Thanks Brother Lemonie for sharing a wonderful DCS video.... Love and respect from Pakistan... 🇵🇰🇵🇰❤️ Long live PAF..... 👍👍👍

The second you got in a rate-fight on the deck I smelled trouble. The F-16 in DCS is widely suspected of having far inferior performance in this compared to the genuine article. If you feel like reaching out to ED as a SME it may be beneficial to the model. Edit: Just saw the drag race and knew the outcome before it started. The widely accepted way to win in an F-16 if a F-18 tries to drag you into a rate fight is not to, i.e. extend and recommit. I haven't heard as many F-16 virtual pilots complain about the F-16's acceleration since it benefits them, lol.

...am I imagining it or does your voice tighten up like you're "Hicking" through heavy G's sometimes?

These dog fights make me wonder why the millitary has yet to build fighters that shoot missiles backward.

Is landing a fighter jet in dcs as hard as in real life

@G E T R E K T probably enjoying his retirement

Thank You for Your service Sir.!

Crew Chief on F-15's and 16's. We bitched and griped, but would give anything to go back and do it again.

@@59thfsaviation79 Nav Systems for me on A10's 23rd Tac Fighter Wing and RF4C's 363 Tac Fighter Wing. What you talking about, we all wish we could go back. I'm 61 now.

@@silent1967 Hey brother, just turned 69 in October.

Implementing this advice into my life right away

Words to live by

Haha, Longshot occasionally sounds like he's pulling Gs lol.

Lol 7:27

*Lockheed

Happy birthday to the GROUND!

LOL it's one circle, one biiiiiiiig circle....

@@caractacustube Actually, the F-104 had better sustained turn performance than contemporary MiG-21s. Small wings, sure, but also better thrust-to-weight and better thrust-to-drag than the contemporary (early) MiG-21s.

@@bronco5334 Yeah I fly an F104C in Warthunder and it actually turns as hard as you'd want with high energy. The problem is that the aircraft doesn't turn very well below 650mph lol!

Hornet in dcs also kind of out rates everything

@@pandabanana2593 I've flown both in DCS, but mostly Hornet. A properly handled 16 should out rate a Hornet. Much lighter plane.

@@icecold9511 and a whole bunch of folks have shown the hornet to get over 21 degrees a second. It out rates almost everything in dcs.

@@icecold9511 Not true below 20,000 feet. The F-16 is a magnificent machine but the Hornet will outrate it below 10,000 feet. So Sayeth The Holy E-M diagrams...and real live pilots who've fought those training dogfights. The F-16 is at its best above 20,000 feet.

*chuckles in Tomcat*

😂

Lmfao

DCS players telling real pilots they're doing it wrong was almost as cringeworthy as a COD player telling a real US Soldier that he's a coward from suffering PTSD after Afghanistan

Let's just pretend Gonky was in an F/A-18D : )

@@pogo1140 [jeremy clarkson voice] ...or B...... or B....

EFPD!

Yeah, I know. Looked pretty tidy didn't it. I would image he wouldn't have much author over the speed with such a steep approach in a slippery jet.

Yeah! That was so cool to watch. He thought he was pretty much in an emergency and slicked it on a sharp approach. That was awesome!

The E-M diagrams tell the tale. The F-16 SHOULD lose a rate fight on the deck against a Hornet. This is why I fly DCS when I want to look at pretty graphics, but I fly Falcon BMS 4.35 when I want to fly ACCURATELY modelled F-16s. BMS is the superior sim if fidelity to the real aircraft's performance is what you seek.

@@Turboy65 you sure the F-16 should lose a rate fight against a Hornet?

@@tharrrrrrr It's well known that the F-16 rates faster when above 20,000 feet but down on the deck the Hornet makes it around the circle faster, both planes being flown to their limits. Check the published E-M diagrams in their respective technical publications. I like the F-16 better and if there was one aircraft on earth that I would pick to fly ONCE it'd be the F-16, but if it came down to a dogfight with a Hornet, I'd be smart to stay high and fast. The Hornet WILL outrate it down on the deck.

@@Turboy65 The pilots seemed confused when the hornet out-rated the viper down on the deck, so maybe they'd never fought against it at such a low altitude.

@@Turboy65 Im confused by your comment. You say that what is seen matches the EM diagram, but then say that Falcon BMS is the only really good F-16 sim. You seem to be saying that the DCS flight model is mostly correct, but then suggest that it isn't. Please clarify.

That probably won’t happen. Gonky doesn’t have that kind of time

@@CWLemoine understandable!

My thought exactly.

It wasn't live. You didn't miss anything. Thanks for the donation!

@@CWLemoine Good people, good cause.

Awesome indeed! The best part for me was when he realized the Hornet *easily* out rates the Viper (even without using the paddle) and subsequently committed to, and absolutely decimated him in, the 2-circle fight.

@@mortlet5180 Not just the rate... I think that might have also shown the work that the viper needs still.

@@Mark_Point No ED has already adressed and fixed the F-16's g-rate control in the latest update, while still keeping the hard limit of 9.0 G's (which limits how fast the FCS will let you turn, even with plenty of airspeed and the stick pulled back all the way). As far as I understand, their main development focus for now (just looking at the F-16) is mainly concerned with multiplayer game balance, with the biggest changes expected to come to the F-16's radar, specifically sidelone clutter and sensor noise. This should finally bring the Viper's maximum radar detection range (for a fighter-sized target and when flying at high altitudes over terrain) down to the ~30nm goal, although I am unsure if this will be the same over the sea as well. Furthermore, it will give adversaries the ability to fly "under the radar" of the F-16, similar to how the reworked AIM-120C AMRAAM's radar seeker now also works, when the target is flying close to the ground (i.e. Increased sensor noise resulting in less accurate target parameters; A chance to lose the lock entirely, in the ground clutter, even when there is a large closure speed relative to the target, placing it well outside the 'notch'; Also a degraded INS guidance when tracking low flyers.). All of that being said, I still think increased drag or decreased engine performance is likely also a high priority, as it will acheive multiple goals at once: It will severely limit the ability of Viper pilots to exploit the PN persuit guidance laws that the majority of DCS missiles still use. It will also make kinetically defeating missiles much less of an option, without ED having to rework the missiles' performance or guidance logic. Taken together, slowing down the Viper would not only allow for a more balanced BVR fight, but would also reinforce the close range 'notch meta' that they like.

@@mortlet5180 Um... there is no such thing as "balance" in dcs. At all. And there never will be. They have repeated this 15000x over the past how many years. When the eurofighter comes out, all "balance" will be thrown out the window in mp for both bvr and bfm anyways...

@@jonnyj. Agree! This DCS is about the aircraft and not "balancing" for gameplay

Loved Falcon 1-3.0

I dont think he would like it that much, real pikot dont enjoy dcs thst much, and as you can see he wasn't happy with the f16 flight model at all lol

pro gamer vs real pilot

GS is still hiding from the FOH DCS Challenge.

@@cup_and_cone You’re right about that, I wonder what’s holding him back.🧐 I mean he did fight a Rafael Pilot in F/A-18s and Mirages.

This and so much

why does everyone assume 9G accelerate is a fact? if your at 9g and 2 degree's of AoA you'll accelerate like a rocket. if your at 9G and 28 degree's of AoA you'll stall out. reduce to the G's to 2 and stay at 28 degree's of AoA and your still gonna stall out. the Alpha is locking you out of your acceleration and nose authority NOT your g.

@@TheRocketdrive How, exactly, does one attain 9G at 2° AoA? G loads are most commonly a factor when an aircraft is turning, or in any way altering its flight path. As for '9G and accelerating,' I simply repeat what I have heard other Viper pilots in DCS say, which is that the F-16 model in the game is severely underperforming. The IRL F-16 was one of the first negatively stable jets that featured a digital FCS, or Fly By Wire FCS. It was designed for agility and speed and had a thrust to weight ratio higher than 1:1. Whether or not it can accelerate while turning at 9 G is immaterial; the Viper should not have problems with nose authority or agility, and should have an advantage in energy recovery over most (not all, _most_ ) aircraft in DCS.

@@skyhorseprice6591 do you know what AoA or angle of attack is and how it correlates to drag?

@@TheRocketdrive AoA refers to the angle (measured against 0° AoA perfect level flight) at which an aircraft's lifting surfaces (wings, strakes, Canards, basically the entire aircraft) attacks the air. As aircraft turn or climb, in AoA increases as the nose moves. Obviously, the higher the AoA, the greater the drag, particularly in delta wing jets & delta/canard planforms. This is why the Mirage is known for its rapid deceleration during high AoA maneuvers. That big delta wing acts like a giant airbrake, especially during rapid G onset maneuvers with around 25°/second or more turn rates. Generally speaking, drag increases as AoA increases, while airspeed decreases as AoA increases. It requires a jet with a T/W ratio over 1:1 to allow acceleration, or even maintaining the same airspeed, at extreme AoA, due to the tremendous drag incurred by extreme maneuvers found in dogfights. I've seen IRL Viper pilots who fly in DCS state that they should be able to maintain a 9G turn in full burner and be able to either indefinitely maintain the jet's ideal airspeed for the highest, most efficient AoA, or to actually accelerate. Acceleration in Max G turns, of course is dependant upon altitude, external temperature conditions, humidity, and engine efficiency under the current weather conditions at the time of engagement. The whole point was, pretty much all Viper pilots agree that the F-16 in DCS is kinematically underperforming. * Also, extreme G loads like 9G are always the result of extreme course deviations, whether that be rapid onset G from quick turns, or from extreme and violent aircraft oscillations found in post- departure regimes. I cannot think of a single example of any aircraft loading up 9G while performing a 2°/sec turn. G load is _always_ related to deviation from linear straight flight, or to rate of acceleration. We do not possess any aircraft that can accelerate quickly enough to produce 9G in linear acceleration. The cause of this is simple Newtonian physics, ie inertia. Objects in motion will continue to move in a straight line unless acted upon by an outside force. The G load pilots feel is due to the action of control surfaces producing deviations in airflow causing a turn in which inertia wants the pilot's body and the aircraft to go straight, but the aerodynamic forces from the surfaces produce a turn. The higher the airspeed & the tighter the turn, the greater the G.

@@skyhorseprice6591 and that should perfectly explain why "muh plaen dun turn at 9g so is wrong!" is lazy and incorrect critism. the G loading doesnt really matter as much as AoA onset in the turn. If people claimed the 16 was riding/took on too much AoA too fast for it's turn then I could see it, but everyone complaining about Gloading being the problem is like complaining that the F18 is underperforming in BVR because of it's paint color.

No I'm not 😂

lamo thats what the us airforce teach you