ESP32 in a commercial product? - From prototype to production

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9 ай бұрын

The ESP32 is a wireless microcontroller that’s really popular with makers and hobbyists.
But what about using the ESP32 in a commercial product that will be mass manufactured?
Is that realistic? And if so, is it a good or bad idea to use the ESP32 in your product?
Well, that’s what I’m going to answer for you in this video.
FREE GUIDE - From Prototype to Production with the ESP32: predictabledesigns.com/esp32
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@PredictableDesigns 8 ай бұрын

Get your free guide From Prototype to Production with the ESP32: predictabledesigns.com/esp32 And get your other free guides: Ultimate Guide - How to Develop and Prototype a New Electronic Hardware Product in 2023: predictabledesigns.com/guide From Arduino Prototype to Mass Production: predictabledesigns.com/from-arduino-youtube/ From Raspberry Pi Prototype to Mass Production: predictabledesigns.com/rpi Prevent mistakes by downloading your FREE DESIGN REVIEW CHECKLISTS for the schematic circuit, PCB layout, and enclosure 3D model design: predictabledesigns.com/design-review-checklists-youtube/ Want my personal help on your project? If so, check out my Hardware Academy program: predictabledesigns.com/Academy

@ThatTalkingDogGuy 8 ай бұрын

Gotta say, your videos, especially about getting a new electronic gadgets to market, are inspirational, and incredibly well structured and presented. And I'm not just saying that because my new device uses an ESP32! Seriously, in just a few videos, you have provided me with confidence in the correct steps I have already taken, and a solid - and thankfully small - to do list for steps I now need to take. Thank you so much for spending the time in crafting these videos!

@cdevidal 8 ай бұрын

I’m also working on an ESP32 product called SecureCoop for chicken keepers. What’s yours called?

@PredictableDesigns 8 ай бұрын

That's so nice to hear, thank you!

@mafhper 8 ай бұрын

I love working and having fun with these little esp32s. I always wonder what to do and the capabilities of this little sign always surprise me.

@SephironV 5 ай бұрын

The only ESP32 product that I know of that I use is the HaritoraX Wireless (not the Haritora 1.1b), it is a 17 gram ESP32 based IMU motion tracking device that you strap to your body. It has an impressive 20 hour battery life per module and the PC connection + flashing for updates is done through Bluetooth. It is not a flawless product because it is susceptible to drift and geomagnetic interference, however it is pleasantly functional in a good environment and I think it's one of the examples where they have taken an ESP32 prototype into production where the product isn't very far off from the prototype.

@jdsan6009 8 ай бұрын

Another advantage with ESP32 is that it can be programmed in Arduino, Micropython and C. The two first languages are useful in the prototype stage as they allow to test functionalities much faster.

@PredictableDesigns 8 ай бұрын

Yes, great point. I commonly suggest using the Arduino IDE with the ESP32 to simplify development. Thanks for commenting!

@cdevidal 8 ай бұрын

I love MicroPy but it is definitely limited in critical ways

@lanceharvie 6 ай бұрын

Great explanation

@PredictableDesigns 6 ай бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

@mauriciotavares5360 8 ай бұрын

Hi John, thanks for the excellent video! I think you could also comment about the programming tools for the ESP32. In my experience, hardware is at most 30% of the product development effort.

@PredictableDesigns 8 ай бұрын

Great point, thank you. I do tend to maybe over focus sometimes on the Hardware. But I do love software too.

@radistor_ua 7 ай бұрын

Hi John, nice and informative video, as all on your channel, thanks! But you didn't touch a question of the firmware protection. I believe that's really actual topic for mass-market products, unfortunately not very well highlighted at all. There are some brief instructions but nothing about how this can be implemented in serial production, for an example. And I want to hear your opinion, is this necessary from perspective that binary probably includes some token for cloud services and is this somehow solved in projects based on ESP32.

@TvistoProPro 8 ай бұрын

One of the reasons the ESP32 is so popular is it's predecessors, namely the 8266. They (or a variant) were used in nearly every Wifi-enabled switch/plug in the market until about 3 years ago, when the market started moving toward the ESP32 and/or similar chipsets. The open documentation put out by ESPressif allowed for easy hacking, and the rise of custom firmware like Tasmota. One could argue that using the 8266 was not the best idea, because it lacked some simple hardware level protections (efuse for write-only boot flash, etc). But with the ESP32 line, there are built in safeties one can turn on in production settings to prevent 99% of the hacking that was done in the 8266 line.

@PredictableDesigns 8 ай бұрын

Thanks for sharing that!

@HermanWillems 14 күн бұрын

Try building systems for the Army, any processor from China and many other products are forbidden. And you don't know about the backdoors .... YET.

@avmattos1 3 ай бұрын

The Emporia Vue 2 whole house energy monitoring uses ESP32 as well.

@PredictableDesigns 3 ай бұрын

Great to know, thanks for sharing that!

@momentomoridoth2007 5 ай бұрын

my xtool laser has an esp32 in its mobo. I had to smile to myself a little when I Saw it.

@srinivaastammaali2937 8 ай бұрын

Good Insights... Thanks

@PredictableDesigns 8 ай бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

@user-mr3mf8lo7y 25 күн бұрын

Wi-fi feature can be disabled, if not needed. On the other hand, #1 strength of ESP based modules is offering 4MB+ eprom.

@tookitogo 4 ай бұрын

5:49 One other big advantage of ESP32: availability. During the pandemic, when every other MCU manufacturer struggled to keep anything in stock, ESP32 products remained available in volume.

@PredictableDesigns 4 ай бұрын

Great point!

@seppeseppe-jq7nr 7 ай бұрын

is the esp working like sps s 7 from siemens? or is there a art windows programm who can make errors in controlling process? sorry bad englisch

@guatagel2454 6 ай бұрын

Thank you!

@PredictableDesigns 6 ай бұрын

You're welcome!

@richdobbs6595 5 ай бұрын

In considering my potential product, it seems like one of the comparatively expensive and clunky aspects is just connecting the signals together using cables. Dupont jumpers are prone to bad loose connections and don't have cheap connections with custom PCBs. So it is tempting to go with wireless data communication, but then you still need power. Is there a standard solution that doesn't require unnecessary WiFi, but instead allows a network of USB C cables, which can provide power and data, as well as cheap reliable cabling?

@PredictableDesigns 4 ай бұрын

If I understand your question correctly, yes there are lots of microcontrollers that support USB without wireless functions.

@richdobbs6595 4 ай бұрын

@@PredictableDesigns What are some of those microcontrollers? Especially ones that have ADCs.

@mytube1000javed 3 ай бұрын

Hi, how to change API keys and secret code in a commercial product?

@PredictableDesigns 3 ай бұрын

I don't know, and it depends on the product.

@sallyolle 8 ай бұрын

Thanks!

@PredictableDesigns 8 ай бұрын

You're most welcome!

@-Slade- 7 ай бұрын

I wouldn't say a microcontroller is not a microprocessor though. It has a CPU and cache just like a desktop processor. The microcontroller just has more embedded peripherals which makes it a System-On-Chip . Yes they are slower and less complex than their desktop counter parts but they do basically the same thing. Many modern Desktops CPUs now are just SoCs. The same can be said of arm processors vs arm microcontrollers they do the same thing just one is more powerful than the other. One Arm M0+ can be clocked at 133 Mhz as a microcontroller but be clocked at 800Mhz or above to be a processor for a phone or iot device. The esp32 itself can and does run operating systems and be used just like SBC. I think we forgot that microcontrollers were used to be called embedded processors

@PredictableDesigns 7 ай бұрын

Yes of course they are really both just CPU's. But they are very different from both an application perspective and a development perspective.

@cdevidal 8 ай бұрын

The external antenna doesn’t give better reception than the internal (a little worse, actually), and using an antenna with higher gain is forbidden by the FCC. The only advantage is if your enclosure is metal.

@lo2740 5 ай бұрын

very peremptive statement, which is also very wrong.

@cdevidal 5 ай бұрын

@@lo2740 I’m certainly no expert and could be entirely wrong, but why would you say that? I based what I said on the datasheets, are they wrong?

@kokalti 2 ай бұрын

So if ESP32 development board is already FCC certified wouldn't your custom PCB that the board will be integrated into have to be certified as well?

@PredictableDesigns 2 ай бұрын

You rarely will integrate a dev kit on a custom board, and instead it will be a module. Correct though, and using a pre-certified module doesn't get you entirely out of FCC certification, it just drastically reduces the complexity and cost of the certification.

@VeritasEtAequitas 6 ай бұрын

ESP32 has notoriously bad ADCs. You have to use attenuation and voltage dividing to match to avoid nonlinearity and noise problems. Even so, they're noisier than other MCUs. I avoid them unless integrated wifi is necessary.

@TheObiwantoby 8 ай бұрын

I believe ESP32 is used in the Whisker Litter Robot.

@PredictableDesigns 8 ай бұрын

Thanks! I'll check it out.

@calvinaizumiramadhan2685 2 ай бұрын

What type of the microcontroler that can use for industrial aplication and product john?

@PredictableDesigns 2 ай бұрын

That depends on what it does. Industrial or consumer doesn't really matter for selecting the MCU.

@HermanWillems 14 күн бұрын

@@PredictableDesigns this comment instantly made you an electronics beginner. It does matter, because proper chip brands have big track record on being able to keep a chip in production for x years. Also microcontrollers and chips from China are forbidden in MANY European products, systems and industries. Especially in the military. The ESP32 is only used in Chinese products. Your code is also less secure on a ESP32, while western chip brand really protect your code much better. There are so many reason why Western companies never choose for ESP32's even though they are amazing for hobby use and super cheap.

@VishalSharma-en9sb 6 ай бұрын

Namaste Sir, Thank You for the video. I am from India[ Bharat], I want to use ESP-C3FH4 Soc in my product for manufacturing, which means I need to make an antenna myself[ using PCB ] or I can use a chip antenna. So do I need an FCC certificate for this or not? I have read online that if we use the ESP32 module we don't need FCC certification, but for ESP32 SoC, FCC certification is required. Can you confirm if this is true?"

@PredictableDesigns 6 ай бұрын

FCC authorization is always required but using a pre certified module makes it easier and cheaper. You lose that benefit if designing a custom antenna so full FCC certification is required. I have a video here on certifications that explain this all. Cheers.

@VishalSharma-en9sb 6 ай бұрын

@@PredictableDesigns Ok, I understood sir, Please send the video link Thank you very much!

@thefreem0 8 ай бұрын

First I have designed many production systems using the ESP32... I will keep using them. However I do not TRUST them... there is a bunch of code I don't have access to that lives in the builtin ROM. It is used as a cheap WiiFi/Blutooth connection peripheral... the real product code lives in a trusted standalone micro-controller and I use an UART link between them. I would not recommend the ESP32 to be used in a product if all your secret sauce code is running on them.

@PredictableDesigns 8 ай бұрын

Thanks for sharing that and commenting!

@keithsummers1889 8 ай бұрын

Drop me a line if you know of any contract opportunities with the Esp32 . I have been engineering code for the Esp32 for over 4 years - C++/IDF. Thanks.

@DMS20231 7 ай бұрын

Do you think the ESP32 is phoning home??

@thefreem0 7 ай бұрын

@@DMS20231 Not necessarily... although that could be a possibility, I have not heard of anyone seeing that behavior. My main issue is the firmware is not secure with their design.

@keithsummers1889 7 ай бұрын

@@thefreem0 is there just one shed of evidence that offers any support at all to the idea that the ROM microcode is insecure? Typically, that firmware is hard coded and immutable. If they even remotely allowed anything nefarious to occur there, it could sink the company. Do you really think they would risk that for data that wouldn't mean anything to them? It just doesn't make any sense.

@platin2148 17 күн бұрын

Well already happened but no network access for this thing. You still have to certify and let you module be checked. Well the RF design is trivial for a real manufacturer that creates mass products.

@minteligencia 8 ай бұрын

Nice 😊

@PredictableDesigns 8 ай бұрын

Glad you liked it, thanks!

@icarossavvides2641 5 ай бұрын

Rather late for this video don't you think? I've personally come across a number of commercial products, in addition to the ones mentioned, using the ESP32/8266. These chips have been around for a long time and they couldn't possibly have survived if they sold only to the limited amateur market.

@PredictableDesigns 5 ай бұрын

That's true, but not every maker using an ESP32 knows this already.

@plcworker Ай бұрын

Ok, thanks for the explanation, but not everything is rosy. There must also be disadvantages,

@PredictableDesigns Ай бұрын

I'd say the two main disadvantages of the ESP32 compared to similar WiFi chips is their increased programming difficulty and lack of good tech support.

@plcworker Ай бұрын

@@PredictableDesigns Thank you very much for answering. I'm thinking of using a WFI32, the advantage I have is my experience of many years working with microcontrollers and tools, from MCHP, however, I must analyze the ESP32 option

@kevinparker48 5 ай бұрын

Yes, I too found the ESP32 incredibly buggy. They need to stop doing them selves a dis-service with so many branches and chip types now. esp-idf has become a mess and is unstable. They need to stop with feature releases for a solid 2 months to focus only on fixes.

@roscosmo 4 ай бұрын

basically every smarthome device i own is an esp32 under the hood

@PredictableDesigns 4 ай бұрын

Not necessarily, but quite a few are.

@lo2740 5 ай бұрын

i wouldnt call adding an antenna and a PI matching circuit a "fully custom RF design", ESP32 is a SoC, there is no "RF design", only a very basic matching and feed trace.

@PredictableDesigns 5 ай бұрын

True, but from a certifications perspective they are both considered custom.

@lo2740 5 ай бұрын

@@PredictableDesigns i know that rules are slightly different for FCC but for CE it doesnt matter at all if the module is "pre certified" you pay exactly the same price and all the CE-RED tests have to be passed in both cases.

@theagentsmith 4 ай бұрын

With CE certification it is a lot easier and cheaper if the RF module is pre-certified as they are allowed to skip a bunch of tests. Been there, done that.

@MaxQ10001 6 ай бұрын

What a strange question...

@TheNamelessOne12357 6 ай бұрын

ESP32 sucks at realtime. It just cannot react as fast and predictable, as other MCUs. Probably because it's SDK looks like a bloatware. And debugging is pain in the ass. I tried ESP32 and even created some working projects, but returning to STM32 was such a relief.

@HermanWillems 14 күн бұрын

ESP32 is powerfull and has many options. But in reality it's still a cheap toy and doesn't meet the professional specs. And in many cases is even FORBIDDED to be used by western companies.

@Ech01378 Ай бұрын

The worst thing in my opinion is the poor debugging method for esp32. Comparing it to stm32 it gets terribly behind. Espressif should care about it. Imagine a world with stm32 + wifi, that would be a pain for all those esp32 boards