That is a really good point I hadn't thought of to be fair. 💪

Great video,happen to have a MK split load board,& having nusiance triping,been considering fitting DP RCBO's to solve issue.

Yur, that sounds like a good solution, I take it everything's tested out OK?

@@efixx Off the tools now, but everything tested ok, had sparky mate to confirm my results just to be sure.

@Boznivich No. *The all DP RCBO board is far better.* In France, Germany, Switzerland, etc, all main panel circuit _interrupters_ are mandatory DP. This means in those countries they can have dual L&N bus bars, which are referred to as combs. In France they have the _combs_ at the top of the RCBOs/MCBs/RCDs, with conductors to the circuits at the bottom of the _interrupters._ Far better. Not this hodge-podge nonsense we have. We are still in the 1950s in some respects. The French/German DIN rail mounted _interrupters_ are available in the UK as are the combs, usually via mail order.

Reece totally agree with you. We to never install dual rcd boards as we have alway considered not to be good wiring practice. The dual board will be gone for the regs as was that stupid reg where there was no need to protect lighting circuits

Does this mean you have only 1 RCD? If such is the case how you split Lighting (using 100mA) to Sockets (using 30mA) and Water Heaters (using 10mA)?

Great insightful comments as always Craig, thanks much. 😊

How about the manufacturers design equipment not to leak to earth ?

@@raychambers3646 not as easy as it sounds without over-engineering the insulation and adding significantly to the cost. Also, some of the current “seen” by RCCBs, RCBOs etc is not actually current leaking to earth, it is due to harmonic currents (particularly 3rd harmonic) drawn by the equipment. Inrush currents on wound components like motors and transformers can also be asymmetric and appear to the devices as faults too. Careful design is the key and, as Joe points out in the video, the regs make contingency for the selection of protective devices and how circuits are grouped in DBs.

@@raychambers3646 Not possible. Earth is used as a reference to 0v in electronics.

Thanks James! 😃

Ahead of the curve is having all AFDDs.

Not really, a new set of regs doesn't necessarily require an upgraded board.

Most rewires are done because the existing system does not meet the needs of the customer. Not be because it’s “not current”. It’s customer choice that drives most of this.

@@MrIbib fair point Phil. Just for the record I think RCBO’s look like the way forward to me. I am nothing more than a DIY’er who likes to be informed as much as I can. The argument around tripping circuits makes sense to me as a person who has the issue

BS7671 states the regulations aren't retrospective.

The problem is the requirement to minimise conducted and radiated noise for EMC requirements - especially on devices required to have power factor correction - requires a lot of filtering and that filtering inherently results in earth leakage.

Technically the RCD 'leakage' current is the imbalance between the hot and neutral wires - which can occur even without an earth wire. We see more of this these days because fewer loads are purely resistive. A lot of loads now have integrated circuits and there has to be AC to DC conversion to power them. I have a forced air gas furnace in my USA home and it is by far the largest source of 'leakage' current in my home. It has a large DC variable speed blower motor to circulate the air in my home. It is great in that it uses significantly less electricity to run. But, I measure significant leakage current both on the earth wire and the natural gas pipe (not a comforting thought). The second largest leakage current comes in on the ground shield of the cable television coaxial cable that enters my home. We have to bond these other utility cables to our electrical service's ground system, which is bonded to the neutral cable in the main breaker panel. I've yet to see a good article/video from an experienced circuit designer that discussed this topic in depth. I'm curious how much of the 'leakage' is due to poor design or cost constraints as opposed to the natural limitations of dealing with non-resistive loads. But, if I were in the UK I'd stop installing split load boards as I'd expect 'leakage' to get worse not better.

@@JasonEDragon great comment

@@JasonEDragon For clarity: leakage is always to ground/earth but an RCD does not need to monitor ground/earth to detect such leakage and therefore operate. It's not exactly down to poor design but is somewhat linked to practicability and cost. Leakage comes from dielectrtic barriers within electronics, i,e capacitor plates. There is no such thing as a perfect insulator so some current will always 'leak' through. In order to make a 'perfect' insulator, the costs would be astronomical and unobtainable for most consumer-pupose electronics. Hence why it is 'dumped' through the protective earth circuit. Otherwise circulating currents would simply rise to mains potential.

I do a lot of fault finding and dont think it really matters, just try not to have more than 4 MCBs per RCD and the more double pole switches used the better.

I always thought that was best practice. My house is downstairs ring, upstairs lighting on one RCD and vice versa on the other. Makes perfect sense.

Best practice is to split power and lighting so if one RCD tripped you didn't lose all power or all lighting. RCBO solves that. They're one of the few things coming down in price.

@@antlane365 Are you saying you use Double Poles MCB for Loads would help in nuisance tripping

@@Pgan803 Double pole MCBs make fault finding much easier but any double pole switches around help. Like the cooker switch, if you turn it off and the fault clears its in the cooker.

I think the split load CU will be around for a long time yet.

@@efixx considering that ring final circuits, choc blocks, bakelite junction boxes and other things that probably should have been consigned to history are still a thing I agree with you!

Fair does, thanks for commenting! 😊

Fusebox is the boss

Cheap but are they quality? A Hager rcbo is around £30 where as a lewden is say £15! I’m regularly doing jobs with around 15-20 circuits. That’s £450-£600 just on rcbo’s if I want to fit a quality brand. We are in a financial crisis and because the iet rule makers need to keep themselves in employment the consumer has to pay for it. Realistically how often after a rewire do we have rcds tripping out because of the reasons they are giving? I’ve not had 1 as of yet

@@ToffeenoseToffee hold on, we can’t fit RCBO’s because of price but rewires are okay. Talk sense lad, if you’re already doing a rewire then a RCBO board is hardly going to break the bank. And RCBO’s don’t really add that much to the price of a board swap. You should be doing a full EICR prior to the swap any way. So the days of £500 swaps are long gone.

@@MrIbib in some instances no we can’t fit rcbos because of cost, believe it or not some people don’t have the funds of an extra ££££ for rcbos. I’m fitting a full rcbo board to a new factory shower block because the funds are there so in that instance it’s the best thing to do. And doing an eicr before a mains change is just conning the customer in most circumstances if I’m doing my work and I recognise it needs changing I’ll change it And give an installation certificate after carrying out the same tests and inspections as I would on an eicr. I’m busy enough without making work for the sake of it and costing the customer. You 6 week crash course sparks with your logo on your vans might work that way because the iet tell you so but some of us do the right thing tailored to the customers needs

Is quick and cheap an exclusively bad thing? 🤔

Er, not necessarily. 🤔

Already thrown away 6 or 7 in houses with no issues.... 2 this year. And electrical fires on the rise.... Any connection?

RCBOs are definitely the best option as we've stayed many times, the point is that split load boards can still be compliant with some thought.

Really?! If the lights are KNOWN to be a problem ... Turn off the lighting breaker, light some candles (it's Christmas), plug in a table lamp (or two - save energy), switch the oven back on and enjoy your Christmas lunch 5-10 minutes later than planned. Remember to fix the faulty lights ASAP as a New Year resolution! 🤔😋😲🤣🤣

@@boblewis5558 what about neutral to earth fault 😉

@@acelectricalsecurity WHAT neutral to earth fault? DP breakers old chap! None of this SP crap! No Neutral connection ... No fault! When a superior ISO standard DP RCBO OR standard breaker is available in standard 18mm width AND frequently available at a lower price than standard single pole, WHY use inferior, more expensive SP breakers that are MORE time consuming to fit? The UK electrical industry is still WAY behind elsewhere in the world when it comes to breaker & RCBO fittings and their utterly ridiculous antiquated wiring format. WHY is there STILL a STUPID Neutral tail dangling out of double height 18mm RCBO's TWICE the size of Euro & Asian ISO standard 18mm sized devices? Bloody ludicrous! WHY do we STILL have breaker inputs at the bottom causing output feeds to have to cross underneath the DIN rail? Again bloody ludicrous. WHY do we have single busbar systems and have SO MUCH clutter in a CU because of all the Neutral feeds going to one bar at the top? Again bloody ridiculous! The UK CU is, pure and simple, a complete shambles, requiring WAY too much time to implement and even greater time to test and fault find. Compare the simplicity of testing a suspect or faulty circuit on a DP standard breaker to an SP breaker as a simple example: DP: isolate the breaker, disconnect the earth/s only and test the fully isolated wiring as normal, without ever touching the live or neutral inputs, without disturbing either of the output terminals and only have to reconnect the earth terminal and re torque. Final ring circuits being the exception to the above for obvious reasons, but there is a solution to that problem too, although too much detail for this post which is already long. SP: work out WHICH Neutral is which in a poorly wired, non dressed unit and disconnect (a reconnection which has to be retorqued on reassembly), disconnect the CP/Earth lead (after finding it in the mess), disconnect live output (not necessary or essential but everyone seems to do it. Now you have THREE connections to be retorqued instead of one, increasing the opportunity for reconnection error. If the release torque wasn't checked, and recorded, of there may be too much compression having been on the wire damaging or crushing it too much, so retorquing (correctly) may weaken it even more. Safer to leave connections alone OR measure & record release torque OR cut cable ends and remake. The latter is clearly impractical long term once cable ends become too short to remake ... ANOTHER reason in my view why solid as well as stranded cable should have ferrules fitted for more consistent connections and better long term physical protection.

@@boblewis5558 yeah if it's double you are hot to trot, but I have never come across double pole breakers in a domestic property, it's all cheap as chips £60 twin RCD board from Screwfix or some brand you have never heard of and all single pole mcbs .

Eight RCBOs is nowhere near £700! FuseBox are around £18 and also DP.

@@johnburns4017 2x21way almost full is about 25 circuits

We are in the UK. Not sure about Poland...

Our thanks to the Grange Hill generation! 😂 Good points though, thanks much.

Lots of content on the channel to help! 😃

Hi how are things? In the institute they ask us for material to do the practices, I do not have the capacity to buy all the material. Thank you

😂 Love that. 💪

so the side that doesn't trip are 'the splitters'?

Yeah, the RCD protection on fixed loads and lighting is more about the cables buried in the walls really. The intention is if someone whacks a nail through a cable it'll protect anyone touching the nail. 👍

I would say that it would add up to 0 extra time, I've never met a single customer who tests their RCDs or RCBOs

@@100tinsoldiers It was an attempt at humour.

@@fredquimby5409 I must admit I thought it was, I thought you can’t be serious, in my best McEnroe voice

and no one wants a faulty white good taking out half their electrics.

The amount of split-load RCD board I've had to reconfig and reload because the customer recently had an LED conversion or upgraded their appliances to modern equivalents. All nuisance tripping from overcrowding the RCD.

A fair point, I only have RCBOs and AFDDs on my own board. 👍