She was like a child who finally conceived of what death is.

Soooo true

That scene pops into my head EVERY time someone in my world passes away...."I was drinking fruit punch....and Joyce will never have fruit punch." Her chops with that scene were on the money. powerful.

My mum died when I was 11 and the episode where Joyce died was scarily accurate regarding the feelings I went through at the time. Brilliant episode.

I'm re watching Buffy, with my teenagers and lost my mom too, a few months ago, that episode is too much for me. Maybe I'll be able to watch it in a few years ❤️

Yep

What she described about Spike nailed it on the head and why I loved their development so much. He knew her in ways no one else did and always had her back, even when soulless. Spike with or without a soul was essentially the same. He knew her and he was her true equal partner.

@@steffnic13 Wrong, if Spike is exactly the same then that’s much worse. If soulless Spike is the same as soulful Spike than he that’s not much of an arc. Spike didn’t get a soul for Buffy, he got it so Buffy could love him because he was obsessed. If Spike has some good in him than his crimes make it that much worse (the murder and attempted rape) because he had some humanity, knew it was wrong and could have stoped himself but didn’t. Demons are evil by nature but humans with a soul who do evil are much worse. And if he didn’t have any humanity left than he didn’t get his soul FOR Buffy but FOR himself. Even when he got his soul they were wrong for each other. Instead of helping him on his redemption Buffy practically says she liked him better as a soulless demon and then the whole thing with Principle Wood. It was character assassination at its worst. They were never right for each other, soul or no soul. Angel was always her true equal because they never used each other.

@@steffnic13 exactly! Bangle shippers can NOT deny Spike whether they ship it or not

@@F5Metal this is YOUR opinion not fact. First of all , that person said Soike was ALMOST the same…not exactly the same. And Buffy’s comment about him being “better” as a demon was in terms of his fighting skills. Not him as a person. Buffy only used him because she came back from heaven and was depressed. Buffy has better timing with Angel because she wasn’t deceased at the time. Who knows what she would’ve done to Angel. You need to remember BOTH relationships were done at different times. Different times means different results. Has nothing to do if a pair works or not. Also Spike wasn’t the one cursed…Angel was so how can Buffy possibly be with Angel? She can’t. Spike getting his soul ONLY to get Buffybis your opinion too..not a fact. You’re arugunents keep using the word “if”, such as “if Souke has some humanity in him”..you can’t prove that unless you Spoke to Joss. You can blame the rape scene on Spike ALL you want but characters can’t control how they’re written. Originally the writers wantedBuffy to do it, but they didn’t want her in likable so they changed it to Spike. Buffy was undeniably part of Spikes reason to change but it wasn’t his only reason. That’s what YOU think. Yes the writers wrote him as a stalker which I totally disagreed with, but he has high points too like willing to give up his life to protect Dawns secret and Dawn is not Buffy. He also had a good relationship with Joyce throughout the series. The last episode of S7 is the perfect example because Spike dies for the WORLD..not just Buffy. So no she wasn’t the only reason he got a soul. Joss confirmed this and I can share proof. So them not being”right” for each other is your opinion..not fact. You treat Angel like he’s perfect or something. How come you complain about souless Spike but NOT souless Angel? Angelus is still apart of Angel. Buffy suffered way more with Angelus than she did soykessSpike. Angel was cursed with a soul but Spike fought for his. I don’t care if you’re only a Bangke shipper Spuffy Will always mean alot to many ppl and there’s nothing you can do. To me soylessSpike didn’t have humanity but he still wasn’t as bad as Angelus. Angel could only help Buffy as his soulful self..never as Angelus. He just wanted to kill her. As long as Angel is cursed Bangke fans can’t deny Buffy can’t keep sleeping with him. Plus Bangle is cliche Romeo /Juliet. Some ppl prefer slow burn love stories. I personally like both. So if you’re gonna talk about BOTH Spike vs souless Spike, it’s only fair you talk about both Angel/Angelus too. It’s not fair to only talk about Angels good dude when he has another side just like Spike and Buffy HERSELF experienced both versions of those characters from Spike and Angel.

Rainbow Kitty I agree, totally something Tara would do

+Boglárka I totally agree, I wish Amber would have come back to play The First's version of Tara. It just didn't feel personally enough, when this girl talked to Willow... it would have been so heartbreaking if it was Tara who talked to Willow and it would have made a lot more sense (like why should The First choose to turn into this unknown girl if it could turn into Tara). But yeah, I get why Amber decided against it (I assume she got a lot of letters from people who were really sad about her character's death and didn't want them to suffer more) and I have great respect for her because she chose the sake of her character and the sake of the people watching over money and publicity. Still, I wish she would have chosen different.

Chaoteee I was just going to say that! If The First came back as Tara it would have been so deep and dark and created a perfect set up for how evil The First was meant to be (im flashing back to Jenny Calendar Season 3). & going forward it then would have ended Willow's character ark perfectly if the real Tara had appeared during that final spell as a last goodbye

Thanks for this! Proves that BOTH Bangle Spuffy have different advantages so these dumb fan wars need to end

I think she was perfectly cast. But writers didn't know what to do with her other than tired sibling tropes

@Chanel Oberlin Anytime a child or younger character comes on suddenly lots of people tend to not like the character. And since she's younger she acts different than the other characters.

@Chanel Oberlin to be fair she was referred to as the "annoying kid sister"

I remember watching Sarah's Burger King commercial from 1983 when it was originally broadcast. I thought to myself "this kid is going places." It was funny hearing her throwing shade at McDonald's at that age. I believe she was 6 at the time. It's really funny that Buffy got a job at "Double Meat Palace" on the show.

Marcie Ross Can anyone imagine what if Marti Noxon worked with Zack Snyder on Man of Steel and Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice?

​@@keelychow4569They might have actually been good.

@Fauxindigo It sounds like not only did she not like the idea of Tara being evil (which does make sense with Restless)... Much more importantly to Benson, Buffy was a toxic working environment.

ye i was like is that a preson or ?

Sarah's eyes never blink maybe it's fake 😮😊

​​@@stephaniemalley5162Thinking she was in deactivated Buffybot mode at the time. That's how good she is. I thought it was amusing.

(yes ik this comment is from 5 years ago, sorry sksks) He's actually from texas i believe, i'm pretty sure he had a dialect coach to work on spike's british accent. and yeah, people are speculating they wanted Amber to come back as the first and i understand why she wouldn't want to tarnish Tara's character.

Deactivated Buffybot comes to mind.

Oh boy. This comment. Today. I mean, he was/is a brilliant storyteller. That means a HELLUVA lot, especially with massive disappointments like Game of Thrones. It's just... IRL Whedon was a terrible person. "Casually cruel". And that won't fly anymore.

@@dante6985 I know some not so great things about him now that make me want to delete this comment. Wow. 8 years ago. Haha

@@TheSquirrelgirl94 I'm glad you didn't delete it! You're not psychic. None of us were. None of us expected this. Like many a nerd I held Whedon in a similarly high regard. What's so disappointing is he so obviously knew much better. I think his behavior was "enabled" by studio execs and people who either were too enamored with his talent to take corrective action so he'd knock it off or just didn't care (work place has changed in the past two decades). Of course, by not taking corrective action they ultimately did him a disservice, what could have been minor disciplinary action (a stern talking to) has amounted to career blacklisting. ...Which is is another conversation. With some of the best quotes about human kindness delivered on television I'm still a little gobsmacked we're in this situation. ...Not to mention the rumors with him and Eliza Dushku.

@@dante6985 what'd he do to Eliza Dushku? 🥊🥊🥊

There was a rule on set to never leave Whedon and Michelle Trachtenberg in a room alone together.

Still is.

Me too I love it

+mattihp i'm 90% sure that he's drunk

At least she was honest about it lol.

Same way she threw shade towards McDonald's in that 1983 Burger King commercial.

hes gunna get you

Considering how Joss is, probably not a good idea.

Harriet the Spy for me!

I knew her from Eurotrip apparently

Love him

I thought it was gonna be a reward for beating the First

@@Kratos-GodOfWar Yup. That’s what I read, as well. She’s get one wish and bring Tara back, but I think was conflicted about making Angel human. (Poor Spike wasn’t considered I don’t think. 😕)

@@Kratos-GodOfWar that sounds more comic booky. Like angel was the one who dealt with higher powers and rewards. Buffy never really addressed anything like that in terms of a higher power, I mean other than Whistler, and I guess that Old lady that got her neck snapped by Caleb...but she wasn't going to be handing out any rewards after that 🤭

dAfoodie101 She was doing American pie

​@@jacklenetaylor6864"And this one time at band camp..."

I read somewhere that the idea was that the first would appear in Tara's image to torture Williow. Amber Benson didn't want the fans to remember Tara that way so she turned it down.

In the season 7 episode Conversations with Dead People it was supposed to be Tara who comes back and speaks to Willow, but it wasn’t really Tara it was the first. Instead they used the character of Cassie, who died a few episodes before that. I haven’t read the original script but I think we basically got the same story. Cassie tried to talk Willow into killing herself and that’s what Tara would have done.

She saved the world a lot.

Sokar Rostau nicely picked up. That’s what I thought of too ;-)

This makes absolutely no sense.

Deactivated Buffybot standing in for Sarah.

Buffybot must have been recharging.

Yes, I think I read somewhere that the first was going to appear in Tara's image.

Omg this made me laugh out loud

ChatBoxGuy I know right I was so confused😂

Sarah must have been in deactivated Buffybot mode.

I believe she was busy with other stuff at the time. Anthony Stewart Head wasn't interviewed, either.

Why is that there?! It's freaking me out man!!

lmao I was like "why is this chick not blinking"... "Why is she staring at Tara like this"... "What a bitch"... then I realized she isn't real. Think it's a wax figure ???

Is that the Buffybot?

Wax figure....duh

I still miss Buffybot.

Yep.

Yes it was a BAD idea. But I’m not blaming the characters..it’s the writers fault. But Angelus did some pretty terrible things to Buffy also; so I never understood why souless Spike got more spotlight than souless Angel. They both made Buffy suffer. Did you know the writers were gonna make Buffy do it? But they changed it to Spike as they didn’t want Buffy unlikable. Go figure. Dumb writers . There should’ve been no rape scene..regardless of who did it. But you know what? I don’t dwell anymore. The past is the past. I just try and forget about it.

The more we dwell on a scene from a million years ago..the more we’ll remember and that our own fault..not the TV show. It’s our choice what we want to focus on

@lessismore8533 Angel and Spike are completely different from their view which Liam before sired too darla into Angelus in 1753 was the black sheep of the family liam grew up didnt show caring and his dad treated him he was worthless and when he goes too at beverage and when met darla at the valley and when got sired became a souless vampire only worse than Liam was ever and unlike other evil bad vamps that isn’t aggressive only as Spike’s and unlike shows lack of supporting, doesn’t hesitate or going soft, and doesn’t get tired of slaughtering and hurting the ones and William Pratt the bloody poem 1880 who wanted was a chance to be liked by when trying to impress some lass but gets rejected leaves him with getting beneath like a waste of nothing and his mom illness feel vulnerable with fear, and met Drusilla to become Spike, he and Angelus not exactly got along then when Spike as wasn’t worthy too be bad enough before killing the Chinese slayer too be one of them when Angelus got cursed by gypsies in 1898 and becomes Angel vampire with soul going thru guilt only not remembered what angelus had done to the town and even the 2nd time when curse lifted the part of murdering Jenny which angel has is D.I.D, Spike on the other hand does not, but has something else in black and white, only less able to control his sadism and when he has feeling for Buffy only had toxic relationship and has not getting the message quite thru to him til he gets what’s causing his bad level ego going too far when he realise attempted rape was quite awful which the writers and joss is too blame

urban7rat she was doing American pie. i know this response is a little late

I heard it was Sarah

You think so? I love to think that Tara was so full of light that the First couldn’t even hope to embody her, as well as to trick Willow since they were so soulfully linked. And I just don’t think seeing Tara evil as the last time we see her would have been satisfying at all. It’s so not her, and her goodness was such a comforting presence for me that I think it would have been really difficult to stomach. That’s just me though!

Then why are you here?

+pabs619sd Right?

Ha! When I first started watching Buffy, I thought the same thing. I thought she was self-righteous, stubborn, a bit annoying, and sometimes disrespectful when she talked to Giles, a man twice her age. But I've grown to love most the characters. Don't care for Tara or Dawn though.

strangely I didn't like Buffy's character when I was young much. Like when I was 13 or whatever. Now twice that age, when I marathon the show I always find myself liking Buffy the most. she is the definite one I would like to be friend in RL compared to the other scoobies.

Buffy definitely isn't perfect, but over all I would say that she is kind, compassionate, wise beyond her years, smart, funny, selfless . . . and she is intensely moral. To a degree she is self righteous and that is a character flaw but nobody is perfect. don't think there is a ever a scene where she is snobbish. Regarding overuling her friends you are right-- to a point. But Buffy does take their input and consider it. But it is not a democracy. Ultimately someone has to make the final decision, and because she is the slayer, ultimately it is both her responsibility and her right to be the one to make the decision. Regarding her fighting skills, what do you mean they get weaker in later seasons? In season one Buffy could only effectively fight one vampire at a time-- she could barely manage two. If she had to fight three vampires by herself she was done for. In season five she single handedly takes out eleven vampires in less than a minute. How is that weaker?