Great job and very sensible suggestions here clearly from someone who has done these projects. Its nice to see constructive suggestions to improve as everyone can learn.

Thank you

48k btu

@@stevensghost945 Ty

Thank You! I really appreciate it!

Thank you 👍

Thank you

that seems extremely inefficient. But it's Europe..nothing is efficient due to guvment regulations.

@kevincorapi137 efficiency would be dependent on the heat transfer coefficient of the different tube materials, soil type, ground temp, moisture content etc....

Not really, in Norway and Sweden we drill geothermical wells.

@@OddEdland Wells are probably the most common in Finland too, but fields are used also.

@@OddEdland It depends a lot on how much space you have. Difficult to install a ground based system with long loops on a smaller plot among other houses. Then drilled geothermal wells might be the only solution. But, if possible the ground based systems are usually cheaper, in particular with complications when drilling, and seems to work just as well, even here close to the Arctic Circle.

I like that

Thank you

There is a booklet with tables that allow you to calculate the dia, and the pitch of the coils and exactly how many feet of pipe a certain dia, pitch = how many feet of pipe it consumes so as to allow you to have 30 feet of single pipe at each end to have enough pipe at the end to make it to your header without any splices.

This is how the geothermal engineer designed the field. The system is currently running at optimal performance and maintained consistent temperatures throughout the winter. So I would say it was a successful install!

The video's description suggests that the "white sand" is actually rock dust, i.e cushed rocks, and probably very similar material to the rocks that were pulled out by the excavator. I think this is a good medium as it will have lots of surface area and only a bit of space between the granuals; I think it is quite close to a sandy loam soil. I think the runs could have been better spread out, but there is a lot of overlap along the slinky anyway, so it's not an efficient system anyway, but it does minimise the amount of soil that has to be moved.

Every site has its own engineering issues and every soil has its thermal properties. If you need more contact there is nothing wrong with coiling, it means more contact and more length for a given area. Remember that at 5 feet deep the soil is pretty stable thermally speaking. Here in FL I would have white sugar sand. Almost no heat retention or transfer really. The only good part, during the hottest part of the year the sand is usually WET, and by that I mean inside the water table. This actually would make geo a great option most years.

There are different kinds of thermal loops. There’s ones where they just run 4-6” tubing in a single loop, and the run is like a quarter mile long. Do you want to tear up trees for geo? I don’t. Looks to me like they used the space they had available. Someone else said this system is 48,000 BTUs which is enough for a 2400 sq ft house, and that house is closer to 1400. So I’m sure the engineer knew what they were doing.

​@@tlangdon12what's the purpose of it all

The piping full of water/glycol can handle the pressure of properly compacted soil no problem. Remember the water is incapable of being compressed so it gives the pipe tons of strength.

Geothermal has been around for decades..They don't use garden hose! They usepoly pipe. 200 psi poly pipe is some seriously tough stuff.

@@machaf ok thank you.

Kind of looks like western PA or Tennessee to me. One is consistently cold in winter one gets the cold but may not be immersed.

My mother in law has an air heat pump. I don't know what her energy bills are, but I do know that when it gets cold enough (below 25F, let's say), there's a limit to how warm she can make things. One time, it was 5F outside and we all brought our home heaters to help heat her place up, because it wouldn't get above 58F. The colder it gets, the less efficient air heat pump work, as they continue to try and suck hot air out of the cold. Finally, air heat pumps (I think) only work through ducting, su if you're retrofitting a solution to an existing baseboard heating system, for example, an air forced heat pump don't be right for you. My oil boiler just died, so I'm trying to figure out what to replace it with. I wouldn't want to rely just on

@@dontbanmebrodontbanme5403 higher efficiency heat pumps can work in colder conditions. Newer hyper heat pumps can work down into the Fahrenheit negatives. Geo is good for extreme cold that stays less than 0 often but generally ends up costing more than just buying a 24 seer greenspeed carrier or a mini split system. Really depends on your climate. Geo would also be good for those areas where the temps are staying up around 120 regularly

The plate on the Tesla said New Jersey.

@@dontbanmebrodontbanme5403 her heat pump should have auxiliary heating which just uses electric to heat if it gets too low. heat pump is always worth it in the long run and geothermal too. if you're in a cold climate you obviously want a good heat pump for cold climates.. there are many different ones hers sounds like it's for texas, lmao

No sorry, I only handled the outside portion of the job. The HVAC tech did all the internal work.

If youre doing it for yourself or youre paid by the hour, absolutely!

@@davidbelanger2681 I guess you’re not aware there’s a whole world of people out there that don’t mind paying quite a bit more for higher quality work, and the extra attention to detail. Not everybody lives in a $200,000 bungalow in the suburbs of Omaha.

The operating fluid would normally a water/glycol (anti-freeze) mixture. Temperature returning to the house will be the temperature of the soil at the depth of the trench, which will depend on location, but will probably be 50F (10C) or thereabouts in Pennsylvania. I've no idea how cold the water coming from the house will be. This will depend on the characteristics of the heatpump, but I'd expect it to be a few degrees above freezing.

Yes it was and your right, I never thought that I would have gotten into something like this. When I was 5 I wanted to be a garbage man lol. I thought it was so cool they got to ride on the back of the truck.

@@srmcontracting yeah, me too. You get to push the button and activate the hydronic and crush the trash. It's was always fun to watch the garbage men crush couches and TV sets. My brothers would run out side all excited just to watch the action.

@@srmcontractingI wanted to be a garbage man too… that truck that could lift and empty our neighborhood dumpster was too cool! Where did you learn all of this stuff, some geothermal class or school?

Stone dust

HDPE pipe fusion joints are 99.999% reliable, and last 100+ years.

@@davealmighty9638 Good to know. Thanks!

Hvac tech here. If it ever leaks you have to dig it up to fix but most times it’s a small leak and we would add an autofill system. So it just refills the system on its own as it leaks down. Really depends on the leak

@@Rgrinkleson That makes a lot of sense to me. Thanks for the idea!

It's a closed loop system, in northern NJ . Thanks for watching

Thank you, I can only imagine. I believe the whole thing cost 50-60k. There is also a major tax credit for these systems. Thanks for watching

So far i know, to spread sand underneath and on top of the pipeline was not a good idea. Sand isn't such a good hit conductor, at least not like the soil. He may loose some efficiency right there.

​@@SpiderF27 Did you read already about sand battery? It can retain the heat... But I don't know if is good for that stituation!

@@universoALC I know about sand battery but that is totally different system. Sand preserve the heat. I this case the sand will act like a insulator and the pipes and keep the heat away ....

sand is not a good idea.

The entire idea is to MOVE as much heat from the ground INTO the coils during winter, and REMOVE as much heat from the coils in the summer INTO the ground as possible. The less resistance to heat movement the better. That said, it might be good to have a layer of insulating soil well above the installed system to protect from cold air in the winter, warm sun in the summer.@@universoALC

Sounds like for your climate and soil type you needed both a deeper trench and more loop. Engineering the system for your specific needs has struck me as potential for this being a waste of time and resources or an exquisite use of nature to positively impact the pocket book and the quality of life.

@@levitheonlylevi20474ft isn’t deep enough u neeeded probably 8ft most time it’s 6ft but I live in Alabama and work for road dpt and in summer time when we dig for sand and gravel sometimes at 6ft ground dirt is dry powder but once hit 8ft and deeper the hole gets a lot cooler and damp. I believe if I was doing one of these systems 8ft deep be the least and I personally be 10ft deep to make sure it’s 100% efficiency as possible. Think about it if u we’re just barely enough wouldn’t take long for the area around the tubing to not be working well.

Same here - curious as to how many hours of labor went into the trench work - don't leave us in the dark!

Thank you, I was on site for 7 days. About 8 hours each day

I thought about that but I was running out of places to put the dirt

@@srmcontracting a easy way to do this in future is just strip the soil and push the the edge of work site and make like a 4 foot top soil wall all the way around job , the all you soil will sit against it . Over all a good job . I live in Australia . Can you please explain why this is done ? Is this normally something you would use in areas that snow or ?

Ironically, we have the opposite problem! Above 6' under ground is the frost line, and that's no joke here. Crazy yours comes out so hot! What's the point of a water heater with that? Do you have a heat pump to cool your water?

@@MrXzylonx It's only like that in the summer. For the rest of the year the water comes out relatively cool. But when it's 118 outside with no cloud cover, the ground gets pretty hot. The surface temperature can be 150-180+ degrees. And no, we have nothing to cool the water. The best we can do is just let it run long enough to empty the hottest water out of the lines until it comes out lukewarm, like 100 degrees or so.

​@@KurNorock Wow! I didn't realize that was even possible, but it does make sense with the surface temp being so high. Where do you live?

@@warpedfusion Arizona.

Were systems really put in at 6' with 15' front line depth??!

@@slaveofjesus3878 that is what the company who did mine said they were planning , untill I told them it was all solid rock at the six foot depth. I have to assume they did others at the six foot depth. But six months after they did mine they closed their company, maybe poor installs were the reason for that

It was a drone, Thanks for watching

it isn't even deep..

This is true, this technique to prevent cave-ins is called soil benching. In Denver for instance you can't dig deeper than 5 feet without benching. All that load above the cut is just more weight than the soil's shear can handle. Always think of soil shear as a 45 degree plane.

Results were great! Everything is working as expected

I don't think that is possible because to build the foundations of the house you need undisturbed soil. Soil that has been removed and then replaced is very difficult to get recompacted to the strength it was before it was disturbed.

When you do your septic field just dig two three feet deeper and put coils down there

Yes but it's not ideal

You’d need reallllllly wide footings

Yes, We are double our loop system under slab. It more effort to get good compaction for a structure. It's doable. Going below a leach field is not a bad idea.

Stone dust

The more contact the pipe had the better the heat transfer will be.

Probably old as the hills!😂

Moraine from sheet ice?

It's HDPE, I believe it has a 50 year warranty.

I believe the whole thing cost 50-60k. There is also a major tax credit for these systems. Thanks for watching

Cool watching you work. Hopefully you live near a blue area and can cash in on "muh climate change".

@@srmcontracting How much of that 50-60k is excavation/laying the field? I believe the tax credit takes 30% off the total.

So you wouldn't have a bill as big for electricity after, but how many years does it take to pay off the loan for this work?

What was the largest expense for this system?

NJ, it can be 100 in the summer and 10 in the winter

What did your system consist of (trench depth, loop length, open or closed loop, etc...) and how do you like/dislike it?

@@levitheonlylevi2047 3000' of 1" hdpe in a 36" pitch slinky (6 500' branches) 7' deep for a 1900 sqft ICF home we keep it at 69F year round and in summer loop temp gets up to 100*F I was honestly hoping for a lower loop temperature, but My Land is high and dry sand For the amount of Btu's. I move to Keep the house as cold as I do I probably should have gone with an even bigger loop field. I have a 3 ton climate master 2 stage. If I could do it again. I would have moved the loop field down The Hill where the sand is a little wetter.

@@SolarTechFL good into, appreciate the pointers. I'm up in the Inland PNW so temp is a little more moderate here. We might see 100° for a week or two in the summer time and might see sub zero temps for a week or two in the winter. I'm considering geothermal just as a safety net/consistent relative indoor temp for my 5000 sqft shop and 600 sqft home. I'm a redneck so trying to gather some pointers on a completely built myself without too much fancy or expensive doo dads... basic is my hope so long as it can be made effective=time and money invested.

Nice to do this. No actual pricey compressor-type heat pump needed. Just circulating loop pump through car radiator with breezebox pushing/pulling room air through! CHEAP!! Then can divert heated ground loop to hot water heater heat exchanger coils to cut THAT bill!//Steve B.

Thats what i had in mind also @@stephenbaker3680

The field design was 6 ft deep. Thanks for watching

It works for both. I'm not an HVAC guy but my uncle is. He explained, since the ground temp doesn't fluctuate like the outside air. It lets the condensing units operate much more efficiently.

@@srmcontracting thanks

I think the whole system was around 50k.

Yes

That's how it was designed by the geo-tech engineer. They run heat transfer rates based on the type of material surrounding the tubing.

@@srmcontracting amazing video and thank you for the info.

if it's wet it's just as good as anything else... but yeah you have a point.

Putting the coils that close together isn't good either.

@@number40Fan this is a slinky loops geothermal system and is valid.

@@zaaz1471 Everything I've read is that there is supposed to be some space between the loops to keep one area from being saturated.

@@number40Fan saturated by what? It's a heat exchanger. The more surface area you can get in one area the more efficient it will be. Any temperature differential will be disbursed in the ground. The only concerns here would be a pump strong enough to circulate the fluid and the tubes chaffing and creating a leak.

its a ground source heat pump, also known as a geothermal system

The coils were pressure tested and all joints sprayed with bubble solution.

@@srmcontracting i understand every manufacturer has their own methods but I would darn surely think a leak could be found a lot easier if the system had water in it, that’s how we used to test vacuum trucks.

I'm shocked you can type

The depth was only 6 feet. It doesn’t get THAT cold where he built this at. The engineer that designed it knows better. Our frost line is 3 feet, but outside of maybe 2-3 weeks a year, 3-8 inches you’re down to unfrozen ground. At 6 feet that’s still 36 inches of insulation at worst, (I would dig my system at 10 because I can, but 🤷🏻‍♂️) and 69 (nice) inches at best. Not to mention the crushed stone will create the frost from happening. This is the correct way to do loops when you have restricted land though. If you have 200 acres, run the 200 acres in straight lines. If you have one acre, you run it like this.

@M21assult it's not about how deep or how cold the ground gets naturally. It's about how much energy you are removing from the ground. Think about a household freezer (ice box) if you had fewer loops of pipe in there, it wouldn't freeze, but it would still get cold because energy is still being transferred to outside the appliance. Add more loops of pipe in there and the food would freeze faster as more energy can be removed because there is more surface area of piping to remove it within the freezer space. It's the same principle in the ground. Remove too much energy from too small a space and the ground WILL freeze. Small plots of land need boreholes to go down vertically. People don't do this though because it is expensive. In Sweden they run the system in reverse in the summer to put the energy back into the ground ready for winter, they treat the ground like a battery.

Sure, if you want to dig a mile long trench

Not necessarily. Depends on pipe sizing & desired gpm for the system design. This is actually a very valid way to condense necessary trench size provided the loops aren’t so tights as to pinch the pipe.

Finally someone is making sense......

I'm not the HVAC tech but "I think" it would just be over kill to do 160. The system itself operates under 10 psi so us testing at 60 is already well beyond what it will ever see. Also pushing things to their max limit seems sketchy to me anyway. Thanks for watching