Very interesting video and Man the sound of a Detroit 2 stroke diesel never gets old!

VisioRacer: A video request: Piston sizes of different engines. Such as train engine, hauler & earth movers, F1, consumer cars and trucks would be really cool. From Dodges 6.2l v8 all the way down to the smallest you can find. Thanks for reading.

The turbo EMD is gear driven to throttle 6, throttle 7 and 8 the turbo is on its own and the one way sprag is in free wheel, throttle 7 in the 645 engines is the most efficient, with BSFC at around (.322) pounds per hp per hour, in the 645 series that around 1100 pounds of fuel per hour, I did testing on these engines in the mid 80s, at the DOT facility in Colorado out in the desert...it's operated by the Association of American Railroads

I was confused for a moment, for what the information initially given took to understanding that the turbocharger was crankshaft driven, meaning that the turbocharger was technically a centrifugal supercharger, which has a turbo-like compressor but not the exhaust driven turbine. Then with the help of the animations provided, I could see that it is a turbocharger. It is only at initial start-up when it is engaged to the crankshaft like a supercharger. And since turbocharged engine setups are of positive loop feedback, the more exhaust, the more air it enters, and the cycle continues, with ways to control boost. It's actually genius.

I had a 100 foot long tug with a EMD V 12 576 rated at 1200 HP. Once when I was working on it I left one of the air box covers off when I started it and the amount of wind that came out was astonishing. There was a wrench laying near the cover hole and it shot across the engine room like a bullet.

The most reliable and best sounding locomotive diesel engine. Change my mind! A surprise is that you included videos from CroRailfan. Greetings from Croatia.

Great video, EMD's 2 stroke engines sound like no other when idling with the turbo running at minimum RPM.

Love the sound of the Detroit diesels and the way they run too brings back some good memories. Keep up the good work.

The turbo sound was earsplitting on the test cell with no covers. 8 hours of full throttle run in before shipping.

Thank you! The sound of the 16 cylinder EMD 567 was part of my childhood soundtrack. They powered most locomotives (NOHAB, Sweden) here in Denmark for decades. I think they were replaced by the 20 cylinder 645 in the 70's. Now most trains on the mainlines are run by all electric locomotives.

Presumably EMD used something like a Sprague clutch to disengage the blower drive when turbine power was sufficient. Smart design. And as a New Zealander, nice to see Kiwi Rail featured.

The gear driven turbocharger that EMD uses was tried on Detroit Diesel 92 series (for truck and bus use). But the throttle response was not good-basically it didn't work well. So this system is only good for slow acceleration/generator use-as in a locomotive. It works so well, the EMD is Tier 4 final approved for marine use. now.

I used to work for a major West Coast rebuilder of those EMDs. The blower/turbo was shipped in from another supplier in a dumpster sized crate. Inside was a dessicant pack the size of a pillow.

Always a pleasure to work on these engines, many power pack and head change outs, very modular engine in construction. Have seen a few over run clutches fail, no drive to the turbo resulting in low power, plenty of smoke from unburnt fuel. Even still a very reliable unit compared with other engines.

Damn it. Completely forgotten about EMD's 2-stroke engines! Used extensively in railroad and marine. EMD 710 series. Best prime mover ever, IMO. Hmm... both Detroit and EMD focused on 2-stroke engine cycle for its diesel engines. What did they had in common? Ah yes, of course. GM! You could focus on railroad prime movers for the next batch of videos, VR.

EMD is some of the best engines ever, their block is a weldment that is field repairable, supercharer that becomes a turbo at high RPM's by declutching from the gear train to eliminate turbo lag and substitute one device for 2 is genius.

I live across the highway from the Canadian Pacific main line and hear lots of V16 EMD710s.

I worked there about 10 years ago. Favorite part was developing SD70ACS and GT38ACe locomotives, for Saudi Arabia and Indonesia. The 2 stroke doesn't meet tier 4 emissions. They have a new 4 stroke, based on their past H engine, for tier 4.

Everyone makes videos about sports cars these days, but nowhere near as many make videos about huge unique engines like these, respect :D

I smile all the way through your videos like a kid watching their first fireworks display. The most enjoyable channel I sub to for sure.

Love the sound of trains👍

Its basically a the same type of clutch you find in a bicycle, and it's freaking genius. For those of you who aren't aware, the Detroit diesels and the 567/645/710 were designed basically by the same people, hence the familial nature of the shared design. That is thanks to ole' GM and her conglomerating ways. The history is fascinating. Its a shame that the 710 has to varying degrees been regulated out of existence (though it's still being produced in smaller numbers for certain industries and via the tier-4 credit program). Perhaps EMD can work with AchatesPower to bring two stroke back to it's former glory while still meeting emissions compliance.

WHATS UP VISIO! I love your videos!

That's pure genius. Use a Sprag clutch to detach it from the crank when exhaust flow it's enough to drive the turbine faster than the crankshaft.

Those are some great shots of the turbo and clutch system! Very nice indeed!

I love the sound of these engines! A few types of loco's run them here in Sydney Australia

Can't get enough of the EMD engine sound. Purposeful chatter. Locomotive 4-strokes just go chop-chop-chop. If I remember correctly, the turbo on the EMD transitions from mechanically driven to exhaust driven at throttle notch 4. Detroit Diesel tried some things on their 2-strokes in the 80's to overcome the Roots blower inefficiencies. The Silver 92 had a blower that would clutch off and charge air would bypass around it once the turbocharger was making boost. They also experimented with a hydrostatically assisted turbocharger to completely eliminate the Roots blower. There was an hydraulic pump driven by the crankshaft plumbed to the turbocharger shaft that had a Pelton wheel added to it. (Think of a small version of a waterwheel.) It would spin the turbo fast enough to start and idle, and run at low loads until there was enough exhaust energy to really light the turbo. I don't think that ever made production. But my favorite EMD sounds are made by the Roots-blown 567 and 645's. The turbo silenced the exhaust on the later 645 and 710's.

Great episode. I love learning interesting new things. Keep up the good work. Would be interesting to see a Hall-Scott episode

Awesome to see you talk about EMD.

Awesome video keep up the good work Visio racer

Screaming Jimmy's , just have to love them🤩

Never heard about this clever design. Thanks for this interesting discovery. (btw these beasts sounds awesome)

That Detroit had the guy in blue stopping. I would too hearing that thing spool up like it did.

EMD bought the design from Detroit Diesel roughly about the 70's. The 149 and 249 series 2 strokes were originally a Detroit Diesel that they couldn't get to pass emissions. Detroit Diesel was the first diesel engine on the railways after steam engines in 1932. The only competition DD had in the 50's was GE. The first DD 12V149 series engines came with 4, 6 cylinder heads mounted on the 12 V engines and same with the 12 V 249 engines. The 16 V engines were 4, 8 cylinder heads mounted on the 16 V engines for that series.

Thanks a lot buddy ❤️ Waiting for more informative videos.

What do you think the fact emd and detroit had the same owner when these engines where developed had to do with the final product? Im also wondering how the low rpm aspect of the emd had on the ways it tackled getting enough air. Would have been cool if emd had developed a truck engine. Love your program. My fav fact on 567. Trips overspeed at 900 rpms. And can run with in parameters at 3 lbs of oil pressure.

Great video, most of the diesel loco's we have in the UK use these hybrid turbo superchargers with their two stroke diesels.

so if this is wrong let me know: it's "basically" a centrifugal supercharger with a one way bearing, which disengages when the turbine rpm exceeds the reduction/crank rpm, turning it into a turbo?

the emd 645 engine was almost 4000 hp with 20 cilinders. The sound of it is astonishing also. Denmark used it in Mz diesel locs.

Cool to see one of the kiwi rail trains in your video, cheers from New Zealand.

Thanks for the information.

Learned something and for that I thank you.

This information is new to me !

Thanks Visio

Interesting and informative even though some of the Engineering is beyond my remit 🤔 Quality vid as always. Respect 👍

Well explained!

Very smart design, I'm surprised it hadn't been used in other applications

I love this channel 👍

I basically came up with this idea on my own, and found out that similar designs have been done before. I think my design is better though. It's a very significant part of my engine design thesis. I love the sound of that Detroit diesel. It sounds extremely powerful. If I'm not mistaken, this is part of the future of the internal combustion engine. Two stroke engines are simple, smooth, powerful and efficient. It's really nice to see that this is an already proven technology. It takes some of the stress off.

I learned a lot about 2 stroke diesels watching this! It would be extremely interesting to see if the EMD's turbo/supercharger could work in a car setting.

Perhaps you should do a video on the Crossley ESN and HST series of two stoke diesel engines. From an engineering angle they are very interesting even if they were far from reliable.

I used to work on the Crawley tugboats the ones in Jacksonville Florida have to GM electromotive v20 engines and I loved working on them

I used to work for a place that rebuilt EMD and GE turbochargers

Does it have a variable gear drive just like that old Super-turbocharger concept video?

All Nimitz Class CVN's have 4 EMD 645's 16

2:19 good choice for a clip

Rus Clay you should visit a desiel engine machine shop in Manitowoc Wisconsin they'll probably have a major amount of eye candy 🍬 for you. Good luck Rus 👍.

Had always wanted to see a non turbo roots blown version of EMD's 20 cylinder 645 series. Was never offered. Cant seem to find out if this was ever tried even on an experimental level at EMD.

I worked on a diesel-electric ship with 5 of EMDs that had this method of supercharging. We would idle them at 600rpm to warm up before putting online, which of course the would have to be brought up to speed (1200rpm) beforehand. Once at speed, you had to get it online soon as the lack of load wouldn't spin the turbo fast enough, causing the exhaust inlet screen to soot up and the engine to surge.

Please do more videos on EMD Locomotives

thank you

Gas is for cleaning parts, alcohol is for drinking, diesel is for making power.

I have a request, coolest sounding fuel pumps… air dog, fass, Bosch 044, holly top fuel pumps, to name a few..

This is an accurate vid. I'm very impressed. You even correctly called them Uniflow Diesel and omitted mentioning the dreaded 'Supercharged' word for naturally aspirated EMD and Detroit Diesel variants. For a short vid it is loaded with accurate information. Well done! I've got some things to add for those that don't already know these things and have a yearning to know more LOL. So as you point out not all EMDs were turbocharged but you show an excellent pic of a naturally aspirated V16 EMD at 4:25. You can actually see very clearly the Roots blowers - one per bank driven by the camshafts at the camera end above the generator. The EMDs were exhausted in the Vee whereas Detroits are coventional location. EMD Vee angle is 45deg and Detroits were 90 degree Vee if they weren't inline engines. Those style NA EMDs were never turbocharged as only Detroit Diesels had a turbo and a blower. The airbox pressure the blowers pump is 0.7 PSI over barometric at sea level. It was found (by Kettering) .7 PSI provided some altitude compensation and some compensation for hot days and combinations of hot and high. Also of interest, Detroit Diesel 92 Silver Series - so the very last automotive 92s, were originally going to use the EMDs hybrid turbo-blower but the impending move to 4 stroke inline 6 Diesels by the trucking industry was in the wind at the time due to tightening emission requirements. Detroit Diesel decided that it wouldn't spend the development costs on a hybrid arrangement for the new Silver 92 so instead stayed with the conventional turbo feeding into the blower of earlier turbo DDs. Turbo blowers were different to NA blowers because they had a bypass flap inside and boost pressure bypassed the blower lobes saving 30hp even though the blower lobes still rotated - so no redundancy in this arrangement. The aftercooler was mounted below the blower and was a liquid to air arrangement fed by engine coolant. In the Silvers, the injection system had electronic control called DDEC (Detroit Diesel Electronic Control). An 8V92TTA (TTA in Detroit Diesel parlance means Tailored Torque Aftercooled not Twin Turbo Aftercooled). Roots blowers on Detroits cost in the order of 100hp to drive which must be paid for in fuel so the hybrid EMD style blower on the Silvers would really have been something. We'll never ever know what could've been except to say the 475hp 8V92TTA Silver Series 92 would've had probably another 70hp and used less fuel producing that power. A side benefit of all turbocharged engines is they have built in altitude compensation ie they maintain their rated power at almost all altitudes below about 18,000ft (not too many EMDs at those kinds of heights). Blowers because they are a positive displacement pump, geared to the engine rather than free spooling also lose pumping capacity with altitude gain. This is because each chamber within it has a known displacement that yields a rated volume of air at sea level. As you go up altitude it can't supply sea level pressure anymore. A blower turned into a supercharger so put on say a V8 gas engine even though it pumps 10PSI boost at sea level still loses its capacity to maintain that boost at altitude. A free spooling turbocharger still pumps the same boost since exhaust is powering the compressor.

man, those detroits are mean as hell

Awesome video! I always wondered where that sound came from. One little detail you didn’t get quite right was that aftercooled doesn’t mean using an intercooler. An intercooler is mounted in front of the radiator and exchanges turbo charge air with cool ambient air. An aftercooler (on a Detroit or Cummins truck engine) is part of the actual intake manifold and looks like a box. It exchanges charge air from the turbo with engine coolant. Not quite as effective, but the older trucks didn’t have room for an intercooler up front.

Would love for you to explain cylinder piling on an EMD engine. How is it done? Is oil consumed in the process? Etc.

Indian Railway manufactured wide Range of EMD series they sounding awesome

Sweet sounds of diesel locomotives 👍

Are there engines with different sized pistons in the same layout?

Danke

GMs Cleveland 645 is my favorite engine

EMD uses roots too.

Talking about force induction diesel engines, i wonder if there's a chance you would do a video on the diesel engine setups used in semi-/truck-/tractor pulling sports. Takes them ages to rev up and make lots of boost, they need much more diesel fuel pumped into the cylinders, and i guess they add a water injection system which gets activated just short before the engine has to deal with the heavy load, for cooling reasons. I guess water injection is what changes exhaust fumes to very dense black smoke - but i actually don't know and would like to learn about it. Regards ^-^,

YEAAA LOCOMOTIVES!!!!!

Thank s

1:36 Pure music. I want a 12v71 so bad, I just can't afford one

What was that last locomotive shown at 3:53?

Good gear

I'm not sure if a crank shaft driven turbo is a turbo anymore by definition. In Germany we call that either a blower or a compressor, depending on the pressure.

EMD engines with roots blower has a more unique sound of typical two stroke end locomotives. All other EMDs sound like a GE engine

Indian railways operate so mamy emds and every one loves the sound and throttle up , in night trains it is even better when the cabin is quiet and all u hear is the awesome sound of this 4500hp engine ... Sadly the days are gone now most routes are electrified there is no new orders or plans to purchase any Diesel locomotive for passenger in service. Only wdg6 and 7s are being produced with emd 4 stroke diesel atleast those bring back the sound of alcos. But again those are getting less and less use as new 12000hp & 7000hp electrics are taking over. On the new freight corridor the catenary is made to take double containers and they have specially designed pantograph that extend to the height. Probably in next 10yrs all diesels will be gone .. only few extremely rarely used rural routes will have emds serving. All the alocs are already being scraped now or given away/sold to porer nations.

"Even at low-range RPM" *cuts to locomotives on notch 8 starting from a stop on a 2% incline*

I'm sure there is a future for a uniflow 2 stroke with an electrically assisted turbocharger that would be motorized at low rpm to ensure scavenging by drawing power from the alternator, yet generating electricity at high RPM as an electrical turbocompound.

these make 13psi of manifold pressure if anyone was wondering the root blowers made 3psi 👍

Too bad those 2 strokes couldn't pass the newest EPA tier 4 emission standards.. they still make it for export locomotives though

Wait, EMD two-stroke engines featured “turbochargers” that were driven off the crankshaft? Wouldn’t that make it a centrifugal supercharger, by definition? Semantics aside, this is very interesting information. I had no idea about the turbo being driven by the engine. Thanks for the excellent video!

Make a video about the most durable 2stroke bike

3:22 710 or 720?

How thet cluch work ?

Isn't a crank drivien turbo just a centrifugal blower?

So it's a procharger with a clutch that lets so of the wheel at a certain rpm so that the exhaust wheel can take over. Sweet.

Question.... Will it fit in my honda?

so its basicly a pro charger?

I could be wrong, but this looks similar to turbo-compound (not compound turbo) on old aero engines like the Duplex Cyclone.

My 2 strokes are cool again!!!!!

I'm surprised you covered emd design

Not a new idea here. The Rolls-Royce Crecy had a similar turbosupercharger setup while being developed.

I've actually been thinking about potential solutions for forced induction along the same lines as of late, and I think I came up with a solutiom of my own. Instead of using a complex twincharging setup, or an overbearing 2-in-1 design that relies on clutches, why not have two turbine blowers and a pulley/cog, all on a shaft with two inverted hybrid ratchet/flywheel clutches? The idea is that, if the engine is spinning the crank drive faster than the exhaust is spinning the turbo drive, then the system will run as supercharged, and there won't be any problems with parasitic power losses from the exhaust blower creating a vacuum and making the supercharger harder to drive. Then, once things start spinning up, the exhaust turbine spins up and the whole system falls entirely over to turbocharging once it's spinning fast enough to take over. Regular ratcheting mechanisms would wear out too quickly due to the friction wear, so a hybrid between a ratchet and a flywheel clutch would be needed for longevity. The ratchet for the supercharger cog would be toothed on the outside, and the one for the exhaust turbing would be toothed on the inside. When the engine is running low speed, the supercharger ratchet would be able to hook and be driven, while the turbo side wouldn't have enough momentum to pop out and drag (think of the clicking in a bycicle cassette, but too fast to even sound like clicking anymore.). But once the speed starts picking up, the teeth on the exhaust turbine would poke out, the shaft would start spinning with it, and the speed would force the teeth of the supercharger end to retract in. Such a system could either be made decently compact, with all parts being on a single shaft, the exhaust turbine could run the system off center through gears to allow for a non-1:1 ratio between the exhaust and intake, or all parts of the system could be physically separate, and linked together via chain or belt drive, increasing complexity, but allowing the turbines to be a lot closer to the intake and exhaust, enabling reduced manifold volumes and as a result improving the pressure buildup characteristics on both ends, massively improving the response of the turbines. This is my mechanical thought of the day, I guess.

The more O2 packed in to a combustion chamber the better bang for your buck. I wonder what the limits are to this concept? How much further can it be pushed to get more work out of the fuel that is being used?