+mud love Suede post-Bulter were a damn good glam-pop band with loads of catchy singles. But with Butler they had an extra weight and the first two albums are rock classics that stand up against anything. So you have to wonder if Suede could have been a much bigger deal than just a top-tier indie band had Bernard remained with them.

Glowing Red Brain Night Toughts is very good than dog man star

Gallagher is a twat though, he's regularly slagged Suede off. He can only wish he could write lyrics of such depth.

Kind of agree but butler pisses all over Gallagher as a guitarist

I don't count them as a rock band , they don't deserve that title

@@ewanjamesbeats3511 so what are they? a pebble band?

@@serenitatis2191 no they're a sand band

Please 😭😭 that’s pretty accurate

He’s heard all of it before

He’s just trying to get some oxygen as Butler sucks it all out the room

Bernard was quite willing to just have a different producer in but that idea got shut down too. When you look back, they really should have sided with Bernard considering that at the time he was pretty much writing the music entirely by himself including mapping out the drum and bass parts before the rest of the band even heard the songs. They should have respected the fact that he felt his art was being compromised, especially when you consider that even in the imperfect form it was released in, it remains the apex of their career to this day. I think the biggest problem back then is that his frustration came out in a way that made him unlikable/unpleasant so they were unlikely to side with him. They've all said many times that they lacked the emotional maturity to have sorted it all out.

No they wouldn’t 😂. For a starter they were not unique enough from those bands you mention to ever stand shoulder to shoulder with them. Suede were the best they were ever going to be and him leaving actually in the end helped the band to have a second coming by going back to writing the pop tunes that he came to despise. Don’t get me wrong they were a great band and part of the soundtrack of my youth but like all UK indie bands from the 90s they suffered from never really emerging from the shadows of the bands they wanted to desperately emulate.

U wouldn't have 'ad either McAlmont & Butler or Richie Oakes-era Suede if he didn't leave so I think we got kt the way it was meant to be.

@@ChainNonSmoker We'd never have had Wings if the Beatles had split & we'd never have had Ronnie Wood era Stones if Mick Taylor hadn't left either. Honestly those McAlmont & Butler or Oakes-era Suede pale in comparison to Suede with Bernard

Ummm no because it doesn’t matter. They obviously were a ticking time bomb. Also coming up was an amazing album that they made without Bernard so there’s no need for that. Their recent music is great as well.

mcbillygoat ! Their last 2 albums have been pretty excellent too.

Yes. If they'd gone in Bernard's direction they could have been right up there with the most important bands ever. They clearly went in the banging singles direction and did try to make more 'Animal Nitrates'. Not a bad thing but it'd be cool to see that parallel timeline of more Butler Suede albums.

The first two are indeed the best.

I know. Bernard was sooo afraid of writing "pop" songs that people liked.. he decided to quit. And do.... nothing? Good job bro

@@hammondsphoto Silliness. Bernard is great but too much ego. Richard Oakes was phenomenal, and songs like Saturday Night are fantastic because of him. He flows so well.

+harry weaver so good he said it twice

+OLDMANDAVE60 3 times, sorry. Schmuck???

To be perfectly fair, there's not much he could have contributed to the conversation in terms of the musical direction. Back then Bernard pretty much delivered fully realised demos complete with bass and the drum parts mapped out on a drum machine before the rest of the band even had any involvement. Brett's part in writing the lyrics and vocal melodies etc was incredibly important but the actual tone of the music was not something he had any control over. This is a big reason why Bernard became so disillusioned at the time because he felt like he was doing a lot of the graft and the rest were out partying etc and eventually the cause for his spiral into resentment, not helped by a producer who saw himself as the 5th band member and interfered creatively in ways that even the band acknowledged were detrimental years later.

I know... Bernard never stops talking. lol

you haven't seen them lately then...they are back and better

Richard Oakes deserves is laurels. He is a phenomenal player. Butler leaving wasn't what killed this band, a name dispute in the US that trashed their chances to make anything big here, along with the emergence of grunge, did far more to stop them than Butler leaving.

​@Compton3clipsed The name dispute didn't register anywhere outside the not very important US market. Bernard leaving didn't stop them commercially but it did stop them realising their full creative potential. They would have went onto be legends if he stayed.

@@sunny70299 You are an idiot lol. “The not very important U.S. market”, the single most important market, you bell end. Richard Oakes is every bit as good as Bernard Butler anyways.

coming up was amazing... head music was their worst album.. same for a new morning although i think it's slightly better.. then they reached for the stars again. their last 4 albums are excellennt and on par with the first 3.

Agreed

one of the best suede songs ever

He calls Anderson a non musician

Mechameleon Rex do your research..Bernard is a very talented and prolific producer and very happy that way,he's a really go on guy that's why he left because he was feeling limited by the band and their will to stay in their genre. That's their loss and a big one to my opinion, dogmanstar was just a little shiny glimpse of what could have been..how fabulous...when they reunited the magic was gone the glitters where cold 😢

What? McAlmont & Butler were brilliant, and "Hendra" by Ben Watt (with Butler) is one of my favourite albums of the last decade. As much as I liked Suede, BB surely had wider musical interests.

what?

More likely he was listening to Bernard describe his mental state while making the record and thinking about how he offered him no support and let him become ostracised and feeling a bit ashamed about that.

Richard is a fantasic guitar player

It's a 2.38 minute clip from a longer interview, Brett had plenty to say. What Bernard says about his mental state when making the album is sad and disturbing that that doesn't even register with you says a lot about who you are.

It's a cliche to say that Coming Up is lacking in depth. Even the 'catchy' 'throwaway' tunes have plenty going on but there's also loads of classic power and drama in by the sea, chemistry between us, saturday night etc

Suede must have been gutted when he pulled that one out of the bag,would have been there biggest hit.

You are if nothing else self-aware.

🤣

Wrong, it sounds beautiful, unique and like a dream/nightmare. If it didnt sound like that it would sound like any other loud guitar record. I never understood the criticism of its production sound, the debut album suffered a lot more with a very thin boxy sound (but still a great record)

I actually like the reverb on DMS (I think it sounds good) and see really no big complaints about the production. Sounds very pleasant to me and the power of the superb songwriting, guitar work and great melodies shines through anyway no matter what. And that should always be the main point. Otherwise, why even bother. DGM is one of the best albums from the 90's. Not everything needs to sound as refined as a James Blake album (love his albums too). Much of what is wrong nowadays is this overemphasizing of production value over truly great songwriting. There are so many songs (looping 2 chords and with a melody of 3 notes) that are produced very well but are musically extremely boring. I guess my point is that for an album to be great or a classic, it doesn't have to be "perfectly" produced, but even the best poduction doesn't save an album if it's full of bad and boring songwriting. DGM is full of great and emotionally captivating timeless songs and to me it sounds just as good as it sounded the first time I heard it.