Living in a country where these tools are forbidden I was always against them. I thought a prong and e collar was inhumane and animal abuse because of the one sided information we get! However, after listing to you Robert, Nino, Larry and other competent balanced trainers I’ve changed my opinion and I would use these tools on my dog if I was allowed, because I can see what good it can do. And, I can’t be the only one, so your knowledge has change my perception on these tools and I consider then ban here in Europe very unfortunate

This is fantastic. Im 20 minutes in and I can tell you that Nino is much easier to understand and follow then Ivan Balabanov. Don't get me wrong, Ivan is of course a DOG GOD but man its hard to follow along with him. Robert, you're the man! Thank you for interviewing this incredible trainer! I love this information!

One of the most important points Nino made, "training skill is subconscious" All knowledge comes from the innermost.

If you want to learn about ‘success’ with ANY tool……paint brush, computer, ECollar, whatever……go to the people that are successful at it.

Dog attacks are off the charts now which I think has several causes, but for certain avoiding all punishment for bad behavior is one of them. What would stop a dog from attacking if it has never been punished? It's very sad reading social media seeing all the dogs being attacked by other dogs. Quite rediculous how often it is occurring. Some people have even stopped walking their dogs.

Thanks for the video, it’s nice to see two real dogtrainers. We must stay together against the people the judge us because we love to train workingdogs. Nino is from a country where is a old dogsport culture like more other European country’s. The world needs workingdogs and this kind of trainers they can train this. 🤝🐕👍🏻

Would love for you to do another podcast, really looking into ecollars. Bark collars, invisible fencing, pros and cons for humans and dogs. And talk about the current bans/politics. You would do a fantastic job diving into this, invite Nino back to join even! It's time for an update for both!

I personally try not to make judgement on things I'm not familiar with that goes for in life too, I try and have a open mind doesn't always work because I am human and my emotions sometimes get the better of me, thanks for the video

Didn't have any idea that some countries choose to give the dogs futue death sentence rather than trying to communicate with them. I have recently introduced my neighbour to use a Herm Sprenger prong instead of the slip lead which his dog been so used to pulling on it that it had zero effect, jt choking himself out. My neighbour had a positive approach trainer (treats after treats to bribe the dog). His dog was reactive to certain dogs, I assume it's the scent of certain dogs that he finds threatening. I taught my neighbour to pop the leash and not pull it to correct his dog. Also told my neighbour if he loves his dog, discipline him, correct him. One weeo after, i can ses his dog wagging his tail more and not panting or coughing from choking. The thing is, if people know how to use a prong, it is the kindest tool on the market ever because dogs can finally understand what we like and what we don't. And if people want to use treats, it's ok, just reward him after he understands what we want. Before they come out with this law, banning of tools, they themselves should work with those problematic dogs that never been corrected. It's just so ignorant to think that dogs and humans are the same. They are on the route to make more crazy unstable dogs.

Thank you Mr Cabral & Mr Drowaert for a brilliant & open discussion. Much appreciated. 💯🐾

Hope you guys have another podcast, so informative, people need to research and listen to your experience and knowledge before taking on a dog, and understand what a huge commitment it is.

He's very advanced and knows his stuff. I could listen to this guy all day long because he's deep and looks at everything because its right and he makes sense.

Great way to start the interview. Brilliant statement from Nino! Just love it. "How the hell did you think this Malinois was trained to apprehend Al Qaeda. I'm loving the cross pollination of trainers I respect.

I haven't finished listening because I want to go back to it in pieces. I think for people listening and applying are two different things. It is difficult to apply when you have no one to correct you.

Took a few minutes to get rolling, Nino seemed to be reluctant at first to engage, but then quickly turned into a fascinating and in depth discussion - and a worrisome one for dogs (and the general public) if Nino’s prognostic as to what is coming down the line in the US is correct. One item I wasn’t clear on- in Belgium, are special forces/ police dog trainers held to the same ‘no force’ (no e-collar, no prong) training? If so, how is that not putting the public, the handlers, and even the bad guys in danger? And special forces will now have to engage with “ok in most circumstances” dogs? Hope that’s not the case! Lastly, Nino mentioned that many of the new Belgian dogs were just being sent back to Holland. What do they then do with them? Aren’t the Dutch under the same restrictions? Robert, if you have the opportunity to go more in depth on that particular aspect, I think it would not only be interesting, but would help people understand the consequences of where Europe, and possibly later the US, are heading. The public has greatly benefited in so many ways from advanced training with police, rescue, SF dogs, are we ready to step back 30 years and give most of that up?

This is such a good listen!!! The psychology is real!!!

Nino does some great work. Looking forward to watching this once I have the chance.

Now that I've watched... Loved the episode. Two of my favorite professionals; so, was bound to be good.

What a fantastic podcast. Nino is a very intelligent person, great discussion from you both. 👍

According to the law of thermal dynamics energy never gets to waste. Transfering the energy from our dogs positively into the world without leaks is the goal!!

Agree with Nino on those of us that have trained for years, much of what we do is subconscious , we don't even think about it. Yes some Trainers make it way to complicated . Energy exchange is everything . High level training is attainable but it takes a lot of work, which many people don't really understand. So true, there is no common sense anymore. What people will never understand is the incredible bond "symbiosis" that people can have when human and dog train and work together. It is the most amazing relationship to have but most dog owners who don't train their dogs will never know it. I can't imagine not having that close relationship with my personal dogs. This is a really great chat Robert and Nino. Thank you both so much.

This was great, Robert. Thank you. My favorite part is 12:54 - 14 min. This practical truth is priceless.👏

Thank you Robert for the interview and thank you Nino for your words! It really is validating to hear everything you said, especially at 31:00 into it. I am a trainer with BPD from my childhood PTSD, and your words about parents and drivers is so on point! I was bummed I couldn't make it to the Florida IACP Conference, but excited for next time!

In my opinion 1 of your best Guests yet.

Robert, common sense talk. Many topics to just think about and self reflect. Well done.

Never give up Nino! I’m sure we will get frustrated on the way but we in Europe must stand up for our opinion. Even if I am going to lose I will keep my head up. 💪🏻💪🏻 Thank you Robert for sending this interview with Nino. ❤️

Wow what an exceptional interview!

Robert has an interview method to get the best from the guests! Awesome Podcast!

Just getting to know the both of you and am very impressed with your wisdom and demeanor in general. Calm, collected, precise and effective. Thank You for the content. I am currently on the waiting list for a Skansen Kennels Giant Schnauzer that I wish to train for obedience, protection and would possibly tracking or search and rescue. Very likely I will take a course with if not both of you. Thank You for the content.

It’s all about results in the most efficient way. I see how my dog responds to tools. The best athletes in the world have tools…it’s about combine techniques to work for that specific dog in conjunction to breed. A lot of trainers lead to dogs that do most the work coming with a lot of energy already. I only take advice from trainers that focus on different breeds. Good interview and perspectives

Great video people knowing.what they are talking about. Good dogs has a good handler. ❤ your dog.

Great topic! The ecollar continues to be a tool looked down upon by so many even within the competitive dog world. I find it amazing that do many just cannot identify good and bad training whether the collar is used or not . Good job bringing these discussions to the masses.

Great discussion gentlemen! I agree with the scientific and psychological aspects Energy creates and attracts Energy, so it's like a surfer predicting how a wave will unfold Thanks Robert, and thanks for the link to another fine intellectual person in Nino

Great discussion, finally some rational discussion on KZfaq about training methods!

Dog training isn’t now or ever will be an exact science. Such as physics or chemistry. Sure the science exists, but great trainers transition seamlessly, between all the science tools and philosophies. Existing and making decisions in the moment. The art of dog training in my opinion is frequently about the relationship you form with a dog. Enabling you to create the required behaviours and at the same time… Satisfying for the dog. Because ultimately if it doesn’t work for either party. You’ll remain in conflict. It’s the use of all these elements that make this beautiful human dog interface an art. Otherwise if we look at the art of painting, which I’m sure it is if you analyse it in that way. Were the grand master’s painted by scientists or Artists such as Picasso or Rembrandt. That’s a great listen. Well done you guys 👍🇬🇧

Great great great content! Thanks for sharing this Robert! Started to follow Nino´s job since you posted it on instagram for the first time and im really enjouing it! Thanks again for this experience sharing, love both your jobs so, you two are great inspiration for me!

Nice this is what I love to hear , I have only studied dogs extensively since I retired , but , I have had off leash dogs all my life . My career , I am an electrician , but dogs is what I want to do

This is a great podcast. It gave me a lot of really good information. However as an avid practicing martial artist, the psychology portion related to "drivers" really makes me analyze my relationship with my instructor as well as my dog. (English Cream) THANK YOU!!!

We did really enjoy this Robert it was a great! podcast.

dogs need to know right from wrong .short sharp shock. When needed

Hi Guys I feel sometimes we watch too many videos and we get confused on them

Great video great interview Dogs training.

I'm having trouble finding the debate with Nino on e collars. Does anyone have a link?

Great guest! I think in regards to positive only training, people who find it hard to "punish" a dog for bad behaviour as they find it unethical are shooting themselves in the foot with large, high drive and dominant breeds. When my rottweiler was acting out during the teenage phase I only had to correct her (gently!) for like 2 times, which made her immediately understand that no means no. I can only imagine what I would have gone through if I had not corrected the bad behaviour..

Good stuff. Thank you for making such helpful content

a WOW interview

And what about police dogs...yikes. when they don't "out" the suspect...without remote collars that could be disastrous. I did see a great podcast recently, police k9 trainer. They train all the same drills while on muzzle, to teach the dog they can disable and tackle, taking down a suspect without biting as well. Oh! It was Ivan's recent podcast! So cool....but, they also use all tools. Imagine without the tools, doable, but less efficient and precise/reliable. Scary thought!

Hi there, great conversation. Where can I find the conversation between Nino and the professor who's name is not mentioned?

The province of BC is going towards that in Canada

Awesome video! Totally agree with the points made and I use these tools myself. At some point we also need to correct the misinformation out there, I'm watching a video now where the host is saying that these collars send 6,000 volts, and the top google result stats that the collars deliver a charge of 4,500 volts. Of course these numbers are from animal rights groups. Pretty sure most collars use 3 or 6 volt batteries that can't output anywhere near that voltage.

Thanks. I'll watch the whole interview when I got home.

Another classic Vlog interview

Pls do a pod with haz with shield k9 I love that guy and you so I’d love to see you guys talk

I like your comments about the people claiming to follow the “science”. I don’t think they have even read these papers they reference because the papers frequently don’t say want they claim they do. And a basic rule of reality - When theory and reality colloids, reality wins every time. Period.

I think what ever works, as long as you don't hurt the dog. Just have fun and enjoy your dog.

As a first time trainer & working dog owner I’m lucky to come across you both!! I found Robert about the time I brought my 8wk mal x Dutch home, and used Roberts videos with Ziggy to get started. I joined Nino’s MVP when my pup was 9 months old. I’m hustling to sign up for The Shelter Dog program and volunteer at my local Give a Dog a Home.

so, the differences between US and EU training methods are only the tools and mainly the use of e-collar? Is there any podcast or video you talk about when, and how to figure out that you need to change a tool for ex. from a normal collar to go to an prong collar?

Yes people overcomplicate all the time . Dogs are simple straightforward beings , just like a little kid , their world is all about right now , no past , no future . You just need the correct view .

One of the things I find really interesting. Is that if you look at the view count on this chat… Which through no fault of its own, it’s relatively low. When compared to another piece of content, which could be a very simplistic how to use a tool. Which may have hundreds and hundreds of thousands of use. But at the end of which most people will have learned very little. but if they were to take the time to listen to this kind of conversation. They may develop a much better understanding of what good quality dog training actually looks and feels like. It’s absolutely a craft or an art. Again the science does exist. But it’s not an exact science. Not all dogs are the same. The balances between any of the techniques you may employ, are subtly different. Whenever you are lucky enough to witness a really great trainer. Look beneath the surface, it will frequently be much more to do with the kind of relationship they have developed with a dog which then enables them to create willing responses to anything they are trying to do. This is where the balance is, if you have a great relationship with a dog. You will have the ability to correct that dog without losing the plot as they say. Simply because you have built enough credit in the relationship, to do this without upsetting the dog. I’m sticking with looking at this discussion but I’m not halfway through yet. We’ve got 20 dogs around the place that belong to other people, that need training😂 we only have them under our control for four weeks. But in that time we do focus on building a better relationship with the dog. Just as much as the actual training itself. Our job at the end, when an owner gets involved again. Is to actually show them how to pick up on this new relationship concept, so that they can actually make full use of the other training that we have put in place. Because if we give the dog back and just focus on the technical training side, but don’t show them how to improve their relationship. We all know what happens. I have wasted my time and they have wasted their money.

one is in Belgium One is in states! How do you both have same microphones? Hello from Romania

Excellent! Where can i see debate? Thank you

Does anyone have the link to the discussion you mention??

I’m 84. I’ve trained German Shepherds from backyard breeding , AKC, to German Schutzhund titled show line imports. I’ve always tried to learn from others through clubs or Professionals. My “tools “ changed but my love and relationships were always the most important. The results have been amazing dogs, males and females that loved and protected me and 4 small children with a usually gone Navy pilot husband. I’ve had them for the last 40 years As a single woman and mother. They’ve become awesome service dogs as I’ve needed them to be ,easily moving into that responsibility. I think common sense, consistency, being fair but firm and using “training aids” when necessary has given me great satisfaction and awesome companionship as my family became grown and gone. I appreciate your KZfaq and real life demonstrations awa discussions. Thank you. I still have a beautiful 13 year old female from German Schutzhund champion showlines that is the joy of life as we care for one another. These dogs need and deserve dedicated trainers to help them keep forever homes. Thank you!

the lack of education on tool use is a big issue as well as the root cause of the problem i.e. reason for reaction fear/aggression. when I was being taught horse riding it was common for heavy-handed people to learn to ride without reins, they weren't so reliant on them, those that had bad balance, tensed and bounced often had stirrups taken away to learn how to balance and centre themselves, results in incredible balance and light-handed riders. people to whip heavy weren't allowed to ride with them.

7 gsd in my life all different personality.s need to get a bond with your dog.know what is best for that particular dog.ie training .all my gsd. Never let me down.protected me and my family and property many times.they were always part of are family ❤.

Alguien tiene el enlace del debate que menciona?

I made my own tools by splicing and braiding ropes

yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!

👌👌👌

My experience looking back on my +35 year periode of professional dog training is that I now meet ordinary dog owners who put their dogs down because positive only training haven´t worked for them. In my consultations more than 95 % of dog owners have gone to positive only training with a very, very poor result. Here in Denmark it is common to teach ordinary petdog owners that they mustn´t say "no" to their dog. Every debate between positive only people and others, who think it´s natural to be able to say "No" to their dog, is impossible. Precisely because of the things you and Nino conclude. I see the hopelessness in Nino, - and I see how you, Robert, are trying to fight with fine arguments. But sadly I dont think that good arguments, lots of experience will win. It´s peoples feelings, not their knowledge, that will win, I think. It has here in Europe..........and it´s getting worse and worse. Lots of dogs are rehomed or put down because of peoples believe in purely positive reinforcement. And when, - typically the good dogs with high drives, becomes too much, - then they are put down, because it is the dogs fault, - not the methode. Ps. Thank you for elaborating your statement about dogtraining and science.

I’m about to bring home two adult rescue shepherds. Sweet beautiful dogs. 90-95% I would be for using positive reinforcement, and I would never hit a dog. I had a generally negative view of e-collars until I grappled with the idea of introducing these dogs to my cats. I’ve seen a shepherd break a cat’s neck in a second. I cannot have them chase my cats or let them react with their prey drive to my cats. So I ordered e-collars for them. I may not have to use them. I hope I don’t. I hope I can just return them, but if they start going after my cats these collars could very well save their lives.

Putting in the work trumps being able to explain the theory every time.

Robert listen to your guest again. He is wise. I don't know if your really hearing him.

I’m in the UK lots of positive only, about to ban ecollar s. I went for a walk on the beach and a lady was asking her dog to get in the car. I walked my dog for an hour and twenty minutes and when I came back the lady was still asking her dog to get in the car. I said do you want me to help you thinking you had physical disabilities, the dog was a miniature poodle and could have been picked up and put in the car. She said no thank you I’d prefer her to get in the car on her own accord because she wants to. That’s positive training gone mad. The lady must have lots of time on her hands

The problem is that since it is not allowed, there is no training or instructors to assign to dog owners. And the chance that the dog will get hurt is almost 100 percent. Even in countries where it is allowed, it should be a law that you can show that you have training in the use of electric collars.

On the bright side.. I can train dogs with nothing but body language. Dog might starve to death but hey

The overwhelming majority of well trained dogs and owners are in favor of using tools if or when needed. With THAT said, there's a very small minority of people that are actively working on proposing bills to ban the tools we need. WHY THE HELL is there NOT enough people advocating and protesting against these bills!?!?!? It makes no sense.

I wonder what these guys think of Susan Garrett’s work

a few weeks or couple months ago you left a response to me about Bark Box, i asked for an explanation and you never did…a hit and run snarky comment….I still don’t know why Bark Box is bad….

I'm watching this and Nate after listening to Zak George rant for hours about balanced trainers. In my opinion, it was nonsense.

A study of canine euthanasia, resultant of a lack training vs top pro w/tools sustained canines must be done. Done correctly. The “no tools” camp is leading many dogs to their death. It must be scientifically made clear.

1st understand Dogs are 'Binary' i.e. they move towards pleasure, away from pain and build your knowledge of training upwards from there. Learning complex details before the basics will confuse you. Just Learn, implement, learn, Implement... you need experience and feedback to research and improve

I have watched this inteview a couple of times and it follows much of my point of view . a dog works WITH you not FOR you !!

Two red circle patches. Which dojos do they represent? Is one Cobra Kai?

39:47 "All these people..." Yes, Nino. You included.

Did u say u met at an ICP concert? Like insane clown posse?

The problem is not using science, the problem is that most of the science available in dog training is not good science - unrealistic scenarios with too many variables. And that goes ESPECIALLY for the studies that are quoted the most as reasons to ban tools. There is way too much bias in how these were set up.

Sadly I can almost see many dog breeds inevitably just having to be banned as a result of all this nonsense. Which I understand is already an issue in some places.

I’m not against ecollar, how ever I do understand that ecollars are necesary for certain trainings… and you should use it IF it works on certain behaviors… I also understand that , for example… if it take a GSD (that a dog have a mean of 10 years) … it takes 5 years to learn something in 5 years without ecollar; and with ecollar learned in 2years… use the ecollar! I understand that depends on on a lot of things… but for god sakes… not a working dog with a job or sport… don’t use it.

Hi its goodnews If it happens , it's only new investors not a complete an popper take over the the owners still hold the majority of the club maybe there waiting for the payback of the Bellingham transfer money

All tools can be used or abused.

Nino agrees that scientific jargon isn't that useful and then promotes a bunch of pseudo-scientific psychobabble. I'm sure he does some good work with dogs, but this conversation didn't do much for me. Two guys building an echo chamber? I'll just add to the echo chamber by saying I think all dogs should have access to any helpful training tool, to include prong collars and e-collars (Neither of which I have ever used).

The only way anyone could possibly get to that level of training with positive only depends on genetics. Let’s get real. This guy works well bred malinios. In my opinion he lacks experience.

I would love to see him train Bullies and see how successful he is MALINOIS can make anyone look good

Lmao if you need an e collar you don't know how to train dogs. Smh