I don't like that they've made them all look very similar though, the unique colourways and design elements were always something I quite liked about climbing shoes, adn it made things like those funky sportiva shoe chalkbags possible!

Futura has been around for like 10 years my G

​@@ethannewman6617 and the "new" mantra's were only 1 year old! I dunno, making them all look the same is a negative in my book!

@@tiktian RIP the speedster. I agree having different colorways is better but I do like the new color options. I think I would definitely try the new Futura/velcro Genius if its heel is good.

@@ethannewman6617 isnt'the speedster still available in europe?

I think they call it men's and women's because apart from the change in volume they use XS Grip 2 in place of XS Edge, or for shoes that come with the XS Grip 2 by default they reduce the midsole thickness to accommodate lighter climbers.

That’s certainly the case with their climbing shoes, but I’m not sure about their mountaineering boots. The climbing shoes - as per Julian’s comment - tend to feature softer rubber. They also (if I recall correctly) use a softer tensioning too.

LaSportiva does different things with different models. Skwama men’s and women’s are high volume and low volume. The new Katanas, as well as the Solution Comps, have the exact same last between men’s and women’s, but different midsole stiffness.

the sole on womens are thinner

@thatonefeller3375 Skwama men is definitely stiffer than women's. I wear womens fine but the mens model just doesn't bend at all it hurts my feet.... (then there's the Scarpa Instinct line which is even more confusing...)

I suspect these will be similarly narrow, but we’ll cover that in more detail once we get our hands on a pair to review properly.

I keep wondering when that’ll happen, because it can’t be far away. The Instinct VS and VSR are getting quite old now and it’d be great to see a refresh, integrating some of the things they’ve done with the S.

@@ukclimbingofficial but then again miura's are downright ancient and are still very popular shoes!

This is true, although Scarpa do have a track record of updating their shoes more regularly. That said, there is something to be said about ‘if it isn’t broke, don’t fix it’. Change for change’s sake isn’t always best!!

I want a Booster with Edge rubber, as I find the Booster to be a phenomenal all around shoe but could use for a little more small edges with that. Have to use the Boostic for this, but tons of differences.

Man if the vs(xsedge)/vsr(xsgrip2) came with the m50 on the toe and heel like the s that’d be 🔥🔥🔥.Also they need to do those updates and change the name of the womens vs to vsr and have the womens vs come with xs edge. Sorry for the paragraph, I’m just a fanboy 😂

You’re quite right, I go down several sizes within both brands, although how many depends on the model and the exact sort of fit that after. Either way, it’s very infrequently (if ever) anywhere close to my high street shoe size.

This colour way appears to be black and white in more ways than one, as people seem to love it or hate it. Anyone out there indifferent?! Didn’t think so… 😅

Sounds like its inbetween the quantic and vapors tbh.

You're spot on - it fits in alongside the Quantix SF as a part of their 'balanced performance' range. Medium fit, with a low to medium to profile. We'll see if we can pick up a pre production model in order to get a review ready for as soon as they're released.

It definitely has 3.5 of RS Rubber on the front. I think the very tip of the Flagship Pro is shaved off to 3 in order to decrease break in time and increase sensitivity. I could be wrong though

@@v0atmygym734 Is it just the tip of the shoe that will be shaved down to 3mm or will the entire front sole be reduced to 3mm from 3.5? UKC please confirm

You're right, there's definitely something slightly old school about it, but it's been executed in quite a new school way.

@@ukclimbingofficial IKR, it looks like those boots just spit mud, LOL!

Interesting observation. On the flip-side, I'd say that I prefer the trend away from it, as it often led to shoes bagging. The sweet spot for leater/unlined shoes always seemed quite a lot shorter compared to synthetic shoes.

Yeah I get where you’re coming from there. I think the balance for me is generally a mix, so something like what a lot of La Sportiva shoes go with with. A mix of leather generally in the forefoot, but then synthetics elsewhere to minimise stretch across the shoe length. That’s my personal preference at least.

Funnily enough, the Scarpa Vapour S which I reviewed quite recently did something similar, with a synthetic upper and a leather footbed. That's a good combination, as the uppers stay pretty much as you'd want them, whereas the footbed moulds to the shape of your foot a bit better. Leather also has the benefit of absorbing a bit more sweat than synthetic, which helps to keep your foot in place (synthetic footbeds are quite slippery in comparison).

I'm pretty sure that these were Spring 2024

No sign of them whatsoever, so I think you’re best hedging your bets with Unparallel. They seem to be doing a better job of making Five Ten shoes than Five Ten did anyway 😅

@@ukclimbingofficial it’s such a weird situation - particularly they have the likes of Janja Garnbret wearing their shoes 🤷‍♂️

@@mattmarcroft8931 and Will Bosi and Mejdi Schalck and Natalia Grossman and Miho Nonaka… list goes on, such a stacked team. Not to mention their mtb shoes and athletes. A bizarre situation and shame on Adidas for not publicly clarifying anything.

@@alexanderwootten5160 Rumor was that they were getting out of the climbing scene entirely, but then they went ahead and just reupped some of their older models and had success with Bosi so... dunno.

@@thesii213 that would be an absolute shame! hope it isn't true!

If the comments here are anything to go by, the new colours seem to have had a pretty poor reception

Yup, had the same issue, and switching to the Scarpa Drago LV fixed it.

A low volume shoe would certainly help, although it’s worth ensuring that they have similarly low volume heels. La Sportiva and Scarpa have always had a good reputation on this front, so it’d be worth starting there.

Also depends on where they are loose. I had the same issue, but switching to LV (Drago) didn't fix it completely, because it was not only loose on the side, but also on the back, even with me downsizing very strongly. Then it depends on the style of heel - solution comp downsized to hell is what worked for me.

I had the same problem. Theory too wide, scarpa vs are huge on the heel. Drago LV are a little better but still loose. I've landed on the dark blue tn pro from unparallel. Slimmest heel I could find. Love it

Yes lv shoes will help. Try out the instinct s or the evolv phantom lv. I had the same problem but with those two models, the shoe fits amazing

You have a truly incredible way with words 😅

If there's one thing that's struck me about brands over the years, it's how few of them actually listen to feedback. When it comes to the colourways, there doesn't seem to be many people who've posted something positive about them. Most seem to think they're a bit stale/bland. My main concern is from the perspective of a customer who's looking to buy a pair, only to be confronted with several pairs that - at least outwardly - look extremely similar. Colours can help to separate them out a little.

Yeah those colors looks like they're just prototypes and give the feeling of an unfinished product. Also as you said it will make harder to differentiate the shoes which is a weird marketing choice imo@@ukclimbingofficial

To a certain extent though we have this already, courtesy of the many different brands producing many different lasts. There's a LOT of variation out there already, both in terms of the fit and the rubbers being used. I guess what we don't have, which may or may not be what you're suggesting, is a modular option where you can combine different fore foots with different heels. I suspect that'd be a lot of efforts for brands to achieve and unlikely to happen as a result, although as per my previous sentiment - there's a LOT of variation out there already, so why would they need to?

It features 3.5mm Vibram XS Grip 2 on the sole, then Scarpa's M50 compound on the toe patch.

@@ukclimbingofficial A semi-agressive, semi-stiff shoe with the good rubber? Sounds promising. Would be interesting to know where it is positioned in relation to the Vapor series. I currently have the Vapor V, which are great on edges, but the XS Edge rubber is straight up bad on smears.

Id say wearing out shoes faster is very much in the manufacturers interesst. Do some reasarch on planned obsolesence. Every company does it and it was tought to me when studying engineering...

I can understand the desire for softer rubbers from a performance perspective, but I would - much like you - be quite intrigued to see a distinct, outright ‘training shoe’ that’s designed to be hard wearing. Indoor climbing takes its toll on your shoes and it’d be great to see something that’s designed to help combat that.

@@ukclimbingofficial i agree. i would like to see a youtube channel compare durability as a focus, keeping a running list and evolving the tests (ex min at 30# at 80 grit).

@@christophh9477 Same as in the running market though? On average a running shoe will last 3-400 miles for peak performance etc. A climbing shoe is no different. They're manufactured for performance and durability is, not a secondary concern, but the rubbers used are, through testing, considered the best you can get for performance and longevity. If you're after Longevity a Sportive Tarantula is a burly offering!

You can resole it a lot of time, with a different rubber if you want In my opinion a good rubber make alot of difference for beginners , not only for pro's.

yeah it's kind of wild the difference in pricese between US and Europe, especially now that there's more or less exchange rate parity!

I’m not sure of the US retail prices, but here in the UK things are being driven upwards courtesy of inflation, which has affected virtually everything - not just climbing shoes. In the case of La Sportiva and Scarpa I do think the price tag is justified, simply because they’re streets ahead in terms of their build quality. That’s not to say I like paying more, because I don’t, but equally I don’t think it’s just a case of them increasing prices for the sake of it.

@@ukclimbingofficial It's still cheaper for me to buy shoes on BananaFingers and ship them to the US. The Dragos are $133 with $15 shipping to the US while MSRP in the US is $220 before tax. Anybody else remember when the Sportiva Katanas changed colors and went from $140 to $200 practically overnight? I don't believe that "it's inflation" when shipping costs are back to normal and the EU pricing has increased by 10-20% while ours has increased by 30-50%. Not to mention Madrock hasn't changed their pricing over the past 5 years and has caught up on build quality, not that Sportiva had great quality (Solution straps, Miura straps, TC Pro laces, delaminations, the heel on a Testarossa ripped in half when I was putting it on??). Unparallel has also been crushing it with their newer shoes and has remained reasonably priced. I'll give credit to Scarpa's build quality though. Besides the toe patch on the Instinct VS delaminating on occasion, their shoes are built incredibly well.

Unparallel is still on top with the pricing im Europe.

Yep - it's the Spot

@@ukclimbingofficial Thanks

It’s partly no edge

Out of interest have you tried any of their more recent shoes, as their recent rubber compounds have been a massive step up? Zenith Pro 2.0 was unrecognisable compared to it's predecessor and very much in the same league as XS Edge. I haven't used Zenith Ultra 2.0 yet, but that basically sounds like it's designed to do something very similar to XS Grip. If you haven't tried them for a few years I think you'll be pleasantly surprised with the change!

@@ukclimbingofficial Hi, I have climbed over 30 different climbon shoes models and I have the latest version of the Dharma. For me it feels always that my shoe slides down from a bas hold or volume. Withe my other shoes it feels much more stable.

Ok, I don’t think you’ll have used the more recent rubber then, as the current Dharma features their old compound. You’re in for a treat as and when you try the new stuff!!

@@ukclimbingofficial if will have the chance to get my hands and cheap pair I will give them a chance. But from where do you have your information? Have you climbed one of these?

@@mikafull I reviewed the Boreal Crux relatively recently, which features Zenith Pro 2.0. I think that was their first shoe to feature the new compound, but it was a massive step up. It was perhaps even more noticeable within the new Joker, which has their Zenith Quattro 2.0 compound. The previous version of Quattro was impressively durable, but a whole lot less impressive in terms of stickiness. The new version balanced things much better, which is why I have high hopes for Zenith Ultra 2.0, because everything else I've seen from them so far has been a major improvement.

The Veloce Lace, which we’ve got in to review currently, looks like it could win that award, but this looks very good too. Tough call as to which will be better!!

I’ve found that flat vs “aggressive” shoes are more ment for the type of arch your foot has. Flat shoes are painful for me because I have high arch’s. I can wear my drago’s or boostics all day long but can’t in quantix’s or tc pros

What makes them so durable? In my experience the no-edge from La Sportiva for example lasts about 50% to twice as long,

@@Pedro28725stickier rubber burns out faster, especially on Walltopia walls; you can of course argue that rubber wear only scales with poor footwork, but the extra grit of those newer walls is certainly a factor I’ve had my slippers for 6 years with the stock vibram xsgrip2 which is among the stickiest, but may consider resoling in ‘grip 1’ or even ‘edge’ (more plastic-like less sticky, but more cohesive) to further prevent blowing through the rand and making them unviable for the 2nd resoling

I bought a pair on Boreal Ninjas a few years ago and love it!!! The classic Ninja slipper was my favorite in the 90’s. This updated version is excellent imo.

It'll be interesting to see how they compare in use. Always feels strange doing these presentations when we haven't worn them, but watch this space - we'll (hopefully) get a pair to review once they're released.

The Origin VS is likely more suited to being an indoor shoe, but that's not to say it couldn't be a very comfy shoe for some low grade bouldering outdoors. The toe box I believe will be slightly narrower but similar!

This was pretty much our thoughts too. No reason it couldn’t be used outside!

Definitely the new color ways is super dull. The new Mandala looks good, but making the rest of the shoes look the same to make them appear like a “family” kind of sucks…. I think of it like a lazy design process where they just made one color way and copied along all the shoes with minimal differences, in few words, they lost their uniqueness. IMO they should have done a color/design update with similar details but with very different color ways.

It's interesting to see how much this has divided people. It'd be interesting to know the reason behind the change, as I'm assuming it's off the back of some market research.

Sadly, no one's bringing them into the UK at the moment so we didn't get a chance to see them. Any shoe designed by Fred Nicole has peaked our interest though!

In some cases it’s because the UK distributor/sales agent doesn’t import them, in others it’s because they’re not made. Neither is a particularly great justification mind, because they’d certainly sell - albeit in smaller quantities 🤷🏼‍♂️

I'm a size 12 and I have loads options and shoes?

@@smashbadger2460 Something that was pointed out elsewhere within the thread, but might have been missed here, is that if you do have size 12 shoes it's unlikely you'll still be a size 12 within a climbing shoe (although I suspect you know that already 😉).

@@smashbadger2460 share info plz.

I guess they thought it was a good idea 🤷‍♂️

I think the leather dying process involves heavy metals and undesirable stuff ecologically. This white colorway might be more eco-friendly. I hope.

It's to appeal to the wider base of people entering the climbing world

It's always tough when a brand changes something that you already like, but I wouldn't be too worried, as I think the change they're making is for the best, as the Solution Comp heel is (in my opinon and the opinion of many others) a step-up from the one used on the Genius and Futura. All fingers crossed that they not only fit, but fit BETTER once they arrive!

The Genius is overall more aggressive in heel tension, downcamber, and asymmetry, and the midsole is larger. I think you will see the 0.9mm Laspoflex used akin to the Solution Comp as compared to the original Solution. The Genius uses laces because of the structure of the toebox, while a Futura you could warp this toe box a little much and therefore simply use this fast strap system.

Genius wider

We reckon the no edge tech, plus the heel and build quality may make it quite different from the Hiangle.

Scarpa seem pretty into laces/lacing at the moment, although these are obviously exceptions to that. The Veloce Lace seems like a good example of this, as it’s a massive improvement on the velcro/strap version. Alongside that there’s the Generator, although that is getting a strap version sometime in the near future too. Either way, I don’t think laces are dead - it’s just that the focus most definitely seems to be on strap and slipper.

Laces definitely give you a more precise fit, but they can also make the shoe feel a bit stiffer, which - if it’s a super soft shoe like this - isn’t what you necessarily want. In terms of durability I’ve reviewed a lot of both and have never noticed a difference.

I had several Velcro models and all of them got damaged after a while and didn't hold well anymore, while the models with laces, which if damaged, can be easily replaced 🙂

Out of interest, do you have quite narrow feet? I’m assuming so, given that this isn’t a problem I’ve personally experienced and I’ve reviewed a lot of Scarpa shoes over the years.

​@@ukclimbingofficial Hello, first of all don't bother the whole capslock thing it was a joke, but the core of my statement remains true : Scarpa always use straps that are way too long and will protrude for a standard foot. My feet are pretty standard and scarpa is the only brand where the straps will stick out that much.

Interesting, this isn’t feedback I’ve heard before - especially from someone with a regular foot width.

@@ukclimbingofficial The Veloce is the model with the most obvious issue

I still think that Italian design is years ahead of everyone else's. Whilst you can question the aesthetics, the quality of construction is unrivalled.

Yes, but at the end it’s all about style, innit?

I’ll feed that back to them when we next see them 🤣

Us, the shoes, or both 😅