The thing that really stuck with me was Crow's line about what we're doing "even though they have the light". Light has never been an indicator of morality, we've always known about the warlords as 'evil' lightbearers. Light doesn't make a saint and darkness doesn't make a sinner

I'd like to point out Saladin's line "38 lives to spare 1". He remembers exactly how many people he killed that day. The Dark Age is considered ancient history, remembered by few. That is quite telling of what kind of man Saladin is.

I’ve been loving Saladin in this season so far. It’s a lot of a parallel with Season of the chosen and The most stark thing is that while Saladin has changed, he’s still stayed to his core of who he is. A grizzled veteran of war.

This is bungie's storytelling at its best. The cutscene with the black and white color story telling is always my favorite cutscene style but this cutscene alone really gives the idea of being a guardian is both a blessing and curse and Saladin knows it best. Not many people knows that Saladin has moments where he suffers from depression and ptsd from living thousand of years and seeing so many stuff happened.

I honestly would love a tv show about the Dark Ages that would be a collection of short stories like this, and small story arcs like The Clone Wars.

This cutscene singlehandedly completely changed how I view Saladin, bravo Bungie. I viewed him as unnecessarily cruel and unconcerned with the morality of what happens so long as he protects people. I now know differently. I dont *agree* with him but i completely understand him

This cutscene just helps with my admiration of Lord Saladin as one of my favorite characters. I really like the development he has gone through. P.S. I still wish Titans had cloaks

When Saladin spoke of the Dark Age, it lets my imagination run wild! Would love to have more Dark Age stories! Also, seeing AKs being used by the bandits reminds me of how Zavala carried an M4 with a carry handle during his story trailer. Small touches like that make you wonder when the Golden Age ended.

Saladin represents one of my favorite tropes in writing. He's a good guy, but he's not soft. A dark knight to contrast crow's glistening white

this story feels like the collision between new players who dont see why so many enemies need to be killed, they look to the caitals cabal and the house of light as examples of how enemies can become allies. while the old players know the previous states of the last city like the red war, the battle of twilight gap and the tragedy on the moon against crota. in other words the new players havent experienced a true disaster, while old players are all too aware of how quickly things can go wrong.

I'm so glad we got that cutscene. Saladin is such an underused and thus misunderstood character. He's endured more than any of our allies, even Eris, Mara, and Saint.

That convo and cutscene felt like two equally naive men, one who can't understand war and one who has seemingly never understood what lasting peace requires, trying and failing to find middle ground between mercy and cruelty

A lot of people gave Saladin crap back in Chosen. I'm glad this season is highlighting his character.

Zavala, Saint, Saladin, Shaxx.... man, Titans are surprisingly huggable people for being hulking war machines.

Saladin’s story must have hit Crow /hard/, considering that Uldren’s mercy for the Fanatic led to the creation of the Scorn. EDIT: I am aware that Uldren was very likely being influenced by Riven at that time, but even before that point it was clear that Uldren had a lot of sympathy and pity for the Eliksni.

This season seems to me like Zavala and Saladin are both teaching Crow these lessons, not just about mercy specifically, but also how to lead and be a leader and what it means; the things you have to keep in mind and the perspectives you have to see and why. Who gets hurt or killed if you don't. The Psiops dialogue really nails it home. They're helping him to cope with his grief from last season so he doesn't get himself or others hurt (IE: Reckless Endagerment lore) but also its clear to me they're grooming him for a higher role of responsibility. Maybe an open Vanguard position? 🤔

I want to see Crow develop and mature his current compassionate, empathetic view of the world rather than simply adopt a view more similar to Saladin. Not because I think Saladin is wrong, that's a different discussion, but because it feels like an appropriate development for Crow as a character. Realistically he could go many directions, but remaining true to his empathetic self while shedding the naivety born of inexperience would be awesome to see and would make him stand out as a character. He's unique in this way. I guess to put it another way, I want to see Crow learn from Saladin and incorporate his starkly contrasting teachings into his own view on morality while remaining true to and building upon the compassionate, empathetic foundation he's developed thus far.

Crow and Saladin are definitely gonna become besties. They’re perfect for each other. Saladin, the oldest (or at least one of) guardian on our team, experienced and knows war in and out, but is jaded and inflexible in his ways. Crow, the youngest on our team, is empathetic and has a fresh perspective, but is naive and doesn’t fully grasp that sacrifices must be made. They’ve got a lot to learn from each other and will absolutely open each other’s eyes to a wider perspective.

I was arguing about this scene and Saladin as character in a discord recently. People are saying this scene changed how they look at Saladin as if they thought he was just some genocidal maniac before. And for the life of me I can't see how people got that interpretation of Saladin. Sure he was going a bit crazy in Season of the Chosen and everyone was calling him out for it, but it's the response to that push back is what makes him ultimately a good man. Instead betraying anyone or going against Zavala's orders, he obeyed then and sided with Zavala's command and the city. He was salty about it but he put duty and the city before his bitterness. And that is what makes him cool. There's also the instance where Saladin was approached by a group of Eliskni and they asked could they participate in the Iron Banner. If he was a bloodthirsty racist that people thought he was (for no reason in my opinion) he would have let them in and let them get murdered since they can't be rezzed. But he instead let them build guns and armor in honor of not only the Iron Banner but also the Eliskni themselves (Marks, cloaks and Bonds have Eliskni eggshells on them). With all this being said Saladin is a way more nuanced character than people give him credit for and it has ALWAYS been there way before this cut scene came out. He actually more reasonable and nuanced than Crow this point. Crow is actually being annoying and acting like anime protagonist by trying to have sympathy and flirting with the idea of befriending hive because they have been blessed with Light. Sorry for the rant. The argument ina discord I mentioned earlier is recent so I'm fresh off of that lol EDIT: TL;DR version. Saladin is a Realist and Crow is a Pacifist. However, I trust Saladin to put the guns down(because he has shown he can and had) way more than I trust Crow to stop being a pacifist.

“Mercy to an enemy can not come at a cost of mercy for their victims the right path isn’t always easy to find but once you do but once you do the only question Is if your strong enough to walk it”

Always been a fanboy of Saladin since D1 when the Iron Banner first came, I remember the mystery behind him was one of the main things I liked about him. Seeing and hearing this and how other people are now understanding him more is nice

Damn that was a hell of a speech from Saladin. His voice actor is top notch

I love these inked out scenes more and more with every one I see. They tend to cover some moral quandry or question some truth we were once certain of, and the play of black and white against a gray backdrop sets the perfect tone for them.

I'm with Saladin. As a lore enthusiast, I'm well aware of the MULTIPLE occasions Hive has captured guardians and slowly and methodically killed them in the most painful ways possible. Striped the light from them like you would peel an orange, and sometimes flesh came along with it. if you need more examples, go talk to Eris, I'm sure she has some nightmares she could give you. If there was another way, I'd feel different. but the hive has a fascination with death. They do not fear it, they embrace it. How do you interrogate something like that? Something that has nothing you can do or take from it? You can't. These hive are mostly braindead, so it's the best we can do to get intel while being the most ethical we can be. It's better than the hive has done to us, so good enough for me.

Saldins story he told crow, gives a new meaning to " a victory at the cost of the innocence is no victory at all" his mercy to the girl is his small little victory, and her betrayal being the cost of the innocence.

As much as it sounds like a lot, I hope we get another cutscene like this one, but a story of Crow's, from his limited time as a Lightbearer, that helps put things in perspective for Saladin as well. And ultimately helps them realise each other's points, if not agree wholeheartedly.

This season is looking really good in terms of story. Really loving the added depth to Saladin’s character.

I'm with Saladin on this, mercy for the enemies can't take precedence over mercy for their victims...

As cold as it sounds, I completely agree with Saladin. Morality becomes muddy when it comes to survival and war and the fight with the Lucent Hive is one of the closest and most personal threats we have seen since the Red War in these games so we can, have and will have to make some concessions as this conflict plays out and The Witness draws ever closer. It parallels the idea that we have taken on darkness to serve our fight for humanity and the traveller. That said, I love what Bungie has done with the current stories because there are so many ways to read these developments moving foward

I really like how bungie put these two different sides together. I think they can both learn something from each other. Saladin could use a new light to show him something new, and Crow needs someone who can guide him. Show him that like Saladin said, making the hard choice. Poor Crow had "Osiris" as a mentor who we all know turned out to be. Having an older guardian guide him is what he needs.

My only lore gripe is some characters seem to miss logic that the player has. Like here, yes torture and interrogation is not good but neither is war, and in war you seek to defeat the enemy. Not to mention I bet it wasn't painless for the guardians we see in psiops to get drained of their light. Also, in lore they said it was mostly painless so what else can you ask for. Loving the story an VA so far especially multiple characters being used here including eris. Thanks for the vids glhf Byf

Do you think the hive think twice when they’re draining a guardian’s light or turning them into a crystal?

I can only point out that the Hive are responsible for the extinction of who can imagine how much life in the universe.

Saladin is literally that quote from Wreck it Ralph. "Just because you are bad guy, does not mean you are *bad* guy."

the conversation between zavala and saladin, and thinking about all that zavala has lost really makes me cry. and in the eyes of saladin I don't see who can deserve mercy.

New Byf video! Instant serotonin

One of my favorite videos. Keep it up!

Crow is very consistent in his ideas of mercy, he continues to speak up about not just killing everyone we face.

I can't wait to see the lore video on the raid to come. And yeah, I agree with Saladin on this one.

Saladin says its best "while they got the light they are still hungry for ours and will kill us for it". They had a taste, they got a meal, now they want the whole kitchen.

I was afraid with everything conflict related being on such a grand scale, we'd lose the opportunity to get more of these grounded stories from the survivors of the Dark Age here on Earth.

Bungie is doing a fantastic job with all the characters this season! And this particular cast of speaking characters and the ones mentioned in seasonal weapon lore tabs, sets up so many interesting possibilities for next seasons

Does anyone else get chills when Byf says his outro

It's interesting to see the difference in Crow as his character keeps developing over time! Uldren always seemed like a BA character but with a week side of being very emotionally dependent on his sister Mara; while Crow seems like he has the potential to be an incredible hunter, but has this reclusive personality - more emo than dependent. Since he's being paired up with Saladin it seems likely he could end up being our new Hunter Vanguard (what rich irony). I would love to see a video on the history of Uldren and how different he truly is from Crow, and your predictions for the future of that character!

"I have no mouth and I must scream" comes to mind with regards to the state the light bearing Hive are forced into.

I don't know if anyone else got this voice line, I have over 60 runs of the arena and only got this line once. I went something along the lines of Crow asking Caitl how the mindscape works, and other details. What I got from that line is it could be very likely that crow himself wants to enter the mindscape to confront his memory of uldren and perhaps even kill uldren with the spear. Then again I could be reaching but it very well could be a story point in this season. Other characters such a Caitl herself used the device to confront memories of Calus, and Saint 14 tried asking Mithrax could he go in to Osiris mind to help him. I would very much like a round 2 with Uldren.

the amount of newly forming relationships is amazing, saladin and crow’s “father son” relationship, zavala and ciatal’s potential marriage. awesome stuff

I feel like “fantastic” is actually underselling just how incredible this cutscene was. This is a new high for seasonal storytelling for the average player, for those who don’t read the lore books.

Mynameisbyf: The evolving relationship between Saladin an- Saladin: LORD Saladin…. Mynameisbyf: Right…..

Congrats on Dynasty my man! That's phenomenal!!!

The issue I continue to have with Salad man is his fervent belief that as long as humanity survives the war crimes committed are justified, while also crying about how the Hive, Fallen, and Cabal use the same logic to justify their own actions. The kicker is always when the worm talks to us in wellspring, echoing Fikruul's lines of "do you really kill for the safety of humanity, you kill as much as we do without even a second thought to your actions. Have you ever considered what you are doing is wrong?" Of course both the worm and Fikruul are hardly benevolent, but it is interesting to see that after the Speaker's death, the Vanguard has been less and less leaning on moral standards and slowly doubling down on Sword logic, A fact that the Darkness and Savathun has made clear to us.

I agree with Saladin that Crow probably shouldn’t be involved since he’s too sympathetic. The fallen and cabal I can understand, because we have alliances with them, but the hive (despite wielding the light) don’t deserve any sympathy or mercy. Crow really shouldn’t question Saladin, he’s lived through the dark age and the age of warlords (i.e. humanity at its worst), and is the sole-surviving iron lord. Long story short, you shouldn’t question the judgment of the most grizzled war veteran of destiny.

I personally believe that this season happens before the big revelations Savathun and the Hive were chosen by the Traveler. Because any other time frame would just feel wrong because they still think that the light was taken. Even though it was explicitly not.

My friends and I were talking about this very topic the other day. I honestly expect one of the seasons this year to be “Year of the Vanguard” with Crow being chosen as the Hunter Vanguard

This expansion is AMAZING! I have a question for you, and I wouldn't trust anyone else's answer. How does Savathun still have a throne world without her worm, and how does it still exist after her death? Always great content. Thank you for your hard work, and dedication to storytelling.

Nobody gonna mention that Psion's badass gaming chair.

In all seriousness, Crow is fast becoming my favorite character

During season of the chosen, Crow trolled Saladin every time he had the chance. I loved it. But with a 5 minute story, Saladin burned Crow so badly, that even the Drifter was drooling at all that cooked meat. All jokes asidd, this story help us understand Saladin a bit better. We need season of iron/wolves. The iron lords need more story. Edit: since people does not know how to read and lacks reading comprehension, I'll have to say it. I know about SIVA and the dead of the iron lords from D1. Season of the iron...wow...season of something...a side story that expands on the lore, giving us more activities and lore...where have I heard that...splicer? Chosen? Hunt? I don't know, I might br high...making seasons and season passes to expand on something makes no sense in destiny. (Sarcasm)

The point of the cutscene speaks directly about the fact that Saladin felt bad for not dealing with the situation in the right way (killing the girl). Its a hard choice but when you know the outcome it's a question of if you can do it.

the moment Crow earns Saladin's respect and him to understand the hard truths Saladin is trying to impress on him will be glorious.

Good luck for the raid 👍

Bungie has recently started to kind of humanize the other races. Eliksni, Cabal and now the Hive. I believe some time ago there was a voice line from crow where he was theorizing about all the races coming together to fight the common enemy. I would be surprised if Bungie didnt end up having us team with all the races to fight the darkness. Maybe in Lightfall?

Perfectly came across this video as I just finished this cutscene

My name is byf video? Clicked immediately

Maybe it’s because of my more progressive values on mass incarceration, prison reform, torture, etc., but I’m personally not the biggest fan of Saladin’s outlook on all this. The strongman “Doing what had to be done”, “leading with an iron fist” rhetoric, we’ve seen where that leads. He’s bordering on pre-crime with his “Mercy” story too. Props to Bungie’s writing that allows a pretty deep analysis of these characters 👍 I’m also generally more partial to Crow due to the whole House of Light stuff too though, so that might play a part. This seasonal story is shaping up to be as interesting as the campaign for me.

Good luck to you and your mates tomorrow! My team and I are prepared and raring Togo!

Confirmed Denzel Washington to play our mighty Lord Saladin in up coming Sony Destiny inspired film lol

When I watched the cutscene, I saw the girl and pointed at the screen and shouted "EFRIDEET!!!?!?!" i was incorrect

This was one of the best cutscenes on ink to date. Just hitting every mark

The seasonal story is amazing, that cutscene was incredible

@mynameisbyf do you know what soundtrack it is you used at 15:28? It’s the same one that’s in the mercy cutscene and I can’t find it

when he hit'em w/the "you new light' jab you know it hit.lol

I wonder how terrified that women became when Saladin started to kill her group and took back his amulet

Congtrats on movie of the week BIG MOVES!

I like that you intentionally or unintentionally used the name of a gun while talking about Uldren.

Show of hands: If it was Reksis Vahn, the Hangman, who here would even *care* how much it hurt? Now remember that these Lucent Hive Commanders did the same thing that the Scorn Barons did to Cayde, killing him and ripping away his Light, and they did it to *multiple* Guardians The only difference is that these Guardians died offscreen and nameless. Nameless to us, but someone, somewhere, knew them like we knew Cayde. Ask *them* if they care how much it hurts. Also, is it really a war crime if the one getting tortured has committed exponentially worse atrocities and called them all "Tuesday" since long before humans were even a link in the evolutionary chain?

Once Saladin orders crow to slaughter the Hive younglings we'll really get the Palpatine/Darth Vader duo going. I feel like the whole 'grey area morality' thing doesn't work as well in a game where we can't make any choices. I liked it way better in the Witcher for example

I'm borderline not a Lore guy but I follow it as a whole.. But this story was amazing and the graphics, the meaning behind the lesson was just amazing.

What Saladin understands but Crow doesn’t is that Mercy is an escape from justice, NOT justice itself. That act, while can be kind, it can also be very costly.

13:45 whether he wanted it or not, crow stepped into a war with the cabal on mars

I love the absolute takedown of all the people who were complaining about Zavala, especially in Forsaken. Of course he would have loved to burn the reef down till he got vengeance for Cayde but a leader who puts his personal feelings over the safety of the people he leads is no leader at all.

I tend to lean towards Crow. Crow calls it torture, Saladin (and the Cabal) call it "advanced interrogation techniques". If we, as guardians don't give our enemies mercy, we're no better than the monsters we fight. But, hey, every villain is the hero of their own story.

I really want to see where they take Zavala with this story. For the sake of humanity he is willing to take the burden and allow these experiments to happen. Zavala will have to make other very hard decisions throughout this season. It is real exciting to think that we will probably to see more of what Zavala was like before he had calmed down. I really hope we get a cutscene of him and Saladin.

We definitely need more lore/cutscene to the dark ages or even middle of the collapse or aftermath

Glad you cleared it up I thought the story was a threat from Saladin to Crow to not think he wouldn't kill him if he stepped outta place

My narrative hopes/ dream for Crow is he understands/ learns about things and either he or Zavala (hopefully Crow) about becoming Hunter Vanguard

I loved this entire exchange between Saladin and Crow. Usually I'm with Crow - but this time I just couldn't. The Hive aren't gonna be the good guys just because they have the light. The Light is just New Powers, it's not gonna suddenly give them morality and empathy when their culture is literally 'kill or be killed'. They don't HAVE mercy. To the Hive, the Light is just a new weapon to kill everything with. I mean, if a band of Hive approached the Guardians peacefully and with actual intent to have a peaceful discussion, I'm all for it, but Crow has lessons to learn this season. I just hope he doesn't get himself hurt...

Saladin is one of the best written characters recently, even if I find him reprehensible. The dynamic between him and Crow is perfect to flesh this out and let the player realize that even lightbearers we know are capable of cruelty and evil. It dovetails really well with the discovery that Savathun was chosen by the Traveler to show that the Light isn't about morality, but about perseverance and power.

That Saladin cutscene gave me Witcher vibes and im here for it

Saladin would probably get along well with Geralt of Rivia

You know, I bet if Mara Sov were there, she would take Saladin's side. I'm sure the sting of being betrayed by the Eliksni House of Wolves still haunts her. And I see where Saladin's story comes from, I do. I just have a question: What happens if Saladin gets his way and mercy happens once in a blue moon? The way I see it, there wouldn't be anyone left to forgive because the majority if not everybody would wind up dead. I'm not saying mercy shouldn't be given out on tap, but it shouldn't be sliced up in thin slices and only given when someone is on the brink of starvation. Because, at that point, we would be nothing less than a mindless animal killing at the mere smallest of grievances. And, as a Guardian, that would be counter-productive.

This story bit was really good

Crow needs to accept who he is as uldren sov in order to develop as an individual rather than some puppet.

I think it's an interesting dichotomy of recent seasons. The Eliksni of House Light and the Cabal of the Empire Reborn seem to have firmly landed on the side of actual people who we should show mercy to, while the Hive of the Lucent Brood seem to have just as firmly landed on the side of monsters we should kill on sight and not even feel bad about. I know this is the big first reveal, and House Light were the non combatants fleeing House Redemption (? Whatever Eramis named her stasis house?) before they showed up in Season of the Splicer. Will we see more Fynchs in the future? A member of the Hive who wasn't immediately indoctrinated by the Lucent Broods dark methods hinted at in the Last Chance mission? Will Immaru show up as a major player? (That last one I certainly hope for, if only so he can do yeehaw dunks on us) Its made my longs term thoughts regarding a Team Light vs Team Dark clash a little more uncertain. Will Savathun and the Lucent Brood be a permanent third player or member of "Team Grey", or is this sort of a Frieza situation where we do eventually need to begrudgingly team up with our biggest enemy to save the universe?

Fastest I’ve been to a Byf video

I want Saladin (not sure if spelt right) to read audio books. His voice is so good.

So many people think the end all be all moral of this is that the child was inherently evil and so are the hive, but that is only saladins opinion. Can’t wait for you to cover some of these Lucent Moth books 🙏

Moments like these, and what the Vanguard and other Guardians are going through, seem to really highlight on what was introduced in Beyond Light. Eris, Drifter and Elsie have been persuading Guardians and the Vanguard to not only wield dark and light in balance, but by doing so, realizing that light and dark are not tied to morality. It seems it took Savathun being blessed with light for them to realize their perceived dogma was naive. Much like how the “Dark Vanguard” were made up of individuals that had a grey outlook, this expansion and season is falling back to that. If a civil war between guardians doesn’t happen, we will need to embrace light and dark to survive.

I love your videos

Byf is clean rn wtf