COSMIC Desktop Alpha Is Only Weeks Away!!
Рет қаралды 18,434
2 ай бұрынThe COSMIC desktop alpha was supposed to come out at the end of March but it's been delayed just a little bit until May to round out developing the first party COSMIC applications
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January Post: blog.system76.com/post/cosmic...
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@sodiboo 2 ай бұрын
can you believe it? cosmic, just some weeks away!
@charautreal 2 ай бұрын
cosmic, in just some weeks!
@a1batross_ 2 ай бұрын
@@charautrealWoohoo! I'm so happy about this information!
@yusefaslam9675 2 ай бұрын
Yees
@domojestic4155 2 ай бұрын
Can you believe it, guys? Cosmic! It got here so fast!
@skelebro9999 2 ай бұрын
no, i cannot believe it
@Bilskirnir3124 2 ай бұрын
I really want Cosmic to succeed so that we will have options besides GTK and QT for desktop environments. I hope ICE opens up the market.
@katech6020 2 ай бұрын
it is called iced
@Bilskirnir3124 2 ай бұрын
@@katech6020 ah. Thanks.
@netkv 2 ай бұрын
there's also enlightement with whatever they are doing
@DRIVING_ME_CRAZY 2 ай бұрын
I HATE Gtk client side decorations ruining my Plasma desktop! I hope so, too.
@taylorworthington9394 2 ай бұрын
Iced is the keymaster, and cosmic is the gatekeeper kzfaq.info/get/bejne/j9R6qdZzx6uwpp8.html
@TheFerdi265 2 ай бұрын
I sincerely hope that Cosmic popularizes tiling. If more people get to know and love tiling in the unintrusive yet powerful way that cosmic implements it, people are gonna start wanting the same from KDE tiling. And if KDE gets cosmic-style tiling, that would be amazing.
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
The main barrier to entry with tiling is having to spend time configuring an environment, Pop OS with Pop Shell had already lowered that barrier a bit but now that it's a full environment I also have high hopes
@MNbenMN 2 ай бұрын
@@BrodieRobertsonI was using Polonium in KDE Plasma for quite a while, and I switched to Hyprland a couple weeks ago after frustration with the first couple days of KDE 6 bugs on Arch. (I know most of those big bugs are fixed already, I do still have Plasma, but kinda got hooked on Hyprland.) Getting started with the hyprland config was pretty rough, but now that I'm into it, I'm wishing I'd given any tiling WM a real chance years ago
@inevespace 2 ай бұрын
I think tiling doesn't give any benefits to a user who use mouse-centric programs. But still tilling must be a default feature of any modern DE.
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
@@inevespace I use a heavy mouse centric tiling workflow
@someguy9175 2 ай бұрын
The most iconic thing about current popOS white theme is the brown window header and orange close button. The fact that they removed that just makes me go "wtf".
@lmnk 2 ай бұрын
Also no maximize button, because double-clicking header does the same. Really neat and thoughtful idea, weird to see them backed it off
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
@@lmnk There are maximize and minimize buttons. They are configurable in COSMIC Settings. I personally use Super+M so have no use for maximize buttons.
@esn2618 2 ай бұрын
@@lmnkyou can turn off maximize button in new cosmic and also turn it on in old COSMIC
@thefunbuns1 2 ай бұрын
I hope Cosmic is as good as I’m hyping it up to be. I need tiling in my life but prefer a full DE just to make my life easier, and none of the tiling scripts or extensions for KDE/Gnome work that well. Cosmic seems like it’ll bridge that gap for me
@holyknighthodrick5223 2 ай бұрын
Same here, I struggle to use anything that isn't a tiling window manager as regular DEs are just too slow to navigate and get things done. However the experience configuring anything is absolutely terrible for WMs. Super excited for COSMIC.
@MNbenMN 2 ай бұрын
@@holyknighthodrick5223 I'm about 2 weeks into configuring Hyprland, but it feels like I've made as much progress toward how I want window navigation to work as I did with a year of KDE. I'm actually finding it more comfortable and efficient to write out config files than configuring through GUI tools. Then again I spent 3 years tweaking my plasma so I'm still constantly tempted to switch back :) I guess I can just reboot and choose the other grub option at any time
@holyknighthodrick5223 2 ай бұрын
@@MNbenMNThat's great it works well for you! Clearly we use our machines a bit differently, I might wanna change refreshrate / display resolution colour scheme etc the basics every now and then, but I find it really painful for myself, especially since I use different devices and need different configs for their hardware. Super easy to open a GUI and do it for me though.
@jandrews377 2 ай бұрын
@@holyknighthodrick5223 I agree. I daily drive i3. Sometimes its just a pain having to muck around with configs for things like screen/bluetooth devices/sound etc. I am willing to give cosmic a fair go and see if I can replicate my workflow adhering to their default bindings where possible. KDE and Gnome are nowhere close to where I need them to be and at this stage going back to a floating window environment is just painful.
@kyuwoochoi2887 Ай бұрын
Same here.
@GameCyborgCh 2 ай бұрын
Neal Gompa lives in Brodie's head rent free
@computerfan1079 2 ай бұрын
Neal Gompa is omnipresent
@qlum 2 ай бұрын
As for tiling vs floating, almost all my apps are maximized, I just use multiple monitors, with independent task bars to switch between applications per monitor. For me a floating manager with a default to maximize everything works best.This is something plasma does reasonably well.
@C4CH3S 2 ай бұрын
Tiling with workspaces is the best of both worlds
@weakspirit_ 2 ай бұрын
same, maximized feels so good
@komododragon6126 2 ай бұрын
The thing I find interesting about COSMIC is the fact that they make it super easy to get into tiling. For example, all you have to do is just turn it on for your workspace in the tiling applet. Takes a few clicks to get from floating to tiling
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
It gives people a chance to try it out and form a real opinion on it
@subrezon 2 ай бұрын
I'm really looking forward to Cosmic. I've been on Gnome for a looong time now. I've tried Sway and liked it a lot, but I realized that I need something that is floating-first, but tiling-capable. Cosmic looks like exactly what I need.
@brianhsu_hsu 2 ай бұрын
10:23 Tabbed Window is my main I3 layout. All window opened in tabbed mode, and only manually switch to tiling mode when I needed it. This is actually really make sense and make life easier. Most of time, when I open multiple application, I still focus on one window at a time. It's really rare that I need two window side by side or overlapping with each other. Once exception is terminal, in this case I use drop-down terminal, works really well with this workflow.
@MNbenMN 2 ай бұрын
Lately, I have a bunch of terminal windows tabbed in a group, with a browser separately off to one side and occasionally stashing an extra browser window on another workspace if i have a bunch of references to research(not i3 but Hyprland, though.) I used to have 6 KDE Activities, each with a different firefox profile and multiple virtual desktops with vscode and konsole and settings and discover windows spread out all over. Things seem a lot simpler and efficient just using CLI tools and neovim.
@Rohinthas 2 ай бұрын
Window tabs are really exciting to me! It seems like the exact thing I want out of my workflow: moving two instances of the same application to different groups so that I can cycle either between windows depending on topic or through tabs depending on task
@hermdude 2 ай бұрын
Pop shell has been the single best thing that improved my desktop experience. Too bad I was a little dumb and updated GNOME to 46 without checking whether pop shell got updated on the AUR side.
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
I'm curious to see what will happen to it after pop os shifts and COSMIC is all they do
@hermdude 2 ай бұрын
@@BrodieRobertson The best case scenario is that someone else would maintain it to be compatible with future GNOME versions, but personally, I'd be moving to COSMIC by then, seeing how more modern the tabbing feature looks compared to Pop Shell's Windows 95-2000-era UX aesthetic.
@phrtao 2 ай бұрын
I don't know whether it is a good idea to 're-invent the wheel' with new core apps at the same time as developing the new desktop environment. I liked the original project plan to concentrate on the actual desktop (along with its tiling and app stacking features). Seriously who is actually looking forward to a 'new' file manager or text editor that probably just mimics what you can get from Gnome's core apps. They could add their own core apps as a second phase once all the headlines features are in there and polished. Still I am looking forward to what they do.
@Wurstbrot03 2 ай бұрын
The core apps were always planned, only the first alpha was supossed to keep the current Gnome apps in place. And the COSMIC Apps make sense because they are desiniged with tiling in mind. As an example: If you haven't enough vertical screen space available, the apps simply hide the navigation menu on the left side, which you still can access through a button if have to navigate through the file browser or similar things. Source: I use the pre-alpha on a old notebook already.
@yorimirus 2 ай бұрын
I wonder if they will start releasing updates every 6 months like they used to once it releases. I liked that quite a bit. Having a 2 years old software repository is too much for me.
@b0t123 2 ай бұрын
I highly doubt it, if anything they'll stop being based on Ubuntu (source: the voices in my head)
@vendetta.02 2 ай бұрын
they will go back to a normal release schedule like they used to have when they update to cosmic, the reason popos waited so long to update was because they were working on cosmic.
@vendetta.02 2 ай бұрын
@@b0t123Stop listening to the voices in your head, they are wrong.
@Daktyl198 2 ай бұрын
As Vanessa mentioned, they've already stated that the only reason they paused on an LTS release and waited was to give them time to write COSMIC Epoch without having to spend resources on updating their existing COSMIC addons for Gnome every 6 months, etc. Once COSMIC Epoch releases and is the default desktop, they are planning on going back to following Ubuntu releases every 6 months.
@yorimirus 2 ай бұрын
@@Daktyl198Nice! I knew that the reason they stopped was because of cosmic, I just wasn't sure if they would continue releasing every 6 months afterwards or not.
@torspedia 2 ай бұрын
I'm looking forward to it, especially for my studies. 🙂
@GridlocSSB 2 ай бұрын
About the ambiguity in the term “tiling”, it may be easier just to say “auto tiling” and “manual tiling”; depending on if newly spawned windows automatically shift the layout or if they need to be individually placed by the user (such as snapping to the screen’s edge or positioning inside the weird mosaic-like overlay layout guide thing that KDE or Windows 11 have).
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
Manual tiling already has a meaning, tilers like i3 are manual tilers. This means the user chooses the direction that the windows get tiled instead of an internal layout being used
@Zitrussaft 2 ай бұрын
I'm super excited to use COSMIC DE. I'm currently using a mix of GNOME + Tiling and it feels so hacky at times, really looking forward to having actual tiling in a DE
@Mordinel 2 ай бұрын
I like their white theme, it's much better than most light themes.
@FagnerLuan 2 ай бұрын
Nah... it looks ok, but it's too minimalist, the header and the list uses the same color, this is a bad UI decision.
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
I actively dislike over use of white in a theme, but I don't like gray being a direct replacement either
@excidium_ 2 ай бұрын
light themes are a bit of a lost art... everything was fine until material design hit the scene
@lmnk 2 ай бұрын
The gray feels too gray-ish. I tried making it just a bit brighter and it looks better for me. Maybe also use dimmed accent colour instead of plain gray Also yeah, some kind of horizontal line separators, or a thin border, along the files working space, would make it nicer
@DavidAlsh 2 ай бұрын
The most impressive thing to me as that they managed to build this so quickly. In half the time it took for Gnome to approve VRR, COSMIC nearly completed an entire new desktop environment. I'm not a big fan of ICED as a UI toolkit. I get that the MVU pattern is all the rage in the web app world but it's honestly such a pain in the neck for me. The other Linux UI toolkits use C which I find to be a poor choice to write a UI in but at least there are Rust bindings and I can choose the architecture I want for my application.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
The MVU pattern, typically referred to as TEA (The Elm Architecture), actually isn't that popular in the web world. It's a niche language that's alien to most web developers. The most popular web frameworks lean towards VVM, such as React (VVM) and Vue 3 (MVVM). Unfortunately, the popularity of these frameworks has also affected Rust web frameworks, given how popular Leptos has become as of late. The concepts from Elm have seen a resurgence in Rust because it fits perfectly into Rust's borrowck analysis and error-handling mechanisms. I'd encourage web devs looking into Rust to check out Sauron if they want to experience TEA for web development.
@yusefaslam9675 2 ай бұрын
Can't wait to try out the new COSMIC! I'm gonna compare between XFCE and new COSMIC on an old pc and see how much faster it is.
@wojtekburzynski654 2 ай бұрын
i used tabs to keep together mail client, zulip, terminal with vpn session etc. In other worlds windows that i don't need all the time, but at the same time need easy access to. And in this particular case is more convenient than minimizing because i does not mess with current window placement and size.
@YannBOYERDev 2 ай бұрын
I will play with Cosmic on a VM, I'm happy with my Fedora KDE system.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
Virtual machines do not have sufficient graphics acceleration to render properly.
@charautreal 2 ай бұрын
@@mmstickI mean... they kinda do if you give it access to (and you don't have a 2008 hp laptop fr)
@FakeMichau 2 ай бұрын
@@mmstickThey didn't specify so they might be doing a gpu passthrough, I know I would
@temari2860 2 ай бұрын
Tiling in Cosmic is to me like the tabbing. I don't use either, but am excited to have them in my normal desktop, in a very user friendly way, which may lead to me using it
@bleack8701 2 ай бұрын
For the tiling vs floating discussion.... I need a mix of the two. Neither one by itself does what I need it to do For the light theme, I'd swap the lighter color of the sidebar and the dark grey of the main window. I'd also make the selection highlight less dark, as it makes it difficult to read
@bluesillybeard 2 ай бұрын
LET'S GO COSMIC is coming together!
@iodreamify 2 ай бұрын
I'm hyped for Cosmic because they'll introduce new ideas and give some competition to the other DEs but i don't care about either tiling or the header bar/csd model they've chosen. Hope all goes well.
@FagnerLuan 2 ай бұрын
I'm really curious about cosmic, it looks good, iced sounds interesting and I hope that it uses less resources than GTK and QT.
@jfftck 2 ай бұрын
The latest COSMIC build has a setting to style GTK to match Iced (unfortunately it doesn’t work yet), so it looks like it will be possible for a consistent look to the applications. I would say that COSMIC is more stable than GNOME and KDE, the desktop doesn’t lock up even if the panel, dock, or widgets do crash. The tiling is the best out of the box experience I have seen in a full desktop environment, the fact that each workspace is able to be treated as an independent entity - where not only are you able to switch workspaces per monitor, but tiling can be applied per workspace - this will allow many different workflows and make for a per user custom experience.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
GTK3 integration only works if you installed adw-gtk3.
@fakecubed 2 ай бұрын
I'm pretty happy with Gnome but I'm watching Cosmic with great interest. Probably be a few years before it's something I'd actually try myself, but there should be more competition in this space.
@anthonyhope2589 2 ай бұрын
The wait is almost over. Been a Cosmic user for ages because of the tiling management. Nothing else comes close out of the box.
@Kylian381 2 ай бұрын
Wouldn't surprise me it it becomes the default desktop for enterprise use in a few years. Mainly due to it being programmed in rust.
@evantaur 2 ай бұрын
it just needs "Safe and blazing fast DE written in rust" added to it's general description and it's all golden
@kxuydhj 2 ай бұрын
i really like tiling but i also like having a full desktop environment that just works out-of-the-box and i'm particularly obsessed with flexibility, so for now i'm stuck on plasma with hyprland installed just in case i get tired of plasma. honestly, i just want plasma to add a full-blown autotiling mode already but i'm pretty sure i'll have to dream on for that.
@MegaManNeo 2 ай бұрын
Didn't expect System76 to take notes from BeOS's/Haiku's window management by grouping them to one block that can be swapped through. Now I am curious to see this thing reaching 1.0 too.
@TheToothPaste1 2 ай бұрын
I hope the apps won't be tied to much to the desktop environment so that we can use them on other window managers
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
Every application is statically linked, which makes it easy to port to any operating system. Using it on another desktop environment is no different. The applets however are unique to COSMIC, because no other wayland compositor uses the same setup.
@oredaze 2 ай бұрын
I want something that can do both tiling and floating very well. So far only awesome fits this requirement. That excludes wayland... We will see how cosmic operates.
@AndersHass 2 ай бұрын
I didnt know about having any window as a tab
@CalvinB_ 2 ай бұрын
I don't know if its passable but I would love to see some kind of config files system or settings / applet backup system. I currently find KDE config files to be a massive mess and near impossible to back up with out a lot of extra work.
@sheevys 2 ай бұрын
Have you looked at konsave?
@Spoonbringer 2 ай бұрын
If I can easily make this look like Gnome + Dash to Panel I am very interested. I was never a fan of the 2 bar layout.
@henrymach 2 ай бұрын
I hope Cosmic gets so good it makes everyone ditch Gnome and all Gnome developers quit programming forever.
@katzicael 2 ай бұрын
I am *SUPER* excited for Cosmic Pop!_OS
@Mishaye 2 ай бұрын
COSMIC absolutely looks like it could be a good alternative to Plasma and GNOME. I think they're both good, but they both also have annoyances and flaws that cause me to switch from one to the other after some time.
@sapzk 2 ай бұрын
Unfortunately, workspaces are still in progress, i am really into gnome+paperwm, but miss independent workspaces/monitor stuff we usually have on tiling window managers, I hope cosmic manage to do it rightly.
@JohnJohnson-dl8oq 2 ай бұрын
In really looking forward to Cosmic! I don’t understand why if you want tiling, you have to use a window manager, then rebuild the world from the ground up.
@reality-drift122 2 ай бұрын
been using it on my both my machines for a week-ish its got bugs but has been amazing
@KoopstaKlicca 2 ай бұрын
I'm super excited for cosmic. I've recently switched to hyprland from plasma, and it was a big mistake lol I fell in love with tiling. In general I much prefer DEs but tiling became such a sticker (despite my love for krunner smh) that it's hard to transition back. I'm hoping that cosmic is a good balance between that (with exception of having to give up krunner nonetheless)
@G4RYWithaFour Күн бұрын
looks like they needed a bit more time, still very excited either way!
@thingsiplay 2 ай бұрын
Brodie is growing up and uses Desktop Environments. :'-) I remember when he was smol when starting his KZfaq career. BTW I also switched to Plasma after using Qtile for a while. COSMIC is intruding to me too (especially as a Rustacean). So curious how this will evolve.
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
Don't worry I still have my Hyprland configs around
@gljames24 2 ай бұрын
Woooo! Cosmic DE!
@cheako91155 2 ай бұрын
I don't have anything against tiling, if it works with gkrellm as a dock and I have not seen that.
@MeepMu 2 ай бұрын
Hopeing that cosmic gets a scrolling mode too (PaperWM/niri style)
@ari-mcbrown 2 ай бұрын
Neal Gompa mentioned!
@Funny0facer 2 ай бұрын
in my opinion, the tiling KDE does, is actually tiling. Just not an auto-tiler.
@luizansounds 2 ай бұрын
Its not, even manual tiling maximizes windows and tiles them without a tiling pattern, Kwin has tiling capabilities but doesn't have proper tiling
@rc2276 2 ай бұрын
Yay for tiling.
@flewwasse 2 ай бұрын
With the window tabs it looks like this is the year of the BeOs desktop!1!1!11!!1!!1 I want tiling windows
@flewwasse 2 ай бұрын
It would also be great if it was aero themable. I like aero
@holly_hacker 2 ай бұрын
You should really try out a few of their apps (cosmic-term, cosmic-edit). They feel very rough. If you have the nix package manager, you can run them that way.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
Unless you're on NixOS, you will be stuck with software rendering.
@KizukiKotataki 2 ай бұрын
Is cosmic de a powerful tiling window compositor? let's say as good as bspwm, hyprland, sway/i3, xmonad, awesomewm, you name it. Or it's just like Plasma 6, just a feature tiling. When it comes to tiling, what I really require are: - Scratchpads - Window tabs/groups - Shortcut keybindings (especially key chords like in sxhkd) - Tags
@GregMan-wu2cp 2 ай бұрын
I prefer the way Win11/KDE do tiling, but I wouldn't mind having an automatic one if they made it opt-in. As in, my window starts floating normally but I can then add it to the tile if I want. Otherwise I just don't like it.
@Redmage913 2 ай бұрын
I’m really surprised at the 60/40 on floating/tiling usage.
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
I'm not, tiling is a great workflow, the only problem is most people don't want to configure a tiler
@kanuuker 2 ай бұрын
Tiling is the primary reason I use Pop.
@BRGBKBULLYING 2 ай бұрын
Soon :)
@rightwingsafetysquad9872 2 ай бұрын
As long as its window management is better than Mac OS, I'll be happy.
@stephanhuebner4931 2 ай бұрын
Honest question, what's the point of window-tabs, having different types of apps combined in one window? I'm still faster switching to another app with virtual screens and a mousebutton-shortcut to switch between them, instead of having to manoeuvre the pointer to a rather small area in a window that constantly changes places whenever a new tab is added or one is removed. I don't have any good visual clues to show me what the tab is in a glance, and I usually don't use app-windows all with the same dimensions. So again, what are the supposed advantages of apps as tabs in windows? Or did I misunderstand something here?
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
Not sure, haven't actively used it but I think it's a neat idea that's worth playing with
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
Context. Why flip the entire workspace when you only want to flip through a single tile?
@stephanhuebner4931 2 ай бұрын
@@mmstickI have eight virtual screens, with certain apps always appearing on the same one. So over time it became kind of muscle memory to press the mouse-shortcut, say, two times to switch from LibreOffice to Firefox, and so on. It's very fast and the windows aren't hidden behind other apps. That, to me, seems to be much faster than looking for some smallish tab on a window.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
@@stephanhuebner4931 Super + Left/Right moves focus between tabs. No need to look for anything.
@dermachedjamel8970 2 ай бұрын
Tabs in a window manager are the only thing that makes them useful to me
@Megalomaniakaal 2 ай бұрын
I could see myself having say heroic and steam in tabs...
@foznoth 2 ай бұрын
Don't tell Vaxry, but Cosmic is looking to being the one DE to pull my away from Hyprland. I tried Polonium on KDE, and it was far too clunky. Though I do like KDE for situtions floating is needed, and for touch interfaces. I'm keeping an eye on this one.
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
Sadly I never got a chance to daily drive bismuth but I hear it was much better
@foznoth 2 ай бұрын
@@BrodieRobertson Polonium is a fork of Bismuth, as that has slowed development. I'd not tried Bismuth much before either. It obviously didn't leave a good impression. Hopefully Cosmic is as featured as Hyprland for the tiling and workspaces, I couldn't live without them these days.
@bhavyakukkar 2 ай бұрын
it would be interesting to see vaxry's reaction because he doesn't have a very positive opinion on rust
@vinny5915 2 ай бұрын
a bit of aligning on the terminology is needed here. What you are refering to as "tiling" is actually "auto-til ing". What KDE has is "tiling", it just does not do it automatically.
@mckendrick7672 2 ай бұрын
But that's quite pedantic. By that token even Windows, Mac OS, and Android have tiling. When we say tiling within the context of Linux we usually mean at least a bare minimum level of self-tiling based around keyboard navigation. Even traditional "manual" tilers like i3, do not rely on the mouse to the same extent which KDE "tiling" does.
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
No, what I'm referring to as tiling is tiling, I'm not letting 1 project try and redefine tiling to fit a windows fancy zone clone.
@stormshaman 2 ай бұрын
"Hacky" ways to do window tabs on X11? This is (or was) a normal feature of a bunch of window managers. I used to use it all the time on Fluxbox. I thought several of the popular tiling WMs supported it too. IIRC, in an early bug report about improving the integration of tabbed web browsers with the window manager, some WM or DE developer opined that tabs implemented in a browser was a hack, and that the proper thing was for the window manager to handle grouping multiple tabs into a single window. Obviously, this view didn't win out, and window managers never took over the task of managing your browser tabs, your text editor tabs, your terminal tabs, etc. Each app implements it in its own way. Hmm. Maybe that developer had a point.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
In-app tabs are still better for the general case so that they're grouped together into the same window. With COSMIC, you can then have application tabs within your window tabs for an extra level of tab depth.
@roo79x 2 ай бұрын
With how long Pop_OS has had their tiling and how much people say it's good. When the KDE devs wanted to implement tiling into Plasma. How did they not look at Pop_OS and think. Let's do that!. It's legit tiling, it works well, The whole concept is laid out already. It could have been an easy win. But then I'm also not surprised in a way. KDE devs like to take a concept use it's name then redefine it to what they think it should. The floating panel is another one of those concepts
@daorkykid 2 ай бұрын
Gotta let the Linux Tech Tips guy try it once it's out.
@QuestionTheTruth 2 ай бұрын
COSMIC should have a file that handles all colours in the system, that way you can easily change the whole systems colour scheme.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
It already does, but integrations with all toolkits requires the settings daemon to respond to those changes
@MisakaMikotoDesu 2 ай бұрын
The only good tiling WM was ion/notion. Blank tiles are a must for any sane tile manager. That's why KDE's tiling is actually useful.
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
Why are they a must?
@MisakaMikotoDesu 2 ай бұрын
@@BrodieRobertson As soon as you start having too many windows open you start smushing windows into sizes that become unusable, forcing you to cycle them through the tabs or move them to other workspaces. With tiling like ion/notion the grid is only changed by the user, never the computer, and each tile has tabs that allow you to cycle between what window is actively being shown in that tile. At least for me I cannot use auto tiling because of this. It's annoying to have to cycle my windows constantly, especially with bloated UIs like we have today with discord or many websites. If I was insane enough to write my own WM, I would make it so you can have overlapping tiles, which I find essential to getting things done on a laptop. As an example, I don't need to see my entire terminal window while compiling in gentoo, I just need to see enough to know how far along it is without the text being compacted into being unreadable. Same for discord, I only need to see the side bar to see if someone messaged me if a channel updated. Maybe some day I can make it happen...
@publicname 2 ай бұрын
They should consider blur on all apps
@excidium_ 2 ай бұрын
I really hate the kitchen utensil palette of accent colors they use on every popos/cosmic screenshot
@adjbutler 2 ай бұрын
Yes, but NixOS video when??? WHEN!!!
@CRYPTiCEXiLE 2 ай бұрын
im taking inerest in Hyprland to be honest
@TrolleyTrampInc 2 ай бұрын
Had a lot of hope for COSMIC purely for the tiling. Have been eagerly waiting to hop over and daily drive it. But something about their UX and GUIs feels outdated like KDE. I mean all of it looks like Gnome bought on Wish. Just like KDE is Windows from Temu. I daily drive Hyprland and honestly might just jump to Gnome. (Window managers don't handle my software needs well) It's 2024 and every linux DE other than Gnome looks like its stuck in the 90's. How is this possible.
@stephanhuebner4931 2 ай бұрын
Because on the desktop the prime principles of the 90s still work very well for quite a lot of people, despite what all the oh-so-cool-hipsters try to sell us. There's something to say for desktops which are based on actual scientific research on how users intuitively interact with desktops.
@TrolleyTrampInc 2 ай бұрын
@@stephanhuebner4931 yeah no! both major desktops, Mac and Windows moved away from these "principles". Those 90's features weren't based on scientific research they were the product of software/technological limitations. Gnome, Mac and Windows all look a million times nicer and maintain lightning fast workflows. Just facts. It's not the "oh-so-cool hipsters", People just want to work! not be boggled down by unnecessary ugly bloat.
@SlyEcho 2 ай бұрын
I don't care about tiling, I have windows all over the screen and it's fine. But I also don't use a 1080p monitor like it's still 2009.
@stephanhuebner4931 2 ай бұрын
I never understood the appeal of tiling. I guess it just does not fit my workflow, but I can't imagine how it makes things more productive at all.
@CRYPTiCEXiLE 2 ай бұрын
TWM is fine :)
@MrHyde911 2 ай бұрын
The only things that keeping Cosmic alive are Rust and Tiling
@TemporalOnline 2 ай бұрын
Did they make the "are you sure" prompts scarier?
@itsHanibee 2 ай бұрын
sega should've done neal everywhere instead smh
@ItsKoiFish 2 ай бұрын
3rd comment
@MW-mn1el 2 ай бұрын
Tiling is a must for pro user and dev.
@OhhCrapGuy 2 ай бұрын
Related, I think this is also why the light theme needs more work: how many devs are using it?
@naheemsays5140 2 ай бұрын
It will be funny if Cosmic turns out to be shit. All the hype merchants will have to do u-turns or keep their blinkers on in that case. System76 will have a very interesting year this year. Either Cosmic turns out great and everything is hunky dory. Or it turns out to be not ready (which is probably more likely than being shit) and then System76 have the choice to either commit seppuku by going ahead with in in their distro release, or back pedalling to another DE for this release. I don't know which way it will go but it is interesting to watch (especially as having a hardware vendor develop a DE based on customer feedback could turn out to be a winning combination).
@stephanhuebner4931 2 ай бұрын
What is funny about a company failing at something they're honestly trying to make good? I do not understand that kind of sentiment.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
@@stephanhuebner4931NaheemSays is a prominent GNOME troll. That's why he thinks it would be funny. He's afraid that COSMIC is actually delivering.
@stephanhuebner4931 2 ай бұрын
@@mmstick Thanks for the clarification. That explains the somewhat derogative tone.
@naheemsays5140 2 ай бұрын
@@stephanhuebner4931Its not about the company but all those hyping the DE without first even trying it. System76 has its plans and if it is not ready this time around it might be by the next round of Ubuntu LTS releases. But I would have expected the hype to be by people who have tried it, but most dont seem to care about that. Most of us have absolutely no idea how interacting with it will look and feel, but OMG ITS THE BEST THING SINCE SLICED BREAD!!?! If it meets those standards, that will be quite an achievement. But even then expecting it from the alpha?
@naheemsays5140 2 ай бұрын
@@mmstickoh, I could troll, but I choose not to. The few times I have asked questions though, I have the answers (only from you, not other System76 developers) to be dishonest. Unlike what you say, I do think It would be good if Cosmic delivers (because having a hardware vendor creating a DE based on paying customer feedback could be a winning combination), but so far we are going off hot air. System76 have a vision, but the product can only be judged when released. The hype train is weird as its based on a product that so far doesnt exist. Once it does, it can be judged on its own merits.
@rogueyun9613 2 ай бұрын
I'm one of the people who can't stand taskbars or application bars of any kind as they just take up too much screen real estate.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
Thye can be disabled andor configured to auto-hide in the desktop settings page.
@Little-bird-told-me 2 ай бұрын
*Cosmic OS will become the defacto distro of the future Linux systems. The potential of using a tilingWM and a floating WM is best of the both worlds and is the logical next step for desktops. I am surprised no one else has picked up on this except the Cosmic team. I am currently using ubuntuSWAY and I am really looking forward to the alpha release. I will even contribute to the project if I love the desktop.*
@rocksquared 2 ай бұрын
Now that I saw what Cosmic can be, I can't like anymore the others DEs like before.
@porterhouse937 2 ай бұрын
Snake oil vaporware. It will make as much impact as lxqt. But hey it’s written in Rust, that solves everything
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
How so?
@porterhouse937 2 ай бұрын
@@mmstick Because I understand the appeal of building everything in-house with Rust, Blackjack and h00kers, but this ain't it, and the guys behind it aren't cool enough nor have deep enough pockets to pull it off. So it remains a nerdy ego-trip that will limp along as long as the company behind it can finance it. I sincerely wish I'm wrong though.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
@@porterhouse937 Sounds very arrogant to claim this is a nerdy ego trip, or that the team is not cool enough. Unless you've been living under a rock, you should already be aware that it's on schedule to release around the end of summer. Fedora already has a SIG and is moving forward with getting it in the official repositories. NixOS is not far behind Fedora on packaging it. Many people are already using COSMIC today. A few third party COSMIC applications and applets already exist now, such as COSMIC Tasks. What kind of deep pockets do you think is necessary? And why isn't the team cool enough?
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
I do like how he says the "guys behind it" not realizing who he's replying to
@porterhouse937 2 ай бұрын
@@BrodieRobertson yeah I did that intentionally to not give anyone the satisfaction, but I knew some nerd orbiter will come around and ruin it
@stephen2282 2 ай бұрын
"experiencing my time on plasma 6 is not bad per se but it does leave a lot to be desired" thats funny coming from a WM user
@GregMan-wu2cp 2 ай бұрын
I hope System76 somehow convinces NVIDIA to give Wayland some love. Tried Gnome and KDE with Wayland using the proprietary drivers recently and it wasn't fun at all.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
They already did. The latest drivers are good, and explicit sync is in. They even have open drivers now.
@GregMan-wu2cp 2 ай бұрын
@@mmstick Does that affect only their latest GPUs? I've tried running Gnome on Wayland with the latest drivers recently and it didn't work well.
@mckendrick7672 2 ай бұрын
@@GregMan-wu2cpMost likely it will only affect newer GPUs. Unfortunately old GPUs are effectively on life support or no longer "supported" at all. Bear in mind, 20 series is already 6 years old, and I can't speak for others but Wayland works fine on my 2060.
@ShadowManceri 2 ай бұрын
Not a big fan of every "desktop" inventing their own file system managers and text editors etc. It really makes no sense. I get that there is different feel to the desktop but why reinvent the apps as well. Surely they can't be as good as some older battle tested apps but take a big chunk of development time. It honestly just feels silly. Like for example Kate(/Kwrite) is amazing text editor. Not really best at anything, but does basics and quite a lot more well. Sure dependencies outside of KDE is going to be tricky to manage. But surely there would be way to use something like that.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
All of the applications were mostly built by Jeremy himself. There's been some community contributions lately, but it's mostly Jeremy. He assembled them all within the last six months. You're overestimating how difficult it is to build applications with libcosmic. Can you imagine installing an OS and not having a text editor or terminal? Not me. Can you imagine developers wanting to build applications using a toolkit that doesn't have those capabilities? Not me.
@ShadowManceri 2 ай бұрын
@@mmstick 🤦And who exactly did say that OS should come without text editor or terminal?
@bhavyakukkar 2 ай бұрын
@@mmstick if you're installing an OS the developers can have the external text editor and terminal emulator install during the installation so I don't really understand this criticism
@bhavyakukkar 2 ай бұрын
I can somehow understand a text editor since there aren't many native wayland text editors out there, but they didn't have to make their own terminal emulator when foot, wezterm, kitty & alacritty exist
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
@@bhavyakukkarNone of those options are as good as the cosmic terminal. They either have no GUI at all, or don't support basic features like tabs, split panes, ligatures and bidirectional text. You're also claiming that cosmic should bundle an entire other desktop environment's applications and their runtime dependencies inside of itself, which is insane.
@mieszkomazurek3033 2 ай бұрын
I just checked cosmic-term code and how it compares with gnome-console Rust vs C terminal emulator app, release build: Compilation time 4m16s* vs 6s (x43) Binary size 30MiB* vs 248KiB (x124) Memory usage (1 instance) 479MiB vs 111MiB (x4.3) Memory usage (10 instances) 4.7GiB vs 143MiB (x34) COSMIC developers will struggle a lot to make their apps optimized enough to conquer with GNOME. Now, just launch a few terminal or file manager instances - basic apps - and your memory is full. Rust is so great and memory efficient, they said? *the difference is mostly because Rust links all the libs statically. I hope Rust will get good solution for dynamic linking or the COSMIC developers will resolve this problem somehow. Otherwise COSMIC will suck.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
You're not measuring this correctly because you've forgotten to count the dynamic libraries. You also need to account for COSMIC Terminal using GPU rendering with wgpu, or that it supports ligatures and bidirectional text, along with split panes. Features that require some memory overhead. Especially the GPU rendering. It would be trivial to optimize the terminal to create multiple window instances from a single process.
@mieszkomazurek3033 2 ай бұрын
@@mmstickNo, I didn't forget. Shared libraries are shared. There's only one running copy of glib, gtk, gdk, cairo, libadwaita, pango, json-glib etc. If you start gnome-shell, most of the components needed for basic GTK4 apps are already loaded. They don't give any extra overhead. Rust "libraries" are copied everywhere, each app, service or applet contains a copy of everything it uses. That's very bad and afaik it's not going to be fixed because that's the way Rust works. There are other good terminal emulators like kitty - GPU rendered, ligatures and no memory overhead. Actually kitty is even lighter than gnome-console! Yes, it seems trivial to optimize multiple terminal to one process but it's not even in the issue list. It's trivial to do so with GLIB - just use GApplication and let it handle multiple instances for you. But I don't know if ICED has the same functionality. If yes, why it's not used? As for now cosmic-term, despite it's good rendering (but neither best nor unique), is simply one of the worst terminal emulators one can use. I'm worried all COSMIC apps will suffer from Rust and the whole desktop will suck because of high memory usage, big binaries and slow app startups.
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
@@mieszkomazurek3033 Maybe I should explain how alphas work. Not everything is implemented or optimized. Many things won't have issues. The software is in a state where only the development team is using it. The libcosmic toolkit supports application instances. And there's no issue with applications being statically linked.
@skelebro9999 2 ай бұрын
100 views in 4 minute. Fell off.
@Darkstring 2 ай бұрын
1000 in 30 minutes... Tru
@-aexc- 2 ай бұрын
i would be so excited for cosmic if it didnt just look like gnome but renade by people with no design sense. like I dont mind plain looking stuff (i use sway very close to stock) but it looks like a bad user theme
@PsycosisIncarnated 2 ай бұрын
Nice soyjack thumbnail.
@Beryesa. 2 ай бұрын
I'm not really interested about iced but smithay people are so nice and the docs might as well just surpass wlroots with this support (ꈍᴗꈍ)
@Alex_whatever 2 ай бұрын
Titling window managers are NOT designed for everyone. It will NOT fit everyone's workflow. It works best when someone is extremely focusing on the keyboard and wanting to view multiple things at the same time without switching or toggling a lot of mouse activity. Anyone who wants single extended window or mouse-centric workflow, would want to avoid the titling managers. Why do you make it seem that mouse-centric window managers are crap when that is entirely just your opinion because it fits the way you like to work, Brodie?
@BrodieRobertson 2 ай бұрын
There's no reason at all you can't heavily use a mouse in a tiler, I have always done so. This idea that everything has to be done with a keyboard is a hold over from terrible youtube videos. But my main point is most people don't even have the first clue about whether a tiler will fit there workflow because they've never actually tried one, they're scared away by the configuration. COSMIC completely removes that configuration barrier
@azenyr 2 ай бұрын
I'm actually sad that instead of investing dev time and money into expanding and helping an existing project like GNOME or KDE, S76 just decided to heavily invest on their own independent and completely different DE, using different toolkits and different themes and ways. They are investing more money into more fragmentation. Next they will create their own compositor, then their own display driver, their own packaging format, their own store, add subscription services and then eventually change their name to Canonical (remember Unity, Mir, Snaps and Snap Store, Ubuntu Pro etc). And now seeing that this DE will actually be an amalgamation of Qt, GTK and "Ice" apps, all with their own theeming and ways of functioning and different UI/UX, just adds to the idea that Cosmic will feel very bloated and with random parts put together with zero harmony and integration and zero ecosystem feeling.
@idk-sy3iu 2 ай бұрын
Welcome to Linux
@cameronbosch1213 2 ай бұрын
The problem is GNOME is nearly impossible to work with and KDE Plasma may be a bit too difficult for complete beginners to Linux. COSMIC might be a good middle ground.
@cameronbosch1213 2 ай бұрын
Also, I doubt they’re going to become another Canonical.
@sheikhshakilakhtar1865 2 ай бұрын
How will you "help" an existing project if your goals and ideas are not compatible with the foundational goals and principles of the existing ones? >"Next they will create their own compositor, then their own display driver, their own packaging format, their own store, add subscription services and then eventually change their name to Canonical (remember Unity, Mir, Snaps and Snap Store, Ubuntu Pro etc)." I don't see how you have reached this conclusion but is that a bad thing? Businesses need to expand and diversify. Do you have any ideas? >"And now seeing that this DE will actually be an amalgamation of Qt, GTK and "Ice" apps, all with their own theeming and ways of functioning and different UI/UX, just adds to the idea that Cosmic will feel very bloated and with random parts put together with zero harmony and integration and zero ecosystem feeling." This is debatable and one can say the same about any DE, since you will need to install apps which are do not use the default toolkit of your DE.
@excidium_ 2 ай бұрын
From their position it just makes sense to be in control of their desktop, with gnome or kde they're just another stakeholder among many. We've seen how many MRs become endless discussions and never move forward because nobody can agree on anything, you people seem to live in some sort of idealized FOSS world sometimes
@lx2222x 2 ай бұрын
Cosmic UI is trash
@mmstick 2 ай бұрын
This comment is trash
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