Agreed. Is Simmons arguing against free agency, which players fought for, in court, across 3 sports, for 25 years? Sounds like it.

@@cecilboyd1692 Bill was Speaking from a slanted Bias view once again and Russillo was like " Dude What Are You Talking about"

​@@MrBimirud dude literally just wants the NBA to be the bird magic NBA forever.

Bill wanted to split up LeTatum and Brown

@@Gidd3yUp Wow! So he is just another Fool with a Podcast Platform with no facts

They won nothing with just their homegrown players. They needed Porzingis, White and Jrue to finally win a title. All 3 were acquired via trade so his whole point is BS.

@@dis6900new rules with 2nd apron restrictions start this upcoming year. All those guys on the team besides Tatum and brown will be shipped out. Every team can only have 2 max players now going forward since a max contract is like 50/60 million for each player. 2 players equals roughly 100 -120 million. Leaving only 50 to 70 million for rest of roster.

Why can't Celtics win the next 10 years? Bill Simmons be like

@@dis6900 If Porzingis could stay healthy, you might be able to keep all three of those players, trade brown & still be a contender under the 2nd apron.

​@dis6900 all of those moves were trades, so I don't believe that defeats Bill's point

Exactly my thoughts. He didn’t care about any of the other previous champions keeping their teams together.

Bingo

THIS

The fact that he says "it wasn't a Celtics discussion" 20 seconds after saying "do you think Jalen Brown is gonna be on the Celtics in 4 years" is absolutely hilarious. It's clearly a Celtics discussion for Bill and that's why he uses them as an example. Bill's thoughts are extremely transparent and his worries are for his team, not the league.

Bill crying, again.

Amen!

It's sad the owners also don't want to pony up the money . Alot of the small market teams choose not to pay guys . It's baffling. But in America some people don't buy sports teams to win anything except their bank account . If I was a small market fan and the team I liked refused to retain talent I would hope the fan base would boycott it. The reason they do it is because they still make money so who cares

Spend to the luxury tax. Exactly zero NBA teams are incapable of that. Market size is completely irrelevant. Cry more.

@@j2398 They choose not to pay guys because their revenue is less. That's like saying A24 chooses not to make blockbuster films.

Market size is not irrelevant. Make a list of all the free agents that WENT to Indiana then tell me your conclusion.

Bill cares about Bill.

The celtics won 0 rings between 1987 and 2007 and 2009 to 2023....the pats won 0 rings from 1960 to 2001...the bruins went 28 and then another 39 years between titles...have won 1 since 1973....the red sox went 86 years before winning a title...86+ 41+21+39 is 187 years of losing....

@@razkable aww. I triggered a Boston fan. The Knicks have won 0 since 1973. They have two since Moses parted the red sea up until 1973. The Mets have 0 since 1986. They have 2 since since 1969. I'm not a hockey fan but the rangers and sabres have a combined 1 championship since 1994. Before that it was decades. Jets 0 since 1969. You don't get to win everything. Noone feels sorry for you for having droughts. It's easy to go through droughts In one when you have others to fall back on. For example Boston had the Celtics in the sixties. Then Bruins in 70s won. Then Celtics again in the 80s. Drought in 90s. Patriots for 100 years in 2000s. Red Sox start winning in 2000s. Few years of drought now Celtics are winning again. They have two since then. It's easy to manufacturer what you said. Especially if you're counting the red Sox for 100 years. We have 51 years Knicks 38 years Mets. 30 years rangers 55 years jets. That's 174 years of drought. And that's not even cheating by using 100 years before you were even born like you did for the red Sox. That's going on right now. Boston is spoiled. Not to mention you've seen dynasties in 3 of the big 4 sports. Multiple times. The 60s Celtics. The 80s Celtics to a degree. The Patriots in 2000s. The red Sox to a degree in 2000s. You poor thing. How do you manage only have a few championships every decade?

​@@razkablemy warriors had a 40 year drought. We were bad before we won in 2015. Bill is reverting back to Page 2 Bill Simmons. Insane boston homerism.

​@@razkableRaptors won ONE championship, Maple Leafs haven't won since 1967 and the Blue Jays have a back to back from over 30 years ago..yea cry me a river 😢

He thinks his takes matter more right now cause the Celtics won the chip. So he is putting out more content the last few days. 🤣🤣😂

8z8

He specifically names the Celtics players as an example then claims that the conversation isn't about the Celtics. It's so ridiculous that he tries to pretend that's not what he's talking about. He couldn't be more transparent.

I always take what Bill says with a grain of salt because of his blatant fanboyism of his hometown teams.

Old fool he’s become 😂

Bill is biased so it’s hard to take his word for anything. If the Celtics were middle of pack and couldn’t get FAs, he’d be saying how the league needs to ensure other teams get a chance at players. Now Boston is the juggernaut with 5 guys on 9 figure deals and now it “isn’t fair” cause they can’t edit the team cause they are deadlocked in the 2nd apron

Lol the last 2 NBA finals have been trash and even the viewing numbers show that, the numbers are down like 30% from the Cleveland vs Golden State era

@@insomatic420Exactly, the league likes dynasties. On top of that it’s going to affect future players legacies. How will they stack up to the Lebrons and Kobes of the past if the best players of the next generation can’t break 2 titles due to the NBA’s obsession with parity.

The NBA did not "stumble" on to the new CBA. It wanted parity.

@@kevinc8955gonna require sacrifice lebron took pay cuts for two chips in Miami Duncan took paycuts Kobe gave some back. Mahomes don’t take it all. This dudes are taking the bag and I don’t blame them.

holy shit I stopped watching after KD joined the Warriors. I know the casual fan is different than me, but you gotta know that team was terrible in almost every possible angle besides the great basketball they played.

Well free agency wasn't even truly free until the 80s so that past very much existed for decades Cousy 13 years all in Boston Russell 13 years all in Boston Havlicek 16 years all in Boston Cowens 10.5 years 10 in Boston Bird 13 years all in Boston McHale 13 years all in Boston Parish 14 years in Boston Pierce first 15 years in Boston Magic all 12.5 in LA Kareem last 14 in LA Worthy all 12 in LA Isiah all 13 in Detroit Dumars all 14 in Detroit Duncan all 19 years in SA Dirk all 20 years in Dallas Kobe all 20 years in LA If you're young it might seem like it never existed but before LeBron, stars just didn't move around that much and you would spend a decade with the same core guys

@@augustosarmentodeoliveira3023 what are you on about

And yet. That was when the viewership numbers where the best. By a long shot. Turns out casual fans loves dynasties.

Mythologizing is a stretch. They began switching teams when FOs stopped prioritizing winning. Go look at post 2010-2011 lockout. Once players held owners to the fire for using Franchises as laundry mats for cash. That’s when the switch happened.

Kobe is only an outlier because he was actively incentivized by the Lakers. Everyone wants to talk about his loyalty, but no one mentions the fact that he was OPEN about wanting to be traded at various points of his career, unless he got certain things. Shit, in that interview he did with Shaq, he outright said he was ready to go to Chicago at the end of their tenure together, until the Lakers pulled the trigger on the Shaq trade and were willing to make Kobe the central piece.

@@thedefinitionisthis He still stayed. His beef was mostly w Shaq. Completely blind loyalty would be stupid.

@@josereyes1148 no cause Kobe went on national radio and demanded a trade lol. Everyone talks about loyalty but he wanted out. He was looking at homes in Chicago and Detroit lol he was ready to go.

@@ddalwy110 Yea because of his beef w shaq. Stars these days like KD have bounced on 3 teams. I don't count it against Kobe because he was mad for an off-season. He ended up staying. He didn't leave. Jerry West ended up talking to him and telling him it was a mistake.

@@josereyes1148 no cause that was done after Shaq left. That 3 year stretch after Shaq left he alienated his teammates and took the shots.

Right. We watched but also complained the regular season was meaningless. Back then there were 3-4 teams tops to contend. Now there are 6-8 teams that can make a run.

Those were the days. I just wish we occasionally got to see steph and klay play all four quarters and win by 60😂

They're going to stay together until Al retires and then Jrue anyway They will age out before it's an issue. They will only be a second apron team this year and next.

@@michaelahurtjrue looks like he can go for another 5 atleast so unless they trade him idk

@@michaelahurt oh so they won't start losing good players the same way Denver did? OK lol

@@Jovaughnbey123 So did CP. By the end of this deal Jrue will be going into his age 38 season. He will not be a $37m player by then But my point is by the time Jrue's deal is over, the window is over. They don't have to ever deal with losing guys one by one because of the salary cap like most title teams. It's honestly flawless team building. (And a lot of luck that all the contracts came up right before a new TV deal.)

@@cptsketch13 Basically yes Like Denver, Milwaukee, GS, 2011 Dallas, 2008 Boston, 2004 Detroit. Even going back MJ's Bulls

Yeah but that was before this new CBA was signed. That isn’t going to be the case anymore with the new CBA.

@@reptilelicks9796 no. They will be able to keep both through the rest of their careers if they want. He says himself that a core is a two-some or three-some, and Tatum and Brown won’t be forced to separate if them and the celtics don’t want that to happen.

@@Colinkrauss1 No because they had Hayward and Kemba on massive contracts in 2020. They would have already had to make a decision on Brown or Tatum knowing they can’t pay them all if this CBA existed in 2020.

@@reptilelicks9796 why would we apply rules that didn’t exist to decisions of 4 years ago? Obviously all decision making would have been different.

@@Colinkrauss1 Because I’m telling you that the Celtics would have already lost 1 of their stars if this CBA existed 4 years ago…. That’s the whole point of my initial comment lol

these things are cyclical, it'll be reversed in a decade or so once people start getting bored again

@@brock985which is how an entertainment product should evolve

But that’s not true. How is OKC, a “poor team”, ever going to win? They won’t be able to afford all of the guys they drafted and will have to blow it all up probably before they ever get a chance to win anything

Sports dynasties are not bad, they’re actually good for driving interest of the game. The Jordan bulls, Showtime lakers, Kobe/Shaq lakers, KD warriors etc. NBA will loosen up these rules on signings and trades once the viewership starts tanking. It’s already been decreasing YoY. Parity isn’t as good for the league as people think. The intrigue isn’t there for the casual fan.

They could arguably win in 2026 lol. I don't even think it's about affording those guys, it's the fact that long-long term people don't want to stay in a place like OKC, shit even a Cleveland, if they can't win every year. Getting free agents is hard due to destination more than affordability imo. The only players that don't care too much are foreign born and mid tier guys. Shai is most definitely leaving for Toronto at some point, imo.

But if you look at the winner. The drafted star is the way to go.

Cba should have reduced the amount of max players to 1 drafted and 1 free agent max.. then tier down everything after that greatly... you have too many 3rd, 4th, 5th guys making too much money and that's why teams don't stay together..

@@janssonsamuel8005 100% you definitely draft of franchise player every single time but his argument is those shouldn't count as much against the cap as free agent signings or as much against the cap as free agent signings or traded signings as much against the cap as free agent signings or sign and trades

Nice

@@joshuafruth6420 That's because they decided quite a while ago that that they prefer the 51% over everyone receiving their market value so the outcome is Max's and super maxes even though players who received them shouldn't and people like Jokic are actually probably underpaid

If they're homegrown they absolutely should have 4 all stars. You shouldn't be punished just for being good at one of the main parts of your job.

@@AceManning18 it's not getting punished, it's players earning their big payday. Hard caps are great. I don't want to see teams being able to afford everyone. Go to Detroit, get that bag. Go to Charlotte, get that bag. I'm over Lakers and Celtics dynasties

That’s not his point though?

The cap rules are counterintuitive. Yes you are able to retain your homegrown talent by going through the luxury tax/aprons but you have to pay such an enormous tax number and face other penalties that it makes it not worth it. I see where Simmons is coming from here.

He's mad because its going to breakup the celtics after this year. He definitely thinks Boston should get a salary cap / luxury tax break for Tatum and Browns contracts, and even if they manage to keep the starting 5 together the bench will be decimated. The NBA is becoming Hockey where anybody can win a series against anybody.

Here's to a future where otto porter doesnt get a max contract.

These guys aren't exactly road scholars, lol.

For real 😂 Sorry you’ll have to move off of 36 year old Jrue’s 30AAV contract in a couple years or have to hit on some late picks to fill a rotation spot

Teams that draft well and make great trades should be rewarded for doing so. Not teams like Miami or Golden State that have the best players in the league just fall into their laps.

@@jesselatham7610 they are so lucky they just stumbled into drafting tatum and brown; its going to be fun seeing this team absolutely collapse over the next few years.

Is impossible to develop cheap young talent while winning championships? Couldn't you have someone younger and cheaper ready to go when the starters get old and expensive?

It's not possible that Bill doesn't know he's talking about the Celtics. He knows. He mentions them by name. He just wants to pretend that's not the reason he's saying these things.

Sounds sensical to me

agreed, and only a little % really deserve the max.

Toronto, Milwaukee, Denver, and Boston all won championships in the last half decade or so and would be considered “cold weather” cities. And Minnesota just made the conference Finals. Paul George just signed with Philadelphia- not exactly a balmy winter destination. Donovan Mitchell just resigned with the rust belt Cavs. The Thunder and Spurs are small market franchises with futures as bright as any in the league. I don’t think playing for the glamour destinations matters as much as it used to in the era of league pass, social media, and national broadcast schedules. The bag, competitiveness, franchise competency, and roster quality all matter.

@@jdankerdake He resigned with Cleveland because the Knicks were taken over by Villanova guys. And I bet he'll demand a trade to Miami. I'm well aware of who won the titles, but that doesn't change the fact that star players gravitate to warmer weather and big market cities. Stuff like that doesn't sit well with middle America. If the NFL was like the NBA, Josh Allen would have demanded a trade and been sent to the Dolphins. But it isn't, and that's why it's more popular. The sport of basketball is the most popular sport in America, but the NBA is poorly run compared to the NFL.

@@deepvoicedude4749 The team that just won the title is a cold weather city (they also have the most titles in NBA history), the best player in the NBA plays in a cold weather city, 3/4 of the teams in the conference finals were from cold weather cities. This is incredibly stupid

I just want to clarify, phoenix isn't warm, it's a blistering concrete pad in the desert.

@@cptsketch13 When people say warm, they just mean places with no snow.

Won a ship? The Spendor Of The Seas? The Titanic?

I'm thinking along the same lines as you, but I would make the discount smaller. Something like 2 to 3%, per year. So a player who has been with the same team for 10 years has only 70 to 80% of their salary count against the cap. We want players to get paid, we want players to stay in one place when it makes sense, but we don't want teams to be able to just buy. All the best players. I think this is a good way to do it

Just be prepared for the top 1-2 tenured players on each team to hold teams hostage and pretty much hold out like Harden

What if Klay wants a better opportunity to win? There are obvious basketball reasons why Dallas is a better fit than GSW.

Klay felt disrespected

​@@imsoicy87For being benched? He need to realise it's a man's game. If you slow down then come of the bench.

​@@imsoicy87 because of his delusional ego lol. 0-10 Klay isn't Game 6 Klay anymore

Dude been injured twice and ain’t the same player no more

The homegrown stars get paid regardless of the CBA system. No team is getting punished by keeping one $60 million superstar, they’re getting punished for having 5-6 elite players on one super team. This new CBA does not prevent teams from keeping their 1-3 superstars.

Acting like the players are the only ones who want to make money, like the only reason 99% of owners own teams isn't to eventually turn a profit down the line. The NBA (and every major sport leauge) is, at the end of the day, a commodity to sell, so I'd rather that money the league already makes go to the players who actually make the product on the court

But the NBA is also getting more media money than ever.

Dude read the room. The nba is shooting up every chart.

Counter point, if 3 max players can easily slot onto one team, wouldn't the league devolve into 3-6 contenders by a mile and everyone else?

“ONLY the seventh pick” as if that’s tantamount to being found in the gutter

@@ObiAmajoyiSrMD Wow, I really have to explain this? 🙄 You wouldn't think the greatest shooter ever, probably top ten players ever, a guy who changed how the game is played would have dropped to seventh.

@@MrOctober44 do I have to explain this: he was not all those things when he got drafted. You seem to not realize that being drafted where he was meant to be that he was viewed at that time as one of the top 10 collegiate players out of more than 1,000. Your frame of reference is so odd and you don’t even realize it.

But now it makes teams have to be smart earlier and make hard choices on players and it makes trades to get out of the tax harder and it makes winning a title less productive and less sustainable or even competing for one less desirable for most owners.....

Then the cap ceases to be the cap, as it would be bastardized. The solution is for the top players to take LESS MONEY, to keep the players around them happy and paid so that they can grow and win together. The problem is, top players don't take less money, take the max, and then expect the front office to "figure it out". They figure it out by cutting or trading the players who helped those "great" players be great. Then the top players will complain that the team around them isn't great and they are frustrated. And then the cycle continues. It's all about the player and his willingness to win.

They really do not. That's why the Westbrook/KD teams always had a crappy supporting cast. The only guy they hit on was Reggie Jackson. Terrance Ferguson. Mitch McGary. Josh Huestis. Alex Abrines. Perry Jones They've traded away more good players than they gave hit on (Bledsoe, Brandon Clarke, Quickley, Sengun, Miles McBride, Peyton Watson) They have 3 years but once SGA's extension kicks that's three players taking up over 90% of the cap

@@michaelahurt Aaron Wiggins, Jaylin Williams, Tre Mann. Lu Dort and Joe acquired for nothing. Any other questions?

@@benluschen4771 Let's see it when it matters

@@michaelahurt I mean, they would not have been the one seed without the recent success in scouting and development. I’d throw out the history pre-PG trade, new a Presti approach and new CBA make it apples and oranges. Will they slow down picking up the hidden gems in years to come? Idk, maybe. But the recent run of players suggests something more than luck.

@@benluschen4771 It's luck. It's always luck. That's why no one in any sport has ever been able to do it consistently. The kinds of guys he drafts hasn't changed. What has though is skill development is way better now which dovetails nicely with his philosophy. Of course he's still had big misses even during this stretch (Giddey, Poku, and it looks like Dieng so far) They were the 1 seed because they were forced into making a trade that gave an MVP caliber guard and because they got the #2 pick in a year with Chet Holmgren. Hitting around the edges is nice but you win with top 40 players. Hopefully they don't try to get cute like last time and just pay the money to keep the three guys together. But Presti is definitely doing a better job this time around

They have to be. NBA owners are so rich now, they don’t care about any tax implications. They’ll just pay it. When you start moving picks to the end of the round, reviving exceptions, and making trade more strict, they pay attention.

@@snarkmark2806 I get that, but what’s the price. We like player movement in the NBA, but are we ready for a whole new level of it ?

Weird Al Yankovic is my favorite parity artist

@@Anonymous-ju9bg my bad professor lol

Celtics bias

About 8 shots during this 18 min. clip

That makes total sense

Maybe even an extra kicker if the player played his rookie season with you, enticing teams to really hit in the draft and develop better!?

All these trade hypotheticals never talk about what the team might acquire in return. I cant think of any direct examples but I think the return keeps the wheels spinning. There are deals where a collection of smaller assets gel and outperform the larger asset that initiated the trade. Or "gave up too much" deals.

@@OH_MY_DOGGG one could argue this happened in Utah post Mitchell to the Cavs and in Boston after the Nets trade (both done by the same GM oddly enough lmao)

Pavlov’s theory only really works when you’re not averse to the stimulus. If you find the team reshuffling averse to begin with, it becomes far less likely or not likely at all that you will become “addicted” to it

@@ObiAmajoyiSrMD It's an excellent point, but are most fans averse to it? Or put another way, are fans tired of "woj bombs", or do they still find them exciting? If it's the latter, the conditions seem ripe to me for Pavlov

Cason probably gone doe

Celtics have a great supporting cast and are being punished for it

I’d say that providing no incentive for teams to draft and trade well decidedly _is_ bad for the league.