First Fragment - La Veuve & Le Martyr - Composer Reaction & Production Breakdown

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Key of Geebz

Key of Geebz

Жыл бұрын

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🎵FIRST FRAGMENT: • First Fragment - La Ve...
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👴 Old Composer Reactions 🤘

Пікірлер: 162
@trve_ingvar
@trve_ingvar Жыл бұрын
Love to see the way Forest blows everyone's mind with his bass playing, he's by far the best imo
@Camadian
@Camadian Жыл бұрын
He and the rest of the band (Phill particularly) are great. The sound at our show in Vancouver was horrible tho and totally ruined the experience. I felt bad for the guys since it was their first time in town.. Ugh! One of my all time faves
@LemmyGibbler
@LemmyGibbler Жыл бұрын
I think he has already seen some beyond creation, but I think it may have been post-Forrest. The aura was phenomenal
@6ic6ic6ic
@6ic6ic6ic Жыл бұрын
The 🐐
@Camadian
@Camadian Жыл бұрын
@@LemmyGibbler played both that and Earthborn Evolution back to back today 🤓
@kristinkowalczyk9213
@kristinkowalczyk9213 Жыл бұрын
I have had such a bass crush on him for like the last 12 years and I'm so glad to see him getting more recognition.
@AzulYoshi
@AzulYoshi Жыл бұрын
Finally, some first fragment! This is the bassist from the first two albums of beyond creation
@guillaumeaudet3139
@guillaumeaudet3139 Жыл бұрын
...also in Augury and many more!
@ckokomo808
@ckokomo808 Жыл бұрын
Beyond creation…👌🏽
@M4570DON
@M4570DON Жыл бұрын
Oooooh. Now it all makes sense.
@groverXIII
@groverXIII Жыл бұрын
First Fragment was already top notch technical death metal, and then they added Forest LaPointe and honestly, that's just cheating. He's credited with "lead fretless bass" on the album, and it's well-earned. This album is incredible, and Forest's performance is probably the most incredible bass performance across an entire album that I've ever heard. The vocals actually do a good job of anchoring the listener into the melody and rhythm of the track.
@Pleistoneax
@Pleistoneax Жыл бұрын
For fans of extreme metal, "Gloire Eternelle" crowned many End of Year lists for AOTY. It certainly did mine. An absolute smorgasbord of virtuosity and styles that are packed together in this incredibly dense piece of music. Says something great about their songwriting--that they were able to incorporate so many phrasings at once, minding key and signature changes and modulations, in a coherent way. That and the lyrical content is meant to evoke the concept of the glory of eternity as a feast. That said, it's not a religious record by any stretch, but one which masterfully evokes the concept.
@6ic6ic6ic
@6ic6ic6ic Жыл бұрын
I've been recommending the title track of the same name as the album for a long time. Was just happy to see some First Fragment though
@byrongamatos7189
@byrongamatos7189 Жыл бұрын
It’s album of the decade for me, dasein was a sign of things to come
@samhorst9928
@samhorst9928 Жыл бұрын
the beauty of First Fragment is that... Sometimes it seems like every intsrument is playing a different song, but it fits together perfect, the 2 guitars playing different things and the bass playing something entirely different as well but its all in the same tempo and aligned with each other in beatufiul ways, theyre gods
@xxitz_pr0gxx631
@xxitz_pr0gxx631 7 ай бұрын
I saw these guys last night and I have to say, THESE GUYS ARE KILLER!!!!!!!!!!!! I have been listening to them for about a year, and last night was one of the best live performances that I have ever seen in my whole life! These guys deserve to be more well known. I think that if Bach and Beethoven were to come back to life, they would love this band.
@Acre00
@Acre00 Жыл бұрын
I love First Fragment. There's a real feeling of joy in their music that is rarely seen in metal, especially in tech death. In a lot of ways they remind me of a happier Archspire, but that really undersells them. I hope to hear a lot more from them in the future I'd love to see you react to In'el. It's a truly massive composition, in style, in composition, and in length.
@ckokomo808
@ckokomo808 Жыл бұрын
Agree with the joy in their music. Very fun and not too serious sounding…although hella serious musically 🤘🏽
@caixiuying8901
@caixiuying8901 Жыл бұрын
not only that but I feel like Archspire is kinda soulless and less technical First Fragment somehow manages to have so much emotion and meaning in their music, yet are still more technical anyways haha fucking love this band
@billybobthekidiswack
@billybobthekidiswack Жыл бұрын
There's lots of joy found in metal. Just look up any power metal band or majority of prog.
@deviousmind1092
@deviousmind1092 Жыл бұрын
@@caixiuying8901 "less technical" I won't argue you too hard on, but Archpire's vocalist is goddamn insane.
@zacknight9137
@zacknight9137 10 ай бұрын
Did you just say archspire are less technical than first fragment? Cmon dude, why the need to make everything a competition? Both play mind blowing technical stuff. Also the soulless thing makes me think you haven’t even listened to archspire because as far as tech is concerned they have some of the most melodic and catchy instrumentals
@cmartin26
@cmartin26 Жыл бұрын
What blows my mind the most is that guitar player #2 is actually the bassist for Unleash the Archers (hence the t-shirt). Too much talent.
@dlxfuentes
@dlxfuentes Жыл бұрын
Just saw these guys live earlier this month. I don't think I've heard as many notes played in a single set before
@malebolgue
@malebolgue Жыл бұрын
Listen to Gula and fall in love with the bass playing 😁
@jamesmcdonald2680
@jamesmcdonald2680 Жыл бұрын
I think he is the same bass player as in Beyond Creation, which you've reacted to before.
@whatTheFup
@whatTheFup Жыл бұрын
it is, Forest Dupont, he also played in Augury, Quo Vadis, and other Montreal based tech bands
@DoggoWillink
@DoggoWillink Жыл бұрын
He was yeah, not anymore though. I don’t think he was on Algorythm.
@racewest11
@racewest11 Жыл бұрын
Saw these guys live just recently. Even before the opener played, Forest was walking around the venue, chatting to folks, all while practicing and shredding with Bass in hand. The talent is absolute unfathomable. Great video as always Geebz!
@johnfoster7823
@johnfoster7823 Жыл бұрын
I think my brain just exploded....your not the only one decomposing here sir. WOW!
@ericsiemens9891
@ericsiemens9891 5 ай бұрын
I've had the pleasure of seeing these guys play this live (for $25 btw). The place was packed, and the hype in the room when Dominic started playing that slap line was so palpable; People were so ready to go nuts. When the full band finally came in, the place exploded. Not only was musicianship amazing, but the atmosphere of the show was also so much fun! They have so much energy on stage, and everyone should definitely go see them live if they get the chance.
@CitizenKang
@CitizenKang 25 күн бұрын
Seeing them live was mind blowing.
@gradypatterson1948
@gradypatterson1948 Жыл бұрын
That bass player - Forest? - gets more melodic content in two measures than most do in an entire song! And beautifully voiced and intonated on a fretless! I've been playing since 1980 - and I want to play like that when I grow up! And I'm not a big metal fan - more into more classic prog, fusion, jazz, and experimental - but, just *WoW!* I definitely see the similarities to Abraham Laboriel, too - another jaw-dropping player!
@R_G_S
@R_G_S Жыл бұрын
That fretless bass 🔥, great band!!
@Zaque-TV
@Zaque-TV Жыл бұрын
Major cacophony vibes with this just pure shredding. And then the bass. Gods the bass.
@evilervcowart6234
@evilervcowart6234 Жыл бұрын
I absolutely love everything about First Fragment...the production, the fluid technique and compositional awareness, the instrumental skill displayed by each member, the singer's voice and cadence. The only detractor with regards to this band is the fact that I do not understand French; which means that I am (sadly) unable to experience the full effect of First Fragment. I first stumbled onto the tech death band from Quebec when they released their 2016 masterpiece Dasein. I was immediately intrigued by what I was hearing and quickly downloaded the album for some offline listening enjoyment. I've been into death metal for many years...so, even with the growling nature of vocals in the genre, I'm still typically able to discern a fair percentage of lyrics by ear. With Dasein, I couldn't make out a single line or even one word. Using Google, I clicked the appropriate link and waited with anticipation to finally be able to gain a more thorough comprehension of my newly discovered treasure...only to be left feeling hollow inside when I realized that it was just slightly beyond the reach of my grasp 🥴 I still listen to Dasein and Gloire Eternellé often, but a part of me grieves over not taking French in high school when I had the chance 🤘
@RustyGonzo
@RustyGonzo Жыл бұрын
If it makes you feel any better, I took eight years of French in Catholic school (super fucking metal, I know) and I barely remember any of it now! I totally agree though with your first bit, too. FF imo are pretty high above most other tech death bands rn - and I love me some tech death.
@TheBeefPudding
@TheBeefPudding Жыл бұрын
@@RustyGonzo ahaha im the same although i was in immersion grade school. same thing cant recall mostly all of it. random words have stuck but other than that... meh. i think i just had 0 interest in learning it to begin with
@RustinRoark
@RustinRoark Жыл бұрын
Wow so stoked La Veuve was recommended to you...hard to breathe while listening to it
@rez6624
@rez6624 Жыл бұрын
I don't know if you have ever listened to, but Slice The Cake. I promise, you will be pleasantly surprised with this name...
@billybobthekidiswack
@billybobthekidiswack Жыл бұрын
I second this
@adamhenton6221
@adamhenton6221 Жыл бұрын
Well this is dope 🤘🤙
@Wrightworth
@Wrightworth Жыл бұрын
Very awesome to see this! Forest is one of the best, "Solus" and their near 19 min epic "In'El" are my song suggestions.
@scosstard3542
@scosstard3542 Жыл бұрын
That was dope AF!!!! Thanks for checking and reacting to them!
@honk1419
@honk1419 Жыл бұрын
love these guys, great that theyre getting more eyes on them
@stolentechniques2519
@stolentechniques2519 Жыл бұрын
Thank you for doing my request. Means a lot to me. Much love
@solame10101
@solame10101 Жыл бұрын
I've been listening to this album constantly this since its release. I really love the bass, but more than that i just find the entire neo-classical completely on point.
@emandude
@emandude Жыл бұрын
oh wow, this was my favorite song from last year. Seeing the thumbnail with the Gloire Eternelle album cover really blew my mind
@cerealkilla2794
@cerealkilla2794 Жыл бұрын
As you enjoyed the last one, I and I'm sure many fans of first fragment would love to see your reaction to in'el ... 🤘🤟🤘
@CitizenKang
@CitizenKang 25 күн бұрын
This is my fav reaction of yours. We all had the same thoughts the first time hearing this.
@Insanalyst
@Insanalyst Жыл бұрын
So good. Forest is one of my favorites ever.
@Kerosian1
@Kerosian1 Жыл бұрын
Alright, now you've got to do some Spawn of Possession. Huge influence on these guys, bands like archspire and many others. Possibly the best composer in all of metal, every track they have is a technical marvel. It's like a weird mix of Bach, Shostakovich, Bartok, and old school death metal.
@Soulfide
@Soulfide Жыл бұрын
Yeah but tell him to only review noctumbulant or cabinet lol that newest record is not the same vibe
@Sophia-pc7vu
@Sophia-pc7vu Жыл бұрын
First fragment is awesome, thanks for the video. :)
@jeremyredd4232
@jeremyredd4232 Жыл бұрын
I think Forrest's left hand technique comes from the fact that he holds the bass like a classical guitar. If you watch him play sitting, he has the bass in between his legs and one foot elevated.
@Penz0id
@Penz0id Жыл бұрын
Just saw these guys a couple weeks ago on their Canadian tour! And my friends got to open for them! 😁🤘🏻
@Camadian
@Camadian Жыл бұрын
Pinch harmonics to the max 😂 love everything FF releases but the number of guitar squeals is next level
@emmap8278
@emmap8278 Жыл бұрын
Yes!!! Explore some more Canadian metal! ❤️ Some incredible stuff! Quo Vadis and Augury are definitely worth checking out!
@shemsuhor8763
@shemsuhor8763 9 ай бұрын
Maaan the blue Augury album blew my mind back in the day.
@ballzheimers1782
@ballzheimers1782 Жыл бұрын
I have been waiting SO LONG for this. Thank YOU GEEBZ
@ProspectorAl
@ProspectorAl Жыл бұрын
That dude makes the bass sing like Jaco!
@steezydan8543
@steezydan8543 Жыл бұрын
This is my new favorite album, alongside "Masstaden Under Vatten" by Vildhjarta. After taking in this album and internalizing it, I absolutely cannot write guitar riffs without excessive counter point and harmonies. The first few times you listen, it's like sensory overload, but once you start to recognize each instrument's melodies and you can track it all in real time, it just blows every other album out of the water. Yesterday I ran 10 km listening to it, my legs are absolute mush right now lol
@steezydan8543
@steezydan8543 Жыл бұрын
Check out my channel for some of my compositions. I haven't recorded much on guitar, mostly just Guitar Pro versions of my comps. Working on "A Countable Infinity" and it's a tech death banger.
@ckokomo808
@ckokomo808 Жыл бұрын
This was my issue at first. I listened and was overwhelmed to a point where I couldn’t enjoy it. After a few listens, familiarity really helped me understand (well kinda 😅) what was happening and the album clicked. These dudes are brilliant!
@RustyGonzo
@RustyGonzo Жыл бұрын
@@ckokomo808 Oh definitely! Like a lot of tech death bands, I know when going into a new FF track for the first time I'm not going to immediately "get it", or the main themes or melodies aren't going to feel wholly apparent. Especially with bands like First Fragment, I'll probably have a blast trying to keep up, but I know it's most likely not gonna "click" right off. But it just makes listening to subsequent playthroughs of albums/tracks so much more rewarding as I sift through the writing and figure out how all of the pieces fit.
@christianmichael3120
@christianmichael3120 Жыл бұрын
Been waiting for you to do this one!!!!! Song blows my mind. My AOTY for sure
@gongal
@gongal Жыл бұрын
Extraordinary musicianship beyond creation
@6ic6ic6ic
@6ic6ic6ic Жыл бұрын
Juicy. I've been asking for some First Fragement since I subscribed. Glad to see you finally got to them! ❤️
@DoggoWillink
@DoggoWillink Жыл бұрын
He clearly has a lot of legit tech death viewers/patrons lol (or one really great patron).
@brennan2792
@brennan2792 Жыл бұрын
I saw these guys play a few weeks ago and I can vouch that they are absolutely jaw dropping to see live, too. Flawless set.
@bigman-ns7mo
@bigman-ns7mo Жыл бұрын
You gotta do Defeated Sanity for sure, anything off Passages into Deformity is nuts
@chickenmonkey6526
@chickenmonkey6526 Жыл бұрын
+1
@eddiestyo1537
@eddiestyo1537 Жыл бұрын
DS is nasty, but its so hard to understand their material.
@8o86
@8o86 Жыл бұрын
"What, what! I don't... I... This is, I -- I don't." -- Thoroughly honest critical assessment of this piece.
@Otero3D
@Otero3D Жыл бұрын
You really need to listen to The Pantheum, it has almost 3 minutes of solos battles (guitars and bass), you're gonna love it
@XenoTravis
@XenoTravis Жыл бұрын
I found forest's bass playing from beyond creation. Gotta say he fits in this band so much more. His talent levels is so much more level with the others. Love forest because he perfected the metal where everyone will hear the bass. It also doesn't sound like random bass slides and filler like some tech prog bands do.
@M4570DON
@M4570DON Жыл бұрын
It finally happened. You reviewed something I wasn't already familiar with and discovered from your channel.
@dans7510
@dans7510 9 ай бұрын
Having played a show with them last year, i can assure you, they are just as good live as they are in the recordings. Simply jaw dropping performance and stage presence.
@SpiderJerusalemJr
@SpiderJerusalemJr Жыл бұрын
This is some of the best shit that comes out of Quebec. One of the best places on the planet for tech-death. It's no surprise some people have dubbed Montreal the capital of metal!
@COBfan1996
@COBfan1996 Жыл бұрын
Another great band that i've been waiting for. Both of their primary releases are amazing
@skatemetal5062
@skatemetal5062 Жыл бұрын
I'm going to see first fragment this Friday in windsor ontario. Cheers 🍻
@cosmicparadigmofficial
@cosmicparadigmofficial Жыл бұрын
I was hoping you would react to this madness. 😁 Definitely one of my favorite albums.
@zanemullins9907
@zanemullins9907 Жыл бұрын
Love this band. Never thought I'd see you react to them
@selrahcit
@selrahcit 9 ай бұрын
Love seeing guys from Québec getting recognition from the legend himself
@NotRKelly.
@NotRKelly. Жыл бұрын
Thank u Geebz
@zooly132
@zooly132 Жыл бұрын
Wow, never knew they came out with a new album so this was a pleasant surprise. You're definitely the best reaction channel on youtube, you really listen and even teach me some things about bands I know. Can you please add Inferi to your list!
@MoiseDosSantos
@MoiseDosSantos Жыл бұрын
“In El “ by them is the only right suggestion ;) 18min of tech death madness masterpiece
@dodgrblu
@dodgrblu Жыл бұрын
immediately thought of Beyond Creation...and whaddya know, the bassist if from there
@PhilTougas
@PhilTougas Жыл бұрын
🤘🤘🤘
@tomkruze1304
@tomkruze1304 Жыл бұрын
Yes!!! Check out their song Gula, mind blowing. Forest is an amazing bass player, Beyond Creation is another great band he worked with.
@thenonillusive1769
@thenonillusive1769 8 ай бұрын
This song needs more solos 😂 I'm excited to see them live soon.
@joelh870
@joelh870 Жыл бұрын
Hell yeah! I suggested this a few months ago on KZfaq on the Eternity's End vid. Easily become my fav FF song. It's a shame it was just the playthrough though, I love the vocalist too - helps to ground the music with something a bit easier to grip onto, and punctuate the sections. The other tune I love off this album is "Soif Brulante"
@ryanrivers1259
@ryanrivers1259 Жыл бұрын
The mad symphony right. Love these guys composition’s
@larryhaug71
@larryhaug71 Жыл бұрын
🤯🤯🤯 Awwwright!!🤙
@teapotdome
@teapotdome Жыл бұрын
holy crap that bassist.
@mikethemotormouth
@mikethemotormouth Жыл бұрын
So when I got that acoustic intro, I said "Wow it's been a while since I've heard some Al DiMeola type flamenco. I'm ready. Let's go!" And then the fretless bass got going and I said "I'm sorry is Les Claypool guesting on this?" Then the guitar started up and I was like "What is this madness?!" And it was about the time you first paused that I said "Oh OK I get it. It's like Adebisi Shank on speed." I would say let's give them a hand but it kinda sounds like they've got too many already.
@Panda_SMM
@Panda_SMM Жыл бұрын
Gonna request The Cryptographer by Pomegranate Tiger. A new single got released today after about 6 years, the music video was made by A.I. and it's really amazing looking. This being in the description of the video: The art in this video has roughly 10,000 uniquely highy detailed individual A.I. generated art frames where each frame took approx 20 min to “draw”. That equates to a total of ~5 months w/ the A.I. working 24 hour days to complete all the art generated in this video. This work was all a result of "good prompts" which was originally distilled from an extra ~40,000 uniquely generated "bad prompts" art frames which never made the cut. The remaining "good prompts" were further reduced down and edited to a total of ~4 minutes run time to accompany the music for “The Cryptographer”.
@craiggoodreid7262
@craiggoodreid7262 Жыл бұрын
YES!!!! FINALLY!!!
@skatemetal5062
@skatemetal5062 Жыл бұрын
He's in my top 5 favorite bass player's
@larsmiles7231
@larsmiles7231 Жыл бұрын
You need to listen to Gula.
@rez6624
@rez6624 Жыл бұрын
Band or song, I don't know it
@honk1419
@honk1419 Жыл бұрын
@@rez6624 Gula by First Fragment and my nuts invert themselves
@larsmiles7231
@larsmiles7231 Жыл бұрын
@@rez6624 Another First Fragment song. Watch the bass playthrough lol. It's insane.
@joelhopper6897
@joelhopper6897 6 ай бұрын
Most talented Metal band to ever exist IMO
@cerealkilla2794
@cerealkilla2794 Жыл бұрын
How's it, would love to see your reaction to in'el by first fragment it will blow your socks off for sure 🤘🔥🤘🔥
@IdAefixBE
@IdAefixBE 11 ай бұрын
I love seeing outsiders organically discovering how technical death is all about musicianship, fun and humor xD
@joeysanzeri9198
@joeysanzeri9198 Жыл бұрын
you know what would be mind-blowing on this channel? if you checked out CYTOTOXIN- RADIUTUS GENERIS!! has to be one of the best TECH DEATH BANDS around right now, I'm sure you will be pleasantly surprised!
@groverXIII
@groverXIII Жыл бұрын
Man, Cytotoxin is incredible. Their mix of technicality and brutality is second to none.
@digitalmouse3314
@digitalmouse3314 8 ай бұрын
Got to love Unleash The Archers lol
@dodgrblu
@dodgrblu Жыл бұрын
Allegaeon - The Dopamine Void pt1 & 2
@veteran_of_pain
@veteran_of_pain Жыл бұрын
I never heard of this band.....gotta go find more now......HEY JEEBZ!!??!! Love a Cannibal Corpse Tune bro...no pressure >:)
@thrive9416
@thrive9416 Жыл бұрын
Spawn of Possession is a must sir
@steezydan8543
@steezydan8543 Жыл бұрын
OH, you wanted to see the drummer? Check out "Soif Brulante - Drum Playthrough"!!!! Dude just jams out, doesn't even play the song 100% to the track and it absolutely SLAYS
@thunderhead1969
@thunderhead1969 7 ай бұрын
such a sick band
@d4mdcykey
@d4mdcykey Жыл бұрын
When two out of three people in the room here asked _"Is that video sped up?"_ you know you have found musicians far above the fray.
@caixiuying8901
@caixiuying8901 Жыл бұрын
FUCK YES I WAS WAITING FOR THIS FAVORITE BAND
@WatchRayPlay
@WatchRayPlay 5 ай бұрын
The "With a fretless bass. Really?" got me
@LemmyGibbler
@LemmyGibbler Жыл бұрын
These dudes are out of this world. Check out pantheum next!!
@bbailey7740
@bbailey7740 Жыл бұрын
Geebz! You have to do “in the heavens above, you will become a monster” by An Abstract Illusion! It comes from their new album “woe” which is making waves and many end of year lists!
@onsyn5095
@onsyn5095 Жыл бұрын
My recommendation of the Geebz next video is Long Road, No Turns by Daughters
@burningtheevidence8038
@burningtheevidence8038 Жыл бұрын
11:40 maybe you're talking about Ryan Martinie from Mudvayne? He also poses his hand to the strings like you've explained.
@KeyOfGeebz
@KeyOfGeebz Жыл бұрын
Gary Willis from Tribal Teck is who I was thinking - thanks for reminding me to look that up :)
@mandala_skies
@mandala_skies Жыл бұрын
maaann you need to see Donovan Melero "Missed Injections" Drum playthrough the dude sings like hell WHILE making insane things on drum
@smoothjiminal4509
@smoothjiminal4509 Жыл бұрын
Love the channel . Please react to more ERRA. Any album. Any track
@coltonpugh9669
@coltonpugh9669 Жыл бұрын
AOTY as well as damn near if all time. Forest is hands down the best bassist in metal today.
@djuengst2000
@djuengst2000 Жыл бұрын
Wow, wtf was that? I thought they were rushing the tempo at first but no I think they were just getting up to speed. Anyway, thanks Geebz I haven’t heard these guys before. Great track 😊
@bqlicious
@bqlicious Жыл бұрын
Dont be scared for Forest and his fretless bass 😂 he got it haha
@ckokomo808
@ckokomo808 Жыл бұрын
Hey Geebz! I was speaking with my parent-in-laws who listen to lots of “classical” music and my father-in-law plays organ. I asked “what is classical music?” We had a great discussion. Curious on your (or anyone else’s) thoughts about this?
@Azzabajam
@Azzabajam Жыл бұрын
Wretched - The exodus of autonomy
@mandala_skies
@mandala_skies Жыл бұрын
I highly recommend Stephen Taranto (one of the best guitarrists alive, this guy is unbelievable). The track Pixel Heart: Celestial is really worth it
@AngryJT
@AngryJT Жыл бұрын
I wish you did Solus, but this is solid. PLEASE, DO OYSTERHEAD- PSEUDO SUICIDE! Live version on youtube. It's the first clip to pop up when you search Pseudo Suicide.
@ProgHead89
@ProgHead89 Жыл бұрын
If you ever want to do something more obscure but grooves hard check out the song "INANNA - Among Subaqueous Spectres". They're a pretty underdiscovered band from Chile. It's really groovy but also heavy in an old school way.
@ProgHead89
@ProgHead89 Жыл бұрын
smoke a lil before listening : )
@Yoshoggutha
@Yoshoggutha Жыл бұрын
All I can do during that bass solo is just laugh at the ridiculous skill!
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