Under the Sign of the Black Mark is everything

I think Beherit is overlooked quite often, it's definitely an essential band for those who love BM.

Next time debate with a Black Metal musician.

You guys really Need to split this to a proto/first wave black metal list and a second wave list

How the fuck does Hellhammer not get mentioned!?!?!?!?!?

These are the awards: Most ahead of their time: "Dissection - The Somberlain" Lone album to shape a genre: "Thorns - Trøndertun" Coldest album (debatable): "Emperor - In the Nightside Eclipse/ Satyricon - Dark Medieval Times" BM in it's most purest form stylistically: "Darkthrone - Transylvanian Hunger" Most historically significant to the genre: "Mayhem - De Mysteriis Dom Sathanas" For excellence in band progression: Enslaved

My 10 Essential Early Black Mal Albums: Venom - Black Metal Hellhammer - Apocalyptic Raids EP Celtic Frost - Morbid Tales EP Bathory - Under The Sign Of The Black Mark Sarcófago - INRI Mayhem - De Mysteriis Dom Sathanas Darkthrone - A Blaze In The Northern Sky Blasphemy - Fallen Angel Of Doom Beherit - Drawing Down The Moon Burzum - Burzum

Starting a debate on black metal never ends well for anyone, this was extremely constructive though

Jason looks like he just wants Norwegian Black Metal bands and looks rather uncomfortable with all the Venom, Bathory, Celtic Frost, Mercyful Fate, Sarcofago...

Mercyful fate definitely needs to be there! Their imagery and lyrics are definitely ask dark as any of those other early Black metal bands! Sure it's not speed black metal like some of the others but it's definitely black heavy metal!

Hvis Lyset Tar Oss is Burzum's most haunting record in my oppinion. It is atmospheric as hell, the vocals and album cover freaks me out. Even though it's only 4 songs I think it's better than Filosofem, Self Titeled and Det Som En Gang Var in my oppinion

Jason Longo is as personable and exciting as a bag of potatoes. :/ I'd be pumped to talk metal with you guys at the banger bar and he doesn't even seem too care. Lol.

So many millions of fundamentalists do not recognize early Venom and Mercyful fate albums as BM classics - why? Oh, because they have melodies and hard rock gimmicks and the whole old bag of tricks. SO FUCKING WHAT? Black Metal is not only about chainsaw guitars and sepulchral Halloween vokillz. It's about ambience and spirit, and in that sense, Venom and MFate MADE IT . So, albums like the Venom Trilogy and MFate's Melissa and "..Oath" are BLACK METAL CLASSICS. They paved the way... and I even fear that I am now (at 53) getting a little bit tired of NBM, especially after knowing from the words of people WHO WERE there in the day, that it was basically a can of bees... of course I also cherish the memories of Bathory's early tetralogy and Hellhammer's scarce discographic legacy. Why do I think this, you may ask... - well just watch this Lock Horns video. Any way I was 18 in 1981, that best explains my opinion. Lock Horns UP !

I'm glad Bathory made it on, but I feel their debut (the yellowgoat album) was the true beginning of the LO-FI sound of black metal.

I seriosly don't understand why they put "Filosofem" on the list and not "Aske", which was a much earlier record that actualy came with a Zipo lighter and had a burnt church on the cover. What could be more black metal than that?

Sam nails the Venom summary on the head. It may be difficult for those who are younger to wrap their heads around the importance of Venom's Black Metal LP but it is unquestionably the cornerstone of the genre. As a zine editor, tape trader, etc.. in the early 80's I can assure you that the bands I was corresponding with and interviewing at the time (Slayer, Bathory, Hellhammer, Exodus, Metallica, Crowley, Nasty Savage, you name it) - they ALL derived inspiration for what they did from Venom's first two albums.

I'm surprised Sam has not heard or is familiar with Beherit. Very atmospheric. The only other album missing is Impaled Nazarene Tol Cormpt Norz Norz Norz. Other Scandinavian bands exist and are influential other than the Norwegians.

Dissection "The Somberlain" is one that should be mentioned. As for the artwork of Emperor's "In the Nightside Eclipse", It takes the chromatic influence from the Dissection Album.

Beherit rules !!! 👏👊👍

Why would anything from the 90's be considered "Early" black metal. That's ridiculous. The list should have had bands like Venom, Hellhammer/Celtic Frost, Slayer (Show No Mercy), Bathory, Vulcano, Sarcofago, Mayhem, Sodom, Tormentor, Bulldozer, Morbid, Mefisto, Sabbat, Necrodeath and such bands.

Pure Holocaust totally needs to be there! That album is top ten early black metal material all day long. An absolute classic! Pummelling, melodic, raw and quintessentially Norwegian black metal \,,/

Nobody wants to talk about Hellhammer but everyone wants to talk about Mayhem. This being despite the fact that three members of Mayhem are named after Hellhammer songs (Messiah, Maniac and Euronymous) and another named Hellhammer! Which just goes to show how fucking clueless most black metal fans are.

The guest Jason has little respect for the true origins of the black metal genre that influenced and largely created the bands he would later love in the '90s. It all traces back to Venom! Martin Ain himself said Hellhammer started out imitating Venom which led to Celtic Frost. Quorthon followed Venom around from city to city when they came to Scandinavia as he was a huge die hard fan of Venom who were a giant influence on Bathory. Dead from Mayhem had a famous quote that roughly said all black metal is here because of the fathers Venom as he put it. Plenty of early pics of Euronymous wearing Venom tshirts. In my view whether you love Venom's early music or not black metal traces it's evolutionary roots directly from them. Even listen to the sound at the start of the song "Black Metal" it sounds much like the early Bathory and Scandinvian bm guitar sound.

This really should've been two lists: 80's with Poison, Morbid, and Samael & 90's with all the second wave bands.

Neckbeard in a beanie doesn't even know about Beherit . great guest choice SAM

In several previous episodes, the "proto" band that started the movement has been put above the title, signifying that they spawned or influenced the movement but weren't necessarily part of it. That's where I would have put Venom. Leave them above the list and THEN put the top 10 essential BM albums underneath. It seems like a reasonable compromise, and then you could keep someone like Ulver or Satyricon (I wouldn't necessarily put Enslaved on there, much as I love them, because their early BM stuff wasn't as influential as their 2000s-era prog albums).

Mayhem 'De Mysteriis' is essential

The entire list in general is excellent because all these bands were brutal black metal and were original!

I get that this guest has been playing music and has been involved with metal for 20+ years, but he doesn't seem so well versed with this subject. Maybe he's just not so great at elaborating on his thoughts, but it comes across like he's unfamiliar with this genre, save the more popular bands.

I think the cornflakes reference talking about Burzum went over Sam's head...

Also, maybe even before Sodom, a band called Holy Moses (which most of you probably don't know) Put out a demo called Black Metal Masters in 1980, and Satan's Angel in 1982. The music is darker than Venom, almost sounding like Deathcrush or early Darkthrone. The vocals, oh the vocals. The vocals actually sound like they are out of Live in Leipzig, or 2nd wave Black Metal!

Mercyful Fate, Celtic Frost/Hellhammer, Possessed, Venom, Bathory were all huge influences on Black Metal so I believe they all deserve a place on this list! this all helped the great black metal bands to come like Darkthrone, Mayhem, Burzum, Emperor, Immortal, Gorgoroth, those are what I consider great 2nd wave Black Metal bands.

I'd consider "early" black metal to be the first wave. What are all those 2nd wave bands doing there?

Venom and Hellhammer are on top of the list of early blackmetal.No debate needed. It is what it is.

this dude doesnt look to excited to be here talking about black metal lol

Come on. Samaels debut lp, and their 1988 7" ?

Absolutely clueless guest with no knowledge on the subject whatsoever.

What the younger members of the metal community might not be aware of is that the term Black Metal had a different meaning in the 80's. It only referred to a band that had lyrics mainly focused on satanism / anti-xtianity. Venom coined the term but Bathory defined the sound.

I would have personally looked into other bands in the scene that were hugely influential under the radar. Bands like Samael with Ceremony of Opposites and Rotting Christ with Thy Mighty Contract, maybe Enslaved's Frost too.

they forgot VON

"So I wasn't really into black metal until this dude showed me the basics, but here are my opinions on the top 10!"

I think the fact that he didnt put Sepultura's Morbid Visions is just not right

Venom defined black metal. The Norwegians just 'redefined' it for themselves. Plus black metal in the 80's was defined by it's satanic lyrical content and not necessarily it's sound. Thus bands like Mercyful Fate and Possessed were described as black metal bands back in the day.

So according to the comments kids these days think Venom isn't black metal HAHAHAHA

Sodom's "In the Sign of Evil" and "Obsessed by Cruelty" have WAY more in common with Venom, Bathory, and Hellhammer than any releases by Kreator and Destruction, who sound relatively much more like Slayer, Exodus, and Metallica, so I strongly disagree on that one.

c'mon guy, get the guests a seat next time, it was so awkward seeing him standing up like that haha

Sam I am totally grateful for what you do man, you keep the metal flag flying and that's what matters in the end. I watch all your shows and while I might disagree with some viewpoints, I respect you for being a huge metal fan. All I ask is please leave political viewpoints out, that shit does not matter, its all about the music, good metal is good metal period!

Id say the legend is Venom's Welcome to Hell or Black Metal for sure..

The first sound of black metal was created with hellhammer (fav. Satanic rites) and bathory. My personal favorites from the first wave are bathory, tormentor and samael!

I'm really surprised no one brought up that Transilvanian Hunger and Filosofem being what directly influenced the start of DSBM.

Mayhem members have acknowledged that they learned they raw sound from bands in Colombia such as Typhon, Inquisition, Masacre, Parabellum, Nebiros..etc

Under A Funeral Moon ???

Lisa is so hot!!!

Man, why the hell is Dark Medieval Times by Satyricon not on there? That's disappointing, it is one of my favorite bm albums of all time. It wasn't even mentioned.

People who refer to Mercyful Fate as just "traditional heavy metal" really annoy me. Do you not hear the thrashy riffing and drumming when compared to their contemporaries of the early 80s?! Contemporaries, meaning Judas Priest, Iron Maiden, Black Sabbath... They definitely DID have more in common with Motörhead and Venom than THOSE bands. The main difference (than the two bands I just mentioned) was that Mercyful Fate had more melody in their musical equation. Of course, these are the bands I'm mentioning because this is pre-thrash; before the likes of Metallica and Slayer, etc. arrived on the scene. King Diamond's vocal acrobatics weren't akin to the bands that came before them either. His falsetto could rival that of Rob Halford but his growls could rival that of Cronos!! Mercyful Fate gets lumped in with regular metal far too often but they were so much more than that! I feel like I'm one of the few people who just gets lost in their music when I listen to them and I just hear the heaviness and atmosphere that pulls me in every time! I feel like there are a lot of people that don't pay much attention when they listen to music. I listen to it and FEEL it. It's harder to categorize them due to their myriad of styles, but they aren't just "traditional metal"... They're so much more than that. Anyway, I just really felt the need to address this since people tend to downplay them a lot, especially when considering the timeline that they arrived onto the scene.

You guys forgot these: Sabbat Master's Hammer Samael Graveland Marduk Impaled Nazarene Mortuary Drape Rotting Christ Mystifier

despite the guest adding almost nothing substantial to this segment, this is still one of my favorites recently. thanks for doing these. I need all of those magnets, you should look into having them licensed and sell them through banger, because I would love a full black metal magnet covered fridge.

I love how hellhammer ended up in the board.

Burzum Aske , Darkthrone A Blaze In the Northern Sky , Immortal Pure Holocaust , Mayhem De Mysteriis Dom Sathanas , Venom Black Metal , Hellhammer Apocalyptic Raids , Bathory the Return

Lock Horns is a hell of a show and Sam is always perfect, but please choose your guests wisely. this dude barely says the same adjectives for each album and doesn't have a clue about black metal :(

I'd like to say thanks for another great video Sam and company. To me, the feeling and atmosphere of black metal is exemplified by Bathory, and that sound of another​ world that the darkness, sorrow and "the journey into the void" is the hallmark of what became black metal as we know it. Many elements came together to allow black metal to exist. Mercyful Fate, Sarcafago, Hellhammer, Celtic Frost, Motorhead, GBH, Amibex, Discharge, Venom, Bathory, and many more are essential to the formation of that signature sound. Are any of those bands black metal? Depends on how YOU feel, and YOUR experience while partaking of this artform. But there seems to be a dividing line at the Norwegian bands and that's when the genre ceses to be super a influential mix of many things and become a solid cohesive genre that stands on it's own.

To all (New Wave) Black Metal Preschoolers : True, Black Metal was not the first Black Metal album, it was Welcome To Hell.

I'd like to make a connection between your Lock Horns video about NWOBHM where you mentionned Witchfynde and this one: can we consider Withfynde as a precursor in terms of imagery? The artwork of the Give 'Em Hell album looks so evil and black metal to me! And it only came out in 1980!

forgot some of the first wave like Root and Master's Hammer

It seems the audio way off-sync with the video whenever I want to watch it. And it's the same for a few other of the Lock Horns videos.

Video starts at 0:45

In the Woods " Heart of the Ages" is one hidden gem of an album.

People mention all these 1st wave bands, but not VULCANO? Their LIVE! album is essential and captures the true essence of black metal.

Why is there no Marduk?

I’m so happy the first band this guy said was DISSECTION 👌🏻🤘🏻 thank god

How could they leave off Slayer? Any body remember Infernal Majesty's album None Shall Defy?

I am surprised, there was no love for The Secrets of the Black Arts by Dark Funeral.

Thank u Sam for the amazing work that you have been putting up for almost so long. I have always appreciated your work and your channel. I have always wanted to be a part of the debates u host but unfortunately i have discovered your channel a little late. Hope to be a part of the other future events... Much love from India brother\m/

Dissection and Sacramentums First one are my favorites but Black metal at all has so much gems like kvist, taake, vinterland, or the early abigor couldnt decide which are the best, i love all the classic albums the same in their own way

First of all it was not Venom's Black Metal who inspired the genre, it was Welcome To Hell a year earlier. Many actual Black Metal musicians from that time remember that album as something really evil and worth listening to. Second, as Venom, Bathory, Hellhammer and Mercyful Fate are widely considered the main pioneers of the 1st Wave there are other bands who also played this sort of fast heavily distorted and evil music, for example Sodom (Germany), Parabellum and Reencarnación (Colombia), Sepultura, Vulcano, Mystifier and Sarcófago (Brazil), Bulldozer and Mortuary Drape (Italy), Blasphemy (Canada), Von (USA), Tormentor (Hungary), Samael (Switzerland), Master's Hammer (Czech Republic), Pentagram (Chile) and many others.

Gorgorth Pentagram....no? Did we forget?No one could scream like Hat

jilemnice occultist is a black diamond....totally overlooked ...i ordered it and drawing down the moon out of the back of metal maniacs...masters hammer are far and away overlooked genius

Dimmu Borgir - For All tid 1994 ?

Angus Young started the black metal voice with Dirty Deeds

If you’re into black metal, you start ranting about how Beherit is underrated and should be up there with the most important early black metal bands as soon as the name comes up.

The Immortal guys look like they had a Black Metal checklist to check off and have notorized before that photoshoot/cover you showed of them.

I'm still bewildered that they had to add Burzum to that list

Hey Sam, I fully agree with you :-) HELLHAMMER Apocalyptic Raids should be on this list!!! Only Death Is Real \m/ BTW you forgot the early stuff from germany and eastern europe Sodom - Obsessed by Cruelty Destruction - Sentence of Death Tormentor - Anno Domini ROOT - Zjeveni/Hell Symphony Blasphemous Greetings from Germany Keep it up

Neckbeard in a beanie can't wait to get home and crank up some Black veil brides and some Slipknot. Which I'm sure he knows a lot more about those types of music than he does black metal. Which maybe he's heard of

What about Gorgoroth's Under The Sign of Hell?

Sooooo when it comes to the Ulver issue, it DEFINITELY should've been up there. You guys need to think of Bergtatt, Kveldssanger, and Nattens Madrigal almost as one...mainly because it was meant to be a trilogy. Each of those album styles are now widely used in modern day black metal..If that's not 100% influential on the genre, then I don't know what is.

Great episode. Love this series. The more content the better from Sam and Banger, we need this shit to keep going. Have to agree with many on here, not sure Venom is the BM jump-off, but Welcome To Hell and Black Metal freaked the fuck out of a 12 year old me in early 80's (in a really fucking awesome way!). Still, Bathory s/t and The Return seemed to me like the 1st albums where the "sound of black metal" cultivated over the next 30 years actually took form. Frost - love them, Venom - love them, Fate - loved them all, but a genre is defined by most importantly a "sound". Those bands influenced the sound, but BM as it came to be was just something different. Could of benefited from a definition of the word "early" i.e. years we should be looking at. A younger person than myself might say "screw Bathory, fucking Enthroned or Taake!" and they wouldn't be wrong, just coming from a different place time wise. Maybe Essential Early should've been set at '84 to '94 or something? "Early" is individually dictated by someone's introduction point. Love what you guys are up to, thanks.

BATHORY- Under The Sign Of The Black Mark is the 1st black metal album proper. nuff said.

Venom to Black Metal is how a tadpole is to a frog

RIP Martin Eric Ain

Emperor....Emperor....Emperor.....fills the air with sound and fury! Never to be topped!

Love Metal like everyone here. Every time i watch a video here though i seem to love it more. Great work Banger. Keep it up!

This is about Early Black Metal like it or not would be bands like Bathory,Venom,Hellhammer,Sarcofago,and Mercyful Fate. Also the first Sepultura, Sodom,Destruction,Slayer,Possessed albums were, regardless of thrash/death metal sounding thsa is where Black Metal started.Also no one will mention them but Onslaught's "Power from Hell' and Exorcist's "Nightmare Theater"I would consider "early Black Metal albums.The bands from the early 90's are not the early/first wave of Black Metal.Bands like Darkthrone,Mayhem,Immortal were obviously influenced by these early Black Metal albums/bands.

I don't understand how no one mentioned Samael's "Worship him"!

Mercyful Fate's "Don't break the Oath" is a quintessential early Black Metal album imo. The lyrical content is about as dark, satanic and occult as it gets and influenced soooo many Black Metal bands…

Mystifier has to be there, Brazilian Black Metal from 1989

If Venom had evolved after Black Metal into something that was a new style that sounded anything like what came later I could roll with it. I didn’t invent the term, but Venom sounds like a more sinister version of Motörhead. There's also the fact that Cronos has said on several occasions that black metal is what Venom does, and the Norwegian bands should change the name of their version. Bathory on the other hand (Cronos said they ripped off Venom, Quorthon denies it. Go listen to them back to back. Not very similar) were the band that basically started as Thrash with screeching vocals. It was the second and third album that started do something that wasn't like anything else. It was what we call black metal today. Venom brought the image to the party. Quorthon brought almost everything else, and built the house it lives in to this day. Cronos was left standing in an open field, dressed like a gay biker looking great and wondering where the fuck everybody was all of a sudden. I own 4 Venom records, and they are good for what they are. What they are not is black metal. Venom has modernized their somewhat, but the atmosphere of those first few albums is undeniably missing. I was around when Black Metal came out. It was just about the time the U.S. "Satanic Panic" was reaching peak insanity. The artwork combined vibe on "Welcome to Hell" and "Black Metal" were better at being scary than any horror movie of the time. Nobody including Venom has ever figured out a way to surpasses. I think Quorthon wrote songs that were equal, but not even he could improve on the vibe.

This episode is a fail because the topic about what is "early black metal" has not been defined, and the guest doesn't know anything about early black metal. We end up with nonsense board.

no ulver??? nattens madrigal IS the quintesential black metal album IMO

Great Black Metal albums; there is a lot of bands and records for a top ten, but in general you took a good choices. I just pick Eld from enslaved and Shadowthrone from Satyricon to add! fucking killer channel ImI