This argument brought me to repentence and surrender earlier this year. Thanks Gavin for being a teacher I can learn so much from. Appreciate and love you Brother

Fun fact: Isaiah 53 sounded so much like Jesus that liberal scholars thought for a very long time that it was just a later addition by Christians. The discovery of a near-complete Isaiah scroll dated to the 2nd century BC among the Dead Sea Scrolls completely proved them wrong.

This argument kept me in the faith. When i got to college and began hearing arguments against Christianity it all fell flat because none of it could account for Biblical prophacy. Never heard a prophessor give an intellectual response to Biblical prophacy, because it was clear they had never heard it in all its depth

This is the Primary reason I am a Christian. Followed by personal experience. The Kalam is great for Theism, but Prophecy is what drives me to Christ.

Mike Winger does a wonderful series on evidence for the Bible based on fulfilled prophecy about Jesus. And other prophecies too, including Alexander the Great and Tyre and Sidon and subsequent kingdoms.

The Roman empire provides some examples of prophecies the early Christians didn't have significant control over. The Romans, not Jews or Christians, decided to implement the highly unusual penal practices needed to fulfill passages like Psalm 22 and Isaiah 50:6 (not only the singling out of hands and feet in Psalm 22, but also the implied nakedness, gathering of enemies, etc.). The Romans, not Jews or Christians, crucified Jesus in line with the timing of Daniel's Seventy Weeks prophecy, then destroyed both Jerusalem and the temple. (For more about Daniel 9, see Robert Newman's discussion in his article "The Time Of The Messiah", which can be found online.) Much more could be said here, but I'll briefly make one other point that's often overlooked or underestimated. Jesus could have provoked people to kill him, but he wouldn't have had control over their reaction (by normal means, if he was a normal human). If you provoke people, you might get a response of mockery or pity, for example, rather than the relevant type of anger. You might get anger, but not enough of it to lead to your execution. Or you might get killed the wrong way. Too soon. Too late. In too humiliating a manner. The gospels illustrate that point. They refer to multiple occasions on which people attempted to do something like throw Jesus over a cliff or stone him. You don't even have to go to a Christian source, like the gospels. Look at what Josephus tells us about how one of Jesus' own siblings was put to death. Jesus could have met the same kind of death as his brother, James, and at the wrong time. So, the fact that Jesus' death lines up so well with the Old Testament is significant accordingly. Or think of Isaiah 9:1. Jesus' living in Nazareth (in the region of Zebulun), then Capernaum (in the region of Naphtali) lines up well with the passage in Isaiah 9, and so do his close associations with Galilee more broadly and the Gentiles. Jesus' early residence in Nazareth is unlikely to have been made up by the early Christians (it's reported by multiple sources; it's undisputed early on; Nazareth seems to have had a worse reputation than other cities in the region of Zebulun [e.g., John 1:46], which raises the question of why Nazareth would have been chosen if the location was being made up; Luke's report that Jesus was conceived in Nazareth is unlikely to have been fabricated, given the potential for a conception there to be perceived as inconsistent with Micah's reference to the Messiah's coming from Bethlehem; the opponents of Christianity corroborated Jesus' association with Galilee and Nazareth in particular from the first century onward, repeatedly referring to Jesus and Christians as "Galileans", "Nazarenes", and such for hundreds of years). Bart Ehrman has gone as far as to refer to Jesus' upbringing in Nazareth as "certain": "Little can be known about Jesus' early life, but one thing that can be said for certain is that he was raised in Nazareth, the home village of Joseph and Mary." (The New Testament [New York, New York: Oxford University Press, 2012], 269) For these and other reasons, the geography of Isaiah 9:1 is a good line of evidence to cite in support of Christian prophecy fulfillment. Or think of Jesus' later influence on the world. The Old Testament and Romans 11 give us the unusual scenario of a Jewish Messiah becoming highly influential in the Gentile world alongside ongoing Jewish rejection, but that's what we've seen happen. You can find extensive argumentation for the fulfillment of these and other prophecies at Triablogue. There's a large collection of articles there on Isaiah 9, I wrote a series of posts on the meaning of Micah 4-5 and the evidence for Jesus' Bethlehem birthplace, etc.

Gavin’s great passion for Christ and the Gospel is such that even his apologetics videos (apologetics is often thought of as a dry topic) fill me with immeasurable gratitude and a far deeper faith. Thank God for men like Gavin and above all, thanks be to God the author of our universe for the beauty of Christ, in whom alone all of the world’s deepest longings find their satisfaction.

Yes, I do believe that fulfilled prophecy is often neglected in Apologetics circles. I believe that Isaiah 53 and Psalm 22 would be the two strongest Old Testament texts pointing to the Messiah's death and sacrifice for us all, not only because how specific these two passages are, but also because of the fact that the Dead Sea Scrolls papyri of these two texts were copied at least a hundred years before Jesus was born, proving that Christians didn't tamper with these texts. I believe this is a very strong argument for the New Testament's veracity and claim to be divinely inspired.

Important to note The Dead Sea Scrolls, they confirm that book of Daniel, book of Isaiah and every other book of old testament except Esther, have 100% was written before Christ. Comparasion between the scrolls and our preserved text, clearly shows that it was written before

Looking forward to this! This was the Fathers' favorite argument for scripture. Also, I've never seen so many chapters in a thirty minute video, lol.

This is one of my favorite Bible topics. Thank you for your work!

As Dutch Reformed (continental), I greatly appreciate your work. May the Lord continue to bless your work and further God's Kingdom.

Fulfilled prophecy has helped solidify my faith. I greatly appreciate the time taken to explain this. Thank you.

I just discovered your channel and have been binge watching your videos. You are so eloquent, so well-read, and so incredibly intelligent. I think this is my new favorite channel. The Lord has used your channel to bless me. Please continue making these videos, they’re amazing!

Yessss I just started watching but I am pumped! The prophecy argument is the most neglected for sure but has so much more power than given credit for.

I came to Christ mainly as a result of studying biblical prophecy, including "Late Great Planet Earth," by Hal Lindsey and prophecy is still one of my favorite studies. Thank you for this study and all your work. Chuck Missler has done some excellent studies on this subject.

This is what convinced me as a teenager.

Great video Dr. Ortlund. I know from my Catholic perspective listening to people like Scott Hahn and Brant Pitre, and reading Bishop Barron’s book on Eucharist revival, it’s so amazing how it all just seems to fit-so often in really unexpected ways-but still a perfect fit, the new fulfilling the old, as it were.

I'm totally on board with you on this, Dr Ortlund! Literally today's Gospel reading is "if you destroy this temple, I will rebuild it in three days" (or words to that effect). As we all know, and have confessed for 2000 years, he suffered under Pontius Pilate, died, was buried and rose again. On the third day. I think this is something that all Christians, Apostolic & Protestant alike, can come together on!

What an awesome and frequently neglected subject! Thank you so much for delving into it. I also heartily recommend to anyone watching this, Mike Winger's Biblical Prophecy series where he goes into detail about many fulfilled Biblical prophecies such as the destruction of Troy. The Bible is rich with examples of this. Also, if you have the chance, Mr. Ortlund, could you do an interview/discussion with James White? I recently discovered his lectures and debates and think it would be very interesting to see you two discuss issues like apologetics, cultural outreach, and Roman Catholicism, which you both are very active in enaging. God bless!

I often think the prophecy that Abraham’s national will be a blessing to all nations goes unexplored. Like it’s a pretty wild claim for a small nation and yet how true is it. Even putting Jesus aside, what other group has shaped the world more

This was absolutely wonderful. I've been looking for discussion on this very topic. If you expand this as a series, I imagine it will perform very well. Thank you Dr. Ortlund!

The greatest difficulty I have with this as a Christian who prioritizes historical-critical methodology, is that the definition for prophecy is treated so loosely by evangelicals. Oftentimes we are so quick to inject anachronistic meaning into the Tanakh for the sake of identifying prophecy, when in reality it is not actually prophecy meant to be taken specifically, but literary theme meant to be taken generally.

Thank you for all the incredible content this month

Been loving Gavin’s apologetic work👍. He is very thoughtful with working through these topics in an engaging and fair way

Father hear my prayers. My husband is with you I still miss him even after all these years. At times I feel so alone especially as a single mom. Since suffering a heart attack two years ago and my on going battle with lupus I’m overwhelmed. Both of my sons are autistic. I’m now homeschooling them so my hours to work are limited. BUT I TRUST YOU LORD! I keep faith even as I constantly struggle to provide for my kids and I constantly struggle to buy groceries. Thankfully I have you Lord! I know I’m not alone. Faith over fear! Praise God and his son Yeshua! ❤

Gavin, thank you for your recent apologetics content. It has been so building up for my faith. Namely, this one, and the one on divine hiddenness. Praising God for how you're futhering the Kingdom. Keep going strong!

@20:50 - this point really hits home! Most of this video gave me Holy Spirit chills, well done! Our great God and King and Savior was predicted in the 3rd chapter of the book. One of the other powerful things I find is that the same hill that Abraham goes to sacrifice Issac on is the same hill David put his alter on and Solomon put his temple on and ultimately that same general location that God’s eternal Lamb was sacrificed on. God Bless you and your ministry!

So interesting and inspiring as usual with such a nice personality :-) Thanks a lot brother Gavin! God bless

Fulfilled prophecy is such a fascinating topic. The OT is so awesome!

Hi Dr. Ortlund. Thanks for this video. I'll be posting a response in a week or so. I'll let you know the details when it's ready. Cheers.

Hello, Mr Ortlund. Big fan, and really appreciative of you demonstrating gentleness and the irenic approach. It's helped me grow so much. For anyone who was expecting a different line of evidence, pointing more towards the reliability of the Bible, may I present something for you to start researching: Ezekiel 26 - Tyre will be scraped bare, and fishermen cast their nets there. Alexander stripped the old city bare to create a causeway to the island city. This forced the water currents to flow differently and submerge the old city. You can google map that right this second on your phone. Daniel 11 - Alexander the Great will die, his four generals take over, and the wars between Ptolemy and the Seleucids and who will win each one over hundreds of years of fighting, all the way to Antiochus IV, his persecution of the Jews and profaning of the Temple with a statue of Zeus who he claimed to be manifest on earth. Right to his death being not by the hand of men, as he died of sickness. These wars are known as the Syran Wars, and the Maccabbean Rebellion. Now, in favour of the arguments for Christianity that you present in this video: Summary: "The Bible is so good at continuity it has to be from God. Despite being written by dozens of authors over thousands of years." Are you skeptical? Ever look at continuity errors and bloopers for a TV Series? We are not as good at continuity as we like to think. You'll find cans of soda on medieval tables, people wearing nylon windbreakers and sneakers in a cowboy western, etc etc. And that's with dozens of team members all looking for these kinds of mistakes. And yet, Scripture has none of these. All the continuity is correct. Please, if you're a Christian, look at these. It'll settle your security in God if you're someone who's always chasing that 'feeling close to God.' If you're not, start looking into the historical reliability of the Bible. And whatever problem or polemic you find, make sure you look for a few defenses of it first before you believe it. Most 'contradictions' are actually arguments from silence or a lack of context. Like why did Jesus go all the way up near Tyre when walking instead of a more direct road? Look at a topographical map. There was a mountain in the way. There's a lot to learn, and its held up against every test thrown at it for 2000 years. God Bless you, I hope this helps you, whoever you are and whatever you believe.

Please consider making a video for the case for partial Preterism. I suspect it ties into the concept of dual fulfillment of prophecy.

LOVED THIS TEACHING! Thank you

Dr. Ortlund I believe another topic that isn’t talked about a lot is what true Christian work looks like. After we’ve accepted Christ, how do we move forward with work and all its components (time management, moving up and doing good work, motivation) would love to hear your Christian Response to work

The seige and destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD is personally compelling for me, with regard to prophecy. There is so much evidence NT manuscripts were written before it happened yet it matches theologically and textually so well with things Jesus said.

Im praying for your Nashville move.

PART 2 (This is the continuation of previous comment I've written) Isaiah 53, possibly the most famous chapter for people who want to argue that "prophecy proves Christianity," Well, I won't repeat what has already been said. Throughout the book of Deutero-Isaiah (no, I don't think Isaiah wrote all of his book, nor did Michael Heiser and other conservative scholars), the Servant is constantly referred to as Israel and how they one day would reunite his people back to their land. This is talking about the return of the Exile! The Jewish people were very despised throughout history, so I think saying that this shows Jesus is being prophesied here is a very bad argument. The chapter also mentions that the Servant will be sick, probably meaning leprosy (read the Cambridge Bible for Schools in the Bible Hub), something that didn't happen to Jesus (he actually cured the lepers). And the translation "he was crushed FOR our iniquities" is actually a mistranslation. The verse ought to be translated as "he was crushed BECAUSE OF our inequities", implying that, because "they" cause harm to him, he will suffer, something that happened to the Jews constantly throughout history. Jews believe that they and their Messiah will bring the redemption of the world, so the passage where it mentions that "by his bruises we are healed" is related to that. God smiting his servant isn't that wholly unexpected either. We read in the first book of Isaiah that Israel was sent to exile because they kept refusing to follow God, which was kind of a punishment for their deeds, but, even through these horrible times, they shall remain faithful. And, interestingly, if we read Isaiah 53:8 in the original language, we'll read, "He was taken from prison and from judgement; and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living; for the transgression of my people, THEY were stricken." The word used is "lamow," which is third-person PLURAL. Don't believe in me? Check it out for yourself. But now let's make a negative case for Isaiah 53. Well, from all we know, Christ only really suffered during his final hours... Throughout his ministry, he was well received, well treated, and even had the opportunity to eat at a Pharisee's house (Luke 14). Can we really say he was "despised, maltreated, and shunned"? I don't think so. But this can absolutely be said about the Jews... According to Isaiah 53:10, the Servant is supposed to see his "seed", a word used specifically for BIOLOGICAL children in the Hebrew Bible, yet, for all we know, Jesus didn't have kids, nor was he married. Another point is the fact that, y'know, Jesus is God? So, technically, God is His own Servant... (food for thought), and throughout the whole Hebrew Bible, the Messiah is NEVER portrayed as someone who would die (and, please, read Zechariah 12:10 in context), so Isaiah 53 is the only chapter in which you can, in a very dubious way, say that "the Messiah shall die". I would also add the idea that in the OT, sin is never portrayed as something that someone shall pay for you; it's always said to be forgiven when someone actually decides to repent and go back to the teachings of the Lord (the Torah) (Deuteronomy 24:16; Ezekiel 18:20). Well, I think that's enough. About the prophecy that the Messiah would be born in Bethlehem, I would first argue that the Nativity accounts are pure fiction or legend. When I was a Christian, I thought of many ways to reconcile them and watched many apologetics videos (IP, Testify, Deflate, etc.), but there is just no way, unless, of course, you invent a census before Quirinius (for which we have absolutely no evidence) and are willing to make some brutal mental gymnastics to argue that the Evangelists were simply mentioning COMPLETELY different details regarding Jesus's Nativity. Even Christian scholars like NT Wright and Dale Allison admit that the accounts are most likely legendary. And about the prophecy of Micah, the Evangelists probably misinterpreted it. Jews seemed to never have bothered where the Messiah would be born, and Bethlehem was just a way of saying "from the same as David", because David was born there. I would also argue that the fact that Matthew quotes a bunch of passages out of context and that have no Messianic themes whatsoever is good evidence that he was just going around the OT and searching for parallels (the "he shall be a Nazarene" is a good example of that). In my perspective, the Nativity accounts were created to explain the origins of the Messiah, as many people would've gotten interested in learning how he was born and all as the movement grew, and also to restle with the fact that Jesus is ALWAYS called "Jesus of Nazareth", a region well-known for various revolts. There are also minor problems, like the fact that the Massacre of the Innocents is nowhere mentioned (not even by Herod's personal friend), when the gospels actually say that "he and all of Jerusalem were troubled when they heard that", and also the completely contradictory genealogies of Jesus (and the fact that there was no way a poor family from Nazareth could've known their genealogy coming from the literal Adam). And lastly, because I'm getting very tired, the prophecy of Daniel 9! All I suggest is reading the whole thing straight up. The Messiah (or Kingdom of God) is supposed to arrive at that time; there is much evidence that Daniel was written during the 2nd century BCE; the word "destroy" in "destroy the city" can mean "to corrupt", which was exactly what Antiochus IV Epiphanes did; there is a huge debate on where the "70 weeks" start (if you want to understand the debate better, I really suggest taking a look at Michael Heiser's presentation on the issue; you can simply search "Michael Heiser 70 weeks of Daniel", and I think it will be the first video; it's around 1 hour long); and the obvious fact that, if you read the book of Daniel (without trying to see Jesus in it), I think someone will hardly see a direct connection to Jesus. Daniel is a very complicated and ambiguous book (funny, isn't it? 1 Corinthians 14:33), and every interpretation needs to be taken with a grain of salt, but (even when I was a Christian) I think that the "Maccabean period prophecy" hypothesis is the one with the most evidential weight. Those are my thoughts. I don't even know if somebody's gonna read that, but whatever. If the language is repetitive and annoying to read, sorry, English isn't my first language.

Good video. Also excited for the C S Lewis one since I recently read The Narnian, which discusses the incident fairly

Thank you. It continues to be a puzzle as to why the Jewish people, from their own holy books, don’t see or interpret said books the way we Christians do.

Love this video! Well said. Powerful content. "The testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy" (Rev. 19:10) Another naturalistic argument I've come across for the development of prophecy and the hope of Messiah throughout the Old is progressive mythmaking. One person says this prophecy and that hope, then that same prophecy/hope is adopted and applied again later on by another person but more content is added to it this time, then another person comes along and the pattern continues. But this view cannot explain their fulfillment in Christ and the global flourishing of the Christian faith. It makes all prophets out to be liars, and then says sin doesn't exist! Such a charitable worldview.

I just watched “The Ten Commandments” (1956) for the second time last night, and it reminded me that the Bible truly is God’s great, big story. There’s nothing else like it.

PART 1 (my thoughts were too long to put under a single comment) Hello Gavin, I gotta say, despite recently deconverting and becoming an Agnostic, I really enjoy the way you speak about these topics and the willingness that you have when you present that information. As an agnostic, I'm going to write about what I think about these topics and explain why I don't think that this "evidence" (which I would barely call that this way) isn't that impressive, and, in fact, it may discredit many points in Christianity. I hope this doesn't sound like debunking in an arrogant way, because I just want to have an honest conversation and dialogue with people with whom I disagree. That's the reason why, despite not believing anymore, I still watch some apologetics channels. Well, I won't address the prophecies mentioned before the 20:00 minute mark for a simple reason... There are many passages there that don't mention the Messiah at all, and I think it's just extrapolation and reading a certain theological framework into the text, but I admit that many of these are obviously messianic. The problem is that those prophecies are VERY generic regarding the Messiah, and they all say pretty much the same thing: "He will become a great king and priest. He will free Israel from its oppression. And all of Earth will know that he is the Messiah.". Do you know what other group thinks the Messiah will be just like that? The Jews. Just a quick read on the Wikipedia page "Messiah in Judaism" and you already have this notion. End of world (before everything as follows) God redeems the Jewish people from the captivity that began during the Babylonian Exile in a new Exodus. God returns the Jewish people to the Land of Israel. God restores the House of David and the Temple in Jerusalem. God creates a regent from the House of David (i.e., the Jewish Messiah) to lead the Jewish people and the world and usher in an age of justice and peace. All nations recognise that the God of Israel is the only true God. God resurrects the dead. God creates a new heaven and a new earth. I would also note that most of these prophecies only appear in the OT during the Babylonian Exile and times when the Jews were being oppressed by foreign rulers. The major problem is that Jesus, supposedly, was meant to do all that, but he didn't. And yes, I know. Christians are going to say, "Jesus will do that, but in the future". But really, let's be honest for a moment here... If you read in your Holy Book that the Messiah will bring the literal Apocalypse to Earth, but when he, supposedly, comes, he is nothing more than a mere man saying that the "end times are near; repent," I understand that maybe because I don't believe Jesus did any miracles anymore (and for good reasons, I would say). A good analogy, in my view, is of a father telling his son that he will give him the most amazing gift for Christmas. He says that this gift will be capable of running many different entertainment platforms, that it will be white and blue, and that it will come with a game where a guy slaughters Greek mythology characters. You think it's a PS5, right? Well, but in the end, he gives his son a Motorola... What are we to think of such a parent? I know I might be getting theological here, but why would God hype the spectations of His own people and give a random dude speaking of an apocalypse instead of what they were actually waiting for? There is no doubt why the Jews refuse to believe Jesus is the long-awaited Messiah. He just doesn't seem to be. In fact, Jesus also seems to have these thoughts in the canonical gospels. I won't be long here because this could be a whole new discussion, but just read Mark 9:1, Mark 13, Matthew 24, Matthew 10:23, and other related verses. Jesus is VERY apocalyptic and thinks the end of the world and the redemption of God are near. We even see this theme in Paul's letters, but I won't elaborate further. But now let's talk about the "supposed prophecies about Jesus in the OT"... First of all, I don't think you can use the NT to "prove those prophecies" like it was done in 20:06-20:27, simply because the Evangelists, when they were writing these gospels (at least 30 years after the death of Jesus), already thought Jesus was the Messiah, so they are obviously going to say that he is the "root and descend of David". I also don't think you can argue that "Jesus is the most influential human being that ever existed" is evidence of it. Yes, he is in the West... So what? In the Arabic Peninsula and North Africa, Muhammad is the most influential person. In India, it's Khrishna. In China, Jesus is a nobody for most of the population. And so on... And even if Jesus was literally the most influential person in the whole world, so what? This just shows that his movement was very successful (a movement that was not prophesied in the OT, btw); that's pretty much it. But let's talk about the actual meat, shall we? I will talk about those in another comment... I've reached KZfaq's character limit.

Daniel 9 (70 weeks = 490 years = 458 BC - 33 AD) and Daniel 2 both placing the arrival of the Messiah after 69 weeks (27 AD) is what convinced me that Jesus was the Messiah, showing up in the days of the 4th empire from the time of Daniel 2 (Babylon-> Persia -> Greece -> Rome). That and Matthew 24:1-35 (I ended up leaving premillennialism and becoming partial preterist after learning how Jesus fulfilled that lol).

Great job

The hardest part about believing it, is that its so easy for the gospel writers to make up the details of Jesus's birth to be inline with the old testament specifics. For example, Jesus being born in Bethlehem is pretty widely disputed and so on.

I would love if you went into more depth on some of the specifics. And the prophecies not relating directly to jesus, very interesting.

My favorite subgenre of Biblical prophecy is "prophecies so clearly fulfilled that atheists have to claim they were written after the fact."

Awesome!

Amazing! I'd love to hear your thoughts on the differences between Matthew's and Luke's genealogies.

I agree, this is the best one. Thanks for a reference.

Awesome video. I’m still not utterly convinced of, or at least I don’t see clearly the argument’s validity (though I’m a Christian). Still, I can recognize it’s remarkable power, and I’m fascinated by it. If I wanted to read more about it, are there any recommended books on the topic? Particularly those that might take this kind of broad scale overview of salvation history and the way it all culminates in Christ.

This is a great overview. I think the challenge with evidential arguments is that they work pretty good with people who have some overlap with your beliefs. For an atheist, evidence can start to lose its value in that they will just re-interpret all evidence through their atheism. That's not a criticism of this argument, it's just that I think people often have to be challenged at the level of their paradigm before they're open to new evidence.

Do you think you could make a video about Daniel and the prophecy there (and how it relates to the dating of the book)? That has more specific prophecies than just about anywhere else in the Bible, and depending on how we date the book, that tells us whether we can trust the authenticity of the prophecy.

Great Job Dr. Ortland. Dominus Vobiscum !

I want to look more into this. Any literature recommendations ?

I hadn’t thought of the aspect of the most significant human in history being expected for thousands of years part. I mean I knew both sides but hadn’t thought of those two aspects together in that way

I think this is a great line of reasoning, and delivered in a way I had not thought of. How is it that the Jewish people had this continual hope, lasting centuries, that was eventually fulfilled by one man? An interesting topic for a future video might be a discussion of why Jewish scholars reject Jesus as the fulfillment of the Old Testament.

This is stellar!

Great work

helpful points--thanks

One of the most important arguments for Christianity. Great video.

Any recommended books for further reading on the topic?

I remember reading Ezekiel 26 and seeing how it compares to what Alexander the Great did to the city of Tyre and being kind blown. Still one of my favorite examples of fulfilled prophecy

As an Adventist, we begin the 490 years with the 3rd decree to rebuild Jerusalem in 457AD. The last 'week' (7 years) begins in the year 27AD, when Christ was baptised and began his mission. After 3 & 1/2 years, Christ was 'cut off' (his crucifixion), end the symbolic sacrifice of animals, and finally, the disciples/apostles were directed to turn their attention to the Gentiles in earnest in 34AD, thus closing the last of the 7 'weeks' (490 years) that were determined for the Jews as the people of God. The symbolism of 3.5 + 3.5 = 7 is reflected at many different levels all throughout the Bible. It's definitely a fascinating book.

Gavin, thank you for this. But the link to your "messianic expectations" article doesn't work.

Of all the arguments, I believe this one is the most well-debunked, not just by atheist or agnostic scholars or debaters, but also people like Tovia Singer. The lynch pin is the fact that the New Testament writers knew theOld Testament, and it would be easy for them to formulate a storyline with that knowledge.

Hey Gavin! Would you be able to explain how Christ fulfills the promises of land and material blessing that are a part of Abraham's covenant? I am writing on the Word of Faith Movement right now, and one of the main things this movement will latch on to when proclaiming the prosperity of all believers is the supposed physical blessings, first promised in Abraham, and thereby fulfilled in Christ, that are open and available for Believers to seize in faith. I have an inkling that this is fulfilled in the unity and blessings of the Church; how the church is to share all of its goodness with those in its ecclesial body, but perhaps I am missing something. Thanks, Gavin!

Isaiah 41:23 “Shew the things that are to come hereafter, that we may know that ye are gods: yea, do good, or do evil, that we may be dismayed, and behold it together.”

Awesome topic

I'd love to hear your thoughts on the rosary! 📿

Powerful video

In Luke 16 :31 Jesus speaking of Abraham telling the rich man "If they hear not Moses and the prophets , neither will they be persuaded though one rose from the dead."

Excellent overview. This is definitely a neglected area. If you're interested, I'll be posting a deep dive on Ps 22:17 (Eng. 22:16) in the next few days.

As a Catholic, I'm curious what you make of supposed messianic prophecies in the Deuterocanon? Two examples immediately come to mind: 1. Baruch 3:37-4:4, which predicts how divine wisdom will become incarnate and all "who cling to her will live and all who die will forsake her". 2. Wisdom 2:12-22, which seems to anticipate the entirety of Christ's passion. Would you view these as prophetic? If not, why? If so, does this have any bearing on their inspiration, or could prophetic passages come from "ecclesiastical" books, which are good, but can't establish doctrine?

What are some good books to read about fulfilled prophecy?

In an effort to break up the echo chamber, let me offer a 4th explanation: The authors of the N.T. had already read and mostly memorized the O.T. Then they penciled in events during the lifetime of Jesus that didn't actually happen in an effort to convince the reader that Jesus was the Messiah. For example, remember when Jesus is offered vinegar to drink and he refuses? We are assuming that was a real event in 33 AD. The "4th explanation" posits that event didn't happen, but the author wanted to insert that part into the story because he already knew about that line in Psalm 22. The same idea for most of Psalm 22, Isaiah 53, and the other heavy-hitter passages. The Gospel of Mark, the first gospel written, was written around 65 AD. It's a huge 30 year gap for lots of legends to develop in a time period where literacy was around 5%.

What are your thoughts on Wisdom 2:12-20? How is this mention of "the Righteous one" not a foretelling of Jesus, his ministry and passion? If it is, how can it not be inspired then, especially with the next several chapters having such a similarity to Jesus own teachings? If it's inspired, what good reason do Protestants have for rejecting it as scripture?

Could you go through the kingdoms that daniel mentions? I think they are in revelation as well. The kindgdoms daniel lists are accurate i think

Thanks for the great video! Could you help me address some of my doubts? As a Christian, these are my biggest problems with the argument from fulfilled prophecy: The skeptical response would be that these prophecies created an *expectation* that Jesus’s life would have been *interpreted in light of*. Because of the 490 year timeline, people would have been looking for a Messianic figure around the timeframe of Jesus. Jesus himself could have believed himself to be the Messiah, just as other pseudo-Messianic figures did before and after him (like Simon bar Kokhba.) Neither he nor his disciples had to be willingly deceptive for this to be the case. Critical scholars often argue that Jesus was not born in Bethlehem *because* there was so much prophetic anticipation for him to be. If he was born and raised in Nazareth, and everyone knew this about him, people would need to concoct a story about him being born in Bethlehem and moving to Nazareth to make sense of the unfulfilled prophecy. They point to things like the problem of Luke’s census to bolster this. For skeptics, fulfilled prophecies actually cause *more* doubt for the historicity if an event than if there were no prophecy. The best secular argument I’ve heard against the resurrection is the argument from cognitive dissonance. There are examples in modern times of prophecies failing (such as predictions if the end of the world), and then adherents pivoting to reinterpret and preserve the prophetic movement instead of abandoning it. One major example is the Seventh Day Adventist church being born out of the so-called “Great Disappointment.” The argument is that this is how belief in Jesus’s resurrection came about. Because Jesus predicted the end of the world in his generation and his Messianic enthronement, his death would have to be reinterpreted as a fulfillment of prophecy instead of its defeat. The disciples would search the scripture and interpret the events through the lens of the suffering servant in Isaiah 53 and Psalm 22. This is the best argument against the historical case for Christianity that I’ve come across, and the one that keeps me up at night. Do you have any thoughts, @truthunites ?

I think the most brief overview can sometimes be strong in itself. Afterall the indepth analysis can sometimes lead to someone being lost in the details.

Hi Gavin! Big fan of the channel, even as an atheist. I wanted to add my personal viewpoint on this, which I feel was somewhat left out of the alternate takes. To me, it seems that our modern concept of Jesus already accounts for the prophetical text. An example of what I mean is the Horcruxes in Harry Potter. I seriously doubt that JK Rowling had the concept of Horcruxes when writing the second book at all (pretty big coincidence that one of the few things in the world able to destroy Horcruxes is handy). Similarly, I don’t think that Horcruxes as a general concept were wholly derived just from Tom Riddle’s diary, they serve multiple narrative purposes that go way beyond extending an artifact from one of the previous books. It seems most likely to me from an honest reading that these narrative needs were conceptualized as Horcruxes, while (crucially) accommodating this previous material. To put this in perspective of Gavin’s alternate points: 1) It would be an unthinkably enormous coincidence if JK Rowling thought of Horcruxes as being susceptible to Basilisk venom independent of Chamber of Secrets. 2) Nobody thinks that the reason Tom Riddle’s diary is so much like a Horcrux is because there was a reprint of Chamber of Secrets to make them more compatible. I think by far the closest in this example would be 3) intentional fulfillment, which I think a case could be made for. While I do think there are examples of intentional fulfillment (especially in the birth narratives), my point is that the two INDEPENDENT objects of the diary and the narrative purpose of the Horcruxes are reconciled by the conceptualization of the Horcruxes in light of the diary. To bring this back to the Bible, I think that there were independently 1) prophetical texts and 2) a historical Jesus, but the conceptualization of Jesus as a messianic savior was made not only in light of some of the exploits of the historical Jesus, but also the previous centuries’ worth of scripture. Hopefully I have explained this well, I am not here to offend anyone, just offering an alternative viewpoint I feel was left out.

amen

Daniel 9 is one of the greatest prophecies ever.

Loved this…although I often wonder about if Jesus is related to David through Joseph and Joseph wasn’t his biological father then how does that work? I guess there’s something I’m missing

yes

I would remind people though that to those who consider the gospel foolishness as the Greeks did, so much more will they regard prophecy; "Is a prophecy fulfilled? Well they wrote it in after the fact and claimed they predicted it." "Is it unfulfilled? Well clearly that proves the bible has failed prophecies!" And so forth. Only someone actually open to God to begin with may receive some benefit. It won't convince anyone who is already in rebellion against God. Recall that God HIMSELF told us this, so unless you are rejecting God, then accept the sword of Truth given to you; Those who Reject God are in rebellion. It is not a lack of information they have or certain information they need, but a change of heart. Romans 1:18 18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who [d]suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because what may be known of God is [e]manifest [f]in them, for God has shown it to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and [g]Godhead, so that they are without excuse, 21 because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. That said, we ARE called to be able to provide defense and that defense may reach the ears of the receptive. So don't expect it to convince anyone, that's not your job. But you are expected to plant the seeds of faith and defend it. The holy spirit is the one who may make those seeds Grow.

My biggest hang up with this is all of the Jewish people of today. If it’s so obvious that Jesus fulfilled the messianic prophecies, then why aren’t the Jewish people convinced?

Yes Matthew 24, Mark 13, Luke 21 are all great fulfilled prophecy that proves Jesus is who he said he is.

While I do in fact agree that Jesus does fulfill the OT prophecies that point to him, I can appreciate the argument that the details of his life were edited after the fact to comport with those passages. Given the nature of poetic texts, it is conceivable that a given event can be interpreted as having its fulfillment in a specific act, whether the source text actually supports it. We’ve seen it with a number of failed eschatological prophecies and calculations in the past few centuries. Given the gospels are essentially the only historic record we have of our Lord’s life, this argument hinges on the historical reliability of those texts. For instance, the Bethlehem birth narrative could have been invented by the authors for the purpose of comporting it with the prophetic expectation of the Messiah. (I don’t think it is, as I agree the gospels have demonstrated themselves to be reliable, but I can understand the objection). I think a strong argument for this position is the novel interpretations of messianic prophecies in light of the resurrection. The fact that passages were only read as messianic after Christ is a compelling case that these texts had been pointing to something that was, in many senses, unexpected but entirely coherent from the outset.

In order to have everlasting life you absolutely must trust in the person and finished work of Christ alone for salvation. Saving repentance is turning from unbelief to belief.

I'd assume that a secular person would deny this argument by only accepting very "late" dates for most of the works that have the prophecies, acknowledging only textual criticism/interpretations of said works that affirms their saccular view, and also by assuming there must be some type of "conspiracy" going amongst the various authors in order the promote this "messianic idea." They don't realize the extent of their mental gymnastics, but when people don't want to believe something they will do whatever they can to prevent themselves from doing so.

I think the lack of academic support is the reason it’s neglected, but that lack of academic support probably comes from the unwillingness to believe in the Bible and also the establishment clause of the first amendment that governs state schools.

We know that the Gospel authors were literate Jews familiar with their Hebrew Bible, and they wanted their fellow Jews to accept Jesus as the prophesied Messiah. Knowing what Jews expected in their Messiah, the authors wrote the Gospels to meet those expectations, and Jesus apparently fulfills Hebrew Bible prophecies.

What is New Testament authors picked up on the messiah being born in Bethlehem from the OT, and they inserted it to show fulfillment?

The prediction of future events is no different than betting on numbers for a lottery or tossing die at local casino. One problem with prophecy is usually there are no details given, just mindless hope treated as if something will happen in the future, and that hope being reimagined as “fact” even in the absence of any evidence. Hope does not make something “true”. Another problem is even in the instance that do occur that mirror some previous nebulous prediction given sufficient passage of time one could rightly claim just about any (unusual) scenario could statistically occur. But such occurrence happened not because of prophecy and instead happen because there are any number of similar events that can occur based solely upon the complex nature of the empirical universe. And does not require the intervention of some supernatural source. There simply are too many parameters that can occur statistically within the natural order to make any claims of the supernatural to be legitimate.

The Church (Body of Christ) established by Christ on the foundation of the apostles in 33 A D is the beginning of Christianity.

Genesis 12 alone is more powerful than people seems to aknowlegde (and this argument is indepentend of what one may think about reliability of Scripture's text - it still works even if you believe that Abraham didn't exist as a historical figure...): simply there is no record of ancient god making promise to give blessing upon nations through someone (it's also somewhat out of scope of ancient thinking: why even would I worship some god who would bless OTHER nations than mine?). And it was written down by a nation which historically speaking had no clear reason to believe that they somehow will overcome or will be "blessing" for example for many empires that they struggle with. So not only fulfilment of the promise in Christ (Christ is known all over the globe while ancient gods of nations are obsolete) is unique - historically *the promise itself is unique* simply in terms of time and place where it was written. When you put uniqueness of promise and uniqueness of fulfilment together, you really have to believe in a miracle: either you believe in a miracle from God or miracle of mere chance that has no comparision in history...

Does anyone remember the name of an argument that uses different verses to make a point.

Isaiah 53 should make everyone a Christian.