I tried both, and the drill press works so much better, you wouldn't believe it. I would just buy the cheapest table top drill press available. They come in handy for many things besides crimping shells.

14:20 think of all the reloading tools you've bought that you no longer use or found a better version of. Different priming tools and methods, case prep tools, primer pockets tools that didn't work at all, stuck case extraction tools (looking at you, Frankford Arsenal). As most people do, I outgrew my first press. It's not wasted at all, it's part of the journey. The first steps of a journey are just as valuable as the last steps, without them you'd never get to where you are.

Overshot cards cost about $9+ for 500, and the plastic overshot discs are $12 for 500, but I got 1000 transparent 3/4" Bingo chips of various colors for $6 and they work perfectly, and if your hulls are not the clear ones, you can still see what you loaded!

Although I'm not a member, The "Reloaders network" store has products made by Nick Ross. he has made many handy tools for shotgun ammunition crafting. he makes quality tools and is a professional in his craft. Also,, I agree with you about the Bilistics products manuals, they are a staple in your library of manuals in shotgun load data. they are the first "Go to" when researching a new load. I'm enjoying the content- Peace, Dave

Cutting your own paper caps could be fun. Use cereal boxes and different cereals for different loads. Cheerios for coyotes. Honeycombs for dove load. Etc., etc.

STRAIGHT CUTS:- instead of putting a tube around the shell, which allows the shell to rotate and flex inward, put a dowel rod inside the shell, gives you more control of the shell and provides support against the cut.

I put a dowel rod inside and cut the hulls off right below the fold crimp. It's easier to cut against something to keep is straight, instead of compressing the shell into empty space. I load my regular load with a shorter wad that I use in my regular folding crimp load, or black powder loads with fiber wads to regulate height in the shell. Overshot wad and an old benchtop drill press. I hold the shell on a piece of plywood with my fingers and run the drill press slow. I put slow even pressure on the handle until the shell starts to spin between my fingers on the wood and it's done. only about 5 or 6 seconds under the crimper. Almost perfect results every time. I think you have way over complicated the whole process. It works very well with paper shells too. Wooden dowel, very sharp knife, all the fixins you intend to put in it, small piece of flat wood for the drill press and a roll crimp tool. The shell will start to spin in your fingers when the plastic gets warm and when it is tight enough on the paper if that's what you're using.

Very. very. VERY informative! Thank you for all you do keeping the tinkering community motivated- you are truly a Mad Scientist at the bench

The drill press may allow for quicker heating. Meaning, less of the plastic will get hot since the RPM will be higher and the heat will be focused on just the part that’s rolling and help prevent that crushing you’re getting.

Keep them coming. Loving this shotgun shot shell reloading

Lots of progress over the last day! I do think a drill press would be useful for two reasons: much higher speeds are available (up to 3000 rpm), and easier to keep the crimping tool square to the hull. Keep up the good work. BTW, the storm front arriving at your place today showed up in North Texas Thursday morning - wind switched direction 180 degrees and increased by over 25 mph in the matter of a few minutes, and temperatures dropped by 20 F in about one hour. Stay warm and safe out there!

Hope everything is well with you, I was really enjoying this shotgun experimentation and your channel in general.

When you’re caught with Vaseline on your “Reloading Bench” again. 😉

Johnny turns shot shell reloading into rocket science great vid thanks

Looks like you really enjoy this. I like the way you come up with different tooling and doo dads. Thanks

Watching that temp fall on the thermometer in the background. It’s 3 degrees here. I know the pain.

Two things about roll crimping: Seriously, use the drill press. And second, all of your roll crimps look fine, no need to beat yourself up on perfection. They will shoot great.

Try the Nick Ross roll crimping tool, you can roll crimp 1/8 to 3/4 of a roll very effortless

Picked up a Harbor Freight bench top press on sale for 60 bucks and it works perfect for these operations.

oh yeah mini shells! I make some 2" and 2- 1-2" buckshot loads from Ballistics manual as well. Being able to stuff 1 oz of buckshot in a 2" shell is astounding to me. Not the best for range, but plenty good for 25 yards.

For your plywood vise drill a couple over sized holes in the jaw pieces and sink a smaller screws (with washers) into the lower piece. Give it some horizontal movement without vertical movement or the jaws falling to the floor every time you move a shell. Then a screw on each side of vise piece and rubber band them together.

There is nothing wrong with the single pin roll crimper, it's the lack of a drill press that is giving you issues. A press is way, way faster. With a press, you can generate more pressure. More pressure=more heat. More heat, faster results. Get you a harbor freight press and one of Ballistic's shell vices. Don't over think this. Long crimps, short crimps, they all shoot. Keep the videos coming. Loving this series.

I would like to say I’m really liking this series. Surprised you don’t have these videos in a play list for when I have to back through and rewatch these videos

I ordered the 4-pin roll crimp tool from precision reloading and seem to have had much better luck than you. For some reason your crimps look a little thicker and flatter than the results I achieved. I was using a shell vise like yours and did not have issue with gun club or cheddite hulls. 3D printing the shell vise with high infill is probably easier and cleaner than using plywood. Just a thought. I’ve made a bunch of barrel vise adapters for holding rifles while cleaning this way and PLA seems to be a pretty good material under compression.

Lol… I noticed the temperature dropping like crazy throughout the video. Good luck with that storm.

You could print out those tubes for cutting the hulls on the 3 d printer. If you want them out of metal, give me the exact measurements that you are after and I'll part some of on my lathe for you to your specs and pop them in the mail

The crimps look fine to me. They don't have to be absolutely one hundred percent scrutinized and perfect

Wait till you try and find loading data for loading my favorite hulls…ACTIVs…I’ve been gifted about 350 brand new skivved unfired 12 gauge hulls by another Cowboy Action shooter who had zero idea on how to load them…my only loading data (pre internet days) came from an old freebie Hodgdon booklet…love my ACTIV no brass base/no resizing needed hulls…they have massive capacity due to their construction…even today they are popular for heavy shot charges…just no steel shot.

Admire your dedication!

Best Christmas present ever! JRB everyday!

27 below here at my house yesterday morning, at least I can watch reloading! since mine is in cold storage now. I'm in Montana

As long as nothing falls out, the crimp is good imo!

Crimps are getting better a drill press will help !thanks for sharing your experience

Sorry!! I just laughing my ass right now!! I been reloading shotshells for 50 years!! What a messy videos I ever seen!! I'm speechless

Those rolls crimps should give you a tighter pattern for longer ranges than the standard fold crimp. Most good factory turkey loads are rolled. That being said you can load a hellish 2.75 shell with good plated shot, hodgen longshot, Winchester AA or gun club hull using your waa12r wad. I can tell you love to tinker but that’s good cause I like to watch! Good luck

Good series you are doing

My buddy had a .410 bolt action and that one kicked like a MULE! We all hated shooting that one!

I'm not sure if it's been said, but look into the 4 pin roll crimping tool sold at Reloaders Network. It is a fantastic tool

Looking at you trimming away that plastic without finger protection is spooky. May I advise "whistlers finger protection". I think that will save you the next years some pain and blood. Nice videos. Thanks!

Look at GAEP roll crimp tools. They produce some of the best role crimps I have ever seen.

Awesome video and I dont load shotgun. The storm is blowing though northern Minnesota past few days. -15f 45 mph winds. Hunker down.

I'm down in SW Louisiana and been in the deer stand all day. At daylight it was 15 degrees with a 1 degree windchill. We don't get weather like this down here I've only hunted in stuff like this when I travel way up north where I go chase things like mule deer elk and moose. But I've never shot shotshells with roll crimps so this is all new for me. I was thinking about getting into loading shotshells because I load for everything else but now I'm not so sure. I just want to load turkey and buck shot maybe some 2.75 low/high brass stuff to hunt rabbits and squirrels. Sometimes Walmart isn't so bad... LOL

Love to see you do some roll crimps on slugs

The life of a fabricator, solving your own problems. Great idea.

Bingo chips are the perfect overshot card

I saw bingo chips work great. Also I do roll crimp I just hold the shell in hand on drill press table.

When you decide on the vice block, you could attatch one seide to the bottom blocks and only one side would need to move.

Watching the temp tank over the video was nuts.

I’d def use an abrasive cut off disk and or saw or some kind over a knife. Straight cuts will absolutely matter I’d also use a drill press

Shannon, they look fine for doing it by hand. As for the temp, it was -7 when I left for work this morning, and never got over 0 here in central Ky where I was out delivering parts today.

Johnny! Starline is making 6arc brass now. Would love to see you make a comeback and kick it off with 6arc

Nice see you getting it figured out. I love shooting 3 inch pretty munch what I shoot if I'm hunting with 12ga with 5 or 6 or 4 shot. The semi auto handle them lot better on recoil my Hatfield SAS felt recoil is have of what my mossberg 500 is and lighter gun.

Watching some of your older videos, and just wanted to toss out that stock fit in shotguns is huge when it comes to perceived recoil. It’s often overlooked, especially by folks who are more focused on rifles/pistols. Hope you got your turkey!

I used my Harbor Freight Bench top cut-off saw & it works GREAT for shortening these hulls, much easier than cutting with a knife. I made a Jig out of wood to lay the shell in & mark it for the correct length.

i thought the short shells on the thumbnail was a joke about the cold and small PP's... anyway nice video!

Simple the hulls are made of plastic, plastic being a bi-product of oil means that when you use oil or vaseline it tends to melt the plastic that is why you do not use anything oil based products on things that are rubber or plastic instead you use silicone however to use some oil based products for roll crimping on shells that are going to be used relatively soon is acceptable but if you store the shells for a long period of time the oil will cause the plastic to deteriorate over time.

Up here in PNW, it's already been snowing, freezing...I hate shooting in this stuff because I can never find my brass....

I found smooth hulls like double A are easier to get roll crimped than the hulls with the vertical lines. I think because they are thinner i mostly roll crimp slugs i cast.

When everyone says "use a drill press" sometimes it's counter-intuitive to go against commonly held, experienced based advice.

Back when I did shot shell loading the Winchester AA was my favorite hull for reloading.

They have a jig for 12ga shotgun for the Harbor Freight saw to cut them. I have one. It works excellent...

Johnny's 12 Days of Christmas!

Buy a quality trimming tool like a GAEP and get hulls the same length. Figure out the powder and shot charge you want and cut hull to be 1/8 over the shot card. Use a drill press with the stop set where you want. You’re doing a lot of work and not getting any kind of consistent shell.

Made a recliner clamp for all sizes needs work,,think the single holder is best !🦆

Your roll crimps look just fine to me, even the one that's not quite level. There are things you can get like a GAEP BN2 crimp finisher to add a taper and make it look pretty, but plenty of people (and my experience) have/has shown that it doesn't have to be showroom floor polished to give good results in a scatter gat. For roll crimps, I find that about 0.200" is the minimum I need above the overshot card.

I like the old school manual tabletop crimper

I enjoy recoil. The 3.5" magnums are absolutely brutal though.

While the hull vice you came up with isn't what I was visualizing, it's an excellent choice based upon performance. Still think a pliers type arrangement would be easier, but I can't fault your choice in the slightest amount (it works). What you came up with is excellent. Regarding the roll crimp, you still have a ways to go. Every example you showed ALSO showed evidence of "melting" plastic. Properly done, there is ZERO melting. A properly roll crimped shell will have a smooth radious, (not flattened) crimp.

Tapered hulls like those remingtons are a pain in the butt to deal with. I just throw those away. I like the federal 12 gauge. The tapered hulls in 410 seem to be easier to deal with. But I am mostly a straightwall hull fan One thing I noticed on your reloading bench. It looks like you have a Winchester tapered hall 12 gidge Shorty. I heard that's kind of dangerous to deal with. I did a Remington tapered in Shorty and it was a dud.

Thanks, Shannon 😁

This I like😊

There are shell cutters , and end trimmers

I cut shells with a razor blade and pipe and in the end bought one of the Ballistic Products trimmer.

Tried to send you a pic. But a got a mini drill press adapter if you will that uses a drill. I use it with a 4 pin crimper and a hull vise. Works great

If you have a 3d printer print a hull cut off tool...I bought one from a fella off ebay a few years ago for 16 ga..u can adjust the cut off length w a screw adjuster. Pretty neat how it works

I use my dewalt miter saw with a homemade wood jig for cutting hulls. Takes no time at all.

Try running the roll crimper counterclockwise. Due to the position of the pin in the BPI roll crimper, running it CCW pulls the hull material towards the centre of the hull. Running it CW means that the pin is trying to push the material in the wrong direction.

👍😀‼️

Use the wife’s hair curling iron. Shove it in the crimped hull slowly spin it around and watch the crimps disappear.

Could you just 3d print youre shell holder you used in the wise? For the height part and then the two pieces of the actually wood that pinches the shell? Just a thought. Love the new daily videos! Keep it up

A drill press makes many of the operations simpler .

I have heard of guys 3D printing there own role crimper with 4 of the bumps in it. I have the same role crimping unit you have as well and it does suck. I wish I had the skills to modify mine and add 2 or 3 pins to it. Because it was expensive however with that said I got mine like 5 years ago. When everyone was doing the birdshot conversations to slugs.

Looks like he's making single use roll crimps as in throw it away after use because he melted the roll crimp. You can have 1/2 the hull rolled as it will reach all the way down to the overshot card so don't freak out about an exact measurement like he is, and a little lube on the roll crimper will do wonders for not melting the hull.

Harbor freight is having a 10% of anything. Take the opportunity and go get a 6" table top one.

I am not a reloader, yet. I'm also not a woodworker, yet... but I've watched a lot of videos on both. I remember seeing a little portable drill guide that you mount to your drill to make it drill straight. You could mount that over your vice and keep everything square, maybe. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/ncuTZ9tllpe9fWg.html

Don’t think crooked finished crimps hurt up to 22degrees ..even then note sealing differences// smoke levels on lip .. Cool to be able to use shells down to what length??? =short slugs ,cool !

Seems a drill press would provide a more consistent and measurable crimp.

Also I would think that cutting the hulls back using a drill press and your clamp would make it easier to get it square.

I use the Michael's 3/4" hole punch. Use it sitting on the table as its designed. Holding in your hand and squeezing it will break it. The 5/8" works for 20g.

Forcing cone may help a bit with recoil, gun weight will make more difference, or going to an autoloader, but, you do wnat a heavier one, not a light one.. Seems to me if you are going to do a bunch of this, a used small countertop drill press would be worth your while, quite useful to have around a gun/reloading bench anyway.

I’m glad you enjoyed Dave’s video!

Next stop is the EMERGENCY ROOM people....... Everyone has 5 grand to pay that bill. This guys buys new human eyes at walmart and new human faces at Lowes I guess.

You need to look at some of the other shell trimmers on KZfaq. Some are very simple and very accurate and very fast.

Etsy dremmel saw time cutting those hulls

I have used an old vintage roll crimper for 16g. It must be a hundred years old. It clamps to your bench.

I have never reloaded shotgun shells in my life but I'm wondering if you could use something a bit more spongy as shot card material. When you are crimping it would get slightly smashed but then it would spring back and fill in those gaps.

Throw that BP roll crimper away and get a Reloaders Network 4 pin one. It is the best one there is.

I'm loading 20G buckshot with BA supplies. I bought new hulls and they roll nicely, but they don't look just like yours. Yours appear to curl all the way under. I only roll my down until what was the leading edge of the hull mouth, squarely contacts the overshot card. Maybe try adjusting your column up a tad and crimp a little less hard.

This seems like entirely too much work to load some shotshells. When my partner used to load them for trap competition, he loaded hundreds in the time it’s taking you to do a few. Everything was done on the press, standard crimp. I can’t see that a roll crimp provides enough of a benefit to take that much extra time.

Have you tried a little light oil on the edge of the hull?