Waynos: Are Tubulars making a come back? Me: No! They NEVER left!

Hi Waynos, after some 45 years of riding tubulars I‘m still fond of them. The best wheel set I have owned for 15 years by now are campy Hyperons.

I am a tubular newbie for all the reasons you say so your analysis is spot on.

I used to race tubs on 50mm Dura Ace Carbon ..... i absolutely loved them. Nothing like the feel of tubs and i have never used anything to date that comes close!!

I've been riding, sometimes a lot, sometimes very little, for five decades. In all that time I've never had any desire to try tubulars. I have no particular interest in tubeless either. Why not? Because standard clinchers with tubes are a lot better than they were 50 years ago, much lighter and easier-rolling. They're much easier to manage when it's time for replacement or repair. They're quite good enough for my riding, which is focused on stretching time and distance over going faster.

Tubulars never went away for me , they roll better than anything

People ask me why latex inner tubes. I reply thus: when was the last time you used butyl condoms?

I was at a gran fondo last week which was clearly advertised as having lots of broken roads and 2% gravel. One smart guy showed up on tubulars to save weight. He punctured of course. He could not fix it with the foam and because he road a little bit uphill with a flat tire he damaged the interface between valve and tubular. He was winning. But had to give up. Now that is a pain in the neck!

I spend Way too much time on Waynos Fotos and on the Paceline cycling forum. I have read extensively on that forum that tubulars are the safest tires to run if you have a flat tire on a fast, steep descent. I run Veloflex tubulars per Wayno’s recommendation. I worry about flatting on clinchers at speed and having a serious accident. Tubulars, if they’re good enough for Sean Kelly….

As far as I'm concerned tubs never left. My 23c tufo tubs ride smoother than my wider latex tubed clinchers. Clinchers now are very close but tubs just have something about the ride.

As I get older I'm less concerned with speed and the latest tech. I've started thinning my collection of modern bikes and have picked up vintage steel. A lot of the older bikes from the 80s and 90s come with tubs. So, I think as long as the vintage market and Eroica events are still going, there will always be a need for tubulars. Could be a nod back in time for nostalgia but I think when it comes to riding, a more practical clincher probably is the choice of many. I've found tubulars on Amazon for cheaper than a lot of clincher tires.

I watched your videos, purchased tubular rims with power hubs at low cost and love the veloflex tires. I run tubeless on my gravel bike but love tubular with tape for my road bikes.

I’ve just a pair of tub wheels given to me recently I’m so glad I’ve found your channel, you gave me the confidence to go out and ride them! They feel supreme quality compared to my corsa control clinchers

40 years on tubulars, plan on riding my last ride on them, maybe 15 years more, shopping out my next ride:)

Cheap good 2nd hand carbon rims is exactly why I am trying tubulars for the first time (A pair of Fast Forward for £240). I have put some new 28mm tyres on (£64 for the pair) and I have no particular fear of punctures. I can't see sales of new tubular wheels picking up by much though.

Love your content!

Love tubular tyres have ridden for many year's ride is nice just put on rims for a few weeks and easy to fit a lot of the new tyres are more expensive than what I buy

Really wanted to try tubular tires and your videos are really helpful to alleviate the fear of puncturing and getting stuck on the side of the road but this video is very helpful. I mean I have an opportunity to purchase a set of 404 FIRESTRIKE for 800 bucks. retail this were 3000 dollars at one time really nice CONDITION

Tubular tires are fine for track riding. As far as on the road clincher is way better. I can change a tube in under 7 minutes, 12 if have to patch the tube. Never want to be 40 miles out and have a flat you can't fix.

My personal favorite in depth video is by Psimet on tubular install

Everything old is new again. Until they have to deal with the technical issues. You do have one great idea: Put some sort of sealant in your tires. I preach this to my tube using buddies.

I run bora ultras tubular with hgigh end tubular tyres..absolutely nothing comesw close to the ride quality....with tape I can install in no time at all..carry a spare tub to ride gingerly home if I have to...I pump to 100 psi for a magic carpet ride...tubeless is a joke when it goes wrong and the best clincher setup cannot compare to the best tubular setup...in spite of everything the pros still ride tubular....

I scored a set of enve 6.7 tubular rims with dt swiss 240 hubs for $550 recently on marketplace. No chance I would even be looking at the latest version haha. Plus they are disc only.

I've always run tubulars as my main wheels with clinchers as my backup or travelling set. Although my most recent clinchers are almost as good as my tubulars... the problem is supply and choice which seem to be limited both at my lbs and on the Internet. Also the width choices seem to be very limited.

come back? I never left. have a huge bunch of different tubular wheels for different bikes, I also have clincher wheels and tubeless, these are pretty good today, but the magic carpet ride of tubulars is still the best.

I will keep pounding the table on this...TUBELESS TUBULARS.... Get a puncture on a ride? Stick a plug in it keep on pushing pedals. I've got a really nice set of used $400.00 carbon wheels set up with gravel tires...slapped them on a cheap caad and it's one of the best feeling gravel bikes. Feels like riding on a cloud....never have to worry about a tire coming off on a downhill. And unless you get a slit in one the puncture protection is better than anything going.

I'd love to see a real world test. Waynos, if you borrowed a couple of wheelsets (one tubeless, another tubed, as similar to your own as you can) from some friends and just compared them as a 'first impressions' video. Just your own thoughts on the pressures you ran, how they rode, handled, felt, weighed, responded to inputs. Nothing in depth, just some thoughts. Just an idea. Keep up the great work

I’ve just fitted some Challenge open tubular (clincher type) tyres to my road bike they don’t require tubular specific wheels I think this is a good compromise

I used to have a pair of tubular deep section BS wheels from FFWD Black edition LTD bla bla bla.. Although the wheels were a bit shit, and they didn't stop at all in the wet, I did like the feel of the tubular tires, just like you mentioned, but the Continental GP tubular tires didn't last very long for some reason. Those where the only tires in my life, well since I was a kid, long time ago, that I actually went through the tred on the tire. I had a flat once, but I still made it home, then put some sealant in and bob was my uncle :) Putting them on was not as difficult as everyone set them out to be. These days I'm rding Latex tubes with 28mm Continental GP 5000 tires, think they are wonderful combo, then on another bike which I think is even better, I run 32mm Continental STR'S with Eurethan tubes that weigh next to nothing. It's only about 10 years ago that I was riding 23mm tires with butyl tubes and had no complaints, pressures above 120psi hahaha... I wouldn't mind trying them Tubulars again, but I'm pretty happy with what I have at the moment and the convenience of using tubes, although I only get a flat once every 5 years or so, or 3x in the same week when using Vittoria Corsa Graphine ll BS tires. Thanks for the cool discussions :) Greetings from your Icelandic friend in Singapore.

The issue these days is that it's hard to get brand new tubular rims. I think Caden is the only company that offers a real high end tubular wheelset. Sub 1100 grams for a medium depth is just insane. And they could probably save another 100 grams in the next product generation by swapping to carbon spokes. Certainly, KZfaq had an impact in making people want rim brakes and tubular tyres. Tho right now it's the UCI that is holding back technology. If we ever get the UCI to relax their weight limit, tubular tyres will be back within the mainstream in no time.. and if we see them allow 5spoke wheels, the traditional spoke design will be gone.

Making a comeback in my house 😁 Had a rear puncture at the outdoor track a couple of weeks ago......I didn't know what was happening, the bike didn't feel right, I thought it was a loose headset so pulled in. Anyway tiny puncture so decided to have a go at fixing, took tyre part off rim, pulled the backing tape off, unpicked the stitches to about 4 inches, patched tube, stitched through original holes and contact adhesive everything. Took about an hour, which I thought wasn't too bad for a first attempt. It was an almost new Vittoria Pista CS so was worth the effort. Not sure I'd attempt it if was a latex tube though?

I heard a few days ago of someone who was starting to collect CDs :-) There is a whole learning experience there, with a post-doc assuring me that the best sound quality comes from vinyl... that’s what the advertising is telling him. If that’s all you read, and you don’t know enough to understand snr,s, that’s what you believe. Ben O’Connr does his training on clinchers and tpu tubes, but says the traction is still better on tubulars... but not the rolling resistance. Pirelli tlr vs Pirelli tube clincher must be 80g difference per wheel. Does it matter? Mike Woods claims climbing pros are continually accelerating, hence less rotating mass is potentially a good thing, while wind-tunnel tests are less relevant. Does it matter if we only care about the feel of the bike while climbing, since we”re not racing? There are also the GCN scribes getting off-message: two from the French language version just concluded that 7 bar is much faster than 3.5bar with 28mm Pirelli tyres. Pity they didn’t also compare to narrower tyres or intermediate pressures Finally, in Europe at least, Continental GP5000S TLR’s are impossible to buy. Supply chain issues. Maxxis HR one zk are also pretty tricky to find. It may be that the tubular tyres are more avaiable for the few non-pros still using them.

Coming from cyclocross background tubulars are standard for racing due to two rim hooked sides sticking out from rim bed that can get damaged when going over rough stuff at low tire pressures. Tubulars not as fast to set up the wheels for use or carry emergency tire if needed but give better ride. Thinking of trying trying tubulars with some tubular wheels for general road use on my rim brake CX bike due to cost replace and hard to find new rim brake clincher-tubeless wheels now days. Prefer bw film images over digital images. Better quality image if you know how to bring it out of the film and camera.

Gold standard. Always were always will be

Finger crossed Tufo and Vittoria seem like the only 2 choices left. ps. Tubular wheel in my possession = Zip303, ZipDic, MavixCXR80, BontragerAeolus 7

I get it why people prefer clinchers vs. tubular . Im really sure most of these people go joy riding versus ride hard and fast. Ive experience flat going 27mph with clinchers almost dump my 5000.00 frame .tubular, you get flat, you can ride on a flat wheel won't ruin the wheel .Tubeless is completely nightmare! Especially mounting tires fk that .Matter fact i get rid my Campagnolo Bora wto for older Campagnolo tubular wheels .never again ride tubeless or clinchers.

Hi Wayne. Great thought provoking content as usual. I’ve never run tubular, but am looking for a cheaper alternative to a nice set of wheels. Now I appreciate they have a great feel on smooth roads, but how would they fair for puncture resistance and vibration damping on rougher roads or even surfaces like Belgian cobbles? Thanks in advance to anyone who answers, shared their experiences

I hope not, and if I will stay on clincher..last ride over 80km in the rain I was able to replace tube in 4min and continue to ride..not sure by the size of the puncture I would be able to made it with tubeless or tubular

I just started riding tubular since I needed a new wheelset and didn't have a big budget for clinchers or tubeless. I love how they look and feel on my bike. However I haven't been using any sealant or carrying something like Vittoria pitstop. So I am definitely a little anxious about doing longer rides. Can anybody recommend a good sealant to carry...or just use in my tires now. My tires are stuck on using Tufo tape. I didn't want to deal with the glue and heard good things about Tufo tape.

I use to see good vintage tubular wheel sets on Craig's List for not much more than $100us but just looked and there are none in my area now. If there is new found popularity, it must just be the new generation rediscovering them. The tires are pricey and they're usually a once and done thing so operating cost is much higher than a good clincher wheel set unless your always slicing the tires on glass. I still don't see why people like tubeless tires when tubes are cheap and tire selection is good. Back in the day I spent a bunch of money on tires that approximated the ride of tubulars and ran over some glass on the first ride. Sad.

People are always trying to get faster the easier way rather than the proper way - training. It's why GCN has 100 videos on cadence.

Tubes kick ass they just have to engineer a new interface and get rid of the glue. It will sell like hotcakes if they can make a mechanism that relies on simple contact. The glue really scares people away.

Yep, bought my second hand rim brake bike in Feb after i crashed my Tarmac SL7, and my second hand bike had tubular wheels, so I've given them a go. Had one flat, it was interesting but i got home.

Wayno you're the one to blame for all these retro stuff!! Lol. I used to ride tubs as a young rider, loved them and did some of my best times etc on them. I didnt find gluing them onto rims a problem, just make sure the glue went on rims, not hands, arms, carpet etc! Then sticky tape came in .....easier! The one thing you do need master is repairing punctures with tubes, sewing skills required otherwise a possible blow out mid ride!! I think its good to be retro, I get sick to death about hearing about tubeless, a load of camp nonsense! Clinches and tubs mate!! Keep up the good reviews!

Vinyls marked share seems up - its close to nothing still. Probably same with tubulars: a niche looks into it. I have a set. Cant recommend the system.

There is a reason why the Pro peloton rides tubulars and another reason why the BS'ers are trying to force them onto tubeless

In our modern culture, we hold a core belief that progress demands change and change must improve "value" for industry and "ease-of-use" for customers - above all other considerations. This is at the root of why digital has replaced analog technologies including CDs replacing vinyl and digital photography replacing film. In the bike industry, the same can be said for clinchers replacing tubulars, discs replacing rims brakes, etc. Of course there will always be a segment of the market (that would include most of Waynos subscribers) that values other factors more highly. For example, factors such as safety, quality, engineering, performance, and cost. Back in the day, the main attack vector against tubulars used by the marketing departments of the bike industry was indeed "convenience". They told us that "glue" was evil and even worse "sticky", nor should a modern cyclist have to contend with unstitching and restitching a tyre in order to repair the inner tube. Of course, they failed to warn us of the major safety harzards of the clincher system, namely, pinch flats and loss of control at higher speeds. It's hard to imagine how the public would react if the car industry started promoting a new tyre system that significantly increased the risk of a driver losing control and crashing during a puncture event at highway speeds! I myself (an engineer) even made the switch to clinchers, albeit briefly. What overcame the power of the marketing hype for me was a front puncture during a speedy descent in the late 1980s. As the flanges of my front clincher rim hit the pavement, the bike instantly disappeared from beneath me and I woke up about 15 minutes later just as the ambulance was arriving. I have seen this same event befall others in the intervening years too. It even happened to one of my club mates two weeks ago. He also needed a trip to the hospital. Keep up the noble work of educating the community Waynos!

Clinchers are outright dangerous on road race width, they can blow out of rim very easily. So only tubulars for me.

Do not see any reason for tubulars to "come back" as no wheel or tyre manufacturer claimed new dedicated products. Rather an wakening of the ancient Evil: what you see here is rather tubular enthusiasts moving over to tubellss and giving away their stuff in favor of nubies - hence the interest. Another aspect - also connected to shrinking market - those who used to regularly throw away tubs do not see it as an economic option now and resort to repairing. And honestly, I'd rather fit a tubular than tubeless myself: both are a nasty job, but at least the first is predictable.

Tubulars isn't just newbie friendly. You have to buy a new tubular wheel set and glue (or tape) the tire. Most newbies also haven't even heard of Tubular tires. Tubulars are also often mistaken as Tubeless tires. Because both words sounds similar. The industry is also heading towards heavily marketing tubeless tires and wheel set. So that's what a typical new rider interested in the sport would hear about watching GCN. Some mid-range built bikes today comes in tubeless ready rims. So converting to tubeless is easy for new riders. Just buy a new tubeless tire, rim tape and sealant. Then you are good to go. So if you aren't a serious cyling enthusiast. Or friends with older roadies. You'll probably never will even consider ridding Tubs. Since only the Pros ride tubulars in races. You also wouldn't hear about tubular tires being promoted tire brands since they are older technology. Part of me believes tubulars still exists because the Pro teams still want them.

They never went away! I’ve raced and trained on tubs all my career. They are lighter, faster, and can be ridden flat. If you have ever experienced a blow out puncture when descending at 50 mph you will know why racers prefer tubs. They don’t suffer from pinch flats either. The only moan I have about tubs is you can no longer get heavy all weather training tubs, so you are forced to train/ club ride on clinchers or tubeless. Toddy.

Nope. Modern tubeless and tubed clinchers are much easier to set up and repair and performance is just as good or better. And usually cost less.

I hope they don't! Much too labor intensive and time consuming in the shop. Not to mention the mess.

No.

If you care for your LBS do not get tubulars !

I think they are dead. Tubeless is the future.

Don't you just hate people that try to sell used stuff and ask way more for it than what it's value really is? Listen up people, if you don't use the item anymore what good is it to you. It depreciated as soon as you bought it then you used it on top of that. Typically it's value is less than half of what you paid for it. And the person interested doesn't know what kind of use you put it through. If it's a few years old and its made of carbon it ain't worth more than a few hundred bucks at best. These sellers are the type of people that are so cheap they make me sick. I have an almost new set of Campagnolo Shamal Carbon wheels that I've only used on a few rides, maybe 200 miles, and when I put them up for auction on ebay I'll take what the winning bidder said he would pay and move on with my life. I ain't using them anymore so help out another cyclist is the way I look at it. And the reason I ain't using the wheels is because I built up some carbon hoops with ONYX Vestper hubs which are totally silent, and the instant engagement is the best thing going for a road bike. Absolutely the best hubs out there. As for the tubulars, I used them for a while back in the days I raced and they are great but I got tired of a spare tire sticking out of my jersey pocket all the time.

No, they aren’t

They never went away! I’ve raced and trained on tubs all my career. They are lighter, faster, and can be ridden flat. If you have ever experienced a blow out puncture when descending at 50 mph you will know why racers prefer tubs. They don’t suffer from pinch flats either. The only moan I have about tubs is you can no longer get heavy all weather training tubs, so you are forced to train/ club ride on clinchers or tubeless. Toddy.