Beat Generation - Kerouac & Ginsberg - New York 1959

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authentic+holy

authentic+holy

5 жыл бұрын

This 5-minute film by Robert Frank was no doubt shot around the time Frank was working with Alfred Leslie on the Beat classic 'Pull My Daisy' featuring Jack Kerouac & Allen Ginsberg. In this short clip we see Lucien Carr & his wife Francesca & their three sons Simon, Caleb & Ethan as well as Mary Frank with her & Robert's children Pablo & Andrea. I put a live version of Dave Brubeck's 'Take Five' behind this Beat meet-&-greet at E 9th Street & 3rd Avenue because"Take Five' came out the same year, 1959, & it seems to go with the upbeat mood among all those kids & smiling Beats.

Пікірлер: 198
@alonenjersey
@alonenjersey 8 ай бұрын
"Take Five" by The Dave Brubeck Quartet always puts me in a good mood. Especially if the weather is lousy outside my humble home.
@user-ql7eb6ln1n
@user-ql7eb6ln1n 7 ай бұрын
Pipe smoking (Tobacco), music.
@jamesanthony5681
@jamesanthony5681 6 ай бұрын
Always a good choice.
@Rhonlynn
@Rhonlynn Жыл бұрын
This is perfect seeing Jack like this!
@Alexander-tj2dn
@Alexander-tj2dn 9 күн бұрын
I saw in Google maps a lot has changed a in all these years, since the building under construction on the other side of the street was demolished and built again in 2012. And the building where the restaurant was located is now a totally different building. It´s amazing to see these famous beatniks in their every day life. I just read about Ginsberg´s stay in Paris, in the so called "Beat hotel" in 1957 and 1958.
@robbydor
@robbydor 7 ай бұрын
‘Released as a promotional single in September 1959, the track would not achieve commercial success until it became a sleeper hit in 1961. "Take Five" went on to become the biggest-selling jazz single of all time and still receives significant radio airplay.’
@RicardoMartinez-oh9sq
@RicardoMartinez-oh9sq 7 ай бұрын
In American poetry there is nothing like the Beat Generation.
@davisworth5114
@davisworth5114 6 ай бұрын
Thank God for that.
@backroomsinvestigator909
@backroomsinvestigator909 4 ай бұрын
@@davisworth5114No thank's the beat
@Gil-io3zn
@Gil-io3zn 4 ай бұрын
Nice document. Jack Kerouac wears the same striped shirt and black trousers in an interview given to journalist Pierre Nadeau on 29 November 1959 for Radio Canada. Jack, the heavenly hobo. I love it!
@anthonyvincentfazio-writer
@anthonyvincentfazio-writer 7 ай бұрын
Lucien Carr is on the screen at 1:22 and his son, the author Caleb Carr is on Jack's lap in the same frame. It's not just Kerouac and Ginsberg. There is also Lawrence Ferlinghetti in the beginning as they walk into the bar.
@misterkefir
@misterkefir Ай бұрын
What a bizarre little film we have here.. Great piece of history.
@stevennorfolk830
@stevennorfolk830 Жыл бұрын
The very Harmony Bar and Grill of early sketches of Visions Of Cody;the Old beat shoe repair shop;the employment office,the Elevated waiting room,and across the street will be the factory whose walls Doctor Sax climbs.
@monicaperezyavicoli8961
@monicaperezyavicoli8961 11 ай бұрын
Que guapo era Jack Kerouac...
@vc2958
@vc2958 7 ай бұрын
no mames
@1kindsoul636
@1kindsoul636 3 жыл бұрын
This is gold
@luislaplume8261
@luislaplume8261 3 жыл бұрын
If only I was an adult instead of a child at that time, I was only 3.I loved in Woodside Queens just a15 minute ride on the LIRR.
@alonenjersey
@alonenjersey 7 ай бұрын
Pure gold without question.
@ezequielvega3120
@ezequielvega3120 2 жыл бұрын
Great musical choice: Dave Brubeck Quartet.
@JoshSmith222
@JoshSmith222 6 ай бұрын
Jack looks totally bombed and it seems like it's early afternoon at the latest.
@jakermausofficial
@jakermausofficial Ай бұрын
I mean, that tracks. RIP Ti Jean
@sitbone3
@sitbone3 7 күн бұрын
I think the woman in the white peasant blouse with long hair is Diane Di Prima. Her book of poetry, "Revolutionary Letters" is must reading.
@guadalupeiorio1216
@guadalupeiorio1216 10 ай бұрын
Enamored of Kerouac 🖤🤎🩶
@8176morgan
@8176morgan 7 ай бұрын
I'm pretty sure that is Lucien Carr seen at 4:25. Kerouac's friend from Columbia back in the mid 1940's who later moved to New York City in the early 50's and apparently stayed there for a while. Nice to see him here and looking quite a bity different from his college years.
@MikeGervasi
@MikeGervasi 7 ай бұрын
This is a ripping version of Take Five. Like any band they had good and great nights. THIS was an excellent night.
@MrWallybones
@MrWallybones Жыл бұрын
This is Fantastico!
@statichousemusic9855
@statichousemusic9855 4 жыл бұрын
They were gone; now that whole scene is gone.
@sprucecoastpress
@sprucecoastpress 7 ай бұрын
That was amazing
@bradforddavis6497
@bradforddavis6497 8 ай бұрын
Great clip!
@MrKmanthie
@MrKmanthie 4 жыл бұрын
pretty hip scene!!
@nassersari2797
@nassersari2797 4 жыл бұрын
j'adore cette scène
@jeremyharple4567
@jeremyharple4567 6 ай бұрын
Would be real cool if a lip reader transcribed what some of them were saying . What a treasure this little clip is , though- wow
@wonder6789
@wonder6789 2 жыл бұрын
Fantastic
@Misserbi
@Misserbi 8 ай бұрын
JK was a little shy. I almost said a little crazy. I think that is why? He still holds a little bit of virtue he does not want to lose. He is a great teacher. I almost never fall out when I tune in. I appreciate that. A great inspiration!
@jennifergalberth1240
@jennifergalberth1240 7 ай бұрын
James Baldwin warned US
@vc2958
@vc2958 7 ай бұрын
@@jennifergalberth1240can u elaborate more? What exactly about what did Mr. Baldwin (love him) have said that i have missed??
@if6was929
@if6was929 7 ай бұрын
@@jennifergalberth1240 Elaborate please.
@stephengholson6543
@stephengholson6543 8 ай бұрын
My favorite beat was Diane di Prima, one of the few women within the circle and a prolific writer/poet.
@jeffreyhanc1711
@jeffreyhanc1711 7 ай бұрын
Thanks for saying this. She’s actually an aunt of mine (sort of a distant complex relation from my mom’s Italian side, predominately Sicilian). According to my mom she had a horrible relationship with her conservative old-school Italian dad, this playing a big part in her social rebellion.
@vc2958
@vc2958 7 ай бұрын
@@jeffreyhanc1711thats cool as heckkkk. Without your aunts influence where the hell would us artists have been and would have we had that swing... Bless the Beats
@CatElse
@CatElse 7 ай бұрын
Only time will tell if you are an artist....bit too much ego here
@vc2958
@vc2958 7 ай бұрын
@@CatElse either ego or nothing. The stars or the moon?
@jakermausofficial
@jakermausofficial Ай бұрын
DiPrima, Joyce Johnson, Elise Cowan ... the women in the Beat orbit have always been minimized. Johnson's book, Minor Characters, is a wonderful book - I highly recommend it ❤
@andredahlmeyer4488
@andredahlmeyer4488 4 ай бұрын
thanx!🙂
@rma3_3_3
@rma3_3_3 Жыл бұрын
#OUTSTANDINGLY #Good !
@retthok
@retthok 3 жыл бұрын
Looks like George Maharis with the disposition of Oliver Reed.
@RobCummings
@RobCummings 6 ай бұрын
Initially, I thought, 'What's with all the kids and strollers? It looks like Saturday afternoon in Park Slope.' But in 1959 Kerouac was 37 and on the cusp of middle age. On The Road had been published a couple years before, and his friends were starting to see some literary success too. If this film had a soundtrack, we'd probably hear the youngish authors talking about publishers, book deals, new projects and maybe moving to Montclair.
@jakermausofficial
@jakermausofficial Ай бұрын
Crazy that we'd lose him 10 years later. RIP Ti Jean
@bobbymirabueno
@bobbymirabueno 7 ай бұрын
a few years later, it would be bob dylan storming the scenes...
@tombombadinho
@tombombadinho 2 жыл бұрын
03:09 Jack... passion guy.
@vc2958
@vc2958 7 ай бұрын
lol
@tombombadinho
@tombombadinho 7 ай бұрын
Ginsberg alert...
@brian22067
@brian22067 2 жыл бұрын
He's got 10 years to live.
@cobra5088
@cobra5088 2 жыл бұрын
That's what I thought when I saw the year this was taken. I was thinking if only jack knew he had 10 years. Imagine the poetry/prose that would of come out of that knowledge.
@danif.9414
@danif.9414 2 жыл бұрын
And your point is..?
@joejones9520
@joejones9520 Жыл бұрын
@@danif.9414 so this is what you do?
@MitchellMaichak-ze7mr
@MitchellMaichak-ze7mr 10 ай бұрын
But he DOESN'T KNOW IT !!!
@MarkAndrews71565
@MarkAndrews71565 Ай бұрын
​@@MitchellMaichak-ze7mr No one knows it. Tomorrow isn't guaranteed.
@lenhummel5614
@lenhummel5614 3 жыл бұрын
Existentialist Momentos ❗💎
@MitchellMaichak-ze7mr
@MitchellMaichak-ze7mr 10 ай бұрын
So Hip of you to observe !!!
@bradlock76
@bradlock76 Жыл бұрын
Wow..
@janetmichaels5040
@janetmichaels5040 8 ай бұрын
I noticed how the more you ignored your children, the more they clung to you, sweet.
@maryanneelliott97
@maryanneelliott97 7 ай бұрын
Sweet? Hope they all grew up to be stable human beings.
@umbrella0326
@umbrella0326 3 жыл бұрын
I like how Ginsberg is nearly the only one with a beard. If around then, I sooop would've been a Beat.
@stephengholson6543
@stephengholson6543 8 ай бұрын
It was so easy to be counterculture in those days. Just grow facial hair and people thought you were a bit peculiar.
@vc2958
@vc2958 7 ай бұрын
@@stephengholson6543no you ignorant swine. It takes more than looks. I didnt even have to explain it, but your cluelessness made me. Thanks.
@nuArk-eq9mq
@nuArk-eq9mq 6 ай бұрын
​@@stephengholson6543as opposed to nowadays
@MarkAndrews71565
@MarkAndrews71565 Ай бұрын
​@@nuArk-eq9mq Exactly. I'm clean shaven with no tattoos and people think I'm strange.
@michaelsamueldantonio
@michaelsamueldantonio 10 ай бұрын
This is what cool sounds and sees like.
@8angst8
@8angst8 9 ай бұрын
Au contraire: They "thought" they were cool. Looking at them today, they look like everyday schlubs, all of them.
@MarkAndrews71565
@MarkAndrews71565 Ай бұрын
​@@8angst8 And that's what makes them cool.
@napadave58
@napadave58 7 ай бұрын
0:37 Neal Cassaday also appears in this although he's not mentioned. (Looks like him, anyway)
@Goosebone
@Goosebone Жыл бұрын
What live version of take 5 is this?
@brianwarner308
@brianwarner308 7 ай бұрын
i've been trying to find that out myself, no luck yet, shazam just calls it live....
@darylcumming7119
@darylcumming7119 6 ай бұрын
Time capsule.
@padfootparrish4539
@padfootparrish4539 4 жыл бұрын
when everyone was dark academia
@LaTachyna
@LaTachyna 2 жыл бұрын
Que sentido tiene
@user-lq3qi3ge8f
@user-lq3qi3ge8f Жыл бұрын
It's so shallow to define the generation with an aesthetic that superficial social media influencers pursue
@harrychapin808
@harrychapin808 Жыл бұрын
Best place 2 B
@stevennorfolk830
@stevennorfolk830 Жыл бұрын
​@@user-lq3qi3ge8fwow we're you tied down while all that was poured into you from an upended text book?
@herecomesforego1787
@herecomesforego1787 8 ай бұрын
​@@user-lq3qi3ge8fbut predictable
@bluechapstick8037
@bluechapstick8037 3 жыл бұрын
Yeah well I was a beatnick b4 it was cool.
@plasteredbastard
@plasteredbastard 2 жыл бұрын
both men in their mid 30s looking very much in their early to mid 30s. fast forward a decade and Kerouac looked infinitely more aged some saying looking well into his 60s. He drank like we breath the natural air. Horrifying what alcohol can do. Ginsburg did much less of the drinking if he did any and lived nearly twice as long.
@danif.9414
@danif.9414 2 жыл бұрын
So?
@NewZman23
@NewZman23 Жыл бұрын
@@danif.9414 So, people observe; people think; people comment; people opine; people ask So?
@oldestgamer
@oldestgamer Жыл бұрын
Except you can already see that Jack is looking bum-like, the effects of alcoholism is already showing on him, slovenly, distracted, etc.
@theoakmontsage1172
@theoakmontsage1172 11 ай бұрын
​@@PoPpUnKdOtCoMHe was hanging in Paris/London/Tangiers around this time I think, working on Naked Lunch/Nova Express/Soft Machine.
@MarkAndrews71565
@MarkAndrews71565 Ай бұрын
​@@oldestgamer He was a dharma bum. I think that's how he'd like to be remembered.
@Tomas-to9kz
@Tomas-to9kz 7 ай бұрын
The irony of the "Beats" is their focus on individual expression, but gravitating to the collective-left. They couldn't, and still can't, see the forest from the trees...
@zarquondam
@zarquondam 3 ай бұрын
The major Beats were all over the political spectrum. You couldn't call Kerouac or Burroughs "collective left."
@Tomas-to9kz
@Tomas-to9kz 3 ай бұрын
@@zarquondam Good point
@Tomas-to9kz
@Tomas-to9kz 3 ай бұрын
@@zarquondam Good point . Like C. Wright Mills...
@dalejosephdesoiza4089
@dalejosephdesoiza4089 21 күн бұрын
Kids in adult conversations! not like nowadays shifted to one side with their iPads 😞
@eduardjozefgregor5103
@eduardjozefgregor5103 Жыл бұрын
4. min. - Paľo Habera !
@monicaperezyavicoli8961
@monicaperezyavicoli8961 11 ай бұрын
Época lo a de tabaquismo drogas y locura...comienzo de un nuevisimo capítulo en la historia
@Transcendent-Economics-101
@Transcendent-Economics-101 Жыл бұрын
I would guess all these young and good-lookin' folk are old now?! or in their 90s..
@jamespenido404
@jamespenido404 10 ай бұрын
One of the blond kids is Caleb Carr, Lucien's Carr son. He's a good writer and in his 70's now, I guess.
@borges9009
@borges9009 2 жыл бұрын
Benzedrim times
@kervilou5905
@kervilou5905 Жыл бұрын
!!!!!!!
@joejones9520
@joejones9520 7 ай бұрын
he had ten more yrs exactly...
@nathalieau4821
@nathalieau4821 2 жыл бұрын
Il me semble à un moment voir neal cassady?
@kervilou5905
@kervilou5905 Жыл бұрын
possib !......
@Frank289100
@Frank289100 Жыл бұрын
THERE HAS TO BE SOMEONE HERE LOOKING AT THIS VIDEO THAT LIVED THROUGH THE BEATNICK ERA. I KNOW MARIJUANA WAS THE DRUG OF CHOICE, AND WOULD LIKE TO KNOW JUST HOW POPULAR WAS THE USE OF COKE. DURING THIS ERA COKE WAS CALLED "THE RICH MAN'S HIGH".
@fortybelow1973
@fortybelow1973 8 ай бұрын
I think more of nasal tube inhalers and/or bennies. So the cats can wail like, forever...
@Olivia-lk9oq
@Olivia-lk9oq 7 ай бұрын
I wasn't alive then but you should read junkie by William Burroughs, he was close friends with Ginsburg. basically Burroughs was a heroin addict and the book is about his interactions with various drug dealers in the 40s. He talked about using amphetamines in times square at one point because coke was so hard to come by. I can't recommend it enough, It's one of the best books I've ever read
@Frank289100
@Frank289100 7 ай бұрын
@@Olivia-lk9oq COKE HIT THE SCENE IN A OFFICIAL STATUS IN NEW YORK CITY IN 1980 WHERE IT WAS AFFORDABLE. A 1/2 GRAMS WAS $20 AND A GRAM WAS $40-50. THE 8 BALL WAS $100-120.
@davisworth5114
@davisworth5114 6 ай бұрын
@@Olivia-lk9oq Burroughs was a murderer, I believe. You have terrible taste.
@clovergrass9439
@clovergrass9439 7 ай бұрын
AG, the tribe member who did boys.
@stealthsadhu306
@stealthsadhu306 7 ай бұрын
Yes he defended underage male teenagers getting sexually and romantically schooled by older gays, as in Ancient Greece and many other cultures. In that , by our standards at least, he was wrong. But don't reduce his genius to that, and the legacy of the work he left behind. Or the morality of his politics so far ahead of his time. Reply
@sitbone3
@sitbone3 7 күн бұрын
Di Prima did boys and girls.
@clownpaint20
@clownpaint20 Жыл бұрын
2:33 is that Lucian carr ?
Жыл бұрын
Yes, it is
@missmovember
@missmovember Жыл бұрын
always wondered what happened to him after the, well,,, 🩸🩸💀💀
@clownpaint20
@clownpaint20 Жыл бұрын
@@missmovember I think he went on to work for a university
@zardozy
@zardozy 10 ай бұрын
Lot's of little kids here. Did the beats have really big families, or are they the first beat groupies (or first embryonic hippies?) btw, I like the woman choking Ginsberg. I wish women could choke him a little more often...(make of that comment what ye will...)
@user-zx6qc6vx6k
@user-zx6qc6vx6k 4 ай бұрын
Even the baby is bored
@momouhtimomouh2218
@momouhtimomouh2218 4 ай бұрын
Il a un air à la Mel Gibson ce jack kerouac
@martinbenson5821
@martinbenson5821 3 жыл бұрын
Is that Cassidy too?
@nathalieau4821
@nathalieau4821 2 жыл бұрын
Yves i am think to in the begining
@user-ne3yw2cu6c
@user-ne3yw2cu6c 6 ай бұрын
NYU destroyed the East Village and around Washington Square Park with their Real Estate intrusion and their connections to developers, so much was destroyed and continues today.
@nightrider12soul
@nightrider12soul 7 ай бұрын
Think Neal Cassidy is in too.He did not write,but was the man of action.Jack look a bit like a boy next too Neal.
@balsamicvinegar5789
@balsamicvinegar5789 4 жыл бұрын
It's scary to see Ginsberg in close proximity to children.
@AmorionPax
@AmorionPax 4 жыл бұрын
Why?
@padfootparrish4539
@padfootparrish4539 4 жыл бұрын
@@AmorionPax he was a part of nambla
@DarrenCondron
@DarrenCondron 4 жыл бұрын
Why is that?
@padfootparrish4539
@padfootparrish4539 4 жыл бұрын
@@DarrenCondron he supported nambla!!
@vastwasteland77
@vastwasteland77 3 жыл бұрын
Trying to be funny and making a really stupid and nasty comment. He was NOT a pedophile.
@8angst8
@8angst8 9 ай бұрын
Wow! Very interesting clip. Thank you! That said: Carr and Ginsberg are creepy. The women hanging around are creepy. Brubeck is hardly the theme to "On the Road" or anything, though associated with Kerouac. They're all a lot better on paper.
@wraithstrongopark
@wraithstrongopark 8 ай бұрын
hahahahahaa i can dig it! they're creepy on paper too. you look at carr and wonder, how many women has he murdered? and we all know ginsberg just loved to rape the shit out of boys. . . yeah, they were fine on paper, because off of it they were a bunch of grungy, intellectual, eastern establishment, STD infested malcontents, who bitched about everything during one of america's most prosperous times while being white.
@CatElse
@CatElse 7 ай бұрын
Why is it creepy? Explain or are you jncapable of understanding another time?
@wraithstrongopark
@wraithstrongopark 7 ай бұрын
they're creepy on paper too. you look at carr and wonder, how many women has he murdered? and we all know ginsberg just loved to rape the shit out of boys. . . yeah, they were fine on paper, because off of it they were a bunch of grungy, intellectual, eastern establishment, STD infested malcontents, who bitched about everything during one of america's most prosperous times while being white. @@CatElse
@if6was929
@if6was929 7 ай бұрын
@@CatElse Don't be upset, he's partly correct. Ginsburg was a lech, indiscreet and compulsive, contemporarily he'd be classified as a pedo.
@davisworth5114
@davisworth5114 6 ай бұрын
@@CatElse Hey lady, creepy is creepy anytime, what does "another time" have to do with it?
@kervilou5905
@kervilou5905 Жыл бұрын
anciens beat devenus petits bourgeois, c'est pathétique !!!! poor jack, my friend !!!
@wwbuirkle
@wwbuirkle 7 ай бұрын
Kerouac looks like a complete drunk
@ichmich6803
@ichmich6803 10 ай бұрын
provocative: they just drugged in daytime and filmed?
@ichmich6803
@ichmich6803 10 ай бұрын
Before suckler ltd company time
@ichmich6803
@ichmich6803 10 ай бұрын
Suckler is primitive
@ichmich6803
@ichmich6803 10 ай бұрын
Are we allowed to Name this bussshit family: suckler!
@Bru.B
@Bru.B 2 жыл бұрын
En fait Kerouac était défoncé ou bourré H24...
@danif.9414
@danif.9414 2 жыл бұрын
So what
@Bru.B
@Bru.B 2 жыл бұрын
@@danif.9414 Et alors? Zorro est arrivéééé héhé! Sans se pressééé héhé !
@danif.9414
@danif.9414 2 жыл бұрын
@@Bru.B That's right! (hehe)
@figurefiguras4104
@figurefiguras4104 Жыл бұрын
Stfu w that cucked language
@kervilou5905
@kervilou5905 Жыл бұрын
exact ! très tôt alcoolique et plus.............;
@andresoutomaior-to5zt
@andresoutomaior-to5zt 7 ай бұрын
ACABOU JA ERA FICOU O JAZZ WEST COAST.
@goback3spaces
@goback3spaces 2 жыл бұрын
The long haired chick ... is that a guy in drag?
@seferdude1
@seferdude1 2 жыл бұрын
No…It’s Mary Frank, under appreciated artist and wife of Robert Frank, Swiss photographer and filmmaker.
@saltrock2002
@saltrock2002 2 жыл бұрын
kzfaq.info/get/bejne/aNByq5tjy6_OiXU.html
@delavan9141
@delavan9141 Жыл бұрын
Neanderthal.
@joejones9520
@joejones9520 7 ай бұрын
@@seferdude1 and she's still alive, she's 90, probably reading these comments, hello mary!
@sepijortikka
@sepijortikka Ай бұрын
I think she is beautiful
@Thirdgen83
@Thirdgen83 3 жыл бұрын
And they all died of cancer & heart disease...
@billburwood7047
@billburwood7047 3 жыл бұрын
You think you live as you choose...... Too bad you're headed for the blues
@miltoncat
@miltoncat 3 жыл бұрын
Kerouac died of an intestinal rupture brought on by decades of drinking. He pretty much drank himself to death.
@patricktruchon9153
@patricktruchon9153 3 жыл бұрын
@@miltoncat Truth! Died vomiting blood into his toilet. He was not happy, I think. Success didn't suit him. That OTR was a great success was due to the fact that the usual TIMES reviewer (who disliked Jack) was on vacation. He got a great review from the sub, who liked Jack. And so a great book was launched! Kismet played a large role.
@wraithstrongopark
@wraithstrongopark 3 жыл бұрын
but, somehow, they'll live on . . . unlike you, buzz killington. you're already dead inside.
@kervilou5905
@kervilou5905 Жыл бұрын
@@wraithstrongopark pfffffffffff
@503punxoioioi9
@503punxoioioi9 8 ай бұрын
It's just some middle-aged people hanging out outside of a bar.
@CatElse
@CatElse 7 ай бұрын
Famous Middle aged people ignoramus
@marianne22222
@marianne22222 Жыл бұрын
Cool but he was over hyped
@joejones9520
@joejones9520 Жыл бұрын
he was hyped just the right amount, they werent a real big deal in their time, only a certain segment of society knew who the beats were even after tv appearances. My parents who were teens in late 1950s never heard of the beats until I told them about them.
@martkell6469
@martkell6469 Ай бұрын
Jack was a square.
@edigabrieli7864
@edigabrieli7864 8 ай бұрын
When I was hoping that twisted generation had finally disappeared here the Woke generation showed up worst than the one before.
@davisworth5114
@davisworth5114 6 ай бұрын
To bad they wasted such a great tune on these grimy, depressing losers.
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