The simple solution is to offer a 'Classic' toggle option to revert to the previous look/feel.

Thanks for the discussion. I think the take that only a few really noisy people should be ignored by Garmin is a pretty condescending take. Many of those commentors, like me, aren’t usual members of Garmin forums because it was working fine and I didn’t mind small issues. And frankly, if you have 1% talking loudly there is probably another 20-30% that are unhappy but won’t say anything. And yes, inside of 2 minutes I turned off the in focus because it is about half the phone display for limited info. I am quite competent and comfortable with changing application settings. But when you say you can see 6 things at a time I have no idea what phone that is. On my standard size iPhone I can only see 2 metrics and half of 2 more tiles at a time and a good 1/3 of that is empty space. And it’s weird. It became a vertical reading order vs horizontal. It’s like reading vertical language vs left to right. And, the previous page was customizable enough for me and I had it organized exactly how I wanted to see it. Garmin threw that all away for me without asking which seemed more than a tad rude to replace it with their “superior” organization.

Garmin have gone for form over function. The new app has lost data, function and customisation. Another case of enshittification.

I think you can tell by the limited videos about the update that Garmin is probably pushing them not to say to much about it negatively. Most people I talk to that have used it for a while really do not like it.

I love my SB20 so much. Y'all have no idea. My whole family has been flogging this thing for years and it's bulletproof.

I personally do not like the V5 update. I utilized the home page a lot for quick look and it is not as helpful the way I've utilized it over the years. I think the tiles should be able to be rectangles like before because on phone screens its to crammed together. It has added a lot of shipping and clicking that was unnecessary before. Adding the items one wants to see is no big deal, its the layout and squares I don't like. I hate having the home page synced to the web app as they have different use in my opinion. This is causing me to rethink the Garmin echo system as I was getting ready to purchase a set of Rally XC 200 pedals for my new gravel bike but now will probably go the SRM route. My final thing is I talking today to someone with vision issues whom said Garmin was very unhelpful after the change and not being able to see the information in the squares like she was able to before using the contrast of colored background in the rectangles. She said that Garmin basically said sorry but really seemed unconcerned so she is shopping for a different platform.

GC 5.0: I’m neutral to the homepage change but removing the dashboard functionality in the web version hurts 😢 as the customizable homepage does not offer what the dashboards offered what could be put in there.

The old homepage was great. I could see everything I wanted at-a-glance. It was simple and sophisticated enough.

Customization, customization, customization. Give the user the ability to configure, whether thats Classic, or new, but make it customizable.

I bought apex pro 2 fews days ago switching from polar to coros because I don't want an amoled display for ultra race and for now it seems that Coros is the only company that follow outdoor users necessity and not influencer users necessity!

GC5: Im a relatively new Garmin user, so I never got used to the old one, but I still disliked the new one not because of the data, but the lack of customizability. As you guys said, there are so many different types of users, and different stats are important for different people. As it is now, the "in focus" section and the "cards/glances" section are just very limited in what stats they can display. If they just allow different stats to be shown in focus/glances, maybe even allow users to "Rearrange" the home screen, that would already be incredible. I never use/look at desktop view so cannot comment.

Not interested in an Amoled watch, unless it can match the battery life of MIP and have always on without any risk of burn in. Maybe we'll see advancements in the tech, but for now MIP is my choice for a sport watch. I've had an Amoled watch (Venu 2), so I have tried it. It's not bad, but there are drawbacks, just as MIP has its own pros and cons.

People were not upset with the beta because they could switch back. A majority of the beta testers gave negative reviews on the UI. Garmin didn't care, they didn't care at all.

I used to rely on the garmin app to look for stats. Now I'm back on the watch, reading the "all stats" just like on my old fenix 3. Great move Garmin 🙄

They could have offered the option to keep the old UI as well as the new UI

@Desfit's video helped to understand how to customize the GC 5.0 app. Thanks...

Great to hear from both of you.

I have been living with the Garmin Connect update for a while now and nah, I just don't like it! I just felt the old version of the home page was more intuitive. Simple as that :)

Why don't Garmin have a simple feature where they show a popup saying 'Do you like the new update to the Connect homepage? Yes/No vote, and then they can see whether it is just '1%' of users, or not. I have a feeling it's not. Likewise, it's kind of lame to say 'i've gotten used to it'. Good UI doesn't need you to 'get used to it', it should just feel better.

It's the desktop version that has the problem now they sync it with mobile. It had cards for goals and equipment that didn't exist on mobile. Now they're also gone from desktop. It also had an easy visual way to add/remove/move cards, now you have to go to another page.

There is a clear lack of a dashboard that shows a lot of info without scrolling. Some people prefer that. They could have offered a one page dashboard in addition to the tiles approach.

Garmin should take a page out of Whoop’s playbook in terms of actionable insights. It is one of the better UXs out there that brings what matters front and center in a very elegant way.

My only gripe with the new Garmin UI is that they forgot to think about people with small phone screens. I don't mind the UI as such, it's just that I cannot make it work in my iPhone mini :(

Interesting discussion on the UX changes. There are so many flavors of Garmin devices and in turn users, the attempt here is really to allow people to better tailor what they choose to see. I appreciated Des' video earlier in which he talked about having something like the Yesterday layout for Today in the new UI. Personally, I'd be more happy if the mobile Connect app supported offline sync so that everytime the server has a hiccup, the app wouldn't be quite so useless.

The thing is that if I want to see some data and thus I have it in the focus section then I only see the 1st card without scrolling (sideways) so this is just stupid. There could be a quick fix though: if they renamed it to something else that more reflects what it is could help. I don't know, something like: "big useless box that hides interesting data you could see if this wasn't here"

WHOA I DIDNT KNOW THIS WAS A THING! I watch you both!

I’m using GC 5.0 since Beta…now the final one…it looks ok and have more info than before…really like it

I frustrated at first during the beta. Took a few days to reconfig the desktop and get used to where things were. But form and function seemed to work out together nicely. Few typical quirks, but nothing egregious. I like all the data upfront and it's nice.

I added just one item to the "In Focus" section. That elminated the part that was most confusing to me- scrolling side-to-side in one section, but having to scroll up and down in another section.

Apple Watch screen mirroring is called "Multidevice Workouts" [Edit: 'device', not 'screen'] - a name definitely focused at developers, not consumers (29:14-31:04).

Amoled is nice but should not get too hot and burn out. I also think it would be better to replace the solar ring, which costs a bit of your screen, with a wrist chrono system and charge something based on that movement. I hope that they remain Outdoor focus and do not become so mainstream smartwatches for everyone. like Garmin and Apple who are now trying to be more outdoor with ultra. I do hope that Coros will make the apex 2 pro line design as a high end model with a flashlight 🔦 Spotify, KZfaq and Amazon music with nfc and I would like maps a bit like Garmin with more information. street names rivers mountains etc.

I've got one of the original stages sb20 bikes apart from initial problems with the flywheel bearings ,it's still going strong. It performs better on zwift than any turbo trainer bike combination I've ever tried

Good job guys! Informative as always 👍

I'm sorry dude but saying it's only one percent of Garmin users that are upset is just completely downplaying the issue and actually is an incredible statement to make when you don't actually know how many percentage it actually is that don't like it. It's just unbelievable statement to make and sounds almost like you're protecting Garmin.

Great stuff. Do you think Strava will ever have a coach to athlete interface?

In what way is the sb20 not a smart bike? Agree it hasn’t got some of the feature of kickr or neo (in fact it is the only bike to have dual sided PMs), but it has everything needed to use on Zwift, with trainerroad etc. mine has been pretty much bulletproof for two years and was bought at literally half the price of a kickr.

Desktop widgets was the best, its a example of UI for widgets I used to show as an example

On the subject of wrist based heart rate seasons I think it comes partly down to the individual. I’ve got two watches, a Garmin Epix Gen 2 which is my main daily driver and a coros pace 2, which I use as a backup for key workouts and races. I find that with the Epix gen 2 a chest strap is a must, most of the times it’s ok but when it goes wrong it goes badly wrong, especially in cooler conditions. However, the pace 2 is almost as good as a chest strap for me. I think it helps that it’s a smaller watch and has a tighter fit compared to the Epix gen 2.

I’m neutral on the GC5.0 layout. I do however have 2 criticisms. Firstly, it’s still as buggy as the beta, after a watch sync, sometimes the UI updates and sometimes it doesn’t (I’m talking about the iPhone app). Secondly it’s still just numbers without telling me anything useful with what to do with those numbers, and on the screens that do offer advice they sometimes contradict each other. Recently it was telling both that my training was spot on and also I was doing too much and needed to ease off The home page needs a summary in words of what all your data means

Is that new Epix on Ray's left wrist? Meaning Fenix 8 is coming? and I just got Fenix 7x Pro as a gift from my wife :D as far as Garmin Connect 5.0, since I'm new to the Garmin's ecosystem, can't comment on changes. still trying to figure it out all the stuff on my watch and in the app :)

GC 5.0: no more possibility in the web version to add tile with goals (german: Ziele) - to see yearly total distance of cycling or running (under goals only the distance left for a goal could be seen)

Any update on a instinct 3 ?

Question: how come Des has a mic and AirPod pros? Is there a lag or echo somewhere on their end when recording?

I actually like the new version of Garmin Connect; however, I do wish they (and Strava etc) would produce a version of the App that is optimised for iPad - especially in Landscape mode.

My issue with Garmin Connect is that they mirrored it to the web page. They should be two independent platforms. I have different use case scenarios for each and they shouldn’t correlate unless I want them to.

Define cleaner interface please! Lol, fonts that are too thin are not easy to read. Especially on the move (like an athlete). Bolder fonts are better IMHO, but not aesthetically though, and the choice was made for pretty. Personally, I prefer the farm girl.😅

You guys have to talk about your take on instagate.. and requesting some KZfaqrs to not disclosure sponsoring

@thefitfile Regarding GC 5.0, I get your point that it depends a lot on how you use(d) GC but there are just some things i don't get. E.g. the redesigned web-version, it no longer uses 'real' links but fake java-script links. Meaning middle click in the web browser does no longer open tabs. Only right clicking works to change to the 'content of the tile you clicked on'. For some tiles ctrl-right-click works but not all. Links are the base of anything web related. How can one screw that up? Granted i guess not many people used the old dashboard just to open lots of links but garmin really had to do work to get rid of links.. just why?!? Actually most of my dislike stems from the web version.. some of that was also mentioned by des.. we lost information when comparing to the old dashboards (segments, goals, gear, newsfeed, reports...) Both combined makes the new web version a lot harder and more cumbersome to use. In fact now that web and mobile mirror each other I don't see a reason the use the web version anymore and i don't mean this in a good way. I used the old dashboard to analyse my data and feel like that got taken away from me or at least got way slower and harder then before. Reversely i feel like the new mobile version is much slower to get an overview now. One has to swipe through the 'in focus' infos.. That takes up to five actions where as in the past one could simply scroll down (fast or slow) and get the same information in the old GC. Same goes if you have more then 1 activity in the today and yesterday sections.. you have to swipe, thats slower and takes more actions now. The 'at a glance' is similar in a different way. There is only a limited amount on the homescreen, and the limit of 20 in total means less info then before and slower to access because i can't simply scroll over it but have to enter an other page to see all 20 and then go back for the rest. Also i don't actually want to see training plans and events on my mobile but have to because i want it on the webpage. In short to me this means the mobile version is less useful because the web version gives me an faster / easier overview. But I don't want to use the new web version because its showing a lot less info then before. But at least i think it looks prettier now..

Oooooh.. I see a watch face dance off happening!

Thanks to this "update" I've switched back to my old apple watch. It does what I need it to do and more. I hate the new UI that much and it's a slap in the face not being able to have the old interface. Oh well...

your description of a quick view of overall health statistics on the Garmin watch is spot on. The level of customization is crippled by their requiring the use of large blocks.

First I lost my interest to Amoled Garmin watches, and if the new Fenix will come with Amoled then that will be the end of the Garmin watches for me. Then I lost completely my interest to open Garmin connect these days. No clue why they change the dashboard and not provide the user to switch back to classic.

I use the Desktop 95% of the time so I'm not thrilled with the change. Not that it was great to begin with, but the tiles limit what I can see at a glance & are not as helpful as it was. I've done all the edits to get what I want to show up in the order I want, but it doesn't give me a greater view than the mobile app does. I haven't sat & configured the mobile app yet. I went to use it and realized it changed, closed it & haven't gone back.I will work with it but at the time, the update had changed everything I recognized & I didn't have time for that. I hope more work will be done to improve both.

Exactly what I did. Just turn off the "in focus" 😊

It is still TILES in Garmin! Like in Windows 8!

Garmin made a jumbled mess. Not intuitive, at all.

I don’t care about the UI change, I just wish Garmin would let me sync devices when I’m offline in the backcountry

The new interface doesn't work. I have stopped wearing my vivoactive4 completely, and will likely migrate from my garmin edge bike computer to a Wahoo. It is unusable to me

So basicly since Garmin does not care, what other brands are there for fitness watches? It feels like they left the goal open for other companys now to take over the crown easily

Hope Stages survives, still love my SB20 after 4 years.

CG app is digastable.... but CG web page is one big drama. Where is my last (today) traning? O! small brick down there... Nothing available without clicking to, finding the old stuff...

The Connect section is just pure gaslighting from your end. What you're basically saying, Garmin can't do no wrong, people always complain. Completely missing the point (obviously we all know why) that: a) not many people complained during beta because many if not majority dismissed beta, many were hoping beta will never go into production b) there's 0 info from you or Garmin as to why Garmin felt they needed to change something that worked flawlessly, rather than focus resources on fixing blatantly obvious issues and bugs which had been ignored for years c) the design they invented is pure 🤮 on mobile, the amount of wasted, empty space in each tile makes me question how many fiverr credits Garmin spent on this exercise - not too many, maybe a fiver or less. Funnily enough the web interface looks aesthetically pleasing, since tiles are spread evenly unlike the previous design where there was chaos.

The app is crap. If I have to configure it to get something meaningful, aka the standard values 80% of the users are interested in, the UX/dev team did a terrible job. Same if I don't see a simple option to get something I found to the home screen. Same if I have to click 10 times to find something - or give up. Same if there is no search field to easily look for "HRV". Same if I CAN'T EVEN FIND AN ACTIVITY because there is no search/filter. Come on. There are many values where you are not sure if they are under "health" or "training". If they are shown as a number or a graph. If you have to scroll right or down on a page that looks like maybe the right place and hope, that you will find what you are searching for, If you could find a history, and if, then in what form, how long back, and if it's a graph with or without the possibility to get numbers for for the last days or weeks. It's a UI mess (btw, like their bike computers and their smartwatches).

Now you're both saying pickle. 😂

Presume you’re going to call out in your next update the fact that Zwift have just increased prices again. UK £12.99 to £17.99

People usually have difficulties adapting to changes. That being said, I enjoy the new UI but, as mentioned earlier, would appreciate a better channel to report bugs (bugs, not cosmetics/ideas). There is one bug with the hydration glance that I've reported back in February during beta and it remains until now that it has been rolled out to general public.

The new 5.0 UI is awful. I can't find the information I need, it's clunky to use and wastes way too much screen space. Old interface was actually quite good. Please either fix this or give me the old interface back!

Garmin Connect, more bloody colour.! Its dull AF.!!!!!!!

I can’t believe how clumsy the new UI is.

The update is terrible. I’ll be moving away from Garmin as a result of this.

Great video guys. I am glad Garmin is working on the app, not perfect but noting is in the end. I am getting use to it and don’t mind it but would like to see the changes you suggested in the other video too. Good tease on new products looking forward to seeing what’s on the way…

The Garmin discussion made me open up my phone to comment on this - I actually think you’re undercounting the negative response to the new Garmin UI. It sucks. Its a backwards step. I had the beta and didnt say or comment much because I could switch away from it. Now that it’s permanent, I like it less. Its great Des has gotten used to it but the next iteration of this from the last was a plain-ass switch from one type of card to another that is less interesting and less intuitive. I appreciate you guys love Garmin (I do too) but this update sucks and should have remained beta / optional.

Any new Garmin watches on the horizon in the near future?

The new one is better. It takes a moment to learn it and set it up, but once you do, it's far superior to the old version.

Not a fan of amoled screens on watches, never will. A watch should always display the time, whether I'm looking at it or not. RIP Pebble.

I wish my garmin asked me every morning how i’m feeling. Subjective feeling score is an important data point that the garmin really misses.

Forerunner 45 Getting Back Forerunner 55

So Coros is trying to copy what Apple did before with its iPhone naming scheme, adding an S to upgrades of a product, which they started with the iPhone 3GS and stopped doing with de XS.

i think garmin fail is impressive. They released completely unfinished software and forced it on everyone like we all are free beta testers for them. In they own statement from january excepted finish is in december. there is zero configrabily if you compare this beta with windows phone tiles, and we all know how windows phone ended. in focus shoud be focal point, as name sad, but its completely unfinished joke and can't be even put on top of screen. They can have 150000 milions of watch wariations that nobody want but they can't let me have prooven (good or bad) classic look instead of beta look. And garmin response is no response!? I can also make comparison when new few years ago yahoo ceo wanted us all to use new webmali that she personally designed as it will beat google mail to pulp (in original in purple colour) ... i'm still using clasic version...

Definitely, more than one percent are upset about the Garmin connect update. I truly believe you two aren't being honest about your feelings about the update, and I would guess sponsorships cause that dishonesty.

I hate to say it, but I'm not a fan of AMOLED displays. I'll just buy a Samsung, pixel or an apple watch if I wanted a phone on my wrist.

Terrible uodate. And I bet it’s a lot more than 1% of people that are upset. The homepage is the most important page in the app. It should be condensed (like it was) then you click out your metrics that you want to see in detail. Not a bunch of overly large cards you need to swipe through. Just give people a choice to go back to the old homepage.

Obligatory "Amoled sucks", no matter how hard tech influencers try to sell it. The only point that gets addressed is battery life, which is only good enough with AOD in giant watches. Wake me up when there is no burn-in, when funny gestures are not needed and when I can choose white backgrounds in-activity screens.

Who cares about garmin connect as far as im concerned it runs in the background and needs no ui

the garmin connect 5.0 app is terrible

I love the Garmin Connect 5.0, it's a heck of a lot more readable and customizable than the old version. Sure, it's not perfect, but I think it's a big improvement. The two "in focus" and "at a glance" sections are great specifically because of the difference in density of information. The old style had everything equally sized...and that didn't reflect how I use it. Now I have my Training Readiness, Training Status, Body Battery and Cycling with big, useful charts, and then my HR, HRV, BP, Stress, Sleep Score, Weight, Load Focus and Endurance Score as the half-width tiles. I kept Sleep Coach and Yesterday on, and turned off Events, Training Plans, Challenges and Last 7 Days for a much more succinct home page I can scroll through, get ALL the info I want but not be overwhelmed. Ray is right, I think people just need to go through customize it until they like it (and the wizard was quite good).

Garmin 5.0 - some people - Do. Not. Like. Change.

I like the Garmin Connect update!

I like Connect 5.0!