I haven't read the books so I didn't know her children are actually supposed to be Harwin Strong's, I thought her first-born Jaecerys is actually Criston Cole's son, given that they didn't actually showed Rhaenyra drinking the "tea" in that previous episode. Imagine if they actually ignore the books and do that, Jaecerys being Criston Cole's son and the rest of the children being Harwin's, now THAT would be a twist.

The book may have made it juicy gossip but I think the show made it definitive. Making the Velaryon family brown skinned with white hair was genius for the live action story. They had to have known what they were doing. At least one of the older children would have had one or more of their traits but they don't. The kids are the Strong Boys.

How dramatic would it be if Cole actually is Jace's birth father. All the hatred directed at his own child and Harwin picking up the mantle of father and being the better man for it. With Cole and his thoughts on duty and honor it would be interesting to see how he would take this news. Cole might even play a role in his old child's death. Would fit in with TBE world of games of thrones (yes I read the book. Yes I know people are going to say Jace is Harwin I'm just saying it's a great plot that could play out. And it doesn't make less of Harwin, it makes him a better man if anything because he treated that child like his own ). it would be drama is all I'm saying

The HBO Max series explains any questioms pretty thoroughly, I believe it's fairly obvious that Sir Harwin was the father, like that was literally one of the main plots that episode

I think that Laenor was a fool, couldn't he ask for "external help" to get him started (just like in GoT, when Margaery Tyrell suggested that to Renly), if he could not tolerate to even be near Rhaenyra in that intimate way, he could have drank some potion to knock him out, so Rhaenyra could become impregnated, the point is that if Laenor was serious about performing his duty, he would have tried harder to have legitimate heirs, then live happily with the man that he truly loved, but no. 🙄 They were both stupid and selfish, they only cared about what they wanted, and thought that just because they were nobility then they could get away with that. What Rhaenyra and Laenor did was very risky and short-sighted, it obviously had the potential for conflict (war).

The thing about cersei is her kids are not only bastards they’re not even a member of the royal house Targaryen or Baratheon

The "Jace is Cristin's son" theory is plausible, given that we don't know if Rhaenyra drank the tea. One would think the showrunners would add that interesting twist. Cole bullying his own son in the training yard, and perhaps even killing him later in the show. Cole might turn out to be a great villain. Strong of body, weak of character. *Haven't read the "dragon" book series, so could be way off base. If anyone wants to relate what happens in the books, no prob with spoilers.

IMO Cersei on the show did not “learn the hard way.” Giving D&D too much credit. In fact, Cersei’s children being bastards was of little consequence to herself or family. Just Ned and others. Nobody even cared or at least that’s what I am left to assume since they never got even semi-deep into how the civilians of Kings Landing feel about that. Little disturbances if any aside from someone throwing mud at Joffrey and calling him a bastard. Cersei was killed because she didn’t step a few feet to the right and because Dany attacked Kings Landing because she believed she was the true heir to the throne. Joffrey died because he was a giant prick and Olena didn’t want him married to Marjorie. Tommen committed suicide because Cersei bombed the sept and killed his wife. And Marsala as payback by the sand snakes. I mean of course you can argue that that’s what sparked the war…. But Ned was willing to go to the wall and who knows how calm that would’ve made the waters had he actually been given the chance. But Joffrey chopped his head off which sparked more anger and caused the north to unite. I would argue that Rob would’ve still gathered his armies even if they weren’t bastards. Like if Joffrey unjustly killed Ned, an honorable man, due to Lannister lies, it likely still would’ve sparked a war. D&D got super lazy and dropped the ball. By the end of the show, being a bastard didnt really matter. See: Jon Snow, Gendry, Joffrey, Tommen, Marsala, Ramsey, etc. Only mattered in seasons 1 and 2. Kinda like how kingslaying was no longer a big deal. You can just kill a king or lord, say “I’m your new King now” and everyone claps for you and makes you the new ruler. 😂 Easy as pie. Anyway, great video either way.

My heart is broken 💔 please bring back again Harwin ❤️ He was a wonderful man 🥰✨ and good husband of Rhaenyra ❤️

But the Lannister’s kids were not heirs once they were recognized as bastards, because the King was Robert. With Rhaenyra’s kids it’s different, because bastards or not, they are the kids of the Queen. So to me it doesn’t matter if the kids are one of each.

Jacaerys is probably Coles son. Oh the irony 🤣🤣🤣 I will pay a million bucks to see Coles face if that happens.

Makes sense and a definitive answer the TV series made. Since the book was written and seen from a 3rd persons perspective and bound to be altered truths. The 3 child doesn't look mixed too, and the subtle mention of the nose by viserys kinda hinted it

If Rhaenarya choose Tyland Lannister as her lover the parentage of her children will not be questioned

It's definitely a stretch in the show and nearly impossible in the book but I really like the idea. It makes the entire thing kind of redundant in a poetic way if Alicent was truly fighting (at least that aspect of her stupid fight) for nothing. That being said, making the Valeryons black in the show is all but an indication that they wanted to show clearly that the boys are Strong bastards. They definitely would have cast mixed-race or at least passing actors for the boy had they wanted to leave some ambiguity (like they did when casting Baela and Rhaena) but they specifically chose strictly white passing boys to play her kids. It was a strategic choice that leaves little to interpretation in the show and the book already left us with even less. In the books, Laenor is almost never in the Capital and, thus, is rarely there would he he could have hypothetically sired his sons. An interesting theory and thank you for considering real genetics as so few do when looking at fantasy.

Harwin beating up criston cole was satisfying

His children are really... strong.

How do you make these video/clips. Is there a website or something. Do you download the episode then cut out the clips you want to post? I want to do the same for this show and many other but dont know how.💚

Doesn't any one remember the Rhaenys, Leanors MOTHER, had dark hair in the book! So its genetically possible for her grandchildren to be dark haired. I know about Leanors preferences and stepping way out on a limb (but its HotD so..) Ser Harwin could have joined in a menage a trois with them so that even none of them actually knows who the father is. Leanor did say that he did try the Roast Duck. 😅 And the Targereyns weren't against mixed blood, ie Dragonseeds. As a ruling family that practiced in breeding they new that a periodic infusion of new blood made them stronger and created many more possible Dragon Riders to fill out a fighting force if needed. Alicent is a Westerosi Karen

All these genetics are a mystery all by themself. In my family everybody has blue or brown eyes. I am the only one since 3 generations with green-greyisch eyes. My mother and father have blue eyes. Even my sisters and grandparents had blue eyes. The only one that had brown eyes was my grandpa fatherlysided. It's said my great grandfather had green eyes and I inherited those but on all other corners I am the spitting image of my father and my mother.

Pretty sure it's a definitive. Doubt Laenor has ever slept with Rhaenyra. MAYBE to consumate the marriage but that's the only time they likely ever have. Alicent knows it, the Court knows it, anyone who's seen the kids knows it. Viserys... he just doesn't care it seems, he can't be that oblivious, he just doesn't want to deal with the ramifications. For someone who truly wants to rule one day, Rhaenyra so far hasn't made a good case for herself, considering her current batch of bastards she wants to place as her heirs to the Throne.

In the books, it really is up in the air. F&B never reveals what Aemma looks like, so, though the show gave her the Targaryen silver hair, she could absolutely have had dark hair and wouldn't know. In fact, it is interesting that the story omits Aemma's features, and that makes me think she did have dark hair. Gyldayn, who was the in-universe writer, supports the greens, so he would have had a vested interest in trying to make Rhaenyra look bad (which would be helped by obscuring evidence that might contradict the claims of bastardy). Second, funnily enough, we never get a description of what Harwin Strong looks like. It is fair to say that he probably does have dark hair, since it's used to spread rumors...but so does most of the world. The vagueness of his description could very easily be because there was a passing resemblance to the boys, so the greens (and Gyldayn) wanted to hype up the possibility of illegitimacy. Third, frankly, is that their bastardy was completely irrelevant. They could have come out looking like Targaryens, and the greens would likely have still spread rumors about them being bastards. The greens were concerned with taking shots at Rhaenyra, and her sons' hair colors were good things to target. But, given that this is a sexist society, and it is easy to call a woman a slut, they probably would have taken the easy shots at her anyway, even if it was likely not true. Overall, there really is no way to tell, but in the end, it was irrelevant. The greens didn't care about their legitimacy; they wanted the throne and the supposed bastardy was just a nice excuse to start a war.

Jon Snow is a Stark and Dayne and Rhaegar Targaryen is the son of Bonifer Hasty (a Knight) and his mother is the sister of the Aerys.

Considering Laenor has strong Velaryon features which in the show all Targs/Velaryons have and those kids have zero not to mention he’s gay there’s absolutely no way there could be a question that those kids are his lol.

My head is spinning

I was a little annoyed with this honestly. Why would they not try to have at least one legitimate child? It seems reckless to do what she did since there is no way to pass them off as Laenors kids.

King Viserys could have legitimized all the Strong boys.

Am I the only one that is noticing how obvious it is that the oldest is Sir Cristian son??? Have we not forgotten he was her first? That whole tea ending is clearly left there to make us wonder about the first kid. He has straight hair like Sir Cristan. Theres so much hinting at this.....how is no one talking about this. lol

Nah! doenst go with reality! i am full african, my husband swedish with blue eys, blond hair... we got 6 kids together... my 4th. a daughter has my deep dark brown skin, shade naomi cambelle brown, blond hair, blue eyes! But when you go look at my tribe, albino''s are normal only my girl got lucky she has the very light version of it!!! her eyes and hair!!! Skin tone is even darker than the other kids... But my 5 other kids? They are a perfect blend between me and my husband... It is just strange it happend to Rhea''s kids 3 times in a row...

Clearly all Harwins idk why some people keep thinking Jace isn't when they made it so obvious he is Harwins son

Ranerya's, wasnt shrewd and cunning enough,should have eliminated the dirty hightowers early on, manipulated a few of the Crooked maestors.

Okay, so maybe someone can legitimately answer this for me. Everything I'm about to say pertains to the show and not the books (because I haven't read them). I'm trying to understand the genetics of the children. In GoT, Jon Snow had dark hair because Lyanna was a brunette and Rhaegar had the Targaryen blonde hair. Rhaenyra's children (prior to Daemon) all have dark hair because their father(s) had dark hair. So how do all of Alicent's children with Viserys have the signature blonde hair when she also has dark hair (though it is kind of a red-ish brown color)?

two "dark" parents can make a blonde baby, but two blondes cannot make a dark haired baby, of white skin...much less one parent being dark skinned. Those kids aren't Laenor's.

Well they do look pretty strong 😀

Here is a big big clue as to who is not the father the kids are not black not in the slightest but yet the cousins born to daemon are they are darker than what their mother looked like at that age suggesting that their mother slept around with someone who is mixed or black so yeah casting is a total mess up they could of picked any other characters to be black but the ones we need to cast shadow over has made it difficult with more questions they needed to be consistent with casting the younger version black actors look nothing like the older versions it just shows they just wanted someone black not bothering about the story stupid

the change of actors + the totally random father was confusing me as hell....

None of these customs was outdated for the time period come on ppl stop looking at it from a 2022 lense

it bugs me so much that this show cant decide what rules of Genetics they want to follow

Looking at the show after this episode it hilights why making the Velaryons "black" was a brilliant creative choice. When switiching to a visual media they sometimes juxtapose features to make certain characters stand out. As it stands right now when u see a white character with the platinum blond hair on screen you automatically think "Targaryen" and a black person with the same hair colour "Velaryon". The princesses kids are neither.

well, obviously yes, the series clearly said so. In the books it is "strongly" inferred.

Wheres Maury when you need him???

Yhe first one has got to be coles

what was the dragon in the crypt??? the small 1 and the big 1 under the bigger 1?

Their parentage doesn't even matter in the overall plot. Don't look so much into it lol The ones that truly matter in the scheme of things are the other children Rhaenyra has later

He is the father I don't even know why the video was made ?

Primogeniture was the main reason women's sexuality was so tightly controlled. Since women actually give birth, you always know who the mother is but the father's identity (before blood typing & genetic tests) could be open to conjecture. In the case of Rhaenyra, it shouldn't matter since she is the heir & future Queen, so the Targaryan line is passed down thru her anyway. As long as the children are claimed/acknowledged on the Valaryon side(her husband's family) it really shouldn't matter since the line of succession is not broken.

Certainly. Water should bead off their heads.

Pretty sure Robyn is Littlefingers.

She should’ve marry someone from how strong or Baratheon Or even the north

Went to spouses who heavily have strong genes with silver hair and your child comes out brown hair and is well known that the male spouse is homosexual it’s not much to guess on clearly the male Refuse perform his duties to his house if I have any children and she was foolish enough to marry a man who did not match her lovers gens

I thought that Cole might be the father of Jace

They certainly have dark hair like his. And did you see the way he smiled at the baby? Yeah. I think he believed it.

I think Criston Cole is Jacaerys’s true father

My friend it's not Ve-LER-ion it's Ve-LOR-ion

It’s interesting that so many of the non book readers are spinning a narrative that does not happen in the book. No, Ser Cole is not the father of any of Rhaneria’s children. The Morning After Tea that was served to Rhaneria by the Maesster has been totally omitted from these wishful fantasies. Read the book.

Genetics are funny. I’m really fair skinned and my husband is the opposite (dark skinned Hispanic). Only one of our sons looks like him. The other is light like me and only has his dads eyes and nose.

Our could the son of Ser Cristen.

Eve best legit has black hair Michelle fsurely had reddish long hair they had her grow it out up extensions in it and catelyn looked way better they legit could have just done the same thing with eve. They should have asked her to grow it out added extensions and bam you have her natural hair . They did the same thing with the actress who plays lysa they added extensions

Dont hate on the actors but Velaryons should be "latinos" spanish because white and american mixed and africans should be all the other nations outside westeros like Essos or even Dorne Also because the brown hair could be from her grandparents i think

I will stick with the book. The show is great but I do not take it is the final facts

I thought rhaenyra first child was ser Christian coles

the oldest has to be Cristons

They may be Harwins but they are Targaryen’s

You really made this video huh?

yes

The husband lost everything because of her

Those kids have no right to the throne

LOL this really needed a video? Whats next? "Do dragons really hatch from eggs? - an ivestigation" hahaha

Come on man.Of coarse he was bonin her.

shes a 304 period

The Valeryian/Targaryen parents have silver hair, which is of course a dominant trait. Both kids have brown hair and all of the sets of grandparents have. silver hair.

spoiler: it's not possible for criston to be jace's father. he's going to become "kingmaker". it makes no sense for him to crown a "green" if his own kid is a "black". criston fathering jace is a tinfoil theory.

Stick to videos bro. The genetics make it possible for those to be Laenor's kids based on recessive traits. You declaring it "null and void" because of the genetics of the parents is a fundamental misunderstanding of how genes manifest.

if you have to guess who the father is she's a

Can anyone who read the book confirm if Ser Harwin and Rhaeryna had a romantically built up relationship or they had a chemistry or mention of details of it cause the time jump and the quick shift in relationship dynamic by the show runner feels forced thru my throat. I don’t feel anything about most of the characters!

sus

What's there to say laenors black, the kids are white af.

Wow, what a VILE INSINUATION.

Jon snow doesn't have very Stark features, he looks more like Eddard Stark than Rob (who may have been Brandon Stark's son). Ashara Dayne threw herself from the tower, maybe the one who dishonoured her was Brandon Stark.

Are Rhaenyra’s Children Truly Fathered By Harwin Strong? Duh.... but the eldest maybe not hehehehe