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I’d attend that service lol

@@funnyusername4774 🤣😭😭

*halo theme intensifies*

Yeah, a separate unranked queue with a built in overlay would be best. It really is the best way to learn, I used overlay way back in orange ranks and stopped after a month because it just gets in the way.

@@IAmEnormous OR MAYBE just to make it fixed in low to mid ranks, and when you get to "high rank" its "training wheels off"

​@@MrTrombonatorit already exists and it's called offline tournaments

they should simply normalize block stun animations to be representative of frame data. example: your character should do the same block animation for < -5, then < -1, complete neutral move (0), then for moves that leave you from +1 to +5, +5 to +9, +10 to +12, +13, +14, +15 and > +15. the differences could be subtle, but evident enough to be noticed if you pay attention. for example, +13 to +15 moves could have the same blockstun animation, but with white dust for +13, light gray/brown for +14 and deep gray/brown for +15. also, throws should be color coded, in my opinion, as the animation can be very hard to discern depending on the angle (blue for 1 break, red for 2 and purple as it already is for 1+2). literally showing the properties of a move should be a priority, having to lab moves and characters for basic balanced gameplay is ridiculous. lack of knowledge should NEVER be a factor in a fighting game, in my opinion.

@@gustavogoesgomes1863 That's nice for intermediate to advanced players. For new players I would find it too overwhelming and complicated.

I use overlay as I find it absolutely stupid and overwhelming to have to literally lab characters to learn basic punishment instead of playing the f*cking game to learn. and the overlay gives me the unfinished string data everytime regardless of my opponent finishing it or not. usually they always do, and I always get counter hit because I press on reaction to the red number.

It's upsetting that there always a chance for cheater to appear where the money coming from :/ So the only way for tournaments to be - offline in one room with searched pads and sticks...

I think if an overlay is considered an awful cheat then playing ranked on Twitch and getting tips in chat should be considered just as bad. It's arguably more effective, because they can also give other matchup tips like what direction to sidestep rather than just block punishes. I've seen popular Tekken streamers ask "What are the frames on that again?" to chat while streaming ranked, and nobody gives them shit for it. The overlay is still a 3rd party tool that reads the game's memory, so I do think it should count as a cheat, but as you said the results are the same as having a friend with a frame data chart sitting next to you and telling you the punishes (which wouldn't be allowed in a tournament either, but it's hard to enforce online). I don't think people should be given the exact punishes while playing, but some more visual feedback would be nice. I believe Tekken 8 is going to have indicators that show when a move is plus on block, which would be a great start. I'd also just want labbing matchups to be more user-friendly, they should add something like Guilty Gear AC+R's replay takeover so that after a match you can replay situations you were actually in and be able to try different things to counter it.

Tekken should have a gamemode where you play with frame data

I hate the way tekken handles learning and I just can't accept basic knowledge about frame data being gated out as "matchup knowledge". tekken is the only fighting game I ever played that does this. this is pathetic, in my opinion. having access to basic knowledge about a move's properties mid-match being considered "cheating" just shows how obssessive this game's community can be

​@Cormick i thought this was going to be our copium, but it's actually a very thought out argument. Kudos!

i don't mind the overlay. at least the player is showing effort in the match

@@mr.almezeini647 oh I don't mind it either, it's a great learning tool, I was just addressing the points of the video

@@mr.almezeini647 but it's unfair for other players of same rank that trying to learn on their own errors...

i dont think it's that bad. i dont mind when opponents use it. i use it for fps unlock. 60fps is unbearable to me i play on 240fps locked

insanity that people are trying to okay this. And let's take a wild guess i'd guess pretty much everybody here in the comments who are saying this delusional shit is has been or is using it atm. Its so mad that these people can't just suck it up and PRACTICE LIKE EVERYBODY ELSE. They are litterally saying i don't wanna lab or at least practice punishment on my character so i will shortcut my way into a matchup haha ffs its so lame. I wouldn't be suprised if they did it against their "hated matchups" or in genereal characters that they simply dont like. I'd even go as far as to say they most likely also rage alot and immediatly turn it on aswell. I won't even wanna hear what this type of person has ready in terms of exscuses i will litterally just leave every kind of communication and stay away from such delusion.

Isn't this kind of an elitist's comment? Practice like everybody else? Do you think it's fair for new people in Tekken 8 to play against people that have played every Tekken since release for example? Why don't you start over like everybody else as well if we want to keep things "fair"? The Tekken community is one for double standards and elitism, it's incredible. I don't think the overlay is used by delusional people. I think it's a symptom of a larger problem inherent to the game. If these people were cheaters and didn't care, then they'd use more effective methods like the video stated, autoblockers etc. But they are using a tool to help them learn framedata more effectively. Imo this is the devs fault for not offering good tools to do so, it has nothing to do with the community or being delusional. Even Tekken 8 is cumbersome to get into the replay (the replay system is fine tho and really detailed). This is no different than having a friend helping them and telling them the numbers, or having an app on the phone like ALL PROS DO btw. I couldn't give a slight fuck for what these people that use the overlay do tbf. If they win, it's probably not because of the overlay, you can't react to numbers popping like that. The only thing that does is make a note for later. If it helps them get into the game, power to them. Especially when some can't even lab because they lack DLC characters. And again, if you think the type of people that is using a tool meant for learning are raging, you're the one who's delusional. You're mistaking the type of people that cheats to troll and win, and someone that wants to learn (even if using such methods). It also does not mean they aren't labbing as well, they're probably using as a reminder. Again, you can't react to numbers if you haven't practiced before (try tekken 8's punish feature, if it's something you never seen you will have to think). This is also not used in any other fighting game title btw, proving that it's a symptom of the game, not the genre. It's due to the reason why other technical players don't play tekken, and the same reason pros state they don't want the knowledge checks removed, in fact they want more. As soon as they remove that, like it was back then, players from SF and Anime Fighters start to win tournaments, can't have that. And people like you spent so much time learning that it's now sunken cost fallacy, you want to justify it even if it makes no sense, cause you feel important, special. Plus Harada literally said he didn't want anyone knowing how to play the game cause at it's core it's mechanically simple and would lead to boring matches. I think it's an horrible way to think of things. Because others and me suffered, the next people will have to go through the same exact experience or they are not worth it. Things evolve, and we should evolve with them, if this is a need of players, I wish devs start implementing better methods. To be fair to Tekken 8, it does a marvelous job. And it's noticeable through the players from other communities that are spending hundreds of hours where they would previously have given up just due to the memorization aspect which takes zero skill but a shtton of time.@@krisztianfrandsen8780

@@robinv1485 i respectfully disagree

@@robinv1485 lol... OFC IT"S FAIR! THAT'S WHY RANKED SYSTEM IS MADE FOR! IF YOU CANT YOU YOUR JOYSTICK - SIT IN LOW LEVELS UNTIL YOU START UNDERSTAND THIS GAME! If you think that's unfair - burn your diploma... cause you get it with unfair ways while everybody is learning to get it. Noone is perfect, just grind matches, lose, win, learn and go higher. If you cant, why did you bought online multiplayer game? Are you playing shooters? Do you cheat there because there always someone better than you? So why cheating here is good?

console still has a good amount of cheaters tough i can also speak for tekken. it's (because of tekkens lackluster anti cheat) pretty simple to cheat even on console.

I also miss your wife

I had the same experience with Nina. I try using trouble characters in practice mode, or setting the cpu to use moves i'm bad with!

Like, moves have properties based on a lot of things including how they are used. Why should i be punished for not knowing a number? A move’s frame data should be, in a perfect world, clear just by looking at animation

why try and practice against artificial gameplay when over 95% of the games are against normal players its absurd and a waste of time can be fun for some tryhard who's too much in main character mode to really care about his opponents cheats or whatever but cmon it is a waste of time dude it really is at least for me it is.

@@krisztianfrandsen8780 I don't like it or respect it, but I can't change it so I chose to use it to my advantage and not let it bum me out.

The thing is that even if he might not react it first time -14 pops up, but the 2nd time he most likely will and he would not have idea how to do it properly without cheat otherwise.

@@perfilordy7804 True, they will depend on it. I have someone who uses that zoom out mod and sadly he can't go playing without it. He has a hard time in offline matches. P.S. All I'm saying is that it just affects so much negatively that in the long run it just because useless than just searching it up and building muscle memory for it. But hopefully people who use it kind of don't rely on the frame that pops up but sadly it might be the case. It's kind of hard for me to grasp because not all people will put in the hours of course and I myself want players to play Tekken casually and not to study every single detail on the game. At the end of it all I want people to just have fun and play Tekken.

@@perfilordy7804 that's because he learned the move's properties, as he would if he took the unnecessary time to lab instead of just playing the game and learning at the same time... I mean, if you already know a move's properties, what the problem is with having them displayed? and if you don't, isn't that a positive aspect? shouldn't "learning by playing" be simply more desireable than having to lab stuff? should you be benefitted by your opponent not knowing the basic properties of a move?

yesterday I played against a heihachi that didn't miss a single electric and backdashed at lightning speed. maybe he's just gifted, or maybe it really was macros. but it was really weird

Project L, not released yet

@@IAMOP Why not Project W

you should have to go into practice and check the frame data for each move individually because thats what *i* did

its cheating because it gives you real time match up knowledge while your opponent has to rely on their memory i dont really see how this is an arguement

@@HyperFangz_YT I use overlay and I would love if it was just a feature of the game. I would actually enjoy knowing that my opponent knows my move's properties and that I have to play considering that they are able to punish me if I overextend. it's best for everyone. I can't see why basic information is a problem, an overlay won't press buttons for you. if you rely on your opponent not knowing what your moves does, I have bad news...

theres more to it than that lmao