an expensive knife. When I think of clones in retail sales , I think of Rolexs, Nike, jewelry that are trying to be identical in order to deceive and profit greatly. I guess some of the knives you have were doing that. So yes, I agree with you if that were the Chinese retailers intent. Be blessed, ✌️🦁

@@leodegas7731 Yeah, I mean if it is a straight up counterfeits with the original maker's name and logo, that's a different matter...

Thanks. People either love it or hate it... no real middle ground on this topic. Either Chinese knives can be decent and they are part of the global economy with us... or you are a sissy communist for having a knife made in China, because 'Murica! LOL

Thanks, and welcome to the club!

Thanks. Sometimes I set out to do a short review and overview, but then I go down a rabbit hole and have a larger discussion...

I luv rants lol

I like the design, but I am not willing to spend $650+ for one. I will poke around and see if I can find a clone

I think that rational people with open minds, that keep their ego in check, realize it. The problem are the "Knife Bro's"... They are like the hardcore Harley guy, or the Mopar Guy, or an Apple fanboi... The over the top person that attaches their ego to a particular brand name because they believe it gives them status. It's to help bolster a frail ego and lack of self esteem. In order for their them to have status and value, the products that they align themselves with have to have it... and in order for that brand to have it, they have to put all the other brands down. Having brand preferences is fine, its when one becomes a loyalist or a fanboy, that it gets annoying and obvious... I bought a few clones, and they in turn were the reasons why I went and spent lots of money on the real deal. The clones win, the legit brands win, everyone makes money... the only one being hurt is my bank account. haha

DHGate

Yeah, counterfeits are one thing... Someone just borrowing the design, not a problem, especially when they add their own flair... It's expensive to do things here in America. I don;t mind paying a little extra, but I don't want to pay double the price and still only get half the quality, and that is often what happens with these things. If you are into homage watches, check out Pagani Designs...

Ouch! What country are you in, where shipping costs that much?

@@SquireSCA Bulgaria , they charge so high ,cuz our govenment (although they wont admit it ) still want us to buy mainly from Russia ,becuase we are ex-commie country .

Turns out, what I was trying to use as a thumb stud, was actually the blade stop. haha When I flick it open with the thumb hole, like a spyderco, it works perfectly.

Yeah, in most cases blade stops are dual purposes, if you still want to softer the detend , there are couple ways, 1-getting tension out from lock bar 2-smoother the ball contact corner on the blade (very very very slightly otherwise you will loose your detend) 3- replacing your ball with a size bigger ball (you just need drill bit size smaller than ball)

Thanks! 👍

amzn.to/3OSoPN0

I might be the oddball then, because I tend to buy both... I like cheaper knives that I can use and not cry if I lose it, but I also appreciate having a real quality knife that I plan to keep a long time. I have the Medford, and it's amazing, but I just compared it to my new Artisan Proponent... and I am struggling to find where the Medford is worth 9x as much for the same materials, size, etc... I am happy with the Medford, but the Artisan is a tank, designed by Dirk Pinkerton...

"disposible knife. use it and throw it out" it's funny how arrogant knife snobs are, for most people an 50$ knife isn't an disposible.

Yeah, we can both articulate a good argument, even if we don't agree. That's ok, its a free country, for now... haha

Or, some use the cheap ones as a way to try the design out, before dropping big money on the real deal.

Thanks for the video, btw…👍

Where did you buy that model? I haven't see the Ti frame lock version on Amazon...

@@SquireSCA Amazon. And, I’ve seen it on there as recently as a couple weeks ago. In fact, every time I scroll with those specifics it shows up. I’ll try and get you a link…

@@SquireSCA Man, it appears to be gone. I just scrolled for a while, trying different search variations and nothing. Next best arguably was the VG10/SS. It’s been on there for months. First time I haven’t seen it.

@@thepugilist4379 Yeah, I have looked for that one for awhile, but I can't find it on Amazon. I think you have to go directly to AliExpress or DHGate...

That's a good point. At this point, its really just a small handful of vocal FUDDS making static in the background...

Strider SNG is the smaller SMF the larger... PS- The Preatorian clone even has M Logo on clip though!

On point supporting an enemy - unsubscribed for me.

Yeah, at this point it's pointless to worry about it. I have another video processing now... It's a Spyrderco, but the knife is made in China. But its still an American company that owns it, sells it, warranties it, etc... So do the "Only MURICAN" guys get upset about that too? haha

While likely true, I don’t WANT them to drive us knife makers out. But like automobiles, I want the us makers to take notice and step up their game and get competitive again. China is cranking out original designs, that offer higher quality at half the price. Many well known custom knife makers are going to china for production, because it’s the only way to make their knives at the quality that they demand, while still being priced so that most people can afford it.

Some truth in that.

Exactly this

Someone's got to! haha

Man I wish I could grab one of those Vespa OTFs. I dont even know where you can get em

Well, are cover bands shady? They are very common these days...

@@matthewadler1329 DHGate. I put a link but KZfaq took it down... of course... lol

Welcome to the show! Yeah, I try to have fun and be open minded with this stuff. I get why a company doesn't like China copying their design, but at this point, I don't think you can legally patent a blade shape or style. And most lock mechanisms are now open for use, the patents having expired... Even Rolex... Rolex never patented their design. They patented their logo and names, but the design itself is open for anyone to make. And Rolex knows that nobody that value's a Rolex would "lower themselves" to buying a clone or an homage... And the person that likes a cheap homage, is never gonna spend $10k-$60k on a real Rolex. One is not stealing business from the other... Rolex maintains their profits and high roller clientele, and us "poors" get a cheaper but nice looking watch. haha

Yeah, and I think that's an important distinction, the difference between a clone and counterfeit...

It really is. I mean, if you have the right materials and a CNC machine, you can crank out just about anything...

I would say that the greed extends to buyers. How many people want to spend American prices? That's why we have Walmart. We can make Walmart the poster child for corporate greed and blame them for driving the mom and pop shops out of business, but the reality is that they were only able to do that because WE as a society went to Walmart to save money. Its no different here. Look at the knives made in the US. They are either gas station knife junk, or, they cost a car payment. lol This opens the door due to demand for something of quality, that doesn't break the bank. In steps China, like they have with Apple products and everything else we buy. An iPhone would cost well over $2k if it was made in the US. People would stop buying them, and Apple would go under in time... or, they would start making cheap lower quality devices, and people would stop buying them for that reason. Either way, Apple ceases to be Apple.

Totally agree, man... I enjoy my US made knives from Medford, Hogue, MT, Guardian Tactical, Heretic, Benchmade, Axial Gear, GEC and others... But they cost a lot of money... And when I look at what you can get from CJRB, Artisan Cutlery, Civivi and others... I do often have a hard time justifying buying the US made knives... The materials are similar, the construction and fit and finish is similar, and what would cost $60 for a Civivi might be easily $150 for it to be made here... just so that I can puff up my chest and tell everyone how I am a patriot because I spent 3x for the same knife? Meh... Sometimes I will, if I like the company or design, but more often than not I am gonna go with the import. We did the same with cars in the 1980's because US cars cost more, and were inferior in quality to the Japanese imports. And like you said, not everyone CAN just go spend $300-$500 on a pocket knife whenever they want...

I don't know of any cover bands that pay royalties to Journey or Bon Jovi. Got a link to any of that?

Its a great knife for the money!

How did they fail? I have never had a lock fail on a knife... What were you doing with it?

@@SquireSCA a valloton clone just stopped locking up after a year of normal use, a brouse folded up on my son requiring stitches....but I do have a strider that still locks fine after 5 years or so

As they say, common sense isn't so common... haha But I think that when they put the original companies name on it and try to pass it off as the legit version, that cross the line from being a copy of something, into the realm of forgery, and that I am not cool with. If you are just using someone else's design and maybe tossing in some tweaks, under your own name. Go for it. Like Rolex. They patented their logo and name, but not the watch designs themselves. If someone else wants to copy their design, it's perfectly legal. Once they put the fake Rolex name on it, now its a counterfeit...

@@SquireSCA you are definitely right about the common sense part lol...and the Rolex example is a good example I have a few clones and counterfeits and they all are very well made