Great Beasts of Legend: Underwater Panthers and Their Place in the Native American Cosmos

Рет қаралды 16,019

7 жыл бұрын

Annual Petersen Lecture: Dr. Megan Kassabaum, Weingarten Assistant Curator, American Section, Penn Museum
Archaeologists generally agree that certain beliefs about the cosmos are broadly shared among indigenous peoples of the Americas. Though the details vary wildly, the world is generally seen as consisting of three layers-the Above World, the Middle World, and the Beneath World. While we live our every day lives in the Middle World, the Above and Beneath Worlds are inhabited by a variety of supernatural beings. One of the most intriguing characters to inhabit the Beneath World is the underwater panther, a composite creature with both feline and serpentine characteristics that is associated with the dangerous yet beneficial powers of rivers, waterfalls, whirlpools and caves.
For further reading:
Howard, James H. 1960. ‘When they worship the underwater panther: a prairie potawatomi bundle ceremony,’ Southwestern Journal of Anthropology 16(2):217-224.
Saunders, Nicholas J. 1998. Icons of Power: Feline Symbolism in the Americas. Routledge (London).
Townsend, Richard F., and Robert V. Sharp, eds. 2004. Hero, Hawk, and Open Hand: American Indian Art of the Ancient Midwest and South. Art Institute of Chicago in association with Yale University Press (New Haven, CT).

Пікірлер: 81

@proudsnowtiger 7 жыл бұрын

I love these lectures, but the audio is always... difficult. Difficult in different ways every time, but invariably - difficult. Can't tell whether it's the audio in the auditorium or the recording that's got issues with levels, but please, please, please sort them out.

@youtuub 5 жыл бұрын

when she spewed forth nonsense ..that's when they pulled the mic away

@ladykoiwolfe 3 жыл бұрын

She actually stepped away from the mic making it hard for us to hear and never went back. The audio would have been hreat if not for that.

@nunyanunya4147 2 жыл бұрын

i love when smart people cant use technology :)

@mileswilliams9737 Жыл бұрын

Why isn't her mic attached to her shirt? I can't stand it when this happens. Wearable mics are cheap and at this point old tech. There's really no excuse not to use them for every talk from middleschool up

$@luminousfractal420$

@luminousfractal420 Жыл бұрын

Someone didnt know how to use a mic and there was severe echo. I had to stop listening it was giving me a headache. Ill have to find the patience for subtitles.

@danasimcho310 Ай бұрын

An excellent presentation!

@ladykoiwolfe 3 жыл бұрын

Please request that your speakers not walk away from the mic while speaking. This audio debacle could have been easily avoided. It sounded like it was going to be a very informative speech and I enjoyed the small part I could hear.

@from-Texas 5 жыл бұрын

Wonderful presentation! Thank you!

@ryanvanzant4788 3 жыл бұрын

Epic presentation...

@ricjonez1816 5 ай бұрын

Boozhu Midewin in Michigan, She did an Excellent Job on the history of the Animals Path of Souls.❤

@triciakennedy6419 4 жыл бұрын

The audio is difficult and paired with this speaker's voice makes it very difficult, I switched it to closed captions and muted the audio.

@mykelgreene911 Жыл бұрын

Under water panthers are spiritual beings that protect body's of water from all sorts of things theres many water spirits as thier are many other types of spiritual beings. This is what we are taught in my tribe the presentation is on the right track and putting the puzzle together correctly.

@yvetteneshilokotz2655 6 жыл бұрын

I found the information fascinating. I wonder what the Ho Chunk historian and other Indigenous Nations could add by their oral winter stories? As to the audio...yeah, I wish the assistants would have fixed her audio. I think she moved something on the mic. I found the comments by others rude. My opinion...those people missed the point of the information. At least Dr. Kassabaum shared the info the best she could.

@ladykoiwolfe 3 жыл бұрын

She literally stepped away from it. I didn't figure it out until the view switched back to her and saw how far away from the mic she was. I wish they had told her to move back to it.

$@luminousfractal420$

@luminousfractal420 Жыл бұрын

They should have cleaned up the audio before uploading. Wouldnt take long. Im not blaming her its the people setting up the audio who didnt walk her through it. ...although most people know how mics work vs distance 😄

@missourimongoose7643 2 жыл бұрын

There is a shine to this deity on my dad's property in southeast Missouri, I would love to send pics to any archeologist who wants to see them and I have alot of questions lol

@garyglonek5496 10 ай бұрын

Please note that the image of the Mishepeshu closely resembles parts of the star constellations Cassiopeia and Perseus with the horns of Mishepeshu being the W in Cassiopeia and the arch of his back being the arch in Perseus. i

@davidbeatty5324 7 жыл бұрын

What happened to the audio?!

@louisgarcia1058 3 жыл бұрын

While we may use the term mythology, The Underwater Being called Unktehi (the difficult one; Un = to be, tehike = difficult) in Dakota and the Sky Being called Wakinyan (Flyer) or Wakan Kinyan (Holy or Sacred Flyer) sometimes called the Thunderbird, represents opposites, Fire and Water, and in turn represent the Hydrological Cycle. So the Native peoples are using these representations to explain a feature in Nature. Not a bunch of made up tales.

@miphaestrella1606 2 жыл бұрын

These spirits and creatures are real but everyone likes to pretend that they aren’t even scientists :/

@missourimongoose8858 2 жыл бұрын

If you would like to see a unknown mississippian shrine to this God checkout my channel, I made a video showing a bluff around my families land that we were told is a shrine to the underwater panther God, its got a bunch of red paintings and 2 caves that most likely were burial sites

@JCLeSinge 4 жыл бұрын

Why "water panther"? The descriptions, and the connections made to other local mythology, sound more like dragon stories. It's scaly, aquatic, horned, spiny-backed... these aren't "panther" descriptors by any stretch. Whence cometh the terms "catlike" and "panther"?

@zooemperor3954 4 жыл бұрын

JCLeSinge cause they were also called The Great Lynx or the Great Panther by the tribes/cultures that worshiped them

@flippbaby7409 3 жыл бұрын

It sounds like a panther and it's basically a cat besides its un cat like features

@bonglee5400 3 жыл бұрын

The water panther sounds like asian dragon. The description, and how water panther are scared of thunder is the same as in the asian culture.

@ladykoiwolfe 3 жыл бұрын

@@bonglee5400 I very much agree, right down to it's horns.

@zeph6439 2 жыл бұрын

Perhaps, dragons move like cats?

@Nobody-dc8dp 4 жыл бұрын

I've seen one in real life, "Spirit Panther" is a story by the Menomonee Indian tribe. Ringtailed bipedal panthers are real, but aren't just limited to water. David Bowie made a music video about them "Burn it Down With Gasoline". Aztec and Mayans worshipped the jaguar Gods and made human sacrifices to them.

$@luminousfractal420$

@luminousfractal420 Жыл бұрын

I guess if otters do it

@Kaz.Klay. 7 ай бұрын

@mileswilliams9737 Жыл бұрын

Please re-release this with the audio cleaned up. This is just shameful. It's nearly impossible to listen to

@chrisallen5680 Жыл бұрын

Thank you for this. One thing, this isn't something that used to be. Many still believe in this, that are very much alive today.

@krzysztofwojtasik1288 6 жыл бұрын

To be fair, she stepped too far away from the microphone, I guess not much could be done post-record.

$@luminousfractal420$

@luminousfractal420 Жыл бұрын

It could have. They could have fixed it before upload. Bit of echo cancellation and a volume normalizing filter. Would take an hour at most.

@theisisreincarnate 3 жыл бұрын

❤❤❤❤

@pixels2u Жыл бұрын

why didn't someone adjust the mic/sound? so unprofessional and tho excellent presentation is too hard to listen to.

$@luminousfractal420$

@luminousfractal420 Жыл бұрын

Really wanted to listen to this one but that audio 😵‍💫

@theisisreincarnate 3 жыл бұрын

Audio was good for a while then she stepped away.

$@luminousfractal420$

@luminousfractal420 Жыл бұрын

Throwing it out there.. axolotl?

@dhstadt 5 жыл бұрын

Why do people even post videos when the audio is unlistenable. Spend s few dollars on a wireless lapel mike for gods sake. 1940s technology doesn't make it anymore.

@whitehorseducharme4428 5 жыл бұрын

Keeasacoosway

@sasachiminesh1204 2 жыл бұрын

Indigenous people should be the ones to tell Our Story. First, Indigenous people don't regard rain as "annoying," but as a gift. You're not respecting the cultural inde3pendenc of Indigenous nations as each unique and not a generalization of a race. This is what happens when Euro privilege co-opts other people's culture - and they make a career off of us without knowing the full story or telling it right.

$@luminousfractal420$

@luminousfractal420 Жыл бұрын

And thats how we get myth and legend :) but yup

@AntzLoks1314 Жыл бұрын

El-Choctaw-lord-De-CalifasMexicoAztlan Antz-that-crawls-on-the-ground MexiCali i

@salvagemonster3612 3 жыл бұрын

You do know that this term was and is used to describe Otters? Right?

@SuperChimcham 3 жыл бұрын

Is a sea lion a lion?

@ladykoiwolfe 3 жыл бұрын

Last time I checked Otters don't have antlers...cats usually don't either. Whatever this was, these people who are very familiar with otters and cougars decided it was closer in appearance to a cat.

$@luminousfractal420$

@luminousfractal420 Жыл бұрын

@@ladykoiwolfe ive seen representations of otters with antlers but im not sure where. Could have been green man related/celtic myth.

@ladykoiwolfe Жыл бұрын

@@luminousfractal420 interesting idea. Could be similar to the Jackalope. Although the Jackalope does come from a German cryptid.

@00stobart 3 жыл бұрын

Though primarily central American and Amazonian (though it's quite conceivable their original range spread into the southern US) - given they habitually hunt in and under water - why is the Underwater Panther not a Jaguar??? Especially as so many of the images feature patterned skins. Dx

@NathanaelFosaaen 3 жыл бұрын

Panthers are a broader class of cats that includes Jaguars, Mountain Lions, and Leopards.

@ladykoiwolfe 3 жыл бұрын

@@NathanaelFosaaen actually not. While you're right about the Jaguars, the mountain lion is not classified as a panther. It is actually considered to be more closely related to small cats than to lions or Jaguars. The Cheetah is also not a part of the panther family, and for the same reason, neither actually roars. I actually agree that's weird, but so is the cougar's scream and the cheetah's chirp. Have you ever heard them?

@missourimongoose7643 2 жыл бұрын

There was a prehistoric jaguar who died out after the ice age who roamed north America also could be a giant river otter maybe

@mileswilliams9737 Жыл бұрын

The jaguar was found as far as new Mexico during Spanish colonization. I'm not convinced that's actually as far as they ranged. Especially thousands of years ago. Also we often forget there were varients of species. The Amazon jaguar and the ones in Arizona were not exactly the same, there were plains buffalo and forest adapted buffalo. Also, just saying, so much went back and forth over the land bridge, people, horses, camels, bears, why not tigers? Tigers might like water more than jaguars do

@mileswilliams9737 Жыл бұрын

The audio really makes the college look bad. To not use a wearable mic is just amateurish. And I mean, grade school kids with no allowance amateur level. Even children know about wearable mics and why they're a must

@jennifermcclean1308 5 жыл бұрын

Has it occurred to you that maybe the reason all the cultures have the same stories and pictures, is because they're all seeing the same images in the sky??? Read the myths, watch electric universe...and then check out Brian Allen Lamberts theory of everything... He's not 100% right, but he's damn close...

@ladykoiwolfe 3 жыл бұрын

That is exactly why I'm into comparative religion and mythologies are a large part of that. I'll check him out.

@jennifermcclean1308 3 жыл бұрын

@@ladykoiwolfe Honestly I think it's been purged from KZfaq.. or covered up by the Singer with the same name.. Some of the mythological, astronomical and geological connections can be found with the Thunderbolts Project though.. but if you find it, can you drop a link?

@ladykoiwolfe 3 жыл бұрын

@@jennifermcclean1308 if I can, and if I find my way back here.

$@luminousfractal420$

@luminousfractal420 Жыл бұрын

Every cuulture has them. In africa its the spider goddess who takes people up to the sky and back on a string of light. But yup, all cultures see the same things. Maybe all our tech keeps them more distant now. Ive seen random direction satellites that can disappear across the sky in a blink. No strings but not normal..id be skeptical if it were human. I dont wven think we can accelerate that fast out in space, and it was above the highest cloud layers zigzagging about. Been told by others theyve seen similar.

@noahinson 4 жыл бұрын

Remember also that there's a mound of evidence that people arrived on boats over 50,000 years ago, possibly earlier as there's controversial evidence of Neanderthal life about 100,000 years ago. We believe this is our homeland. We've been here for a bit.

$@luminousfractal420$

@luminousfractal420 Жыл бұрын

Yup people were traversing the world always. Columbus and his ego can do one. Theres even four tribes of my own natives who lived in the americas about 400years before columbus showed up (welsh). We lived with the native americans for a while, patagonia still has a welsh speaking area. Easter island also was found to be a meeting place between american indians and some other groups. Theyve found evidence of that. To turn up on that random chink of rock takes some skillfull seamanship and navigation skills.