That’s what sal the tile guy recommends too: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/jryDYJWnprG1dpc.html

Expansion gap for plastic? That’s just got wood

I was told by a plumbing supply outfit (not Home Depot) that I should not have my new vinyl laminate lifeproof flooring under the flange, but around it. Reason being was because the floor can shift and move, and cause the finished flooring joints to crack or start to come apart. Much like you said. I removed the previous tile floor and backerboard, and will put a new subfloor down in the area of the toilet (wood is rotted out from leaking). So new subfloor will be lower than current toilet flange (which was too high to begin with). Wondering how low the cut in the copper drain pipe should be below the new subfloor, so the new flange sits well on that floor. I got a plastic Oatey 1 piece flange with a Proflex Fernco specifically made for transition from plastic to copper.

I'm at that stage right now. Did your planning work out well?

Did it fix it?

There are two slots where the Johni bolts need to go. Looking at the flange from the front of the toilet, the middle of the slots go into the 9 and 3 o'clock position.

For this product, no, because moisture barrier is part of the flooring. But many floors do require an underlayment. The box will tell you if you need one or not. Add 30 to 50 per sq. ft. for underlayment.

You'll need pvc cement for fluid seal and #12 stainless screws for flange

Not that I'm aware of, but you could check with Ferguson. If you only need a skosh you might be ok with the taper on the flange. Also, you can go into the basement, crawlspace or ceiling below and install new pipe as needed with a coupler or fernco to get the length/height you need.

@@JamesGlassJamesGlass we are installing new tile in our bathroom. Would you recommend using something like an Oatey 1/4 In. PVC Flange Spacer instead of tearing out the old flange?

@@danolson8790 The Oatey Flange extender might work. It's worth a dry fit to see.

Is it a 3 or 4 inches pipe, you can use a flange the goes inside the pipe.

kzfaq.info/get/bejne/bt1ziNKCrLiXaZs.html

Maybe. Maybe not. Tile repair is possible if you have matching tile and grout. You can cut out tiles, make flange and subfloor repairs and install new tile. You would need an experienced tile person because the devil's in the details of the finish: matching tile, matching grout, height, spacing, etc.

Yes, the flange must be secured to floor using stainless oval head screws, usually #12. If the flange isn't fastened the toilet won't be fastened. Toilet is attached to the flange, which is attached to the floor. Note: many floating floor manufacturers say to never screw the flooring down, and while this is true in most cases, for toilets you must screw through floor into subfloor. The toilet is 80 pounds on on the floor anyway so it's not like the floor is going to have movement.

I wouldn’t. I would use some scrap flooring to provide a solid foundation at right height for the flange. Then add floating floor around that. But would probably stay away from floating floors in general for bathrooms.

You mean the hole? Close but too tight. 1/4" all around is fine. I foamed under also for air control. Don't make it so large your flange screws can't get purchase!

The rough in was already passed long before this. The stub out is usually 6" off the subfloor w the test cap on for the test. The toilet install is considered finish work. It has to be there for the final walk thru, of course, but the pressure test is always done before. Also, the pipe is NOT flush w subfloor! That's my point. It's flush w the height of the finish floor.

@@JamesGlassJamesGlass Looks like you guys are Contractors/ License plumbers..... ......The Plumbing Codes Must be changed and the Toilet Bowl also.... Why...??? PVC flange and other flanges are Not Strong enough to withstand the Roughness of the people... ...... Therefore.... Still 2-Holes for the Flange and Added 2-Holes for the bowl to Bolt it to the Floor to make Stronger and more durability..

@@Honestandtruth The bottom of the horn on all toilets is level with the bottom of the toilet’s perimter walls., with all weight borne by those perimiter walls.. So when bolted to a level floor, not sure how the toilet horn would adversely impact the flange. Maybe so if the toilet was really wobbly, but then other far mare adverse issues are going to enter the picture, (making excess pressure on the flange the least of your worries).

Can you get a ok seal with your model toilet without using 2 wax rings? If yes, then roll.

Is there a good way to know that without installing the toilet?

@@danielrosborne No, but it's only 15 minutes and a wax ring to find out.

Okay, thanks!

One easy way: 1) flip the toilet over so the bottom of the toilet faces up (easiest if you're installing a new toilet, before the tank goes on) 2) or turn the toilet on its side 3) put a straight edge across the bottom of the toilet and become aware of the spacing between the toilet's output drain connection and the straight edge We just installed a new HD-bought 'Glacier Bay' power flush toilet. The topmost edge of the existing toilet flange was flush, level, with the existing tile flooring. The flange had been installed in some amazingly stout manner, not to the tile, but to what ever was under it. The house is concrete slab, no crawlspace. No movement at all in that flange, which was cool, so we didn't have to replace it. We installed the new toilet on the existing flange 'as is.' The dang thing rocked back and forth. We had to use plastic shims (also bought at HD btw) to stop it from rocking. I listed the steps (1) through (3) above because that might have saved us from grief. Since the old toilet didn't leak, and only one wax ring had been used, we didn't bother to check anything. Next time, we'll be using those steps. My assumption here is that the new toilet's drain output port on its bottom IS NOT FLUSH with the bottom rim of the toilet base, but actually extends deeper towards the floor, as if that factory expected the flange to be lower than the flooring. Not sure though, we didn't check it. .

Yes. There's still ample float.

@@JamesGlassJamesGlass Thanks so much man! Is there a certain length of #12 flange screws you are supposed to use or is the ones that were in it originally fine? I think they are probably 2 inches long maybe.

@@kccreations5945 #12 stainless oval head

@@JamesGlassJamesGlass great! Is there a certain length I would need? Thanks for the help! I’m going into a 3/4” subfloor and probably same flooring thickness as you in this video.

@@kccreations5945 My subfloor is 1.5 inches but normally it's 3/4". Just get something long enough to grab all your subfloor, say 1.5"

#12 stainless screws into subfloor. It's fine the floor won't technically float there. There's plenty of room for movement.

Mark where screws will go and drill a 3/4” hole in the vinyl plank so the screws won’t hold the floor.

@@jpjp3873 That's a good idea but what I'm going to end up doing is cutting all the way around to leave a quarter inch space between the flange and the flooring and I purchased some oatly ring spacers to space the flange up perfectly flush with the height of the floor.

You can use a 3" pipe. In this case, I used 4" to a 4x3 closet bend. I like a nice airy drop.

You drill a hole in the tile about 30% larger than a #12 stainless steel screw. Also, porcelain is the best tile choice for bathrooms, kitchens and wet areas. I'd always choose it over ceramic

No. And that reasoning makes no sense. Just cut the flange off, use a machine tool for the drop pipe, replace the floor and reinstall the flange. If you're spending hours replacing a floor, you can spend 10 minutes replacing the flange. The only way to properly seal the toilet is with the flange on top the finished floor. It's literally in the instructions.

@@JamesGlassJamesGlass With a slab foundation it's a lot more than 10 minutes to replace the flange since you have to excavate concrete to clearance space to expose more ABS pipe to install a coupling for a spigot flange . The Home Depot site says the twist-fit flanges that install on the inside of the pipe do not meet code. Too bad, that would be easy.

Yes. Primer and cement (glue).

Yes, but the type of glue you use depends on the type of flange you use. The white pvc uses a glue and primer, but abs style flanges use a simple abs cement glue, no primer.

You use a wax ring or modern equivalent. I like wax rings.

@@JamesGlassJamesGlass I think he is asking whether you need to use PVC cement to bond the flange PVC to the PVC pipe. If you do, then, how do you get it off if you need to change the finished floor later on? Cut the entire flange off and have to redo all the piping just to change the finished floor?

Yes.

James, thank you!

It's mounted to the subfloor and it's still to high? Something is not right. If your finished floor goes around the flanged and it's still so high that your toilet rocks, go back and ask the plumber (or if you did it yourself, just go back) and inspect everything.

@@jamesglasscameraobscura1148 Yeah, it's weird. My mom's place, yeah she cant afford a plumber, but it ain't my first rodeo... It seems the new toilet's recess is less than the old... I replaced the rotted subfloor and mounted the original flange to it. Hard to say 100% what it was before as it was all rotted, though it was mounted to the original at some point. Looking at the install instructions it says the flange can be no taller than 1/2 in so, looks like I'll be installing a new flange too. Will keep your tips in mind, ill at least add a spacer the height of the finished flooring. Won't be installing the finish floor for a bit, and we need a commode... X ) Thanks for the reply.

@@jamesglasscameraobscura1148 Sorry, 1/2 in above the subfloor, I meant.

Don't you mean put the flange on the SUBFLOOR if you want the toilet FLUSH on the finished floor with no caulking ?

@@captainedc ya I think we're talking about the same thing. Thoughts?

No. It is literally made for bathrooms and kitchens. Here's the link to product info. Why do you think it's waterproof? For the shower in your living room? www.homedepot.com/p/Lifeproof-Sterling-Oak-8-7-in-W-x-47-6-in-L-Luxury-Vinyl-Plank-Flooring-20-06-sq-ft-case-I966106L/300699284#overlay

I've read the info sheet too. You're technically correct. But, think about it: the toilet weighs 80 pounds. It's so heavy that the floor isn't floating anyway. There have been zero issues anchoring thru lvp in the last decade. If one was really paranoid, you could anchor thru lvp, then route a 1/4" around the flange to separate anchored lvp from rest of floor. But with the weight of the toilet, it hardly matters. Either way, flange must go on top.

@@JamesGlassJamesGlass No. You're reasoning is flawed. The weight of the toilet has nothing to do with expansion and contraction of material. It should be afforded to move the way it was designed regardless of what you're application might be. Think about putting a plank floor in a living room. You wouldn't bolt your couch through the floating plank floor to secure it to the ground and prevent it from moving. It weighs more than 80 lbs. The manufacturer put these warnings out for a reason. I'm happy you haven't had issues, but don't try and say that following manufacturer guidelines on a product they probably spent millions developing is being "paranoid." They literally, before releasing this product, tested and found that enough reason existed to have a technical document writer call out: "DO NOT ANCHOR TOILET THROUGH THE MATERIAL". Eh, but what do they know. Finally, to respond to "either way, the flange must go on top"... No, no it doesn't. Your flange can be secured directly to your subfloor and then you can cut your LVP around the flange with more than enough clearance to satisfy the gap requirement while at the same time being completely covered by the toilet base. That's how I did it at least, and it worked out great. You should probably change the name of the title on this video to "Incorrect toilet flange installation, but it works anyway for me so far".

The jibber-jabber is the difference between an average job and a great job--the devil is in the details. Jibber-jabber helps you understand the "why" with the "how". Why do some toilet flanges fail after a few years and why do some last a lifetime? Jibber-jabber is why. If you don't understand building science, you're just screwed. You're just an automaton mimicking a craftsman. Plus, if you're attention span is so short you can't take 2 minutes to understand why the flange goes on top, you have problems that go beyond plumbing.