Was amazing to make this together man!

Having AloisNL coach you is basically all you need to become proficient in lane timings, which is everything you'll ever need to have a successful climb! Proper wave manipulation is kinda like "denying" creeps from your opponent due to being able to zone enemies away from gold and\or XP. Edit: Looking forward to seeing Grubby do a ranked series! Also with Alois always preaching fundamentals, what better way to put his theorem to the test than by teaching a new player with Grubby's ability to garner information and have him practice it without being a mechanical genius (yet)?

To the guy in grubbys twitch chat who said "nah silver players know levelup timers": knowing a fact and consciously considering its practical applications are two different concepts and while the latter is usually named the same as the former for convenience reasons (like the way alois does it in his "people below masters don't know levelup timers" speeches), the former is nowhere near being the same as the latter

AloisNL coaching Grubby? The world really is small!

Dude grubby is so smart here. I am so impressed with the amount of understanding and forward thinking he showed during the session. Soo many intricate questions where he utilised his knowledge of other games and applied it to a new game. Alois still the goat as always, honestly I knew nearly everything beforehand but it was still so refreshing and entertaining watching this coaching session!!!! Pls do more of this content, you 2 are killing it!! :D

Great to see Alois teaching Grubby some fundamentals!

An easy way to think about minion aggro is simply if something is point and click, it draws aggro. Autoattacks are point and click, so they raw aggro. Skillshots and AoEs aren't point and click, but if a skillshot ability specifically says it triggers on-hit effects - Ezreal Q being the primary example - it draws aggro; the inherited autoattack behavior takes priority. There aren't really any hidden exceptions since any ability that applies on-hit effects will generally say so.

As a 1000 game this season plat 4 player I learned a goood amount this video… I love ur league videos grubby ur so enjoyable to watch

Yess, finally my new favorite youtubers together. Very helpful video. Keep it up (y)

Love seeing the toplane content. Would also LOVE too see you get coached by Bwipo. One of the best macro decision makers too touch the game. You guys have same vibe etc. LOVE YOU GRUB GRUB

@39:00-- So back in the early seasons (maybe even season one or open beta?) there was a glitch with Heimerdinger where he could place his turrets at the spawning locations for minions by the nexus. The turrets and Heimer would prevent minions from spawning. Teammates didn't have minions to back them up, but the other team didn't get any farm while Heimer's 4 teammates got to farm for free. After like 30 minutes, Heimer can then move aside and it will spawn every wave simultaneously from every lane into whatever lane Heimer was blocking. This would create a giant horde of like 300 minions to spawn down mid lane where they could push to end the game. This glitch was quickly patched when videos of it started showing up on KZfaq. There was also a period of "proxy farming," using champs with tons of mobility like Master Yi and Singed. You basically go hang out between an enemy's turrets where you kill every minion, often by pulling them part way into the jungle. When enemy champs show up to get you to go away, you just skedaddle off into the jungle. You end up denying farm to multiple champions because one lane is stuck farming under turret and other champs aren't farming because they're too busy chasing Singed (don't chase the Singed). There were nerfs to champs that could do this and some changes to minion pathing that removed this from the game.

Let's goo grubby is funding da mentos!!

I have a revolutionary tip for Alois; he can put the active stream camera spot on top of the spot he used in the original video to not clutter up the screen twice.

This is quickly becoming my favorite content to watch. Ive recently been inspired to play seriouslg again and hit Emerald on NYE! Absolutely loving watching you learn these concepts and asking interesting questions. It's sparking my own curiosity about the game and improving how I think about the game as well.

Small detail that ends up being a big factor in wave priority is the position of the wave. Sure, the fact that the opponent has leftover minions from previous wave dealing damage to your new wave as their new one comes in matters, but the way minion ai is coded, the stretched out minion wave in the "on the move" state spreads its agro equally on all the targets in the enemy wave as it connects (in neutral position each melee is targeted precisely by 1 opposing melee and 1 opposing caster) and after their respective first assigned target dies they switch to the closest one, so in reality after your minion wave finishes off the remains of previous enemy wave they start ALL focusing the one melee minion of the next wave making it die (and stop contributing to DPSing your wave) way quicker than any of your melees will since their aggro is equally spread among your 3 melees, naturally pushing the wave. Add your and your opponent's lasthitting (which he due to the riskiness of situation will naturally do less of) contributing to the wave dps and you have a situation where 4-5 (3-4 if full hp but that's unlikely to happen as they're the first target to be hit by your minions) melees or 2-3 casters leftover creates a natural bounce with a slowpush.

Great collab! I've been waiting for this!

1:24:29 chatter's massage had me dying "next slide pls"

Part 2 plz ❤ very interesting coaching btw, wave management definitely is a key

this is an insane crossover, never thought I'd see the day lol

Great content guys👍 I learned a lot from this. My brain started melting after the 1hr point though 😂

Loved this, thanks. Would appreciate learning sessions with chat off the screen in the future. Just my opinion, but seeing the bad faith arguments, reductive interpretations of actually complex concepts, the eternal sandbox debate of which moba is better - and most of all - the personal insults towards the coach. It is so insanely disrespectful and distracting that I'll enjoy this one as a podcast. Keep up the vids!

Amazing, as many other people mentioned, it would be great to see Bwipo teach you as well!

Very instructive video. Thanks Grubby and Alois for providing quality educational content

the chat roasting grubby when he was talking for a few minutes straight was fucking funny one guy said who's coaching whom maaaan i'm dead

wow, getting to see two of my favorite league content creators together in 1 video

Been watching all of your league content, absolutely love it. With trying out the different MOBA's that are out there, would try Smite as well?

About minion aggro, think it this way: the things that do draw minion aggro are EVERYTHING that involves an act of choosing the single target if you choose the champion as said target PLUS ezreal yone yasuo and zeri q if you hit a champion as their main target (yone and yasuo qs wont draw aggro if the closest target to you that was hit wasnt a champion and ez qs deal damage to one target only, not sure if who is the first target of zeris q means anything for that regard) which are skillshots treated as autoattacks. Basic autoattacks for every champion inherently carry the "choosing the target" part so no need to specify that they do draw aggro aswell (which they do in case i overcomplicated my explanation).

very few skillshots will draw minion aggro, and those that do have a targeting function (or auto attack) and built in ezreal Q is a skillshot but also an auto attack so it will draw aggro azir's sand soldiers are a product of his w, and their auto attacks on champs will draw aggro senna q will draw aggro if you hit a champion, even if you target a minion attacking towers also draws minion aggro if i had to guess, the magic words that make this function through spells are "apply on hit effects"

Been waiting for this upload ever since the announcement, LESS GOO!!! THUNDER MAN TOES!!!

I am in the happy spot with this collab

39:00 there are actually a decent amount of cases especially with ganks and fights in botlane, that minions sometimes chase you to or past drake

39:00 taking other lanes minions is possible, there was an old youtuber Singed420 that one tricked proxy Singed (Proxy is when you farm the enemy waves behind their towers) basically he would work his way into the enemy base and take the entire top and mid lane minion waves. The only up side to this is your mid laner gets to perma roam the map with the jungler while the enemy mid laner is stuck perma shoved, also someone HAS to chase the Singed around in their base getting 0 gold or exp and applying 0 pressure until he dies all the while he gets double gold and exp while doing it. The down side to this was sometimes your team would just get pissed and tilt.

happy new year grubby

So happy that it actually happened!

Saw Alois and insta-clicked, this should be fun!

Great choice, I've stopped playing lol for Dota but I still religiously watch Alois and Dom

would be cool to see it the other way around with grubby coaching a high level league player at dota even if he's maybe not the highest level in dota

Nice they did this guide for community. Two dutchies together talking English :)

Literally and honestly the smartest student i have ever seen. I feel like Alois could teach him to be diamond level in like a month xD

League minion aggro rules are wild! I'm no expert and I don't play much anymore, but I've been keeping up with league since beta and this is the first time I've ever seen someone that explicitly understands it.

Dang a lot of concepts covered in this video. You should also know that to freeze a wave, you need 4 enemy minions to be left to attack your next wave when your wave hits theirs. So their new wave plus those 4 minions will kill your wave and have 4 enemy minions left while keeping the wave in the same spot.

Grubby: he doesn't understand the characters and basic mechanics yet. Coaches: so, look, at such and such a minute, so many mobs come out on the line. Why does he need this information at the moment?

nice this is what i suggested on your 2nd video 😁

Turn on floating exp text to get a good feeling for exp range 👍

Really enjoying this "playing & learning league" series! I was thinking, a lot of people say "wait to play ranked" since you usually end up low ranked if you do that. This advice makes sense for people who are non-streamers, I suppose, since they probably wouldn't want to be low ranked themselves and have to climb out. However, I think it would be good, if not incredible content to see grubby jump into ranked games as soon as possible and get a rank. That way, you could see him incrementally improving with each concept he learns and tier climbed. There would be so much funny and surprising content in these divisions really: the 1v1's/2v2 duels, the team fights and subsequent *team convos* etc. it writes itself really! I also mention this because there's an old video explaining that in the blackmarket of selling league accounts the most expensive ones, even more than diamond ones, are those that are 'truly' iron rank (the lowest rank possible). I suppose it's because people do indeed "wait to play ranked" and thus never place into these divisions making them rarer. Also, I believe Riot does a pretty good job at detecting "smurf" accounts and quickly adjusting their MMR to shove them away. Regardless, it'd still be cool content to see if Grubby can just visit these ranks before his inevitable climb out of them. I doubt Grubby would place in Iron after he reaches lvl 30 (there could be a small possibility rn as he is lol) but even bronze or silver, which the majority of ppl are in, would get peopled hooked like, "what!? Grubby in silver?!" clickbait type deals. I'm just thinking out loud here but either way, hope you're having fun, Grubby!

"Let's get the ppl the live game as well" video ends 😂

chat box is ruthless

Amazing

oooooooooooo the grubby playing league! With Alois!!!!

You are basically the avatar of games.

Is live game going up here or on alois' channel?

Im learning a lot

Something to note is that just because ur lane can be over at 3 minutes doesn't mean the game is over, top is just one of 5 roles and even if you're losing other members of your team could be winning which can then later allow you to recover and come back into being strong and winning the game. Unless you're going 0/10 losing lane isn't cause to surrender as other members of you're team could be winning more than you're losing meaning your team is winning overall.

Minion aggro on abilities is weird. Generally homing abilities and single/multiple target abilities draw minion aggro and aoe ones don't, but there is no general rule: the choice of whether an ability draws minion aggro is made mostly based on whether they can be used to poke reliably in early game.

it's crazy, i have been playing and watching this game for years, but didn't even know how exactly the minion aggro works, i just assumed if you hit enemy champs with anything you get aggro, and didn't pay much attention, honestly i still can't believe it, but that explain so much why certain champions are able to take such favorable trades.

For anyone curious, the Discord streaming lagged so Alois was unable to do the live coaching game.

Nice to see that Grubby is following Noway4u a collab would be awesome!

How much experience to have in dota? Grubby: Well, let me tell you what I know!

Grubby is going ballz deep 😅

33min its not single target spell its a point and click spells and autos trigger it so Ryze E on a champ triggers it same with his W skill shots only if the have on hit aplly (like ezreal, gangplank or irelia Q )

I might be wrong but I do believe minions are tethered to lanes in some way. They won't chase into river or jungle past a certain distance regardless of what you do. Like they have a prime directive of 'Walk on this line' and beneath that command is all their other interactions with enemy champions. But once their distance from that line passes a threshold they just revert to their prime directive. I'm actually curious if I have it wrong?

Next on Yt: Faker coaches Azir to his newest friend

FUNDAMENTOS GUY

ah yes it's Mr. Fund The Mentos

Premium content 🔥🔥🔥 I love Mac and his coaching but, his cocaching is WAY more efficient for players who already are pro or really high lvl, alois gonna help you to honning your understendings of the basics. FUNDAMENTALS GUYS, REMEMBER THE FUNDAMENTALS

I understood "mean" instead of "minion" 100% of the times he said it.

Next time: grubby X faker

Love this video! I like this much better than the previous "coaching"

All point and click attacks draws agro.

I wish they played a 1v1 for fun so Grubby sees what happens when you face a challenger ahahhahah

Have you given up on League? I know you play lots of games which is impressive but just curious because your League content has been fun.

There is only one coach Grubby needs to talk to, LS. Please collaborate with him

let's gooo

FANTA MENTALS GRUBBY!

Y'all are both Dutch natives, right? Always wondered if there's a temptation to switch into Nederlands under those circumstances.

free choche lets go

Oh yeah toplaners have the best tecnical knowledge and micro and macro and currency in the game, if u want to learn league in the most chad yet unforgiving lane then toplane is ur choice, bwipo is a good coach too, baussffs with the gold death xp and push style, minishcap1 covers proxy style, currency, cheese plays, adaptive itemization/ rune setup mentality macro and teamfights, these are all good tet fun channels to watch and learn best of toplane, keep away from rat player broken champs abusers(druttut..ect ect) Hope he reads the comment

I have been observing your work for many years and I have an intuition that the ideal hero for you will be an unconventional character, especially Shaco. You will have a very hard time fighting against it and learning how to play it, but if you master it, it will give you the most potential to use. The properties of this character perfectly reflect your nickname Grubby ;) Good luck in your new challenges and I really hope that we will meet in a fight or in a team in LOL (EUW server). Greetings from Poland!

alois is the goat

MORE WITH ALOIS! GREAT VIDEO!

give us some support coaching videos in League Of Legends o Great Grubby, i reach ancient in dota cause of you and now i want reach platinum in Support in league.

You should only get coaching once you plateau.

still hoping for trick2g and grubby collab. one middle aged man and one grandfather

alois should really get win11 and turn on dark mode for notepad

for jungle, pls get dantes/doaenel to coach u bro plsss 😆😆

This was a great lesson, but I can't help but think that 40 games in, Grubby still needs more general knowledge, such as what items do, some simple timings, and awareness on ganks, etc.Personally, from watching the games, my one suggestion would be better map awareness by paying attention to the mini map more.

pretty scuffed but good info for u

My man played against SK Insomnia... c'mon now grubby

GRUBBY ILY

Does dota not have wave management like this? i assumed it would be the same in dota

Really wish Alois just shared his screen to you on discord instead of having you watch his twitch stream with the huge delay. Trying to keep up with what he was saying while the steam was 5 seconds behind was pretty annoying. Aside from that though he gave good advice.

FUNDAMENTOS

I think this type of content should be pushed more for when you already ranked and you're settled in a rank and you need extra things to go forward. That's just my opinion though. It seems like you're just starting the game and this guy is talking about how many minions each level requires to level up.

OMg hahaha He got little pigggy fundamentals to coach him HAHAHAH COOOL! jokes aside Fundamentals is really good and then go to mechanics

Ok, so over all it seems like you just have to be faster than your enemy in order to win.. got it

This lesson seems like it comes a few months too early for Grubby. More basic things would probably be more useful right now.

Yes, too bad you didn't start playing lol much earlier, you would be one of the best Europeans for sure.

Grubby presented so many high level concepts and asked so many good questions... I just wish Alois would go into that instead of ignoring everything he said and only talking about the level up timers. Watching the last coach and this one I'm actually surprised that people rise to the title of "coach" while being absolutely incapable of listening to what their students are saying and adapting their lessons instead of being a tape recorder.

Day 4 of asking grubby to play warhammer wc3 mod more and try more races

Wait I thought Immortal was the highest rank in Dota? But the base MMR for that is only like diamond/master equivalent? There must be an enormous skill gap across that tier