Was Cleopatra Black? The Truth About Cleopatra's Ancestry

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Күн бұрын

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Chapters:
0:00 Introduction
5:24 Sponsor
7:11 Cleopatra's dodgy ancestry
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Пікірлер: 5 300

@Bonzi_Buddy Жыл бұрын

Question: Was Cleopatra Black? Answer: No.

@kaasmeester5903 Жыл бұрын

Some people will ask a followup question: *should* she be?

@Izaiyusa Жыл бұрын

I think "very unlikely" are the better answere here

@sheila19954 Жыл бұрын

@@Izaiyusa very unlikely...? so, in other words: No she was literally fully Greek idk how hard this is for you to comprehend

@Izaiyusa Жыл бұрын

@@sheila19954 ok ;-;

@nict5828 Жыл бұрын

@@kaasmeester5903 In a movie Yes, but not in a documentary.

@ScipioAfricanus_Chris 2 жыл бұрын

There was also an uproar regarding Rami Malek being cast as an Egyptian....and he's actually Egyptian.

@TheBc99 2 жыл бұрын

I believe the common argument is that modern Egyptians are Arabs rather than "OG" Egyptians, which was a misconception planted by the Victorians to dismiss modern Egyptian sovereignty over native artefacts. Even if modern Egyptians aren't descended from ancient Egyptians and are purely Arab (though the inverse is in fact true), the two peoples are still very closely related by virtue of being geographically extremely close and both being Semitic; certainly much more closely related than they are to Nikolai Caster-Waldau or whoever else was in Gods of Egypt.

@mr.dorianblackwell 2 жыл бұрын

@@TheBc99 But there's a problem when today's Egyptians (90% of them being Arabs) try to sell Ancient Egyptian history as their own. Because it isn't.

@phillip_iv_planetking6354 2 жыл бұрын

@@TheBc99 When Arabs or mud people pay for the movies they can put whoever they like. The West is not obligated to appease non Westerners.

@2DRonaldo 2 жыл бұрын

Thing is, people are losing their shiz over the fact that they're filming a Black Actress in that new Tolkien series. There is ALWAYS racially motivated reasons to film someone in these regards.. Why can't they just enjoy the film? It's not as if it's going to be historically accurate. lol Wonder if there people out there who actually believe 300 is a perfectly historically accurate account of King Leonidas and the battle of Thermopylae?

@octem2251 2 жыл бұрын

@@2DRonaldo I'm just curious about the concept of black dwarves. They live underground, it's not that they need their skin to protect them from the sun

@3Cheese42 Жыл бұрын

This is a very long video to say that, "No, she was 100% NOT black".

@andrabook8758 Жыл бұрын

it never sayd that. she says we cannot be sure.

@Lukas-Trnka Жыл бұрын

@@andrabook8758 Actually no, that is not the conclusion of that video. It was said here that within the uncertainty as there is, we can still say, that Cleopatra VII was not african black. Apart from her royal macedonian and persian ancestry, there is a chance that there was also some non-royal-greek ancestry. Most likely it was still some other greek, or maybe some northen african or persian ancestry. Chance that it was a black african ancestry is the least probable. And even if so, then she would still not be a full black african.

@sporkfaceman Жыл бұрын

She was 0% black

@maniacal1870 Жыл бұрын

Paintings and busts made of her literally depict her as pale skinned with reddish hair.

@filthyrottenmedia Жыл бұрын

Could you do me the courtesy of stating what exactly constitutes as “black” please? 😊

@user-ro2nn7lt3r Жыл бұрын

As an egyptologist I am absolutely amazed and somewhat terrified that you managed to express adequately the Ptolemaic family tree on a two-dimensional plane without summoning an Eldritch Abomination or something similar...

@DelphineDenton Жыл бұрын

If modern genealogical software can handle the population that lives on almost any tiny island in the middle of the sea, ancient royalty is probably not gonna be impossible. My family tree on one side is probably a Gordian knot.

@Senkino5o Жыл бұрын

It was truly terrifying, kind of mysterious how Cleopatra (VII) could come out beautiful after all that incest.

@justinwatson1510 Жыл бұрын

She didn't even have to use those wedges organic chemists use for the bonds that go in front of and behind the plane.

@-Reagan Жыл бұрын

@@Senkino5o Her intelligence is even more of a marvel after all that...

@Spectre2434 Жыл бұрын

Yassssss 😮

@sortingoutmyclothes8131 2 жыл бұрын

So what I get from this is that Cleopatra should be played by someone of incestual descent.

@TheCuriousConservative 2 жыл бұрын

YOU WIN! lol best comment I've read thus far 😂😂😂

@Visplight 2 жыл бұрын

Yes! At least 3 generations of a braided family tree or GTFO!

@michaelautrey6641 2 жыл бұрын

i think if you go back far enough you'll find we are of that descent.

@jonathanbowers8964 2 жыл бұрын

So she should be played by a Hapsburg.

@joshua9473 2 жыл бұрын

So someone from Alabama?

@ryantannar5301 2 жыл бұрын

I will never understand why it is so hard for people to understand that Cleopatra was a Greek ruler who inherited power from her Greek predecessors that date back to Alexander's conquest of Egypt.

@nidohime6233 2 жыл бұрын

Because most people don't study History of Ancient Egypt, most of what they know is by movies.

@Violaa707 Жыл бұрын

@@nidohime6233 this is so sad they'll never know the struggle of studying 40 pages of Egyptian history in two weeks

@wrestlinganime4life288 Жыл бұрын

@@nidohime6233 Sad thing is that people don't even know that everything after Ramses isn't Ancient Egypt either

@detroitpolak9904 Жыл бұрын

Thank you! She wasn’t black like people think. Look at Greek people and you’d probably be looking at her.

@mandragor9440 Жыл бұрын

Greek ruler, well, the Lagides dynasty still adaptated quite a bit to the egyptian culture while bringing their share of traditions and stuff to the table. Sure, they are being referred to as "the macedonian" and stuff. But saying that she was greek is denying the egyptian influence on her family and upbringing, would you tell someone of irish descent that they are Irish and not american ?

@Sound557 Жыл бұрын

She didn't have a family tree so much as she had a family bush

@kurtsnyder4752 Жыл бұрын

Seems a lot of these guys COULD have actually been their own grampaw. Like from the song describing a feller's family background.

@AJHart-eg1ys Жыл бұрын

A family telephone pole.

@joelhungerford8388 Жыл бұрын

Family branch

@Mahbu Жыл бұрын

I just wanna say I appreciate how not-aggressive this is. I'm not worried about "agendas" or whatever people gripe about. I just like how casual and inquisitive this is.

@Bethelaine1 2 жыл бұрын

I’ll never understand how anyone can call history boring. It’s the longest running soap opera going.

@astrida111 Жыл бұрын

History about war and crimes must be the most boring shit out there. History about culture and powerful women is a 100 times better

@nemumami Жыл бұрын

@@astrida111 I don’t know about you, but reading about one guy dying and snowballing effect the whole of europe to war is interesting. Oh, and the fact the European war was basically a whole family feud lol.

@jk-gn2fu Жыл бұрын

@@astrida111 History of powerful women is good but it only explains a small part of the entire history. History does not stop when there is no powerful woman in prescence. Culture is an interesting thing, but wars and crimes also shapes a part of culture too. If you think only gentle and nice things are culture, you might want to reconsider your view.

@margowakefield3295 Жыл бұрын

Bethelaine1, what a terrific way to look at History. 🙂👍

@leobuana7430 Жыл бұрын

@@nemumami Literaly break down to "salty about granma favorite grand child"

@RedWinter21 Жыл бұрын

To call all Africans as black or dark skinned is the same as saying all Asians look Sino-Mongolian. It's a fricking big continent populated with various and diverse people groups.

@quack420 Жыл бұрын

the answer is still no.

@sphinx2476 Жыл бұрын

@@quack420 who cares of your answer..Who is CLEOPATRA'S mum?😂😅

@quack420 Жыл бұрын

@@sphinx2476 ? her dad's sister... does that make her black some how? that sounds pretty racist mate.

@blank1393 Жыл бұрын

@@sphinx2476 Bro cleopatras family tree was a line, thinks habsburgs times 10

@inggasmith Жыл бұрын

You do know when black people says "Black people" were speaking about ethnicity not the actual color

@pamelacunningham7196 Жыл бұрын

For those who don't know that Cleopatra was of Greek nationality not Egyptian . Cleopatra was a descend of the Ptolemy Pharos who ruled Egypt after Alexander the great conquered Egypt . Cleopatra was not of African or Egyptian descent .

@shill1444 Жыл бұрын

Yes. This is exactly right. And believe it or not a LOT of Black people actually know this and agree with this.

@christianrowbotham7386 Жыл бұрын

Well, she was born in Egypt, so she is Egyptian by nationallity, but she is from Greek descendent

@alonsoACR Жыл бұрын

@@christianrowbotham7386 Nationality? That's not a thing in the ancient world. And in most of the modern world what defines nationality/citizenship is mostly blood (jus sanguinis, look it up), not birthplace (like Japan, Germany, Switzerland, Austria, Colombia, China, etc.)

@farkasabel Жыл бұрын

@@christianrowbotham7386 the term of nation didn't exist until the 18th century.

@christianrowbotham7386 Жыл бұрын

@@alonsoACR my point is that she was born in Egypt even if she is not pure Egyptian

@vamsikasina4555 Жыл бұрын

When I watched the trailer of queen Cleopatra i realised that the documentary is trying to sell us the point that Cleopatra is black rather than focusing on her accomplishments

@UGTLDG Жыл бұрын

Sadly I'm half expecting a cheap production, resorting to controversy in order to attract attention at the defendable flaws. For example, I've seen far better pillars than the ones presented... It won't be the first time.

@chrisbutler1176 Жыл бұрын

What accomplishments? She did not lead armies in battle or conquer other nations or anything of note. Other than to seduce Julius's who forced the Egyptians to accept her as a ruler/ queen and when he died she seduced Mark Anthony to try and hold on to power. When that failed she killed her self.

@bruh-po6fz Жыл бұрын

@@UGTLDG can't believe you were half expecting it 😂

@nidohime6233 2 жыл бұрын

Cersei: Targaryens wed brothers and sister for 300 years to keep their bloodline pure. Cleopatra: Hold my brother.

@jawo8754 Жыл бұрын

Was wondering when someone would make the reference. Lol.

@kanthony776 Жыл бұрын

That made me laugh so hard. Thank you.

@judeconnor-macintyre9874 Жыл бұрын

Actually Daenerys is more inbred then Cleopatra. Daenerys's inbreeding coefficient is 0.375, Cleopatra VII's is 0.359.

@SingingSealRiana Жыл бұрын

yeah, grrm is not just a creep for being a creeps sake, reality is worse

@SingingSealRiana Жыл бұрын

@@jawo8754 the reason for it was even the same, the pharao was from the line of the god horus and keeping the blood pure meant being ruled by a good

@MCKevin289 2 жыл бұрын

I think it is okay to cast someone of Mediterranean ancestry for Cleopatra, it’s historically accurate. Anyone of Levantine, Greek, Balkan, Turkish, Italian, Spanish, and North African descent could play her.

@jaojao1768 2 жыл бұрын

True, people today like to divide into "whites" and "non-whites" but Greeks and Turks are quite similar in skin colour, as are South Italians and Tunisians

@incogb6696 2 жыл бұрын

no. i want to see a greek woman we r bored of gal gadot..

@charlotteillustration5778 2 жыл бұрын

Gal Gadot is Israeli, isn’t she? So geographically very close to Egypt.

@MCKevin289 2 жыл бұрын

@@charlotteillustration5778 I mean theoretically yeah, but I think some Egyptians may not like that because she’s Israeli and they occupied the Sinai peninsula until the 80’s.

@incogb6696 2 жыл бұрын

@@charlotteillustration5778 as a north african (non egyptian) i would like to see a beautiful interesting modern greek woman play Cleopatra :O

@Stargeek2006 Жыл бұрын

Ancient greek rulers were like "I am my own grandpa thrice removed."

@Professor_Fate 2 жыл бұрын

The problem lies with people trying to impose modern-day racial/ethnic categories onto the past.

@CinziaDuBois 2 жыл бұрын

I actually think the real problem is people pretending like race wasn't an issue in the ancient world and present it as some harmonious utopia, thus completely ignoring the centuries of massacres and genocides that created empires such as that of the Romans, and completely ignoring that race played a huge role in that. Racism and ethnicity weren't the terms they used, but the reason there was intense incest and mass genocide and conquering was very much based on an ideology akin to that of contemporary racism and xenophobia today. Pretending racism wasn't a thing back then has lead to a glorification and celebration of the Roman empire, etc, and completely sterilised the brutality of its nature.

@mykalkelley8315 2 жыл бұрын

@Lady of the Library I'm glad you reject the (for lack of a better term) "noble savage" trope. Mark of someone truly professional.

@droe2570 2 жыл бұрын

@@CinziaDuBois It really was not "Racism" as we use the term today. This goes to the OP, who rightly points out that group preference is not modern day "racism". It was a division of the "other" such as the Greeks referring to non-Greeks as "barbaros." I don't think xenophobia is a correct term, either, since it is literally an "irrational fear of strangers". The Greeks saw non-Greeks as primitive and generally inferior/uncivilized, but they were not really afraid of them, in the sense of a phobia. I think ethnocentrism is the better term for this phenomenon. The idea that our ethnicity (culture/civilization) is superior and we must impose our superiority onto everyone else.

@brandondavis7777 2 жыл бұрын

@@CinziaDuBois No, the reason there was incest was egotistical people wanting their "bloodline" to be perfect, and to secure land(resources). The reason there was genocide, which even in Rome, there was very little, was it was an effective way to reduce populations that might rebel, and conquest is simple for resources. You decide to ignore facts to spread nonsensical racial ideals.

@redfullmoon Жыл бұрын

@@CinziaDuBois eugenics studies weren't even a thing until the 16th or 17th century, so even the concept of racism and racialism being applied as far back as the Roman empire doesn't make sense. Tribalism and ethnocentrism would most like be the cause of divisions, i.e. cultural, linguistic. They fought for resources and political control and cultural dominance. Racism and racialism as based on genetics is a pretty modern concept.

@sanguinelynx 2 жыл бұрын

"He married both his sisters, very loyally, as he should" I love your delivery and had a good laugh at that!

@hydrolito 2 жыл бұрын

He had three sisters and allowed sister to have one of three sisters head cut off what kind of loyalty is that?

@maxttk97 2 жыл бұрын

@@hydrolito It's obvious loyalty in a sense of keeping it in the family. Not the loyalty of your current understanding.

@annaclarafenyo8185 2 жыл бұрын

This woman is doing fascist propaganda. Cleopatra was about 1/3 Greek 1/3 other Middle Eastern, and 1/3 African Egyptian. She should be played by either a modern Egyptian or a modern Middle-Easterner, not by a person with Northern European ancestry.

@goldilox369 2 жыл бұрын

@@annaclarafenyo8185 🙄 she's literally going through the bloodlines with a chart. And your math doesn't add up at all

@annaclarafenyo8185 2 жыл бұрын

@@goldilox369 She's going through 1/10th of the bloodlines, the ones she can track, and disgusing it by making it complicated. About 1/3 of Cleopatra's ancestry is Greek, 1/3 is Egyptian, and 1/3 is other Middle-Eastern. She only focused on the Greek ancestors, because they are easy to track, and fit her preconceived incorrect conclusion. As another commentator mentioned, Cleopatra's sister's skeleton is available for study, and shows large amounts of Black African Egyptian ancestry.

@Abremoch Жыл бұрын

Very nice video! You probably did not know that a year ago, but your video is now pretty relevant considering the whole Netflix Cleopatra controversy going on right now!

@rebekkhagill5766 Жыл бұрын

Reading through a lot of these comments...I'm just like wow. You can tell who didn't actually pay attention to the video. Thanks for condensing a lot of complicated information down into something digestible. I actually feel like I understand Cleopatra's lineage and the cultural significance of legitimacy of the time a bit better.

@persiswynter6357 2 жыл бұрын

The Elizabeth Taylor Cleopatra movie even alluded to her origins. One of her lines was "as a mostly Greek thing myself". There's the allusion to that missing ancestors. As for the "too many Ptolemies", France had 18 kings named Louis.

@barbarossarotbart Жыл бұрын

France only had 17 kings named Louis, because Louis XVII never was King of France.

@craigjomaia Жыл бұрын

1960's Hollywood movie scripts aren't exactly citable as history facts.

@barbarossarotbart Жыл бұрын

@@craigjomaia True, but if those quotes from the script are backed with historical sources and archeological findings then they are not wrong.

@Vee_of_the_Weald Жыл бұрын

@@barbarossarotbart I was certain there had been 19 Louis… and shamefully lost at a pub quizz because of the “how many KINGS were named Louis”… 😅 Yet, are we completely sure that Clovis wasn’t a misread Louis or that all the Louis should have been called Clovis? After all, one can clearly see how William can become Guillaum (and later Guillaume) in old French “font”, so why not the Clovis/Louis?

@NapoleonCalland Жыл бұрын

@@Vee_of_the_Weald The Legitimist claimant to the throne, the Duke of Anjou, is Louis XX for his followers (they don't recognise the French Revolution).

@Timurlane100 2 жыл бұрын

So, ultimately, with respect to the Gal Gadot controversy, she's as good a pick for Cleopatra as anyone.

@TheGrinningViking 2 жыл бұрын

She looks more "Egyptian" than Greek, so yeah probably.

@starcapture3040 2 жыл бұрын

yeah you support the occupation and ethnic cleansing in palestine too i'm sure of that?

@agravery223 2 жыл бұрын

I'll say NO in her casting because she can't act. She is attractive but is terribly stiff and one note. I would appreciate an actress that was middle Eastern and talented... ijs Hollywood likes to cast solely on looks and forget that viewers might actually like a story that was well acted too. There are plenty of attractive females who CAN act out there who deserve a chance.

@mediamenace1879 2 жыл бұрын

Hardly controversy, it's a bunch of racists convinced caucasian history is black history and doing out of the box thinking and creative wording to make it work, such as the term African for North African with the assumption it wasn't inhabited by caucasians but the highly inaccurate "people of colour".

@jonathanbowers8964 2 жыл бұрын

The bigger issue might be the fact that Gal Gadot is Israeli. Due to Egypt's current political issues with Israel, this would be controversial for contemporary Egyptians. It would be the equivalent of casting a Pakistani actor as Gandhi or casting a Japanese actor as an ancient Chinese emperor. While Gal Gadot probably resembles Cleopatra as well as almost any current actress would, it still would be controversial given the present politics.

@amandarichards-satour9184 Жыл бұрын

I’m here learning about this because of the controversy around the Netflix docu-series. You explain the facts and historical context so well, thank you!

@cisco20211 Жыл бұрын

You needed a video to tell you something History class should have taught you at age 10?

@dakotadenton8523 Жыл бұрын

On the cultural side she was the first ruler of her dynasty to learn the local language. For about 250 years the leaders of Egypt spoke Greek and could not directly communicate with their subjects.

@baddiewinxpersianluv Жыл бұрын

@@cisco20211 Considering the original commentator would’ve had education in the Western world (so Europe/ American continents), the amount of documentation in book for students about Ancient Egypt or others such as Ancient Persia is very little, the history books for students in school in Western countries centrically revolve around History in the eyes of Western Countries, mostly North Western European countries. So it’s actually very great that OP watches this video to get her sources about these empires and their ethnicity/heritage, cause education failed to do so

@justinw1765 Жыл бұрын

I think the deeper point is, even if she wasn't pure Greek, and had some Syrian, Persian, or what not blood in her, well these all still fall under the larger "Caucasian" umbrella.

@Gypsygeekfreak17 Жыл бұрын

She was Greek

@emmarichardson965 Жыл бұрын

I think the real question is: How on earth did one of the most intelligent and well-educated people of her time result from a family tree that made the Hapsburgs look diverse?

@hgoodin1013 Жыл бұрын

You beat me to it! I thought exactly the same thing.

@MaryPoppins.333 Жыл бұрын

Because her family was very well educated?

@jackalhead7433 Жыл бұрын

Not all results of incestuous union are problematic An offspring of incestuous birth can come up normal but the risks of genetic abnormalities are extremely high

@greatestaxolotl4933 6 ай бұрын

Well if her granny on her dads side was a concubine, thats like 25 percent of fresh dna. Maybe thats why she was described as so beautiful, bc everyone was surprised in comparison to the rest of the lot 😂

@markbrooks8623 2 жыл бұрын

The Egyptians remain with us. They are called the Copts now. However, Cleopatra's ancestry appears to have been at least mostly Greek. It is important to bear in mind that the Mediterranean world once looked quite different, in terms of peoples and even climate. To imagine that Egypt was once the breadbasket of the Mediterranean may seem impossible now, but it was once true.

@michaelautrey6641 2 жыл бұрын

the ptolemys literally kept it in the family.

@curiaregis9479 2 жыл бұрын

When people say things like: "The Greeks/Egyptians/Misc remain with us" it's usually intended to distort the issue. I see this all the time in documentaries, an assurance that the people living in a certain area today are the descendants of those from some past great civilization. The "proof" is that their genetics continue to reflect their ancestry. This is true but deceptive. It is intentionally deceptive. Sharing genes with ancestors of a great civilization is NOT the same as being of a similar genetic profile as those who built that civilization. It is an undeniable fact that modern peoples, particularly from the Mediterranean, have a mixed heritage that greatly distinguishes them from the ancestors they CHOOSE to identify with.

@incogb6696 2 жыл бұрын

@@curiaregis9479 wow people r more delusional than i thought. did u just say..."The "proof" is that they their genetics continue to reflect their ancestry. This is true but deceptive. It is intentionally deceptive." have a nic 1

@yorkiepit 2 жыл бұрын

Amazing what a 1 degree change in the axial tilt of the earth can do, Egypt is a perfect example.

@curiaregis9479 2 жыл бұрын

@@incogb6696 I suppose that's too complex for you? Let me put it in a simpler, more concrete way. Pretending a person with 15% or 20% or 30% African ancestry is the same as some group who lived in the area previous and built a civilization there is deceptive. The ancestors of the modern people are choosing to identify with a certain part of their heritage, but this part did not have this admixture, they did not have the same genetic profile. But as the mixed people in question still SHARE some genetic ancestry with those ancestors it is often suggested they are genetically the same, just many generations later. This is a lie. The documentarians who say this know it will be misunderstood and that's why they do it. It's the sort of pandering and lying that is common with the global elite agenda.

@joycekellner9957 Жыл бұрын

Such good analysis.

@catscattying943 Жыл бұрын

“It was a bit like calling someone ‘ugly’.” 😂

@matthewwoods7674 2 жыл бұрын

Game of thrones has nothing on the dramatics of the Cleopatras. Very informative 🙂.

@janwojtyna3392 2 жыл бұрын

Look at history of Poland following the testament of Bolesław Krzywousty... There are times in history compared to which war of the roses is simple story...

@zoerphl 2 жыл бұрын

i would LOVE a series on the cleopatra line

@sleekoduck 2 жыл бұрын

Daenerys Targaryen was based on Cleopatra VII.

@nobbynoris 2 жыл бұрын

Au contraire. The Ptolemys/ Cleopatras would have fit like a glove into the Frey family's wider echelons.

@the98themperoroftheholybri33 2 жыл бұрын

Or a royal family tree. Ancient royal Egyptian families were incredibly inbred

@KevDaly 2 жыл бұрын

Gal Gadot as someone who looks 'generic mediterranean' is probably a reasonable pick to play Cleopatra. One valid objection would be that she's too good looking, but that's not fatal.

@Gentilejedi 2 жыл бұрын

Gal Gadot is Israeli in nationality, but her ancestry is Eastern European. She does not look Generic Mediterranean, or Greek. Can she play Cleo, sure.

@chrystals.4376 2 жыл бұрын

She can’t act though, and it’s not like there’s a lack of Greek much less Southern Italian actresses out there.

@ravensthatflywiththenightm7319 2 жыл бұрын

"too good looking"? The woman who seduced Caesar and Mark Antony is "too good looking"?

@Copperkaiju 2 жыл бұрын

I feel like she's too tall. I don't know why but I've always thought of Cleopatra as being short, lol.

@warrenpuckett4203 2 жыл бұрын

In today's with woke ideology you can not be taken seriously unless you are not melanin challenged. Clearly to be correct, facts don't matter.

@MrPGC137 Жыл бұрын

Well, given the fact that Cleopatra was the end-result of several generations of Macedonian inbreeding, the last in the line of the Ptolomeic Dynasty, it's difficult to comprehend how she could possibly have been "black" (or to put it more accurately, contained any ancestry of sub-Saharan African origin...)

@recurrenTopology Жыл бұрын

As the video points out there is the off chance that her paternal grandmother was of non-Greek decent, in which case a Nubian concubine wouldn't be outside the realm of possibility. Quite unlikely though.

@MrPGC137 Жыл бұрын

@@recurrenTopology To reiterate: It is a fact that Cleopatra was the end-result of several generations of Macedonian inbreeding (repeat, INBREEDING!) and the last in the line of the Ptolomeic Dynasty. This is established historical fact, and not a mere 'off-chance' possibility. I realise that some people don't like to allow mere facts to get in the way of a good story, but there it is.

@recurrenTopology Жыл бұрын

@@MrPGC137 Did you watch the video? It isn't known who her paternal grandmother was, just that she likely wasn't the wife (and sister) of her paternal grandfather. Since the ethnicity of that women, likely a concubine, is unknown, it is impossible to definitively state the entirety of Cleopatra's ethnic makeup. It's seems most likely that her grandmother was also of Greek descent, but their exists the possibility she had a different ethnicity.

@ne0nmancer Жыл бұрын

@@recurrenTopology There are artistic depictions of Cleopatra (i'm thinking of a bust sculpture and a portrait from the 1st century BC if you want to look it up) that depict her as a fair skinned woman with a greek style hairdo, with a diadem and all. Even the coins with her image depict her as a mediterranean/levantine woman.

@thefrenchmode Жыл бұрын

How am I just discovering your channel ? I'm obsessed !

@lotfibouhedjeur 2 жыл бұрын

Cleopatra isn't Egyptian, she ruled Egypt. Charles V wasn't Spanish, he ruled Spain. Catherine the Great wasn't Russian, she ruled Russia... Cleopatra is of Greek descent and her association with Egypt in the Egyptian psyche is a very recent thing. As the icon of Egypt that she now is, she's the brain child of poet Ahmed Shawki who published The Death of Cleopatra in 1927. If you asked any Egyptian about her before then they probably would have gone: Cleowho?

@Adsin16 Жыл бұрын

How is she not Egyptian? Ptolomaic dynasty ruled Egypt for 250 years. that is longer than USA exists. She was like 12th generation born and raised in Egypt. If you think 12 generations aren't enough to consider someone a local then your and mine definitions are very different. She was absolutely an Egyptian, of distant greek ancestry.

@lotfibouhedjeur Жыл бұрын

@@Adsin16 You mistake royals for commoners. Court life is so removed from the daily life of the people. So much so that not a single one of Cleopatra's predecessors spoke Egyptian. And while she did herself, her education was entirely Greek. Her name was Greek. Her blood was Greek since her predecessors, in their disdain for the locals, didn't mary any Egyptians. Can you then show me the Egyptian part? And for the sake of fidelity, the video is about her skin color, ethnicity. Under that light, she's entirely Greek.

@sangmaudit4982 Жыл бұрын

@@lotfibouhedjeur Oh, it's true, they married between relatives. Something that has always been done during the different times of pharaohs throughout the centuries to preserve the purity of the blood. At least in all of the most famous Egyptian dynasties, Tutankhamun didn't look this handsome for nothing. Cleopatra is supusse to be basically a product of incest, like the vast majority of her family. So it's normal that his ethnicity is more Greek, when your parents are brothers or cusins (allegedly) you don't have many options. So yes, her ethnicity was Greek. But she was born in Egypt, in Alexandria. City founded by Alexander the Great (from Macedonia, but his ethnicity is also Greek) who conquered Egypt and proclaimed himself pharaoh; when Alexander died, Ptolemy I, also of Macedonia and the ancestor of Cleopatra, was proclaimed Pharaoh of Egypt. Alas, a new dinasty of pharaohs was born. What happened to the Ptolemaic dynasty is that they adopted the Egyptian culture and customs. That is why Cleopatra is Egyptian, regardless of her ethnicity, her culture was a mixture of Egyptian and Greek. And Greek because the whole part of Upper Egypt was basically territory colonized by the Greeks, know as the Hellenistic period of Egypt.

@nutyyyy Жыл бұрын

@@Adsin16 She was Egyptian in the same sense that the Plantagenet Kings of England were English - i.e they were born there but they weren't really culturally English and were a French family. Its not uncommon for such things to happen. Its not unreasonable to call Cleopatra Egyptian but she was still of Greek and some Persian ancestry and culturally Greek/Macedonian.

@user-zv2vm8bd8h Жыл бұрын

@@Adsin16 She was the first of her dynasty to speak Egyptian. Let that sink in. The Ptolemaic dynasty ruled Egypt as foreigners.

@ericspencer8093 2 жыл бұрын

If you ever find yourself embroiled in this debate, there are two surefire signs that somebody doesn't know much or anything about the subject: 1) They don't know there was a lot more than one Cleopatra. 2) They don't know that the Ptolemies came from Greece, not Egypt.

@Korilian13 2 жыл бұрын

Don't let the Republic of North Macedonia hear you say that... also, don't let the Greek hear I said that.

@allangibson2408 2 жыл бұрын

Think Serbian rather than Greek…

@ballenboy 2 жыл бұрын

@@allangibson2408 Slavs like Serbians didn't migrate there until much much later.

@gazlator 2 жыл бұрын

Quite, quite so

@allangibson2408 2 жыл бұрын

@@ballenboy Language and genetic ethnicity are different things. Albanian is a relict of preRoman times as well… Dacian, Thracian and Illyrian would be relevant ethnically but utterly unfamiliar to modern audiences…

@Bimfirestarter Жыл бұрын

Whatta great video! Thanks! I love how you brought the subject to life in such a gloriously giddy fashion!

@sharadvemalanathan5236 Жыл бұрын

This video is spot on, considering current events!

@charitysheppard4549 2 жыл бұрын

I think the best representation of what she truely looked like are the statues that were produced during her time in Rome. These were produced by sculptors who actually saw Cleopatra. Romans appreciated a true level of reality in representation in their sculptures, obviously with some "photoshopping." The Roman sculptures produced of Cleopatra during her time in Rome show a decidedly Mediterranean/Middle Eastern appearing woman.

@HollowDesert 2 жыл бұрын

Thats what I was thinking

@pontios2006 2 жыл бұрын

As a Greek myself, anyone with Balkan and east Mediterranean would be great to cast. Gal Gadot is perfect.

@kay1057 Жыл бұрын

@@pontios2006 No they would not, most of today's balkans would be very different from the classical age. Slavs, Bulgars, Magyars, and different hordes and western barbarians(Germanic) came way after Alexander and his followers times. Islandic Greeks would make much more sense.

@barbarossarotbart Жыл бұрын

@@kay1057 No. It seems that you do not understand how a conquest did work. The original people were not replaced.

@kay1057 Жыл бұрын

@@barbarossarotbart You would be surprised genocide and slavery were fairly common, especially the hordes that ravaged the Eastern Roman Empires' borders. + The greeks, migrated into Anatolia and the middle-east.

@jonservo 2 жыл бұрын

Okay, all things being considered, regarding her family tree, I think we can all agree there is only one person that could properly portray Cleopatra… Andy Serkis

@brademerick9181 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah , ...because Cleopatra was a dude .

@brademerick9181 2 жыл бұрын

that's a joke people .

@jonservo 2 жыл бұрын

@@brademerick9181 it’s odd that after all the characters Mr Serkis has played, an Egyptian Queen may be the most normal lol

@kentuckywildcatgobigblue7190 Жыл бұрын

And he'd be great lol

@jonservo Жыл бұрын

@Alban Musa but does either have the chops to play an Egyptian Queen like Serkis could lol

@laraigneesurlaporte9992 Жыл бұрын

Amazing work!

@CinziaDuBois Жыл бұрын

Glad you think so!

@stanpski5442 Жыл бұрын

That is undoubtedly one of most interesting videos I've ever seen.

@GrumpyOldGuyPlaysGames 2 жыл бұрын

The Ptolemys... Ptolemies? What's the plural of Ptolemy? Anyway, they married people who were not Greek only four times in their entire history. Otherwise, they stuck with Greek spouses. I'm fairly sure that we can safely assume Cleopatra looked Greek.

@redassassian 2 жыл бұрын

I like how she doesn't bring the idea of race of concubine and illegitimate together. Cause if Celeoptra 7th was darker then rest of the incest babies, wouldn't there be mention of that.

@srfrg9707 2 жыл бұрын

The plural should be Ptolemiei (nominative) or Ptolemion (genitive). As an Egyptian Greek from Alexandria I can confirm we stuck with our greek spouses a lot. 😉

@BlommaBaumbart 2 жыл бұрын

At the same time I'm fairly sure Cleopatra didn't look like "a Greek", because in actual Greece the family trees didn't look like an instruction on how to weave a carpet.

@OdinsSage 2 жыл бұрын

@@BlommaBaumbart XD

@memykios7160 2 жыл бұрын

Ptolemy, Ptolemaios in Greek. Hence, the plural is Ptolemaioi (ai as in fair and oi as in see).

@Fenrasulfr 2 жыл бұрын

So basically Cleopatra is most likely similar to the modern Southern Europeans. A mix between European and Middle Eastern.

@docstockandbarrel Жыл бұрын

Maybe like a Habsburg.

@drdeesnutts48 Жыл бұрын

Yes but without the Middle-Eastern they were northern greeks but the Macedonians weren't necessarily regarded as true Greeks before Philip. The Ptolmies bred within their own family line for most of the reign and the only outbreeding seems to be from Anatolia which was largely ethnically Greek.

@docstockandbarrel Жыл бұрын

@@drdeesnutts48 did someone say blessed are the Greeks?

@taxthesocialist2602 Жыл бұрын

Black supremacists are mental nutcases that need help.

@Deniz-uk1wo Жыл бұрын

@@drdeesnutts48 she has Syriac and Persian DNA too

@dustinbennett9388 Жыл бұрын

Brilliant breakdown!

@gaius9240 Жыл бұрын

Get ready to get a spike of viewers because of Netflix

@BeaHasPP 2 жыл бұрын

"where the fuck is cleopatra the 6th" best quote

@sionanenrois1433 2 жыл бұрын

The best part of that quote was hearing it in such a lovely refined accent. Thank you, Cinzia.

@snobook 2 жыл бұрын

I once fell into Wikipedia rabbit hole of Cleopatras and kept asking this question.

@nono-io5kt 2 жыл бұрын

I'd by merch w/ that on it.

@tinyhowie 2 жыл бұрын

Sweet Home Alabama!

@stephenpmurphy591 2 жыл бұрын

Cleopatra the 6th greatest quote was as follows. "When arriving in Rome make a splashy entrance" We see her profile on a Roman/Egyptian coin. Yike's. Then again beauty is subject.

@odetomy 2 жыл бұрын

Girl, I give you A LOT of kudos for breaking down all that complicated family line. I had no idea it was sooooo mysterious and complicated. I always just thought Cleopatra was the one and only Cleopatra of her time. Thanks for sharing all that. 👍👍

@annaclarafenyo8185 2 жыл бұрын

She isn't 'breaking it down', she is obfuscating it deliberately. She is ignoring most of the ancestry, which comes from un-named and un-known Egyptian concubines and Middle-Easterners. The result is a person who would resemble a modern Middle-Eastern person.

@Copperkaiju 2 жыл бұрын

@@annaclarafenyo8185 You say she is obfuscating but what you just said is exactly what I took away from her video. Besides, if so much is unknown and unnamed, then how is she to know it, lol?

@rataflechera 2 жыл бұрын

The Ptolemies. Next on Netflix or Amazon Prime.

@matiusbond6052 2 жыл бұрын

@@annaclarafenyo8185 That is true

@wilmascholte7607 Жыл бұрын

@@rataflechera Sounds more like an HBO thing hehe.

@SyIe12 Жыл бұрын

GREAT WORK!!! I´M VERY IMPRESSED!! THANK YOU!!

@anacatalinaae2199 Жыл бұрын

Excellent video! Congrats 🎉 loved it

@ciamciaramcia99 2 жыл бұрын

5:15 Love how you diplomatically squezed the sponsor ad before the incest talk.

@CinziaDuBois 2 жыл бұрын

I've been here a long time

@Fetrovsky 2 жыл бұрын

I'm sure she likes squeezing sponsors.

@carnoth9864 2 жыл бұрын

I’m absolutely floored by your ability to keep that family line straight. I had to watch the video several times, so confusing. Well done! Very well done.

@fmas1978 Жыл бұрын

this I believe is the second video of yours that I've ever watched (first being a reaction to BearEars' denial of ancient Rome), I've enjoyed both, great work, thank you

@brianwaugh548 Жыл бұрын

Can you imagine the uproar, if Netflix had Dylan Mulvaney playing the lead actor in a film about Nelson Mandela. Netflix are a disgrace to truth, history and fact.

@MARQUE9368 Жыл бұрын

Just stumbled upon this channel, not really sure what I was looking for when I found it but very engaging, lively and wonderful. Subscribed!!!

@bboops23 2 жыл бұрын

4:02 this reminds me of a fascinating discussion that I had with a Korean woman. She had her DNA tested and her family made fun of her because "you're Korean, born in Korea. Why do you need to know more than that." Her DNA came back as part Japanese and a little bit Chinese her family freaked out. Based on the percentage it lined up with a probable great grandparent being Japanese and a great great grandparent being Chinese. Cut to a few years later her DNA test updated to say she was 99% Korean. Well, why did it change? Was it wrong? Probably not. What changed was where the line was being drawn between the cultures. Realistically both are actually right. Did she have a secretly Japanese Great grandparent? Probably not. More so the numbers lined up with the standard percentage of how much most Korean people cross married with Japanese and Chinese people throughout history. So where do you draw the line? Is she 12.5% Japanese, 6.25% Chinese, and 81.25% Korean because centuries ago the civilizations that became China and Japan also moved to the region that became Korea? Or is she 100% Korean because the mixing of cultures and peoples happened so long ago that you can't call those ancestors Japanese and Chinese anymore, but instead part of the tapestry of people's that would become Korean?

@LmaoMoni Жыл бұрын

I mean Japan had a lot of mass rapings throughout history. That’s why having Japanese ancestry is such a touchy subject. Korean people also ancestor worship like a lot of Asia so many people have family members who were in royal courts when the Chinese invaded several times.

@adapienkowska2605 Жыл бұрын

These tests are mostly a hoax. Nobody can say if you are 'Korean' or 'Japanese'. They can say that the type of genes you have also appear fairly often in Japan. They sometimes can roughly track your maternal line (if you are a woman) or paternal line (if you are a man). But the results are not cut and straight. The best example is a girl from the video 'SHOCKING African Ancestry DNA Results Im UPSET! Nia Hope'.

@Kevin_the_Caveman Жыл бұрын

There's really a big problem with those tests in this regard. Being "16% French" or something like that makes no sense: it's not like French people are a homogenous thing or ever were close to being, nor is it that they were dropped on earth at the same time as the other groups and had no contact outside that strictly deliminated gene pool. Those gene tests are the contemporary equivalent of personality tests for people so self-obsessed and shallow that they can't have a sense of identity without a test that'd make the Lebensborn jealous

@AL-nv4gk Жыл бұрын

@@adapienkowska2605 that video is hilarious if it's the one im thinking of. 😂

@emmq5157 Жыл бұрын

japanese imperialism also plays a role into that

@CinziaDuBois 2 жыл бұрын

The first 1,000 people to use the link or my code ladyofthelibrary will get a 1 month free trial of Skillshare: skl.sh/ladyofthelibrary04221 DISCLAIMER This video was produced by a random student on the internet who loves reading, especially about ancient history and classics. The purpose of my videos is to make classics and ancient history interesting and accessible to everyone. It is important to highlight that I am not a professional or qualified educator, “expert”, historian or classicist. However, I ensure that all the information I use in my video scripts has been collated from numerous credible sources, which I will link in the description box if accessible online. I always work my hardest to deliver thoroughly researched and reliable information in my videos, but please always conduct additional, independent research to formulate a thorough understanding of any topic discussed. Additionally, I am dyslexic, and I will mispronounce words throughout this video, sometimes without realising it. This is not ill-intended or stemming from willful ignorance, and I do make the effort to research how to pronounce words before I start filming, but I often misread my phonetic spelling. In light of this, please do not rely on my video for an authoritative or reliable source of how to pronounce certain words.

@christinemuschiato5895 2 жыл бұрын

there is ambassador letter that give green eyes to cleo

@christinemuschiato5895 2 жыл бұрын

there is an ambassador letter that give green eyes to cleo

@claytonbenignus4688 2 жыл бұрын

@@christinemuschiato5895 That could imply a Scythian Heritage.

@christinemuschiato5895 2 жыл бұрын

@@claytonbenignus4688 could be

@OrAngeAnArchy 2 жыл бұрын

Oh my the incest! I knew Royals did this as the norm but Dayum!

@microhistoria Жыл бұрын

Lovely channel, i loved it

@CinziaDuBois Жыл бұрын

Thank you so much!

@tacticalministries3508 8 ай бұрын

This shouldnt even be a question Hundreds of years of macedonian incest, no she wasnt black.

@fuzzymurdermittens 2 жыл бұрын

I'm pretty sure you lost me on that family tree (seriously, dudes, there are more than two names in the world - you don't all need to be Ptolemy and Cleopatra!) but that was a very entertaining discussion of it. Thanks for the vid and I hope you feel well soon :)

@jeffengel2607 2 жыл бұрын

Maybe they saved money on monogrammed wedding gifts bought in bulk and just handed out over generations.

@D64nz 2 жыл бұрын

The version I heard was they were considered immortal or godlike, and would just shift bodies when the old ones died. Hence all the inbreeding and keeping the same names. I thought it was routine to kill off the spares after they took over the titles too, but that might be a Byzantine thing I'm thinking of. Things were crazy af back then.

@jeffengel2607 2 жыл бұрын

@@D64nz Pruning spares was definitely an Ottoman thing; I doubt it was _only_ an Ottoman thing though. I seem to recall some Byzantine problem with rebel spares at times, so if that's right, then they weren't consistent about it at least.

@strawberrysangria1474 2 жыл бұрын

It reminds me of Alexander the Great naming a bunch of conquered cities "Alexandria". The royals do be vain!

@ciaobella8963 2 жыл бұрын

Most European Royalty are products of incestuous marriages. In other words, the same blood lines. This is common with elites. But if it happened a long time ago, and also now, doesn't it beg the simple question, why?

@d.l.hemmingway3758 2 жыл бұрын

Cleopatra was of Greek Ancestry and most likely looked very similarly to those from the Hellenic Republic.

@srfrg9707 2 жыл бұрын

Even more to the Greek communities of Alexandria and Cairo.

@Splexsychiick Жыл бұрын

No that's not right. It's a possibility but I think it most likely not what she looked like.

@jasonlee0290 Жыл бұрын

Thank you pretty historian lady!! This is how you properly do historical research :)

@eliteteamkiller319 Жыл бұрын

Why no documentaries or shows about the ancient Nubians? That checks all the diversity boxes big companies think will make them money, and it also brings to light history that most people in the western world don't really know about.

@fives5555arc Жыл бұрын

The von Habsburgs after they learn the Ptolemaic family tree: Finally, a worthy opponent, our battle will be LEGENDARY!!

@emilyspencer305 Жыл бұрын

Explaining this to Americans is quite challenging because often they don't know the difference between race and ethnicity, let alone that your ethnicity is not a 100% guarantee that you will develop certain phenotypes. As you showed in the video, it's far more complicated than just black or white, Greek or North African. Plus, why focus on her "race", when we could instead focus on how damn incestuous her family is, it's insane!

@whyaminotoriginal Жыл бұрын

Its in our history 🧏‍♀️

@miinfl7143 Жыл бұрын

they don't know the difference between race and nationality, in my experience.

@jesusbrito5165 Жыл бұрын

As a general rule the loudest people tend to be the most ignorant. And Americans love to be loud about everything. So it check's out. But mostly it's just ethnocentrism. They can't see beyond their own 100 or so years of history ( if even) and the bubble of their very particular national idiosyncrasies with identity.

@kevinbergin9971 Жыл бұрын

@@miinfl7143 So hard to explain things to Americans. Hey, try winning a few wars.

@juliaj7939 Жыл бұрын

We know the difference. Afrocentric and leftist Americans don't. Just saying... just look at the reaction leftists had to Jame Franco being cast as Fidel Castro... Also, America has won lots of wars.

@GUULLIVER Жыл бұрын

Even if one of those *"gaps"* were of North African origin, it doesn't make her "Black" as in the recent movie. Genetically she would be very slightly NAf then - around 10-12%. The rest will still be Macedonian with a tinge of Persian and Syrian. Bottom line is, it would have still been very difficult to recognize her as a black af person visually. Therefore, Hollywood representation is still a fake, not to mention that even this is an imaginary scenario because there is absolutely no info on what those "gaps" mean.

@UGTLDG Жыл бұрын

Yep, given her family tradition of inbreed and eliminations, a black Cleopatra would mean a "dead at birth" Cleopatra. In no uncertain terms.

@justinw1765 Жыл бұрын

I completely agree with you, but feel something should be clarified. The actress is not pure Sub Saharan Black African descent, but half of her genetics/DNA is Caucasian. It is inaccurate to refer to her as simply "black" when she is clearly mixed. She is much lighter skinned (for example) than many people who are of more pure Sub Saharan black descent. But yes, still not a good choice, because it is very unlikely that Cleopatra had half Sub Saharan black genetics/DNA, and was probably 100% Caucasian, which also includes Persian/Iranian, Syrian, and some North African groups/peoples. Egypt itself is quite mixed, and there is indeed some Sub Saharan Black genetics in there somewhat, but mostly in the far south, near to the border of Sudan.

@billprep1855 Жыл бұрын

I was thinking exactly that...you're my new favorite history person.

@idab2605 2 жыл бұрын

One of the weird things about being a jew is you are not white when it comes to being accepted as European, but you are absolutely white when you cast as an Egyptian queen. Nice

@CinziaDuBois 2 жыл бұрын

That is a really weird thing. I only came to know of people not classifying Jewish people as white when I was actually attacked by white supremacists on youTube a few years ago. they all said I wasn't white and I was Jewish and I "shouldn't speak of white people issues". I'd never heard of this distinction before then. Though to clarify, I'm not Jewish, but because I was supportive of Black rights activists, they tried to make me "less white" and distance me from them via assuming I was Jewish and it was baffling. But yeah, when I saw the backlash to a Jewish woman, someone from the middle east, playing a Macedonian/Persian/Iranian queen, because she was "too white", I was very confused.

@patty1247 2 жыл бұрын

This sort happens to me as a white Latina. Like my skin is darker than what some people in the US consider white person so I often get categorized as a person of color but other times I don’t. It is somewhat situational because sometimes I have white privilege and sometimes I don’t.

@waldemarsikorski4759 2 жыл бұрын

@@CinziaDuBois I was under the impression that Persia and Iran did not exist in the same timeframe.

@idab2605 2 жыл бұрын

@@waldemarsikorski4759 Persia is just another name of Iran. Europeans usually refer to this country as Persia (the land of persian) before Rezashah Pahlavi reign, during his reign due to political views it officially changed into Iran, but keep in mind Iran is not a new name, in the oldest manuscript this land called "Iranvij" which means the land of Aryans and at least for the last 2500 years it's been called Iran. Persia is the name Greeks came up with for this country.

@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl 2 жыл бұрын

@@CinziaDuBois cleopatra would have considered herself to be a hellenistic woman and a ethnic Macedonian

@ConradsStudio 2 жыл бұрын

Interesting note: "Berenice" one of the three popular girls names in the Ptolemaic dyansty, is pronounced more like "Veraneekee" in Greek, and is where we get "Veronica." Bonus factoid: Alexander the Great had a sister named Cleopatra, and as far as I can tell, is the only one of his siblings portrayed in movies or TV. I can't be positive, but I went through a lot of credits to find any other instances and have come up empty.

@GirlintheSea 2 жыл бұрын

Which movies/TV shows have Alexander's sister in it? I'm just curious because all the ones I've seen never show any of his siblings and it'd be nice to see a version with Cleopatra in it :)

@ConradsStudio 2 жыл бұрын

@@GirlintheSea Young Alexander the Great, 2010

@GirlintheSea 2 жыл бұрын

@@ConradsStudio thank you! I tried to find this show years ago but only came up empty handed!

@abelbasconessalazar529 2 жыл бұрын

I would say fereneeke as feres (bringer) nike (victory). Medieval tradition use the christian mythology as Verum Iconos mixing Latin and greek as for true image (of the Christ)

@thedativecase9733 2 жыл бұрын

You're right about the pronunciation of "Veraniki" what confuses some people is that Berenice used to be a fairly common girl's name until about the 1960s. I knew a couple of older women with this name as a kid.

@saphadill7069 Жыл бұрын

I am insta-subscribed! I ADORE the sound of your voice!

@Marissa_J Жыл бұрын

I just finished making an episode about Cleopatra because of the upcoming Netflix “documentary” but I’m just now coming across this channel! Definitely placing this in the description for people to watch, as I didn’t go into this much detail! Great episode, definitely subbing❤

@icecell 2 жыл бұрын

I've recently seen a video about Cleopatra's genealogy and possible actual looks too, so right now I'm more curious about her purported beauty more than anything else, seeing that her family tree is so...tightly knit.

@michaelautrey6641 2 жыл бұрын

and so murderous. a vicious lot.

@wolfshanze5980 2 жыл бұрын

She had a honker of a nose... that much is well documented.

@StephanFitzgeraldTay 2 жыл бұрын

Apparently commentators of the time said she was charming and intelligent (she was fluent in at least nine languages and was well versed in history, philosophy, religion, etc.), not that she was ridiculously beautiful. She also connected herself with the Egyptian pantheon

@dissodatore Жыл бұрын

it just proves that Beauty is both subjective and subverted by time.

@your_dad_on_vacation Жыл бұрын

People mostly called her beaitiful because of her intellect and things such as

@ciamciaramcia99 2 жыл бұрын

This whole controversy about Gal Gadot portraying Cleopatra VIIth proves how race is a social construct ie totally made up. She's from the same region as egyptians (middle east), similar phenotype (dark hair & eyes, olive skin), same language group (semitic) yet she's "white" but her doppelganger from neighbouring Egypt would be a "person of colour". PS: I'm not a fan of Gadot (mostly for supporting Isreal's policy in Palestine) but she's probably the best famous actress for the role. If the film makers wanted to go more obscure but authentic route they should've cast either a coptic actress or preferably a greek actress from Saloniki region. Although I doubt that more "correct" ethnicity would make their performance better.

@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl 2 жыл бұрын

We in Egypt can range from dark brown to fair skin we aren't just olive skin

@TheGrinningViking 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah that's to be expected in an important area with lots of trade going through it. If we are talking pre-trade Egypt everyone probably had the same skin phenotype, but Cleopatra's time was far far past that.

@KP-ej7gc 2 жыл бұрын

Nah race isn’t a social construct, it’s biological. Look up mixed raced people waiting for bone marrow transplants. It’s very difficult to find matches for mixed race people specifically.

@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl 2 жыл бұрын

@@KP-ej7gc it's a social construct based on some biological reasons

@KP-ej7gc 2 жыл бұрын

@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl but it can’t be a social construct if it’s based on biology.

@Mausso Жыл бұрын

It's weird to me that so many people bring up the Elizabeth Taylor movie when they bring up historical accuracy and whitewashing. I'm pretty sure that when they cast Elizabeth Taylor, representation and historical accuracy weren't even a blip on the radar. They just thought "Who is hot enough to play history's most beautiful woman?" It's not really a standard to take seriously.

@DerTable Жыл бұрын

Love your ethos and videos!!

@akankshyamahapatra6352 2 жыл бұрын

I would call this video "An abundance of Cleopatras"

@--Paws-- 2 жыл бұрын

In middle school my teacher told us the same thing about how the Egyptians depicted all women with yellow skin and males with red. She made us color some copies of Ancient Egyptian murals to drive the lesson's point home.

@matiusbond6052 Жыл бұрын

Paws..your teacher should be fired

@--Paws-- Жыл бұрын

@@matiusbond6052 You clearly do not understand the context.

@hanscusheshtate-ati4659 Жыл бұрын

You are 100% correct

@tnvalleyyoga7122 Жыл бұрын

Well done Lady.

@a.kitcat.b Жыл бұрын

💖I dressed up as her once and I have been obsessed since!! It is so wonderful to see videos like this!!🐍

@mongoose621 2 жыл бұрын

Informative and hilarious. Love it!

@CinziaDuBois 2 жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it!

@elaineyoung9672 Жыл бұрын

I am amazed at how fluently you have presented this convoluted story ! Congratulations 🎊

@DG-cc6tx Жыл бұрын

O.K. Your explanation was great! Learned soooooooo much from analysis. Wonderful and professional KZfaq channel.

@robcreel4257 8 ай бұрын

I'm new to your channel and absolutely love this stuff! That's quite a family tree. The root system is immense!

@SigridStorjern 2 жыл бұрын

I can't express enough how much I enjoy these videos!!! Please keep them coming! 🙏🏻🧡

@CinziaDuBois 2 жыл бұрын

Thank you! Will do!

@janwojtyna3392 2 жыл бұрын

@@CinziaDuBois please do plus I love your voice even when you are little under the weather.

@Uldihaa 2 жыл бұрын

"The Ptolemys kept it in the family..." Literally. So literally it'll make your skin crawl.

@STho205 2 жыл бұрын

I know of a certain royal family that live to the ripe old age of about 100...that tend to do it too.

@yassineferchichi6627 Жыл бұрын

It's difficult for me to comprehend that some brilliant minds out there still believe that north african people are black

@mikedrop4421 Жыл бұрын

Boy you were way out ahead of the curve on this one. I remember watching this when it was uploaded and now that the documentary is out the debate is raging.

@HistorySkills 2 жыл бұрын

Great video. Going to share this with my followers on social media, as well as my fellow teachers. Great work.

@CinziaDuBois 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for sharing!!

@thomasspicer4130 2 жыл бұрын

I love this actually someone who knows the nitty gritty of the genealogy. I think the recent casting of an ethnically Jewish actress is actually pretty accurate for Cleopatra as ethnically Jewish people are sort a mix of Southern European and Levantine Middle Eastern people.

@liteney 2 жыл бұрын

Who are the so called Levantine people if they are not caucasian? The arabs are not from the levant. Turks are not from the levant. Egyptians are not from the levant. Mongols are not from the levant. Persians are not from the levant. That leaves one race of people who are from the Levant, the Caucasians. Everyone else is a conquerer, invader, colonizer, enslaver.

@davidstansbury9309 2 жыл бұрын

@@liteney lol

@andrewtan2894 2 жыл бұрын

I think Gal Gadot was a pretty good choice for Cleopatra. She's from the region as well

@liteney 2 жыл бұрын

@@davidstansbury9309 Why are you laughing? Are you one of the non caucasian people who colonized anatolia, enslaving the caucasian people who's homeland that is?

@blatman5653 2 жыл бұрын

@@liteney Dude. TF are you on.

@therisingphoenixlovedbynat121 Жыл бұрын

As a black person, we do not claim this clusterf*ck of incestry. That bloodline/family tree is nuts. And it doesn’t help that dern near everyone in it has the same name. I’m wondering if that was purpose.

@j.m.5620 Жыл бұрын

Best explanation of her race/ethnicity given. Good research. Well done.

@winterburden 2 жыл бұрын

Thank you so much Cinzia, I never knew anything before about Cleopatra's ancestry! 😀

@CinziaDuBois 2 жыл бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

@thomaslehman6676 2 жыл бұрын

You are great! I would only have explained that the 'marrying within the family' was an Egyptian idea, that the Alexandrian Greeks took on, only after they conquered Egypt. The "Phaoronic family" was 'godly', and therefore, was expected to breed only within itself. This led to over 250 dynasties over 5000 years, as I'm sure you know!

@Cat_Woods 2 жыл бұрын

Sounded pretty monstrous to me.

@michaelcaffery5038 2 жыл бұрын

This may be of interest to you if you don't know it already. DNA was extracted from the base of a skull from what was probably the most sacred part of Newgrange Neolithic site (c3200bc) County Meath, Ireland. It showed the individual was the product of 1st degree incest ie either parent/offspring or siblings.

@CollinBuckman Жыл бұрын

I mean for a lot of history that was mainly ceremonial afaik, most Pharaohs mainly had children with their concubines.

@eunbiasedfan2873 Жыл бұрын

@@CollinBuckman did the children of the concubines go on to be the pharaohs though? Or was that only the incest babies?

@lonetemplar1748 Жыл бұрын

Very thorough explanation. I enjoyed your trip down the family stick (can't really call it a tree, can I?) of Cleopatra.

@anitarichmond8930 Жыл бұрын

First off terrific topic and Nextly great voice deep and husky I thought it was deliberate

@chriser3753 2 жыл бұрын

"Books save lives, so keep reading" Sooo I was that typical smart kid who would absolutely DEVOUR books far too advanced for my age and I could spend hours and hours every day reading in any location at any opportunity. Then life happened and anxiety and poor mental health took over, (bla bla bla you know the story) Basically I lost my ability to read, I just didn't have the attention span or ability to concentrate for long periods anymore and I haven't successfully completed a book in 15 years and I HATE IT! But that glorious sentence right there, (also maybe the joint I just had lol) got stuck in my head and drove me wild to the point that I've tore through my cupboards and trashed my flat to find this book I got 7 years ago that I've been trying to read since. So I'm gonna plan it all out and get myself all comfy and work myself up to it all day, for tonight, WE READ!!! So yeah! thanks for that! I haven't felt inspired like this for years!

@stancalung5186 2 жыл бұрын

Oh dear, that´s 1 to 1 what happened to me, a life ago... As a child I was even punished for reading (obviously, not what I was supposed to read for school) and then, as you say, life happened, depression - you really know the story :)) I started after a (long) while with psychology books, to understand what happened with the happy girl I used to be and why. Then I read books about science, phisics, history, step by step, page by page, and suddenly I could read again! Don´t worry, it is like bicycle riding, it´s there! I whish you can make the same happy comeback as I did! Have a nice reading session!

@rachel8089 Жыл бұрын

Something similar happened to me. My mental health went downhill and I simultaneously stopped reading as much. My concentration during reading has become awful, and I’m not sure if that’s because of ADHD or pure anxiety clouding my mind. I hate it, too, because I like reading and what I get from it. Sometimes it actually irritates me as I have to read sentences over and over. I might be sharing too much, but it’s nice to know others have gone through the same. Good luck with redeveloping your reading habits! 💗

@Oskar_A. Жыл бұрын

Good luck getting back into reading! I have recently started again, as well.

@jeffbriem 2 жыл бұрын

This was terrific. I learned more in twenty minutes than I did in a college course on ancient Egypt. Thank you!

@grandmastersreaction1267 Жыл бұрын

Says a lot about the college education system.

@TheFamousMockingbird Жыл бұрын

thats because ancient egypt is way more important than cleopatras ethinicity.

@TheFamousMockingbird Жыл бұрын

@@grandmastersreaction1267 i think it says something about this persons expectation of what is important historically

@jeffbriem Жыл бұрын

@@TheFamousMockingbird or that the ethnicity isn’t a simple issue and that there are certain assumptions people make without sufficient historical context?

@pedromarques5948 Жыл бұрын

???? Persians, Sirians and the majority of egypcians are NOT black. So even if Cleopatra have some blood from these peoples, she was NOT black.

@luigit2341 Жыл бұрын

Whether legitimate or illegitimate daughter, Cleopatra had to look pure Helenic Greek, we are talking about the successor of the Egyptian Throne; there were competing family member for the throne. If she was born looking different from her parents, she would have been ousted or killed by another Royal family member. The Romans certainly would have called her bastard. Also, were not the Selucids royalty at the time also Macedonian/Greek? as they were conquered by Alexander the Great, and his top generals split the conquered territories after death.

@TheHabsification 2 жыл бұрын

Best guess of Cleopatra's appearance in modern context would be a modern day southern European. Knowing Gal Gadot's ancestry and appearance probably the right choice. Example: Andalusian or Sicilian.

@curocurovic6675 2 жыл бұрын

yeah but egyptians did realy not like schasu they would not like it that one of them is portrayed as an egyptian

@TheHabsification 2 жыл бұрын

@@curocurovic6675 That's not the point dude

@lifeline.6144 2 жыл бұрын

She ain’t Egyptian

@arak5502 2 жыл бұрын

I think we also have to admit that Egypte was a mixed race society. When people say "it's in Africa, so everyone has to look like a Sub-Saharan African" is just incorrect. I think that when the African diaspora (wich I am a part of) is looking into their history, they meet a wall when it comes to Africa (because of the history and culture lost because of slavery), this had an effect on the people's sense of self and confidence. That is why they look at Egypte.

@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl 2 жыл бұрын

Yes and try to steal our history and call us mutts

@livelovelife32 2 жыл бұрын

@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl steal your history and call u mutts? idk anyone in my country that thinks of y'all as mutts or wants to steal your history? where did u hear that?

@ghost-user559 2 жыл бұрын

@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl Well Egyptians are a mixed people and have been for thousands of years? It’s a fact, not an insult. People trying to steal culture goes both ways. And it also depends what time period and culture you are referring to.

@cjohnson3836 2 жыл бұрын

@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl Same happens to indigenous Americans. Now we see some claiming that Africans were 1st in American continents. And also some saying Africans ruled China. Its all nonsense.

@jameschristophercirujano6650 2 жыл бұрын

Why would history be lost coz of slavery? Maybe Colonialism, the African Americans are the ones who lost their culture.